you you you you okay good evening ladies and gentlemen it is 5:30 and I will call this regular meeting of the Burnsville City Council to order it is our tradition to stand for a moment of silence followed by the Pledge of Allegiance and we invite you to join us I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all and we have some announcements this evening for our upcoming meetings council meetings are scheduled for Tuesday December 17th at 5:30 p.m. and Tuesday January 7th at 5:30 p.m. we have a work session at scheduled for Tuesday December 10th at 5:30 p.m. and a special work session scheduled for Wednesday December 4th at 6:00 p.m. all meetings are held here in the council chambers tonight we will be adopting the levy and a budget the next item on the agenda is citizens comments this is the opportunity for anyone in the audience who wishes to address the council on an item that is not in a printed agenda and not an application form that will be coming before us at a future date is there anyone who wishes to address the council anyone who wishes to address the council seeing no one I will then move on the next item is for emergency items only and this is additions to the final agenda miss mess co-lead are there any additions no madam mayor members of the council okay thank you we then move on to the consent agenda the consent agenda is a group of items that is considered to be routine and will be enacted by one motion however an item on the consent agenda can be removed for a separate discussion and vote is there anyone in the audience who wishes an item on a consent agenda to be removed for a separate discussion and vote anyone who wishes an item to be removed seeing no one miss muscari no madam I remember the council hey I then have a motion to adopt the consent agenda please okay comes home every Schultz makes the motion selected by councilmember work - all in favor please say aye opposed say nay and the motion carries we now move on to the regular agenda and the first item and the regular agenda is a public hearing and this is an ordinance establishing the 2020 fees and charges and our finance director missus try good evening tonight the first segment of the budget processing is really related to fees and charges these fees and charges that were attached in your background or the fees and charges that were included in the 2020 budget process within the fees and charges we are proposing an increase to liquor license fees which is the reason that a public hearing is required on these and then it also gives us direction on movin on gas electric utility franchise fees and with that I stand for questions okay members of the council we have gone through all of this through all of them many work sessions that we've had with regard to the budget budget any questions but mister I if not I need a motion please to adopt the ordinance is someone going to make a motion to adopt the ordinance I'll make the motion to adopt the ordinance is there a second I'll second there's a motion in a second any discussion mr. I oh there is a it's a public hearing yes forgive me ah this is a public hearing is there anyone who wishes to speak to this item anyone who wishes to speak to this item I will then close the public hearing and a motion was made and second any further discussion if not all in favor please say aye aye opposed say nay nay and clerk has a division at the house thank you we then move on to item 5b item 5b is the application for the city of Burnsville for an amendment to city code title 10 zoning chapter 7 general provisions section 18 screening and buffer areas chapter 12 r11 family residential district and chapter 14 r22 family residential district of the Burnsville city code to modify screening requirements for trash and recycling receptacles in single-family and to family residential areas and tonight and mrs. Madden and welcome and congratulations mrs. Madden just got married and so eight days ago so congratulations and best wishes no I knew that she got married and and your name thank you madam mayor we're still the council so this item is an order amendment for consideration to modify some screening requirements for our trash and recycling receptacles and like the mayor said in a single-family and to families doting districts based on some council direction to remove screening requirements and adjust placement provisions as discussed at the October work session so the Planning Commission did hold a public hearing on this item and the ordinance amendment last week on November 25th where they voted 3-2 in approval of the ordinance with some modifications to the staff recommendation and the language on the placement provisions their recommendation included this adjustment to the language to only allow trash and recycling containers behind the front facing wall of the garage or structure the language which eliminated the screening requirements of the trash and recycling receptacles was unchanged in the Planning Commission recommendation and then this slide shows the difference and the language of the ordinance amendment for the placement of these containers so the original staff recommendation stated that they be stored within 5 feet of the structure the Planning Commission recommended changes which indicated containers should also be placed behind the front of the primary building wall garage or structure the Planning Commission recommendation is the recommendation on the table as stated in your background packet as part of the council direction to move forward with this ordinance amendment staff did conduct community outreach and received many pieces of feedback across multiple avenues form on the city website process most of the comments which were included in last week's Planning Commission background since that meeting a few additional messages did come in which were included as a hard copy to you today the comments Illustrated the passionate issue and nature of the topic staff did receive a total of 194 responses across the multiple outreach avenues so ok council member Schewel did you want oh you just wanted this okay all right thanks and so that Planning Commission recommends approval of the ordinance amendment with that language changed to the placement provision to add that the trash and recycling containers be placed behind the front of the primary building wall garage attached or detached accessory structure facing the primary street and this still included the within five feet provision and it still includes the removal of the screening requirements as part of the ordinance amendment and then I'll open this up for your discussion on the topic thank you any questions for mrs. Madden okay thank you so much we do have some residents who wish to speak on this item so first is mr. Kramer you want to speak on this item so please come before us and welcome just curious with the reason before the changes like you're going from being less restrictive allowing this to be visible yeah mr. Kramer we need for you to give us your full name from your address for the record twice approver 3001 changer court burns oh yes just because some of us know you so modest the people