November 11th uh 2023 Planning Commission meeting to order tonight's meeting will be held in person in the chamber and also on Zoom as chair will be leading the commission and the public will be welcome to participate when invited uh you can participate in person or online via Zoom if you're on zoom and experience audio problems we suggest that you leave the meeting and then rejoin that usually fixes it um additional information on how to participate via Zoom is on our website burnsville.gov uh as usual the meeting is also available on bctv and the City website if you're unable to participate this evening and you'd like to submit public testimony I encourage you to email your comments to staff or mail your comments directly to City Hall the zoom zoom ID is 880. zero nine five three four eight three eight um we should put up a slide that has that number on it just a thought um I don't know if that's possible um once you log into the meeting please do the chat feature to tell the moderator which item you'd like to speak to you can also call in the meeting the telephone number for phoning in to zoom is 651 -372 -8299 and again that meeting ID is eight eight zero zero nine five three four eight three eight for each item that has a public hearing I'll open up a time when the callers may speak and we can guide you with more instructions at that time um if you're speaking on the phone please mute your computer so that there's no delay so now we're on the onto the agenda so the first item on our agenda is the swearing-in of a new commissioner John Hamilton welcome to the Planning Commission thank you um who will be leading the swearing-in ceremony I'll take care of that so thank you John I'll have you just stand where you're at there and you can raise your hand and repeat after me I had John Hamilton do solemnly swear I John Hamilton do solemnly square that I will support the Constitution of the United States and the state of Minnesota I will support the Constitution of the United States in the state of Minnesota and Faithfully will discharge the duties as a member of the Burnsville Planning Commission of the city of Burnsville and we'll physically discharge the duties as a member of the Burnsville Planning Commission in the city of Burnsville in the county of Dakota and state of Minnesota the county of Dakota and the state of Minnesota to the best of my judgment and ability the best my judgment and ability so help me God so help me God congratulations thank you welcome commissioner Hamilton thank you item number two is the adoption of the agenda are there any changes to the agenda from staff no changes and are there any changes to the agenda from Commissioners welcome commissioner Timmerman here uh seeing no changes I'll entertain a motion commissioner branic second from commissioner Timmerman um all those in favor say aye aye any opposed uh the agenda has been adopted item number three is the approval of the minutes from our last meeting which was August 14th any changes from staff no changes any changes from commissioners uh again entertain a motion commissioner Wallace so moved second by commissioner Braddock uh all those in favor say aye aye the motion is unanimous item number four is our first public hearing this is the application of Costco Wholesale warehouse wholesale Corporation for concept stage plan unit development to allow off-site parking as a principal use at 140.01 burn Haven Drive Miss Garris has the report thank you Commissioners we do have an application before you this evening it does require a public hearing Costco however is working with staff on a transportation issue related to their application and they have asked that the Planning Commission continue this meeting to the October 9th Planning Commission meeting and just in short in case there is anyone online that's interested in the application what we're looking at is really the there is a lot that is located east of the Costco warehouse site it's highlighted in blue here the 14001 bernhaven Drive spend the home to Pumpkin Patch daycare for many years Costco purchased the property earlier this year and the daycare is actually relocated to another building in Heart of the City what the applicant would like to do is to take the building and the existing facilities down demolish everything on that lot and to install a new parking lot for employees so that would be the application the property is owned mixed and the ordinance does allow a freestanding parking lot off-site if it's done through a planned unit development or if it's in the B3 or B4 zoning districts so that is why they've made application for the concept plan PUD and with that I can stand for questions otherwise if you want to open the public hearing and if anybody wants to provide their comments this would be the time to do so okay maybe we'll start with uh I have a I have a question before I open up to the rest of my Commissioners um are you gonna is there going to be a more in-depth report at the next uh when we re when we reopen the hearing in October yes the still okay so then I'll open before we open up the public hearing else open those questions to the commissioners commissioner Timmerman uh Ms girls quick question um this is our Burnsville Center Center Village area does additional parking fit what is envisioned for that area um there are a couple of different things related to the center Village Vision um it would not and we will discuss that further however the zoning ordinance allows it so we've got some competing uh competing things and that will be something that we'll discuss further with the Planning Commission when this comes back to you on the ninth great I look forward to it thank you commissioner Hamilton so the land directly to the east is where the old fire station was correct that's correct are they going to be utilizing that space at all one of the applications does show a potential to use part of the fire station property it does show a connection so they wouldn't have a driveway connection to this lot but it would be moved to the main driveway coming off on the actual fire station lot and then a connection to that that is something that is a city council decision they need to identify they have not made as I'm aware any decisions regarding what the fire station site will be used for would they be purchasing that parcel if uh yes that would be part of the question if that option is pursued they would like to purchase part um or perhaps all of the parcel I have another question if I may uh the intersection at 140th and fernhaven so it was a reference in the report regarding some type of stop sign or signaling is sort of been a decision on that or is that still open to discussion that is why as welding engineers and the applicants Engineers they have proposed putting in stop signs with a crosswalk the warrants and the consultant for the city is recommending signalized intersection so in order to take a look at all of those details more in depth that's why the continuance is requested the applicant has provided a transportation study and background information any other questions from commissioners uh I saw you raise your hands sorry um seeing none will open the public hearing at six six forty and if there's anybody in the audience that wants to speak to this issue you can approach the podium and uh identify yourself and your address and seeing