>> Chair Downs: OKAY. SO WE'RE GOING TO, IF YOU WOULD JOIN ME, WE'RE GOING TO SAY OUR PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE AND GET STARTED. [PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE] >> Chair Downs: SORRY. YOU'RE WAITING ON ME. >> COMMENTS OF PUBLIC INTEREST THIS PORTION OF THE MEETING IS TO ALLOW UP TO THREE MINUTES PE SPEAKER WITH 30 TOTAL MINUTES ON ITEMS OF INTEREST OR CONCERN AND NOT ON ITEMS THAT ARE ON TH CURRENT AGENDA. THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MAY NOT DISCUSS THESE ITEMS, BUT MAY RESPOND WITH FACTUAL OR POLICY THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MAY CHOOSE TO PLACE THE ITEM ON A FUTURE AGENDA. THE PRESIDING OFFICER MAY MODIF THESE TIMES AS DEEMED NECESSARY. >> Chair Downs: THANK YOU. DO WE HAVE ANY SPEAKERS ON THIS ITEM? >> WE DO NOT. >> Chair Downs: THANK YOU. CONSENT AGENDA, PLEASE. THE CONSENT AGENDA WILL BE ACT UPON IN ONE MOTION AND CONTAINS ITEMS WHICH ARE ROUTINE AND YPICALLY NONCONTROVERSI ITEMS MAY BE REMOVED FROM THIS AGENDA FOR INDIVIDUAL CONSIDERATION BY COMMISSIONERS OR STAFF. >> Chair Downs: WOULD ANYONE LIKE TO PULL AN ITEM FROM THE CONSENT AGENDA? SEEING NONE, I'LL -- >> I MOVE THAT WE APPROVE THE CONSENT AGENDA AS SUBMITTED. >> Chair Downs: I HAVE A MOTION BY COMMISSIONER BRONSKY WITH A SECOND BY COMMISSIONER RATLIFF TO APPROVE THE CONSENT AGENDA. PLEASE VOTE. THAT ITEM CARRIES 7-0. WE HOPE AT OUR NEXT MEETING IN ABOUT THREE WEEKS TO HAVE ALL EIGHT OF US HERE. THAT WILL BE NICE. OKAY. MOVING ON. >> ITEMS FOR INDIVIDUAL CONSID PUBLIC HEARING ITEMS: APPLICANT ARE LIMITED TO 15 MINUTES OF PRESENTATION TIME WITH A FIVE-MINUTE REBUTTAL, IF NEEDED REMAINING SPEAKERS ARE LIMITED TO 30 TOTAL MINUTES OF TESTIMON TIME, WITH THREE MINUTES ASSIGNED PER SPEAKER. THE PRESIDING OFFICER MAY MODIFY THESE TIMES AS DEEMED NECESSARY ADMINISTRATIVE CONSIDERATION ITEMS MUST BE APPROVED IF THEY MEET CITY DEVELOPMENT REGULATIO LEGISLATIVE CONSIDERATION ITEMS ARE MORE DISCRETIONARY, EXCEPT AS CONSTRAINED BY LEGAL CONSIDE. IF IT PLEASES THE CHAIR, ITEMS 1A AND 1B, CAN THEY BE READ TOGETHER? >> Chair Downs: YES. AGENDA ITEM NO. 1. PUBLIC HEARING: ZONING CASE 2022-009 - REQUEST TO REZONE 19.1 ACRES CATEAT THE SOUTHWEST CORNER OF PLAN PARKWAY AND EXECUTIVE DRIVE FROM CORRIDOR COMMERCIAL TO PLANNED DEVELOPME ZONED CORRIDOR COMMERCIAL AND LOCATED WITHIN THE 190 TOLLWAY/PLANO PARKWAY OVERLAY D PETITIONER: ONALP PROPERTY OWNER, LLC. AGENDA ITEM NO. 1B. PUBLIC HEARING - CONCEPT PLAN: FRY'S ELECTRONIC ADDITION, BLOC A, LOTS 1-37 AND 1X-8X, AND BLOCK B, LOT 1 - MID-RISE RESIDENTIAL, SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENCE ATTACHED, PROFESSIONA ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICE, AND HOTE ON 46 LOTS ON 16.5 ACRES LOCATE AT THE SOUTHWEST CORNER OF PLAN PARKWAY AND EXECUTIVE DRIVE. ZONED CORRIDOR COMMERCIAL AND LOCATED WITHIN THE 190 TOLLWAY/PLANO PARKWAY OVERLAY D APPLICANT: ONALP PROPERTY OWNER. >> GOOD EVENING, EVERYONE. MY NAME IS KATYA COPELAND AND I'M THE SENIOR PLANNER WITH THE PLANNING. THIS REQUEST IS TO REZONING THE SUBJECT PROPERTY FROM CORRIDOR COMMERCIAL TO PLANNED DEVELOPMENT CORRIDOR COMMERCIAL TO ALLOW RESIDENTIAL USES AS A PERMITTED USE WITH MODIFIED DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS. IS RUEST INCLUDES A NUMBER OF PLANNED DEVELOPMENT STIPULATIONS. THE SUBJECT PROPERTY HIGHLIGHTED IN YELLOW -- IS HIGHLIGHTED IN YELLOW. TO THE NORTH ACROSS PLANO PARKWAY THE PROPERTIES ARE ZONED CORRIDOR COMMERCIAL. TO THE SOUTH ACROSS STATE HIGHWAY 190 THE PROPERTIES ARE VACANT OR DEVELOPE AS MULTIFAMILY RESIDENCES. TO THE EAST ACROSS EXECUTIVE DRIVE THE PROPERTY IS ZONED PLANNED DEVELOPMENT 491 CORRIDOR COMMERCIAL AND IS DEVELOPED AS MULTIFAMILY RESIDENCES. TO THE WEST THE PROPERTIES ARE ZONED CORRIDOR COMMERCIAL. SHOWN ON THE SCREEN IS THE COMPANION CONCEPT PLAN THAT HAS BEEN SUBMITTED. THE CONCEPT PLAN SHOWS THE PROPOSED MID-RISE RESIDENTIAL ALONG PLANO PARKWAY AND EXECUTIVE DRIVE. IT ALSO SHOWS THE SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENT ATTACHED UNITS IN THE MIDDLE OF THE PROPERTY, THE PROFESSIONAL GENERAL ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICE ON THE NORTH SIDE OF EXECUTIVE DRIVE, THE OPEN SPACE IS PROPOSED NORTH OF THE OFFIC AND THE HOTEL IS PROPOSED ON THE SOUTH SIDE OF EXECUTIVE DRIVE . THIS CASE MAY HAVE STARTED TO SOUND FAMILIAR TO SOME OF YOU AND THAT'S BECAUSE A SIMILAR ZONING CASE ON THE SAME PROPERTY WITH A LARGER NUMBER OF RESIDENTIAL UNITS WAS PROPOSED AND PRESENTED TO THIS COMMISSION IN 2021. THE COMMISSION DENIED THE ZONING REQUEST AND THE APPLICANT APPEALED THE DENIAL TO CITY COUNCIL. ON JUNE 28, 2021 BUT WITHDRAW THE APPEAL REQUEST . THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS DESIGNATED EXPRESSWAY CORRIDORS ON THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP. THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN ANALYSIS OF THIS REQUEST INCLUDES SEVERAL POLICIES THAT ARE LISTED ON THE SCREEN. THE REQUEST MEETS THE GENERAL DESCRIPTIONS AND PRIORITIES OF THE EXPRESSWAY CORRIDOR DASHBOARD. HOWEVER, THE REQUEST DOES NOT PROVIDE SUFFICIENT MITIGATION FROM THE EXPRESSWAY CORRIDORS. THE PHASING AND RATIO OF RESIDENTIAL TO NON-RESIDENTIAL USES IS INCONSISTENT WITH THE R RGM POLICY. DUE TO THESE ISSUES AND INCONSISTENCIES WITH THE REDEVELOPMENT AND GROWTH MANAGEMENT POLICY THE REQUEST WILL REQUIRE FINDINGS BY THE COMMISSION AND CITY COUNCIL. THE APPLICANT IS PROPOSING A MAXIMUM AMOUNT OF 501 MID-RISE RESIDENTIAL UNITS IN THE LOCATION OUTLINED IN RED ON THE SCREEN. MID-RISE RESIDENTIAL IS A TYPE OF MULTIFAMILY RESIDENCE AND IS DEFINED AS BUILDINGS CONTAINING NOT LESS THAN FIVE FLOORS THAT MAY INCLUDE A MIX OF RESIDENTIAL AND NON-RESIDENTIAL USES IN THE SAME STRUCTURE. THE REQUESTED MID-RISE RESIDENTIAL USE IS NOT IN CONFORMANCE WITH SIGNIFICANT PORTIONS OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN. ADDING THE SURROUNDING ZONING MAY BE INCOMPATIBLE WITH RESIDENTIAL LIVING. THE SUBJECT PROPERTY SHOULD BE RETAINED FOR FUTURE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT DUE TO THE HIGH VISIBILITY AND ACCESS TO THE SURROUNDING THOROUGHFARE AND EXPRESSWAYS. ADDING THERE ARE 2,638 MULTIFAMILY UNITS IN THE GENERAL AREA YET TO BE BUILT. DUE TO THESE ISSUES, MID-RISE RESIDENTIAL IS NOT AN APPROPRIATE LAND USE FOR TS SITE. THE APPLICANT IS ALSO PROPOSING 33 SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENT ATTACHED UNITS IN THE LOCATION OUTLINED IN RED ON THE SCREEN. THE ADDITION OF THE SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENT ATTACHED UNITS IS IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN'S MIX OF USES BUT IS NOT IN CONFORMANCE WITH SIGNIFICANT RECOMMENDATIONS OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN. THE PROPOSED UNITS ARE SITUATED BETWEEN TWO MID-RISE RESIDENTIAL BUILDINGS, OPEN SPACE NON-RESIDENTIAL BUILDING, AND A PARKING GARAGE. THE DESIGN ISOLATES THE SINGLE-FAMILY DEVELOPMENT AND DOES NOT ESTABLISH QUALITY PLACEMAKING ELEMENTS. REDESIGNING THE PROPOSED UNITS IN A MORE COMPACT ARRANGEMENT ALLOWS FOR A SENSE OF COMMUNITY AND NEIGHBORHOOD IDENTITY THAT COULD BENEFIT THESE RESIDENTS IN THE LONG TERM. AS CURRENTLY PROPOSED, STAFF IS CONCERNED THAT THE APPLICANT IS ONLY PROPOSING THE SINGLE-FAMILY ATTACHED UNITS TO MEET THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN MIX OF USES REQUIREMENT AND IS NOT ADEQUATELY CONSIDERING THE QUALITY OF LIFE OR PLACEMAKING ISSUES FOR THESE FUTURE RESIDENTS. THE CLOSEST DART RAIL STATION IS THE CITY LINE BUSH STATION ACROSS STATE HIGHWAY 190 LOCATED WITHIN THE CITY LIMITS OF RICHARDSON. THERE ARE EXISTING PEDESTRIAN CONNECTIONS TO ACCESS THIS STATION AND THE APPLICANT IS PROPOSING SIDEWALKS WITHIN AND THROUGHOUT THE PROPERTY. THE DOWNTOWN PLANO RAIL STATION'S STOP IS 1.4 MILES AWAY FROM THE LOCATION. SINCE 2018, THE CITY'S LONG-RANGE PLANNING POLICIES HAVE FOCUSED ON LIMITING RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT IN EXPRESSWAY CORDORS THE PURPOSE OF THE EXPRESSWAY CORRIDOR ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH AREA ALSO SHORTENED TO EHA IS TO PROTECT SENSITIVE LAND USES BY REQUIRING MITIGATION METHODS TO ENSURE MEASURES FROM IMPACTS OF THE EXPRESSWAY, INCLUDING REDUCING NOISE LEVELS BELOW 65 DECIBELS. THE SUBJECT PROPERTY FALLS WITHIN BOTH EHA1 AND EHA2 AREAS SHOWN ON THE SCREEN. NOTING DEVELOPING RESIDENTIAL USES IN THE EHA2 IS DESIGNATED AS INAPPROPRIATE AND THE APPLICANT IS NOT PROPOSING ANY RESIDENTIAL UTS WITHIN THE EHA-2. THE APPLICANT IS, HOWEVER, PROPOSING RESIDENTIAL UNITS WITHIN THE EHA-1 AREA . RESIDENTIAL USES MAY BE APPROPRIATE IN EHA-1 IF MITIGATION METHODS ARE PROPOSED. THE EXPRESSWAY CORRIDOR ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH AREA FOCUSES ON MITIGATING OUTDOOR NOSE LEVELS WHERE SPECIFIC LAND USES ARE PROPOSED. THE APPLICANT HAS SUBMITTED AN EHA SITE ANALYSIS WITH MITIGATION METHODS BUT THE SITE WOULD EXCEED THE RECOMMENDED OUTDOOR NOISE LEVELS. ADDING THE APPLICANT HAS SHARED THAT THE RESIDENTIAL BUILDINGS CAN BE CONRUCTED ACHIEVE INTERIOR NOISE LEVELS OF LESS THAN 45 DECIBELS. THIS STANDARD DOES NOT MEET THE CITY'S EHA POLICY GOAL AND THE LACK OF COMMITMENT FOR CONSTRUCTION OF NON-RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURES AS A BUFFER MAY IMPACT THESE FUTURE RESIDENTS' QUALITY OF LIFE ON THE SUBJECT PROPERTY. THE APPLICANT IS PROPOSING PLANNED DEVELOPMENT STIPULATIONS TO ALLOW FOR THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE RESIDENTIAL USES WITHIN THE CORRIDOR COMMERCIAL ZONING DISTRICT. MANY OF THE STIPULATIONS ARE DESIGNATEDOR TRACT 1 OR TRACT 2. TRACT 1 INCLUDES THE ALLOWANCE FOR MAXIMUM OF 501 MID-RISE RESIDENTIAL UNITS AND A MINIMUM OF 33 SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENT ATTACHED UNITS. TRACT 2 INCLUDES STANDARDS TO ACCOMMODATE A FUTURE HOTEL DEVELOPMENT WITH REDUCED SETBACKS AND A REQUIRED LANDSCAPE EDGE. FOR TRACT 1 THE STIPULATIONS REQUIRE 1.5 ACRES OF OPEN SPACE WITH A MINIMUM SETBACK OF 150 FEET FROM BOTH EXPRESSWAYS. E APPLICANT IS ALSO PROPOSING TO PHASE THE ZONING REQUEST. THE FIRST PHASE OF DEVELOPMENT MID-RISE RESIDENTIAL UNITS, THE REQUIRED OPEN SPACE, AND 33 SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENT ATTACHED UNITS. THERE ARE NO REQUIREMENTS FOR ANY NON-RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT WITHIN THE FIRST PHASE. WITH PHASE 2, A BUILDING PERMIT MUST BE ISSUED WITH A MINIMUM OF 70,000 SQUARE FEET OF NON-RESIDENTIAL USES PRIOR TO THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE REMAINING M-RISESIDENTIAL UNITS. HOWEVER, AN ISSUED BUILDING PERMIT DOES NOT MEAN THAT THE NON-RESIDENTIAL USES WILL EVER BE CONSTRUCTED. THE LACK OF ESTABLISHED NON-RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURES PROPOSED IN PHASE 1 MAY IMPACT THE QUALITY OF LIFE FOR THE FUTURE RESIDENTS WHILE THEY WAIT FOR THE NON-RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT TO BUFFER EXISTING NOISE CONCERNS. THE APPLICANT IS ALSO PROPOSING STANDARDS RELATING TO THE RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT INCLUDING NOISE LEVELS, MODIFIED SETBACKS, HEIGHT LIMITATIONS FACADE REQUIREMENT UNITIZE SCREENING PARKING AND OUTDOOR LIVING AREAS. LASTLY, THE APPLICANT IS PROPOSING PLANNED DEVELOPMENT ADJUSTMENTS RELATED TO SETBACKS, LANDSCAPE EDGES, AND DESIGN STANDARDS. WE RECEIVED THREE UNIQUE RESPONSES IN FAVOR WITHIN THE 200-FOOT BUFFER. WE RECEIVED ONE RESPONSE FOR A TOTAL OF FOUR RESPONSES. AND WE RECEIVED A TOTAL OF 18 UNIQUE RESPONSES, SEVEN IN SUPPORT AND 11 IN OPPOSITION. WE RECEIVED TWO DUPLICATE RESPONSES AND ONE RESPONSE OUTSIDE THE CITY OF PLANO FOR A TOTAL OF 20 RESPONSES. TO CONCLUDE, THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING TO REZONE THIS PROPERTY FROM CORRIDOR COMMERCIAL TO A PLANNED DEVELOPMENT DISTRICT TO ALLOW FOR RESIDENTIAL UNITS WITH MODIFIED DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS. THE REQUEST WILL AID IN THE CITY'S GOAL OF REDEVELOPMENT ADDITION TO MEETING OTHERN STANDARDS OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, SUCH AS THE MIX OF USES. HOWEVER, THE REQUEST LACKS ALIGNMENT WITH THE REDEVELOPMENT AND GROWTH MANAGEMENT POLICY AND THE REQUEST DOES NOT PROVIDE SUFFICIENT MITIGATION FROM THE EXPRESSWAYS. APPROVAL WILL REQUIRE FINDINGS DUE TO SUBSTANTIAL CONFLICTS WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN POLICY GUIDANCE FOR REDEVELOPMENT AND GROWTH MANAGEMENT. THE ZONING CASE AND COMPANION CONCEPT PLAN ARE BOTH RECOMMENDED FOR DENIAL. AND THAT CONCLUDES THE PRESENTATION AND STAFF IS HAPP TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MAY HAVE. THANK YOU. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. THANK YOU. WHEN YOU MENTION THAT THERE ARE ALREADY 2300 RESIDENTIAL UNITS IN THE GENERAL AREA TO BE BUILT, THAT'S BASICALLY CONCRETE, IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE REFERRING TO? >> YES. >> Chair Downs: ARE THERE ANY OTHER DEVELOPMENTS BESIDES COLLIN CREEK THAT MAKE UP THAT NUMBER ? DON'T KNOW. >> I BELIEVE COLLIN CREEK IS THE FOCUS OF THAT LARGE NUMBER. >> THAT IS THE CORRECT NUMBER OF. >> Chair Downs: THAT'S WHAT I THOUGHT. I WANTED TO MAKE SURE THERE WASN'T SOME OTHER DEVELOPMENT THAT WAS GOING ON. YOU MENTIONED FOR THE SINGLE-FAMILY, THAT STAFF FELT A REDESIGN OF THAT LAYOUT MIGHT BE BENEFICIAL. ARE YOU SUGGESTING THAT IF THE APPLICANT WAS TO CHANGE THE LAYOUT OF THE SINGLE-FAMILY THAT STAFF WOULD THEN LOOK MORE FAVORABLY UPON THIS? OR NOT REALLY. IT JUST MAY BE A RECOMMENDATION THAT MAYBE THEY OULDONSIDER SOMETHING LIKE THAT. >> SURE. I WOULD DEFER THAT TO EITHER MS. DAY OR MR. HILL, IF HE'S ON THE LINE. >> MR. HILL JUST NOTED THAT THERE ARE SOME UNITS REMAINING AT HERITAGE CREEKSIDE THAT HE ALSO WANTED TO NOTE. AND SO I'M SORRY. COULD YOU REPEAT YOUR QUESTION? >> Chair Downs: AS PART OF THE REPORT, ONE OF THE STATEMENTS WAS THAT IF THE SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENTIAL, INSTEAD OF BEING KIND OF STRUNG OUT THERE WHERE THEY WERE, WERE INSTEAD COMBINED INTO A MORE COMPACT AREA. WOULD THAT BE SOMETHING THE STAFF WOULD LOOK MORE FAVEBLY UPON THE PROPOSAL? >> YES. I THINK THERE ARE A NUMBER OF CONCERNS BUT THAT WOULDN'T NECESSARILY ALLEVIATE EVERY CONCERN BUT IT ABSOLUTELY WOULD BE SOMETHING. IN FACT, WE MADE SOME SUGGESTIONS ALONG THOSE LINES AS PART OF OUR REVIEW AND DISCUSSION. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. YOU MENTIONED THE DISTANCE TO THE BUSH STATION AND THE DOWNTOWN STATION. HOW FAR FROM HERE TO THE NEW TWELFTH STREET STATION? DO WE KNOW THAT INFORMATION? >> IT WOULD BE CLOSER THAN THE DOWNTOWN PLANO STATION. >> Chair Downs: BUTOT AS CLOSE AS BUSH? >> NO. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. OKAY. I THINK THAT'S PRETTY MUCH ALL MY QUESTIONS. ANYONE ELSE FOR STAFF? COMMISSIONER RATLIFF. >> Ratliff: KIND OF FOLLOWING UP ON THE SAME LINE OF THOUGHT -- >> Chair Downs: I NEED TO LOOK AT MY SCREEN. SORRY. >> Ratliff: THE PHASING SEEMS TO BE AN IMPORTANT QUESTION IN HERE BECAUSE OF THE MITIGATION ISSUE. IF THE PHASING WAS FLIPPED OVER WHERE YOU COULDN'T GET A BUILDING PERMIT FOR THE MULTIFAMILY OR THE RESIDENTIAL UNTIL AFTER THE COMMERCIAL WAS BUILT, BECAUSE IT'S A BIG PART OF THE MITIGATION, HOW WOULD THAT AFFECT STAFF RECOMMENDATION? >> THAT WOULD BE FAVORABLE. THAT WOULD BE A SIGNIFICANT IMPACT ON STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION BECAUSE ONE OF OUR MAJOR CONCERNS IS THAT MITIGATION AND YOU STILL GOT SOME -- IT'S STILL NOT GOING TO MEET THE BALANCE OF USES IN THE RGM POLICY BUT IT WOULD, AGAIN,E ANOTHER ISS THAT WE WOULD NOT BE ADDRESSING IN OUR STAFF REPORT. >> Ratliff: OKAY. AND THEN DOES THE CONSTRUCTION ON TRACT 2, THE HOTEL -- I'M SUFFICIENTLY VAGUE ON HOW, IF AT ALL, THAT AFFECTS THE MITIGATION. >> MR. HILL IS ON ZOOM. IF HE IS AVAILABLE, HE MAY KNOW MORE ABOUT THIS, BUT I DON'T RECOLLECT THAT BEING AN ISSUE IN THE MITIGATION, BUT I WOULD WAN TOOOK MORE CLOSELY AT THE REPORT. >> Ratliff: YEAH, RESULTING IN MY QUESTION OF WHETHER OR NOT THE CONSTRUCTION ON TRACT 2, THE PHASING OF THAT NEEDS TO BE CONSIDERED AS PART OF THIS PHASING PLAN, OR IF THAT'S JUST KIND OF A STANDALONE PARCEL AS FAR AS THIS CASE IS CONCERNED. IT SEEMED TO BE KIND OF A STANDALONE PARCEL. >> PERHAPS THE APPLICANT COULD ADDRESS THAT MORE CLOSELY. THE HOTEL IS SHOWN BUT IT'S NOT OUTLINED IN THERE AS PART OFT 100% CLEAR. >> Ratliff: THANK YOU. >> Chair Downs: I WOULD LIKE TO APOLOGIZE TO THE COMMISSION. WE GOT THE SPEAKERS LINED UP HERE AND I JUST COMPLETELY IGNORED IT, SO MY APOLOGIES. THE FASTEST ONE ON THE DRAW WAS COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF SO WE'LL LET YOU -- YEP. THERE YOU GO. >> Brounoff: TOO MANY BUTTONS. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. I HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS. IS THE PROPOSAL INCLUDING ANY NON-RESIDENTIAL USES, OTHER THAN THE HOTEL AND PARKING GARAGES? >> AND OFFICE. >> Brounoff: DO WE KNOW WHAT KIND OF OFFICE? >> GENERAL ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICE. >> Brounoff: OKAY. TO YOUR KNOWLEDGE, IS THERE ANY FORM OF INTERACTION OR COMPLEMENTARY USES BETWEEN THE RESIDENTIAL PORTION OF THE PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT AND THE NON-RESIDENTIAL PORTION? DOES ANY -- DOES ONE OR THE OTHER, DO THEY INTERACT WITH EACH OTHER IN ANY WAY SUCH AS, YOU KNOW, RETAIL SERVING THE RESIDENTL AA OR RECREATIONAL THINGS THAT THE -- THAT WOULD SERVE THE RESIDENTIAL AREA? >> SURE. THE APPLICANT IS HERE AND I BELIEVE THEY CAN ANSWER THAT QUESTION. >> Brounoff: ALL RIGHT. WE'LL HOLD THAT THOUGHT THEN. HAS THE STAFF IDENTIFIED ANY ENVIRONMENTAL MITIGATION ISSUES INVOLVING AIR QUALITY? WE TALKED ABOUT NOISE A LOT BUT I'M WONDERING ABOUT AIR QUALITY. ARE THERE ANY AIR QUALITY ISSUES? >> SURE. THE EHA DOES ENCOMPASS NOISE AND POLLUTION CONCERNS AND SO THAT'S WHY WE ALSO WOULD LIKE TO -- WE DISFAVOR RESIDENTIAL BEING WITHIN THE EHA-1 DISTRICT BECAUSE WE DO HAVE IMPACTS ON NOISE AND POLLUTION. AND WE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THAT. >> Brounoff: IS THERE ANY DOCUMENTATION OF A POTENTIAL POLLUTION PROBLEM? THAT'S WHAT I MEAN. >> THE APPLICANT DID PROVIDE AN EHA STUDY AND I BELIEVE IT WAS IN THE PACKET. I DID NOT READ THE DOCUMENT AND I BELIEVE THE APPLICANT COULD ALSO SPEAK TO THAT IF POLLUTION WAS INCLUDED IN THAT. >> Brounoff: CHRISTINE, MAYBE YOU CAN ANSWER THIS. DOES THE STAFF HAVE ANY CONCERNS ABOUT AIR QUALITY? >> CERTAINLY. I THINK DUE TO THE PROXIMITY, WHAT WE WOULD BE LOOKING FOR IS FOR THEM TO MEET THE STANDARDS WITHIN THE ZONING ORDINANCE. SO MOVING THE INTAKES AWAY FROM THE HIGHWAYS AND THINGS ALONG THOSE LINES. I THINK THAT WAS NOTED IN THE COMMENTS ON THE CONCEPT PLAN. AND SO AS LONG AS THOSE STANDARDS WERE MET, I THINK THAT WE WOULD BE COMFORTABLE THAT THEY WERE DOING ADEQUATE MITIGATION FROM AN AIR QUALITY PERSPECTIVE. I JUST WANT TO POINT OUT THAT THIS IS NOT ORIGINALLY MS. COPELAND'S ZONING CASE. FOR EVERYONE'S KNOWLEDGE, SHE IS STEPPING IN TO ASSIST BECAUSE OF OTHER PEOPLE BEING UNAVAILABLE. THANK YOU. >> Brounoff: THANK YOU,& MR. CHAIRMAN. >> Chair Downs: NEXT UP IS COMMISSIONER BRONSKY. >> Bronsky: THANK YOU FOR FILLING IN. I DO HAVE A WHOLE SERIES OF QUESTIONS. I WANT TO START WITH A BLOCK PATTERN. ON PAGE 3 OF THE LETTER PROVIDED BY THE DEVELOPER, BAY WEST, THEY HAVE A GREEN CHECK MARK NEXT TO BLOCK PATTERN AND STREETSCAPE. HOWEVER, ON THE STAFF REPORT -- LET ME SEE IF I CAN SORRY FOR THE DELAY HERE. ON THE STAFF REPORT, PAGE 10 AT THE TOP IT SAYS THE URBAN STREET STRUCTURE DOES NOT MEET THE TYPICAL URBAN BLOCK PATTERN SIZE OR PROVIDE CONNECTIVITY TO SUPPORTING REDEVELOPMENT OF ADJACENT PARCELS. CAN YOU GO INTO THAT A LITTLE BIT MORE? >> MR. BELL CAN HELP WITH THAT ANSWER. >> SURE. THIS IS ACTUALLY EXPRESSWAY CORRIDOR FUTURE LAND USE CATEGORY, WHICH CALLS FOR ACTUALLY WIDE SETBACKS. AND SO IN THIS CASE IT'S MOSTLY ALONG THE EXPRESSWAY THAT THIS IS INTENDED. SO ALTHOUGH THEY ARE PROPOSING AS MORE OF A MIXED-USE URBAN ENVIRONMENT, AND SO THEY'RE BREAKING UP THE BLOCKS WITH THIS INTERNAL STREET AND THE SETBACKS ARE SHORT BECAUSE OF THAT INTERNAL SYSTEM, BUT THAT'S NOT REALLY IN KEEPING EXACTLY WITH WHAT'S IMAGINED GENERALLY ALONG THE CORRIDOR WHERE WE HAVE WIDER BLOCKS AND DEEPER SETBACKS. >> Bronsky: DOES IT IN FACT CAUSE CONNECTIVITY ISSUES WITH ADJACENT PARCELS THEN? >> I DON'T BELIEVE IT CAUSES CONNECTIVITY ISSUES. I BELIEVE IT'S JUST A DIFFERENT FORM THAN IS GENERALLY ENVISIONED FOR THIS CORRIDOR. >> Bronsky: OKAY. SECOND QUESTION WAS AROUND THE SOUND MITIGATION. AND IN THE REPORT IT MENTIONED THE CONCERN ABOUT THE HEIGHT OF THE BUILDINGS AS IT RELATES TO THE SOUND AND THE ABILITY TO RORD THOSE CORRECTLY. CAN YOU GO INTO ANY MORE DETAIL ABOUT THAT? >> I DON'T THINK I CAN BUT IS MR. HILL AVAILABLE TO -- I SAW HIM BUT THEN HE LEFT. >> I'M HERE. CAN YOU ALL HEAR ME? >> Chair Downs: YES. >> SO THE NOISE STUDY DOES PROVIDE INFORMATION ON MULTIPLE FLOORS OF THE MID-RISE RESIDENTIAL BUILDINGS. HOWEVER, IT ONLY PROVIDES DATA FOR THE FIRST FLOOR OF SINGLE-FAMILY BUILDINGS. I THINK THAT WAS A CHALLENGE THAT WE NOTED IN OUR STAFF REPORT, BASED UPON HOW THE MEASUREMENTS WERE MADE OF THE STUDY. IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE ASKING? >> Bronsky: YES. SO YOU CONCLUDED THAT THE ZONING REQUEST IS FOUND INCONSISTENT WITH THE EHA SITE ANALYSIS AND IS NOT IN CONFORMANCE WITH THE EXPRESSWAY CORRIDOR ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH MAP FOR THAT REASON? >> NO, THERE'S MULTIPLE REASONS. I THINK FIRST AND MOST SIGNIFICANTLY IS THAT THE STUDY, IT IDENTIFIES THE HOTEL, THE OFFICE, AND THE PARKING GARAGE AS MITIGATING DEVELOPMENTS. HOWEVER, AS MS. COPELAND NOTED, THOSE DEVELOPMENTS ARE NOT REQUIRED TO BE CONSTRUCTED, SO THE NOISE STUDY, ALTHOUGH SHOWS THE LEVELS BASED UPON THOSE STRUCTURES, THEY MAY NEVER BE BUILT. SO THAT'S A CHALLENGE THAT WE NOTED. SECONDLY, THERE ARE DEVELOPMENT THAT EXCEED THE MAXIMUM 65-DECIBEL LEVEL THAT'S RECOMMENDED. SO THAT'S KIND OF NUMBER TWO. AND THEN NUMBER THREE IS THAT WE DID NOT RECEIVE ALL NOISE LEVEL READINGS FOR THE SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES, AND I BELIEVE THAT THE APPLICANT PROVIDED A RESPONSE LETTER, WHICH MENTIONS WHY THAT WAS DONE. BUT THAT IS ANOTHER ISSUE THAT WE WANTED TO NOTE. >> Bronsky: YEAH, AND I THINK IN THE APPLICANT'S LETTEROR THE NOISE STUDY ITSELF ACTUALLY SAYS THE RESULTS OF THE ANALYSIS INDICATE THAT FUTURE NOISE LEVELS AT THE BUILDING PLAN FOR SENSITIVE LAND USE AT RESIDENTIAL WILL NOT EXCEED 75, WHEN OUR REQUIREMENTS ARE 65. AND IT FINISHES THE LEVEL IDENTIFIED BY THE CITY OF PLANO AS UNACCEPTABLE FOR THE RESIDENTIAL USE. >> CORRECT THERE'S REALLY TWO EHA AREAS. THE EHA-2, WHICH IS THE MORE EXTREME AREA CLOSEST TO THE EXPRESSWAYS, THAT REALLY SAYS RESIDENTIAL IS INAPPROPRIATE AND THOSE AREAS ARE TYPICALLY 75 DECIBELS AND HIGHER. AREAS WITHIN EHA-1 ARE POTENTIAL AREAS FOR RESIDENTIAL WITH APPROPRIATE MITIGATION. HOWEVER, THE POLICY, AS YOU NOTED CORRECTLY, STATES THAT REALLY RESIDENTIAL UNITS AND BUILDINGS SHOULD NOT BE PLACED IN AREAS TT AR ABOVE 65 DECIBELS. AND THERE ARE PORTIONS OF THESE HERE THAT ARE ABOVE THAT. SO AS THE APPLICANT HAS PRESENTED OR WILL PRESENT, THEY WILL BE MITIGATING INTERIOR NOISE THROUGH CONSTRUCTION AND THE EXTERIOR WILL STILL BE IMPACTED. ESPECIALLY IF THOSE ADJACENT BUILDINGS AND THE HOTEL ARE NOT CONSTRUCTED. >> Bronsky: OKAY. ON PAGE 11 OF THE STAFF REPORT, THE STAFF MAKES THE COMMENT, ADDITIONALLY THE PROPOSAL DOES NOT MEET OTHER RECOMMENDATIONS FOR MIXED-USE REVELOPMENT GROWTHATED IN THE MANAGEMENT OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN. CAN YOU ELABORATE ON THAT AT ALL? >> HAPPY TO TAKE THAT ONE. THERE ARE TWO SPECIFIC ACTIONS IN THE REDEVELOPMENT AND GROWTH MANAGEMENT ACTION 