[0:05] [Music] [0:54] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Welcome everyone to the April 1st city council meeting. I call this meeting to order. I invite everyone to rise for a moment of silence and the Pledge of Allegiance. [1:23] All: I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. [1:23] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Ms. Orlofsky, roll call please. [1:23] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Michelle Volk? [1:23] Councilmember Michelle Volk: Here. [1:23] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Joshua Lee? [1:23] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Here. [1:23] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: John Bermel? [1:23] Councilmember John Bermel: Here. [1:23] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Dan Wolter? [1:23] Councilmember Dan Wolter: Here. [1:23] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: All right, thank you very much. Next we'll go into citizens' comment. This is a time for anyone that's here that has an item that they want to bring to the Council that's not related to one of our public hearings. You have up to three minutes to speak up here at the podium. Is there anyone here or online that is interested in coming to speak? Come on up, please state your name and address for the record. [2:08] Cindy Graham: I'm Cindy Graham and I live at 20480 Holyoke Avenue. Thank you. I have concern about the rising number of panhandlers in Lakeville and just within the last month—I mean, it's very common to see them on 50 and 35W and the last time I saw two men with a small child in a stroller, which I thought was pretty odd. Lakeville West on 50 and Jubilee Way there was a family; Cub, Cedar North and 179th Street there was a young woman, she was probably like the age 17 to 20 and she's standing right in the median as you would come out onto Cedar. Target 185th, that was weird—so you're coming on 185th going west and you take a right to go into Target and she was right on that median too, just a young woman again. And it's common out at Walmart also; as you enter into Walmart you'll see families sitting there and I was actually approached by one in the store asking for me to pay for their groceries and I guess this happens a lot. But I'm just noticing the bigger we're getting, the more panhandlers we're seeing and I know that a lot of them aren't poor, it's a scam type thing. So I just have concern about that, thank you. [3:40] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Thank you very much. Chief Paulson, would you mind commenting on this? I know that this is a concern that has been brought up before, but would you mind talking a little bit about our approach to this and what residents should do if they interact with or see this happening? [4:26] Police Chief Brad Paulson: Sure. So there's a few different layers to this and each situation is a little bit differently, or different. But in general, as long as the person is not impeding traffic, they are not violating law if they're on public property. So the center median, generally we would count that as impeding traffic; if there's traffic moving both directions, we would normally move someone off of that location. Private property—you know, businesses, things like that—that's a different story. Some businesses will call and ask us to have that person removed from their property; some of them allow them to operate there as well. So it depends a little bit on the situation. I always tell people just err on the side of calling and we can check the situation out, we can make contact. We also have some tools to vet whether the person needs some additional resources that we can link them up with if they're in need of housing or food or whatever it is. Or we may simply move them along if they're just looking to gain some additional funds and they're in a spot that is not safe for them and for the motoring public to be. [5:12] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Thank you. And thank you for bringing up the concern. It is something that I think most of us have noticed and want to make sure that the folks that do need help get help and that there are ways to make sure those resources get there too. Is there anyone else with public comment that's not related to an item on the agenda? Thank you very much. Mr. Miller, any additional agenda items? [5:57] City Administrator Justin Miller: Mayor and Council, item J, there's a revised agreement at your desk. Same terms, same cost, it's just a change in the form of the agreement. [5:57] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Very good. Thank you very much. Any comments or items that need to be removed? I'm sorry, I've jumped over something. First we should probably go to our presentations and introductions. We have Deb Anderson here today to talk about the National Day of Prayer and our Proclamation. [6:19] Deb Anderson: Today I have with me Diane Horton because I can't talk today. [6:19] Diane Horton: Thank you, well welcome. I'm Diane Horton. Yeah, good evening, thanks for having us. May 2nd, 2024 will be the 72nd observance of the National Day of Prayer. There's a National Day of Prayer task force that has been organizing prayer events throughout the country. According to the local records, National Day of Prayer began to meet outside Lakeville City Hall in 1991. The first known time of recognition was in July 20th, 1775 when the Continental Congress issued a proclamation recommending a day of public humiliation, fasting, and prayer to be observed. Our first president made a proclamation in 1795 when George Washington proclaimed a day of public thanksgiving and prayer. On April 17th, 1952, Congress proclaimed a joint resolution for a National Day of Prayer in which the people of the United States may turn to God in prayer and meditation at churches, in groups, and as individuals. Public Law 82-324, President Harry S. Truman proclaimed a National Day of Prayer to be observed on July 4th, 1952. Each year since that date, Americans have observed the day in their own way. President Ronald Reagan on Thursday, May 5th, 1988, signed into law Public Law 100-307, the designation of the first Thursday in May as the annual observance for the National Day of Prayer, and it has been proclaimed each year since then. People are asked to turn to God in prayer and meditation. The president is required by law to sign a proclamation each year encouraging all Americans to pray on this day. Whether in times of tragedy or celebration, our nation has always been strengthened by the faith of our people. This day stands as a critical reminder of how fortunate we are to live in a country where our constitution protects our free exercise of religion. Thank you for proclaiming May 2nd, 2024 as a National Day of Prayer in the City of Lakeville. [8:38] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Thank you very much. Now I'll ask Councilmember Bermel to read the proclamation. [8:38] Councilmember John Bermel: Proclamation for National Day of Prayer 2024. National Day of Prayer is an annual observance held on the first Thursday of May inviting people of all faiths to pray for the nation. And whereas the National Day of Prayer task force, a nonsectarian group with no political affiliation, encourages citizens to pray for our leadership in America especially in the areas of government, military, media, business, education, church, and family. Therefore, the City Council of the City of Lakeville does hereby proclaim Thursday, May 2nd, 2024, National Day of Prayer in Lakeville. By Joshua Lee, Acting Mayor. Proclaimed April 1st, 2024. [9:24] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Thank you very much. Thank you, Diane and Deb, for being here. Next we'll move to our Public Works Department quarterly report. Mr. Oehme. [9:24] Public Works Director Paul Oehme: Good evening Acting Mayor, City Council members. This is the first quarter report for Public Works. So I'd like to start off with some staff updates. So in January, the Minnesota City Engineering Association selected Zach Johnson, our City Engineer, as the City Engineer of the Year for 2024. This is a high honor for a city engineer to receive. So other staff members from Lakeville were there to witness the ceremony as well. So we're really fortunate to have Zach Johnson as our City Engineer. Other staff updates: our Street Division, Doug Aldrich our supervisor, decided after 30 years of service to the City, he is planning to retire in end of May. So we did go through our hiring process and found that Josh Lovell is our candidate to replace Doug. So Josh is moving up from a Street Maintenance 2 position to take on the supervisor role. The street staff was honored to help out with the Burnsville Memorial in February. So about 10 street employees helped out with traffic control along the route in Burnsville, and in all there were about 90 Public Works staff members from across the metro area here in cities and counties that helped out with traffic control along the route from Eden Prairie to Burnsville. Moving on to some street projects that are coming up: Dodd Boulevard, the reconstruction, the anticipated project from Cedar Avenue to Pilot Knob Road, is actually going to start this week, mainly on the east half, east of Flagstaff over to Pilot Knob Road. So the project is well underway now, the trees along the corridor have been removed as necessary and again construction is going to start here. It's going to take all summer, so it'll be nice when this project's done. We'll have an urbanized roadway section there, new storm sewer, and then trails on both sides of the road as well. Look forward to that project being completed. Moving on to Street Division: as you know, we had a very light snow event season this year. So we had about 21 call outs this year, only about 17 inches of snow recorded. So a lot lower than average even; you've got to go back about eight years to a season that's as low as it was this past winter, but saving a lot of money on overtime and salt usage and everything else. And then we're in high gear for spring activities