who are watching mr. Kramer so we just want to make sure that we have your name and address of the record so you want to know why we're making the reason for the changes wouldn't pushing her head listen I mean so the changes came about based on some city council discussion over feasibility residents to be able to comply with this ordinance amendment as it previously stood or currently stands without being adopted the discussion mainly centered around winter weather and how this may be the financial obligation of building a screening fence may be complicated for some residents - to work that into their home and on their property and the discussion about the winter where these can be placed because of snow storage on the residential properties and things like that yes yes but the other clarification is the way that no proposal this here is within five feet of the garage or accessory structure over behind the primary structure so you have the option like magnifying the garage as I can see with my primary structure because it's attached so it has to go behind the wall or size or so that it's not visible from the street yes that's the main thing we're after is it you know like which most cities do have vegan apple family savage all of them have not visible from public right away or from the street okay and I think that the way it was worded here I think a lot of people weren't certain that you can put it fight the out in front of your garage okay and you're all in opposition of that in opposition yet we want to be where it's not visible from the street as it is now because it's as your violations looks like over the years of slowly decreased except for one year's yeah so people are more and more people aren't complying with it and I know there are some real circumstances where people can't do it door there whether yarns are developed turn off their beacon some consideration for those people to make an example to do the best they can do with it but I think most residents I have talked to especially from our neighborhood like that is we just don't want to be visible from the streets I mean why start trashing up the neighborhoods and garbage cans being set outside all the time and then crap Coons get into it or against a windy day now we got garbage all over the neighborhood that's our main concern is it doesn't isn't any worse than it is now yeah so we thank you for the work that you helped us about ten years ago on this same issue I think the wisdom here is so ago so thank you that you're continuing to be diligent about making sure that the neighborhoods continue to look at least from the street side visibly yesterday well yeah but but well-maintained for the neighborhood I know there's a lot of other concerns a near about the trash service which we didn't know 10 15 years ago that with our neighborhood we were fortunate we have one service for our whole development we contracted on ourselves we keep the trucks off our streets yeah and we try to tell others to also model what you have done because you've really maintained that throughout the 15 years yes and we trying to help someday we're going to do it in some of the larger one like North River Hills yeah it's so big it's hard to get everybody to comply with it yeah but so I guess I guess maybe they'd answer my questions it the only thing has changes if you have it along the side of the house it doesn't have to be screened is that the only change or yeah miss Arnold is the way the the the ordinance reads now because I'm looking at the red the red marked and this is the change from the Planning Commission so this doesn't include every every portion of the amendment but what you're saying is true so it would not be required to be screened if it was five feet from the side of the home okay but again it cannot be in front of the house with the Planning Commission's recommendation it cannot any longer be in the front of the house the original recommendation that went to the public hearing last week was that it could be stored within 5 feet of the front and then the Planning Commission recommended a further change that it cannot be behind the front wall of the building so in that industry so it so another one can be visible from public right away or the ones on his side can be the one there's screening requirements were removed so if it was on the side of the home within that five feet it would not be required to be screened but your lawn having five feet from the house on the side said Oh for you that I I'm in opposition of that I think he still should be screen hit some of the comments you had here some of the people I'm pregnant say that it's very expensive but most screening is a small little fence or a plant a tree or a bush something to put it behind to screen it now if you started getting five feet off in my house now you're I don't know why they want to have to have them five feet away from the house well your love to the house on the side yeah okay councilman but I think it's councilmember Keely yes oh sorry I move yeah it's a cake I know think of a number I want to get a little clarity for my own interpretation of that fight foot because I I thought it was there because sometimes people have some landscaping along the side of the house and so outside the garage right so it's all along the side of the house and they may have five feet of bushes or shrubs or whatever and so is that why we're saying it can be five feet instead of thick it doesn't have to you don't have to take out your shrubs to be able to put it against the side of the garage you can have it as much as five feet out so with the the council recommendation to move forward with these ordinance changes one of the big discussions of looking at our pure cities with the City of Plymouth model which did not give a specific numerical feat for distance and for an enforceability standpoint and from staff to be able to have an ordinance that we can interpret easily and that residents can interpret easily instead of the word abut which can mean different things to people we went with five feet and arms spin essentially easy to understand for residents and for staff to be able to explain and interpret so is that saying it has to be within the five feet yeah or just at any point inside that five feet which could then accommodate some shrubs or bushes but it could it would still be along the side of the house to your comments the way I interpret this as well is what we're saying is if I wanted to put my garbage cans along the side of my house next to the garage which is a fairly common place to put them previously you had to put in a some fencing put a shrub there so it was a hundred percent out of view and I think what in the spirit of what we're trying to do here is we're saying if it's not facing the street but you've put them around the side of your house portion of that garbage can that one on the end would still be visible that we're basically saying that's okay and that's kind of what I've seen in most other cities that I've driven around we're just not saying don't put him in the front of the house and face the road and I have seen that too right where people just stick