nobody is there anybody on line or on Zoom okay so we don't have anybody here for the public hearing we'll close the public hearing sorry I'm on autopilot so I will entertain a motion to continue the public hearing to the October 9th Planning Commission meeting I've moved continue second second seconded by commissioner Braddock so uh all those in favor say aye the motion is unanimous well this hearing will be continued at the October 9th Planning Commission meeting thank you Miss Garros um item number five on our agenda is a also a public hearing this is the application of tenurb developments Incorporated for a planned unit development PUD Amendment for additional signage and updated signage criteria at Burnsville Marketplace located at 13901 Aldrich Avenue South uh Miss Garros will be presenting for staff thank you chair uh good evening plan Commissioners uh so as mentioned this next item on the agenda is a PUD Amendment related to signage at the Burnsville Marketplace shopping center property and so to refresh your memory on this property this is um a very large uh 26 acre property in our main commercial area in birdsville also near the Burnsville Center Village Vision area so just north of County Road 42 and west of I-35 W uh so the site has been developed as a shopping center for many years the original PUD was approved in the late 80s and then has been amended a few times over the years some for exterior updates or for new outbuildings that were to be constructed on the property and then a number of amendments were completed in 2011 and 2012 related to signage on the property so this amendment that is being requested this evening is also related to signage and it does include the refacing of some of the existing signs on the property to allow for a new tenant in the upper level space it's currently home to Best Buy and as part of the applicants narrative they've indicated that Best Buy will not be renewing their lease in the space and that a new tenant has been identified as Bob's Discount Furniture so to reface the existing signs on the property which are highlighted kind of in these various circles pointed around the property that's something that can be done administratively so long as the signs are consistent with the previous approvals some of the signs on the property were specifically requested and then approved as part of a PUD amendment in 2011 and 2012 for additional signage beyond what the sign organs would require so refacing them as long as they're consistent could be done administratively the reason that some of these amendments are to require plan unit development amendment is there are additional new free standing signs which are proposed as well as shown on number 12 here on the site plan a new type of retaining wall sign Edge proposed by the tenant so again some examples of the freestanding signs that exist on the property that would be refaced with a new um messaging from the new tenant one of the key aspects of the plan unit development amendment is the replacement of these two smaller directional signs which currently direct traffic to the upper level space for Best Buy so the applicant is proposing that these two directional signs be replaced with more permanent Monument signage shown here within those Landscaping Islands the reason that this is requiring a deviation to the city code is because of the addition of new freestanding science but also due to the setback requirement for a freestanding sign so a directional sign or an informational sign is does not have to meet a five foot setback from a parking space or a drive aisle but a permanent freestanding sign does and in this particular location with the width of the existing Landscaping Island that a setback requirement would not be able to be met so it is included as part of the deviation request for these signs to be replaced with larger still in an effort to provide Direction and arrows to to seek that rear upper level tenant space but a more larger freestanding sign classification the next new type of signage which is proposed is part of the wayfinding and directional efforts of the property owner and the new tenant which includes a mixture of types of signage so painted signs which are not currently allowed in the zoning ordinance as well as a more with the lettering of the name of the tenant Bob's Discount Furniture um individual letters which would be consistent with the zoning ordinance requirements so for benefits of that the use of the tenant space as this new tenant establishing it is a benefit to the city and Retail Community it's consistent with previous PUD approvals um that the amendment would provide greater visibility for a unique space on the parcel and that the amendment would provide additional wayfinding for a site that's complicated to navigate so as part of the applicant's narrative letter that's attached to your background report they indicated that with the existing Best Buy tenant as well as Circuit City who is in the space prior to Best Buy there have been a number of complaints both from the tenants themselves as well as from customers that are visiting the site that it is confusing on how to navigate the site from its many entrances at such a large size to find the direction to get to that upper level tenant space since it faces a different direction than the remainder of the attendance within the shopping center and so as part of that they're requesting this to assist with that way finding for the customer experience so as mentioned there are signage-related deviations to the city code to allow the additional freestanding signs on the property for the two new monument signs and to allow those two Monument signs to be located within five feet of their Drive aisle within that Landscaping Island to allow additional wall signage above the adjacent roof line which I apologize I'll go back to that and show you where that is and then to allow a new wall sign on the retaining wall to be a combination of bronze and permanent signage material so sorry that I skipped over that so above the roofline here you can see currently there is the existing Best Buy sign which was approved through a former PUD Amendment the applicant is proposing to upgrade the facade of this parapet and to add some additional decorative materials to raise it and increase the visibility and to add an additional sign which faces to the west of the property rather than this current one right here for Best Buy which is the south of the property so it's also for this additional overhead wall sign so that that visibility is from each access point to the property um so with that staff is in support of the applicant's request for the Pud Amendment we are recommending that the Planning Commission recommend to the city council approval of the Pud Amendment for additional signage as well as the updated signage criteria for the shopping center um there are three conditions that we are including in the request the first and second of course Very consistent with our standard conditions for plan unit development that the conditions and approvals of previously approved puds remain in full force and effect and that uses listed in the underlying zoning District as permitted or accessory are allowed in addition to the specific uses that have been outlined in this plan unit development and of course that no exterior signage be installed without prior