in our Street Division. So really starting our street sweeping program for the community, going through all the streets this spring, and it's going to take several weeks to complete that operation. We are completed with our tree trimming along the boulevards for the year, and pothole patching is ongoing as well right now. Utility staff: it was busy inspecting and cleaning a few of our water towers, specifically four of them. About every four to five years we take the water towers down for internal cleaning and inspection, just making sure that maintenance is properly performed on a regular basis and looking for any defects and necessarily putting Capital Improvement projects together based on some of these inspections. Then we're also rehabbing three of our wells. We pull wells every 8 to 10 years depending on the well type just to make sure that the pump and motors are working properly so we decrease the potential for breakdowns during high peak demand season. And then Well 23, that project—the new well—is starting this week and going to be drilled off 190th Street and just east of Dodd Boulevard. So that's going to be an all-summer project taking place there. And then what's in your packet this evening is consideration for applying for a water conservation grant through the Met Council. This annually we do get grant dollars from Met Council. In the past, as you may recall, we've worked with HOAs on irrigation audits and irrigation monitoring, and this year we're going to change it up a little bit and hopefully if we get the grant dollars, we'll use that money for residential rebates for high-efficiency or smart irrigation meters, irrigation head replacements, and then also water-efficient toilet replacements as well. Then moving on to Environmental Services: 2023 was a big year for Environmental Services. We completed a lot of projects and in all, the City received over $1.3 million worth of grant funds for several projects throughout the community, namely Foxboro Pond replacement, we did a fish barrier at East Lake, some environmental stewardship projects over at Ritter Farm, and then the realignment and improvements to North Creek as well. [14:45] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Can I ask where this QR code goes to? [14:45] Paul Oehme: That goes to some of our projects that just kind of highlight some of the projects. And then since we had a mild winter, we had staff that worked in the East Lake area and Ritter Prairie area removing Buckthorn and invasive vegetation from these parks and these natural areas. In the spring, we're going to be hiring contractors to replant some of those areas for native grasses and things like that, and we saved a lot of money by doing the removals in-house. Moving on to the Forestry Division: as you know, Emerald Ash Borer is throughout the community now so we're struggling to deal with that. We removed over the winter months 105 ash trees from our boulevards, it's about 7% of our stock within the community, and those trees—we'll remove the stumps and replanting will take place this spring. We're anticipating treating ash trees again this summer, about 860 of them, which is a little down from years past in 2022 when they were last treated. So every two years we retreat the ash trees that we think are in good quality. Forestry staff is working with private property owners on EAB as well. So we've contacted over 200 property owners with EAB-infested trees and working with them to take those trees down per our shade tree ordinance, and we did send out over 500 postcards to property owners that we have identified EAB on their private ash trees as well, that they might consider taking them down or injecting them or trying to save them. And just want to let you know that we do still have the Rainbow Tree Care partnership where residents can work with them and receive some bulk discounts for treating ash trees on their property. In addition to tree removals, now we're planting trees. So this spring we're planting about 130 trees throughout the community on boulevards and in eight different parks. Arbor Day sales—our annual tree sale—that was a very successful program again this year; all their trees sold out in about three weeks and they can pick those trees up at our central maintenance facility during April 20th, our Earth Day event. And then Arbor Day tree planting event, this is our annual tree planting event for the community that's going to take place on May 1st at Independent Park. And Forestry was again awarded an AmeriCorps member for 2024 and 2025; this is an individual that'll help us out with community engagement type projects and notifications and mailers and those type of things. So we're really excited to have that member come back again. And then as I indicated before, Earth Day is our next environmental activity that's coming up. So that's on April 20th from 11:00 to 1:00 and this year Dakota Valley Recycling is going to be offering a swap your garden tool exchange; so bring your damaged or not used garden tools and they'll exchange them for some new tools. And then moving on, there is a free Landscaping and Water Cleanup or water quality event at Ritter Farm to be held on April 29th. This is to discuss if you want to put like a rain garden or natural vegetation in your property instead of mowed areas. And they are offering a grant application that would be offered over $250 for Lakeville residents to participate in this event as well. And then there is a papers shredding event on May 4th at Central Maintenance as well from 9:00 to noon. And with that, that's my quarterly report for Public Works and I stand for any questions you may have. [19:20] Councilmember Michelle Volk: Yes, just that the water efficiency grant, we're in a very early process of applying for that, but if we were to get it, what would that look like especially for our citizens? [19:20] Paul Oehme: So if the schedule holds, we potentially would receive the money in June/July timeframe. So then we'll first advertise it—we'll get on the website, social media blast, and those type of things. And so the process would be that the resident, whatever type of equipment that they want to upgrade to—either a toilet or irrigation high-efficiency meter or irrigation head—they would purchase that equipment. And on our website, there will be a list of approved equipment that they can purchase; so it'd either be at Home Depot or Amazon or some of these other places, but it has to be specifically approved by the Met Council. And then they would purchase that equipment, then hand the City the receipt, and we would reimburse them for our cost. [19:20] Councilmember Michelle Volk: Thank you. [19:20] Paul Oehme: So yeah, and again, it'll be June or July/August before the program potentially would start if we get the funds. [20:07] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Other questions? In terms of dollars, you talked about the reduction in salt and overtime. Do you have an estimate of what that looks like in terms of how much less we've spent in that area due to the lack of snow? [20:53] Paul Oehme: So, we used about a quarter of the salt we typically use over a winter season. So that's a huge cost savings for salt and I haven't crunched the numbers in overtime yet, but that's going to be looked at, you know, for next year's budget as well too and try to offset maybe some cost for next year, especially the salt because we're not going to have to purchase as much. [21:40] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Sure, because the salt is already purchased for this year obviously, so it's just a matter of not purchasing as much. [21:40] Paul Oehme: We purchase the salt from state contract and we're obligated to buy so much salt every year, but next year since we're going to have a lot more in the bin, we won't have to buy as much. [21:40] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Got it. Great, thank you very much. All right, very good, thank you. All right, on to the consent agenda which are typically routine business items for the City. Are there any items that the Council wishes to remove or discuss further? Great. Can I have a motion to approve the consent agenda? [22:28] Councilmember Michelle Volk: So moved. [22:28] Councilmember John Bermel: Second. [22:28] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Motion and a second. Any further discussion? All right, all in favor say 'aye'. [22:28] Council: Aye. [22:28] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: All opposed? It passes, thank you. We'll move on to our three action items for tonight, starting with the public hearing application for Phoenix Cove Event Center. Do we have a staff report on this? [23:16] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Yeah, I can just quickly explain. The applicant Christina Quan is not available this evening, she's out of the country. But they are applying for a beer and wine license; they currently have a consumption and display and they want to start offering different types of delightful dining experiences for participants between the hours of 9:00 and 3:00, and they want to be able to serve beer and wine with that experience. So that's the reason for their change. They have gone through their background check and all their application stuff and it is ready for approval. [23:16] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Very good, thank you very much. All right, so this is a public hearing so I will open this up to the public in case anyone has comment. Very good. Is there a motion to close the public hearing? [24:04] Councilmember Michelle Volk: I'll move to close the public hearing. [24:04] Councilmember Dan Wolter: Second. [24:04] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Motion and second. All in favor say 'aye'. [24:04] Council: Aye. [24:04] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Any opposed? Not seeing any, the public hearing is closed. Is there any other conversation or do I have a motion? [24:04] Councilmember Michelle Volk: I move to grant an on-sale wine and on-sale 3.2% malt liquor license for Phoenix Cove Event Center