it right out in front of their garage to the left maybe in front of the third stall or whatever on the corner of the house and they're literally between the road and the house we're saying putting around the corner but now you don't have to put up a fence put up a bush so it's a hundred percent screen so there's some visibility of the can but not that much and I do we had some background notes that noted you know garbage cans today are quite different than they were 20 years ago or 30 or 40 one of those was originally put in they were dented up beat up dirty metal cans that really were unsightly these new molded plastic cans are much better than that it's not like not we're also saying those are good enough to put right in front of your house we still want them along the side so they're partially screened I think naturally by the house you know I as everybody I've driven alone all over the country all of us that in cities all over the country and I've seen examples of apparently no ordinance where all the garbage cans literally are lined up in front of the houses to the street and apparently that's okay to them we went to screening which said we never ever want to see your garbage can in visible sight unless it's garbage day and I have agreed with in the spirit of what we're trying to do here with councilmember Schultz who brought this forward to say it seems a bit excessive to force a hundred percent screen and I think that's what we're proposing is let's relax a little bit but not allow it to be put in the front of the house so they're still going to be majority of those cans are gonna be seen but some of them can then the other issue we were dealing with is houses that have steep grades on the sides where you have a split-level and the garage is on the main level and you have some yardage that comes around and there's not a flat surface to put it anywhere on the court side of the house they're in a difficult situation it almost says you have to put them inside your garage and some people do and choose to but that's also that mean it looks better clearly from the state standpoint but it also is the challenge that councilmember Gustafson brought up in a previous discussion is you you're gonna attract some rodents inside your garage so there maybe has to be some other issues addressing that but that I think is the one area of this that is to me left a little more open to interpretation if I have one of those situations that under this ordinance we're saying you have a hardship you can put them in view but I don't know how else we deal with that other than because I don't think we can say well if you have that situation you're forced to put them in your garage alright that's not fair and equitable everybody else that doesn't have to put you know to them compared everybody else who may not simply because they have flat land and they have a place that they can circle around the side of the garage so there's dealership we're like not physically able to do it in the snow I just and everything our neighborhood ninety-nine percent of everybody puts him in the garage and a lot of the complaints in here about till they stink and everything else my recommendation is wash it out once yeah yeah they put him outside too especially where we're at I won't River Valley bang at the raccoons and everything else come went up at that and they're getting into the garbage cans no you got garbage all over the neighborhood so it is better to put it inside something or I know some people put some kind of container and they put like a Senate or whatever out there but that's a little excessive where some people say they can't afford it on some of these comments like I said a small fence or like you see in a situation like you got a yard that you got no yard to put it next to right I can understand that where he has some circumstances but I'd still rather see Mike Apple Valley League and still not visible from public right away any type that's my my preference is like that but that helps her a little bit I don't the wording should be changed a little bit because the way you read this thing here oh I can put it in front of my crunch yeah or do it and maybe that should we clarify that way worded that says or behind principal sculpture well if I don't want to put him over to principal structure I'll just put it on the front of my garage so maybe that could be clarified to me help people yeah make sense people read anyway they want to do what that's why I'm suited here okay madam mayor let me just a quick follow I yeah I live in a town home and because of our ordinance with the screening even though this is around the backside of our home I there are other solutions out there but I'm not saying that this is what people should do it's an option we ended up buying a it's a plastic enclosure that you basically order and snap together and it's got a pop lid and both of the large garbage cans go inside that so now it's a you know tan and brown topped decorative trashcan container I guess and put it that way it's it's an option if we chose to do it but it wasn't cheap but it is an option out there there are other options out there it's it's I would still say I'm screening my garbage cans as a result I just preferred having it that way rather than I'm just sitting out even though they're on the back side of our town home but there are some other solutions to put a garbage can and that can contain them in more plastic unfortunately you know to to make them look nicer so I you know I fully expect we we've got a lot of pros and cons we've got a lot of people saying yeah in my situation I can put them along side of my garage within 5 feet a portion of the one can that's closest to the street might be visible but it's not in front of my house and it's not unsightly in their opinion in other opinion and then we have folks that are you know we we love the fact that we've and those that may have bought screening like I did and now maybe I don't have to have screening so we are dealing with the the spectrum of opinions and and you know desires in this issue and I don't know that we're gonna please everybody I guarantee we won't but hopefully we we we don't end dramatically changing what our screening was and I think this proposal just to say they can't be in front of the house between the road and house is a means to get us to a different place that still is looks nice right we're not gonna have cans out in front I think the other challenge is on the corner lots and the lots with three sides with roads I mean where they put a pole there's a lot of them because we have a lot of streets a lot of corners a lot of cul-de-sacs which creates a lot of corners corner Lots and they're even more challenged but if the city could emphasize if you have ability to screen it let's create it but don't force them into screen in it but main thing is keeping it as much as possible out of use love the street does the city is going through a lot of thumbing over the years but get recreational Veals moved and now somehow keeping the city cleaned up and maybe go in the other direction now we're gonna start trashing they were going up again or