5. A IS THAT THERE SHOULD BE A PROPORTION OF NO MORE THAN 58% RESIDENTIAL TO NON-RESIDENTIAL. IT IS NOT MEETING THAT ACTION. AS WELL AS THERE'S A PHASING REQUIREMENT SO THAT NON-RESIDENTIAL DOESN'T GET UP TOO FAR AHEAD OF THE RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENTS. AND THAT IS ALSO NOT BEING MET BECAUSE, AGAIN, AS MR. HILL MENTIONED, THERE'S NO COMMITMENT TO THAT NON-RESIDENTIAL PIECE. >> Bronsky: AND THAT CONTINUES ON TO THE RGM8 AS WELL CORRECT? >> CORRECT. >> RGM-8 ENCOURAGES THAT MULTIFAMILY BE LIMITED TO AREAS WHERE IT MEETS A CITY HOUSING GOAL, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, OR SPECIAL HOUSING NEED. WE FOUND IT DID NOT MEET THOSE GOALS BECAUSE, AGAIN, WHEN YOU PAIR IT ALL TOGETHER WITH THE OTHER ISSUES, IT'S NOT PROVIDING A SITE DEVELOPMENT THAT IS CONDUCIVE TO SINGLE-FAMILY DEVELOPMENT. >> Bronsky: OKAY. ON PAGE 14 OF THE STAFF REPORT, WHEN IT TALKS ABOUT WASTEWATER DEMAND, IT LEAVES OPEN THE POSSIBILITY THAT THE PROPOSED LAND USE MAY PROVIDE ADDITIONAL -- MAY PROMPT ADDITIONAL OFF-SITE WATER/WASTEWATER IMPROVEMENTS TO MEET THE DEMAND FLOWS REQUIRED. IS THAT GOING TO BE A SIGNIFICANT EXPENSE TO THE CITY OR WOULD THAT BE OFFSET BY THE DEVELOPMENT AT ALL, THE NEED FOR THAT TO HAPPEN? >> I BELIEVE THAT MR. HILL WORKED WITH THE ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT ON THIS LANGUAGE, SO DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD? >> I DID. NO, I WISH I HAD ADDITIONAL DETAILS FOR YOU. THE ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT IS LOOKING AT THIS SITUATION. THEY DIDN'TAVE ANY FURTHER INFORMATION, WHETHER IT WOULD BE IMPROVEMENTS -- WHAT THE IMPROVEMENTS WOULD BE, WHO WOULD BEAR THOSE COSTS. SO I DON'T HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL INFORMATION UNFORTUNATELY. >> Bronsky: OKAY. NEXT ON PAGE 16 OF THE STAFF REPORT, THE PUBLIC SAFETY RESPONSE TIME, YOU MAKE THE STATEMENT RESIDENTIAL UNITS IN THIS AREA WILL INCREASE EMS AND FIRE CALLS FOR SERVICE AND MAY IMPACT FUTURE STAFFING LEVELS AS WELL. ANY IDEAS ON THAT EITHER, ON WHAT THAT IMPACT? >> NO DETAILS ON THIS. THIS IS A TYPICAL STATEMENT THAT YOU WILL SEE IN OUR RESIDENTIAL ZONING CASES. THIS WAS PLACED IN OUR RESIDENTIAL REPORTS AT THE REQUEST OF THE FIRE DEPARTMENT. >> Bronsky: OKAY. THANK YOU. SORRY. I'LL SCROLL THROUGH. OH, AND ON PAGE 19 WHERE IT TALKS ABOUT ACCESS TO THE DART. FUTURE RESIDENTS WOULD BE REQUIRED TO WALK ALONG PLANO PARKWAY TO ACCESS A TRAIL. AND THEN IT TALKS ABOUT TO CROSSING OVER 190, CROSSING THE THREE-LANE EASTBOUND SERVICE ROAD INFO IN ORDER TO ACCESS. IS THAT THE CORRECT MAP? >> YES. WALKING EAST ALONG THE ACCESS ROAD AND THEN WALKING UNDER 190. AND THEN THE DART STATION IS JUST ON THE BORDER OF THE CITY LIMIT LINE. >> Bnsky:KAY. ALL RIGHT. SO I JUST WANT TO SAY IN CLOSING, THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR ALL OF YOUR -- ANSWERING ALL OF MY QUESTIONS. THE REFERENCE TO THE REDEVELOPMENT POLICIES A AND B WERE VERY CLOSE TO ME. I THINK THE PHASING IS VERY IMPORTANT. WHEN I SAT AS VICE CHAIR FOR THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, I FELT THAT WE WERE -- IT WAS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WAS LEAST CONTROVERSIAL WERE THE 50% AND THE PHASING IN RGM-B. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. YOU GUYS DID A VERY THOROUGH JOB ON ALL OF THIS AND YOUR QUESTIONS. THANK YOU. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER CARY. >> Cary: THANK YOU. GOOD JOB OF PINCH-HITTING SO FAR. IMPRESSIVE. COMMISSIONER BRONSKY ASKED A COUPLE OF MY QUESTIONS I WAS GOING TO ASK SO I HAVE JUST A COUPLE OF SIMPLE THINGS. SO WITH THIS PROPOSAL, IS THERE A LIMIT TO EITHER THE NUMBER OF FLOORS OR THE NUMBER OF UNITS THAT CAN BE BUILT HERE? OR IS IT NOT LIMITED? >> SURE. THE MID-RISE RESIDENTIAL NEEDS TO BE AT LEAST FIVE. AND THEN INR COMMERCIAL ZONING DISTRICT IT SAYS MAXIMUM OF 20. >> Cary: SO WHILE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT FIVE STORIES I THINK TODAY, IT COULD BE 20. IS THAT ACCURATE? >> I BELIEVE THERE'S A STANDARD IN THE PLAN DEVELOPMENT THAT LIMITS IT TO FIVE STORIES FOR THE MULTIFAMILY AND THREE FOR THE RESIDENTIAL. I WILL VERIFY. >> YES. THAT'S CORRECT. >> Cary: OKAY. SO IT IS LIMITED THEN. OKAY. THANK YOU. WE TALK ABOUT NO RESIDENTIAL IN EH-2 AND PROBABLY THAT'S TRUE BUT SOME OF THE RESIDENTIAL IS GOING TO BE VERY, VERY CLOSE TO THAT EH-2 LINE, I THINK. AM I WRONG ABOUT THAT? >> THAT'S CORRECT. I CAN GO BACK TO WHERE WE SEE THE MAP OF THE EHA-1 AND THE EHA-2. AND THEN WHEN YOU OVERLAY THE PROPOSED CONCEPT PLAN WITH THE EHA-1 AND 2, YOU CAN SEE IT IS VERY CLOSE. >> Cary: I THINK THAT STATEMENT IS ACCURATE BUT I DO THINK IT'S VERY CLOSE. AND PROBABLY MY NEXT TWO QUESTIONS ARE GOING TO BE BETTER SERVED BY THE APPLICANT, BUT MAYBE YOU KNOW, BECAUSE YOU SEEM TO KNOW A LOT HERE ABOUT THIS ALREADY. BUT TIME TO COMPLETE PHASE 1. ANY ESTIMATES THAT THEY HAVE ABOUT THIS OR NOT? >> THAT WOULD BE A GREAT QUESTION FOR THE APPLICANT. >> Cary: THANK YOU. AND FINALLY, I THINK COMMISSIONER BRONSKY ALREADY KNOW WHAT THE COMMERCIAL ASPECTS OF THIS MIGHT LOOK LIKE. BECAUSE I THINK, BASED ON THEIR PLAN, THERE'S NO CLUE TO WHAT THAT MIGHT BE AT ALL. IS THAT RIGHT? I MN, TRE'S OFFICE AND THERE'S A HOTEL, MAYBE, BUT THERE'S NOTHING -- FROM WHAT I COULD TELL IN READING THIS DOCUMENT THAT REALLY WOULD LAY THAT OUT TOO MUCH. AM I MISSING IT? >> FROM WITHIN THE MID-RISE RESIDENTIAL AS YOU COULD HAVE RESIDENTIAL AND NON-RESIDENTIAL MIXED. IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE REFERRING TO? >> Cary: I JUST DON'T SEE ANY COMMERCIAL THAT'S REALLY LAID OUT YET. MAYBE I'M JUST MISSING IT. IT'S A VOLUMINOUS DOCUMENT SO I VERY LIKELY MAY HAVE MISSED IT. >> RIGHT. THE REQUEST DOES STATE JUST MID-RISE RESIDENTIAL, SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENTS ATTACHED, OFFICE, AND HOTEL, OPEN SPACE, AND PARKING GARAGE. >> Cary: SO IT'S FAIRLY VAGUE, IN MY OPINION. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER OLLEY. >> Olley: TWO QUESTIONS. I THINK MOST OF THE QUESTIONS HAVE BEEN ASKED. IT SOUNDS LIKE, IF THE APPLICANT ADDRESSES RGM5B FROM A PHASING PERSPECTIVE, IT WILL GO A LONG WAY TO MITIGATING THE ISSUES ON THE EHA WAS THAT RELAYED BACK TO THE APPLICANT TO, I DON'T KNOW, MAYBE TO COME UP WITH A DIFFERENT PHASING COMMITMENT BEFORE BRINGING THIS FORWARD? >> SURE. MR. HILL, WAS THERE ANY CONVERSATIONS ABOUT FLIPPING THE PHASING OR IS THE APPLICANT ABLE TO ANSWER THEIR PHASING PLAN? >> SURE. YEAH, WE HAVE A LOT OF CONVERSATION AROUND THE PHASING AND THE COMMITMENTS. THE APPLICANT IS FAMILIAR WITH I THINK THE FINDINGS POLICIES AND RGM POLICIES. STAFF DID ASK SEVERAL TIMES FOR A STRONGER COMMITMENT TO COMMERCIAL, BUT THE APPLICANT PRESENTED WHAT'S BEFORE YOU TODAY. >> Olley: SECOND QUESTION. ON THE DIVERSITY OF HOUSING FOR -- I BELIEVE THAT'S RGM-8, WHAT VIOLATES THAT? IS IT TOO MUCH MULTIFAMILY OR TOO MUCH SINGLE-FAMILY OR NOT ENOUGH, PERIOD, IN THE CONCEPT PLAN? >> I'LL LET MR. BELL ANSWER THAT ONE. >> FOR RGM-8 IT'S THAT IT NEEDS TO MEET A HOUSING GOAL BUT ALSO NEEDS TO COMPLY WITH THE RECOMMENDATIONS OF THE FUTURE LAND USE DASHBOARDS. AND IN THIS CASE, BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT COMPLYING WITH THE PHASING AND THE MIX OF USES FROM A BALANCE OF RESIDENTIAL/NON-RESIDENTIAL, WE INTERPRET THAT AS NOT MEETING THE FUTURE LAND USE DASHBOARD. SO IT'S NOT MEETING THE FULL INTENTION OF THAT ACTION. >> Olley: SO IT DOESN'T EVEN THE MINIMUM THRESHOLD BEFORE WE START THINKING OF SINGLE-FAMILY ATTACHED VERSUS SINGLE-FAMILY -- >> CORRECT. I WANT TO BE CLEAR THAT IT IS MEETING THE MIX OF USES, GENERALLY SPEAKING, FOR TH WHOLE AREA, THE WHOLE 75 CORRIDOR. IT IS COMPLIANT WITH THAT. BUT ON AN INDIVIDUAL SITE BASIS IT IS NOT MEETING THE MIX OF USES FROM A RESIDENTIAL/NON-RESIDENTIAL STANDPOINT FROM A MIX OF DEVELOPMENTS. >> Olley: ONE LAST QUESTION. FOR THAT SIDE IS THERE A PERCENTAGE -- I MAY HAVE MISSED IT -- A PREFERRED 75% COMMERCIAL VERSUS 25% RESIDENTIAL? >> YES. SO RGM-5A RECOMMNDS NO MORE THAN 50% RESIDENTIAL FOR MIXED-USE DEVELOPMENT. THAT'S BASED ON SQUARE OOTAGE. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER RATLIFF? DID YOU TURN YOUR -- YOU WERE UP THERE. GO AHEAD. YOU TURNED IT OFF. >> Ratliff: I JUST WANT TO -- THERE WAS A QUESTION ASKED BY COMMISSIONER CARY AND COMMISSIONER OLLEY ABOUT THE DEVELOPERS' POSITION ON SOME OF THE COMMERCIAL. AND I THINK IN PAGES 7 AND 8 OF THE LETTER THAT THEY SENT, THEY MAKE IT PRETTY CLEAR WHAT THE POSITION IS RELATED TO THE FLIPPING OF THE PHASING. THE PLANO SUBMARKET WHERE THE PROPERTY IS LOCATED HAS A GLUT OF COMMERCIAL SPACE AVAILABLE AND IS IN AN UNDERPERFORMING COMMERCIAL AREA. AND THEN IT GOES ON TO PART B. DUE TO THE UNDERPERFORMING NATURE OF THE COMMERCIAL SPACE DEND FOR NEW COMMERCIALNO SQUARE FOOTAGE IN THIS AREA TODAY. I JUST WANTED TO POINT OUT THAT THERE WAS IN FACT AN ANSWER, IT JUST WASN'T LISTED IN THE STAFF REPORT. >> Chair Downs: I DON'T SEE ANY MORE BUTTONS LIT UP, SO DOES THAT MEAN EVERYONE HAS THEIR QUESTIONS ANSWERED FROM STAFF? OKAY. THANK YOU. NICE JOB PINCH-HITTING THERE. THANK YOU SO MUCH. OKAY. I WILL OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING AND I'M ASSUMING THE APPLICANT WANTS TO ADDRESS US. >> I HAVE FOUR INDIVIDUALS REGISTERED AS APPLICANT. I WILL CALL THEM ALL. I'M SORRY. YOUR NAME? BRIAN WOLFF AND THEN I HAVE BRIAN MOORE, BILL DAHLSTROM, AND DYLAN IS AVAILABLE TO ANSWER QUESTIONS. >> GOOD EVENING, COMMISSIONERS. MY NAME IS BRIAN WOLFF. I'M A PARTNER AT BAY WEST DEVELOPMENT AND HEAD OF OUR DALLAS OFFICE. REAL EXCITED TO BE HERE TONIGHT AND SHOW YOU GUYS OUR PLANS TO REVITALIZE THIS SITE. WE HAVE BEEN WORKING ON THIS PLAN FOR OVER THREE YEARS. IT'S BEEN A LONG ROAD. WE'VE BEEN GOVERNED BY THREE DIFFERENT SEPARATE COMPREHENSIVE PLANS, SO IT'S BEEN A BIT OF A MOVING TARGET FOR US. BUT WE THINK THIS DEVELOPMENT NOW BEST REPRESENTS THE NEEDS OF THIS PARTICULAR NEIGHBORHOOD AND COMPLETES THE EXISTING MIXED-USE TOD NATURE OF THE AREA. I'M GOING TO GO THROUGH A LOT OF INFORMATION QUICKLY IN THIS PRESENTATION, SO PLEASE BEAR WITH ME. I HAVE OR ARCHITECT, CIVIL ENGINEER, AND LAND USE ATTORNEY AND WE WOULD BE HAPPY TO EXPAND FURTHER IN THE Q&A SECTION. I WANT TO START OUT TONIGHT WITH OUR VISION FOR THE SITE. HERE TO TRANSFORM ANRTUNITY UNDERPERFORMING COMMERCIAL AREA INTO A VIBRANT ECONOMIC DISTRICT IN EAST PLANO THAT BRINGS THE COMMUNITY TOGETHER. OUR GOAL WITH THIS PROJECT IS TO SIMPLY FILL IN THE GAP OF THIS ALREADY MIXED-USE NEIGHBORHOOD AND APPLY THE GUIDING PRINCIPLES, POLICIES, AND PRIORITIES OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN TO GUIDE THAT DEVELOPMENT. WE WANTED TO PROMOTE A SENSE OF PLACE BY INCORPORATING A LIVELY, USABLE OPEN SPACE CENTERED AROUND PUBLICLY-ACCESSIBLE PLAZA GREEN THAT'S 1.4 ACRES THAT BECOMES THE HEART OF THIS NEIGHBORHOOD. WE WANTED TO USE THE HIGHEST DESIGN STANDARDS I THE CITY TO PROVIDE TIMELESS DESIGN AND START ATTRACTING THE HIGH-WAGE EMPLOYMENT. WE WANTED TO PROVIDE MULTIPLE TYPES OF HOUSING PRODUCT, WHICH WILL ALLOW CURRENT AND FUTURE RESIDENTS IN PLANO THE ABILITY TO CHANGE HOUSING TYPES AS THEY ENTER NEW STAGES OF LIFE. WE WANT TO UTILIZE OUR CLOSE PROXIMITY TO THE DART STATION TO CREATE THIS VIBRANT DISTRICT. FINALLY, IT WAS IMPORTANT FOR US TO DEVELOP THIS PLAN IN CONJUNCTION WITH THE SUPPORT OF OUR NEIGHBORS. I THOUGHT IT WOULD BE HELPFUL TO START BY SHONG WHAT TH EXISNG PPERTLOOKS LIKE TODAY. THIS IS A VIEW OF THE PROPERTY FROM PLANO PARKWAY. THIS IS AN AERIAL OF THE PROPERTY LOOKING NORTH. THIS IS AN AERIAL OF THE PROPERTY LOOKING SOUTH. YOU CAN SEE HERE THE MIXED-USE TOD CITY LINE DEVELOPMENT WITH STATE FARM, WHOLE FOODS, AND THE DART STATION ACROSS THE HIGHWAY. WHEN WE FIRST STARTING LOOKING AT THIS PROPERTY OUR THESIS WAS WHY CAN'T WE DRAFT OFF THE SUCCESS OF CITY LINE AND BRING THE SAME VIBRANCY TO EAST PLANO? THEY PROVED OUT THE CONCEPT OF ECONOMIC SUCCESS, IF YOU BRING A CONCENTRATION OF PEOPLE AROUND THE DART STATION. HERE'S A MAP TO GIVE CONTEXT TO WHERE WE SIT IN THE LARGER DART RAIL SYSTEM. OUR PROPERTY IS LESS THAN A HALF MILE FROM THE DART STATION. IT'S ABOUT AN EIGHT-MINUTE WALK TO THE PLATFORM. WE SEE RESIDENTS OF OUR PROPERTY HOPPING ON THE TRAIN TO GRAB DINNER AND DRINKS IN DOWNTOWN PLANO OR VISITORS AND CUSTOMERS WITH A HOTEL AND OFFICE HAVING EASY ACCESS TO DFW, ONCE THE SILVER LINE IS COMPLETE. WHEN WE STARTED TO THINK ABOUT SITE PLANNING, IT WAS IMPORTANT TO THINK ABOUT NEIGHBORING USES. WE HAVE TWO LARGE OFFICE BUILDINGS, AN APARTMENT COMPLEX, AND FLEX OFFICE ACROSS PLANO PARKWAY. WHAT WE WANTED TO DO WAS FILL IN THIS GAP IN THE CENTER OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD THAT COMPLETED THIS NEIGHBORHOOD AND BROUGHT A CENTERPIECE GREEN SPACE THAT IS CURRENTLY LACKING IN THE AREA. THIS IS WHAT WE'VE COME UP WITH. 124,000 SQUARE FOOT OFFICE BUILDING AND 100 KEY HOTEL ON THE SOUTHERN END OF THE SITE CLOSEST TO THE HIGHWAY. 1.4-ACRE PLAZA GREEN, 33 TOWNHOMES SITUATED ALONG THE MAIN STREET AND FLANKING THAT PLAZA GREEN. AND TWO MID-RISE RESIDENTIAL BUILDINGS WITH ABOUT 250 UNITS EACH CLOSEST TO PLANO PARKWAY. THE FIRST PHASE OF THIS PROJECT WOULD BE THE CENTER OF THE PROPERTY. WE WOULD BUILD THE PLAZA GREEN, TOWNHOMES, AND THE APARTMENTS ON THE PLANO PARKWAY AND EXECUTIVE DRIVE CORNER FIRST IN ORDER TO CREATE A SENSE OF PLACE THAT WILL DRIVE DEMAND THROUGH THIS OTHERWISE UNDERPERFORMING AREA. AND WE WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THE SECOND PHASE OF RESIDENTIAL UIL WE PULLED PERMITS AND MOVED FORWARD WITH EITHER THE HOTEL OR THE OFFICE BUILDING, WHICHEVER DEMAND RETURNS FIRST. THIS IS A VISUAL OF WHAT IT WOULD LOOK LIKE FROM PLANO PARKWAY LOOKING DOWN THE MAIN STREET THROUGH THE CENTER OF THE SITE. YOU HAVE THE APARTMENTS ON THE LEFT, THE TOWNHOMES IN THE CENTER, AND AN OFFICE BUILDING IN THE DISTANCE. THIS IS THE OFFICE BUILDING. THE DESIGN IS MEANT TO SPILL OUT INTO THE PLAZA GREEN TO ACTIVATE THAT SPACE, NOT ONLY AT NIGHT FOR THE RESIDENTS BUT ALSO THROUGHOUT THE DAY. ONE OF THE KEYOMPONENTS OF THIS PROJECT WAS TO FOCUS ON THE QUALITY OF THE ENTIRE DEVELOPMENT. A LOT OF PEOPLE TALK ABOUT CLASS A PROPERTIES BUT WE WANTED TO CODIFY THAT WITH OUR DESIGN STANDARDS. SO WE ASKED STAFF WHAT THE HIGHEST DESIGN STANDARDS IN PLANO ARE AND WE INCORPORATED THOSE INTO OUR PD STIPULATIONS. WE SET STANDARDS FOR BUILDING MATERIALS, MAXIMIZED THE NUMBER OF SAFE OUTDOOR SPACES. WE SET FACADE STANDARDS FOR OUR PARKING STRUCTURES, WHICH CAN OFTENTIMES BE AN EYESORE, AND WE RESTRICTED THE FENCING. WE INCREASED THE SETBACKS FOR NOISE AND AIR QUALITY. WE MADE LARGER LANDSCAPE EDGES, ESPECIALLY COMPARED TO OUR NEIGHBORS. FINALLY, WE BUILT THIS INCREDIBLE AMOUNT OF OPEN SPACE ANCHORED BY THE 1.4-ACRE PLAZA GREEN WHICH WILL BE SET BACK FROM HIGHWAYS AND BUILT IMMEDIATELY. WHY DID WE DO ALL THIS? WE NEED TO CREATE DEMAND IN THIS LOCATION BY BRINGING VIBRANCY AND DELIVERING TO THE MARKET SOMETHING UNIQUE THAT CANNOT BE FOUND ELSEWHERE. HOW DO YOU DO THAT? ONE, EXCEPTIONAL DESIGN. TWO, A CONCENTRATION OF PEOPLE. AND, THREE, A UNIQUE AMENITY. THIS IS HOW WE ARE GOING TO BUILD ECONOMIC DEMAND FOR THIS ENTIRE NEIGHBORHOOD. AS FAR AS HOUSING IS CONCERNED, I KNOW STAFF MENTIONED THEY REPORT THEY DO NOT THINK THE AREA IN PLANO HAS ENOUGH DEMAND FOR ADDITIONAL MULTIFAMILY. THEY REFERENCED A REPORT DONE FIVE YEARS AGO IN 2018. THE MORE RECENT COMPREHENSIVE PLAN ACTUALLY HAS A DASHBOARD THAT CALCULATES THE POTENTIAL NEW HOUSING UNITS. OUR AREA SHOWS 829 MULTIFAMILY UNITS AND 87 NEW ATTACHED OR DETACHED SINGLE-FAMILY UNITS AVAILABLE. ADDITIONALLY, WE COMMISSIONED OUR OWN STUDY DONE BY THE CONQUER GROUP WHEN WE PURCHASED THE PROPERTY, WHICH WE SHARED WITH STAFF. THAT REPORT STED THAT OUR COMPETITIVE MARKET AREA TAKING INTO ACCOUNT THE COLLIN CREEK MALL REDEVELOPMENT WOULD BE UNDERSUPPLIED BY OVER 3400 