located at 20732 Holt Avenue. [24:04] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Thank you. There's a motion, is there a second? [24:04] Councilmember John Bermel: Second. [24:04] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Motion and second. Can we have a roll call please? [24:04] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Volk? [24:04] Councilmember Michelle Volk: Aye. [24:04] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Lee? [24:04] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Aye. [24:04] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Bermel? [24:04] Councilmember John Bermel: Aye. [24:04] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Wolter? [24:04] Councilmember Dan Wolter: Aye. [24:51] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Motion passes. Always excited to see what the Phoenix Hall Event Center has in store; they're always doing really interesting things. So good luck to Christina Quan and all that are a part of that. We'll move on to item 7B which is a public hearing regarding a contract for the 2024 Street Reconstruction. Acting Mayor again and council members. [25:27] Paul Oehme: So, this is our annual Street Improvement project that the City considers every year. Our streets are—annually we need to make sure our streets are making improvements on an annual basis just so we're not falling behind and making sure our street system is in good condition. So for this year, it's a little bit smaller project than we have seen in the past. For this year, we're looking at about 2.7 miles worth of street that are going to be considered for reconstructing and then another 2.7 miles of streets for rehabbing. And we actually, this is the first year we're trying to combine those two projects together for economies of scale as well. But we'll focus tonight on just the reconstruction areas. So there's several different neighborhoods that we would like to consider for improvements this year. Two of the streets are up in the Jaguar area: Jaguar Path, Jaguar Court off of Kenwood Avenue and 185th Street. So that's one neighborhood. Kensington Court off of Kensington Boulevard just south of 205th Street; cul-de-sac there is in need of replacement for the streets. Italy Avenue and 201st Street, 205th Street, and that's kind of a dead-end street just north of the downtown off of Holyoke. And then 172nd Street, 173rd Street in the Ipswich area. Just a little background on this project: the project was—is currently in the CIP. The public engagement process started back in about August 1st; we did have a neighborhood meeting to kind of gather information from the property owners on the project and look for things to include in the feasibility study in terms of like drainage issues or sewer/water issues, those type of things. So we completed that neighborhood meeting. We went on to have another neighborhood meeting on November 9th and then finished up their feasibility study after that and had the public hearing back in November, as you recall. During the winter months, we did put our plans and specs together and then on February 20th we did have a bid opening for this project and we did receive three bids. And then last week we did have another neighborhood meeting on March 27th. So just real quickly, kind of the scope of the project, mainly involves street improvements but there are some utilities that we'd like to improve as well. So streets, we're looking at reclaiming or milling up the asphalt, using that granular material that's created from the asphalt as the new base, replacing some of those soft areas that we know are out there that we're going to dig out and replace with some of that reclaim material. There's curb and gutter that is in need of replacing—either settled or cracked or has moved that doesn't drain very well anymore. So we want to replace that as long as we're out here. And then we're looking at urbanizing all of Italy Avenue which involves just putting curb and gutter on that street. There are some drainage issues there, it's a very flat road and we think that adding the curb and gutter will help that situation. And then also enhancing some storm sewer improvements in some of these areas as well, adding additional catch basins or drainage inlets or outlets, and then reconstructing some of the storm sewer basins as well for water and utility improvements. In a lot of these neighborhoods, we would like to replace the gate valves and some of the bolts that are out in this area. The bolts in the vintage of these areas for the pipes and the hydrants are such that the bolts are to the age where they're going to start failing on us, so we want to be proactive and replace those bolts and some of those hydrants at this time. And then also including infiltration barriers on our storm or sanitary system just so that we're not getting clear water into our sanitary system. We did, like I said, have a bid opening in February and here's what the bid results are compared to the feasibility. We are a little bit higher, but we did have to add on a lot more storm sewer improvements which were not anticipated in the feasibility when we got into the final design. Here's kind of the breakdown of the cost as compared to the feasibility study. Property taxes—that's the City share of the project, the 60% of the project cost, and those are typically bonded for. Then special assessments per our assessment policy, and then water improvements and sanitary sewer and storm sewer would be paid out of our enterprise funds for those improvements. And then Environmental Service resource funds, that helps with water quality throughout some of the project areas as well. We're adding some trail segments as well to the project areas, especially on 201st Street. Based upon our assessment policy, we did go through the assessment calculations and here are the assessments calculated based upon the assessment policy and compared to other feasibility studies. We're pretty close in most areas. And just to review the assessment policy: this is based on the Minnesota Statute 429. Again, our street reconstruction projects are typically assessed based on our assessment policy of assessing 40% of the benefiting street improvements and storm sewer improvements back to the property owners. The water main, sanitary sewer, storm sewer water quality pond improvements, those are not assessed and those are paid through the enterprise funds. And then for the assessments, again, townhomes are assessed a half of a single-family unit, and then on this project I don't think there's any commercial units that would be proposed for assessments. Just so we're—part of the assessment policy is we assess per unit, not on front footage or some other calculations that maybe some other communities would assess for. So if the driveway comes off or is off a street that is proposed for improvement, that unit would be considered to be included in the assessment roll. And then again, urbanizing a street such as Italy Avenue or adding new curb and gutter that's not already there, that's 100% benefit for the property owner, so we propose to assess 100% of those costs to the property owners. Just to review the assessment as if they were to go forward: the assessments again would be considered at this public hearing for tonight. Property owners have several ways to pay for the assessments. One is to pay the assessments in full by November 15th without any interest; there's some other options if you want to pay it off by the end of the year as well. On townhomes, since they are lower assessment, those would be assessed over a five-year period if the property owner does not want to pay the assessments in full at this time. And then for the residential units, those are assessed between a 5 and a 15-year assessment based upon the cost or the assessment amount, and then there is an assessment interest associated with that but that's basically the City's carrying cost and that's set by the Finance Department, so that's basically a pass-through cost for us. There is a senior discount, disability person, active-duty deferral as well, so that's part of the assessment policy. So if any residents would like to apply for that, just come see me and we can start working through that process. And again, it's a senior discount, they have to apply within 90 days after the public hearing, and there's some other stipulations associated with that too. So if the project were to go forward, we'd like to hold a public hearing or assessment hearing tonight, approve the contracts for the project. Applications for deferrals as I indicated before for senior or military deferrals, that would be due July 1st. Completion of the project, we're anticipating this project to be completed in October, but 1st of November for sure weather permitting. And then prepaid assessments again would be November 15th if the property owner wants to pay them off in full. And then certification of the assessments—the assessment roll that goes to the county would be delivered in December by the City. At this point, I would stand for any questions that the Council may have, but I'd request that a public or assessment hearing be opened and then consideration of the resolution for adoption of the assessment roll and then the contracts associated with the background as well. [36:03] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Thank you. I do have a question if we want to go back—I want to say it's six or seven slides. There's a slide that compares the feasibility estimate versus the bid results and the costs there. Can you talk a little bit more, and actually based on property type, I think it might be the one after that—there we go. Can you talk a little bit more about why the estimate and the bid results, the difference is different based on the type? And why there would be item C is about 13% less versus item D is 10% more? What goes into those calculations and why those costs are different? [37:05] Paul Oehme: So, these are our best estimates when we put the cost together for our feasibility study. We pretty much average out the streets—how much we think the streets are going