issuance of a permanent sign permit with that I can stand for questions this evening and this is a public hearing uh thank you Miss Madden can you go back to the the picture of the painted chevrons yeah so they appear to be is that just are you saying that's just painted on the side of the retaining wall or are they are they like objects that are painted painted like the sign is painted so they have indicated that they'll be painted onto retaining wall and that the um letters for the actual sign portion of the request will be a um attached material three-dimensional yes the three-dimensional traditional wall sign material because the way it appears here that they're all three-dimensional you know and maybe that's just the way they're painting it you know so it's just a red Chevron with a black outline to make it look three-dimensional uh possibly they've indicated both in this kind of caption on their images that it's painted as well as in their signage criteria packet that they included with their application materials um so I didn't include that packet it's attached to your report but not in the PowerPoint because the criteria packet is an administrative approval okay mainly a just a point of clarification just yeah trying to clarify that that looks three-dimensional um questions from Commissioners for Miss Madden commissioner Timmerman I had the same question uh actually cherawat about the the rendering of that image I mean I'm I'm curious about that axis and that bridge is that owned by the property owner yes okay so basically they they can do what they want with it if it were to come to cleaning or upkeep or things like that or if the letters faded and things like that it's not like it's a City Bridge or anything that's correct yes and the same maintenance requirements for a sign would would apply to all signage on the property okay okay um yeah frankly I think it's a great idea I think getting more cars up there using that space it's been an underutilized property for 15 years now so I think it'd be great to get a new business in there um direct traffic I think it's a pretty nice proposal and I liked the rendering of that top floor with the new the new design there too so I like it any other questions uh commissioner Hamilton all right so there's also access from 42. that's correct are they playing any signage F 42 sign that is off of 42 and they kind of show their rendering here of the existing Best Buy sign and how it would be transferred over so this sign right here is the county road 42 monument that is shown uh right here on the plan so this is County Road 42 right you would be on so they do have that separate access so they have the upper part of that um overpass and they have the under part of the overpass all on their property but yes they would be at same size same size same size to just replace it with the new messaging okay thank you yes any other questions from commissioners uh seeing none we will open the public hearing at 6 52. if there's anybody in the audience that'd like to speak to this item please approach the podium nobody is approaching the podium is there anybody on Zoom or on the phone nope okay well seeing no public testimony will close the public hearing at 6 53. um are there any further questions from commissioners commissioner Wallace uh no further questions but if there are none I think it's a pretty um straightforward recommendation that I'll be happy to I would love to entertain a motion thank you I I'll make a motion to the Planning Commission recommend to the city council approval of the Pud Amendment for additional signage and updated signage criteria at Burnsville Marketplace subject to the following three conditions a second Ed by commissioner Braddock all those in favor say aye the motion passes unanimously so this will be heard at the city council meeting on their consent agenda um September 19th September 19th thank you um we'll move on to item number six this is a public hearing for the application of collaborative Design Group for a planned unit development Amendment for a religious institution use and a joint parking agreement located at 121 19 16th Avenue South also presenting Miss Madden thank you so as mentioned this last item on our agenda is another public hearing within a plan unit development so this site it's owned B3 and is part of the happy commercial park plan unit development so this particular development was established in 1979 as a commercial subdivision and it at that time included a variety of uses for office there were commercial and Retail uses restaurant uses proposed and then in 1985 following kind of six years of that were not all of the buildings had yet been constructed the developer came back in to establish the commercial park as more of an office Park and so you can see in this building some of the surrounding ones that primarily they've been developed as traditional Office Buildings typical for that time period so this building was constructed in 1980 as an office occupancy building with a warehouse and loading dock area so it did function as that for the first few years but in 1994 a permit was issued to a Destiny Christian Center for a remodel of the building and it did include their Sanctuary spaces assembly space for a religious group in 1995 the city code was amended to allow places of a religious assembly as a conditional use in the B2 zoning District which carried forward to the B3 zoning District so the use is considered legally non-conforming in this current space the building was purchased by Destiny Christian Center who did complete a few minor remodels over the year some expansion into the space we do have a certificate of occupancy on file for Destiny Christian Center from 2003 and then in the later portion of the 2000s and into the 2010s let's say there were some changes within the building that occurred without a building permit and so in 2018 the owner applied for a rebottle of the building to allow a it's what's called Gateway STEM Academy they are a charter school that is currently in the north portion of the building to occupy a portion of the building Monday through Friday as part of General maybe business hour uses so the school itself at that time was approved as the building permit as a permitted use within the B3 zoning District the permit was issued with a clarification that Destiny church that use in the south portion of the building was non-conforming and that any expansion into a greater portion of the building would be an expansion of that non-conforming use and at that time a conditional use permit or in this particular case because it's a plan unit development a PUD amendment should be applied for so in the fall of 2022 the building was sewn sold to the current owner who collaborative Design Group is a representative for and they began meeting with staff immediately to talk about the changes they'd like to make to the building and what permits would be necessary as part of that we directed them that for the remodels that they wanted to do and growth in the space that they should apply for this beauty Amendment and we would discuss the parking counts at that time to see if the site could be compliant with what the city code would require for parking minimum so that's the application that is before you this evening for this building and so you can see here as I was mentioning it's about split