>>JOSEPH CITRO: CITY COUNCIL IS BACK IN SESSION. ROLL CALL, PLEASE. >>BILL CARLSON: HERE. >> VIERA? MANISCALCO? >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: HERE. >>LYNN HURTAK: HERE. >> GUDES? MIRANDA? >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: HERE. >>JOSEPH CITRO: HERE. THANK YOU. AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 7, FILE NUMBER E2022-8, CHAPTER 27. >>ERIC COTTON: ERIC COTTON, LAND DEVELOPMENT COORDINATION. CAN WE GET THE PRESENTATION UP FROM WHERE WE LEFT OFF? AWESOME. THIS IS, I THINK, THE MOMENT WE'VE ALL BEEN WAITING FOR, WHICH IS ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS AND THE PROPOSED CHANGES TO THE CODE. ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS, QUICK BACKGROUND, THEY ARE ALLOWED IN THE CITY IN TWO LOCATIONS. ONE, LOWRY PARK CENTRAL, WHICH WAS A PRIVATELY INITIATED TEXT AMENDMENT, 2003-2004 TIME FRAME. AND, OF COURSE, IN SEMINOLE HEIGHTS, WHICH WAS ADOPTED BY COUNCIL, WHEN THE CITY ADOPTED SH DISTRICT. WHAT WE DON'T HAVE IN THE CODE IS A DEFINITION OF WHAT AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT. THE LANGUAGE THAT'S PROPOSED THAT YOU CAN SEE UP THERE, IS A DWELLING UNIT THAT SERVES AS AN ACCESSORY USE FOR PRINCIPAL USE. THAT IS MIMICKED IN THE STATE LANGUAGE THAT'S IN FLORIDA STATUTES. I DON'T KNOW IF YOU WANT TO HAVE ANY QUESTIONS AS WE GO FROM SLIDE TO SLIDE. HOW WOULD COUNCIL LIKE TO HANDLE THAT? >>JOSEPH CITRO: ANY COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS? >>ERIC COTTON: THERE ARE A LOT OF SECTIONS. DO YOU WANT TO GO THROUGH ALL OF THEM OR DO YOU HAVE QUESTIONS AND PAUSE? >>JOSEPH CITRO: I'D LIKE TO. AND IF WE HAVE QUESTIONS ALONG THE WAY OR TOWARD THE END OF EACH SECTION, WE'LL HAVE QUESTIONS ASKED. >>ERIC COTTON: OKAY. SO ONE OF THE APPEALS THAT CITY COUNCIL HEARS ON A REGULAR BASIS IS WHEN SOMEONE APPLIES FOR AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT IN SEMINOLE HEIGHTS OR EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCE ELSEWHERE IN THE CITY, THEY ARE PUTTING IT INTO A DETACHED STRUCTURE IN THE BACKYARD, INSTEAD OF THE REQUIRED THREE FEET, THREE FEET IS AT TWO AND A HALF FEET. ADMINISTRATIVELY, STAFF DENIES THAT REQUEST. THEY APPEAL TO COUNCIL AND COUNCIL HEARS THE ARGUMENTS AND PROBABLY 95% OF THE TIME HAS WAIVED THAT REQUIRED SETBACK AND GRANTED A RELIEF TO THAT SECTION OF CHAPTER 27-132. SO THE LANGUAGE THAT'S UP HERE IS FOR LANGUAGE FOR BOTH EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCES AND FOR ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS IS VERY SIMILAR. FOR AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT, IT CANNOT BE LOCATED IN A NONCONFORMING ACCESSORY STRUCTURE, STRUCTURE MADE CONFORMING AS A RESULT OF VARIANCE. SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENCE MIMICS THE SAME LANGUAGE. WHAT THIS IS PROPOSING IS ALLOWING STAFF TO APPROVE THOSE INSTANCES WHERE THE STRUCTURE IS NONCONFORMING. INSTEAD OF HAVING TO COME TO COUNCIL FOR A PETITION FOR REVIEW AND ADDING ANOTHER 45, 60 DAYS' WORTH OF TIME, THIS WOULD ELIMINATE THAT. WHAT HAPPENS NOW FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO CAME FROM THE VARIANCE REVIEW BOARD, CHAIR CITRO AND COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK, WHEN A VARIANCE IS GRANTED, THAT STRUCTURE NOW HAS STANDING, SO TO SPEAK, TO STAY THERE. IF THEY WERE TO REMODEL IN THE FUTURE, KNOCK IT DOWN, THEY COULD GO BACK TO THAT TWO FOOT SETBACK. WITH THIS LANGUAGE, IF IT'S APPROVED, THEY KNOCK DOWN THAT STRUCTURE, CATCHES ON FIRE, WHATEVER, THEY HAVE TO BUILD IT BACK TO THE REQUIRED SETBACKS FOR THE ZONING DISTRICT IT'S IN. THAT WOULDN'T MEET THAT REQUIREMENT. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ANY COMMENTS? ANY QUESTIONS? COUNCILMAN MIRANDA. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: WE'RE ON NUMBER 7, RIGHT, MR. CHAIRMAN? >>JOSEPH CITRO: YES. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: AS I READ, AN ACCESSORY DWELLING, SINGLE-FAMILY DWELLING WITH SEPARATE ENTRANCE. IS THIS FOR A FAMILY MEMBER WE'RE TALKING ABOUT? >>ERIC COTTON: EXTENDED FAMILY OR FOR THE FAMILY MEMBER WHEN THEY GO THROUGH THE SPECIAL USE. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I BELIEVE IN THE TRUST BUT VERIFY. HOW DO WE KNOW THEY ARE A FAMILY MEMBER? IN OTHER WORDS, WHEN YOU COME INTO THIS COUNTRY YOU HAVE TO FILL OUT A BUNCH OF FORMS. YOU HAVE TO BE PROCESSED AND SO FORTH AND SO ON. YOU PUT A FAMILY MEMBER TO CHECK ALL THAT OUT. DO WE REALLY CHECK THEM OUT OR TAKE THEIR WORD? >>ERIC COTTON: THEY SIGN AN AFFIDAVIT AND NORMALLY PEOPLE SUBMIT EITHER LIKE WEDDING LICENSE, THEY ARE MARRIED OR SUBMIT THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE WHO THEIR MOM WAS OR FATHER. THEY ARE REQUIRED TO SUBMIT -- >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I'M NOT OPPOSED TO -- WHAT'S HAPPENING IN THIS CITY IS THIS. THERE ARE HOUSES THAT ARE BOUGHT. THERE ARE HOUSES THAT HAVE BEEN THERE FOR 30 YEARS AND HAVE HAD AN ACCESSORY DWELLING WITHOUT RESIDENCY, THE DWELLING OF A MEMBER. AND THOSE -- LET ME USE AN EXAMPLE LIKE I DID TODAY. LET'S SAY MY HOUSE WHERE I LIVE AT $800 A YEAR TAXES BECAUSE I LIVE -- BUT A HOUSE LIKE MINE THAT'S NOT HOMESTEADED, IT IS ABOUT $3,000 A YEAR. BECAUSE WHY? IT'S NO LONGER A SINGLE-FAMILY USE AND NOT HOMESTEADED. BEEN THERE 20, 30 YEARS, THEY'VE BEEN COLLECTED RENT AND I CAN VERIFY EVERYTHING I'M SAYING TO YOU. WHEN I SAY YOU, SIR, NOT YOU DIRECTLY. JUST YOU SIMPLE. THEY PAY NOTHING TO THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT IN INCOME BECAUSE STILL UNDER THEIR NAME, WATER BILL IS UNDER THEIR WATER BILL. THE ELECTRIC BILL IS UNDER THEM. BUT THEY ARE COLLECTING RENT BELIEVE ME WHEN I TELL YOU. THERE WERE 232 OF THESE FOUND IN A SMALL SECTION OF WHERE I LIVE. NOTICE I'M NOT MENTIONING NAMES OF WHERE I LIVE. THAT WAS ONLY A SMALL SECTION. IT COULD BE A THOUSAND OF THEM WHERE I LIVE. NOW, THE SCHOOL BOARD WAS LOOKING FOR MONEY. I LOOKED AT MY BILL JUST LAST NIGHT, AND I'LL ROUND IT OFF TO $2,000 INSTEAD SO I CAN EQUATE THE SYSTEM. 1,000 OF THAT 2,000 IN AD VALOREM TAXES GOES TO THE SCHOOL BOARD. THE OTHER 500 TO THE COUNTY AND 500 TO THE CITY OR THEREABOUTS, A FEW DOLLARS APART. YOU KNOW HOW MUCH REVENUE IS BEING LEFT ON THE TABLE? MILLIONS, JUST BECAUSE IT'S BECAUSE. I'M NOT BLAMING THIS ADMINISTRATION. LET ME SAY THAT. I'M NOT BLAMING THIS ADMINISTRATION. THIS HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR VARIOUS ADMINISTRATIONS. NOW I'M SUPPOSED TO TAKE THIS AND SWALLOW THE PILL IN MY SAME NEIGHBORHOOD AND ONE BLOCK THERE'S THREE OF THEM. ONE VERY CLOSE TO WHERE I LIVE. GOT AT LEAST THREE TO FOUR APARTMENTS. HOW DO THEY DO IT? WHEN YOU SEE THE OPENING OF A GATE, THAT THE OUTSIDE IS WHERE YOU PUT THE KEY IN, YOU GOT A PROBLEM. IT DOESN'T TAKE A KID FROM YBOR CITY TO UNDERSTAND THAT. IN FACT, 10, 15 YEARS AGO, GUESS WHAT, AT MY OWN HOUSE WHERE I LIVED, I GOT CITED. I SAID HOW CAN I BE RENTING WHEN YOU CAN'T GET IN THE BACK OR THE FRONT? TH LOCKS ARE ON THE INSIDE AND NOT THE OUTSIDE. I SHOWED TO THEM. SOMEBODY MUST HAVE SAID HE'S DOING THAT BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T LIKE WHAT I WAS DOING. IT'S GOT TO BE STOPPED. TAXPAYERS ARE SUBSIDIZING THOSE INDIVIDUALS. THEY ARE NOT PAID THEIR FAIR SHARE OF AD VALOREM TAX AND THEY ARE PAYING NO INCOME TAX ON THE EARNINGS. AND THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO BE NEW AMERICANS. THEY ARE MY KIND. MY NATIONALITY AND I DON'T LIKE IT. DO YOU KNOW OF ANYTHING WE'RE GOING TO DO ABOUT THAT? ARE WE GOING TO DO THIS WITHOUT DOING THAT? >>ERIC COTTON: WHAT YOU'RE DESCRIBING WOULD NOT BE LEGAL. THIS DOES NOT ADDRESS THOSE ISSUES AT ALL. THOSE ARE CODE ENFORCEMENT ISSUES AND CODE ENFORCEMENT -- YOU'RE AWARE THEY DID A SWEEP OF WEST TAMPA PROBABLY ABOUT TEN YEARS AGO AND THEY CITED A NUMBER OF RESIDENTS THAT WERE LIKE THAT. THE ONES THAT ARE ILLEGAL GET CITED. THE ONES THAT ARE NOT ILLEGAL WOULD NOT BE CITED. THIS WOULDN'T ADDRESS THAT ANYWAY. THIS IS FOR EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCES WHICH IS STILL AN ISSUE, ONE, EVEN IN THE CODE TODAY WOULD STILL REMAIN THAT. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: GOING TO BE CITYWIDE OR JUST IN CERTAIN AREAS OF THE CITY? >>ERIC COTTON: THIS LANGUAGE -- WELL, THE LANGUAGE THAT WAS ON THE SCREEN IS CITYWIDE. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: CITYWIDE. CAN BE ANY PART OF THE CITY. >>ERIC COTTON: CORRECT. EXTENDING FAMILY RESIDENCES. THEY STILL REMAIN SPECIAL USES. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT. WHAT I DO HAVE A PROBLEM, IN CASE WE SEGREGATE IN CERTAIN PARTS OF THE CITY BECAUSE THEN WE'RE NOT APPLYING THE LAW EQUAL. WE'RE DIVIDING IT THE WAY WE WANT, ONLY CERTAIN PARTS OF THE CITY RECEIVE THAT. THE OTHER PART DOES NOT. >>ERIC COTTON: THAT WILL COME -- THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS WHERE THEY ARE ALLOWED IS FURTHER IN THIS PRESENTATION. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ANY OTHER QUESTIONS AT THIS TIME? COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. >>LYNN HURTAK: I WAS GOING TO SAVE THIS COMMENT FOR LATER, BUT SINCE IT'S BEEN BROUGHT UP ABOUT EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCES, I FIND THIS TOPIC, THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS AND EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCE VERY CONFUSING. I REALLY THINK WE SHOULD DO AWAY WITH EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCES AND FIND A WAY TO PUT IT ALL TOGETHER. I'LL SAY THAT RIGHT NOW. I WOULD REALLY LOVE TO HAVE A DISCUSSION ON THAT AT SOME POINT BECAUSE THIS IS CONFUSING. HE'S RIGHT. WE SIMPLY DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH CODE ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS TO CHECK ON THESE THINGS. AND, YES, I REALIZE THAT THAT MIGHT HAVE SOME TAX IMPLICATIONS FOR SOME PEOPLE. AGAIN, THIS IS WHY WE NEED TO DISCUSS IT, BUT IT IS TOO MUCH OF A BURDEN ON THE CITY. I TECHNICALLY HAVE AN EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCE, AND IN SEVEN YEARS, NO ONE HAS EVER COME TO INVESTIGATE. SET UP TIMES AND THEN THEY KEEP CANCELING. YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO BE CHECKED ONCE A YEAR, AND IT'S JUST NEVER HAPPENED FOR US. SO IT'S ONE OF THOSE THINGS THAT IF IT'S NOT HAPPENING FOR ME, IT'S PROBABLY NOT HAPPENING FOR OTHER PEOPLE AND THEN OTHER PEOPLE ARE TAKING ADVANTAGE OF THAT SYSTEM. AND SO I SEE EXACTLY WHAT COUNCILMAN MIRANDA IS SAYING. I THINK THAT WHEN WE'RE REDOING THIS, THIS IS THE PERFECT TIME TO LOOK AT TAKING THESE AWAY AND FIGURING OUT JUST ONE METHOD. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN GUDES. >>ORLANDO GUDES: WE TALKED THIS MORNING ABOUT THE PROCESS. I'M JUST TRYING TO FIGURE WHAT IS OUR PROCESS? SOMEONE GOES AND APPLY? MY THING IS IF YOU'RE APPLYING, WE SHOULD HAVE A REGISTER, A TALLY SO WE CAN TRUST AND VERIFY. SO WHAT IS OUR PROCESS? >>ERIC COTTON: CURRENTLY IN THE CODE FOR BOTH AN EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCE AND AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT, THEY ARE BOTH SPECIAL USE 1s, WHICH IS THE ADMINISTRATIVE PROCESS REQUIRED, NOTICE SPECIFIC STANDARDS THAT THE APPLICANT HAS TO MEET FOR EXTENDED FAMILY, ONE OF THOSE IT HAS TO BE A RELATIVE, CAN'T BE SEPARATELY METERED, THOSE KINDS OF ISSUES BUT THEY ARE BOTH SPECIAL USES REQUIRING NOTICE. THEY SUBMIT A SITE PLAN, REVIEW THE SITE PLAN, PROVIDE EVIDENCE OF WHO IS SUPPOSED TO BE LIVING THERE. IF THEY MEET THE CRITERIA SET FORTH IN THE CODE WE CAN APPROVE IT. IF THEY CAN'T MEET THE CRITERIA, WE DENY IT AND FILE TO COME BEFORE CITY COUNCIL. >>ORLANDO GUDES: REGARDLESS IF A FAMILY MEMBER, IT IS A BACK DWELLER. EVEN IN YOU DIDN'T HAVE A FAMILY MEMBER LIVING THERE, SHOULDN'T THAT STILL BE REGISTERED OR CAN WE PUT THAT REGARDLESS OF A FAMILY MEMBER? THAT WAY WE'RE COLLECTING THE TAXES ON THAT? >>ERIC COTTON: WELL, MY UNDERSTANDING FROM THE PROPERTY APPRAISER'S OFFICE, EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCES BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT INCOME GENERATED ARE NOT TAX. THERE IS NO ADDITIONAL TAX ON THEM. ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS, WHICH IS WHAT WE'RE GOING TO BE DISCUSSING LATER ON IN THIS PRESENTATION ARE TAXED. THE PROPERTY APPRAISER DOES ASSIGN A VALUE AND THEY DO TAX THOSE. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I'M NOT TRYING TO TAKE OVER THE HEARING OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT. ANY BUILDING OTHER THAN YOUR FAMILY BUILDING, IF YOU PUT A SHED IN THE BACK, GUESS WHAT, YOU PAY EXTRA FOR THE SHED. >>ERIC COTTON: CORRECT. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: NOW WE'RE SAYING THAT BECAUSE WE HAVE -- AND I CAN SHOW YOU WHERE PEOPLE HAVE ENCLOSED THEIR CARPORT AND CHARGING SIX OR SEVEN HUNDRED DOLLARS ON THE SIDE OF A CARPORT, NO BIGGER THAN HERE FROM MR. -- SQUARE. LET'S SAY 16 BY 10 AND THEY ARE GETTING $600 A MONTH. THERE IS A TOILET, A LITTLE BED, AND A TV SET. AND YOU TOOK ON A LITTLE COLEMAN GAS STOVE OR WHATEVER. >>ORLANDO GUDES: HOT PLATE. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: THAT'S RIGHT. AND THEY CHARGE FOR THAT. HERE, I'M NOT TRYING TO STAY AWAY FROM WHAT YOU GOT, BUT HOW IN THE WORLD CAN SOMEBODY HAVE SOMEBODY THAT'S REAL PROPERTY NOW AND NOT BE TAXED? >>ERIC COTTON: THOSE UNITS LIKE THAT ARE ILLEGAL. I'LL BE HONEST WITH YOU, WHEN PEOPLE COME IN AND FILE FOR -- THEY GET CITED BY CODE ENFORCEMENT. THEY GO THROUGH A PROCESS FORMAL DECISION OF THE ZONING ADMINISTRATOR WHERE THEY TRY TO PRESENT EVIDENCE THAT THE USE WAS LEGALLY ESTABLISHED EITHER, A, PRIOR TO ZONING. A LOT OF TIMES THEY WERE ESTABLISHED THREE YEARS AGO. DECISION IS DENIED. CODE ENFORCEMENT THEN CONTINUES WITH THAT PROCESS OF CODE ENFORCEMENT TO MAKE THEM -- TRY TO MAKE THEM REMOVE THE SECOND UNIT. WHEN PEOPLE COME IN AND THEY TALK TO ME AND SAY WE'RE GOING TO PROVE, JUST SO YOU KNOW, IF IT'S FINDING IN YOUR FAVOR, THE PROPERTY APPRAISER WILL ON OCCASION TRY TO GO BACK AND COLLECT BACKTAXES ON PEOPLE. IF THE UNITS WERE ILLEGALLY ESTABLISHED OR LEGALLY ESTABLISHED, THEY HAVE THE ABILITY TO GO BACK AND SAY, HEY, YOU OWE US FOR THE PAST SIX YEARS. YOU COLLECTED THIS MUCH. YOU HAD THE SECOND UNIT THAT WAS INCOME-GENERATING, YOU OWE US MONEY. IF THEY ARE SUCCESSFUL AT THAT, I DON'T KNOW. THAT'S NOT US. THAT'S THE PROPERTY APPRAISER'S OFFICE. >>ABBYE FEELEY: IF I CAN JUST ADD, ABBYE FEELEY, THE DISCUSSION TODAY, I SEE WHERE IT'S GOING IN RELATION TO THE TAXES AND THAT, BUT WE'RE NOT THE TAXING AUTHORITY, YOU KNOW, THE PROPERTY APPRAISER IS. WHAT WE'RE HERE ON TODAY, I WANT TO PULL IT BACK TO THAT FORWARD SECOND IS YOU'VE HAD SEVERAL APPEALS COME TO YOU OVER THE PAST COUPLE OF YEARS RELATED TO NONCONFORMING STRUCTURES, STRUCTURES THAT HAVE A TWO-FOOT DETACHED UNIT THAT'S ALREADY EXISTING ON A PROPERTY AND THEY WANT TO PUT EITHER AN EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCE IN THERE OR AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT IN THERE. AND THE CHANGE WE HAD PROPOSED WAS THE CODE CURRENTLY DOESN'T ALLOW IT BECAUSE IT'S NONCONFORMING. WHEN THEY COME TO YOU ON APPEAL, YOU'RE GRANTING IT AND SAYING, OKAY, WE'LL LET THAT USE GO IN THERE, AND THAT MAKES THAT STRUCTURE THEN CONFORMING% BECAUSE YOU'RE GRANTING THAT THIS SAYS WILL ALLOW THEM TO GO INTO THOSE NONCONFORMING STRUCTURES THE WAY THEY ARE NOW AND IT LEAVES THOSE STRUCTURES AS NONCONFORMING. SO I KNOW THIS IS A MULTIFACETED DISCUSSION. WE WANT TO TALK ABOUT ALL THOSE DIFFERENT ELEMENTS BUT I WANT TO KIND OF KEEP THIS ON TRACK AS FAR AS WHAT IS ENFORCEABLE FROM THE TAXING AUTHORITY OR FROM CODE ENFORCEMENT VERSUS WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO WITH THE CODE HERE TODAY. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: NO ONE SAID THAT WE'RE THE TAXING UNIT. HOWEVER, WE ARE THE ONES LETTING IT HAPPEN. WE'RE THE ONES THAT FOR ONE REASON OR ANOTHER, CODE ENFORCEMENT MAYBE WORKS SATURDAYS, SUNDAYS, I DON'T REALLY KNOW. I KNOW THEY DO GO OUT IF THEY ARE CALLED. WE DON'T HAVE THE PROPER TOOLS TO LET THEM DO THEIR JOB FULLY. THEY CAN CITE SOMEBODY AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT HAPPENS. IN FACT, THE OTHER DAY I WAS DRIVING AROUND AND I REMEMBER THREE OF THEM ON ONE STREET. I'LL GIVE YOU THE ADDRESSES BECAUSE ALL OF A SUDDEN WE HAD IT ON THE AGENDA THREE OR FOUR YEARS AGO AND THEN WHEN I WAS DRIVING AROUND, IT DISAPPEARED. I NEVER HEARD WHAT HAPPENED. IT WAS SUPPOSED TO COME TO COUNCIL. IT WAS SET FOR ANOTHER DATE AND NEVER CAME BACK. >>ABBYE FEELEY: IF YOU'D GIVE% THOSE TO US I WOULD BE HAPPY TO GET BACK WITH YOU ON THAT. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I JUST WANT CLARITY THAT IT'S GOT TO STOP. THERE'S OVER A THOUSAND UNITS THAT I CAN POINT OUT TO YOU. I KNOW 232 FOR SURE IN A SMALL AREA. YOU MULTIPLY THAT BY TEN TIMES OF THE AREA, I'LL MAKE AN ASSUMPTION, THERE'S GOT TO BE A THOUSAND. THERE'S NOT ONE BLOCK WHERE I LIVE THAT DOESN'T HAVE AT LEAST ONE OR TWO OF THEM AND NOBODY DOES ANYTHING. >>ABBYE FEELEY: UNDERSTOOD. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: LET IT HAPPEN. LET IT BE HAPPY. NOBODY PAYS THE TAX. MEANTIME, THEY ARE CRITICIZING THE GOVERNMENT. >>ABBYE FEELEY: UNDERSTOOD. I JUST DON'T WANT US TO BLOCK PROGRESS ON LOOKING AT THIS IN THE ZONING LIGHT VERSUS THE ENFORCEMENT LIGHT. AND THE ENFORCEMENT NEEDS TO BE HANDLED SEPARATELY. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: BUT IF WE PASS THE ZONING, IT CLEARS UP EVERYTHING, WE DON'T HAVE TO HAVE ENFORCEMENT. >>ABBYE FEELEY: NO, UNFORTUNATELY, IT DOES NOT. IT DOESN'T MAKE THINGS ILLEGAL LEGAL JUST BECAUSE WE DO THAT. ENFORCEMENT IS STILL THE KEY TO BRINGING THAT ISSUE INTO COMPLIANCE. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: OUR PROBLEM IS THAT I NEVER SEE THE END OF IT WHERE SOMETHING IS RESOLVED. THAT'S IT. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. >>LYNN HURTAK: TO BRING IT BACK TO THIS, I -- SO WHAT YOU'RE SAYING HERE IS THAT IF SOMEONE HAS AN OLD GARAGE AND THEY WANT TO TRANSFORM IT INTO AN ADU, THEY WILL BE ALLOWED TO DO IT, BUT IF THAT GARAGE BURNS DOWN, THEY'LL HAVE TO REBUILD IT TO @T. >>ABBYE FEELEY: YES. >>LYNN HURTAK: THAT'S FINE. AS LONG AS WE CAN USE THE STRUCTURES THAT ARE HABIT -- OR THAT COULD POSSIBLY BE USE. I KNOW THERE ARE A LOT OF HISTORIC GARAGES IN SOME PARTS OF THE COMMUNITY THAT ACTUALLY ON THE VARIANCE REVIEW BOARD SAW SEVERAL OF THOSE. I WOULDN'T WANT THAT TO BE STOPPED. THANK YOU. THAT ANSWERS MY QUESTION. >>ABBYE FEELEY: BECAUSE THE CHALLENGE TODAY IS WHEN THEY APPEAL IT AND YOU GRANT IT AND THE TWO AND TWO OR WHATEVER THAT SETBACK IS, ZERO, THAT'S WHAT THEY GET IF IT BURNS DOWN. THEY GET TO GO BACK TO ZERO. AND OUR GOAL WITH NONCONFORMITIES IN THE CITY IS TO EVENTUALLY HAVE THOSE THINGS BECOME CONFORMING. SO WE DON'T WANT TO CONTINUE TO PROLIFERATE THEM. WE WANT TO IDENTIFY THEM, USE THEIR LIVES, HAVE THINGS CONFORM TO THE CODE. >>LYNN HURTAK: THANK YOU. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS? IF I MAY, MS. FEELEY, ARE WE JUST TALKING SETBACK CONFORMITIES? OR ARE WE TALKING HEIGHT? ARE WE TALKING PERMEABLE SPACES SINCE THEY ARE ALL NONCONFORMING TO THOSE ALSO? IF YOU HAVE AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE IN YOUR BACKYARD AND IT MEETS THE SETBACKS BUT IT'S 15-FOOT IS THE HEIGHT FOR ACCESSORY STRUCTURE. IF IT'S 25 FEET, ARE WE CONFORMING THAT ALSO. >>ERIC COTTON: THAT WOULD BE CORRECT. >>JOSEPH CITRO: IF SOMEBODY'S BACKYARD IS TOTALLY PAVED AND SOMEBODY BUILT THIS ACCESSORY STRUCTURE, THERE'S NO PERMEABLE SPACE. ARE WE CONFORMING THAT ALSO? >>ABBYE FEELEY: NO, BECAUSE THAT -- THE PERMEABLE HAS A RESOLUTION. WHEN YOU GO OVER 50%, YOU HAVE TO RETAIN HALF INCH ON YOUR PROPERTY. YOU HAVE TO PUT IN A PIPE SYSTEM AND OTHER THINGS. THAT'S NOT A NONCONFORMING CHARACTERISTIC THAT YOU WOULD BE ALLOWING AT THAT POINT. THEY WOULD STILL HAVE TO COMPLY WITH THAT ELEMENT. IT IS THE DIMENSIONAL REGULATIONS. >>JOSEPH CITRO: THANK YOU. THE CONFORMITY WILL BE THE SETBACKS, THE HEIGHT, AND THE SIDES, THE SQUARE FOOT SIDES. >>ABBYE FEELEY: YES. >>JOSEPH CITRO: THANK YOU. COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. >>LYNN HURTAK: BUT TO FOLLOW THAT, YES, 15 FEET, BUT WHAT IF IT'S A GARAGE APARTMENT? >>ERIC COTTON: AGAIN -- >>ABBYE FEELEY: IT'S STILL A NONCONFORMITY. >>ERIC COTTON: COULD STILL BE A NONCONFORMITY. BULK HEIGHT SETBACKS THAT'S WHAT WE'RE DISCUSSING. >>LYNN HURTAK: SO 15 FEET IS ENOUGH FOR A HEIGHT OF A GARAGE AND A GARAGE APARTMENT? >>ABBYE FEELEY: ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT AN EXISTING STRUCTURE? >>LYNN HURTAK: YES. NO, JUST -- SO, YES. SAY YOU HAVE AN EXISTING STRUCTURE THAT'S TWO FEET AND IT BURNS DOWN AND YOU HAVE AN APARTMENT AND A GARAGE UNDER IT, AND THEN YOU WANT TO REBUILD IT BECAUSE IT BURNT DOWN, YOU WOULD IN ESSENCE NOT BE ABLE TO DO THAT BECAUSE YOU WOULD ONLY HAVE 15 FEET HEIGHT. >>ABBYE FEELEY: OR YOU MEET PRINCIPAL STRUCTURE SETBACKS. IN ORDER TO GO ABOVE 15 FEET IN HEIGHT, YOU MEET PRINCIPAL STRUCTURE SETBACKS. BUT I DON'T WANT TO GET CAUGHT UP IN THE NEW ADU CONSTRUCTION. I WANT TO TRY TO HANDLE THESE -- IT'S A VERY MULTIFACETED DISCUSSION. BUT I DO WANT TO TRY TO HANDLE THESE ONE STEP AT A TIME. THE FIRST WAS, HEY, LET'S GET A DEFINITION FOR THIS IN OUR CODE. THE SECOND WAS ALLOWING THEM IN NONCONFORMING STRUCTURES WHICH CURRENTLY THEY ARE NOT ALLOWED. THEY COME TO YOU ON APPEAL AND COUNCIL IS GRANTING THEM BECAUSE IT IS APPROPRIATE TO TRY TO USE THAT HOUSING STOCK OR THAT BUILDING STOCK. THAT WAS NUMBER TWO. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS? COUNCILMAN CARLSON. >>BILL CARLSON: A LOT OF PEOPLE ONLINE AND OTHER PLACES HAVE BEEN ASKING ABOUT AirBnBs. I KNOW WE'RE PREEMPTED BY STATE LAW. DOES THIS ALLOW PEOPLE TO HAVE TWO PLACES FOR AirBnB OR IS IT ALL ONE? >>ABBYE FEELEY: I DON'T KNOW THAT US ALLOWING THIS IN NONCONFORMING STRUCTURES IS GOING TO BE IMPACTING HOW AirBnB. IF YOU HAVE TWO UNITS ON YOUR PROPERTY TODAY IN HYDE PARK AND YOU'RE ALLOWED TO AirBnB BOTH OF THEM. YOU WOULD BE ALLOWED TO AIRBNB. WE'RE PREEMPTED BY THE STATE IN THE REGULATION OF AirBnB. >>BILL CARLSON: IF PEOPLE WERE BUILDING NEW ONES, THAT WOULD PROVIDE TWO UNITS FOR AirBnB ON THEIR PROPERTY. >>ERIC COTTON: THEORETICALLY, YES. >>ABBYE FEELEY: JUST LIKE IF YOU'RE BUILDING TWO TOWNHOMES AND THEY ARE NOT FOR SALE. IT'S TWO UNITS. BECAUSE ADU AND PRINCIPAL UNIT, IT'S TWO UNITS. IF IT'S A HUNDRED CONDOS, IT'S A HUNDRED CONDOS. YES. >>JOSEPH CITRO: YOU CAN THANK TALLAHASSEE FOR THAT. COUNCILMAN VIERA. >>LUIS VIERA: THANK YOU, SIR. APPRECIATE THAT. QUICK QUESTION. I KNOW THIS WAS MENTIONED BEFORE. FOR THIS, ADUs, ET CETERA, PLACES WITH DEED RESTRICTIONS, ET CETERA, CDDs, WHATNOT, OBVIOUSLY THIS WOULD BE INAPPLICABLE I WOULD ASSUME. >>ABBYE FEELEY: CORRECT. >>LUIS VIERA: MUCH OF NEW TAMPA, FOR EXAMPLE, THIS WOULDN'T BE APPLICABLE. I THINK THAT IS OPEN AND OBVIOUS, BUT JUST SAY IT. SOMETHING THAT COUNCILMAN CARLSON SAID WITH AirBnB, THAT IS A CONCERN FOR A LOT OF FOLKS AND IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE REALLY -- YOU KNOW, IF WE DO GO FORWARD WITH SOMETHING ON ADUs, WHICH I SUPPORT. I THINK IT'S SOMETHING THAT IS SMART, ESPECIALLY RIGHT NOW WITH OUR HOUSING CRISIS, BUT WE OBVIOUSLY HAVE TO MEASURE AND KEEP TAB OF ANY UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES AND WHATNOT. AND WE HAVE TO JUST KEEP ABREAST OF THAT. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN GUDES. >>ORLANDO GUDES: ONLY THING I'M LEERY ABOUT, MR. VIERA BROUGHT IT UP, GOOD POINT. CERTAIN COMMUNITIES HAVE CDDs AND DEED-RESTRICTED AREAS. I'M JUST CONCERNED THAT PUTTING THESE ALL OVER THE CITY, ESPECIALLY IN SOME ALREADY BLIGHTED COMMUNITIES WILL BRING ON MORE BLIGHT. I'M KIND OF NERVOUS ABOUT THE CONSTRUCTION AND BUILDING OF THESE. PERMITTING AND THINGS. I'M JUST CONCERNED. >>ABBYE FEELEY: WE HAVEN'T GOTTEN THERE YET. WE HAVEN'T GOTTEN THERE YET. THESE ARE EXISTING NONCONFORMING STRUCTURES THAT ARE ON THE GROUND TODAY AND COULD THEY BE ALLOWED TO USE THOSE FOR EITHER EFR, EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCE OR ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS. WE'RE STILL ON WHAT WE HAVE IN THE CITY TODAY. WE HAVEN'T GOTTEN TO ANY OF THE NEW STUFF. WE PROMISE YOU WHEN WE GET THERE WE'LL LET YOU KNOW. WE'RE NOT THERE YET. THAT'S WHERE WE ARE ON THIS ITEM. ALL EXISTING EITHER DETACHED, THEY ARE DETACHED ACCESSORY STRUCTURES THAT EITHER DON'T COMPLY WITH THE SETBACK OR A HEIGHT REGULATION THAT WOULD NOW BE ALLOWED TO BE USED FOR THIS. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. >>LYNN HURTAK: JUST A THOUGHT, MAYBE WE SHOULD APPROVE THESE AS WE GO BECAUSE THE FIRST ONE, APPROVING THE DEFINITION, I THINK WE'RE ALL OKAY WITH THAT AT THIS POINT. I THINK WE'RE ALL OKAY WITH THIS AT THIS POINT. JUST SO WE DON'T GET CONFUSED DOWN THE ROAD BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY WE'RE HAVING A LOT OF CONVERSATIONS AS WE GO. HOW DOES EVERYBODY FEEL LIKE THAT? SO I MOVE THE FIRST TWO. >> SECOND. >>JOSEPH CITRO: A MOTION MADE BY -- DO WE WANT TO TAKE THEM SEPARATELY? >>MARTIN SHELBY: SO THE ACTION SUMMARY COMES UP CLEAN. MADAM CLERK, ARE YOU OKAY WITH THAT? >>LYNN HURTAK: CAN YOU GO BACK AND I CAN SAY WHAT THE OTHER ONE IS? >>ABBYE FEELEY: I HAD A TABLE IN THE FRONT. DEFINITION. ADDING A DEFINITION OF ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT TO THE CODE, 2743 IS THE FIRST ONE. >>LYNN HURTAK: 2743 AND THEN IF YOU HOP TO THE NEXT ONE, 27132, I MOVE BOTH OF THOSE. >> SECOND. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: MR. CHAIRMAN, I HAVE A QUESTION ON THE MOTION. >>ABBYE FEELEY: PUBLIC COMMENT. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I CAN VOTE ON ONE PART BUT NOT ON THE OTHER PART. >>JOSEPH CITRO: WE'LL TAKE THEM SEPARATELY. >>LYNN HURTAK: OKAY. DEFINITION. 2743. >>JOSEPH CITRO: DO WE HAVE ANY PUBLIC COMMENT? SEEING NONE, WE HAVE NO ONE ONLINE. THANK YOU. WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. SECONDED -- >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: CAN WE DEFINE FOR FAMILY USE AND THE OTHER ONE IS NOT. >>LYNN HURTAK: I THINK WE'RE GETTING THERE LATER. THIS IS JUST -- >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: NUMBER 7. >>LYNN HURTAK: I'LL MAKE THAT MOTION LATER. I DON'T THINK THAT'S PART OF WHAT WE'RE DOING HERE. BUT I'M HAPPY TO MAKE THAT MOTION LATER ABOUT TAKING OUT EXTENDED FAMILY OR AT LEAST DISCUSSING IT. THIS IS THE LANGUAGE OF NONCONFORMING TO CONFORMING. >>ERIC COTTON: THE SECOND PORTION OF THAT, CORRECT. THIS IS STRICTLY THE STRUCTURE ITSELF, NOT THE USE. IT'S ON THE DEFINITION. OKAY. >>JOSEPH CITRO: JUST ON THE DEFINITION. MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN VIERA. ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE. >> AYE. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ANY OPPOSED? >>LYNN HURTAK: MY SECOND MOTION IS MOVE 27-132. YES. I'M SORRY. ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS, EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCES AND NONCONFORMING STRUCTURES. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: SECOND. >>JOSEPH CITRO: WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO. IS THERE ANYONE IN THE AUDIENCE WHO WISHES TO SPEAK TO THIS? >> I'LL BE SPEAKING A FEW TIMES. I'LL BE BRIEF. SUMMARIZE WHY THIS IS IMPORTANT. A PATH TO COMPLIANCE FOR ILLEGAL ADUs I THINK IS SOMETHING EVERYONE AGREES WE SHOULD HAVE. IF WE DIDN'T HAVE THAT AND SAY TEAR DOWN EVERY ILLEGAL ADU IN THE CITY, THAT WOULD BE DESTROYING THOUSANDS OF AFFORDABLE HOMES. I'M ON THE FENCE. TO THE ASSISTANT YOU BELIEVE HOMEOWNERS WOULD PROVIDE AFFORDABLE HOUSING, BUT I WILL SAY THE SMALLER UNIT, THE FAMILY ONE IS -- YOU KNOW, NOT PAYING TAXES ON IT AND IT BEING SMALLER, MAKE THAT THE MOST AFFORDABLE TYPE OF HOUSING WE HAVE IN THE CITY. THAT'S ALL I'LL SAY ABOUT THAT. >>JOSEPH CITRO: WE DO NOT HAVE ANYONE ONLINE. THANK YOU. ANY FURTHER COMMENTS? >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: AGAIN, MAY I JUST SAY THAT I CAN'T VOTE FOR THIS BECAUSE IT'S THE ACCESSORY DWELLINGS AND IT'S NONCONFORMING, AND IT'S FOR BOTH, EXTENDED FAMILY AND ACCESSORY DWELLING FOR ANYONE. AND THEY ARE NOT GOING TO LET THEM HAVE IT FOR FREE. THEY ARE GOING TO CHARGE AND THEY ARE NOT PAYING ANYBODY ANYTHING AND THEY ARE JUST LIVING OFF THE FAT OF THE LAND. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. >>LYNN HURTAK: JUST TO RESPOND TO COMMENT, I AGREE THAT THOSE ARE CHEAP. HOWEVER, MY CONCERN IS HABITABILITY. SO JUST BECAUSE SOMETHING IS AFFORDABLE DOESN'T MEAN IT SHOULD BE -- THAT IT IS HABITABLE, AND I THINK WHAT WE ARE ALL TRYING TO DO IS MOVE FROM HOUSING THAT IS NOT LATELY RIGHT NOW, AND I BELIEVE ALL OF US HAVE IT IN OUR GOALS TO DO WHATEVER IT TAKES TO MAKE THAT HABITABLE, TO BRING PEOPLE INTO COMPLIANCE BECAUSE WE WANT PEOPLE TO DEFINITELY BE LIVING SOMEWHERE THAT'S SAFE BUT ALSO AFFORDABLE. I DON'T THINK WE HAVE TO DECIDE ONE OR THE OTHER. I THINK WE CAN HAVE BOTH. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ANY OTHER COMMENTS? I JUST HAVE TO MAKE THIS COMMENT. I'M GOING TO VOTE YES FOR THIS BUT WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT THIS MUCH FURTHER. IT GOES FURTHER THAN WHAT COUNCILMAN MIRANDA IS SAYING. IF SOMEONE WALKS INTO AN ACCESSORY DWELLING USE, I WANT TO RENT IT. I'D LIKE TO SIGN A LEASE. THE OWNER SAYS, NO, YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT A LEASE, MEANING THEY ARE NOT GOING TO REPORT THIS SO THEY DON'T HAVE TO PAY TAXES ON IT. IT'S AFFORDABLE NOW, BUT THAT RENT COULD BE INCREASED AT ANY TIME THE PERSON WANTS TO. SO I AM GOING TO VOTE YES, BUT WE NEED TO TAKE A LOOK AT THIS FURTHER. WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN VIERA. COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO. ALL IN FAVOR AYE. IS THERE ANY OPPOSED? >> AYE. >>JOSEPH CITRO: DID YOU GET THAT? DO YOU WANT TO DO ROLL CALL? ROLL CALL VOTE, PLEASE. >>ORLANDO GUDES: NO. >>LUIS VIERA: YES. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: YES. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: NO. >>LYNN HURTAK: YES. >>BILL CARLSON: NO. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ONLY WITH SOME INVESTIGATING LATER ON, YES. >>THE CLERK: MOTION CARRIED WITH GUDES, MIRANDA, AND CARLSON VOTING NO. >>JOSEPH CITRO: MR. COTTON. >>ERIC COTTON: CAN I HAVE THE PRESENTATION BACK? THANK YOU. NEXT UP IS ACTUALLY A CHANGE TO ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT STANDARDS. RIGHT NOW, AS I SAID EARLIER, THEY ARE A SPECIAL USE IN TWO SECTIONS OF THE CITY -- SEMINOLE CENTRAL AREA.HE LOWRY PARK- WHAT THIS IS PROPOSING IS TO REMOVE THEM FROM REQUIRING THE SPECIAL USE APPROVAL AND ALLOWING THEM TO BE PERMITTED ELSEWHERE IN THE CITY. GO TO THE NEXT SLIDE REAL QUICK. RIGHT NOW THE CODE WOULD PROPOSE THEM TO BE ALLOWED IN THE CENTRAL TAMPA, WESTSHORE, AND UNIVERSITY PLANNING DISTRICTS BY RIGHT. SO ANYBODY WHO HAS -- COULD APPLY THROUGH PERMITTING AND ESTABLISH AN ADU IN ANY OF THOSE AREAS THAT ARE SHOWN ON THE SCREEN. SO WE CREATED, OR PROPOSING SPECIFIC STANDARDS FOR THOSE USES -- OR FOR THAT USE. RIGHT NOW, SOME OF THIS CURRENTLY IN SEMINOLE HEIGHTS WHICH WAS PREVIOUSLY APPROVED BY COUNCIL WHICH IS MAXIMUM SIZE OF 950 SQUARE FEET. THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT CAN ONLY BE ON A PIECE OF PROPERTY THAT'S OWNER OCCUPIED IN THE FRONT TO THE MAIN HOUSE, WOULD HAVE TO BE OWNER OCCUPIED. YOU CAN DESIGN IT EITHER WITHIN THE SINGLE-FAMILY HOME, LIKE A USE, HAPPY DAYS WHERE LIKE THE ATTIC WAS ON TOP WHERE FONZIE WOULD RENT OUT FROM THE CUNNINGHAMS OR IN A SEPARATE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE, LIKE DETACHED DWELLING UNIT OR WHATEVER. NO MORE THAN TWO PEOPLE IN THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURE ANY GIVEN TIME AND YOU COULD SEPARATELY METER THE STRUCTURE ITSELF. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. >>LYNN HURTAK: I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH B. ONLY BECAUSE, A, THEY ARE EVERYWHERE. I CAN GIVE YOU A HUGE LIST RIGHT NOW WHERE THE FRONT AND BACK ARE BEING RENTED IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD. AND IT'S NOT A HUGE PROBLEM. ALSO, WHAT I'VE HEARD FROM LANDLORDS IN THE PAST WEEK KNOWING THIS IS COMING UP IS SAYING, HEY, WE ACTUALLY HAVE THE CAPITAL TO PUT THESE IN AND WE WOULD DO IT WITH OUR EXISTING RENTAL HOUSING. SO I WOULD REALLY LIKE TO LOOK AT THAT FURTHER. BUT THE OTHER ONE FOR ME IS D. I THOUGHT THAT THAT HAD CHANGED TO TWO UNRELATED OCCUPANTS, BUT I WAS THINKING LIKE A SMALL FAMILY. >>ERIC COTTON: THEY WOULD NOT BE UNRELATED. >>LYNN HURTAK: OKAY. I'M SORRY. SO NEVER MIND. MY CONCERN IS B BECAUSE THIS IS WHAT I'M HEARING FROM CONSTITUENTS THAT ARE LANDLORDS ARE SAYING THEY WOULD LIKE TO USE THIS TO INCREASE THE HOUSING STOCK. >>ERIC COTTON: WELL, THE BASIS FOR THAT REQUIREMENT, THAT'S CURRENTLY WHAT IS IN THE CODE NOW FOR SEMINOLE HEIGHTS. SOME OF THE BASIS, FOR THOSE THAT THINK COUNCILMAN MIRANDA WAS ON COUNCIL MAYBE BACK WHEN THE ZONING FOR SULPHUR SPRINGS WENT INTO EFFECT AND ZONING WENT FROM SINGLE-FAMILY TO R-2. AND PART OF THAT AND I WAS TALKING TO SUSAN SWIFT, WHO WAS HERE THIS MORNING BECAUSE SHE WAS WITH THE CITY WHEN THAT TOOK PLACE, THE LOGIC ON THOSE, YOU WOULD HAVE A DUPLEX, OWNER-OCCUPIED RENTAL AND WHAT ENDED UP HAPPENING IS BOTH ENDED UP BEING RENTAL UNITS AND THERE WAS NO OWNERSHIP TO THE NEIGHBORHOOD. AND THAT'S WHERE STAFF IS COMING FROM BASED ON THAT EXPERIENCE. THE CURRENT LANGUAGE IN THE CODE TO REQUIRE ONE TO BE OWNER OCCUPIED BEFORE YOU COULD RENT OUT THE BACK. THAT'S THE BASIS OF THAT REQUIREMENT. >>LYNN HURTAK: YES, BUT I THINK IT HAMSTRINGS PEOPLE. I MEAN, IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD, ONE OF MY NEIGHBORS OWNS 12 DIFFERENT RENTAL PROPERTIES AT LEAST IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD. AND HER HOUSES ARE IMPECKABLY MAINTAINED. SHE HAS HIGH STANDARDS FOR HER TENANTS BUT WE HAVE INCREDIBLY DEEP LOTS IN SEMINOLE HEIGHTS. SHE WOULD LOVE TO BUILD ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS TO PROVIDE MORE HOUSING. BUT IF SHE DOESN'T HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO DO THAT, I MEAN, THAT'S 12 MORE UNITS. I HESITATE -- MAYBE ON SMALLER LOTS, BUT -- >>ERIC COTTON: IT'S A DECISION OF COUNCIL ON HOW YOU WANT TO DIRECT THIS. THIS IS STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION. BUT IF COUNCIL WANTS TO -- DOESN'T WANT THAT REQUIREMENT, I MEAN, THAT'S THE PURVIEW OF CITY COUNCIL ON THAT. >>ABBYE FEELEY: IF I CAN FOR JUST A SECOND. THESE CRITERIA CAME OUT OF THE PRELIMINARY DISCUSSION WE HAD WITH YOU ALL IN JUNE. AND WE DEVELOPED THESE FIVE AFTER COMPARING NOTES, WORKING WITH STEVEN, YOU KNOW, AND COMING TOGETHER AND WRITING THIS CODE TO SAY, OKAY, HERE'S WHERE WE'RE GOING TO START. SO THAT'S WHAT IS BEFORE YOU TODAY. HERE'S WHERE WE'RE STARTING. IF YOU DON'T WANT A, B, C AND D AND YOU WANT THEM TO BE WHAT -- I MEAN, IT'S AT THE PURVIEW OF COUNCIL. THESE ARE STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS TO YOU. AND AS A BOARD, YOU CAN TELL US THE DIRECTION YOU'D LIKE US TO TAKE. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS? COUNCILMAN VIERA. >>LUIS VIERA: THANK YOU, SIR. AGAIN, CONFIRMING -- AND I'M SUPPORTIVE OF THIS. I THINK BY AND LARGE -- I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY THERE COULD BE UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES BUT GENERALLY SUPPORTIVE OF, BUT AGAIN CONFIRMING THE RESTRICTED NEIGHBORS, 33467, ET CETERA -- >>ERIC COTTON: CORRECT. >>LUIS VIERA: BECAUSE I'M OCD. ANOTHER THING I WOULD RECOMMEND IS MAYBE, AGAIN, UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES OF THIS IS MAYBE A MOTION, MAYBE COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK WHO BROUGHT THIS UP, AND AGAIN VERY SUPPORTIVE, MAYBE TO LOOK AT THIS RETURNING BACK TO US IN NINE MONTHS, A YEAR, WHATEVER IT MAY BE, JUST TO SEE HOW IT'S GOING AND WHAT ANY UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES ARE, HOWEVER WE MAY PULL THE NUMBERS TOGETHER. SO JUST SOMETHING THAT I WOULD SUGGEST MAYBE BE DONE IF YOU WOULD BE AMENABLE TO THAT. OH, A MOTION TO MAYBE HAVE THIS COME BACK TO US MAYBE IN A YEAR, WHATEVER, TO SEE HOW THIS IS GOING, ANY UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES. >>LYNN HURTAK: ABSOLUTELY. >>LUIS VIERA: I'M SUPPORTIVE. EVERYTHING HAS GRAY IN IT, RIGHT? >>LYNN HURTAK: I THINK THAT IS A WONDERFUL IDEA BECAUSE WE HAVE TO LOOK AT HOW THIS EXPANDS, BUT THE REALITY IS THESE AREN'T CHEAP TO BUILD. SO YOU'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE PEOPLE -- THESE AREN'T GOING TO END UP BEING PLACES WHERE WE HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THE UPKEEP GOING -- THAT'S PROBABLY FURTHER DOWN IN THE FUTURE, SEVERAL YEARS IN. BUT ABSOLUTELY, TO KEEP BRINGING THIS UP. BUT WHAT WE'RE HEARING NOW AND LOUD AND CLEAR FROM RESIDENTS, WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH PLACES FOR PEOPLE TO LIVE AND LITERALLY ANYTHING ELSE WE CAN DO TO ENCOURAGE PEOPLE TO BUILD THESE WOULD BE WHAT I WOULD SUPPORT. I WOULD ABSOLUTELY SUPPORT IT COMING BACK IN A YEAR OR SO WITH MORE -- WITH MAYBE A CODE ENFORCEMENT LOOK OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. >>LUIS VIERA: THANK YOU, MADAM. AND THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN. I SALUTE YOU FOR THE "HAPPY DAYS" COMMENT. THAT WAS WELL DONE. >>ERIC COTTON: THANK YOU. I AGE MYSELF. WHAT CAN I SAY? >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN MIRANDA. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I LOOK AT IT AND SOMETHING I HAVE TO SINGLE OUT HERE. AN ACCESSORY DWELLING MAY BE DESIGNATED -- DESIGNED TO BE LOCATED WITHIN A SINGLE-FAMILY DWELLING WITH A SEPARATE ENTRANCE, AND THAT'S HAPPENING ALL OVER NOW. IF WE PASS THIS, ALL THOSE THAT HAVE BEEN DOING THIS FOR YEARS, COLLECTING AND NOT PAYING, I DON'T WANT TO BE AN ACCESSORY TO A CRIME AND THEN THAT C AND E, C AND E CONTRADICT EACH OTHER. AN ACCESSORY DWELLING MAY BE SEPARATELY METERED FOR UTILITIES. THEY ARE NOT. I'LL TELL YOU WHY THEY ARE NOT, THEY DIVIDE IT. THEY CHANGE THE WALLS. THEY ADD RESTROOMS. THEY PUT MINOR KITCHENS IN THEM. GUESS WHAT, NOW YOU HAVE THREE AND FOUR UNITS IN A HOUSE AND YOU'RE COLLECTING. WHAT HAPPENS, THE KEY TO THIS, THE FIRST THING THEY DO IS FENCE IT OFF WITH A PLASTIC FENCE. THE NEXT THING THEY DO, ONE UTILITY YOU CAN FOLLOW, THEY PUT SOLAR SO YOUR ELECTRIC BILL IS LESS, SO THEY CAN'T PUT FOUR METERS IN THE HOUSE. THEY ONLY HAVE ONE METER. AND THAT'S THE ONLY WAY YOU CAN VERIFY BY CHECKING THE AVERAGE FLOW OF WATER WITHIN THAT BLOCK. THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS, C AND E CONTRADICT EACH OTHER. WITHIN A SINGLE-FAMILY DWELLING WITH A SEPARATE ENTRANCE OR AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE. I CAN SHOW YOU HOUSES NOW WHERE THEY HAVE FOUR DOORS ON THE OUTSIDE. THEY MARKED APARTMENT A, B, C AND D. >>ERIC COTTON: MOST LIKELY NONE OF THOSE ARE PROBABLY LEGAL UNITS. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: NONE OF THEM ARE LEGAL. ONCE WE PASS THIS, THEY BECOME LEGAL TO SOME DEGREE. >>ERIC COTTON: THIS IS ONLY ALLOWING FOR ONE ACCESSORY UNIT ON A PIECE OF PROPERTY. I UNDERSTAND WHERE YOU'RE COMING FROM COUNCILMAN MIRANDA MIR THIS IS ONLY ONE DWELLING PROPERTY. NOT DWELLING ON OUTSIDE. THIS IS ONE DWELLING THAT'S BEEN CUT UP INSIDE AND MADE IT TO WHATEVER THEY WANT. >>ERIC COTTON: UNDER ZONING, WHEWHAT YOU ARE DESCRIBING IS FR DWELLING UNITS, NOT ONE ANYMORE. THIS IS ALLOWING, AS COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK WAS SAYING, PEOPLE WHO HAVE A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME IN FRONT, THEY WOULD BE ABLE -- AND THEY BUILD AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT, THEY COULD HAVE THAT SEPARATELY METERED AND NOT HAVE TO JUMP THE METER, THE ELECTRIC FROM THE MAIN HOUSE BACK TO THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT. THAT COULD HAVE IT OWN METER, RECEIVE ITS OWN BILL FROM TECO. CITY WATER WOULD HAVE ITS OWN WATER AND SANITARY SEWER METER. THAT'S WHAT THE LOGIC, THAT'S WHAT THE IMPETUS BEHIND THE LANGUAGE IS BASICALLY GOING TO ALLOW. WE'RE NOT -- NOTHING IN THIS IS ATTEMPTING TO MAKE WHAT YOU'RE DESCRIBING LEGAL. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. >>LYNN HURTAK: I'M GOING TO MAKE -- WE DON'T REALLY QUITE HAVE A MOTION FOR THIS YET. I SORT OF DID, BUT I THINK THE BIGGER DISCUSSION THAT WE ALL NEED TO HAVE IN ANOTHER MEETING IS HOW -- I'M GOING TO MAKE A MOTION FOR STAFF TO BRING BACK A PLAN FOR BRINGING NON--- IS IT NONCOMPLIANCE STRUCTURES? NONCONFORMING -- >>ERIC COTTON: NO. ILLEGAL. >>LYNN HURTAK: ILLEGAL. THANK YOU. FOR BRINGING ILLEGAL ACCESSORY DWELLINGS ADUs FAMILY I GUESS WE'LL USE BOTH LANGUAGE AT THIS POINT, ACCESSORY DWELLINGS AND EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCES OR JUST -- >>ABBYE FEELEY: WHAT ABOUT ILLEGAL RESIDENTIAL UNITS? >>LYNN HURTAK: THAT WORKS. THANK YOU. A MOTION FOR STAFF TO BRING BACK A PLAN FOR BRINGING ILLEGAL RESIDENTIAL UNITS INTO COMPLIANCE. ONE OF THE THINGS I WAS THINKING ABOUT IS MAYBE A YEAR OF AMNESTY. EAST TAMPA CRA IS TALKING ABOUT THE RENTAL ASSISTANCE PROGRAM FOR MAKING RENTAL STRUCTURES HABITABLE, LIKE GOING TO THE LANDLORDS AND SAYING, HEY, WE'LL HELP YOU PAY FOR THIS AND WE'LL PUT A LIEN ON THE PROPERTY AND YOU HAVE TO GUARANTEE YOU'LL KEEP IT AFFORDABLE. I'VE TALKED TO STAFF ABOUT THIS BEFORE. MAYBE A PROGRAM LIKE THAT. BECAUSE HE IS RIGHT, WE ALL HAVE TO FIGURE OUT HOW DO WE ENCOURAGE AND MOTIVATE PEOPLE TO BRING BACK, TO GET INTO COMPLIANCE FOR HABITABILITY AND FOR JUST SO WE KNOW HOW MANY WE HAVE. >>ABBYE FEELEY: IF I CAN ASK, IN THAT MOTION, THAT WOULD BE CODE ENFORCEMENT AND LAND DEVELOPMENT TO COME BACK WITH THAT PLAN. >>LYNN HURTAK: OKAY. >>ABBYE FEELEY: I THINK THE FIRST THING ON THAT WOULD BE UNDERSTANDING, BEFORE WE KNOW IF IT'S AMNESTY OR WHAT THE SOLUTION IS, WE NEED TO UNDERSTAND HOW WE'RE GOING TO ADDRESS FIRST THE PROBLEM AND WHAT IS GOING ON AND WHAT THAT REALLY LOOKS LIKE IN TERMS OF QUANTITY OR NUMBER OF THESE THROUGHOUT THE CITY. THAT'S FINE. JUST THAT WE ARE NOT THE ENFORCEMENT ARM. I MEAN, SO WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE WORKING WITH OUR PARTNERS ON THAT TO GET YOU THE BEST ANSWER POSSIBLE. >>LYNN HURTAK: OKAY. SO MAYBE MARCH WORKSHOP. IS THAT ENOUGH TIME? APRIL WORKSHOP? >>ABBYE FEELEY: WE HAVE ONE IN FEBRUARY THAT'S GETTING PRETTY FULL. I'LL ASK FOR TIME TO WORK WITH KEITH O'CONNOR AND THAT TEAM TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THEIR CURRENT PROCEDURES ARE WHEN THEY ARE DEALING WITH THAT, HOW THAT LOOKS. UNDERSTAND HOW MANY WE MIGHT HAVE UNDER CITATION RIGHT NOW OR WITH LIENS. APRIL WOULD BE FINE. >>LYNN HURTAK: APRIL, PERFECT. AND THAT WOULD BE APRIL -- IT LOOKS LIKE APRIL 27th. >>JOSEPH CITRO: WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO. ALL IN FAVOR? >> AYE. >>JOSEPH CITRO: IS THERE ANY OPPOSED? THANK YOU. >>ERIC COTTON: THERE STILL NEEDS TO BE -- ON THE ISSUE WE WERE JUST TALKING ABOUT, THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS STANDARDS, WAS THAT MOTION -- THE MOTION WAS FOR LAND DEVELOPMENT TO WORK WITH CODE ENFORCEMENT, BUT WHAT ABOUT THIS CASE RIGHT HERE? YOU WANT TO TAKE ACTION ON THIS TODAY OR -- >>JOSEPH CITRO: IS THERE ANYONE IN THE PUBLIC THAT WISHES TO SPEAK TO THIS PART OF AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 7? >> I THINK THAT -- I THINK WE'RE ALL A LITTLE BIT CONFUSED BY THE PROCESS RIGHT NOW. THIS NEEDS TO CARRY ON THAT WAS SOMETHING VOTED ON NEXT MONTH. THAT'S MY POINT OF VIEW ON THIS. I'M NOT SURE WHAT HAPPENS IF YOU DON'T MAKE A MOTION, WHETHER IT JUST DOESN'T COME BACK NEXT MONTH SO I WOULD REALLY APPRECIATE A MOTION TO MAKE SURE IT COMES BACK NEXT MONTH. SPECIFICALLY, I WANT TO POINT OUT WHY THIS ITEM IS IMPORTANT. WE'RE LOOKING FOR CHANGES THAT ARE GOING TO ACTUALLY CREATE A USEFUL AMOUNT OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING FOR THE CITY OF TAMPA. I HEARD A CITY LIKE OURS CAN EXPECT IF WE IMPLEMENT A REALLY GOOD POLICY TO HAVE 300 PER YEAR. IF WE COULD DO 300 ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS PER YEAR, THAT WOULD BE AN INCREDIBLE ACHIEVEMENT. IT WON'T CREATE 10,000. IT WILL CREATE 300. IF WE'RE MAKING RULES AND BEING PICKY AND RESULT IN 50 BEING BUILT, THEN THIS DAY WOULD HAVE BEEN A WASTE OF OUR TIME. 50 HOMES IS NOT GOING TO MOVE THE NEEDLE. WHEN WE LOOK AT B OR THE ONE COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK WAS TALKING ABOUT WITH THE PRIMARY RESIDENCE, I THINK THAT'S THE MOST IMPACTFUL CHANGE THAT WE CAN MAKE TO WHAT'S BEING PROPOSED HERE THAT WILL TAKE US FROM 50 TO 150 OR -- TAKE TO US THE NEXT LEVEL IN TERMS OF HOW MANY OF THESE THINGS GET PRODUCED. I WOULD HATE FOR US TO GO THROUGH ALL THIS, AT THE END, DO THE MEETING A YEAR FROM NOW AND WE FIND OUT THERE'S BEEN 50 APPLICATIONS BECAUSE WHY WOULD YOU DO IT WITH ALL THESE RULES WE HAVE IN PLACE? WE NEED TO HAVE THIS NEW RULE PASSED BUT I WOULD LOVE TO SEE A CHANGE THAT SAYS HOMEOWNERS WHO CAN AFFORD TO BUILD THESE WILL ACTUALLY BUILD THEM. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ANYONE ELSE WITHIN CHAMBERS WHO WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK TO THIS? MS. POYNOR, YOU'RE ONLINE? >> HEY. GOOD AFTERNOON. I DON'T THINK IT MAKES TWO FLIPS OF A DIFFERENCE WHETHER THE LANDLORD LIVES ON THE PROPERTY OR NOT. IF THEY ARE GOING TO BE A GOOD LANDLORD, THEY'LL BE A GOOD LANDLORD WHETHER THEY LIVE THERE OR WHETHER THEY LIVE DOWN THE STREET OR ACROSS THE COUNTRY. IT REALLY DOESN'T MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE. OH, CRAP, I LOST MY TRAIN OF THOUGHT. BOTTOM LINE IS THAT IT JUST DOESN'T MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE. I JUST DON'T WANT TO SEE THESE IN THE CHAA. SORRY, NOT SORRY. AND 300 OF THEM, THAT IS NOT EVEN GOING TO TOUCH THE 3,000 THAT WE STILL HAVE COMING SOUTH OF GANDY, WEST OF DALE MABRY. THEY ARE ALREADY COMING. THANK YOU. >>JOSEPH CITRO: MS. BENNETT, YOU ARE ONLINE? MS. BENNETT? >> CAN YOU HEAR ME? OKAY. MY NAME IS CARROLL ANN BENNETT. I WANTED TO SPEAK ON THE LAST ITEM, AND I WASN'T GIVEN THE OPPORTUNITY TO DO SO. MY CONCERN IS THAT I DON'T FEEL LIKE THE PUBLIC HAS REALLY HAD A CHANCE TO UNDERSTAND WHAT'S GOING ON AND ASK QUESTIONS. THE PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING, I CAN ONLY STAY ON FOR AN HOUR AND A HALF. I DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH LONGER IT WENT ON. I BELIEVE MS. FEELEY SAID IT WENT FOUR HOURS. A LOT OF PEOPLE DIDN'T GET TO HEAR WHAT WAS GOING ON AND ASK QUESTIONS. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE A PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING THAT'S DEDICATED TO NOTHING BUT ADUs. I LOOK AT THIS AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT IS THE SETBACK? IS IT THREE FEET? WHAT'S THE HEIGHT? THERE'S JUST A LOT OF QUESTIONS THAT PEOPLE DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT THIS IS ACTUALLY GOING TO RESULT IN. I HAVE QUESTIONS ABOUT THE LAND USE LIMIT. IF YOU'RE GOING TO DOUBLE THE NUMBER OF UNITS ON A PARCEL, HOW DOES THAT AFFECT THE LAND USE? WHAT IF IT GOES OVER WHAT THE LAND USE ALLOWS FOR THAT AREA? I DON'T KNOW HOW THAT WORKS. WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT THE PERSON, OWNER OCCUPIED -- I'LL TELL YOU WHY. MOST OF THESE ADUs ARE GOING TO BECOME AirBnBs. VIRGINIA PARK, WHICH YOU CAN'T -- WEBSITE, AND THE ONES THAT WE DO NOT HAVE A PROBLEM WITH, THE ONES THAT NEIGHBORS DON'T COMPLAIN ABOUT AND THE ONES CONCERNED ABOUT, THE ONES WHERE THE OWNER LIVES IN THE PRINCIPAL DWELLING BECAUSE THEY ARE RIGHT THERE AND IF THINGS GET LOUD, IF THINGS GET OUT OF HAND, IF THERE'S BAD BEHAVIOR, THEY ARE RIGHT ON TOP OF IT BECAUSE IT'S KEEPING THEIR CHILDREN AWAKE, TOO. I HAVE QUESTIONS ABOUT, WHAT ABOUT ROOFTOP? ARE THEY ALLOWE TO HAVE A ROOFTOP PARTY AREA? WHAT ABOUT THE 950 SQUARE FEET? DOES THAT INCLUDE THAT? DOES THAT INCLUDE AN ENCLOSED PATIO? I'M NOT AGAINST ADUs. I NEED TO MAKE THAT CLEAR. I DON'T UNDERSTAND THE CHANGES BEING MADE. IF I DON'T UNDERSTAND IT, THAT MEANS A LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T UNDERSTAND IT. I WOULD LIKE MORE OPPORTUNITY FOR THE PUBLIC TO ASK QUESTIONS AND GET ANSWERS. I WOULD LOVE TO SEE IN PRINT A WRITTEN LIST OF QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS THAT CAME OUT OF THE LAST PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING AND ANY FUTURE PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETINGS BECAUSE A LOT OF PEOPLE JUST WANT TO UNDERSTAND WHAT'S GOING ON. THANK YOU. >>JOSEPH CITRO: THANK YOU. IS THERE ANYONE ELSE? >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: JUST VERY QUICKLY. AS I READ THIS HERE AND WHAT THE LAST SPEAKER SPOKE ABOUT, THE MAIN RESIDENCE IS GOING TO BE OWNER OCCUPIED. IT MAY BE THE FIRST MONTH OR SO, IT MAY NOT BE. AND THEN YOU LOOK AT C, THE ACCESSORY DWELLING, LOCATED WITHIN THE SINGLE-FAMILY DWELLING WITH AN ENTRANCE ON THE STRUCTURE ON THE OUTSIDE I GUESS. YOU LOOK AT D, AT NO TIME, NUMBER OF UNRELATED OCCUPANTS OF AN ACCESSORY DWELLING EXCEED TWO. WE CAN'T EVEN FIND WHO RENTS AN AirBnB FOR FIVE DAYS OR LESS INSTEAD OF FIVE DAYS OR MORE, AND YOU'RE TELLING ME WE'RE GOING TO FIND THIS. WE'RE TELLING THE PUBLIC WE'LL FIND THIS. LET'S BE REALISTIC. YOU GO TO E, AN ACCESSORY DWELLING MAY, NOT SHALL, BE SEPARATELY METERED FOR UTILITIES. I DON'T UNDERSTAND IT. YOU'RE GETTING LIKE, SAY, YOU KNOW, IT USED TO BE IN A BANK YOU WORE A HAT AND DARK GLASSES AND A SCARF, THEY ARREST YOU. NOW YOU DON'T HAVE IT ON THEY ARREST. I DON'T UNDERSTAND IT. WE'RE SCARING AN IRON DOG OFF THE PORCH. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN CARLSON. >>BILL CARLSON: CARROLL ANN BENNETT DESCRIBED EXACTLY HOW I FEEL ABOUT THESE ITEMS. I CAME IN HERE PREPARED TO SUPPORT THIS BECAUSE IN CONCEPT I SUPPORT ADUs, BUT EVEN THE INFORMATION I READ OR SAW SUGGESTED THAT SOUTH TAMPA OR PARTS OF SOUTH TAMPA WOULD BE EXCLUDED, AND THAT THERE WOULD BE VERY TIGHT DETAILS. I DON'T SEE IT IN HERE. >>ABBYE FEELEY: ABBYE FEELEY. WE'RE NOT THERE YET. >>BILL CARLSON: LIKE NATHAN SAID, IT IS THE CONFUSING ABOUT HOW THIS IS BEING PRESENTED. NOT CRITICIZING YOU, BUT THE CONTEXT OF IT. IT'S LIKE THERE ARE TWO ITEMS HERE. I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY SUBDECISIONS WE HAVE TO MAKE HERE. I THINK THE WHOLE THING IS CONFUSING AND I'M SURE THE PUBLIC IS CONFUSED. I'M GOING TO VOTE AGAINST ALL OF THESE JUST BECAUSE IT'S CONFUSING THE WAY IT'S BEING PRESENTED. AND IF SOMEBODY WANTS TO VOTE TO HAVE THEM COME BACK AS ANOTHER WORKSHOP OR SOMETHING, I'M HAPPY TO SUPPORT THAT AND MAYBE I WOULD SUPPORT THEM THE NEXT TIME. RIGHT NOW AS IT STANDS WITH THE INFORMATION WE HAVE, I CAN'T SUPPORT WITH TOO MANY QUESTIONS. >>ORLANDO GUDES: WE WANT TO PROVIDE A WAY FOR LIVABLE MEANS, AND WE CAME UP WITH THE IDEA OF THE ADUs. WE KNOW SEMINOLE HEIGHTS HAS HAD THOSE FOR A LONG, LONG TIME, BUT THAT WAS A LONG TIME AGO. WE HAVE A HOUSING CRISIS. SO I KNOW WE'RE TRYING TO PROVIDE HOUSING, SOME TYPE OF HOUSING. THIS COULD BE AN EXTRA WAY TO DO IT, BUT I DON'T THINK WE'VE GOT THE WHOLE VOTE IN THERE JUST YET. THERE ARE MISSING COMPONENTS. FOR ME, IF WE'RE GOING TO DO IT, THIS WOULD BE FOR EVERYBODY. I HEAR SOUTH TAMPA WON'T HAVE TO DO. YOU'LL HAVE SOME COMMUNITIES -- EAST SIDE OF TOWN, THEY MAY NOT WANT THOSE IN THE COMMUNITY EVEN THOUGH IT'S NOT DEED RESTRICTED. I THINK WE'LL HAVE A LOT OF CONVERSATION. I LOOK AT THE SPECIAL NEEDS SIDE OF TOWN. I DON'T KNOW. SOME OF THE STRUCTURES WE HAVE, WE PROBABLY COULD USE FIXER-UPPERS. BUT I LOOK AT GOUGING AGAIN. PEOPLE START, WE TALK ABOUT THE BUILDING OF THESE THINGS, I DON'T THINK WE HAVE ENOUGH INFORMATION YET. I DON'T SEE ENOUGH INFORMATION. >>ABBYE FEELEY: I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHAT INFORMATION YOU WOULD LIKE. THIS DISCUSSION STARTED BACK IN JUNE. WE BROUGHT BEST PRACTICES TO YOU AS TO WHAT OTHER LOCAL GOVERNMENTS HAD. WE GOT DIRECTION FROM YOU AS TO WHAT YOU WOULD LIKE OURS TO LOOK LIKE. THIS LANGUAGE HERE IS WRITTEN BASED OFF OF THAT. THESE ARE OUR RECOMMENDATIONS PURSUANT TO HOW YOU DIRECTED US. IF YOU DON'T LIKE ITEM B AND YOU WANT THAT STRICKEN, THAT'S FINE. IF YOU WANT IT TO SAY NOTHING IN THE CHHA, THAT'S FINE. BUT WE CAME TO YOU IN JUNE. WE HAD THAT DISCUSSION. WE CAME BACK IN SEPTEMBER AND PROVIDED THE DRAFT LANGUAGE FOR EVERYONE. WE CONDUCTED A PUBLIC INFORMATION SESSION. MS. BENNETT AND MS. POYNOR AND MS. ZIMMERMAN HAVE BEEN E-MAILING AND E-MAILING I THINK THREE TIMES WHILE WE WERE AT LUNCH. THEY KNOW HOW TO REACH US. WE'RE OPEN TO ANY SUGGESTIONS, RECOMMENDATIONS OR COMPROMISES ON ANY OF THESE CRITERIA. WE WERE STRICTLY TAKING THE DIRECTIVE THAT WAS PROVIDED BY YOU TO COME BACK WITH ADUs, THAT WE NEEDED ADDITIONAL HOUSING OPTIONS AND HERE WE ARE. THAT WAS ALMOST SIX MONTHS AGO WHEN WE STARTED THIS. IF WE'RE NOT ON TARGET TO WHERE WE NEED TO BE IN THIS LANGUAGE, PLEASE TELL ME WHERE YOU BELIEVE THAT IS INSTEAD OF CONTINUING TO HAVE CIRCULAR DISCUSSIONS ON TO WHERE WE NEED TO BE. WE'RE HAPPY TO GO BACK AND LOOK AGAIN AT OTHER CITIES AND BRING THAT BACK, BUT I THINK WE'VE GOT A REALLY GOOD START AS TO WHAT WE NEED. WHICH DON'T WANT OWNER OCCUPIED, WE CAN TAKE OUT LETTER B. THAT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE THERE. THIS IS THE CODE THAT WE'RE WORKING ON TOGETHER TODAY THROUGH THIS WORKSHOP IN ORDER TO ENABLE THIS IN THE WAY WE COLLECTIVELY WANT TO SEE IT HAPPEN TO PROVIDE ALTERNATIVE HOUSING SOLUTIONS. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. >>LYNN HURTAK: WE DESPERATELY NEED HOUSING. WE DESPERATELY NEED HOUSING. I UNDERSTAND THAT WE HAVE CONCERNS, BUT LITERALLY IN THE NEXT SEVERAL SLIDES DEAL WITH SETBACKS, DEAL WITH HEIGHT RESTRICTIONS. I MEAN, ALL OF THIS IS ALREADY IN THIS. THIS IS JUST TALKING ABOUT THE STANDARDS THAT ARE GOING TO APPLY. WE HAVEN'T EVEN DECIDED WHERE WE'RE GOING TO PUT THEM YET. THIS IS JUST STANDARDS. AND THIS IS INCREDIBLY FRUSTRATING. THIS IS NOT -- WE'RE NOT DECIDING IT RIGHT NOW. WE WILL HAVE A FIRST READING. THE PUBLIC WILL HAVE A CHANCE TO TALK ABOUT EACH OF THESE ITEMS THEN. BUT THIS HAS BEEN DISCUSSED BY US. THIS HAS HAD A PUBLIC MEETING. THESE ARE THE THINGS THAT THEY ALREADY HAVE IN SEMINOLE HEIGHTS. ANYONE WANTS TO COME, I WILL GIVE YOU A TOUR OF SEMINOLE HEIGHTS AND WHAT THEY LOOK LIKE AND HOW THE COMMUNITY DEALS WITH THEM. I DON'T EVEN NOTICE THEM ANYMORE. THERE'S NOT A NEW CONSTRUCTION IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD THAT DOES NOT ALREADY HAVE ONE OF THESE BEING BUILT BECAUSE IT HELPS WITH A MORTGAGE. IT PROVIDES LIVING SITUATIONS FOR MAYBE A CHILD OR AN ELDERLY FAMILY MEMBER. BUT WE'VE GOT TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT HOUSING. WE CANNOT KEEP KICKING THE CAN. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN GUDES. >>ORLANDO GUDES: I'M GOOD, SIR. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN CARLSON. >>BILL CARLSON: I DON'T KNOW WHAT EVERYBODY IS PLANNING ON DOING RIGHT NOW, BUT I WOULD LIKE FOR YOU TO GO THROUGH THE SLIDES. ORIGINALLY WE TALKED ABOUT MAYBE GOING THROUGH ALL OF THEM AND COMING BACK. ARE THERE SLIDES YOU HAVEN'T SHOWN YET? >>ABBYE FEELEY: YES. >>BILL CARLSON: I THINK IF WE SAW ALL OF IT, MAYBE THAT WOULD CHANGE THE DISCUSSION. >>JOSEPH CITRO: OKAY. AND THEN I WILL FINISH MY STATEMENT. COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. >>LYNN HURTAK: I'M JUST GOING TO GO AHEAD AND MAKE A MOTION TO PASS SECTION 27-132 AND SECTION 27-282.30, ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS, SPECIFIED USES BY TAKING -- AND TAKING OUT SECTION B. LET'S JUST SEE WHERE WE ARE. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: SECOND. >>JOSEPH CITRO: WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO. ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? COUNCILMAN VIERA. >>LUIS VIERA: THANK YOU VERY MUCH. YEAH, I'M GLAD TO VOTE YES. I KNOW SOME FOLKS ARE TALKING ABOUT POTENTIAL IMPERFECTIONS IN THIS. I DON'T REALLY NECESSARILY SEE ANY, BUT WE CAN'T LET THE IMPERFECT BE THE ENEMY OF THE PRETTY DAMN GOOD, ESPECIALLY WITH A HOUSING CRISIS THAT WE HAVE RIGHT NOW. SO I WOULD URGE A YES VOTE. MY ONLY QUESTION IS COUNCILMAN CARLSON, DID YOU WANT TO SEE ALL THE OTHER SLIDES BEFORE VOTING? >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN CARLSON. >>BILL CARLSON: LIKE I SAID, WITHOUT THE LARGER CONTEXT I'M GOING TO VOTE AGAINST ALL OF THESE. IT'S NOT THAT I'M AGAINST ADUs. I CAN'T VOTE FOR IT WITH THIS PROCESS. ALSO, I WOULD WANT TO KEEP IN B ON THIS ALSO. >>MARTIN SHELBY: FOR THE PURPOSES OF THE PUBLIC AT HOME WHO DON'T SEE IT ON THE SCREEN, COULD YOU PLEASE TELL THE PUBLIC WHAT B THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT TAKING OUT IS AND HOW IT IS REFERENCED. >>LYNN HURTAK: B IS AN ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT MAY ONLY BE APPROVED WHEN THE MAIN RESIDENCE IS OWNER OCCUPIED. AGAIN, THE REASONING FOR THAT, LIKE MR. MIRANDA SAID, IT MAY BE FOR ONE MONTH BUT YOU CAN'T REALLY CONTROL IT AFTER THAT. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN MIRANDA. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I UNDERSTAND THE NEED FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING. THE CITY HAS AN OPPORTUNITY TO BUY LAND. THERE'S LAND RIGHT NOW FOR SALE ON MacDILL AND CYPRESS, BOTH SIDES OF THE CORNER, THEY CAN TEAR DOWN THAT AND BUILD SOME REAL, FOUR, FIVE, SIX STORY HIGH BUILDINGS AND HAVE ALL THEY WANT. ALSO ANOTHER 1.5 ACRES ON NORTH ARMENIA THE OTHER SIDE OF HILLSBOROUGH AVENUE ON THE EAST SIDE, OR THE WEST SIDE FACING EAST. YOU CAN PUT SMALL UNITS IN THERE AND DO ALL YOU WANT. BUT WHEN YOU GO INTO A NEIGHBORHOOD AND ANYONE THAT'S HERE WANTS ME TO GIVE AN IDEA OF WHAT'S HAPPENING, CALL ME AND I'LL GIVE YOU A TOUR OF WHERE I LIVE. AND IF THE MEDIA WANTS TO COME, I'LL SHOW YOU 7 AND 8 CARS IN ONE LOT WHERE SITS ON THE GRASS. BUILD THE SIDEWALKS AND ALL KINDS OF VEHICLES ON THE SIDEWALKS. I CAN SHOW YOU THINGS THAT ARE HAPPENING. AND THAT'S WHY I CAN'T SUPPORT THIS BECAUSE I KNOW WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN. IS THIS CITYWIDE? NO. IT LEAVES CERTAIN PARTS OF THE CITY OUT. I JUST CAN'T DO THAT. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >>LYNN HURTAK: I JUST WANT TO MAKE A STATEMENT THAT I DO APPRECIATE THAT WE ARE BUILDING MULTIFAMILY ON MAJOR CORRIDORS. BUT YOU KNOW WHAT? JUST BECAUSE YOU ARE A RENTER DOESN'T MEAN YOU SHOULD HAVE TO LIVE ON A MAJOR THOROUGHFARE. I THINK THAT EVERYONE, RENTERS AND PEOPLE WHO ARE LUCKY ENOUGH TO BE HOMEOWNERS, BOTH OF THEM SHOULD HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO LIVE IN A QUIETER NEIGHBORHOOD IF THAT'S WHAT THEY SO CHOOSE. AND THAT'S WHAT THIS HELPS ADD. THIS IS ABOUT EQUITY TO ME. AND EQUITY, IT'S JUST REALLY FRUSTRATING THAT WE'RE SAYING THAT BECAUSE YOU'RE A RENTER YOU SHOULD REALLY ONLY BE ON CORNERS OF MAJOR THOROUGHFARES. AND THIS HELPS, IN MY OPINION, HELPS MAKE THAT MORE EQUITABLE FOR PEOPLE TO HAVE OPTIONS. AS WAS STATED EARLIER, WE'RE GOING TO BECOME A COMMUNITY OF MORE THAN HALF RENTERS SOON. AND WE REALLY NEED TO HAVE AN OPTION. JUST BECAUSE YOU'RE A RENTER DOESN'T MEAN YOU DON'T HAVE MONEY. IT DOESN'T MEAN YOU DESERVE LESS. I'M OFF MY HORSE. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ANY OTHER COMMENTS? >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: ONE MORE. I AGREE THAT IT'S ABOUT 50% OF THE PEOPLE THAT LIVE IN TAMPA. NOT QUITE 50, BUT IN THE HIGH 40s ARE RENTERS. NOTHING WRONG WITH BEING A RENTER. SOME OF THE PROPERTIES I JUST SPOKE ABOUT, ONE IS A BEAUTIFUL LOT, IT IS ON ARMENIA AVENUE, BUT IT'S WAY BACK. IT GOES BACK, I'D SAY A COUPLE OF HUNDRED FEET, 250 FEET OR SO. I DON'T OWN THE PROPERTY. DON'T KNOW WHO OWNS THE PROPERTY. I SAW IT WHEN I WAS DRIVING AROUND THE OTHER DAY. THAT'S JUST MY FEELING. YOU CANNOT HAVE THIS AND BE THE WAY IT IS NOW AND NOT ATTACKING THOSE WHO HAVE TAKEN ADVANTAGE OF THE SYSTEM. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN GUDES. >>ORLANDO GUDES: I'M GOING TO SUPPORT IT TODAY. I HAVE SOME CONCERNS BECAUSE I BELIEVE THIS WILL BRING ON A LOT OF TRANSIENT BEHAVIOR IN SOME COMMUNITIES. I KNOW SOME OF THE OTHER COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE IT, A LOT ARE OWNER OCCUPIED THAT ARE ALREADY THERE. THEY CAN CONTROL. I FEEL LIKE WHEN YOU START PUTTING SOME OF THESE AND ALLOWING SOME OF THESE IN CERTAIN COMMUNITIES, IT WILL BRING ON MORE TRANSIT BEHAVIOR. I WILL SUPPORT IT TODAY TO MOVE THE PROCESS FORWARD WITH HOUSING. WE HAVE TO TRY SOMETHING. I'LL GIVE A TRY AND CIRCLE BACK IN A YEAR. BUT I'LL GIVE IT A TRY TODAY. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: I UNDERSTAND THE CONCERNS OF ALL THE DIFFERENT BOARD MEMBERS HERE. WE HAVE A HOUSING CRISIS. WE HAVE AN IMPENDING OR WE'RE IN THE RECESSION. I DON'T KNOW HOW BAD THIS IS GOING TO GET IF WE GO TO ANOTHER REPEAT OF WHAT 2008 TO 2012 AND BEYOND WAS. RENTS ARE RISING. WE DID NOT PASS ANY TYPE OF RENT CONTROL AND FOR WHATEVER LEGAL REASONS, I GET IT. I KNOW WE HAVE STATE PREEMPTIONS AND STUFF. WE HAVE OFFERED DIRECT ASSISTANCE TO RENTERS, BUT THAT'S TEMPORARY. WE CAN'T BUILD HOUSING FAST ENOUGH, EVEN THOUGH WE HAVE THOUSANDS OF UNITS THAT ARE PERMITTED, APPROVED, AND IN SOME STAGE BUT EITHER WE DO SOMETHING, AND I'M GOING TO SUPPORT THIS, OR WE'RE GOING TO HAVE AN INFLUX OF HOMELESS PEOPLE ON THE STREETS. THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE I KNOW THAT ARE STRUGGLING PAYCHECK TO PAYCHECK, NOT EVEN THAT. THEY ARE STRUGGLING JUST TO MAKE ENOUGH TO PAY THE RENT AND THEY ARE NOT DOING ANYTHING EXTRA BECAUSE THERE IS NO EXTRA. AGAIN, WITH RISING RENTS AND THE DEMAND OF PEOPLE THAT ARE MOVING TO TAMPA, WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING THAT IS MEANINGFUL. I UNDERSTAND THAT IT'S NOT PERFECT. I UNDERSTAND THERE'S A LOT OF CRITICISM ON THIS. I UNDERSTAND A LOT OF THINGS, BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY, WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A BIGGER CRISIS IF WE DON'T DO ANYTHING. AND THAT'S GOING TO BE WITH PEOPLE ON THE STREETS. THEY ARE NOT GOING TO MOVE OUT OF TAMPA BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO MOVE OUT OF TAMPA. THEY LITERALLY WILL BE ON THE STREETS. BE EVICTED. GET THREE-DAY NOTICES, EVERYTHING THAT HAPPENS. I'M HEARING THESE STORIES. SO I'M GOING TO SUPPORT THIS AND WE MOVE FORWARD AND THEN WE START TWEAKING IT. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. >>LYNN HURTAK: I JUST WANT TO AMEND MY MOTION TO HAVE THIS COME BACK DECEMBER 15th. THAT WAY THE PUBLIC GETS A LITTLE BIT MORE KNOWLEDGE FOR TIME. >>ABBYE FEELEY: I WAS GOING TO TALK ABOUT THAT FOR A MOMENT BECAUSE THIS WILL -- PENDING ON ACTION ON THE MOTION HERE TODAY, THIS WILL GO TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION ON MONDAY, NOVEMBER 7. WE DO COME BACK TO YOU FOR A FIRST READING ON DECEMBER 1st WHERE WE WILL HAVE A WHOLE HEARING ON THE LANGUAGE, AND THEN IF THERE ARE CHANGES IN BETWEEN FIRST AND SECOND READING, JUST LIKE YOU DO WITH OTHER THINGS, YOU COULD MAKE CHANGES THEN AGAIN. THIS ISN'T THE END-ALL, BE-ALL BEFORE YOU TODAY. AND WE HAVE TIME. AND IF THE PUBLIC OR MS. BENNETT OR MS. ONLINERMAN WOULD LIKE TO MEET WITH OUR TEAM AGAIN BEFORE THAT AND BEFORE WE COME BACK ON THAT DECEMBER 1st, WE ARE ALWAYS AVAILABLE TO HAVE THOSE DISCUSSIONS. >>LYNN HURTAK: THE ONLY REASON I MENTION THAT IS BECAUSE THIS IS WHAT WE ALREADY HAVE ON DECEMBER 1st. I JUST THINK IF WE MOVED -- >>ERIC COTTON: DECEMBER 1st IS GOING TO BE A NIGHT MEETING. >>LYNN HURTAK: -- COGNIZANT OF WHAT WE PUT ON THE AGENDAS. >>ABBYE FEELEY: IT IS AN EVENING HEARING ON THE 1st. >>LYNN HURTAK: NO. COUNCIL. THIS IS DECEMBER 1st, OUR REGULAR SESSION. >>ERIC COTTON: LAND DEVELOPMENT COORDINATION. THE ACTUAL ADOPTION OF LANGUAGE, BECAUSE WE'RE CHANGING THE USE TABLES, THAT BECOME A NIGHTTIME MEETING. >>LYNN HURTAK: APOLOGIES. YEAH. I THINK DECEMBER 1st IS FINE. THANK YOU. SORRY ABOUT THAT. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ANY OTHER FURTHER DISCUSSION? WHEN I FIRST MOVED -- ARE WE SAYING THAT THIS IS GOING TO NOT BE IN SOUTH TAMPA? >>ABBYE FEELEY: WE HAVE NOT DISCUSSED WITH YOU THE AREAS YET. WE'RE GOING TO DISCUSS WITH YOU NEXT. WE'RE SAYING WHERE THESE WOULD BE ALLOWED, THESE WOULD BE THE CRITERIA UNDER WHICH THEY WOULD BE ALLOWED. >>JOSEPH CITRO: WHEN I FIRST MOVED TO SOUTH TAMPA BACK IN THE '80s, THERE WAS ALL THESE -- ALL THE MULTIMILLION DOLLAR HOMES IN SOUTH TAMPA WERE ALL CUT UP INTO FIVE OR SIX DWELLINGS. AND YOU HAD THE WORST SLUMLORDS IN THE WORLD. BUT ON EACH ONE OF THESE MULTIMILLION DOLLAR NOW DWELLINGS, YOU HAD A CARRIAGE HOUSE THAT HAD A UNIT UPSTAIRS. FAST-FORWARD 30 YEARS, THOSE MULTIMILLION DOLLAR DWELLINGS ARE NOW JUST ONE UNIT, BUT THOSE CARRIAGE HOUSES ARE STILL BEING RENTED OUT AS ACCESSORY DWELLINGS. I'M JUST SAYING THIS. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE B STRICKEN AND I WOULD LIKE TO SEE C STRICKEN. WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN -- NOT NOW, IN THE FUTURE. >>MARTIN SHELBY: OH, IN THE FUTURE. >>JOSEPH CITRO: NOT NOW. IN THE FUTURE. BETWEEN NOW AND FIRST READING, FIRST, SECOND READING, WE'LL DISCUSS THAT LATER. >>MARTIN SHELBY: NO, SIR. >>ABBYE FEELEY: I NEED TO KNOW NOW. ON C, THIS IS SAYING HOW IT MAY BE DESIGNED TO BE EITHER SEPARATE OR WITHIN. >>JOSEPH CITRO: I JUST DON'T WANT TO SEE A UNIT DIVIDED UP, A SINGLE-FAMILY UNIT. >>ABBYE FEELEY: IT CAN ONLY BE LIKE IF YOU DID IT WITHIN AN EXISTING GARAGE. >>JOSEPH CITRO: EXISTING GARAGE. >>ABBYE FEELEY: THAT'S WHAT IT'S SPEAKING TO. >>JOSEPH CITRO: -- MAIN STRUCTURE. MY BAD. >>MARTIN SHELBY: THE MOTION IS TO HAVE B STRICKEN. THAT IS THE MOTION. YOU WANT TO AMEND THE MOTION TO TAKE SOMETHING ELSE OUT, SIR? >>JOSEPH CITRO: ADD E TO IT. THANK YOU. >>LYNN HURTAK: I WON'T TAKE THAT AMENDMENT BECAUSE OUR MIND -- MINE IS SEPARATELY METERED RIGHT NOW. AND IT SAYS "MAY" NOT "SHALL." YOU COULD HAVE IT METERED BUT YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE IT METERED. I DON'T THINK SEPARATELY METERED FOR UTILITIES REALLY MAKES A DIFFERENCE. I'M CURIOUS WHY. WHAT'S YOUR RATIONALE? >>JOSEPH CITRO: MOST TIMES WHEN CODE ENFORCEMENT GOES OUT TO INSPECT, IF THEY ARE ALLOWED TO GET -- IF THEY ARE ALLOWED TO GET OVER THE FENCE AND SOMEONE SAYS, NO, NO, WE ONLY HAVE ONE METER -- >> THAT MEANS THEIR UNIT IS PROBABLY ILLEGAL. SO THIS WOULD ALLOW THEM TO ACTUALLY LEGALLY ESTABLISH IT WITH A SECOND METER. THAT'S WHAT WE'RE ASKING FOR. >>JOSEPH CITRO: AND SHOULD HAVE A SEPARATE METER. >>ABBYE FEELEY: IT COULD HAVE EITHER IS WHAT THEY ARE SAYING. IF IT'S OWNER OCCUPIED AND YOU'RE DOING IT ACCESSORY AND YOU WANT TO USE THE MAIN HOUSE METER AND YOU DON'T CARE, YOU DON'T WANT TO CHARGE SOMEBODY SEPARATE FOR THE UTILITIES, THEN YOU COULD USE THE SAME METER. IF NOT, YOU MIGHT ELECT TO HAVE IT SEPARATELY METERED. >>JOSEPH CITRO: IF YOU HAVE THE SAME METER BUT YOU HAVE AN ACCESSORY DWELLING THAT'S BEING RENTED OUT. THERE'S NO SEPARATION. >>LYNN HURTAK: THEY JUST ADD TO THE FEE. >>JOSEPH CITRO: I UNDERSTAND THAT. BUT IF CODE ENFORCEMENT GOES OUT AND ACCESSORY DWELLING, SOMEBODY SAYS, NO, NO ONE LIVES THERE, BY HAVING A SEPARATE METER YOU'RE SAYING, YES, THERE IS ANOTHER PERSON. >>ABBYE FEELEY: NOT NECESSARILY. >>ERIC COTTON: AGAIN, IF THESE ARE ALLOWED AS SPECIFIED USES, THERE WOULDN'T BE A NEED FOR CODE ENFORCEMENT TO GO OUT AND CHECK TO SEE IF THE UNIT IS ILLEGAL BECAUSE THEY WOULD -- ASSUMING I HAVE A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME. I HAVE AN ACCESSORY UNIT RIGHT NOW, I'M RENTING THAT OUT ILLEGALLY THEORETICALLY IF THIS WAS APPROVED AND I'M IN THE RIGHT LOCATION WE'LL DISCUSS MOMENTARILY, THAT SECOND UNIT COULD BECOME LEGAL. SO THERE WOULD BE NO NEED FOR A CITATION TO BE ISSUED ON THAT OUTSIDE OF WORK WITHOUT PERMITS, PERHAPS, BECAUSE I MAY HAVE CONVERTED IT OVER WITHOUT A PERMIT, BUT THE USE -- IT COULD BE A LEGAL UNIT. THE ISSUE YOU'RE CONCERNED WITH, MR. CHAIR, WOULDN'T REALLY AFFECT IT. >>JOSEPH CITRO: I WITHDRAW WHAT I WAS SAYING. BUT WE'LL RUN INTO PROBLEMS DOWN THE LINE. WE'RE GOING TO RUN INTO PROBLEMS DOWN THE LINE. CODE ENFORCEMENT GOES OUT AND SUSPECTS SOMEBODY OF HAVING AN ACCESSORY DWELLING -- [AUDIO CUTS OUT] -- DOWN THE LINE. WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO WITHOUT MY AMENDMENT. ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE. >> AYE. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ANY OPPOSED? ROLL CALL VOTE, PLEASE. >>LUIS VIERA: YES. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: YES. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: NO. >>LYNN HURTAK: YES. >>BILL CARLSON: NO. >>ORLANDO GUDES: YES. >>JOSEPH CITRO: YES. >>THE CLERK: MOTION CARRIED WITH MIRANDA AND CARLSON VOTING NO. >> COUNCILMAN CARLSON. >>BILL CARLSON: I THINK THE CONVERSATION YOU ALL JUST HAD WITH THE CHAIR IS AN EXAMPLE OF WHAT I TALKED ABOUT A MINUTE AGO. THIS IS SO COMPLICATED AND SO CONFUSING. MAYBE COUNCIL MEMBER HURTAK COMPLETELY UNDERSTANDS IT, BUT IT'S SO COMPLICATED, WE PROBABLY SHOULD HAVE HAD A SEPARATE WORKSHOP JUST FOR THIS. I WISH WE COULD HAVE A SEPARATE WORKSHOP JUST FOR THIS. WE'RE RUNNING OUT OF TIME AND THERE'S NO WAY THAT, WE HAVE THIS LONG OF CONVERSATION ON ONE SLIDE AND YOU HAVE A BUNCH OF OTHER SLIDES. >>ABBYE FEELEY: WE HAVE TWO LEFT. AND BEFORE WE GO ON TO THOSE TWO, IF I MIGHT, DURING THE PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING, THERE WAS SOME INFORMATION SHARED ABOUT HEIGHTS AND SETBACKS FOR THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURES. A LOT OF CONFUSION BECAUSE WE WEREN'T TALKING ABOUT THAT AT THE BEGINNING. SO THAT WAS PULLED. IT IS STILL GOING TO MEET ACCESSORY -- [AUDIO CUTS OUT] -- WE'D LIKE TO TAKE THESE SMALL STEPS WITH YOU TODAY. SO THE LAST TWO ITEMS WE HAVE ARE THE ALLOWABLE AREAS AND THEN THE PARKING FOR THE ADUs. BECAUSE THESE ARE ALL HOUSED IN DIFFERENT PARTS OF THE CODE, THAT'S WHY WE'RE TAKING THEM THE WAY THAT WE ARE. BUT WE'RE GOING TO TURN OVER TO STEVEN TO TALK TO YOU ABOUT THE ALLOWABLE AREAS AND THEN THE PARKING, WHICH WAS A DISCUSSION IN JUNE ABOUT IF THERE ARE CERTAIN SIZE NO PARKING, CERTAIN SIZE ONE SPACE. THAT'S WHERE WE ARE TODAY. AGAIN, THIS WILL ALL COME BACK AT THE DECEMBER 1st WHERE IF WE WANT TO MAKE TWEAKS OR OTHER MODIFICATIONS WE CAN, AND WE'RE HAPPY TO HAVE OTHER DISCUSSIONS IF NECESSARY. >>JOSEPH CITRO: SOMETIMES YOU HAVE TO MAKE A POINT. SOMETIMES YOU UNDERSTAND BUT YOU JUST HAVE TO MAKE A POINT. >>STEPHEN BENSON: ON THE SCREEN, I'M SHOWING YOU THE AREAS OF THE CITY WHERE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS ARE ALLOWED, EITHER THROUGH THE GENERAL USE TABLE, WHICH SHOWS THE RS 50 AND THE RS 60 LOTS OVER IN THE LOWRY PARK AREA WHERE IT'S PERMITTED. IT WAS DONE THROUGH A PRIVATELY INITIATED AMENDMENT SOME TIME AGO. THE SEMINOLE HEIGHTS AREA HERE IN PURPLE. AGAIN, THE SH ZONING DISTRICTS, WHICH IS WHERE ADUs ARE PERMITTED NOW. AND THEN DOWN HERE, NMU DISTRICTS WHICH WERE CREATED FOR THE WEST RIVER AS PART OF THE MASTER PLAN PROCESS, COMBINED ALL OF THESE AREAS, ACCOUNT FOR ABOUT 4% OF THE CITY. AND THEN I THINK IT'S FAIR TO SAY FROM A PLANNING STANDPOINT, THE SELECTION OF THESE AREAS RELATIVE TO EVERYWHERE ELSE AROUND IT IS RELATIVELY ARBITRARY. WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO IS MAKE THE ALLOWABLE AREAS MORE EQUITABLE AND EXPAND THEM TO AS MANY PLACES AS POSSIBLE WHERE IT MAKES SENSE TO DO SO. SO IN LOOKING AT THE COMP PLAN -- >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I HAVE A QUESTION. IF WHAT I'M LOOKING AT -- PURPLE -- ALLOWED, RIGHT? >>STEPHEN BENSON: YES. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: MLK, MARTIN LUTHER KING BOULEVARD NORTH, THAT WOULD BE ALL OF WELLS WOOD, AM I CORRECT? >>STEPHEN BENSON: NO. THAT'S A GOOD POINT. LET ME KIND OF EXPLAIN THE AREAS. THIS IS ANYWHERE -- >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: EXCUSE ME. WELLSWOOD BE ON THE WEST SIDE OF THE RIVER, NOT THE EAST SIDE. >>STEPHEN BENSON: YES. SEMINOLE HEIGHTS AREA, EAST OF THE RIVER AND SOUTH OF THE RIVER BUT NORTH OF MARTIN LUTHER KING, EAST OVER TO 15th STREET, UP 15th STREET AND THEN EAST ON HILLSBOROUGH AVENUE AND NORTH ON 22nd. ANYWHERE THAT'S OFFICIALLY A SEMINOLE HEIGHTS NEIGHBORHOOD, THERE'S SOUTHEAST SEMINOLE HEIGHTS, OLD SEMINOLE HEIGHTS, IT'S INCLUDED -- IT'S ALREADY ALLOWED IN THAT DISTRICT. THAT'S WHAT COUNCILMAN WAS REFERRING TO. SO LOOKING AT WHERE THE AREAS THAT WE'VE PROPOSED, THERE HAVE BEEN SEVERAL POLICY-RELATED AMENDMENTS TO YOUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN RECENTLY THAT DEALT WITH WHERE GROWTH IS ENCOURAGED IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN. >>JOSEPH CITRO: CAN YOU PUSH IT UP JUST A LITTLE BIT? LITTLE FURTHER. >>STEPHEN BENSON: I'M TRYING TO KEEP THE LEGEND THERE. THE PURPLE AREAS ARE, AGAIN, REALLY THE FOCUS. BUT SPECIFICALLY THE PLANNING DISTRICTS IDENTIFIED THERE IN DARK PURPLE, AND THEN THE ALLOWABLE ZONING DISTRICTS% WITHIN THEM ARE WHAT ARE SHADED PURPLE. THAT'S WHERE THEY ACTUALLY WILL BE ALLOWED. THESE DISTRICTS WERE SELECTED BECAUSE THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN SPEAKS TO THE ESTABLISHMENT OF PLANNING DISTRICTS. SOUTH TAMPA, WESTSHORE, CENTRAL, UNIVERSITY DISTRICT, AND THEN THE NEW TAMPA DISTRICT. AND THEN WHAT THE FUTURE IS SUPPOSED TO LOOK LIKE WITHIN THOSE DISTRICTS. IT SPEAKS TO DIRECTING GROWTH AND NEW DEVELOPMENT AND REDEVELOPMENT INTO THE WESTSHORE DISTRICT, THE CENTRAL DISTRICT, AND THE UNIVERSITY DISTRICT. IT SPEAKS TO DISCOURAGING GROWTH IN THE SOUTH TAMPA DISTRICT AS BEING NOT SUITABLE FOR AS MUCH GROWTH AS THE CENTRAL THREE DISTRICTS. IT SPEAKS THE SAME WAY ABOUT NEW TAMPA, WHICH IS WHY NEW TAMPA ISN'T INCLUDED ON THIS MAP AT ALL. WE'RE NOT PROPOSING TO TOUCH EITHER OF THOSE AREAS. IN ADDITION TO THAT, SPEAKING TO THE NEW TAMPA DISTRICT SPECIFICALLY, WE'RE NOT PROPOSING TO INCLUDE THAT AREA AS PART OF THIS BECAUSE OF THE ISSUE WAS BROUGHT UP EARLIER. MAKING A CHANGE FOR NEW TAMPA RIGHT NOW WON'T AFFECT WHETHER YOU'RE ALLOWED TO DO IT BECAUSE OTHER MECHANISMS IN PLACE PREVENTING THAT. SOUTH TAMPA, FALLING BACK ON THE LANGUAGE IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, SPEAKING TO WHERE GROWTH SHOULD BE ENCOURAGED, SOUTH TAMPA IS NOT ONE OF THOSE AREAS. IN ADDITION TO THAT, YOU CAN SEE WE PUT HERE ON THE MAP THAT MAJORITY OF SOUTH TAMPA IS INCLUDED IN THE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREA, AND IT DOES HAVE A UNIQUE GEOGRAPHY COMPARED TO THE REST OF THE CITY AND THERE ARE IMPLICATIONS WITH THAT. SO THIS IS WHERE OUR RECOMMENDATION WAS. IT DOESN'T MEAN THAT WE ARE RECOMMENDING AGAINST INCLUDING IT IN OTHER AREAS. IT JUST MEANS AS THIS NEXT STEP GOES FORWARD, THIS IS A GOOD NEXT STEP THAT STAFF WAS COMFORTABLE PUTTING BEFORE YOU TODAY. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: SO THIS IS NOT A CITYWIDE INITIATIVE. AS YOU EXPLAINED, IT IS RESTRICTED TO THOSE BOUNDARIES THAT ARE COLORED IN THAT LIGHT PURPLE CORRECT? >>STEPHEN BENSON: YES, SIR. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN, IN MY OPINION, PEOPLE IN MY DISTRICT OR IN WEST TAMPA OR PEOPLE THAT ARE AGAINST THIS ARE GOING TO SAY, WHY IS SOUTH TAMPA EXCLUDED? WHY ARE THEY BETTER THAN WE ARE? WHATEVER THEY SAY, THEY ARE NOT GOING TO BE HAPPY AND THEY ARE GOING TO SAY -- THEY MAY SAY -- WHY CAN'T IT BE EQUALLY ASSESSED ACROSS THE CITY? I UNDERSTAND YOUR ANALYSIS AND WHY YOU CAME TO THIS CONCLUSION AND WHY YOUR TEAM CAME TO THIS CONCLUSION. BUT I KNOW -- I MEAN, I CAN HEAR MY FATHER SAYING IT. YOU KNOW, WHY IS IT -- IT'S NOT GOOD ENOUGH FOR HERE BUT GOOD ENOUGH FORGET. YOU KNOW, DO IT OR DON'T DO IT AT ALL. RIGHT THERE I HAVE PAUSE WITH THAT BECAUSE I KNOW WHAT I'M GOING TO HEAR FROM OTHER NEIGHBORHOODS. AND I UNDERSTAND WHY, WHETHER COASTAL HIGH HAZARD, WHETHER THE DENSITY IS ALREADY THERE IN OTHER PARTS OF THE CITY WHERE WE'RE NOT HAVING TO ENCOURAGE THIS KIND OF GROWTH, BUT THE ISSUE WITH RENT IS A CITYWIDE ISSUE. IT'S NOT -- OH, SOUTH TAMPA, NOT ALL OF SOUTH TAMPA IS RICH. NOT ALL OF WEST TAMPA IS RICH. IT'S MIXED AND DIVERSE. I'M JUST SAYING WHAT FEEDBACK I'M MOST LIKELY GOING TO HEAR BECAUSE OF THIS. THANK YOU. >>LUIS VIERA: THANK YOU VERY MUCH. YOU KNOW WHAT I'D SAY FOR SOUTH TAMPA AND NEW TAMPA AREA IS WE EXPLAIN BECAUSE THERE IS A VERY RATIONAL BASIS FOR THE EXCLUSION. SOUTH TAMPA, LIKE YOU SAID, THE HIGH COASTAL HAZARD, 47 BECAUSE OF DEED RESTRICTIONS, ET CETERA, SIMPLY EXPLAIN IT. I'VE DONE THE REVERSE FOR PARTS OF MY DISTRICT. REMEMBER WHEN I WAS RUNNING FOR OFFICE IN '16 AND I SUPPORTED THE STORMWATER TAX ASSESSMENT, WHATEVER, AND A LOT OF FOLKS IN MY DISTRICT WERE SAYING, WELL, WE DON'T GET A LOT OF STORMWATER AND WHATNOT. WELL, WE'RE ONE CITY, RIGHT? AND JUST THE PIPES PROGRAM. A LOT OF FOLKS, HEY, WHY ARE YOU DOING THIS? IN NEW TAMPA, OUR PIPES ARE NEW. NEWER, 35, 25, WHATEVER YEARS IT MAY BE. AGAIN, WE'RE ONE CITY, AND THERE IS A RATIONAL EXPLANATION FOR THAT. SO I THINK FOR THAT, SO LONG AS WE EXPLAIN IT, I DON'T THINK IT'S THAT DIFFICULT TO EXPLAIN, IN MY OPINION. BUT TRUST ME, IT'S FUNNY WHAT YOU SAID ABOUT YOUR FATHER. I SOMETIMES THINK MY FATHER WOULD SAY THAT. I OFTEN DO THAT. THANK YOU. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN MIRANDA. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ONE OF MY TWO DAUGHTERS OR ANY OF MY FAMILY MEMBERS LIVED IN SOUTH TAMPA AND WANTED TO BUILD SOMETHING FOR ME, I COULDN'T DO IT RIGHT? SO I COULDN'T LIVE AT MY DAUGHTER'S HOUSE? >>STEPHEN BENSON: YOU WOULD STILL BE ABLE TO UTILIZE THE EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCE USE BECAUSE THAT USE IS STILL PERMITTED CITYWIDE. THIS IS ONLY CHANGING THE ADU USE, WHICH DOESN'T HAVE THE FAMILY MEMBER REQUIREMENT TO IT. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: THAT GETS A LITTLE MORE COMPLICATED WHAT YOU SAID BECAUSE THE PUBLIC WON'T UNDERSTAND THAT ONE EITHER. YOU TELL ME IF THEY BUILD AN 8 BY 10 ROOM, THEY CAN DO IT? >>STEPHEN BENSON: YES, IN THE SOUTH TAMPA PLANNING DISTRICT. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE? >>STEPHEN BENSON: THE DIFFERENCE IN THE TWO USES? >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: NOT PUTTING INTO LAW THAT THEY ARE OMITTED FROM THAT. >>STEPHEN BENSON: BECAUSE THE EFRs ARE WHAT CURRENTLY EXIST. THOSE ARE THE EXISTING ALLOWABLE AREAS. WE DIDN'T PROPOSE MODIFYING THOSE. THAT'S JUST SITTING IN THE BACKGROUND. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. >>LYNN HURTAK: I DON'T KNOW IF I MADE THAT MOTION TO TALK ABOUT GETTING RID OF EXTENDED FAMILY DWELLINGS, BUT I'M GOING TO DO THAT RIGHT NOW. I WOULD LOVE TO COME BACK AND TALK ABOUT THAT MAYBE IN JANUARY OR IF WE HAVE APRIL. I DON'T KNOW, THROW OUT A DATE. BUT I STILL THINK, BECAUSE I AGREE, THERE IS CONFUSION, AND I THINK WE JUST NEED A CLEAN SLATE. SO I WOULD LOVE TO MAKE A MOTION TO COME BACK TO DISCUSS THAT AT A FUTURE TIME, NOT NOW, BUT AT A FUTURE TIME. I CAN ALSO WOR WORK WITH YOU ONT AND COME BACK LATER WITH A DATE. MY QUESTION IS, I SEE A BIT FURTHER SOUTH IN CENTRAL TAMPA THAT LOOKS LIKE IT'S PURPLE BUT ALSO COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREA. LIKE, EXPLAIN, WOULD THEY BE ALLOWED THERE? >>STEPHEN BENSON: JUST TO BE CLEAR, THE DEFINITIONS FOR THE PLANNING DISTRICTS ARE VERY SPECIFIC. SO THE SOUTH TAMPA PLANNING DISTRICT DOES INCLUDE SOME AREAS THAT PEOPLE REFER TO AS SOUTH TAMPA. JUST TO BE CLEAR, DAVIS ISLAND WOULD BE INCLUDED AS AN ALLOWABLE AREA. HYDE PARK WOULD BE INCLUDED AS AN ALLOWABLE AREA. THAT'S BECAUSE OF HOW THE PLANNING DISTRICT LINES ARE DRAWN. IT'S NOT -- EVERYTHING SOUTH OF KENNEDY NECESSARILY PART OF THE SOUTH TAMPA PLANNING DISTRICT. THAT'S WHY THE MAP IS VERY IMPORTANT. >>LYNN HURTAK: JUST TO EXPAND ON THAT BECAUSE IT'S THE SAME QUESTION, THINKING ABOUT WHAT JUST HAPPENED IN FORT MYERS, THINKING ABOUT FUTURE LAND USE, FUTURE USE ON IN COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREA, THAT IS AN AREA WHERE THE PUBLIC HAS MADE COMMENTS ABOUT NOT ALLOWING CERTAIN GROWTH IN COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREAS, BUT I ALSO KNOW THAT DEPENDING UPON THE NEIGHBORHOOD YOU'RE IN, THEY WANT MORE DEVELOPMENT. SO WHAT'S THE BALANCE THERE? MILLION-DOLLAR QUESTION. >>STEPHEN BENSON: THIS WAS OUR ATTEMPT AT TRYING TO STRIKE THAT BALANCE. IF YOU WISH TO ADD TO THIS CRITERIA IN SOME WAY AND SAY IN ADDITION TO THESE THREE DISTRICTS, PLEASE ALSO OMIT ANY PARCEL THAT'S WITHIN THE CHHA. WE CAN ADD THAT TO THE LANGUAGE AND MAKE IT EVEN SMALLER, IF THAT'S THE DIRECTION YOU'RE GOING IN. >>LYNN HURTAK: I'M JUST ASKING BECAUSE I WAS TRYING TO FIGURE THAT OUT. THANK YOU. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN GUDES. >>ORLANDO GUDES: I'LL YIELD BACK SIR. >>JOSEPH CITRO: IS THERE ANYONE IN THE AUDIENCE THAT WISHES TO SPEAK TO THIS PART OF AGENDA NUMBER 7? >> NNATHAN HAGEN. LAST YEAR, THE PLANNING COMMISSION ADOPTED AN EQUITY REPORT WHICH INCLUDED A PHENOMENAL PRESENTATION ABOUT THE HISTORY OF RACISM AND DISCRIMINATION AND PAINTED A PICTURE ABOUT HOW WE HAVE DELIBERATELY CONCENTRATED POVERTY IN WEST TAMPA OVER THE LAST 80 YEARS WITH OUR ZONING CODE. IT'S VERY CONSPICUOUS TO ME -- WELL, ALSO ADD THIS, LAST WEEK THERE WAS AN ARTICLE ABOUT ADUs IN CREATIVE LOAFING THAT SAID THAT THEY WERE A FORCE FOR GENTRIFICATION. THAT IS A COMPLEX ISSUE THAT I CAN'T TRY TO WALK US THROUGH HERE IN THREE MINUTES. BUT IT'S CONSPICUOUS, I THINK, COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO ALLUDED TO THIS, IS THAT IF YOU'RE SOMEBODY WHO IS IN A COMMUNITY THAT HAS SUFFERED FROM OUR INEQUITABLE ZONING CODE FOR THE LAST 80 YEARS, YOU'RE GOING TO SEE THAT SOME NEIGHBORHOODS GET SPECIAL TREATMENT. AGAIN, AS THEY HAVE FOR 80 YEARS. SO I UNDERSTAND THE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREA. DEED RESTRICTIONS, I DON'T HAVE A POLICY SOLUTION TO THAT, BUT I DO KNOW THAT SAYING WE CAN'T HAVE ADUs, OCCASIONALLY IN THE WEALTHIEST PARTS OF TAMPA FOR THIS REASON, WHICH, BY THE WAY, SHOULD BE A SAFETY BUILDING CODE ISSUE, NOT A ZONING CODE ISSUE, PER SE, TO ME, I THINK EVERYONE CAN SEE THROUGH THAT. ANYBODY WHO IS ON THESE ISSUES IN EAST TAMPA AND WEST TAMPA WILL SEE IF THEY ARE INFORMED ABOUT THIS ISSUE, THAT SOUTH TAMPA ONCE AGAIN IS GETTING SPECIAL TREATMENT. I THINK THEY SHOULD BE CITYWIDE. I THINK IT IS AN IMPORTANT QUESTION YOU HAD ABOUT DEVELOPMENT IN THE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREA. THAT INCLUDS PARTS OF DOWNTOWN, HARBOUR ISLAND, DAVIS ISLAND AND ALL THESE PLACES THAT WE HAVE TO FIGURE OUT A BIG COMPREHENSIVE PLAN. I KNOW THAT WE'RE DOING THAT. I THINK THAT CONVERSATION CAN HAPPEN THEN. JUST TALKING ABOUT ADUs, WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT THE EQUITY COMPONENT AND THAT INCLUDES ALLOWING THESE IN THOSE NEIGHBORHOODS. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN GUDES. >>ORLANDO GUDES: YOU KNOW, KIND OF LIKE THIS RED PEN. IT'S JUST RED-LINED ON YOUR MAP. WE COULD TALK ABOUT THE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREAS, WHICH WE KNOW WE HAVE SOME ISSUES THERE, BUT WHEN YOU SAY YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE A PROGRAM FOR THE CITY, IT SHOULD BE INCLUSIVE. YOU MAY HAVE SOME DEED-RESTRICTED AREAS, BUT SOME OF THOSE AREAS DEED RESTRICTED, MAY BE RIGHT OUTSIDE OF IT AND MAY NOT BE. AGAIN, IT LOOKS TO ME, AGAIN, ANOTHER CLASSIC WAY OF RED-LINING, JUST DOING IT IN A NICER WAY, BUT TO ME IT'S RED-LINING. WE TALK ABOUT EQUALITY, IT'S A PART OF EQUITY AS WELL. WE HAVE TO SPREAD THE WEALTH AROUND. YOU'RE RIGHT, NATHAN. WE'RE NOT SPREADING THE WEALTH AROUND. THANK YOU. >> JUSTIN WILL ITS, TAMPA HEIGHTS. I FEEL LIKE WE SHOULD JUST MOVE AHEAD ON THIS. IF SOUTH TAMPA WANTS TO COME BACK AND CAMPAIGN FOR THIS, THEN BY ALL MEANS. I THINK IT MAKES A LOT OF SENSE BASED ON WHAT STEPHEN BENSON SAID. WE SHOULD BE PROMOTING GROWTH IN THE PLACES THAT MAKE SENSE. SOUTH TAMPA HAS DEMONSTRATED SKEPTICISM TOWARDS GROWTH. THERE ARE SOME TRAFFIC ISSUES THERE. WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH TRANSIT. THE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD IS A LEGITIMATE CONCERN, AND IT DOESN'T MEAN WE SHOULDN'T MOVE FORWARD IN THE REST OF THE CITY. AND SOME OTHER ITEMS THAT I WANT TO JUST ADD IN, YOU KNOW, WE DON'T HAVE MONEY FOR TRANSPORTATION OR HOUSING. WE MAY NOT GET IT VERY SOON. WE CAN'T EXPECT THE CITY TO BUILD ENOUGH. TRANSPORTATION OR HOUSING. WE NEED TO LEAN ON PRIVATE PROPERTY OWNERS TO BUILD SOME MORE OF THE HOUSING AND THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT TODAY. I BOUGHT MY FIRST HOUSE IN TAMPA HEIGHTS SEVEN YEARS AGO AND THOUGHT I PROBABLY ALREADY HAVE AN ADU BY NOW AND WE'RE STILL TALKING ABOUT IT. THERE ARE REALLY A LOT OF BENEFITS THAT THIS HOUSING WOULD PROVIDE INCLUDING AFFORDABILITY, AGING IN PLACE, REDUCING DISPLACEMENT WITH SOARING COSTS. THE SPECIFIC TRANSPORTATION-RELATED IMPACTS AS A TRANSIT PLANNER MYSELF, FORMER HART EMPLOYEE, THE PROBLEM WITH TRANSIT HERE IS WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH PEOPLE NEAR IT. THIS IS HOW WE GET MORE PEOPLE NEAR IT. WE HAVE CORRIDORS LINED WITH CAR SHOPS, NOT DENSE HOUSING. WE CAN ADDRESS THAT AS WELL. THERE ARE 10, 20, 30, 50 THINGS WE SHOULD DO AS A COMMUNITY TO GET MORE HOUSING. THIS IS ONE PIECE. IT IS ONE OF THE EASIER PIECES. LET'S MOVE IT AHEAD AND DO THE RIGHT THING. LIKE I SAID, COME BACK LATER FOR SOUTH TAMPA. I THINK THE PLANNER, THE CITY PLANNER MADE A GOOD CASE FOR WHY. IT DOESN'T MAKE A TON OF SENSE AND BASED ON WHAT I'VE PERSONALLY HEARD FROM THE SOUTH OF GANDY FOLKS, I DON'T THINK THEY WANT ANY DEVELOPMENT. THIS JUST IS PART OF THAT THING. I THINK I'VE NAILED ALL MY POINTS HERE. I'M SURPRISED I'M NOT AT THREE MINUTES. I JUST THINK WE NEED TO MOVE THIS AHEAD. YOU HAVE TIME TO PUT MORE EFFORT INTO THIS. THE BEST TRANSIT SERVICE WE HAVE IN THE CITY AND THE COUNTY IS IN THE AREAS THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT DOING THIS ON THAT MAP YOU'VE GOT 15 AND 20 MINUTE SERVICE ALL DAY ON FLORIDA, NEBRASKA FLORIBRASKA 56th STREET AND HILLSBOROUGH AVENUE. THOSE ARE THE FOUR BEST ROUTES IN THE WHOLE HART SYSTEM. THEY CARRY ABOUT 25% OF THE DAILY RIDERSHIP. AND THIS IS GOING TO PUT MORE HOUSING OPPORTUNITIES ALONG THOSE TRANSIT ROUTES. IT'S LIKE THIS IS GOOD FOR TRANSIT. THAT'S THE BIG TAKEAWAY. THANKS. >>JOSEPH CITRO: MS. POYNOR, ARE YOU ONLINE? MS. POYNOR? MS. BENNETT, ARE YOU ONLINE? >> HELLO? >>JOSEPH CITRO: MS. POYNOR? >> HELLO. CAN YOU HEAR ME? >>JOSEPH CITRO: YES, MS. POYNOR. >> FIRST OF ALL, I WANT TO ADDRESS MR. HAGEN IMPLYING THAT THERE IS NO POVERTY SOUTH OF GANDY, THAT THERE IS A -- WE ARE BEARING THE BRUNT IN THE FOUR SQUARE MILES THAT I LIVE IN, WE'VE GOT 3,000 MORE APARTMENTS COMING. THAT DOESN'T SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES. THAT DOES NOT INCLUDE CONDOMINIUMS. THAT DOES NOT INCLUDE TOWNHOMES. THAT'S ONLY APARTMENTS. WE HAVE BEEN WORKING OUR BUTT OFF TO STAVE THAT. HURRICANE -- IF YOU DON'T KNOW% WHAT IT IS, YOU SHOULD GOOGLE IT AND WATCH THE VIDEOS ON IT. ALSO, IAN, HAD IT HIT HERE, EVERYTHING DOWN HERE WOULD HAVE BEEN UNDERWATER. SO, YOU KNOW, HOW MANY PEOPLE DO YOU WANT TO DROWN? THAT'S REALLY WHAT IT'S ABOUT. IT'S NOT ABOUT AFFORDABLE HOUSING IN THIS PARTICULAR SITUATION. WE HAVE TAKEN ON THE BRUNT OF THE HOUSING DOWN HERE, AND THEY HAVEN'T EVEN BUILT WHAT IS NEEDED FOR THE 22,000 PEOPLE WHO DRIVE THROUGH OUR COMMUNITY EVERY SINGLE DAY TO GET TO WORK. SO LET'S JUST MAKE SURE WE'VE GOT IT STRAIGHT. I'M NOT AGAINST ADUs. IF I DIDN'T LIVE ON A DEAD END, I WOULD BE ALL ON IT. IF I DIDN'T LIVE IN A COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREA, I WOULD TOTALLY BE ON IT. I WOULD THINK IT WOULD BE A GREAT IDEA. I HAVE A COUPLE OF PROPERTIES THAT ARE LARGE ENOUGH TO HAVE ADUs. BUT THE BOTTOM LINE IS, NOT EVERY AREA OF THE CITY NEEDS TO HAVE IT BECAUSE WE ARE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD. ALL IT TOOK WAS IAN TO HIT A COUPLE OF HOURS NORTH AND YOU GUYS WOULD HAVE A TOTALLY DIFFERENT CONVERSATION TODAY. AND IS THAT THE CONVERSATION YOU WANT TO HAVE WITH YOUR CONSTITUENTS FIVE YEARS FROM NOW, TEN YEARS FROM NOW WHEN ALL THE FOLKS ARE STUCK SOUTH OF GANDY AND CAN'T GET OUT. WE ARE A FOOD DESERT. YOU CAN'T BE A FOOD DESERT WITHOUT HAVING PEOPLE IMPOVERISHED. ALL OF OUR ELEMENTARY SCHOOLS SOUTH OF GANDY ARE FREE AND REDUCED LUNCH. BOTH OF OUR MIDDLE SCHOOLS FOR SOUTH OF GANDY ARE FREE AND REDUCED LUNCH. SO MAYBE IT'S TIME FOR FOLKS TO DO THE MATH ABOUT WHAT POVERTY MEANS VERSUS US BEING SMART ABOUT WHAT WE'RE DOING FOR OUR CITY. THANK YOU. >>JOSEPH CITRO: MS. BENNETT. MS. BENNETT? >> HI. THIS IS CARROLL ANN BENNETT. IN THE TAMPA COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, IT SAYS THERE ARE SIX LEVELS OF INTENSITY TO INDICATE WHERE DEVELOPMENT SHOULD BE FOCUSED. THE LOWEST LEVEL, LEVEL ONE, IS SOUTH TAMPA. EVERY DEPARTMENT HEAD IN THE CITY HAS COME BEFORE YOU AT ONE TIME OR ANOTHER AND TALKED ABOUT WHERE THE GROWTH NEEDS TO BE. A LOT OF IT HAS TO DO WITH TRANSIT CORRIDORS. AND EVERY TIME THEY DO, THEY EXCLUDE SOUTH TAMPA AND NEW TAMPA. IT IS THE THREE CENTRAL PLANNING DISTRICTS WHERE THEY THINK THE GROWTH SHOULD BE CONCENTRATED. ONE OF THE REASONS THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN SAYS THAT YOU SHOULDN'T HAVE THE GROWTH IN SOUTH TAMPA IS BECAUSE OF THE LACK OF TRANSIT SERVICES AND NO PLANS TO INCREASE THEM. THE FLOOD-PRONE LAND AND STEPHANIE IS CORRECT. THERE'S PLENTY OF PEOPLE IN SOUTH TAMPA WHO ARE NOT RICH. A LOT OF OUR SCHOOLS QUALIFY FOR FREE AND REDUCED LUNCHES FOR ALL OF THEM. I'D ALSO LIKE TO POINT OUT THAT SOUTH TAMPA HAS DONE MORE THAN IT'S FAIR SHARE OF ADDING TO THE DWELLING UNITS IN THIS CITY. THERE'S NO COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREA IN THE CITY THAT HAS HAD MORE GROWTH THAN THE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREA IN SOUTH TAMPA. WE HAVE A SPREADSHEET THAT SHOWS THE ADDITIONAL DWELLING UNITS AND WE GOT THIS INFORMATION FROM THE PROPERTY APPRAISER. SOUTH TAMPA HAS ADDED -- [AUDIO CUTS OUT] -- BUILT ALMOST 9300 ADDITIONAL DWELLING UNITS. OUR FAIR SHARE TO ADD TO THE HOUSING -- COMPLETELY INACCURATE. AND THIS IS HAPPENING IN AN AREA WHERE THERE SHOULD NOT BE THE GROWTH. A LOT OF THOSE UNITS SHOULD HAVE BEEN IN OTHER AREAS THAT NEED THEM AND WHERE THEY ARE MORE APPROPRIATE. I AM NOT AGAINST ADUs. I APOLOGIZE IF I HAVEN'T DONE ENOUGH TO UNDERSTAND ALL THE COMPLEXITIES OF IT. I SUPPORT ADUs, BUT I NEED TO UNDERSTAND THEM COMPLETELY. AND I'M GOING TO REACH OUT. I'M GOING TO TRY TO DO THAT SO I'M NOT SITTING HERE SAYING I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT THIS MEANS. BUT THE BOTTOM LINE IS THAT THESE TWO AREAS NEED TO BE EXCLUDED FOR SPECIFIC REASONS. THEY ARE VALID REASONS. IT IS RECKLESS AND IRRESPONSIBLE TO CONTINUE TO INCREASE THE POPULATION IN EVACUATION ZONES A AND B AND IN THE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREA. THANK YOU. >>JOSEPH CITRO: THANK YOU. QUESTIONS FROM COUNCIL? WHAT IS THE PLEASURE OF COUNCIL? COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: YOU KNOW, COUNCILMAN GUDES SAID SOMETHING. HE HELD UP THE RED PEN. RED-LINING. AGAIN, I'M ALWAYS READING ABOUT HISTORY AND THERE'S A LOT OF RACISM IN THAT HISTORY. WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT REDLINING, THE GENTRIFICATION, WHATEVER YOU WANT TO CALL IT OVER THE LAST CENTURY OR HALF A CENTURY. I GET IT. BUT IN THIS CASE, REGARDING HOW CERTAIN PARTS OF THE CITY FLOOD, THE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREAS, WHERE THE GROWTH IS CONCENTRATED, STEPHANIE POYNOR SAID IT REGARDING SOUTH OF GANDY, 3,000 APARTMENT UNITS. THEIR DENSITY IS COMING IN RAPIDLY. AND THAT'S, AGAIN, NOT COUNTING SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES AND EVERYTHING ELSE. BUT AT THE SAME TIME, I UNDERSTAND, YOU KNOW, WHY THE BORDERS. AND YOU MENTIONED IN THERE HYDE PARK AND OTHER PARTS OF THE CITY. IT'S NOT JUST EAST TAMPA, WEST TAMPA. BUT I'M GOING TO SUPPORT IT MOVING FORWARD. CAN WE FURTHER EXPAND THOSE BOUNDARIES IN THE FUTURE? WILL YOU LOOK AT THAT FOR FURTHER EXPANSION? THIS IS JUST PHASE ONE, ESSENTIALLY? >>STEPHEN BENSON: WE WOULD BE HAPPY TO COME BACK WITH A REPORT AND TELL YOU HOW WE'RE DOING IN THE YEAR. ADDITIONAL TWEAKS. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO ADVANCE THIS AS PRESENTED AND GO -- >>LYNN HURTAK: SECOND. >>STEPHEN BENSON: THANK YOU. >>JOSEPH CITRO: WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILMAN GUDES. SECONDED BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? COUNCILMAN GUDES. >>ORLANDO GUDES: I THINK COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO MADE THE MOTION WITH MS. HURTAK SECONDING IT. >>JOSEPH CITRO: THAT'S WHAT I MEANT TO SAY. >>ORLANDO GUDES: ALL RIGHT. LET ME SAY THIS. A PERSON WHO WORKED EVERY INCH OF THE CITY, FROM NEW TAMPA TO PORT TAMPA, AND WHEN YOU LOOK AT SOUTH TAMPA, THERE IS A DIVIDE. A LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T KNOW THAT. I WORKED AT ROBINSON HIGH SCHOOL, AND THE LADIES ARE RIGHT. THERE ARE UNDERACHIEVING SCHOOLS DOWN IN THAT AREA. AND THERE WAS A SEPARATION WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT SOUTH TAMPA. BECAUSE WHEN I WAS THERE, YOU HAD THE BORDERLINE. DIDN'T MIX AND MINGLE TOO MUCH. THAT'S KIND OF CHANGED A LITTLE BIT NOW THROUGH THE YEARS. AND I CAN REMEMBER WHEN THERE WERE NO APARTMENTS ON THAT SIDE. MANHATTAN, THOSE AREAS DOWN THERE. THEY ARE RIGHT AS FAR AS THE GROWTH IS CONCERNED AND THE AMOUNT OF APARTMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN BUILT UP THERE. THE AREA HAS TOTALLY CHANGED, EVEN THE BACK AREA, YOU HAVE NOW HOUSES BACK THERE, WASN'T ANYTHING BACK THERE BEFORE, BACK IN THE EARLY 2000s. I CAN CONCUR WITH WHAT THEY ARE SAYING IN REFERENCE TO THAT. I CAN SEE HOW WE'RE TRYING TO SAY WE WANT TO LOOK AT THE GROWTH PATTERN. THEY DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT. THEY JUST SEE WHAT I JUST SAID BEFORE, A SEPARATION. AND I DON'T LIKE SEPARATIONS. I'M GOING TO SUPPORT IT TODAY. LIKE MR. MANISCALCO SAID, WE JUST HAVE TO BE MINDFUL AND KEEP OUR EYE ON THE PRIZE AND MAKE SURE THAT THE DISTRIBUTION IS GOING -- EVEN WITH THE NEW TAMPA FOLKS, THERE ARE SOME AREAS UNDEVELOPED THAT PROBABLY WILL BE DEVELOPED AND WE CAN'T LEAVE THEM OUT IN THE FUTURE. SO I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE KEEP AN EYE ON EVERYBODY SO IT'S FAIR. >>STEPHEN BENSON: WE DO HAVE THE SOUTH OF GANDY STUDY THAT IS ONGOING AND ADUs WILL BE A TOPIC OF DISCUSSION AS PART OF THAT. ADDITIONALLY WITH NEW TAMPA, IF THERE ARE NEIGHBORHOODS THAT WANT THIS, WE WOULD BE HAPPY TO MEET WITH THEM AND TALK ABOUT THE IMPLICATIONS. THEY JUST DON'T ALLOW IT ALREADY. AS FAR AS IMMEDIATE FIRST STEP, WE JUST DIDN'T FEEL LIKE THAT WAS WORTH GOING INTO YET. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN VIERA. >>LUIS VIERA: THANK YOU, SIR. I APPRECIATE THAT. AND, AGAIN, WHAT I HAD MENTIONED -- AND I THINK EVERYBODY HAS MENTIONED THIS -- IS MAYBE COMING BACK AND LOOKING AT THIS IN THE FUTURE, EITHER FOR EXPANSION, EITHER TO LOOK AT, AGAIN, UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES. THERE ARE TWO DISTINCT ISSUES, AS YOU INDICATED WITH NEW TAMPA. IT'S MORE OF A CONTRACTUAL ISSUE WHERE YOU HAVE SEPARATE GOVERNMENT ENTITIES LIKE CDDs, ET CETERA. IT'S FUNNY, WHEN I FIRST HEARD OF CDDs, I KEPT CALLING IT CCD, IF YOU ARE CATHOLIC, YOU KNOW WHAT CCD. THERE ARE CDDs AND DIFFERENT TYPES OF ISSUES LIKE THAT THAT PRECLUDE US LEGALLY FROM DOING THAT. SO IT'S REALLY NOT A POLICY ISSUE. IT'S MORE OF OUR HANDS ARE TIED ISSUE. WITH SOUTH TAMPA, IT'S A POLICY ISSUE AND WHATNOT. BUT, AGAIN, I STRONGLY SUPPORT THIS. AND WHEREVER WE CAN DO IT THROUGHOUT THE CITY OF TAMPA, I SUPPORT THIS. I'VE ALWAYS BEEN A SUPPORTER OF EXPANDING OUR HOUSING STOCK. I REMEMBER, GOSH, MAYBE A YEAR AND A HALF AGO, I THINK ABBYE WAS THERE WITH ME, AS I RECALL, TALKING IN A PART OF MY DISTRICT ABOUT APARTMENTS THAT WERE COMING. THEY WERE ALREADY APPROVED YEARS AGO BY CITY COUNCIL. THEY WERE COMING AND PEOPLE WERE REALLY ANGRY AND I WAS MEETING WITH THEM OR ONE GUY. THE STUFF THAT PEOPLE SAID BECAUSE THE IMPLICATIONS THAT PEOPLE HAVE DUE TO THEIR OWN FEAR AND LACK OF CONNECTION WITH THE REAL WORLD ON THINGS LIKE APARTMENTS IS STUNNING. AND THIS IS POLITICAL, BUT I REMEMBER IN THE 2020 ELECTION SOME OF THE THINGS SAID BY ONE CANDIDATE WHO HAPPENED TO BE THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES AT THE TIME ABOUT LOWER INCOME HOUSING, SOUNDED LIKE THEY WOULD HAVE COME OUT OF THE MOUTH OF GEORGE WALLACE IN HIS 1968 CAMPAIGN SAYING WE'RE GOING TO SAVE THE SUBURBS FROM LOW-INCOME HOUSING AND A LOT OF PEOPLE FELL FOR THAT AND THAT'S SHAMEFUL. SO WE ALL HAVE TO STAND UP FOR OUR CITY OF TAMPA THAT WE HAVEO- TO HAVE A CITY WHERE THE MIDDLE-CLASS CAN LIVE, THE WORKING CLASS CAN LIVE AND FOLKS WHO ARE STRUGGLING AND WORKING HARD TO MAKE IT TO THE MIDDLE CLASS AND WORKING CLASS HAVE A PLACE AT THE TABLE. I THINK WE ALL SUPPORT THAT 110%. LET'S MOVE THIS THING FORWARD. GET IT DONE BECAUSE I THINK IT'S GOOD POLICY. THANK YOU. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN MIRANDA. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I'M NOT GOING TO SUPPORT THIS. IT TALKS ABOUT EXTENDED FAMILY. VERY DIFFICULT UNLESS THEY GET AN ANCESTRY CERTIFIED COPIES AND SHOW YOU. TRUST BUT VERIFY. ALSO THE ACCESSORY DWELLING. YOU MAY BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND IT'S ACCESSORY DWELLING. THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT THE MOST NECESSARY ONES ARE GOING TO GET RENT ARE THE ONES GOING TO GET IT. THERE'S NOTHING HERE ABOUT AFFORDABILITY. NOTHING HERE TO HELP SOMEBODY OUT. IT'S JUST PLAIN WHOEVER GETS IT GETS IT. REALLY MAY NOT HELP ANYONE BUT WHOEVER CAN AFFORD TO RENT. >>LYNN HURTAK: I'M SUPPORTING THIS AS IS BUT I AGREE WITH OTHER COUNCIL MEMBERS THAT NOT ONLY SHOULD WE COME BACK AND LOOK AT ADDING OTHER DISTRICTS, BUT ALSO TO REALLY -- WE REALLY NEED TO START GRAPPLING WITH THE COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREA AND WHAT WE WANT TO SEE. SO I WOULD LIKE TO ADD THAT TO THE DISCUSSION OF EXPANDING WHERE WE ALLOW THESE, BUT ALSO REALLY TALKING ABOUT WHAT WE WANT AS A COMMUNITY IN OUR COASTAL HIGH HAZARD AREAS. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ANYTHING ELSE? SOUTH TAMPA HAS ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS ALREADY. IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN, AT THE CORNER OF PALMIRA AND HIMES, WHICH IS GOING EVEN FURTHER SOUTH, THERE WAS A NEW CONSTRUCTION THAT HAD -- [AUDIO CUTS OUT] MANISCALCO, SECONDED BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. >>THE CLERK: [INAUDIBLE] >>JOSEPH CITRO: THERE IS A CERTAIN NUMBER INVOLVED. >>STEPHEN BENSON: CAN WE GET THE PRESENTATION BACK UP, PLEASE? 27- 132. IT'S THE CODE SECTION. >>JOSEPH CITRO: I THINK YOU HAVE TO ADVANCE THE SLIDE ONE MORE. 27-132. >>STEPHEN BENSON: 27-156. THE CODE SECTION IS NOT IN THE SLIDE. >>JOSEPH CITRO: REPEAT THAT ONE MORE TIME. >>STEPHEN BENSON: 27-156. >>JOSEPH CITRO: 27-156. ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE. ANY OPPOSED? >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: AYE. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ROLL CALL VOTE, PLEASE. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: YES. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: NO. >>LYNN HURTAK: YES. >> CARLSON? GUDES? >>ORLANDO GUDES: YES. >>LUIS VIERA: YES. >>JOSEPH CITRO: YES. >>THE CLERK: THE MOTION CARRIED WITH MIRANDA NO AND CARLSON ABSENT. >>JOSEPH CITRO: MR. BENSON. >>STEPHEN BENSON: WE HAVE ONE MORE ADU-RELATED CHANGE. IF THE PRESENTATION COULD COME BACK UP, PLEASE. THIS RELATES TO OFF-STREET PARKING REQUEST. NOW ADUs REQUIRE ONE PARKING SPACE ON THE SITE. EXTENDED FAMILY RESIDENCES, WHICH ARE 600 SQUARE FEET AND BELOW DO NOT. THEY ARE ESSENTIALLY THE SAME TYPE OF USE. WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING TO DO HERE, AGAIN, WITHIN THE AREAS THAT WE'RE EXPANDING ADUs INTO. BY SAYING IF THE 600 SQUARE FEET OR BELOW IS ADU, PARKING IS WAIVED. AND THIS WOULD APPLY TO THE SAME SECTION JUST APPROVED ALL OF THOSE ALLOWABLE AREAS. 600 FEET OR BELOW, NO PARKING REQUIRED. GREATER THAN 600 SQUARE FEET, PARKING WOULD BE REQUIRED AND IT WOULD BE ONE SPACE PER UNIT. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: THANK YOU VERY MUCH. WHEN YOU SAY ONE SPACE PER UNIT, IF THEY DECIDE TO JUST PARK VEHICLES ON THEIR FRONT YARD AS THEY DO ON TAMPA BAY BOULEVARD -- NOT THROWING ANYBODY UNDER THE BUS -- [AUDIO CUTS OUT] -- >>STEPHEN BENSON: MEET THE CODE AND TECHNICAL REQUIREMENTS FOR PARKING TO PARK ON THEIR SITE. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS? COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. >>LYNN HURTAK: I'M JUST GOING TO GO ON RECORD SAYING I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD REQUIRE PARKING, BUT I KNOW I'M IN THE MINORITY. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: MOVE TO APPROVE. >>JOSEPH CITRO: IS THERE ANYONE IN CHAMBERS THAT WISHES TO SPEAK TO THIS? >> NATHAN HAGEN. I WANT TO EMPHASIZE, I THINK WE'VE ALL HEARD OVER AND OVER AGAIN, REDUCED OUR PARKING MINIMUMS DOWNTOWN. ORLANDO ELIMINATED THEM. BY THE WAY, SOMEONE CAN MAKE A MOTION ABOUT ELIMINATING THEM DOWNTOWN ANY TIME SOON. BUT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ADUs HERE. THE PEOPLE WHO -- ONE OF THE GREAT THINGS ABOUT ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS ARE THAT TODAY, AND I SAY THIS ALL THE TIME, IF YOU CAN'T AFFORD A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME, YOU'RE PROBABLY IN CRISIS. NOTHING SMALLER THAN A SINGLE-FAMILY HOME OR HIGH-END LUXURY APARTMENT DOWNTOWN THAT IS AN OPTION FOR ANYBODY. WE DON'T HAVE A LOT OF HOUSING STOCK THAT IS GOOD TRANSITIONAL HOUSING. ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS FILL THAT NEARBY. I KNOW THERE'S -- FILL THAT NICHE. I KNOW THERE IS A FEAR THAT EVERY SINGLE ONE WILL BE AN AirBnB AND SOME CHARGED ABOVE MARKET RATES, BUT SOME WILL. MANY WILL BE SOLD AT REASONABLE PRICE PER SQUARE FEET, ON 600-SQUARE-FOOT UNIT IS ACTUALLY RELATIVELY AFFORDABLE. I WANT TO EMPHASIZE PARKING COSTS MONEY. [AUDIO DROPS] -- ACROSS THE CITY AND WE'RE SAYING THAT YOU HAVE TO NOW PAY ALL THIS EXTRA MONEY OR HAVE THIS EXTRA LAND FOR PARKING, YOU'RE PREVENTING THESE HOMES FROM BEING BUILT. YOU'RE ACTUALLY SAYING WE WANT ADUs BUT DON'T WANT THE ADUs FOR PEOPLE WHO CAN'T AFFORD PARKING. I HAVE A FEELING WHERE THIS IS GOING. I WANT TO BE CLEAR, THERE IS A POLICY REALITY FOR REQUIRING PARKING, THAT THERE BE FEWER OPTIONS, FEWER ADUs CREATED AND THOSE ADUs NOT CREATED WILL BE THE ONES THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN THE MOST AFFORDABLE BECAUSE THERE IS A PRICE GAP BETWEEN HOUSING THAT HAS PARKING AND DOESN'T HAVE PARKING. IT IS A REAL MARKET PHENOMENA. AND PEOPLE WHO DON'T HAVE CARS BECAUSE THEY CAN'T AFFORD THEM SHOULD NOT BE PAYING FOR PARKING. THANK YOU. >> JUSTIN MOLETTES AGAIN, AGREEING WITH NATHAN THAT WE SHOULDN'T BE PROVIDING PARKING. TRYING TO MAKE AFFORDABLE UNITS NEAR TRANSIT. THERE'S NO REASON TO INCLUDE IT. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ANYONE ONLINE? MS. POYNOR, ARE YOU ONLINE? >> CAN YOU HEAR ME? >>JOSEPH CITRO: YES, MS. POYNOR. >> OKAY. GOOD AFTERNOON, AGAIN. HOPEFULLY THIS IS THE LAST TIME. WHEN WE TALK ABOUT PARKING, ARE WE TALKING ABOUT, LIKE, REAL CEMENT OR ASPHALT? BECAUSE IN MUCH OF OUR CITY, IT'S OKAY TO PARK ON YOUR GRASS. IF THEY ARE DOING THAT, I'M NOT AGAINST IT. PERMEABLE PARKING SHOULD CERTAINLY BE CONSIDERED FOR ALL OF THIS, IF THAT'S GOING TO EVEN BE A THOUGHT PROCESS. I WOULD LIKE TO NOTE THAT THIS IS WHAT FOUR ITEMS THAT YOU GUYS HAVE DISCUSSED THIS AFTERNOON SINCE LUNCH, AND IT'S TAKEN YOU THREE HOURS TO DISCUSS THOSE FOUR ITEMS. AND EVERYBODY WHO IS PARTICIPATING IN THIS AT LEAST HAS A INCLUDE WHAT'S GOING ON. WE WERE EXPECTED IN OUR PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING TO ADDRESS 12 ITEMS. I THINK IT WAS ABOUT TWO AND A HALF HOURS LONG. I STAYED FOR THE WHOLE THING BUT DON'T REMEMBER FOR SURE. JUST IMAGINE DOING THAT WITH 58 PEOPLE OR MORE AND THEN, OF COURSE, SOME OF THEM HAVE NO CLUE WHAT THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT. THE GUY WHO GETS ON AND TRIES TO SELL HIS 3D HOUSING AND ALL THIS OTHER STUFF. JUST REMEMBER HOW MUCH WE POSSIBLY GOT DONE DURING THAT TIME. 12 ITEMS IN ANY PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING IS TOO MANY. YOU ALL HAVE A GREAT DAY. THANK YOU. >>JOSEPH CITRO: MS. BENNETT, ARE YOU THERE. >> HI. THIS IS CARROLL ANN BENNETT. I'M IN FAVOR OF THIS. I URGE YOU TO GO AHEAD AND VOTE FOR IT. WHEN I MADE COMMENTS ABOUT THE PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING IN NO WAY WHATSOEVER WAS MY INTENTION TO DENIGRATE STAFF OR ANYTHING THEY DID. IT'S JUST AS STEPHANIE JUST SAID, IT'S A VERY COMPLEX ISSUE, AND EVERYBODY IS HAVING A LITTLE TROUBLE UNDERSTANDING ALL OF THE DETAILS. AND IF I HAVE NOT MADE ENOUGH EFFORT TO UNDERSTAND THEM, I APOLOGIZE. BUT I WOULD LIKE PERHAPS TO HAVE ONE MORE PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING BETWEEN NOW AND FIRST READING THAT WOULD JUST COVER THE ADUs. I CAN MAKE AN EFFORT TO EDUCATE JUST MYSELF BUT IT'S HARD FOR OTHER PEOPLE, TOO, AND THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE ON THAT MEETING. I THINK THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE IN FAVOR OF IT. THEY JUST WANT TO KNOW THE DETAILS. THAT'S THE CATEGORY THAT I'M IN. AND I ALSO THINK THAT SOME PEOPLE ARE IN FAVOR OF IT AND THEY JUST WANT ONE OR TWO LITTLE THINGS TWEAKED THAT THEY HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT. SO I WOULD ENCOURAGE THAT WE HAVE ONE MORE PUBLIC INFORMATION MEETING BETWEEN NOW AND FIRST READING. THANK YOU. >>JOSEPH CITRO: THANK YOU. WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO. SECONDED BY -- WHO SECONDED THAT? COUNCILMAN HURTAK IS SAYING NO. SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN VIERA. ANY FINAL DISCUSSION? >>LYNN HURTAK: I'M JUST GOING TO VOTE NO BECAUSE I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD HAVE ONE SPACE PER UNIT. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ANY FURTHER DISCUSSIONS? TO AVOID IT, LET'S HAVE A ROLL CALL VOTE, PLEASE. NOT THE ROLL CALL VOTE, THE VOICE VOTE. >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: YES. >>LYNN HURTAK: NO. >> CARLSON? GUDES? >>ORLANDO GUDES: YES. >>LUIS VIERA: YES. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: YES. >>JOSEPH CITRO: YES. >>THE CLERK: THE MOTION CARRIED WITH HURTAK VOTING NO AND% CARLSON ABSENT. >>JOSEPH CITRO: THANK YOU. MS. FEELEY, YOU'RE RUNNING UP HERE. >>ABBYE FEELEY: I JUST WANT TO FINISH REAL QUICK. I APPRECIATE YOUR INDULGENCE. THIS IS A HUGE STEP FORWARD FOR US IN PLANNING FOR OUR CITY AND FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO PROVIDE ALTERNATIVE HOUSING SOLUTIONS AT A TIME WHEN WE ARE PRESSED AT THE SEAMS TO BE FINDING THOSE OPPORTUNITIES. I DID JUST WANT TO GO OVER THE SCHEDULE THAT WE WILL GO TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION MONDAY BASED ON YOUR VOTES TODAY ON THOSE ITEMS THAT YOU SELECTED TO MOVE FORWARD. WE WILL BE BACK IN FRONT OF YOU THE EVENING OF DECEMBER 1st TO HAVE FIRST READING, INCLUDING ANY CHANGES THAT YOU PRESCRIBE TODAY, THE REMOVAL OF CERTAIN ITEMS ON THOSE ITEMS THAT DID NOT GET FAVORABLE, WE WILL PULL THOSE FROM DISCUSSION AT THE PLANNING COMMISSION FOR MONDAY AS WELL. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN GUDES. >>ORLANDO GUDES: MS. FEELEY, THANK YOU FOR THE PRESENTATION TODAY. I KNOW IT WAS A LOT OF WORK. I'M NOT GREAT ON THE ADU SYSTEM RIGHT NOW. IT HAS TO GROW ON ME BECAUSE I DON'T SEE THE ATTAINABILITY OF THEM FOR A LOT OF FOLKS. I SEE THIS AS A WAY OF CAPITALISM BECAUSE I DID ASK MS. HURTAK WHAT THESE THINGS COST FOR SOMEBODY TO RENT. I'M HOPING WITH US GOING FORWARD, WE WOULD WORK WITH OUR HOUSING DEPARTMENT AND OUR CRA PEOPLE TO TALK ABOUT HOW WE CAN HAVE SOME PROGRAMS IF WE DO THIS SO PEOPLE CAN BE ATTAINABLE IN SOME OF THESE ADUs. THAT'S WHAT I'M LOOKING FORWARD TO, SEE HOW WE CAN TIE THOSE IN TO GET FOLKS IN AND NOT CHARGING A LITTLE 500-SQUARE-FOOT PLACE, 15, 16 HUNDRED BUCKS. SO MAKE SURE WE KIND OF LOOK AT THAT AS WE'RE MOVING FORWARD WITH SOME POLICIES AND THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT WOULD BE MOST OUTSTANDING. THANK YOU. >>ABBYE FEELEY: THE OTHER THING I DID WANT TO MENTION WAS, DEPENDING ON HOW THIS GOES AND WHEN WE GET TO SECOND READING, I'VE TALKED WITH THE TEAM, AND WE WOULD LIKE TO PROBABLY HAVE AN EFFECTIVE DATE ON THIS, UNLIKE YOUR TYPICAL ORDINANCES THAT GO INTO EFFECT AS THEY ARE SIGNED, WE WOULD HAVE AN EFFECTIVE DATE OF THIS LIKE APRIL 1st, OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, TO GIVE THE CODE A CHANCE TO CHANGE AND TO GET THIS LINED UP IN A POSITION THAT IT WOULD THEN GO INTO EFFECT. UNLIKE WITH WEST TAMPA OVERLAY, CHANGE THAT DAY, WENT INTO EFFECT, AND THEN THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT, ET CETERA. SO TO MAKE SURE THAT ALL THE WHEELS ARE HEADED IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION, WE'VE GOT THIS GOING, WE WOULD DO WITH THAT IN THE ORDINANCE AS WELL. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. >>LYNN HURTAK: MAYBE I'M WRONG, BUT I THOUGHT SOME OF THESE WERE SLATED TO COME BACK NOVEMBER 17th. >>ABBYE FEELEY: THERE IS ONE ITEM IN OUR PRESENTATION WE ASKED TO COME BACK NOVEMBER 17. IT WAS THE LAST SLIDE. IT WAS THE CHANGE FOR THE WEST TAMPA ALLEYS. WE DID NOT TALK ABOUT THAT TODAY, AND GIVEN THE TIME, I DON'T WANT TO TALK ABOUT IT NOW. IF WE COULD SET THAT FOR NOVEMBER 17, WE WOULD BRING THAT BACK UNDER STAFF REPORTS AND STEPHEN WOULD PRESENT THAT TO YOU. AND IT IS A VERY SMALL CHANGE BACK DEALING WITH THE ALLEYS. >>LYNN HURTAK: OKAY. THANK YOU. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: REAL QUICK. I JUST WANTED TO SAY THANK YOU TO YOU AND MR. BENSON AND MR. COTTON FOR ALL YOUR HARD WORK. I THINK I KNOW HOW HARD YOU WORK, BUT I REALLY HAVE NO IDEA BECAUSE THIS IS A HUGE TASK AND YOU ALWAYS GO ABOVE AND BEYOND. SO I WANT YOU TO KNOW THAT WE APPRECIATE YOU. THIS IS A VERY LENGTHY DISCUSSION, BUT NECESSARY, AND MEANINGFUL. SO THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >>ABBYE FEELEY: THANK YOU. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCIL, WE HAVE TWO MORE AGENDA ITEMS TO GET TO BEFORE OUR 5:01 MEETING. I ASK THAT WE EITHER BE CAUTIOUS OF TIME OR WE TAKE A BREAK AND GO HAVE SOMETHING TO EAT AND COME BACK. THAT'S WHAT I'M ASKING YOU, THE COUNCIL, IF WE CAN BE BRIEF OR DO WE BREAK FOR SUPPER BEFORE 5:01? THAT'S WHAT I'M ASKING COUNCIL. COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: I SEE JONATHAN MOORE IN THE AUDIENCE, AND HE'S NODDING YES THAT WE CAN BE BRIEF. I TRUST HIS NOD. I'M SURE WE'LL BE GOOD. I DON'T HAVE MUCH TO ADD. >>JOSEPH CITRO: MR. MOORE, WE'RE HOLDING IT ON YOU AND YOU HAVE TO TAKE US TO DINNER. AGENDA ITEM 16, FILE NUMBER CM22-76987. >> GOOD AFTERNOON, CITY COUNCIL. JEAN DUNCAN, INFRASTRUCTURE MOBILITY. I BELIEVE THOSE WERE MOTIONS 16 THANK YOU. WE WILL BE VERY BRIEF. WE APPRECIATE YOUR TIME TODAY. WE WANT TO ADDRESS THE TWO MOTIONS THAT WERE MADE. THE FIRST MOTION HAS TO DO WITH ANSWERING SOME QUESTIONS THAT THE PUBLIC PROVIDED. AND WE E-MAILED THOSE RESPONSES A COUPLE OF DAYS AGO. I DO HAVE PAPER COPIES IF THAT WASN'T SOMETHING THAT YOU WERE ABLE TO SEE IN YOUR E-MAIL BOX. THE OTHER ITEM WAS TO GIVE YOU AN UPDATE ON THE HANNA AVENUE PROJECT AS WELL AS THE APPRENTICESHIP ORDINANCE. JUST VERY QUICKLY, AGAIN, WE WANT TO TRY TO START TO GET FAMILIARITY WITH OUR PROCESS. WE'RE GOING TO BE FOLLOWING OUR GRADE A PROCESS THAT CHIEF OF STAFF MENTIONED THAT WILL BE EMBEDDED IN EVERYTHING THAT WE'RE DOING. WE HAVE OUR TEAM HERE, IF YOU HAVE ANY SPECIFIC QUESTIONS. WE'VE GOT DPR, PROJECT SUPPORT SERVICES, AERIAL GROUP AND ENVISION MIJON THE OWNER OVERLOOKING THE EBO AND APPRENTICESHIP COMPONENTS OF OUR PROJECT. WE DID HAVE TWO VIDEOS TO SHOW, BUT IN THE INTEREST OF TIME, I CAN SEND YOU THOSE LINKS IF YOU WOULD LIKE. THEY ARE VERY GOOD STORIES ABOUT SUCCESSFUL EXPERIENCES THAT SOME OF OUR PARTNERS HAVE HAD ON THE PROJECT. SO I'LL DEFER TO THE NEXT PART OF THE CONSTRUCTION UPDATE. VERY QUICKLY -- I'M SORRY. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. >>LYNN HURTAK: ARE THOSE AVAILABLE TO THE PUBLIC ON YOUR WEBSITE? >>JEAN DUNCAN: I DON'T KNOW IF THAT IS DONE BUT WE CAN CERTAINLY DO THAT. >>LYNN HURTAK: I THINK THE PUBLIC WOULD LIKE THAT. >>JEAN DUNCAN: I THINK THE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR POINTED IT OUT OR PUT IT ON SOCIAL MEDIA. I CAN CONFIRM AND ALSO PUT THEM ON THE WEBSITE. >>LYNN HURTAK: THAT WOULD BE GREAT. THEN THE PUBLIC CAN FIND THEM. THANK YOU. >>JEAN DUNCAN: YES. VERY QUICKLY ON THE CONSTRUCTION PART OF THE MOTION, WE BROKE GROUND IN JANUARY OF THIS YEAR ON THE HANNA AVENUE MUNICIPAL BUILDING. WE'VE GOT FOUR STRUCTURES TO BUILD, THE MAIN BUILDING, THE PARKING GARAGE, THE FLEET BUILDING, AND THE FACILITIES BUILDING. THIS IS ALL PART OF OUR DECENTRALIZATION OF OUR FLEET AND FACILITIES, WHICH EVERYONE IS EXCITED ABOUT, THOSE DEPARTMENTS THAT DEPEND ON THOSE SERVICES. OTHER WORK HAS TO DO WITH THE SITE. THE SITE SOLAR REMEDIATION, UNDERGROUND PIPING, STORMWATER CONSTRUCTION AND UTILITIES. CURRENTLY THE PROJECT IS WHAT WE CALL 30% COMPLETE WITH THE ENVELOPE OF THE MAIN BUILDING AND PARKING GARAGE COMPLETELY UP. NOT SURE IF YOU HAD A CHANCE TO DRIVE BY, YOU'LL SEE VERTICAL STRUCTURES THERE P THIS WEEK, WE HAVE A ROOFING CONTRACTOR WHO IS MOBILIZED AND GETTING THAT STARTED. ELECTRICAL ON THE PARKING GARAGE IS STARTING. WE HAVE DECK POURS IN THE MAIN BUILDING UNDERWAY. THOSE WILL TAKE ABOUT SIX WEEKS. AND THE MAIN BUILDING, WE EXPECT TO BEGIN THE CURTAIN WALL INSTALLATION OF THAT IN A COUPLE OF WEEKS. OUR FINAL CONSTRUCTION IS ANTICIPATED FOR FALL OF NEXT YEAR. WE STILL HAVE A LOT OF TIME TO WORK ON THE APPRENTICESHIP AND THE EBO AND OTHER ENGAGEMENTS WITH FOLKS IN THE COMMUNITY AND WITH TRADES TO POSSIBLY PARTICIPATE IN THIS PROJECT. AGAIN, THE FIRST MOTION ABOUT THE QUESTIONS, WE DID PROVIDE ANSWERS ON THOSE. AGAIN, I CAN PROVIDE THOSE ON PAPER FORM, IF YOU'D LIKE. THE OTHER PART OF THE MOTION ABOUT THE APPRENTICESHIP ORDINANCE, I KNOW DPR HAS BEEN EXCITED TO PARTNER WITH FOUR APPRENTICESHIP PROGRAMS. THEY ARE CURRENTLY WORKING WITH APG, AND THAT FIRM IS DOING ELECTRICAL, FIRE ALARM AND DATA COMMUNICATIONS WORK. WE HAVE ACKERMAN PLUMBING, GMF STEEL AND DPR CONCRETE. AND CURRENTLY ALL FOUR COMPANIES ARE TRACKING TO MEET THE 12% REQUIREMENT PER OUR ORDINANCE. JUST A REMINDER THIS ORDINANCE CAME ALONG AFTER THIS CONTRACT WAS ISSUED. SO WE APPRECIATE THE COOPERATION OF DPR TO MAKE GOOD ON THAT REQUIREMENT, EVEN THOUGH IT WAS POST-CONTRACT LETTING. AND WE ALSO APPRECIATE ENVISION MIJON FOR COMING ALONG AND ADDING TO THE EYES OF THOMAS HUGGINS WHO IS OUR EBO OVERSEER FOR DPR, THEY ARE ADDING AN EXTRA SET OF EYES ON THESE THINGS TO MAKE SURE EVERYTHING IS DONE PER REQUIREMENT, PER GOAL, PER ORDINANCE. SO I DO HAVE OUR FOLKS HERE TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS. A COUPLE OF WONDERFUL STORIES, OT DeLANCEY FROM STRATEGY PROJECT SUPPORT SERVICES. IF YOU COULD WAVE YOUR HAND SO THEY COULD SEE WHO YOU ARE. THOMAS HUGGINS WITH THE AERIAL GROUP IS HERE. MANY OF YOU KNOW HIM. I WAS GOING TO OFFER FOR THEM TO SPEAK IF WE HAD MORE TIME. BUT IN THE INTEREST OF TIME, I'LL STOP THERE AND LET ANY QUESTIONS COME ALONG THAT WE CAN TRY TO ANSWER FOR YOU. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN GUDES. >>ORLANDO GUDES: THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN. WHAT I DIDN'T SEE, I THOUGHT IT WAS THE -- THE 11 QUESTIONS THAT I SUBMITTED FOR YOUR REVIEW FOR YOUR STAFF, JEAN, AND SOME OF THESE QUESTIONS I ALREADY HAD BUT SOME QUESTIONS I GOT FROM OTHER FOLKS. NOT JAMES RANSOM, JUST SO YOU KNOW. >>JEAN DUNCAN: YES, YES. >>ORLANDO GUDES: WHAT I DIDN'T SEE -- WHAT I WAS LOOKING FOR -- I DIDN'T SEE THE BREAKDOWN. I WANTED TO SEE THE BREAKDOWN, WHEN I SAY MINORITY, AFRICAN AMERICAN FEMALE HISPANIC I DIDN'T SEE THAT BREAKDOWN. I'M LOOKING FOR THAT BREAKDOWN. >>JEAN DUNCAN: OKAY. >>ORLANDO GUDES: THEN I'LL LOOKING FOR THE BREAKDOWN, IF I HAVE A MINORITY, I WANT TO KNOW THE BREAKDOWN THERE. KNOW THE MINORITY BUT WHO THEY ARE HIRING AS WELL. I THINK WE NEED TO HAVE AT LEAST A COUPLE OF MONTHS A BRIEFING ON WHAT WE'RE DOING SO PEOPLE -- I DON'T HAVE TO HEAR WHEN I DRIVE BY, BECAUSE MY MOTHER LIVES TWO BLOCKS AWAY FROM THE PROJECT, I DON'T HAVE TO HEAR PEOPLE SAY, WELL, I DON'T SEE ANYBODY WORKING THAT LOOK LIKE US. I DON'T WANT TO HEAR THAT. I WANT TO BE ABLE TO SEE WHAT THOSE BREAKDOWNS ARE, SO I CAN SAY THESE ARE THE NUMBERS THEY ARE SHOWING ME SO I CAN TRUST AND VERIFY WHAT PEOPLE ARE TELLING ME OR WHAT I'M SEEING. DO HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS AS IT RELATES TO WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THE MINORITY PARTNERS. PROJECTED CONTRACT -- CONTRACTED. HOW DOES THAT WORK. MAKING SURE THAT -- WHAT WOULD PREVENT A MINORITY PARTNER FROM GOING FROM A PROJECTED CONTRACT TO AN ACTUAL CONTRACTED PERSON? >>JEAN DUNCAN: I THINK I MIGHT ASK BRIAN YARBOROUGH TO ANSWER THAT SO I CAN MAKE SURE I GET YOU THE SPECIFIC ANSWER. I HAVE A CONTRACT ADMINISTRATION VERSION OF THAT ANSWER, BUT I'LL LET HIM SPEAK DIRECTLY ABOUT THE PROJECT ON THAT. >> BRIAN YARBOROUGH, DPR CONSTRUCTION. COUNCILMAN GUDES, IN RESPONSE TO YOUR QUESTION, WE HAD OUR ORIGINAL ESTIMATE THAT FORMED THAT GMP AGREEMENT. SO WHEN WE TALK ABOUT PROJECTED VALUES FOR STRATEGIST OR DUCON, IT'S BASED ON THAT ESTIMATE. THE TEAMS GO OUT TO MARKET, SOLICITED PROPOSALS AND PRICING BACK FROM TRADE PARTNERS AND THEY GET A CONTRACT, THERE'S SOME VARIANCE IN THAT FROM THAT ORIGINAL ESTIMATE. THAT'S WHERE THAT IS PROJECTED, A, FINALIZING PROCUREMENT AND EXECUTION AT CONTRACT, WE'RE GETTING CLOSER TO EXACTING THAT NUMBER. >>ORLANDO GUDES: SINCE YOU ARE THE MAIN GUY, I THINK I DID -- I KNOW YOU HAVE THE CDC THAT CONTRACTED WITH YOU, IS THAT CORRECT? >> YES, SIR. >>ORLANDO GUDES: THE PARTNERSHIP OUTLINED IN THE MOUU ANY SERVICE OPPORTUNITY FOR THE CITY OF TAMPA, WITH CONTRACT OR COMPENSATION FOR THOSE SERVICES? >> COMPENSATION TO THE CDC? >>ORLANDO GUDES: FOR THOSE SERVICES. DO THEY HAVE A MAIN CONTRACT? I WANT TO MAKE SURE WE'RE CLEAR, THEIR ROLE WITH THE ORGANIZATION. ARE THEY CONTRACTING WITH YOU NOW, CDC DOING ANY WORK, ANY TYPE OF MINORITY PARTNERSHIP? >> JUST EARLIER THIS WEEK, OUR PARTNERS, DUCON CONSTRUCTION HELD A WORKFORCE AT CDC -- >>ORLANDO GUDES: I WAS THERE. THE FIRST QUESTION THAT NUMBER BREAKDOWN, I WANT IN THE FUTURE. IF YOU'RE HIRING FOLKS TO SEE WHAT NUMBER OF PEOPLE ARE ACTUALLY BEING HIRED FROM EAST TAMPA. I THINK THAT'S CRITICAL TO THE PROJECTS THERE. SO WHAT'S YOUR BREAKDOWN OF HERE TO YOUR MIDDLE SUBCONTRACTOR -- YOUR SUBS DOWN HERE, I WANT TO KNOW HOW MANY ARE COMING FROM EAST TAMPA. I THINK THAT'S GOOD THAT WE KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE APPLYING. HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE GETTING HIRED. I THINK THAT'S CRITICAL TO THE PROJECT OVER THERE. I DON'T WANT TO HEAR DIDN'T HIRE ANYBODY. PEOPLE LIVE WEST TAMPA, TO ME, MINORITY GET HIRED BUT I THINK FOR THE PEOPLE IN THOSE COMMUNITIES OVER THERE, THEY WANT TO KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE OFFERED A JOB AND GOT ON THE JOB SITE. HOPING PROVIDE THOSE THREE THINGS IN THE FUTURE. WELL, WE HIRED PEOPLE FROM EAST TAMPA. WE HAVE NAMES OF PEOPLE WHO ACTUALLY WORKED -- MR. MASSEY, ARE YOU COMING UP? >>MORRIS MASSEY: WE COULD ASK FOR THAT INFORMATION. I WANT TO MAKE IT CLEAR THEY HAVE NO LEGAL OBLIGATION TO HIRE A CERTAIN NUMBER OF RESIDENTS FROM A SPECIFIC GEOGRAPHIC AREA IN THE CITY OF TAMPA. THEY HAVE COMMITTED TO CERTAIN GOALS IN THE CONTRACT FOR ACHIEVING BOTH MINORITY BUSINESS AND SMALL LOCAL BUSINESS ENTERPRISES. AND THOSE ARE THE THINGS THAT WE'VE HIRED, ENVISIONED TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY DO MEET THOSE GOALS AND THEY ALSO MEET THE APPRENTICESHIP REQUIREMENTS IN OUR CODE. SO JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE YOU UNDERSTAND. YOU CAN CERTAINLY ASK FOR MORE INFORMATION BUT LEGALLY WHAT THEY ARE REQUIRED TO DO IN ORDER TO MEET THE CONTRACT TERMS. >>ORLANDO GUDES: CLOSED MOUTH AIN'T EVER GET PEDESTRIAN. I'M OPENING MY MOUTH TO GET FED. I DON'T THINK THAT'S TOO HARD TO ASK. IF I HIRE SOMEBODY, DO YOU LIVE IN THE AREA? I DON'T THINK THAT IS A BIG DEAL. OR I DO HIRE, HAVE THE CONTRACTOR THERE TO KNOW HOW MANY MINORITY BUSINESSES WE HAVE AND A BREAKDOWN OF THAT SUB WHO YOU HIRED, HOW MANY MINORITIES YOU DID HIRE AS WELL. I DON'T THINK THAT SHOULD BE A BIG, BIG ISSUE CONTRACTUALLY TO ASK -- >>MORRIS MASSEY: WELL, THE OTHER THING THAT JEAN DUNCAN REMINDED ME, WE DO NEED TO BE CAREFUL. THERE'S SOME PRIVACY ON WHAT THEY CAN REQUIRE FROM THE FOLKS THAT THEY HIRE AND WHAT THEY HAVE TO REPORT OUT. I JUST WANT TO WARN YOU, THERE MAY BE -- >>ORLANDO GUDES: I GET YA. I NEED TO KNOW WE HIRED SOMEBODY FROM EAST TAMPA. HIRED ONE, FIVE. ONLY FIVE PEOPLE APPLY. ONLY FIVE HIRED. I DON'T HAVE TO KNOW THE NAME, TELEPHONE, ADDRESS, BUT DID WE DO OR WAS THERE AN EFFORT TO DO. YOU FOLLOW ME? YOU KNOW I'LL GET A SPANKIN' IF I DON'T ASK THE QUESTIONS. OTHER THAN THAT, I THOUGHT THE REPORT WAS GOOD. YOU DID ANSWER MY QUESTIONS. I'M HOPING WE GET REGULAR UPDATES ON THE PROJECT, NOT WAY DOWN THE LINE, EVERY COUPLE OF MONTHS, GIVE ME SOMETHING SO I CAN TELL PEOPLE WE ARE DOING AS THESE THINGS GOING UP, BEING ERECTED THAT WAY I DON'T HAVE PEOPLE IN MY EAR SAYING I DON'T SEE NOBODY OVER THERE WORKING. >>JEAN DUNCAN: WE WILL BE COMING BACK IN JANUARY PER OUR CHIEF OF STAFF'S OFFERING TO COME ON IS A SEMI ANNUAL BASIS. WE'RE KIND OF GETTING THAT STARTED. IT'S NOT EXACTLY A SIX-MONTH SEPARATION, BUT WE WILL BE BACK IN JANUARY AND WE CAN CERTAINLY GIVE YOU SOME OF THE INFORMATION BEFORE THEN, BUT WE'LL HAVE MORE OF A COMPREHENSIVE PROJECT UPDATE IN JANUARY AS WELL. >>ORLANDO GUDES: THAT WOULD BE FINE. THANK YOU. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN VIERA. >>LUIS VIERA: THANK YOU. I'LL BE VERY, VERY BRIEF. I KNOW WE'RE PRESSED. NUMBER ONE, I KNOW THIS IS OBVIOUS. THESE ARE STATE-CERTIFIED APPRENTICESHIPS RIGHT? >> YES, SIR. >>LUIS VIERA: I DIDN'T KNOW, MS. DUNCAN, I DIDN'T KNOW THIS, THE APPRENTICESHIP ORDINANCE WENT INTO EFFECT -- IN OTHER WORDS, THE DPR COULD HAVE HAD AN ARGUMENT THAT THE APPRENTICESHIP ORDINANCE DIDN'T APPLY TO THIS PARTICULAR CONTRACT, BUT THEY VOLUNTARILY DID IT. IS THAT WHAT YOU WERE SAYING? >>JEAN DUNCAN: THAT'S MY INTERPRETATION. BRIAN, YOU CAN SAY, BUT VERY COOPERATIVE IN MY OPINION. >> YES, I THINK WHEN THE APPRENTICESHIP ORDINANCE PASSED, I BELIEVE IT WAS MARCH OF '21, AND THE CITY PUT A LIST TOGETHER OF KIND OF CONTRACTS THAT WERE UNDERWAY, THIS ONE PREEXISTED THAT ORDINANCE. SO A FIRM THAT HAS NEARLY 4,000 CRAFT EMPLOYEES NATIONWIDE, WOMEN AND MEN PUTTING TOOL BELTS ON EVERY DAY, WORKFORCE DEVELOPMENT IS IMPORTANT TO US SO OUR CONVERSATIONS WITH THE CITY WERE THAT WE WERE COMMITTED TO THIS. AND IT'S BEEN A STEEP LEARNING CURVE, CERTAINLY, THE FIRST PROJECT BEING SUBJECT TO IT. BUT I THINK WE'RE TRENDING VERY WELL WITH SEVERAL APPRENTICES ON-SITE AND SOME FROM EAST TAMPA EVEN. WE'RE CONTINUING TO GATHER THAT DATA AND LEARN AS WE GO BUT WE FEEL LIKE WE'RE ON THE RIGHT TRACK. >>LUIS VIERA: WE ALL APPRECIATE THAT HUNDRED PERCENT. WHAT'S GREAT ABOUT THAT ORDINANCE IS IT TAKES THE CONTRACTING PROCESS AND HAS CONTRACTORS WHO MEET A CERTAIN THRESHOLD TO INVEST IN OUR YOUNG PEOPLE IN THE CREATION OF THE FUTURE OF OUR MIDDLE CLASS IN TAMPA. SO THAT'S GREAT. BUT WE APPRECIATE THAT A HUNDRED PERCENT. BECAUSE I WAS UNAWARE OF THAT. I SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUT I WASN'T AWARE OF IT. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN. >>JOSEPH CITRO: COUNCILMAN GUDES, AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 16, YOU WERE THE MAKER OF THE MOTION. ARE YOU SATISFIED WITH THIS REPORT? >>ORLANDO GUDES: YES, I'M SATISFIED. >>JOSEPH CITRO: ALL COUNCIL MEMBERS, ARE YOU SATISFIED WITH THE REPORT? AGENDA ITEM 17, COUNCILMAN VIERA, YOU WERE THE MAKER OF THIS MOTION, ARE YOU SATISFIED WITH THIS REPORT? >>LUIS VIERA: YES, I AM HEREBY SATISFIED. >>JOSEPH CITRO: THANK YOU VERY MUCH. COUNCIL MEMBERS, YOU ARE ALL SATISFIED AS WELL? >> YES. >> YES. >>JOSEPH CITRO: THANK YOU ALL VERY MUCH. WE ARE IN RECESS UNTIL 5. >> THANK YOU, COUNCIL. >>MARTIN SHELBY: THE EAST TAMPA OVERLAY TO RETURN BACK UNDER STAFF REPORTS ON NOVEMBER 17. >>LYNN HURTAK: I'LL MAKE THAT MOTION. >>MARTIN SHELBY: THANK YOU. >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: SECOND. >>JOSEPH CITRO: WE HAVE A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILWOMAN HURTAK. SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO. ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE. ANY OPPOSED? >>GUIDO MANISCALCO: ALL RIGHT. ON SEPTEMBER 15, CITY COUNCIL RECEIVED AN E-MAIL FROM THE CHIEF OF STAFF REQUESTING US TO SCHEDULE TWO PRIVATELY INITIATED TEXT AMENDMENTS ON OCTOBER 27 CITY COUNCIL AGENDA. UNFORTUNATELY, WE INADVERTENTLY FAILED TO MAKE THAT MOTION. SO AT THIS TIME I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO SCHEDULE THE TWO PROPOSED PITAs ON THE NOVEMBER 17th, 2022, CITY COUNCIL MEETING AT 1:30 P.M. ONE APPLICANT IS EAST TAMPA COMMUNITY REDEVELOPMENT AREA AND THE SECOND APPLICANT IS TYLER HUDSON. >>JOSEPH CITRO: A MOTION MADE BY COUNCILMAN MANISCALCO. SECONDED BY COUNCILMAN MIRANDA. ALL IN FAVOR? ANY OPPOSED? WE'RE IN RECESS UNTIL 5:01. [ SOUNDING GAVEL ]