to cost based upon the knowledge that we have going into the feasibility study. And that's pretty much what the costs we use are from last year's projects and kind of averaged out over maybe the last three years as well. The bid results that we receive—a contractor may look at each individual neighborhood a little bit different. So our assessment practice or our assessment policy is to calculate the assessments per those neighborhoods. So you know, a cul-de-sac, the contractor—if there's just one cul-de-sac there—the contractor may consider the cost to mobilize to that cul-de-sac a little bit more and bring his equipment out there, and the work environment may be a little bit more restrained, so he thinks that that area may take a little more time to complete. So the contractor kind of really dials in what he thinks those costs are going to be to complete each of those neighborhoods. That's why you're seeing the difference in the costs. [37:52] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: So just another way to say what you're saying is that these areas are paying for the project in their neighborhood and the cost for that? It's not an averaged-out cost across the board for this upcoming year's group of projects? [38:37] Paul Oehme: Right. Yeah, that's a great way of putting it. [38:37] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Very good. Great, thank you. Any other questions from the Council? [38:37] Councilmember Michelle Volk: Yes. So the 100% for what new curb and gutter is constructed—is that state law or is that our policy? [38:37] Paul Oehme: That's our policy. That's part of our assessment policy. [38:37] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: All right. If we don't have any questions, this is a public hearing, so we will open this up to the public if anyone has anything to say regarding this item. Similar to the public comment, I'll ask that you keep your comments to under three minutes and when you come up to the podium, state your name and address. [39:23] Bradley Anderson: My name is Bradley Anderson, I live on Italy Avenue. And I'm a little concerned about the cost of this. It seems like we're not really going to be getting a value for our money. I've been assessed at $5,555 and I don't see how we're going to recoup that in the value of our homes. It just doesn't seem like it's going to improve our property value at all. The street is in need of repair, but we pay taxes for that. We shouldn't have a special assessment to put on top of that. As far as the gutter system goes, that might address a little bit of the surface water, but we have other water issues that are going on. There's hydraulics involved—I don't know if anybody's done an assessment on hydraulics. You know, if they start packing a road in front of my house and doing infrastructure below grade, I'm worried that my basement is going to flood. I've got drain water coming off a field and from the other part of the yard and that's not going to improve my property at all. Also, I don't know how it's been surveyed. I've heard that the surveys are all over the place. I'm also concerned that that road is going to take a lot of my yard; that's not going to improve my property value. So I wonder how you've addressed any of these issues? Have you even looked at it? Thank you. [41:40] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Thank you. And I'm sure some of these comments can be addressed for the good of the public here, but some could be done one-on-one after the meeting too. Is there anything you can address regarding the surveying and public benefit to the property? [41:40] Paul Oehme: Yep. So I mean, we follow the state statute for making sure that the 429 process is followed and we can show benefit for the street project. Now, I mean in terms of property evaluation, that's kind of out of my control; I'm not sure how that all would play in. But in terms of the project itself, we did have our consultant survey Italy Avenue, 201st Street—every neighborhood—and make sure that we know what the grades are and elevations are. So we are not moving the street and the alignment of the street is going to stay the same on Italy Avenue. In 201st, the alignment's not going to change either and the width is not going to change. So we're putting the street back right where it is today. You know, construction, there's going to be a lot of construction equipment and materials that are sitting out there and it's going to be a little bit cumbersome for that smaller area. But in terms of the street when it's put back together again, it's going to be in the same spot it was today with the curb and gutter as proposed. In terms of geotechnical evaluations, the City did take soil samples, borings, cores out in each of the project areas too. We know what the soil types are. We designed our pavement sections based on that, and then we also are putting in some drain tile in some of the lower areas by the new catch basins that we're putting in on Italy Avenue to try to capture a little bit more of that groundwater. As the property owner indicated, the area is very flat, there is a lot of high water table out there. We acknowledge that it is a difficult area to get drainage out of, but we're trying to do our best to improve the situation. [43:16] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Another comment—he's coming up. We do have somebody online as well. [43:16] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Okay, thank you. [44:03] Sam Wilson: Good evening. My name is Sam Wilson. I live at 20666 Italy Avenue. I've lived there for 32 years as a homeowner and I rented it before I moved into it. Now I've got to be honest with you, you know, I came here tonight because I was hoping that I could be convinced that this was a good idea for me, and I'll be honest with you, I'm not convinced. I don't understand why all of a sudden we have to have the curbs down there that haven't been there for 32 years. I mean, I don't see how or why—it's an older neighborhood, most people are senior citizens. With the economy the way it is, I feel like every time I get the water from my chin to the top of my neck and shoulders, somebody comes up with a new way to take it away from me, and that's kind of how I'm feeling when I saw this assessment in the mail. So I mean, I don't know how it's going to end, but I just want to make sure I had my say to tell you I don't—I'm not convinced. Lakeville overflows every couple years, you've got ducks swimming in a driveway across the street, now we want to worry about curbs. So I'm just not convinced. I'm sorry. I hope that before I leave here I am, but I'm not holding my breath. Thank you. [44:48] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Thank you. Mr. Oehme, I assume that part of the curb is in conjunction with the gutter and the water improvements with that, right? [44:48] Paul Oehme: Correct. Yeah, I mean the curb and the gutter is integral. So it's—we're trying—it's a very flat street as the property owner is indicating, and the water table is high and we acknowledge that it's, you know, the lake level is right there. So our—again, we're trying to do our best to get the water off the street and off the properties and into the storm sewer system as best as we can with limited options, I guess. And we did have a neighborhood meeting again like I indicated back in August of this year, and you know we had talked about adding curb and gutter. It seemed at that time a lot of the property owners did seem like the curb—adding the curb and gutter and adding additional storm sewer systems out there to help improve the project was a good idea to add into this project. [45:33] Councilmember Michelle Volk: Mr. Oehme, so does curb and gutter—you know, water likes to take a path. So if you just have your property and there's no curb and gutter, then it's going to find a path on your property. Is the curb and gutter going for these property owners an attempt to keep the water off their property and not create other kinds of drainage issues? [46:19] Paul Oehme: That's the intent—is to try to get the water off the property so it doesn't pool on their lawn or on the street, and try to get it into the curb and gutter into the storm sewer system as efficiently as we can. [46:19] Councilmember Michelle Volk: So basically what you're trying to do is corral water like you would cows, right? [46:19] Paul Oehme: Yeah, you know trying to facilitate a path of least resistance as you indicated, to try to get the water to move as efficiently as we can. [46:19] Councilmember Michelle Volk: Thank you. [47:06] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Like to move on to the online comment. [47:06] Jennifer Buie: My name is Jennifer Buie. I am a homeowner on Italy Avenue as well. As far as I know, I only know of one of my neighbors in that 11-house neighborhood that was for the curb and gutter system. I also, like my other neighbors who have previously spoken, I don't see the benefit in this curb and gutter system. I honestly feel like it was just a way for the City to match the improvements at Antlers Park. It's a dead-end cul-de-sac neighborhood. I just—I guess I just don't understand who were the people that were in favor of this project? It also feels like it's a way to improve the walk for people along the trail system versus the people who live in the neighborhood. So I guess I'd like to understand how many people were in favor of this? [48:39] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Before I turn that question over, can you repeat your name and address? The sound was a little scratchy at the beginning. [48:39] Jennifer Buie: Sure. My name is Jennifer Buie. The address that I own is 20680 Italy Avenue. [48:39] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Thank you very much. So the question that I believe I heard is just other comments that were taking place at the neighborhood meeting. It sounded like a majority—I don't know that there's a count of how many people were in favor of it. [48:39] Paul Oehme: Yeah, and just based on anecdotal our discussions with the property owners at that