between the you know the north portion and the south portion of the building so North is this way on the left of your screen I'm kind of showing the um the Gateway STEM Academy use which is not included as part of this application this evening what is included is um alticon Center which is the new owner of the building and leases the space to the charter school and they have applied for the beauty amendment to allow that religious institution use which is a listed conditional use in the B3 zoning District as a permitted use within their plan unit development to be able to remodel the space in and grow into portions of the space not previously occupied by an assembly use as well as to request a joint parking agreement with the neighboring property within the plan unit development for shared least parking space so you can see here they're outlined in the existing parking on the property which does include a mixture of parallel parking spaces along the perimeter of the parking lot as well as internal parking this does total 81 parking spaces um so shown here is the overall exiting and life safety plan the main floor plan of the main level of the building there are upper level spaces which I'll show you in a moment um so you can see here this is the existing uh main assembly space of the building so this is generally to remain in its same form as what was previously part of the permit approvals for the former owner Destiny Christian Center so the areas which are proposed to be increased and or expanded into for this are there is this location right here it's a little blurry on your screen and this would be a prayer room area there is this area right here the evolution ambulution area there's a kitchen area shown to be remodeled here if you can see on my mouse and then to quickly go to the second level future expansion in the upper level of the space showing an additional prayer area as well as there will be changes for the Gateway STEM Academy in the future this has shown as a future phase for their tenant also in the upper level that would come along with this elevator use here um so as mentioned um so they currently are um owners in the space and able to occupy their previous use that was permitted through the variety of permits from 1994 to the present and um what they're requesting this evening is an amendment because they are changing some of the space interior for their assembly use so as part of the plan unit development request benefits to the Pud are that the proposed amendment will allow the existing legally non-conforming use to be allowed in conformance with the current zoning ordinance and with the Pud and that the proposed parking lease allows for additional parking for the existing uses without reducing the green space on the property to add in more hard surface deviations that are requested this evening there are the base requests of the plan unit development to allow the religious institution use within the plan unit development as mentioned this is a conditional use in the underlying zoning District there's a requested reduction in parking requirements from 262 spaces to 151 spaces which staff is supportive of with conditions that I'll get to shortly in the report and then to allow that joint parking agreement through a parking lease with the neighboring property within the plan unit development so for the parking requirements the existing property does have 81 parking spaces and the applicant is proposing 70 off-site spaces through a parking lease so that property to go back so it would be to the west of the property um but on the bottom of the screen so you can see a portion of the spaces would be right here across 16th Avenue and 70 spaces to lease from that property owner and additional images of their parking lease are attached to your background report so the applicant has stated that the two uses the religious institution and the school that exists within the building are operating at differing peak times and have stated in their narrative letter and in their development review comment responses that the intent is for any special events such as a wedding or funeral or large large occupancy events to take place outside of school hours or traditional business hours this is also something that is identified in the drafted lease agreement which they have provided to the city showing that they would be able to lease these spaces as part of any special events or larger overflow services um so the parking itself for the building is calculated by the occupant load of the assembly spaces within the building and not by fixed seats so there are two ways to calculate parking for religious institution in our parking schedule and in this particular case there are no fixed seats in the space so we must calculate that by the occupant load um so the applicant's currently stating that their current membership at their existing location and which they have in South Minneapolis is approximately 170 members they do anticipate some growth to about 350 members by 2028. and the uh daf concerns with the application are related to the parking access and circulation around the property um so the condition that staff is recommending is that a traffic management plan with some of the standard operating procedures of how any direction of traffic during a special event or larger surface would be provided and that be provided to the city prior to any permits for work on the site to do the remodels into their space um so this examples of what this could be um there has been used in previous conditional use permits for religious institutions that have had multiple parking areas where they would have had to direct traffic an example on a larger scale is the Berean Baptist Church Edition which was off of County Road 42 East and that included a traffic management plan on how the property owners would help to direct traffic in the event that there was a larger event so this is something that the city is including as a condition of approval on the Pud Amendment um oh and here I had a plan for it after all so showing the um overall this is a number of the buildings that are within the same plan unit development and shows highlighted here in white the 70 lease spaces that are across the street and this property is within the same happy commercial park plan unit development but owned by a different property owner so the spaces would be used during non-business hours and weekends and um there's a condition that the parking agreement be recorded on the properties with Dakota County so in order to have a joint parking agreement there are two ways that can be done per our parking ordinance one of them is that the legal agreement be separate and filed on both properties and the other is that the um two Property Owners jointly apply for the conditional use permit or PUD amendment to file it so we have put a condition on it that the agreement that they've provided us that they've already been able to negotiate with their property owner be recorded which would County and there's an additional condition that should that be terminated and no longer available for the use that the property owner provide evidence that parking for all uses within the building can be provided on the site or that they apply for a PUD amendment to request further approval of a new joint parking agreement or or approval of the parking as it stands and