the city and I and I think it's fair - I don't think we should interpret this change is oh now we're gonna have garbage cans down every you know you drive down the street you're gonna see cans every I don't think that's what's I don't think you're trying front of the house yeah exactly what's been most people but some people will I'm gonna hate just start slowly on it because yeah many years yeah destroy yeah if the later on or bring it back really the language is done correctly there will be no garbage cans allowed to be put in front of the house between the street and house and those are the folks who will get you know a a slope of paper from the city saying hey this is not tort compliance would you please move them and we'll give them some instructions to do so don't like we just no go to your neighbor and tell me this is what's going on yeah but I said maybe you know whatever you're gonna vote out but they clarify the language of it so it does state that cuz I growl I think it's a little vague what you can again do and the other thing that we can do is that we put out our bulletin on a quarterly basis perhaps we can also make sure that we remind people about this particular ordinance change and what they can do and so we'll continue to ensure that people are aware and that we all want to live in harmony together and we all want our property values to continue to be viable and increase in market and the neighborhood to also continue to be viable and increased in market value so those are the things that we want to make sure for our community and I think part of it is our communication with everybody and so using the bulletin is one way that we can do that and if things started to go the other direction and we can always revisit it okay all right and thank you very much mr. norburg good evening my name is Douglas norburg I live on 107 or 1 Cambridge Court you answered part of most of my questions with ham and stuff I'm still against this ordinance here's a perfect example what if we just put it there and they'll catch it on the camera and it'll go up and all of us can see it there it is this is a neighbor on my street I took a picture of this afternoon okay and as you notice it's got all the garbage cans in front it's got grill up in front and on the side they also have stacked more garbage cans and more other stuff you know this is a detriment to our property values and stuff and I just want to keep my personal clean yeah well that's all I really got I just want to make sure that and I see you know and I do understand we've gotten something photographs also and where people are saying you know this is what I have to look at yes this is you walk by it or drive by it every day and stuff and it's an eyesore and it hurts our property values okay thank you so much and I think it's mr. Herman Herman okay Brewster Benson 31:16 Chandler Court and I'm one of those corner Lots so and I had a firm that was built when the house was there we removed the burn during construction we wanted more access the burn was right up next to the garage but if I if I understand the ordinance correctly I could put the cans on the side of my garage that would be not visible to the sorry in front of my house but visible on the side street is that correct you know the way it's written now that I would suggest that that's what it says yes I I don't you know people are I have to be honest with you my recycling bin is full every week my trash can is very little maybe one bag every week and I'm hoping that the rest of the city is that way by the way I want to comment when I came here tonight part of the city of just gorgeous it's just beautiful and so in the spirit of that part of the city and keeping our city clean I think it's important that we keep them the ordinance the way it is so I really do oppose this because I think you're you're running down a slippery slope I also see the fact that you could probably have business owners coming to you at some point in time and having the same hardships or the same argument with you that says hey wait a minute you're doing it for residential now why wouldn't we do this for business and your require them to put in screening and actual storage containers okay you make some very good points okay okay Thank You mr. Hermanson okay I don't have anyone else who wish to speak on this item is there anyone who wishes to speak that didn't sign up okay thank you members at the council councilmember Keeley I just want to follow up the good comments and the commercial was was addressed actually one of the things that triggered this discussion came from both residential but also commercial our aim Center building which the city you I had a bit of a challenge with meeting our ordinates for trash screening and so we we already have addressed some changes in our commercial there's a business owner that I've been in coming in communication with over the last three years who has a hardship situation where there wasn't any place on his property because of when it was built back in the 70s and he's got a road on three sides there was no place for him to put without literally building a small building at a high cost just to contain a couple of garbage cans which made no sense at all so we've been addressing this situation for for commercial as well as looking at the residential and in trying to be a little bit more in line with what what other cities do not very many when you look around require screening there's a lot that say get it out of public view but don't say you have to build a fence or plan and make sure that it's 100% invisible to to any any perspective around your house which is I think where I think that was getting a little excessive but it's been around a long time I don't disagree but I'm looking for some common-sense approach to it so people aren't forced to build structures or build fences they can put it along the side of their house out of direct view and that should be okay in my and my perspective so again I am not in favor of of going with free for all and having garbage cans along the front of the house that was never part of this discussion from my perspective and I'm interested in changing our ordinance but keeping the front of the houses the way they should that gentleman who brought the picture of the house with two garbage cans in front of it I don't think that should be allowed I mean that it doesn't it isn't allowed under our current ordinance and it wouldn't be allowed under this proposed ordinance Thank You councilmember workman and you um I'd just like to address what's in front of us and the Planning Commission review of this miss girls touched on some litigation missiny Commission some litigation about the word opaque and miss Madden can maybe a little bit but there was some hard or difficult it was difficult to define what that exactly meant and so that was we switched to fully screened and now there's still some challenging interpretations of what that truly means as well which is I think one of the reasons why we're discussing this as far as the staff recommendation versus the Planning Commission recommendation I appreciate the diligence at the