time, it seemed like the property owners were in favor of adding the curb and gutter to the project. So I mean, the cost to add the curb and gutter, the assessment will go down about $900 if you take the curb and gutter off, so just kind of to give you context of how much that cost is to the neighborhood. [48:39] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Thank you for the added cost analysis too, I think that's helpful. Yes. [49:25] Michael Mosic: Good evening. My name is Michael Mosic. I'm living at 20640 Italy Avenue. I echo what Mr. Wilson and Bradley had to say as well. Just my concern is there's just not a return on the investment, number one. Number two, it's the long term—show we're looking at that water has been doing what it's been doing for years and I think it's found a path of least resistance, but there may be ways to improve that to get it to the lake quicker. I'm not sure exactly what it is, but I just don't feel extending that curb and gutter to the dead end is really going to facilitate that any different than what it is already doing. I guess the other thing I would be concerned with is if the road is raised, that curb will restrict water from leaving those yards on the high side, which in turn that water can't flow if there's a curb there. And to Brad's point, when you're packing that soil down, you're causing a restriction—a restriction flow of water, a natural process where it can leave the higher ground to find its path of least resistance, like Michelle Volk had brought up. So the road was actually, when I moved in three years ago, not in great shape but it was okay. But since the Antlers Park reconstruction, we've had a lot of big vehicles, trailers, tractors, excavators up and down that road, and that road doesn't look like it did three years ago. Like it's really beat up. I would be for resurfacing the road like it was, and that would be it. That would be my vote if I could have a vote on it. I never—I don't know where the votes came from that said they were in favor of curb and gutter, but I live by almost everybody that's here and I don't think any of us were on that page. But anyway, that's my opinion on it and I just wanted to make sure I was heard as well. Thank you. [51:41] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Thank you. Yes, please. [51:41] Cindy Graham: Cindy Graham, 20480 Holyoke. So as I'm listening to everybody and I'm realizing that we're the only ones on a one-way street, okay? And we're paying quite a bit. And my concern is that it still isn't used as a one-way. They'll get people coming up the wrong way and so our street is going to be used more in a sense because it's not a two-way street; it's just getting extra traffic when we shouldn't, okay? And there was one time last summer there was a cop sitting out on Holyoke and somebody went down the wrong way, turned out right in front of him, and he didn't go get him. And I went out there and talked to him. I said, "Why didn't you go and get that person?" and he just didn't really have an excuse. But I go out and stop people to the best of my ability, but that road is really bad. And if it's going to get double usage because now when it gets done people are going to think, "Well, this is great, let's use it again" or use it more and it's just going to put more wear and tear on that one-way street. And it's dangerous too. I've had two people come flying off of Holyoke into my yard and a lot of people use that street as a walking path with their kids and I try to warn them: "Be careful because people aren't looking when they're coming off of Holyoke." And I just hope I don't see something bad happen there someday. But the more people we get in Lakeville and there's a lot of families with little kids and they just use that street like a walking path and they're not paying attention. But it's a lot of money for just a one-way street. So that's all I have, thank you. [53:16] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Thank you. [54:02] Heather Anderson: Good evening. I'm Heather Anderson. I live at 20480 Italy Avenue, part of the club. I'm going to approach this at a slightly different angle. I'm opposed to the assessment in general and I think my big opposal to this is: city streets are City business. I pay my property taxes; you maintain my road. I would also submit that the road is in disrepair and it's much to the credit of the City of Lakeville—dereliction of duty in keeping the road maintained, plain and simple. We wouldn't be where we are today had this road been maintained properly. Now it's gotten to the point where it's so disintegrated that you can now assess homeowners to do the fixing. When it comes to the gutters and the curb, I'd also like to point out that that's 100% City homeowner assessed. That is not a law; that is your policy. I would like to promote that that's a beautification in terms of where this is at, since we are right next to Antlers Park and our road goes straight into a trail and walkway, that this is more of a beautification project and that this is actually benefiting the City of Lakeville and not the homeowners directly. And yet we are 100% responsible for that part of the assessment. Be it $900 or not, it's still not a homeowner benefit and you need to prove to me that this is going to benefit my home, my property to the tune of $5,500 at 3% interest. And I would like to submit that the assessment in general doesn't benefit the homeowner whatsoever. At five grand, I'm not going to get that return on my investment. The city streets is the City's problem and we wouldn't be in this situation had the street been maintained properly to begin with. Thank you. [55:43] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Is there anyone else? [55:43] Kandle Boon: I'm Kandle Boon. I live at 20720 Italy Avenue. I've been there with my wife, Dr. Kayla Boon, since April 1986, so we've been there 38 years. I want to thank the City for being very transparent about this process. I think you've been doing a good job of keeping us informed even though we don't necessarily all understand all the variables involved. The 100% assessability to the property owners for curb and gutter—that surprises me since it is not a state law, it's a policy. So I think there's some wiggle room in there. I sympathize with the Andersons in their comments there. My wife and I have seen this piece of Italy Avenue underwater four times since we first saw the place in the winter of 83-84, and the last time I saw it, my neighbor's two daughters were out on the street in an inflatable canoe paddling around in what briefly we renamed Venice Avenue. So I guess what I haven't heard is how there's going to be any kind of a grade improvement that's going to cause the new street surface to shed the water. I have seen where the smiths folks sandbagged with the help of the City and ran pumps for days to get the water off of their property. This was partly due to the fact the outlet of the lake back in the early 80s was still blocked up to the south, but we still have a situation where there are probably six or seven main stormwater sewage surface water drains going into the lake; there's only one outlet. That to me is a management problem of significance and I don't hear anything in here about how that's going to be managed in the future. I expect curb and gutter or no curb and gutter that we're going to see this piece of Italy Avenue underwater again and again unless that's been addressed in the planning. I haven't seen that. And again I confess I'm somewhat ignorant of some of the details, but I would certainly like to know before we go ahead with approving this assessment and the project if that has been taken into your plans. How do we keep the street from flooding again and again and again? You know, I think there is really there's one advocate for this whole project. He lives on what was the False Property between Ringisen and Smith. He's very vehemently in favor of making the street look as good as any other in Lakeville, and I've heard that and I've had conversations with him and he is basically indifferent to the issues about whether this will adversely impact the retirees like the Ringisens, the Smiths, the Boons, the Wilsons—you know, that doesn't seem to be a factor in his thinking. So I'm not sure that enough of us were really present at the earliest meetings to bring this forward and I'm not aware of any real formal vote that was taken among the neighborhood to approve or disapprove or register themselves in favor/not in favor. So there's some things I haven't heard yet that I would sure like to hear more about, but especially how are you going to keep this from happening again? What good will curb and gutter and repaving do if the street's going to be Venice Avenue again? That's all, thank you for your time. [59:38] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Thank you. Yes, sir. [59:38] Resident (Jaguar Path): I live on Jaguar Path in the Wildwood Oaks area, my house is right behind that 18482 Jaguar Path. And I've got a pond behind me there and on the roadside of I think there's some wildlife stuff there. And I asked Zach, I think it was about two years ago or three, I asked them about, you know, cleaning up where the water comes down and drains in the pond and going out—there's a lot of trees and stuff. He says, "Well, don't worry about it, when we redo the whole thing there, we're going to do something different there." But I can't find any answer to what they're going to do. I have no idea with the pond or what they're going to do with it. I don't know if they're going to build on it or what, and I can't find any answers from anybody. [1:00:25] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Can I ask you to clarify your concern with that property? Is the concern that there will be development on there or that—? [1:00:25] Resident (Jaguar Path): No, I've got ducks and animals out there and it's nice looking, and if they fill it in or do something with it, they build in behind me, I ain't going to be happy. [1:01:13] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Right. And our street's never