provide the evidence at that time for meeting the minimum parking standards um also included um just so you know some conditions on the plan unit development are related to some of the signage that they have shown in its preliminary form so they are showing a Improvement to the existing kind of post freestanding sign that's on the property to something of a more permanent Monument style which uh is good and is more consistent with what the ordinance would require for a freestanding sign this is still in preliminary form and they're showing it in this location right here there is a a little bit more room for them to move it over so there are conditions included with this report that the sign B move to be consistent with the five foot setback um from a parking space or drive aisle and there is room on them the property for them to be able to be consistent with setbacks and still be visible for their freestanding sign as well as signage related conditions that the wall signs meat construction standards of the zoning ordinance and that no permanent signs be issued without the permanent sign permit application um so for staff considerations so as mentioned there are some concerns with access to the property from public streets and that the there's a potential for the Overflow parking which is needed that could impact Public Safety vehicle access to and around the site if that was needed or necessary as part of an event or in the area after an event so Public Safety staff is supportive of the condition to require traffic management plan to be provided to us and approved by the city um and as mentioned this is something that has been a tool that's been utilized for previous religious institutions through the cup process where we're reviewing parking and access concerns and as mentioned the proposed use the religious institution use is a conditional use in the underlying B3 zoning district and the use itself has been approved in the space back in 1994 and that adjacent School use that is attended in the building has been in place beginning with that permit approval in 2018. standard conditions are included with the splint unit development that the Pud remain in full use in effect from previous approvals and that underlying uses can be considered as permitted uses within the plan unit development here um and as mentioned there are conditions related to the signage as these signage plants are preliminary and those permanent sign permits would be applied for at a later date through the typical staff review and administrative process so staff overall is recommending approval of the application subject to eight conditions listed here so as mentioned the first two conditions are standard plan unit development conditions which note that the conditions and approvals of previous plan unit developments remain in full force in effect and that those uses that are listed as permitted or accessory could be allowed in addition to the specific uses that are outlined within this plan unit development there are three of those mentioned conditions related to signage that the wall sign plans be revised to meet construction requirements of the zoning ordinance that this freestanding sign location be revised to meet the setback requirements of the zoning ordinance and that no exterior signs be installed without prior issuance of a permanent sign permit and then these last three conditions are related to the parking and access on the property so number six is that the property owner provide proof of the recorded legal instrument for the joint parking facility prior to building permit issuance for this expansion of the religious institution use um and that if the parking lease is terminated and no longer available for use uh that the property owner provide evidence that parking for all uses can be provided or apply for a PUD amendment to request approval of an additional joint parking agreement to accommodate the required parking standards for the site and the uses on the site and then lastly and the condition for the traffic management plan that we provided to the city for review prior to issuance of any building permits on the site and then an example of how that will indicate how the applicant will provide event traffic management and parking and access assistance for visitors to the site during large events so with that I can stand for questions this evening we do have members of the applicant team available in the audience to answer any questions if necessary and this will be a public hearing thank you Miss Madden excellent presentation um any questions from Commissioners commissioner Wallace yes Miss Mann uh could you go back to the overview picture of the building the floor plan or the site of the site the actual visual picture like the Drone picture of it oh of this of this where are we going all the way back to this yes okay that one thank you sorry I didn't know what slide number um it appears to me that there are no sidewalks or crosswalks um along where that overflow parking would be and so just as a a point of concern for the safety of the public that would have to cross the road is that also then included into that uh traffic management plan then to either increase sidewalks on the site or the crosswalks just so it is safe for pedestrians so at in the traffic management plan explicitly to install new improvements what would be included is the um use of the property owners resources to direct like provide a traffic direction or a pedestrian Direction services so this sidewalk that is on 122nd here um it is a you know a legal pedestrian Crossing um but it is how you can see it in this photo is its current state and there are no City planned improvements for that striping now um if there are on their own property they have the ability to make improvements um but the city is not at this time suggesting any improvements to the right-of-way portion of the the street because my biggest concern is obviously if people are going to the Overflow parking they have to cross the street the chances are they're not going to walk away from the building access to make it to the sidewalk to go across the crosswalk legally and safely to get to the other side so chances are people will be going through like the parking entrances and going across the middle of the street and so my concern is just for the safety of the pedestrians at either if that's the case that some type of additional crosswalk or pedestrian Crossing signage or something be utilized just for the sheer safety of well both drivers and the pedestrians foreign so the inclusion of a an additional condition which addressed those concerns is something that you have the ability to impose on the application so that it's something that if the language can be kind of agreed upon and consensus by the planning Commissioners that could be incorporated into the conditions of approval of this request um if you so choose well Mr chair I would like to include an additional con condition that at least uh does additional research then for an additional crosswalk or access for pedestrians from the Overflow parking um and just to understand the process in the if the the traffic management plan you and this is what you just is this what you just said that the traffic management plan really is more about how are you how are you going to direct traffic it doesn't necessarily include stop signs