Planning Commission put into this and the discussion that they had my issue with with behind the primary structure is that it it really makes no difference from the staff recommendation because if it's in front of your home or two feet to the right and behind your front flat line it's still equally visible from the front street so it it almost I understand what they were going after but it doesn't achieve what I think they were trying to achieve which is why I'm more comfortable with the staff recommendation in this case so that's all I have to say everything at this time okay council member Schewel looking at this just her for and there was a couple reasons why why we looked at this issue number one was residents who are struggling to comply with it and although people are noting that there was a lessening in you know that that it looked like more people were complying with it what actually appeared to be happening more often was people were granted exemptions warmer or granted exemptions and we just you know staff knew that those were ones that they they struggled to comply with the ordinance as written they've been checked they've worked with that homeowner like that's as good as it gets and so you know don't mean to keep checking them so that was that was one issue that we had with that the other issue was the sheer number of calls that people had on issues with with garbage and is this 100% screened because I think it's 80% screened there's a bush there and the homeowner is like saying my garbage can is screened and the neighbor next door tom is saying well yeah you have a bush but I can see the side of the garbage can and so there was quite a bit of staff time devoted to how screened is it so we were looking at how do we also reduce that make it very clear what the ordinance is and thank you for asking for for clarification and to have it a little more clear and I agree with you on that so that's also one of the reasons why I would go with what the staff recommendation was on this I think that would solve those problems make things a little more uniform and have this be a little easier for everyone to follow as well everyone knows what the expectations and the rules are then it's pretty clear okay anything else so you see staffs recommendation and you see the Planning Commission's recommendation and you also had a diagram of because we received 148 comments and then you had a diagram that really shows us the people who are saying leave the ordinances is which was the majority and then there were people who said the changes when you evaluate it the folks who have said keep it as is and the staff recommendation versus the Planning Commission where do you see that analysis with regard to the two Aria or maybe that's because you know I tried reading through all of the 148 well it really was very closely split down the mail from the comments we received and many of the comments they would state that they were either overwhelmingly in favor or in opposition but they would also add maybe I could be okay with it if yeah this type of the change was implemented so there were a lot of I think a lot of people that didn't respond to this had strong opinions on the topic and clarifying the language of the ordinance to make everyone pleased what the outcome is is not going to it's not viable but that there are some changes that if the council would like to adjust that based on some of the comments they've received I think clarification and mr. Kramer made a very good observation that we need to make sure the language it's clear so when people read it it is clear and I think mr. Kramer can you come back to I just if you look at the staff recommendation does that meet so if you look at the staff recommendation to the Planning Commission yeah that's the ones yeah this is or yeah you know it makes it sound like well I don't want to put it behind my structures Ron yeah Center and what you're saying it is to remove the or it should be stored behind the program it's we'll all everybody I think if we all monitor and make sure I think we'll get there I don't find someone to clarify it because when you say five feet of the garage some people say well my idiot minds all one building but something really terminal with this in my garage this is my house yeah I can put it fight feet foot in my garage as a picture showed that he had there that she was there in front of his garage maybe some people might think well I can put it for my garage fight for you know course to the side didn't say it has to be to the side five feet of the garage or accessory strike it doesn't say it has to be to the side of the garage yeah so I think the side of the garage so miss Mantin can you give us your thoughts on staff's recommendation is it five feet of a side of the garage so with the staff recommendation based on the direction that we received and following the language of the City of Plymouth ordinance this that's what the staff recommendation reflects other than the staff addition of the within five feet of the garage accessory structure because we felt that that would be easier to interpret and to for others to read and interpret rather than the word about which does come with stun but on this side of the garage so but that would the staff recommendation would have allowed in front as long as it was it was within five feet in a front of the garage it would have yes that is yeah this is where we see a lot of folks it will you have those garbage cans in the front of the garage just like what I think it was mr. norburg who brought the folk the photographs yeah so for example the house like that is I'm right on highway 13 in North River hillside right and highway the they got a separate single sandy garage next to their house so according to this thing they could put their garbage cans in front of that garbage can and it's yeah in front face and I have the public right away oh yeah exactly at least that's the wrong side that should be facing the public right away okay okay councilmember T lien and I'm going to go to mr. Peterson oh you too okay it's both no yeah II to switch okay so it comes remember Keely pardon me that was an outdated queueing sir oh okay so misspoke here man mayor members of the council members of the audience I just want to clarify that what miss Madden is talking about was the staff recommendation that went to the Planning Commission after the Planning Commission talked about this yeah they're recommending to you that you use the word and so it's it's within five feet of the primary structure and behind the front of the primary building wall etc so that's the recommendation and the resolution that's before you so that would require it to be on this side and not the front does that make sense because I'm hearing so it's we're not know what I don't think is there's a separate garage the house is here the garage is probably said back find a few feet back so they beat still behind the front of the primary structure but it's in front of the garage about five feet back away okay misspoke I don't think that that's what the ordinance intention is madam mayor the recommendation from the Planning Commission