UNITS OVER THE NEXT FIVE YEARS. THEY HAD ACTUALLY SUGGESTED 1,000-PLUS UNITS ON OUR SITE. AS PART OF THE REDESIGN PROCESS WE SPENT A LOT OF TIME TALKING TO THE COMMUNITY AND NEIGHBORS AND DOING A DEEP DIVE INTO THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN. ONE COMMON POINT THAT KEPT COMING UP IS THERE ARE ONLY REALLY TWO TYPES OF HOUSING PRODUCTS IN THE CITY OF PLANO: SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES AND APARTMENTS. SO IT WAS IMPORTANT FOR US IN THIS REDESIGN PROCESS TO PROVIDE A DIVERSITY OF HOUSING. WE DECREASED THE NUMBER OF APARTMENTS BY OVER 330 UNITS FROM OUR ORIGINAL APPLICATION AND ADDED THE SINGLE-FAMILY ATTACHED RESIDENCES. AS YOU CAN SEE IN THIS CHART, THIS ALLOWS THE HOUSING INVENTORY FROM THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN TO GO FROM OUT OF COMPLIANCE TODAY TO INTO COMPLIANCE WITH OUR PROJECT. BUT OUR ARCHITECTS WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT THE PLACEMAKING ENCOURAGED HUMAN INTERACTION AND COMMUNITY BUILDING. TO DO THIS OUR ARCHITECTURE SUGGESTED HAVING THE TOWNHOMES CENTERED AROUND THE MAIN STREET AND PLAZA GREEN TO MAKE SURE THE RESIDEN WERE THE HEART OF THE COMMUNITY. ALL MULTIFAMILY RESIDENTS HAVE TO PASS BY THE TOWNHOMES IN ORDER TO UTILIZE THE PLAZA GREEN. THIS PLACEMAKING DIRECTLY CONNECTS THE TWO USES IN ORDER TO BUILD COMMUNITY. AND THIS IS WHAT YOU GET. A BEAUTIFUL INTERACTION WITH THE TWO PRODUCT TYPES. THE TOWNHOMES ALSO DO A GREAT JOB AT PROVIDING A STEP BACK FROM THE PLAZA GREEN FROM THE MULTIFAMILY MASSING. BUT THE REAL CENTERPIECE FOR THE PROJECT IS OUR 1.4-ACRE PUBLICLY-ACCESSIBLE PLAZA GREEN. THIS AMENITY WILL ANCHOR THE ENTIRE NEIGHBORHOOD AND BE A PLACE FOR ALL TO ENJOY. WE WORKED WITH THE ADJACENT OFFICE OWNERS TO PROVIDE DIRECT CONNECTIONS TO THE PLAZA GREEN FOR THEIR TENANTS AND EMPLOYEES. WE WANTED THE SPACE TO BE ACTIVATED FOR THE ENTIRE DAY AND BE A GATHERING PLACE. AS I'M SURE YOU ALL KNOW, THIS SECTION OF EAST PLANO HAS VERY LIMITED GREEN SPACE. WE COMMITTED TO BUILDING THIS PLAZA GREEN IMMEDIATELY TO BRING A BOOST TO THE ENTIRE NEIGHBORHOOD. AND FROM A CITY PLANNING PERSPECTIVE WE ARE TRANSFORMING THIS CONCRETE SURFACE PARKING LOT TO THIS BEAUTIFUL OPEN SPACE NOW I WANTED TO QUICKLY ADDRESS SOMETHING THAT I BROUGHT UP IN A STAFF REPORT THAT CAUGHT US OFF GUARD WHEN WE RECEIVED IT OVER THE WEEKEND. WE HAVE BEEN WORKING FOR YEARS ON THIS PROJECT WITH A NOISE CONSULTANT TO ENSURE OUR DEVELOPMENT MET AND EXCEEDED THE EHA STANDARDS . WE ASKED THE CITY WHO THEY USED TO DEVELOP THE STANDARDS AND WE COULD USE THEM TO MAKE SURE WE STAYED COMPLIANT. WE HIRED THE SAME CONSULTANT THE CITY USED AND THEY HAVE BEEN ANALYZING ALL OF OUR VARIOUS ITERATIONS OVER THE YEARS AGO. HOPEFULLY YOU ALL RECEIVED A COPY OF THE LETTER THAT HMHH ISSUED AND PROVIDES SOME CLARIFICATION TO THEIR ANALYSIS AND SHOWS THAT IN THEIR EXPERT OPINION WE ARE IN CONFORMANCE WITH THE EHA MAP, EVEN WITH THE PROPOSED PHASING. IF YOU DON'T HAVE A COPY OF IT, I HAVE SOME EXTRA COPIES HERE. A COUPLE KEY TAKEAWAYS: ALL OF OUR RESIDENTIAL IS SITUATED OUT OF THE 75 DBA CONTOUR LINE AND NO UNITS EXCEED THAT 75 DBA THRESHOLD WITH OR WITHOUT THE COMMERCIAL STRUCTURES. WE SITUATED THOSE STRUCTURES WHERE THEY ARE TO PROVIDE ADDITIONAL PROTECTION AS GENERAL GOOD PRACTICE AND TY WILL PROVIDE ADDITIONAL NOISE MITIGATION OVER TIME. BUT SIMPLY ENSURING NO BALCONIES AND PATIOS ARE BUILT ON THE SOUTHERN FACADE OF THE BUILDINGS AND UTILIZING ENHANCED BUILDING MATERIAL TO KEEP INTERIOR NOISE LEVELS BELOW ACCEPTABLE LEVELS, PROVIDE APPROPRIATE MITIGATION AND PROTECTION FOR OUR RESIDENTS. WE HAVE HMMH AVAILABLE VIA ZOOM TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS SHOULD YOU HAVE ANY. NOW AS PART OF OUR REDESIGN WE WANTED TO MAKE SURE WE DID A DEEP DIVE INTO ALL APPLICABLE CITY POLICIES IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, THE FIRST IS THE DOWOWN VISION STRATEGY UPDATE OF 2019. THIS POLICY SPECIFICALLY ADDRESSES THE UNDERDEVELOPED PROPERTIES SOUTH OF PLANO PARKWAY WITHIN WALKING DISTANCE TO THE DART STATION AND MENTIONS THEY ARE SUITABLE FOR MIXED-USE DEVELOPMENT AND RESIDENTIAL USES WITH IMAGINATIVE DESIGN AND AMENITIES. THIS DEVELOPMENT PLAN ACHIEVES ALL THE APPLICABLE GUIDING PRINCIPLES OF THE DOWNTOWN PLAN. THEN WE GET INTO THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN 2021. OUR PROPERTY IS DESIGNATED IN THE UPDATED PLAN. THE EXPRESSWAY CORRIDOR HAS THREE MAIN PRIORITIES. THE REDEVELOPMENT OF THE 75 CORRIDOR, PROTECTING LAND USES IN THE EHA, AND UTILIZING RESIDENTIAL USES FOR THE REDEVELOPMENT OF UNDERPERFORMING COMMERCIAL AREAS. THIS PLAN ACHIEVES ALL THREE OF THOSE PRIORITIES. THE CHART -- THIS IS A CHART OF THE DESIRABLE CHARACTER-DEFINING ELEMENTS OF THE EXPRESSWAY CORRIDORS. WE ARE IN BELIEF WE ARE MEETING ALL THESE ELEMENTS. NOW WE GET INTO ALL THE APPLICABLE POLICY ACTIONS OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN. OUR PROJECT IS IN CONFORMANCE WITH 9 AND ONE-THIRD OFHE LICY ACTIONS. THE FIRST IS LAND USE POLICY ACTION 4, WHICH CALLS FOR REVITALIZATION OF UNDERPERFORMING RETAIL. THE NEXT IS LU5, WHICH ENSURES THE RESIDENTIAL ADJACENCY STANDARDS. THIRD IS THE TOD POLICY ACTION 5 WHICH ENCOURAGES NEW DEVELOPMENT WITHIN A HALF MILE OF A LIGHT RAIL STATION. NEXT IS TOD4 WHICH DESCRIBES USING STRUCTURED PARKING TO INCREASE OPPORTUNITY FOR MORE OPEN SPACE, WHICH IS WHAT WE HAVE DONE. FIFTH IS THE REDEVELOPMENT AND GROWTH MANAGEMENT POLICY ACTION ONE WHICH TAL ABOUT CONSISTENCY WITH THE FUTURE LAND USE MAPS AND DASHBOARDS, ALL OF WHICH WE BELIEVE WE HAVE MET. SIXTH IS RGM-4 WHICH TALKS ABOUT PROVIDING SUFFICIENT OPEN SPACE. NEXT IS RGM-5 WHICH WE ONLY PARTIALLY MEET. RGM-5A AND B WHICH RESTRICTS RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT TO 50% OF THE PROPERTY. IT WAS A HIGHLY DISCUSSED TOPIC DURING THE ADOPTION OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN . THESE MINIMUMS AND MAXIMUMS ARE DIFFICULT TO APPLY. AS I MENTIONED DURING THOSE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN HEARINGS, UNDERPERFORMING COMMERCIAL AREAS SUCH AS THIS NEED THE ADDITIONAL RESIDENTIAL TO STIMULATE THE ECONOMIC ACTIVITY IN THOSE AREAS. JUST AS THE COMP PLAN SUGGESTS ELSEWHERE. LUCKILY THE COMP PLAN ALLOWS YOU TO OVERRIDE THAT POLICY ACTION SO LONG AS YOU MAKE FINDINGS. WE ASK YOU LOOK AT OUR PROJECT IN THE CONTEXT OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD AS A WHOLE. THE DEVELOPMENT NEVER PIECES THE 33% AND TOTALS 51% RESIDENTIAL AT FULL BUILD OUT FOR THE NEIGHBORHOOD. FINALLY WE ARE BUILDING OUR GREEN SPACE CONCURRENT WITH THE FIRST PHASE. RGM-8 IS ANOTHER ITEM FROM THE STAFF REPORT THAT WE WERE A LITTLE CONFUSED ABOUT. OUR PROJECT IS CONSISTENT WITH THE FUTURE LAND USE MAPS AND DASHBOARDS, WHICH ARE DIFFERENT THAN THE POLICY ACTIONS. AND WE ARE PROVIDING A DIVERSITY OF HOUSING TYPES AND WITHIN A HALF MILE OF THE DART STATION. THE LAST TWO POLICY ACTIONS ARE FOR THE REVITALIZATION OF RETAIL SHOPPING CENTERS. OUR RETAIL CORNER IS A PRIME CANDIDATE FOR REDEVELOPMENT AND WE ARE CERTAINLY INCLUDING ACTIVE, OPEN AND GREEN SPACE. BECAUSE WE DO NOT COMPLY WITH THE TWO-THIRDS OF SINGLE POLICY ACTION YOU MUST MAKE FINDINGS THAT OUR PROPOSAL IS CONSISTENT WITH THE GUIDING PRINCIPLES OF THE PLAN. WE BELIEVE WE MEET ALL THREE AND HERE ARE OUR PROPOSED FINDINGS. FIRST IS PLANO TODAY. WE WILL REVITALIZE THE AREA. THERE'S NO DEMAND FOR LARGE-SCALE COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT. WE WILL CREATE A LIVE-WORK PLAY DISTRICT ADJACENT TO DART. THE PLAN WILL ELIMINATE VACANT DARK STRUCTURE AND PROMOTE SAFETY AND VIABILITY OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD. AND THE PLAN WAS DEVELOPED IN SUPPORT OF OUR NEIGHBORS. >> SIR, YOU HAVE ONE MINUTE LEFT. >> FOR PLANO 2050 WE'RE PROVIDING FUTURE GENERATIONS TO ALLOW HOUSING TYPES. WE ARE RIGHT SIZING THE COMMERCIAL SPACE FOR SUSTAINABLE EMPLOYMENT AND HOSPITALITY. AND THE PROJECT