or or additional walkways it's how how are you or could that be part of the traffic management it could be part of the traffic management plan um on their own property on what they could provide us changes but the intent is for the the actionable items like operating procedures what the property owner would do in the case of an event here is how I would direct traffic here is who we would place on the property to direct all modes of traffic and in these different directions or here is who we would hire if we were to hire someone to do that things like that so the intent is for the traffic management plan to be provided to the city and that as part of the permit approval process we would approve that traffic management plan the staff development Review Committee which consists of the you know building plan planning engineering fire and police departments would approve that traffic management plan okay commissioner Wallace I'd like to amend my last recommendation to make that as a sub bullet under the current traffic management plan um just to be addressed during that same peace then okay so right now this says a traffic management plan shall be provided to the city for review prior to the issuance of any building permits on the site the traffic management plan shall provide guidelines for standard operating procedures for parking access during large events traffic management plans shall indicate how the applicant will provide event traffic management and parking and access assistance for visitors to the site um and so as a sub bullet to number eight yep I I feel would be appropriate so what do you want to add as a sub bullet that there will be um additional research as to a crosswalk and or signage um to cross the street for pedestrian access uh signage for pedestrian for pedestrian I'm writing this down as quickly as I can so bear with me and I I look for further recommendations if need be on the verbiage yeah so I'm going to ask a question I'm not sure how often you know if there is a big event that would require traffic management uh to uh solution and is it is you know depending on the size and uh and frequency it may you know if it's a big if it's a big deal often then we want to have some sort of infrastructure in place and if it's an occasional it's a big deal but occasional a few times a year then can it be handled by you know hiring people to direct traffic and whether it's police or you know that's that's sort of a thing and I don't know the answer I'm just asking the question do go ahead um I think if the Planning Commission you could just simply add that you would like the traffic management plan to also review um if there's a need for additional pedestrian Crossings and that can be done that's something exactly that we're doing with the Costco application now and I know that we've looked at it for other similar types of applications so it's really including an analysis based on the the traffic that's occurring out there based on what's proposed or anticipated and then what if any improvements needed so moved right that's essentially what uh what you said commissioner Wallace did yes additional Research into a crosswalker sign is from pedestrian access okay so in terms of procedure are we do we have a little sub vote on whether we add this uh additional item to Bullet number eight so when a motion is made in later in the evening it could be you know motion to approve you know as listed with the additional condition requiring okay we'll have a look we'll have a little more uh discussion about it after we close this get through our public hearing and then have have another second round of discussion prior to issuing a motion yes perfect are there any other questions commissioner Braddock um I don't see any I see a maintenance clause in the agreement but I don't see any um snow management planning for either of the the parking areas um has there been any discussion do we know what the plan is and who's responsible for that across the street too um so I don't have that information I would defer that question to the applicant if they have that available to them I know within the terms of the parking lease it indicates when the parking lease would be utilized and the current property owner does still maintain their um their permanent ownership and their existing agreements for the the office warehouse building next door any other questions from Commissioners commissioner Hamilton what happens if the growth continues and they exceed the 150s faces where is there on street parking on 16th do they have to come up with another agreement to utilize other properties so that is part of the concern with the parking lease and why there's a condition that if the parking lease is terminated that additional approvals would be required through the plan unit development process in addition in the event of every building permit that we receive on the property the parking would be re-evaluated based on the current occupant load and count now that is based on not their membership that is based on the occupant load of the assembly spaces in the building um that is how the parking would be calculated so as as their membership the reason that their membership numbers were provided as part of the applicant's narrative was to show that if they were to calculate their parking based on the number of seats instead of on the occupant load of the room that the ordinance for fixed seating would actually require less parking minimums than the occupant load so they were providing that information of their own for their own justification of showing how they feel that they their parking could be reduced because of their known membership levels that does not account for any increases of those membership levels over professional events or special events um so and for those we are that's why the parking account in this particular case without the LA the exceeding is going by the occupant load of the space for one parking space per three in the occupant load okay any other questions seeing none we will move to the public hearing session a section of this we'll open the public hearing at 7 22 and if there's anybody in the audience that like to speak to this matter please approach the Pope can you state your name and your address please for the record [Music] oh my address is 5571 Jenny Lane White Bear Lake good evening um a couple things just want to um I had a couple questions and one of them is regarding um marking of sidewalks on public streets which usually I I don't recall ever having done that for a client on a public way so is the commission commission suggesting that we would actually add sidewalk markings to one of the public streets my recommendation was to have something included in that just for the Overflow parking situation as people legally would have to go down to the corner cross and go back as we know as most people and for Public Safety purposes will go from the one exit to the other entrance um so that's why I added that as a recommendation to be analyzed okay um I would I think that's a great idea having a sidewalk Crossing um I just am hesitant to say that that should fall on the on one building owner to do that crosswalk I think we would be highly in supportive of that support of that I also think um given um your point about shortest distance and walking from door to door and I am an agreement that's