been tarred. I've been there since 2006 and they never tarred it yet. Curbs and everything—that's never been tarred. I think once they put toilet paper on it and a little tar on top of it but that's been about it. What they're going to do in that area—we can ask staff if they have an answer to that. We can probably find that, I don't know if they have it handy, but maybe stay after—Paul can talk to you about exactly what the plans are there. Yeah, thank you. Is there anyone else online? I believe that's everyone in the chambers. So because of that, I am sure Council will have additional questions and follow-up based on those questions from the public. But should we close the public hearing? Is there a motion? [1:02:27] Councilmember Michelle Volk: I move to close the public hearing. [1:02:27] Councilmember John Bermel: Second. [1:02:27] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Motion and a second. All in favor say 'aye'. [1:02:27] Council: Aye. [1:02:27] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Anyone opposed? All right, the public hearing is closed. Council, based on public comment, is there any question you would like to address? [1:03:13] Councilmember Michelle Volk: I don't remember our policy being that it was 100% the homeowners for curb and gutter when we make the suggestion. So I'm a little concerned about that. But I guess the other thing is that I've lived in Lakeville a long time—I want to say close to 40 years at my house—and I've only had one time in those 40 years that it was a complete street reconstruction. And the way I understood it as a citizen is that I don't pay property taxes to do a full reconstruction on everybody else's streets in Lakeville; I'm only going to be paying for when it happens to be my house. But I am paying taxes as a citizen to have, you know, like when they go out and do what you might called tissue paper or a little tarring, etc. I've never had to pay that separately in my property taxes as a citizen but I don't have a separate bill because they came down my street to do that to keep it up for so many more years. So I think that's kind of the difference of living in this community is that some other communities you're automatically paying those property taxes for everybody's streets whether yours is getting done or not. And I guess that's one way to share the burden, but in my thought process, I kind of like it better knowing that I'm only paying for what's being done at my home instead. And as far as the curb and gutter, the cost of the street reconstruction—the way I remember it at that time was I didn't pay for the certain curb that was removed because it was wear and tear, you know it needed to be replaced as they were coming through but it already existed. So then it was formulated into the figure that that got replaced for me. I like having curb and gutter in my neighborhood, it does help on my property. But I guess you know, we'll have to determine as a Council on that policy for that street. [1:05:31] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Mr. Oehme, one of the themes that I heard was whether or how I'm interpreting it is that there's not confidence that this project will alleviate the drainage issues. So one of my questions for you is: is curb required to do the gutter improvements that are needed for this drainage improvement? And are there ways to do that without new curb? [1:06:20] Paul Oehme: It's a good question. And I acknowledge and staff acknowledges, our consultant acknowledges, there's no way we're going to be able to address all the drainage issues on Italy Avenue and 201st Street. What the issue is is when the lake level comes up—that's what governs the drainage in that whole area. So if the lake level comes up to a certain elevation, there's nowhere for the water to go and it's going to back up. So we can't do anything with that. We're talking about the drainage on a day-to-day basis, on a year-by-year basis, try to get that water off the property, off the street so it's not ponding, so it's not soaking into the pavement section as it is right now and deteriorating the pavement structure. So we're trying to do our best just to get the water away from the off the street and off the properties as best as we can. [1:07:05] Councilmember John Bermel: Yeah, on the same line—this is a unique piece of road. It's near the lake, it's a low level, and it's a total redo. So aside from the curb and gutter, is there any other engineering that's going to go into trying to mitigate the water? [1:07:50] Paul Oehme: Well, so we are putting in high-capacity inlets—and I don't know if we can show that here with the overhead—but we're adding some beefier catch basins along the street. So the catch basins would look something similar to this; right now they're very undersized structures that are currently out there. So we're looking at high-capacity inlets to try to get the water off the street as best as we can. And then the outlet to the lake would look something similar to that—and bigger pipes obviously—but a little bit beefier headwall and bigger access and better flow design to the lake. But to get the water to where you want it to get, the first step is let's get it off of the street. [1:08:36] Councilmember John Bermel: Would that be what the gutters and the curb—? [1:08:36] Paul Oehme: Exactly. That's what the curb and gutter is designed for—is to try to get the water off the street as most efficiently as we can. So the curb would be placed with string lines and a curb machine. So what that gets you is better tolerances for grades that are out there. This street's less than a half percent grade from the end of the road to the low point. So we need to make sure that the grades are such that they're flowing as best as we can and that's what the curb's designed for. So if we don't put curb in there, then we're left up to the paving machine to basically determine where the grades of that road are, and there's no way that the paving machine can do as good of a job as putting in curb and gutter and getting that water to flow. So that's the reason for us proposing the curb and gutter, if that makes sense. [1:09:22] Councilmember Michelle Volk: Can I clarify? So currently there's not that grate in the street? [1:10:08] Paul Oehme: There's a little one. It's a much smaller structure that's out there. [1:10:08] Councilmember Michelle Volk: And then what do they have on the sides by their property instead of that—you've got that square in the picture? It's a big square, but they must have some place that the water goes. [1:10:08] Paul Oehme: Yeah, there is storm sewer currently out there that ends up at the low point of Italy Avenue to the lake, but we're proposing to beef up that system and try to get the water into that catch basin as efficiently as we can with these bigger structures. And when those higher storm events happen as well too, you know a 10-year or 50-year storm event, these structures would take that water very efficiently and get it off the road as quickly as we can as long as the lake's not backed up. This system would really help the drainage of Italy Avenue. [1:10:53] Councilmember Michelle Volk: Can you build that square basin without curb and gutter next to it? [1:10:53] Paul Oehme: We can. So that can actually still be put in, yep. [1:10:53] Councilmember Michelle Volk: Okay, so we can build that. It's just getting the water from on the road down to here as efficiently as we can. But isn't that the way that you would grate the road to make sure that water was going to flow downhill or to your basin particularly? That's the way you design a road, right? [1:10:53] Paul Oehme: Right. And then the tolerances come into play—you know, trying to get those tolerances to try to get as much grade out of the road as we can to the low point. That's where the curb and gutter really helps out. [1:11:41] City Administrator Justin Miller: Mr. Oehme, would it be fair to say that the condition of Italy in particular is due to the fact that water cannot get off the road as easily as it can? And if we simply were to just repave it and not do anything different, the City's investment in this of 60% of the cost, we'd have to be redo it again? So it wouldn't necessarily be a good investment on the City's part to just do a resurface and not try to address the drainage at the same time. [1:12:27] Paul Oehme: Yeah. From a staff's perspective, we would like to do all we can to get the drainage addressed with what's being proposed tonight. Because like Mr. Miller had indicated, you know, the best design is to get the water off the street and out of the pavement section as quickly as we can because that's going to lengthen the life of the road tremendously. Water is, especially in Minnesota, the culprit for a lot of premature pavement distresses. [1:12:27] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: How often do we reconstruct roads with no curb and gutter in town? [1:12:27] Paul Oehme: It all depends. You know, a lot of—there are some neighborhoods in the community where we had to reconstruct roads without curb and gutter because there's really no place to put the water because of the drainage situations out there. But typically a road that does not have curb and gutter doesn't last as long as one that would have curb and gutter. [1:13:11] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: I appreciate the concerns brought up today. I think it's fair to say that this is expensive. It's an expensive project and I recognize the investment that you as residents have to make when these projects come to light. It's also an investment for the City, which all taxpayers in the City are investing money into this as well. I don't believe that there is a tie between the curb and gutter and aesthetics for the park; I think those are very separate things and were not related. But we talked about this project a while back and I trust the assessment of staff in terms of the need and how to address the drainage issues. And so I hesitate to—based on the engineering studies and surveys—to not heed the advice of our engineers and staff who have really looked