would allow that to be in front of the garage if the garage is set back further than the the bone structure that's closest to the street ideas that it be not in front of the part of the structure that's closest to the street uh and then there is the rub yeah and now now you have those garbage containers in the front in full view of the right of the public right-of-way okay that's where like Apple Valley Eagle like that they have a nerve ordinance as well so to do is out of sight from the right away yeah hey thank you okay if it's off the side of the garage that's okay it's not quite as bad but to me and no it's still not okay it's starting to see screen too sometime oh yeah so not in the front it's not attach or test yeah we're giving a difference okay members of the council do you want to amend the Planning Commission and make sure that it's not in the front but it's on the side whether it's a garage or the primary structure that it is on the side that allows the our residents to say okay maybe I don't like that it's not screen but if it's not in the front then we'll look at that compromise mr. German ik mayor and council I think if you read that sentence from the Planning Commission in its recommendation as miss Falkner indicated by adding the word and each of those independent clauses function so that you would say it's in or within five feet of the primary structure and behind the front of the primary building wall and behind the front of the garage and behind the front of the attached or detached and success restructure will you do sentence construction and decoupling yeah it is it's behind each of those independent so the Planning Commission recommendation I believe it does effectuate what the council's stated intent des is that as councilmember Keely observed if it's on the side you'd see the scientists say don't buy the part in there behind that wall but it could not be along the front of any of those structures and I think that's the intention that really Street now that gentleman mentioned the corner lot that would be one of those circumstances where it would be viewable from a major street if you would yeah but that is when you're dealing with thousands of properties yeah you are functioning here to try to get about eighty percent ninety percent and dealing with some of those outriders and hopefully people will reach the conclusion that in that situation it'd be beneficial for them that's pick up their garbage that rolls down the hill or whatever let's start at inside or put in a container up or doing something but you're not going to get all of these situations addressed but I think the Planning Commission recommendation is indeed tighter and then the original staff recommendation by the use of the word and taking or additional building structures yes yeah uh kind of my bikini are you yielding to customers yes okay okay council member schultz could you explain what you mean by tighter it addresses the yeah each of the building just a building the looseness i think in the in the staff recommendation is the or yeah it's the phrase as well as the fact situation where if you add the garage detached from the principal structure you could have the garbage cans store full-time yeah in front of us the doors visible from the street along the driveway you can't you would not have that situation occurring here in this in the planning commission recommendation so and adds a little bit more restrictive if you will of where you to be able to place the container mister gymnic so that last sentence so wall garage attached and and detached accessory structure not or because that's the way that and i think is earlier in your sentence right yeah before that is nina yeah and behind and and garage and garage attached or detached accessory okay are you okay with that I mean I'm better okay okay which most cities have okay disabilities there are some services but that's very minor compared to 60,000 residents we have it thank my Super Furry whistle thank you very much I know I know all of you would prefer screening so hey I see your heads nodding so thank you so much okay ah councilmember Keely thank you I'm glad we had this discussion because did you read this yeah I'm working technical sense yeah that's getting to my desire that they're along the sides of the structures and not in front of the structures it reminded me of our RV ordinance intra in trailers like I said where you could pull it along the side of the year of your house it could be visible from the street but it could not extend beyond the front facing wall of your vehicle and that's planning what we're trying to say here is those cans can't be further toward the street than the front facing of your house or accessory structure or garage which means they're gonna be along the side they have just sort of pinpoints it to be on the side okay still visible but not nearly as visible as literally sitting in front of the garage and facing the street that's what I would support how that language easy I'll leave that up the experts but I think you're you're there yeah I I think yeah I think all of us and I think mr. King I know we were just trying to get at a compromise here and so councilmember Schultz so my question is so on on the language of this if someone does have where their property is has roads on either three sides of it two sides of it how does that play into called the definitional issue of primary street and that would call for an interpretation of what the primary street is in other situations that may be the front door where the street address sign is located as a determinant we've had other situations that call those factors into account some of situations where the property owner declares it and then is held to that standard for all sorts of purposes it comes these things are not unique just the garbage containers air-conditioning boxes compressors are a common issue your meters and other attachments where utilities are served into the house those also might be able to seen from the primary street but they're seen in profile or in the side yard well you can't place them in the rear yard so we're gonna have those situations regardless of what you have as a ordinance just like we've had challenges with the opacity issue and the totally screened issue I mean you are not going to get a hundred percent uniformity there's just too much variation in the design of properties within any community customer shows so in the Planning Commission recommendation to the City Council you're saying we'll still have issues with staff time having to make decisions based on sides do we still have that with the staff recommendation yes you have that with regard regardless of any regulation even if you have no regulation sure and you'll have nuisance complaints or other issues yes but is will there be as much of a determination where they have to go out and determine because it's it's my standing looking at the first one we're it doesn't matter if there is a side street or a back street or a front street it doesn't matter it's five feet from the structure I think the Planning Commission recommendation council member is a little