exactly what's going to happen actually the um the entrance into the adjacent parking and the entrance into Gateway happened to be right across from each other so if the city was so inclined to put in a crosswalk I would think that would be the place that would be the most obvious additionally I think as Sarah and I have discussed and she's been extremely helpful you guys are really lucky to have her she's been really helpful in making sure the client and and myself understand what we need to do but one of those conversations and my interpretation and I so I'd like some clarification I think um on our traffic plan for any large Gathering is our thought would be that it would be things like cones to come out and so we would be conning the area where we would be asking people to cross as a directional device I'm also having people um from uh the religious use the owner actually flagging so we would have somebody standing out flagging as people were going across and I don't know if that's also a consideration and if that um helps with your concerns about people crossing and Crossing not in a good spot I agree so yeah I think it's all can be part of the analysis part okay yeah if I may commissioner so that is the intent of the traffic management provide their essentially their to-do list of what they would do during a special event and that would include pedestrian safety directional work and they would show us how they would provide that so that we could see you know here now we know the plan in the event of an event or something like that so my understanding with the condition is that yes there might be additional Research into safe pedestrian Crossing um I would say planning as in how the owner would add that into their operating procedures for pedestrian Crossing um the city has not um in review of this application suggesting any new striping on that existing legal crosswalk Where the Sidewalk at that intersection and then um the city has not been in support in previous applications across the city for a mid-street crossing and that's not something the city would install um where those two driveways intersect so there have been requests for that from other uses in the city including religious institution uses where that has not been supported by the city to install a separate permanent sidewalk mid-block so that that isn't something that the city would suggest as part of this application it's not what's proposed go ahead Miss Garris um what would happen is that I think commissioner Wallace is has some state of this but it's basically a review um that the city engineering would do with our traffic consultant and if there we have to look at warrants if it's warranted meeting state requirements all of those types of things so I think it is more just a review taking a look at what you anticipate you know those occupancies might be and then taking a look and perhaps just through the study there are some suggestions that they can bring forward as to how to um how to do that okay perfect perfect um and then the snow removal question um So currently those both sites both the site that we would be using that we're going to lease spaces from and our site are have their own snow maintenance that's happening on an ongoing basis and those the building across the street is occupied I don't know to what extent but I I think it's over 50 so they have full occupancy so they're keeping that site clean um we are keeping our site clean it right now in general we have school um so the you know the schools are really very careful about the snow removal so the snow removal is happening I don't Envision any changes to that and because of that we did not do a any kind of plan it's sort of already in place um and then lastly and um this is actually in our um in our uh submittal about how many members and how we are calculating and Sarah did a really good job of saying that the calculation is based on occupancy of the space that being said sometimes those occupancies in the large spaces get just out of control with how many people could actually fit in that space which is 653 I think um so we have 170 members in the in the institution granted there could be that many people there could be 650 people in there but that's not the norm with the um parking spaces we have on site and the additional parking spaces next door we could actually grow this institution to almost 500 I think it's for 63 or something on that line I don't have a calculation right with me so there's a tremendous amount of growth available until we actually exceed the parking that is on site and right now the current plan for um for growth uh there are other institutions close that are taking up some of this population um and so as we're looking at this it does not appear anyway right now that we are going to even come close to exceeding that parking for for a minimum of five years we would be looking I in that we still have the occupancy but I want to make clear that we know we are that we are really under what we think what we know for the uh for the institution as far as how many members they have now thank you uh do any of the Commissioners have questions for the applicant no additional questions thank you thank you very much and um as Miss Madden said that you uh were got the staff involvement early in the process and I think we all appreciate that that makes it easier and better for everyone so thank you is there anyone else that'd like to speak to this hi please state your name and your address welcome Mary heinths I live in 1825 East 122nd Street right across from the institution and I'm really glad to hear that the parking is being addressed where I live in the Covington Point Town Home area and right across from our second driveway that's west of 11. there's three um drives that converge kind of on the same spot and I know with the um with a Baptist Church sometimes when they have big functions people park on the street and so my concern was if people start parking on the street by the entrances it's going to be like blind spots so that was my concern so I'm glad that's being addressed so that was my main concern okay thank you uh is there anyone on Zoom or online that wants to address this not that I see um seeing no additional commentary we will close the public hearing at 7 32. and I'll open the floor for discussion to the Commissioners any additional discussion commissioners commissioner Timmerman um Commissioners Wallace Wallace's motion that's on the table um I I mean I want to comment that 100 or sorry that 16th Avenue is a fairly light traffic Road throughout the day during events obviously more cars um I think Depending on time of day you know you're going to be looking at different safety concerns I want to you know share your concern I think this Planning Commission has always put Safety First and I appreciate that um that being said to the applicant um you know this isn't a full-fledged traffic study I think Ms Garros did a good job of describing its frankly it's it's pretty um it's easy compared to some of the red tape you might have to go through for a an actual traffic study I like the thoughts that you already have about the the larger events coning things like that so I think you'll you'll have a fairly uh fairly straightforward time going through that um that being said I support commissioner Wallace's motion I think you know it