at this area. You know, our lake is lower than we'd like it to be—I don't know if we're ever going to get back to the levels that we used to see at Lake Marion—but big weather systems are going to come regardless of the lake level. And I think that's what we're trying to manage—the water and those big rushes during storms and whatnot. So I'm in favor of continuing with the project as stated, again recognizing that this is expensive but we—that's also why we have those systems in place to pay over time so that it's more manageable than trying to pay this all at one time. I haven't quite got a feeling or a sense from the rest of Council of if there are requests for changes or support on this. [1:15:30] Councilmember Michelle Volk: I guess I have one more question and it might be from Mr. Miller or Mr. Oehme. The 100% to construct curb and gutter—I'm just trying—I'm new enough I'm trying to figure out what's the rationale for that, the 100%? [1:15:30] Justin Miller: So that's been part of our policy for as long as I've been here that I can think of, and I've been here nine years. The rationale is that it's usually something that benefits that property more than the City as a whole. And so there are cities that—it's all over the gamut in terms of assessment practices too. And so this is something that has been talked about and addressed over the years and it's just more of a local preference. [1:15:30] Councilmember Michelle Volk: And if the curb and gutter in front of my house is reconstructed, that goes under the normal formula and not the 100%? Or is it—? [1:15:30] Justin Miller: Yes, that's correct. It's just the initial. [1:16:17] Councilmember Michelle Volk: Interesting. See and that's the part I'm having a little trouble with, because if the resident asks for it as we're coming through and doing a street reconstruction—I've heard in years past when I went to my own public hearing as a citizen of my neighborhood—if you didn't have curb and gutter and you wanted it, that you would have to pay for that. I get that—you didn't have it, you want it, you've got to pay for it. And then I don't know what our requirements are; I assume we have every developer put it in when the new houses go in, etc. But I'm just having a little hard time with 100% of something that didn't exist and yet we need it there. But how does it become 100% their problem if we've determined that it's part of—I would like to see a share in it if it's 60/40 again, we pick up 60 of it or something. But I don't understand the philosophy when it's something new for a whole area and they didn't ask for it. [1:17:48] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: When it comes to this practice—it's a practice, right? It's not a policy—? [1:17:48] Justin Miller: No, it's a policy. [1:17:48] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: So that's a policy change—to change a curb assessment to 40? If we were—what I'm hearing you say is to match our other reconstruction policy potentially of a 40% to the homeowner and 60%? [1:17:48] Councilmember Michelle Volk: But only if the homeowner requested it and it wasn't there and we weren't going to be putting it in and you want it, you pay for it, right? You know what I mean? If that's—but does that make sense? [1:17:48] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: And I think the policy is there to—the problem is you can't just do curb in front of one house. And according to our staff, we did hear from people that wanted curb in this area too. And we did do a project where I think it was around Orchard Lake where they didn't put curb in, there wasn't curb there and they didn't put it in. [1:17:48] Justin Miller: Right. It is spot selective; I mean, it depends on how it benefits the road. And like we talked about this one, the drainage problems are significantly impacting the condition of the road and we would be back in this situation again at the cost of the taxpayers if we don't try to do everything we can to try to get the drainage off of the road. [1:18:36] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Are we on the same page that we feel that the curb and gutter should be installed? I'm seeing two things right now. [1:19:23] Councilmember Michelle Volk: I honestly I think it should be there. I understand that I'm, you know, kind of contradicting myself here, but I get that they're trying to come up with solutions for this street and the water, and I think the curbs and the gutter system that they're outlining is going to help tremendously. I mean, it helps in my own neighborhood keep it off my property. And I live on a little lake too so I'm, you know, and I've lived there a long time and of course we all have weather events—you're going to have standing water for a week or something. But anyway, so that's separate than my issue with how it's paid for. [1:20:11] Councilmember John Bermel: Yeah, I agree with the curb and gutter. To me that seems like a necessary piece of making this road the best road that it can be. When's the last time that we've done work on this stretch of road? [1:20:39] Paul Oehme: Don't have the maintenance records handy right now, I'm sorry. But yeah, I think it was seal coated and the normal maintenance, but once it gets to a point where the pavement condition drops to a certain level, it really doesn't make any sense to do some of those minor maintenance techniques anymore because you're not going to get the value. [1:20:39] Councilmember Dan Wolter: Yeah, and we experienced that in my neighborhood a couple years ago living in a cul-de-sac. We had the whole thing redone, paid the assessment. But in terms of your question about the curb and gutter, I agree. I think the curb and gutter is a necessary part of the project. [1:21:25] Councilmember John Bermel: I would agree. Just being close to a lake, the number of big rainfalls we have, I think that's a best practice and that would occur. My concern again is the 100%, but I don't know that we change policy in this one item. [1:21:25] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Well, and I think that's the separate issue. I mean, we as a Council have had a tradition of not doing one-off changes, and that doesn't mean we haven't changed policy after some discussion and further investigation of those policies. So it sounds like the project itself, the Council feels that it's merited as laid out. I guess the question is, if we look at this after the fact, can a potential policy change retroactively be applied if this project hasn't started yet? And how does making this proposed motion tonight impact potential costs in the future if we decide to change policy? [1:22:11] Justin Miller: So I would not recommend deviating from your policy for this project separately unless you had already made the change to the policy. Typically, you do not do a retroactive policy and apply it to a prior situation. That being said, you could consider—if you do change your policy, I suppose you could consider an abatement of that amount from those taxes. [1:23:08] Bradley Anderson: If you're going to allow this, you need to come up to the microphone. My name is Bradley Anderson again, I live on Italy Avenue. I think we have the majority of the homeowners here tonight; I can only think of a couple that are missing. So I don't know where you got your information before, but it certainly wasn't from us because we are against it. So I hope you can make a decision based on that. [1:23:08] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: And I appreciate that standpoint. I think—and I don't want to speak on behalf of the Council yet until this is voted on—but from where I'm sitting, part of it's not about whether it's a majority of the neighborhood who wants it or not. I think part of the majority of where I'm coming from is: does the merit of this proposal necessitate the curb and gutter? Because it's not an aesthetic change, it's a drainage change. And so that's where I'm coming from. And so I can again appreciate that, yes, in terms of numbers, I agree with you—as I'm counting up the houses on this block, it sounds like the majority are against curb and gutter. But from an engineering standpoint and from a drainage improvement standpoint, I think that's where the City is looking to ensure that that investment is well spent and not take out an element of it that's going to impact the street going forward. [1:24:41] Councilmember John Bermel: Yeah, on that same line, we have a responsibility to all the taxpayers and to the people that are directly affected. You know, if we don't do what we need to do to mitigate the drainage issues on the road, which includes the curb and gutter, we'll be back and we'll be doing the same things. My understanding on that—and I, this is just how I see it—we'd probably be coming back and doing that project again and there would be more assessments because of how it would affect the construction, would affect the roads or the properties there. And those might happen when the residents that are currently there are still there or long gone. We just don't know the timing on that. But I feel—I think when we make these decisions, we gather data, we have engineers, and we try to mitigate things the best way that we possibly can, and we have a great responsibility to do that. That doesn't mean I don't hear what you're saying—like I say, I remember when I got assessed, it isn't a fun thing. And what I hear from you is you're going, "We don't want this." I mean, I had curb and gutter in my area so it's just done. But what I'm hearing is, "We don't want this," but that isn't necessarily the question. The question is: what is our greater responsibility to make sure that we do something that's going to be the most beneficial for the entire community? And so that's where I'm sitting with it. [1:26:14] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: So I'd like to keep that on the agenda for us to look at the policy and know that that abatement is an option for us in the future. But I believe we've heard what we need to approve the motion that we have in front of us. So is there a motion to approve