clearer yeah so between those two options I would say you would have fewer interpretive calls with the Planning Commission recommendation merely because it is a little bit more refined than the initial staff recommendation at staff observe there's the use of difference between and or or and a little bit more clarity on those detached garage situations so I think you would have fewer fewer staff calls with the Planning Commission recommendation just like I think you may have fewer staff calls with subsequent of my amendments and refinements to this because as you go through it residents and staff will be identifying ambiguities or issues here and these are as the mayor indicated works in progress always and the ebb and flow with experience and so you will find something where you say we should we should tweak this or tweak that to refine it in order to respond to the conditions that aren't apparent at any time you're doing any ordinance amendment because literally we're dealing with thousands of properties and I think this is a direction that helps us to get at compromise between those who wanted a little bit more union C and for us to maintain the quality of our neighborhoods so we can move with the Planning Commission recommendation just make sure that we have the language in place the other part about all of this is that our staff can also with our bulletins to make sure that we have continuously educate folks on what on what the new ordinance is with regard to trash containers councilmember Keely I just want to clarify with this Planning Commission recommendation where it says primary structure and behind the front of the primary building walls detach excited stretcher facing the primary Street when I first read that I thought oh it's saying it's got to be behind the entire structure in other words put it in the backyard huh how do we clarify that that's similar to like our RV ordinance where we're talking about the front I think I think facade wall in other words the front elevation line from the street to the front not we're not saying it's right some illustrations explaining it but I think climatically the language works as you indicated it is that front wall determinant creating a line extending that a side yard placement would be acceptable okay yeah and in a photograph on what that means it gives people clarity as what the ordinance reads so members of the council are you ready to make to adopt we'll see how far goes I'll make a motion that we accept the Planning Commission recommendation language screen here you regards to our application on city code 10 zoning in Chapter 7 etc etc I don't want to read the whole thing yeah I move for the Planning Commission there's a motion in a second for the discussion all in favor please say aye aye opposed say nay and emotion carries we'll continue to watch it and we'll continue to put out information through our bulletin and other communication methods that we have so hopefully that everybody helps us to keep our community looking good but thank you for coming out thank you for being engaged and we really appreciate your taking the time thank you we now move on to 5c 5c is the resolution to adopt the 2020 budget and established a 2020 property tax levy and to adopt the 20-20-20 for capital improvement program and mrs. Strunk welcome good evening again madam mayor and councilmembers I'm pleased to present to you the final budget and property tax levy for your approval this evening council began working on the 2020 budget back in June of this year and you've had several meetings regarding the budget throughout the past several months council has historically considered the city and EDA levy together for transparency purposes the city levy proposed is 37 million five hundred and eighty eight thousand six seventy four and the EDA portion is one hundred ninety seven thousand five hundred these amounts are the same as the proposed tax levy adopted in September for the max tax and that were shown on the property tax proposed property tax statements that people received in November from the county the budget includes proposed funding changes between the city and the EDA fund which increase the city levy with offsetting reduction in the EDA levy and that was staffing changes and debt changes between the two funds so the expenses moved to the general fund as did the matching property tax levy so you see them together represents a 6% increase at tonight's meeting you have several actions to take first for the city council meeting you'll have to certify the 2020 tax levy and adopt the 2020 budget also adopting the 2020 to 2024 CIP the five-year plan the following that the e to the City Council meeting well recess recess thank you and I will have an EDA meeting which you will be authorizing the 2020 IDI levy and EDA budget and then we'll resume city council and city council will need to approve the actions of the EDA so that's kind of the movement for tonight the first item to consider is to adopt the resolution of the 2020 property tax levy and the amount of 37 and 588 674 this does not include the EDA levy which will be acted on separately the amount is consistent with the previous budget meetings in your budget workbook the second item to consider is to adapt the resolution of the 2020 budget totaling a hundred and ten million 479 5:17 this is all funds and it's consistent with the budget workbook with council direction received during previous budget meetings fund level details included in your background and in the resolution the third item to consider is to adapt the 2020 2020 for capital improvement plan again this is a planning document that schedules the public improvements for the five-year period of time the CIP is presented in your budget workbooks and as presented in a budget work session by mr. Peterson earlier in last month projects in the CIP will come before you draw the normal approval process so approving the CIP does not automatically approve any particular project you have you will see each of those items again as they reach the levels of approval and these three items can be adopted in one motion and I stand for any questions any questions for mrs. fry we've been working through it since June but we're always in budget so council member hschultz okay could you flip back to the previous screen yes thank you that's all I wanted okay come to my bikini did you want I just saw you had left it on speaker I just turned it off but okay I saw you reach that was turning it off but okay okay go meow okay now cell councilmember workman I just have a comment I want to thank mr. I for walking me through my first okay come to my bikini thank you I'll echo councilmember workman's sentiments and compliments this is the 13th or 14th budget I've been through and I thought your presentations throughout this entire six month long process were fantastic it was inclusive of infographics and charts that were easy for anyone who isn't as deeply engaged as we are to understand and extract you know what we were dealing with and grappling with from a budget standpoint and certainly we've had plenty of public meetings because all of our meetings are