should be part of the conversation uh it sounds like Miss Madden said that this city is is not inclined to put a crosswalk in there which sense but but at least being aware of what those safety concerns are so I do support commissioner Wallace's motion um I support this project I support the the leasing of the property uh adjacent um I hope that in five years or less you do come back and you know this is a booming institution and and you do have to look at some more parking if that's what you want I think most institutions are looking for that but um but yeah best of luck I think it's to me anyway it's palatable uh thank you commissioner Timmerman I'm going to pose a question does the the concern that you're bringing up uh commissioner Wallace is it covered under the Point number eight as it's written or do we need to add additional language about it I mean I would still include it in as more of an 8A sub bullet um and very similar to what Miss Garros um has addressed okay and Miss Garros did you do you did you write down what this 8A sub bullet is or um because we need to uh write it down so it can become part of the official record just add so that the traffic management plan or or that the site also be reviewed for pedestrian Crossings and any uh possible improvements or things that can be done to ensure safety uh say that again site B reviewed for pin for pedestrian for pedestrian Crossings Crossings and and then the findings can be incorporated into their traffic plan that they're putting together okay I would note too that so the second sentence and the number eight condition so says the traffic management plan shall provide guidelines for standard operating procedures for parking and access during large events you could say parking comma access and pedestrian safety and crossings I like that does the rest of the commission like that is that acceptable to you I will amend my motion to include those additional words in eight as is currently written okay um any further discussion seeing none I will entertain emotion uh I'll second his motion okay so your motion is to approve with the with the additional condition that you but the additional verbiage added to eight was my motion to be then seconded okay so now we've approved we've approved the recommendation and can you just to make it official can you read the oh yes well I was making the emotion just for number eight Amendment but I I can make the full motion I think you make the full emotion with this with this added item and then hold on yeah so we have to vote on his first motion do we have to vote on the on the addition of this uh you'd have to work on the additional Amendment okay um motion seconded we'll take a vote all those in favor say aye aye aye any opposed no uh now I would let uh commissioner Wallace back to recommend that the Planning Commission recommended to the city council approval of the planned unit development Amendment for a religious institution use and Joint parking agreement located at one two one one nine 16th Avenue South subject to the following eight conditions including the amendment to number eight second is there a second to the motion seconded by commissioner Timmerman we'll take a vote all those in favor say aye aye aye any opposed the motion passes unanimously thank you for helping me get through that good team effort uh the next item on our agenda item number seven is updates are there any updates from I'm going to go any updates from commissioners seeing none are there any updates from staff um yes so um obviously our big update today is that we swore in a new planning commissioner this evening um welcome commissioner Hamilton um so uh if you've been paying attention to the city council agendas um with commissioner Wallace's resignation from the Planning Commission um Al Anderson Who currently serves on the economic development commission has been appointed to the new Planning Commission alternate position to replace commissioner Wallace and his first meeting will be the first Planning Commission meeting in October as part of the Planning Commission additional updates on ongoing items with the Planning Commission so I've been trying to provide updates periodically about the zoning code update and so we've received the clearance to um kind of move back forward with the project so you should be receiving something by email likely in the beginning of October which would be the opening of the next public comment period for the residential drafted chapter before that happens you'll receive some email Communications from Regina Dean our assistant community development director informing all of our volunteer commissions of what's been decided on that so I would say stay tuned for communication on that as of right now we do not have any items currently scheduled for the next September Planning Commission meeting so so um so I would say watch your inbox to see but um this moment it does appear that that meeting will be canceled um so your next Planning Commission meeting will be Monday October 9th Canadian Thanksgiving um good to know commissioner Wallace yes uh with that stated update um if we are definitely going to cancel September 25th I would still like to propose an outing of my fellow Commissioners and staff do we have to put anything out publicly to say we're getting together for unofficial business yes we do and we can post that if a location is decided on we would just have to post it on the cities I think website and on the bulletin board that there will be an informal meeting of planning Commissioners and the location yeah you want to pick the spot now I think last time we gathered for an unofficial outing was Clive's and I think you know it's a good central location if that works for both my fellow Commissioners and staff that's what you're hoping for yes I in case something comes up or if it doesn't come up while we still have an agenda all right yes we will make that voted and send out an email to all of the Commissioners excellent um so if we are skipping the 925 uh official Planning Commission meeting that means this is your last commission your Planning Commission meeting commissioner Wallace and I want to thank you for your service and just Express how much I've enjoyed working with you up here thank you very much uh it's definitely been an honor and a privilege uh to serve with my fellow Commissioners and staff unfortunately it's only been a little over two years um I was looking for some additional time but um it's truly been an experience uh definitely encouraged the general public to volunteer in their Community I've learned a lot over the years on the several several commissions I've been on with both the city and the county and it is definitely heartfelt to say I have appreciated my time and it's with mixed emotions that I'm leaving but I'm moving to Savage so I'll be right next door um and maybe get on their Planning Commission and maybe have future communications back and forth somehow but no truly thank you all very much I've truly appreciated it and you're all great people so thank you with that I would entertain a motion to adjourn commissioner Wallace going out strong I'll make a motion to adjourn on my potentially final meeting excellent is there a second to the section commission second by commissioner Hamilton all those in favor say aye aye our meeting is adjourned thank you thank you