this? [1:26:14] Councilmember Dan Wolter: Can I ask one question first? So one part of the motion is the resolution adopting the assessments, correct? I'm assuming we need to do all of this—is it possible to revisit the policy and then revisit this, or does that screw up the whole project? Does that make sense? [1:26:59] Justin Miller: Just remember there's more than just this street in this assessment roll. [1:26:59] Councilmember Dan Wolter: Oh, good point. Good point. [1:26:59] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: And you need the mechanism for funding the approval that we are putting in front of us. So that we're approving the mechanism to pay for what we're approving for, knowing that we have another conversation that could lead to a change if we deem that necessary. [1:27:46] Councilmember Michelle Volk: I appreciate you trying to kind of think around this creatively for somewhat of a solution. You know, and I know this—I don't want to sound condescending, I don't know what the right word is—but I don't remember how many years ago my assessment was for our street project but it's roughly about the same, even with inflation, etc. So I mean, I guess what I'm thinking, when I saw your assessment amounts, it didn't trigger any red flags in my head that you were being severely assessed for the project on your road. So I know that for me, you know, it balanced with what I had already paid for my house in my neighborhood. And I understand the theory because I kind of had those same questions when it came through: "How does this really benefit my property?" But it was really explained to me that state law says that we can't come in and do something that isn't going to be a benefit. State law says that basically we have to prove that what we did is of value. And our City wouldn't go through the process of setting themselves up for a lawsuit if they couldn't prove that it does actually keep the value of my property and also help to secure it in the future. So I trust the City coming through to evaluate the street, the condition of it, and the engineers have come up with their way of trying to deal with future problems. So you know, obviously I'm going to have to vote for the project. I was just hoping that we could have come to some sort of solution on the pricing on the curb and gutter, but it is what it is at this point. So I mean, it'll be a great discussion for the future as you're asking for it to be brought up for another work session topic and we can debate it in a little bit more length then too. [1:30:05] Councilmember John Bermel: Yes, I'd like to just make the motion. Move to approve (1) a resolution awarding contract to McNamara Contracting Incorporated for the 2024 Street Reconstruction Rehabilitation Project, City Project 24-02; and (2) a resolution adopting the assessments for City Improvement Project 24-02; and (3) a resolution authorizing funding and 2024 budget amendments to fund the transfers; and (4) approved proposals with WSB and Braun Intertec for professional services. [1:30:52] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: A motion is there a second? [1:30:52] Councilmember Michelle Volk: Second. [1:30:52] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Motion and a second. Roll call please. [1:30:52] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Volk? [1:30:52] Councilmember Michelle Volk: Aye. [1:30:52] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Lee? [1:30:52] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Aye. [1:30:52] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Bermel? [1:30:52] Councilmember John Bermel: Aye. [1:30:52] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Wolter? [1:30:52] Councilmember Dan Wolter: No. [1:30:52] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Majority—it means that it is approved. I genuinely appreciate you all coming in here today. I hope you don't leave here feeling that we haven't heard you and that it was all for naught. I do think that there was some thought provocation—is that a word?—thought-provoking parts of what you were talking about that will facilitate future discussion and may lead to other changes to this policy. So thank you for your time. All right, so we have another public hearing. So let's move into the public hearing and resolution for assessments of unpaid special charges. [1:32:12] Finance Director Julie Stahl: Thank you, Mr. Mayor, members of the Council. We are doing this public hearing process for the adoption of the assessments for unpaid special charges. The City minimizes its losses due to bankruptcy by assessing unpaid special charges to the taxes. These charges could include costs incurred by the City for mowing grass, removal of weeds, property maintenance on nuisance properties, false alarm charges, unpaid utility bills, and tree removal charges. In order to recover those unpaid special charges, we must follow state statute in these proceedings, and these procedures provide that we must adopt a resolution declaring the unpaid special charges to be assessed and establishing the date for the assessment hearing, which is what we're doing tonight here—having this assessment hearing. Public notice of this hearing was mailed to the customers and also posted on the City website and published in the newspaper. So there's four different portions of this. We have delinquent utility bills, and through this spring certification, this process is actually affecting less than 1% of our Lakeville utility customers. We have nuisance abatement and unpaid false alarm charges, and then tree removal charges, which Director Oehme talked about the EAB removals. We had our first certification of the tree removals of EABs on residents' property in the fall; this is our second time around, so we'll see more in the fall again as residents try and get on top of those removals. The EAB trees that are on their properties, we are following the Minnesota Statute 444.75 subdivision 3 and that's what's allowing us to do this. Excuse me, our City Code section Title 7 in Chapter 5 also references this ability for delinquent accounts and gives us authorization to do this. Unpaid utility charges and special assessments and real estate taxes are liens against the properties and the liens are then enforceable and are not impaired by the transfer of ownership; so they stay with the property if the property sells. Current and previous property owners have both been notified via letter of the delinquency and this whole certification process. When we're looking at comparison data, this spring certification compared to last 2023 spring certification for delinquent utilities, there was not roughly a change in the number of them—there was 29 of them. Dollar amount is $8,300, so that's up roughly $2,800 from last year's. We are doubled up on the nuisance abatements; we've actually doubled that almost from last year's—we only had 10 and we have 19 this year totaling roughly $5,600. False alarms were down, there's only two false alarm charges on there. And then the tree removals like I mentioned, we've got three for those nuisance EAB tree removals. The option for the payments that are received prior to the hearing, if they were able to come in, as well as within 30 days following the hearing when interest is not charged, will be removed from the final certification list that goes to Dakota County. With that, I'll ask if there's any questions before we open it up to the public hearing. [1:36:03] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: I don't believe there's any questions. Okay, thank you. This is another public hearing and so same rules apply. Is there anyone in the audience that wishes to speak on this issue? Anyone online? Okay. I'll make a motion to close the public hearing. [1:36:03] Councilmember John Bermel: There a motion to close the public hearing, is there a second? [1:36:03] Councilmember Dan Wolter: Second. [1:36:03] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Councilmember Wolter for a second. All in favor say 'aye'. [1:36:03] Council: Aye. [1:36:03] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: All opposed? All right, the public hearing is closed. Is there any additional question or comment from Council? Hearing none, is there a motion? [1:36:48] Councilmember Dan Wolter: I move to approve resolution adopting assessments for the unpaid special charges. [1:36:48] Councilmember John Bermel: Second. [1:36:48] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Motion and a second. Roll call please. [1:36:48] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Volk? [1:36:48] Councilmember Michelle Volk: Aye. [1:36:48] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Lee? [1:36:48] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Aye. [1:36:48] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Bermel? [1:36:48] Councilmember John Bermel: Aye. [1:36:48] City Clerk Ann Orlofsky: Wolter? [1:36:48] Councilmember Dan Wolter: Aye. [1:36:48] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: All right, motion passes, thank you. Thank you. All right, is there any unfinished business tonight that needs to be discussed? Hearing none, any new business? And our announcements for tonight are that the next regular city council meeting is April 15th, 2024 at 6:00 p.m. The next work session is April 22nd, 2024 at 6:00 p.m. So next, we are going to need a motion to adjourn to closed session as permitted by Minnesota Statute 13D.05 subdivision 3b to hold a confidential attorney-client privileged discussion of legal rights and remedies, potential settlement, and strategy regarding the City of Lakeville versus Julie A. Larson. [1:37:34] Councilmember Michelle Volk: I'll move what you just said. I don't have the whole thing in front of me. [1:37:34] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: Great, so there's a motion. [1:37:34] Councilmember John Bermel: Second. [1:37:34] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: And a second. All in favor say 'aye'. [1:37:34] Council: Aye. [1:37:34] Acting Mayor Joshua Lee: We are adjourned to closed session. [1:38:14] [Music] [1:38:28] [Music]