televised which I really appreciate unless they're a couple of unusual ones like the all-day work session or or a different type of meeting but 99 or maybe 90% of our meetings are all televised this whole six-month we've had a lot of great discussions throughout each of these segments of the budget the levy the fees the capital expense and so it is a load of work absolutely a ton of work on your part and your staff and city manager Melanie Lee's part so and the rest of staff so I really do appreciate it it was a more enjoyable experience to go through because the information was presented in a way that it was a lot easier to really absorb it and understand it and be able to make ultimately some good decisions informed decisions as a result of it but thank you very much I know you get about five months off maybe six and then you got to start all over you just the budget and then you get to actually do other work right thank you thank you for the nice compliments it really is a team effort I would like to echo your sentiments too with city manager Lee and mrs. Faulkner mr. P your son and then all the staff that and mr. Lindbergh all the staff that are under them we have a lot of people working on preparing the budget a lot of people in my department as well miss roadie and miss Ryan also are very intimately involved in this and it is a it is a big team effort and we always strive to make it better and with anything we're looking forward to the next process on how we make that better yeah and I also want you to know that because of the way the book was laid out with all of the graphs and the narrative was so well done you I think every year it has improved you've learned from previous year and said okay we need to do this one better and for your 50 plus preparers throughout and I think people need to understand throughout this organization there is so much transparency not only within the organization but then when our citizens here when you have over 55 people within the organization who are preparing the budget both from the Union side and a non-union side is why we have what we have today where we don't go to arbitration because everybody knows what it is so I thank you for that the other part that I want people to understand is that because when our residents also and you know you and miss we also know that when I get those emails about the budget and then when we go through and walk them through it was like oh I have no problems and thank you for making that clear but the narratives I thought was so rich that it helped our residents understand the numbers because it is very complicated when when you're looking at the different funds so that was well done thank you city manager Li and you mr. I and all of the people who help us to get to this point and so thank you so members of the council I need motion to adopt the resolution to establish the 2020 tax levy adopt the 2020 budget and 2022 2020 for capital improvement program I will move that all three of those be bundled into one motion as stated by Mayor Kautz there's a motion in a second all in favor please say aye aye opposed say nay nay okay thank you and now I will recess the Burnsville City Council meeting so the economic development meeting can convene and I just want our residents to know that councilmember Gustafson who is the president of the EDA it's at the hospital with his mother so our prayers go out to his mother and what's going on and the vice president of the EDA is councilmember Schultz and they're meeting recess the Burnsville City Council meeting so I'll call the Economic Development Authority meeting to order as our mayor noted please note for the record that president Gustafson is absent item 1 are there any additions to the final agenda seeing none we move on item 2 is the consent agenda which is approval of the October 8 minutes may have a motion to adopt the consent agenda motion by Commissioner Keeley seconded by Commissioner workman all those in favor say aye aye opposed say nay motion carries moving on to regular agenda item 3 is a resolution adopting the Burnsville Economic Development Authority 2020 property tax be mystery is presenting thank you thank you we tonight have a proposed EDA levy of one hundred ninety seven thousand five hundred this is five hundred and forty five thousand dollars less than it has been in the past so as I mentioned that was because that moved to the general fund or the general city levy a variety of funds and the related staffing and debt service removed as well this levy is below the EDA allowed levy which is a percentage of taxable taxable market value if you were to I love you the maximum amount that would be somewhere near one point two million dollars so you're well below that the 2020 budget for this fund is six hundred and fifteen thousand 503 which includes some one-time expenditures for 2020 and would be spending down some fund balance and that was included in your five-year financial plans and with that I stand for any questions any questions just one comment I get part of your job with this particular budget and I know a little bit was done last year as is accommodating a anticipated half-million dollar drop in host fees from waste management in the landfill for a variety of reasons which started to cause a rethinking of how some of these funds where they're funded shifting staffing under one fund annexed to actually put us in a far better position financially for us a more sustainable and supportive type of funds going for and I know that's part of the reason why we have a large reduction of a little over half a million decrease from what we normally would love you to put into the EDA fund I think it's fair to say for the audience watching and those that will read John's article is we're still funding our economic development we don't have to fund it at the level that we used to because of those shifts and those are all very good decisions in the interest of the city thank you very much okay any other questions motion to adopt the resolution I'll make a motion to adopt the resolution for the EDA levy for 2020 second motion by a commissioner Keeley's I can add by make commissioner cards all those in favor say aye aye all those opposed say nay nay and the motion carries there's no other business so I may have a motion to adjourn motion to adjourn okay motion to adjourn by Commissioner Keeley seconded by Commissioner workman all those in favor say aye carries thank you nice president Schultz I now reconvened a Burnsville City Council meeting to ratify the actions of the EDA and I don't think miss Frye needs to say it again all we're doing is approving the actions of the EDA motion to approve the resolution adopting a purnsley can only develop on a 30 ad a 2020 property tax levy second there's a motion in a second all in favor please say aye opposed say nay nay okay and members of the council there are no other items to come before us this evening and a motion to adjourn is in order so moved second there's a motion in a second all in favor please say aye aye opposed say nay and the motion carries thank you for being with us and have a great rest of the week