WILL ENCOURAGE INCREASED PUBLIC RIDERSHIP AND THE PLAN WILL HOPEFULLY SPUR FURTHER ECONOMIC INVESTMENT IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD. FINALLY, PLANO TOGETHER. THIS PROJECT IS IN ONE OF THE MOST TRANSIT-RICH LOCATIONS. WE ARE ADJACENT TO A LIGHT RAIL, BUS STOP, AND TWO MAJOR HIS. HIGHWAYS. WE ARE BUILDING THIS 1.4-ACRE PLAZA GREEN WHICH WILL BRING THE COMMUNITY TOGETHER AND THE PLAN WAS DEVELOPED IN COLLABORATION AND SUPPORT OF OUR NEIGHBORS. ON THAT NOTE, I HAVE PERSALLY SKY ONE OF OUR NEIGHBORING PROPERTY OWNERS AND THEY ALL SUPPORT US. PLEASE SEE HERE SOME OF THE LETTERS THAT WE'VE RECEIVED. I WANT TO PARTICULARLY POINT OUT THE LETTER ON THE RIGHT FROM THE OWNER OF THE ORA190 APARTMENT COMPLEXES NEXT TO US. THE RESIDENTIAL COMPONENT OF OUR PROJECT WILL BE A DIRECT COMPETITOR TO THEIR PROPERTY. DESPITE THIS THEY SEE HOW THIS CAN TRANSFORM THE NEIGHBORHOOD. THIS IS ANOTHER INDICATION THAT THERE IS ENOUGH DEMAND IN THIS AREA FOR OUR PROJECT. >> SIR, YOUR TIME IS UP. >> Chair Downs: JUST WRAP UP REAL QUICK. >> YEP. AGAIN, THE VISION THAT OUR NEIGHBORS ARE SEEING IS HAVING THIS BE THE NEW FACE OF PLANO PARKWAY. WE DO HAVE SLIDES THAT TALK ABOUT ALTERNATIVES, IF WE WANT TO DISCUSS THAT AND IF A PROJECT LIKE THIS ISN'T APPROVED, YOU KNOW, WHAT WOULD THE OTHERWISE STATUS OF THE PROPERTY BE. WE'RE HAPPY TO GO THROUGH THAT IN THE Q&A. >> Chair Downs: THANK YOU. DO WE HAVE ANY OTHER SPEAKERS OTHER THAN THE APPLICANT ON THIS ITEM? >> WE DO NOT. >> Chair Downs: WITH THAT, I'M GOING TO SEE IF WE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? MR. BRONSKY FOLLOWED BY COMMISSIONER TONG. >> Bronsky: COULD YOU RESTATE WHAT YOU FELT CAUGHT YOU OFF GUARD -- LET ME START WITH THIS. I'M REALLY EXCITED ABOUT SOME OF THE THINGS YOU TALKED ABOUT IN HERE. THE HIGH-QUALITY STANDARDS AND THE MATERIAL DESIGN STUFF. I THINK WE DEFINITELY NEED TO ALWAYS BE PUSHING THAT ENVELOPE. THE SECOND THING THAT YOU MENTIONED THAT I FELT IS VERY CRITICAL, AS SOMEBODY WHO SERVED ON THE COM ON THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN. I BELIEVE THAT UNIQUE DESIGNS -- WELL, LET ME REPHRASE THAT. I BELIEVE THAT THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN ALLOWS US TO HAVE MULTIFAMILY USE ALMOST ANYWHERE IN THE CITY IF IT'S DELIVERED AT A LEVEL THAT WE FIND MEETS OUR STANDARDS AND HAS THAT WOW FACTOR, HAS THAT UNIQUE DESIGN. AND SO I'M VERY GLAD THAT YOU POINTED THAT OUT. MY FIRST QUESTION FOR YOU WAS YOU MADE A COMMENT ABOUT SOMETHING RELATED TO THE EHA CAUGHT YOU OFF GUARD THAT YOU RECEIVED OVER THE WEEKEND. CAN YOU STATE THAT AGAIN? >> YEAH, WE HAD NO INDICATION THAT OUR EHA SITE ANALYSIS WAS NOT IN CONFORMANCE. WE DID AN EHA SITE ANALYSIS WITH HMMH, WHO WAS THE CITY'S CONSULTANT DURING THE ADOPTION OF THE EHA PLAN. THEY HAVE BEEN PART OF TS PROCESS FOR MULTIPLE YEARS AND WE HAVE UTILIZED THEM CONTINUALLY ALONG THE WAY. THEIR STUDY, AS STATED IN THE RESPONSE LETTER THEY PROVIDED IS IN THEIR BELIEF, WE ARE IN COMPLIANCE. WHEN WE SAW THAT -- THE FIRST TIME WE HEARD OF IT OVER THE WEEKEND TO THE DETAIL THAT WE DID WAS THAT. SO THAT CAUGHT US OFF GUARD BECAUSE THE ENTIRE TIME AS WE'VE EXPRESSED TO STAFF AND EVERYBODY ELSE THAT WE'VE BEEN DESIGNING THIS ENTIRE PROJECT TO BE COMPLIANT WITH THAT FROM THE VERY BEGINNING. >> Bronsky: OKAY. SO MY NEXT QUESTION -- IS ERIC STILL ON THE LINE? >> I BELIEVE HE SHOULD BE. >> Bronsky: ERIC, CAN YOU -- >> I AM. >> Bronsky: CAN YOU PLEASE HELP ME WITH THIS? HELP ME TO UNDERSTAND HOW THIS CAUGHT MR. WOLF OFF GUARD AND JUST RECEIVING THIS INFORMATION? THAT DOESN'T STRIKE ME AS HOW WE NORMALLY OPERATE. >> NO. AND, YOU KNOW, NOT TO AIR OUR BACK AND FORTHS, WE HAVE BEEN COMMUNICATING WITH THE APPLICANT FOR SOME TIME. WE HAVE PROVIDED COMMENTS, TWO OR THREE ROUNDS OF CMENT ON THE STUDY. SO THEY'RE VERY AWARE THAT WE HAD THESE CONCERNS. AND YEAH. I THINK IT'S JUST, MAYBE OUR UNDERSTANDING IS DIFFERENT THAN THEIR UNDERSTANDING. BUT WE THOUGHT WE COMMUNICATED THIS WELL. >> CAN I RESPOND? >> Bronsky: GO AHEAD. >> SO, WE'VE ALWAYS KNOWN THAT THERE'S BEEN A CONCERN ABOUT PHASING. THE PHASING HAS BEEN A BIG TOPIC AND A BACK AND FORTH WITH THE CITY FOR A LONG TIME. WE'VE MADE OUR STATEMENT CLEAR ON WHAT WE CAN PROVIDE WHEN. WE BELIEVE IT WAS CLE IN HMMH'S STUDY THAT THE COMMERCIAL STRUCTURES BEING BUILT DID NOT HAVE AN IMPACT ON THEIR ANALYSIS. THERE ARE A NUMBER OF UNITS ON THE SOUTH PORTION OF THE SITE THAT ARE BETWEEN THAT 65 AND 75 DBA LEVEL. THAT MEANS THERE NEED TO BE CERTAIN MITIGATIONS THAT PROTECT RRESIDENTS. WE APPLIED THE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT HMMH MADE -- NO BALCONIES OR PATIO ON THAT SOUTHERN FACE. AND IN ADDITION, I THINK THE PURPOSE OF IT IS TO PROTECT PEOPLE FROM LONG-TERM HIGH NOISE LEVELS, PARTICULARLY WHEN THEY'RE SLEEPING. SO WE COMMITTED TO THE -- ENHANCING OUR BUILDING MATERIALS SUCH THAT WE ACHIEVE A NOISE LEVEL OF 45 DBA ON AN INTERIOR LEVEL. >> Bronsky: OKAY. I WANT TO MAKE SURE WE CLARIFY WHEN ANYONE'S MAKING STATEMENTS REFERENCING OUR DEVELOPMENT STAFF. I WANT TO BE CLEAR ABOUT WHERE EVERYBODY'S AT. THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR TIME. >> I MIGHT ADD, IT APPEARS TO ME THAT THERE ME SOME MISUNDERSTANDING ON THE PART OF THE CONSULTANT, BECAUSE IN THEIR LETTER THEY STATE THAT THE -- THEY'RE RESTRICTING BALCONIES AND PATIOS ON THE SOUTHERN FACADE RELATED TO THE SINGLE-FAMILY STRUCTURES IN THAT LAST PARAGRAPH. AND I DON'T FIND THAT IN THE PLANNED DEVELOPMENT LANGUAGE. SO I KNOW -- THEY GO ON TO TALK ABOUT HOW THE ROOF DECKS HAVE BEEN REMOVED. WE KNOW THAT. BUT IN MY READING OF THE PLAN DEVELOPMENT LANGUAGE, THE MULTIFAMILY DOES HAVE THAT RESTRICTION, BUT THE SINGLE SINGLE-FAMILY DOES NOT. >> MY UNDERSTANDING IS FOR THE ENTIRETY OF TRACK ONE, ALL RESIDENTIAL, RESTRICTS PATIOS AND BALCONIES ON THE SOUTHERN FACADE. >> I WOULD BE INTERESTED TO SEE THAT LANGUAGE, BECAUSE -- >> DO WE HAVE -- SOMEBODY HAVE THE STIPULATIONS? >> WE HAVE IT IN OUR STAFF REPORT. I DON'T KNOW IF WE HAVE IT. >> Chair Downs: SO CAN WE SUBMIT -- YOU AGREE THERE WOULD BE NO -- WHATEVER IT SAYS IN HERE, WHATEVER WAS APPROVED WOULD INCLUDE NO BALCONIES ON THE SOUTRNACE OF ANY RESIDENCE. >> THAT'S RIGHT. >> Chair Downs: SO, IT COULD BE QUITE EASILY THAT'S WHY THERE'S A MISCOMMUNICATION, THERE'S A MISSING SENTENCE SOMEWHERE. AND THAT WAS ENOUGH TO THROW EVERYBODY. >> SURE. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. SO, LET'S MOVE ON. COMMISSIONER TONG, YOU WOULD BE NEXT. >> Tong: THANK YOU, CHAIRMAN. FIRST OF ALL, I WANT TO APPLAUD YOUR EFFORT ON THIS PROJECT. PERSONALLY, I'M IN FAVOR OF ANY PROJECT THAT WOULD REVITALIZE OUR UNDERPERFORMING RETAIL COMMERCIAL PROPERTIES IN PLANO. SO, YOUR PROPOSAL SEEMS VERY APPEALING TO ME. IT LOOKS GREAT. IT'S A GREAT IDEA TO REVITALIZE THAT PIECE OF PROPERTY THAT'S IN A VERY DIFFICULT CORNER THERE. IT'S VERY HARD TO GET TO, AND IT'S JUST KIND OF UNDER THE INTERSECTION OF TWO HIGHWAYS. I HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS. JUST THIS PICTURE YOU'RE SHOWING RIGHT NOW, IT LOOKS LIKE THE TOWNHOMES OR SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENTIAL UNITS ARE SIMILAR HEIGHT TO THE FIVE-STORY BUILDINGS, OR THEY'RE DIFFERENT HEIGHTS? >> THEY'RE THREE STORIES. JUST AN ANGLE -- IT DOES -- IT SHOWS IT IN THE PARK SLIDE AS WELL. GIVEN THE PERSPECTIVE THAT YOU'RE LOOKING FROM MAKES IT -- IT PROTECTS THE MASSING OF THE MULTIFAMILY BY ADDING THOSE TOWN OKLHOME UNITS, BUT THEY'RE THREE STORIES. TOTALLY DIFFERENT HEIGHTS. >> Tong: SO IF I WERE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE COMMUNITY, IN THOSE SINGLE-FAMILY ATTACHED UNITS, THEN THERE WOULD BE LIKE TWO HUGE TALL BUILDINGS AROUND ME? >> BEHIND THE PROPERTY -- BEHIND THE SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENCES THERTHERE'S AN ACCESS STREET WHE THOSE OWNERS WOULD ACCESS GARAGES TO THEIR TOWNHOMES WHICH PROVIDES A BUFFER TO THE MULTIFAMILY DIRECTLY BEHIND IT. WHICH ONE? AS YOU CAN SEE HERE, THERE'S TWO STORIES ABOVE THOSE THREE-STORY TOWNHOMES. YOU CAN KIND OF SEE IN THE DISTANCE, THAT'S THE MULTIFAMILY BEHIND THE TOWNHOMES. AND THEN -- WHERE WE HAVE A SITE PLAN. YOU CAN SEE THAT ACCESS ROAD FOR ALL OF THOSE UNITS BETWEEN THE MID-RISE RESIDENTIAL AND THE TOWNHOMES. >> Tong: OKAY. AND EACH OF THE SINGLE-FAMILY ATTACHED UNITS HAVE THEIR OWN GARAGE? >> CORRECT. >> Tong: OKAY. THE SECOND QUESTION I HAVE, DO YOU KNOW THE CLOSEST RETAIL -- I UNDERSTAND THIS PROPERTY RIGHT NOW IS UNDER-PERFORMING. IT'S PROBABLY, I THINK IT'S BECAUSE OF THE LOCATION. BUT ONCE YOU HAVE RESIDENTS THERE, ONCE YOU HAVE 500 OR MORE UNITS THERE, THEN IT COULD BE A VERY WELL-LOCATED PLACE FOR RETAIL. SO, DO YOU KNOW, WHERE IS THE CLOSEST RETAIL CENTER TO THIS RESIDENCE? >> THE CLOSEST CURRENT RETAIL CENTER IS DOWN IN RICHARDSON IN THE CITYLINE DEVELOPMENT. THERE'S A WHOLE FOODS LESS THAN A MILE AWAY AND ALL OF THE RETAIL ASSOCIATED WITH THAT IS THERE. WHAT OUR HOPE IS, AND WHAT WE BELIEVE THIS PROPERTY WOULD PROVIDE, IS THE ADDITIONAL REINVESTMENT OF THE PROPERTIES JUST NORTH OF PLANO PARKWAY THAT ARE SITUATED TO SERVICE THAT RIGHT NOW, ILUDI THE FORMER LOVE IN WARREN, TEXAS, A RESTAURANT THAT CLOSED DOWN BECAUSE THERE WAS NOT ENOUGH DEMAND. WE THINK BRINGING PEOPLE TO THIS AREA IS GOING TO REVITALIZE ALL OF THOSE PROPERTIES TO THE NORTH OF IT THAT ALLOW IT TO BE ABLE TO SERVICE IT. IN ADDITION -- AND WE ARE SHOWING IN OUR OFFICE BUILDING A SMALL AMOUNT OF RETAIL. WE'RE THINKING OF THAT LIKE A COFFEE SHOP. A RESIDENT WHO TAKES D.A.R.T. INTO THE -- TO WORK CAN GRAB A CUP OF COFFEE ON THEIR WAY DOWN. SO WE SEE THIS BUILDING, OVER TIME. BUT CURRENTLY, WHERE THAT WOULD BE SERVICED FOR TODAY IS IN THE CITYLINE DEVELOPMENT, WHICH I CAN PULL UP THAT TO SHOW. IT'S LESS THAN A MILE. >> Tong: YEAH, IT'S OKAY. I KNOW WHERE IT IS. I'M JUST -- I WANT TO POINT OUT THAT THE DISTANCE-WISE IT'S VERY CLOSE. BUT BECAUSE IT'S ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE HIGHWAY, IT COULD BE A LITTLE BIT CHALLENGING FOR THE RESIDENTS TO FEEL LIKE THEY BELONG, THAT'S WHERE THEY WILL GO TO. SO I STILL THINK THAT'S A CHALLENGE TO THE QUALITY OF LIFE OF THE RESIDENTS THERE, EVEN THOUGH THERE IS A HUGE SHOPPING CENTER JUST ACROSS THE HHWAY BUT THER IS A HIGHWAY IN BETWEEN. SO YOU SEE MY POINT. SO I AM KIND OF SUPPORTIVE TO THE STAFF'S VIEW THAT THIS PROPERTY DEVELOPMENT ITSELF NEEDS ITS OWN RETAIL OR COMMERCIAL COMPONENTS TO MAKE IT SUSTAINABLE. SO THAT'S KIND OF WHAT I'M THINKING. THANK YOU. >> YOU'RE WELCOME. >> Chair Downs: >> Olley. >> Olley: GREAT QUESTIONS BY COMMISSIONER TONG. I THINK SHE ANSWERED SOME OF MY QUESTIONS. HELP ME ANCHOR TO THE NUMBERS YOU SHOWED THAT SHOWED RESIDENTIAL IS ABOUT 51%. >> THAT'S RIGHT. >> Olley: IF MY MEMORY SERVES ME. PICTORIALLY, I'M TRYING TO RECONCILE THAT, RIGHT? >> I'LL SHOW YOU IN OUR MAP HERE. AT FULL BUILDOUT WITH ALL THE HIGHLIGHTED PROPERTIES, IT'S 49% COMMERCIAL AND 51%. FROM A SQUARE FOOTAGE PERSPECTIVE, RESIDENTIAL, OF ALL OF THE HIGHLIGHTED PROPERTIES. >> Olley: SO NOT JUST THE PROJECT. >> THAT'S RIGHT. BECAUSE WE WON'T MEET IT ON OUR SITE. AND WE'RE ASKING THE P&Z TO LOOK AT IT IN THE CONTEXT OF AN ENTIRE NEIGHBORHOOD, GIVEN THAT WE NEED TO DO SOMETHING TO REVITALIZE THIS AREA, BECAUSE WE JUST CAN'T BUILD COMMERCIAL THERE TODAY. THERE'S NO ABILITY TO DO THAT. THERE'S NO FINANCING FOR IT. AND THERE'S NO DEMAND AS IT CURRENTLY EXISTS. >> Olley: TO FOLLOW YOUR COLOR CODE, BLUE ISOMMERCIAL. YELLOW IS -- >> SORRY, BLUE IS OFFICE, MOSTLY OFFICE, FLEX SPACE. THE RED IS RETAIL. THE PURPLE IS THE HOTEL PIECE. THE GREEN IS THE PARK, OR THE PLAZA GREEN. AND THE YELLOW IS THE RESIDENTIAL. >> Olley: OKAY. ANY THOUGHT TO THE MID-RISE RESIDENTIAL CLOSEST TO THE BLUE AND THE RED? WAS THERE ANY THOUGHT GIVEN TO -- WHICH IN MY MIND WOULD SATISFY MORE OF A MIX OF USE, LIVE, WORK, PLAY KIND OF VIBE TO THE PROPERTY, TO CHANGING THAT FROM RESIDENTIAL TO MORE -- I DON'T KNOW, RESTAURANTS, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING -- NOT NECESSARILY COMMERCIAL LIKE OFFICE SPACE, BUT MORE RESTAURANTS, GROCERY STORES TO SATISFY -- WHICH WOULD GIVE IT MORE OF THAT CITYLINE VIBE LIKE YOU MENTIONED IN THE FIRST PLACE. >> YEAH, SO INITIALLY -- THIS IS, AGAIN, THREE YEARS AGO, EARLY DAYS IN DESIGN OF THIS, WE WERE LOOKING AT ALMOST LIKE SHOP RETAIL SPACE ON THE SOUTHERN PORTION OF THE SITE WHERE WE THOUGHT IT WAS MOST APPROPRIATE. AGAIN, THROUGH BACK AND FORTH WITH STAFF, WE WANTED TO BE ABLE TO PROVIDE AS MUCH HIGHWAY NOISE PROTECTION AS WE CAN, WHICH LED TO THE OFFICE DESIGN THAT WE'VE CURRENTLY GOTTEN. SO AGAIN, YOU KNOW -- AND I GUESS IN THE WAY THE PD STIPULATIONS ARE WRITTEN, THAT COMMERCIAL SPACE ON THE SOUTHERN PORTION OF THIS SITE IS CC STILL AND WOULD APPLY TO THOSE. SO I GUESS YOU COULD SWAP OUT THE OFFICE FOR RETAIL. WE JUST THOUGHT THAT DRIVING AN ECONOMIC BASE WOULD BE MORE BENEFICIAL. >> Olley: IT WOULDN'T BE THE OFFICE FOR RETAIL. IT WOULD BE TAKING THE MID-RISE TO THE LEFT TOP CORNER AND SWAPPING THAT OUT FOR RESTAURANT/RETAIL. >> PART OF OUR THESIS IS BRINGING PEOPLE TO THIS AREA. AND THAT'S WHAT'S GOING TO CREATE THE VIBRANCY OF THIS NEIGHBORHOOD. IT'S A SOMEWHAT CONDENSED NEIGHBORHOOD, AND WEHINK THAT HAVING THE CONCENTRATION OF PEOPLE AND RESIDENTS THERE IS MORE IMPORTANT TO HELPING THAT BE SUCCESSFUL. >> Olley: LAST QUESTION. JUMPING OFF OF WHAT COMMISSIONER TONG ASKED WITH THE TOWNHOMES, ESSENTIALLY BEING IN BETWEEN TWO MUCH TALLER BUILDINGS, I REMEMBER A ZONING CASE WHERE A SHADOW ANALYSIS WAS AN ISSUE. I'M THINKING IF I'M LING THERE, AND AT ALL TIMES OF THE DAY IT FEELS LIKE NIGHT -- [ LAUGHING ] I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE MITIGATION IS, BUT THAT JUST FEELS OFF, PERSONALLY. IT'S MORE OF A COMMENT THAN A QUESTION. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER RATLIFF. >> Ratliff: THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN. JUST TO FOLLOW UP ON A COUPLE OF THINGS, I'M VERY FAMILIAR WITH THIS AREA. I'VE RIDDEN MY BICYCLE DOWN TO CITYLINE. THE PROXIMITY -- I'M NOT SURE HOW YOU GET ANY CLOSER TO THAT D.A.R.T. STATION UNLESS YOU'RE ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE FREEWAY. SO I ACTUALLY DO APPLAUD YOU FOR THE CONNECTIVITY TO THE D.A.R.T. STATION, BECAUSE NOT ONLY IS THAT ON THE CURRENT D.A.R.T. STATION, IT'S GOING TO WITH BE ON AT THE SILVER LINE. THAT WILL PROVIDE PEOPLE GREAT ACCESS TO D.A.R.T. THAT'S A WINNER. HAVE Y'ALL CONSIDERED AT A -- INS WITH THE COMMERCIAL AND THE HOTEL. THAT'S A DEMAND ISSUE. HAVE YOU CONSIDERED AT ALL ANY SHORT-TERM MITIGATION MEASURES? I AM VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THE ROW OF RESIDENTIAL THAT EFFECTIVELY WILL BE FACING THE FREEWAY IN PHASE ONE, BECAUSE IF PHASE TWO IS INDEFINITE, WHICH IT IS AT THIS POINT, THAT MEANS THATHAT ROW OF RESIDENTS WOULD E THE FREEWAY FOR AN INDEFINITE PERIOD, LOOKING AT A VACANT LOT. HAVE YOU GIVEN ANY CONSIDERATION TO A SHORT-TERM OR INTERIM MEASURE FOR MITIGATION FOR SPECIFICALLY THAT ROW OF RESIDENTS, AS WELL AS YOUR PLAZA GREEN THAT WOULD BE BASICALLY FACING THE FREEWAY AS WELL? HAS THAT COME UP AT ALL? >> FROM A LOOKING AT A VACANT LOT PERSPECTIVE, WHEN WE'RE DOING THESE MULTIPHASE DEVELOPMENTS WE'LL DO SOME SORT OF PLANTING ON THE VACANT LOT FOR THE PERIOD OF TIME THAT WE'RE NOT BUILDING IT SO YOU'RE NOT LOOKING AT A PILE OF DIRT, A BIG PARKING LOT, OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. WE HAVEN'T LOOKED SPECIFICALLY FROM A NOISE MITIGATION STANDPOINT. WE DID COMMIT TO BASICALLY A TREE LINE ON THE EASTERN PORTION OF THE SITE, WHICH WE WOULD WELCOME CONSIDERATION FOR -- FROM A TEMPORARY PERSPECTIVE ON THE SOUTHERN PORTION OF THE SITE AS WELL, BUT WE HAVEN'T -- WE WERE TAKING IT IN THE CONTEXT OF WHAT OUR EHA CONSULTANT WAS TELLING US, THAT WE'RE MITIGATING THEM APPROPRIATELY WITH OR WITHOUT OFFICES THERE. I GUESS THE ONLY OTHER THING I'D ADD IS WE'VE SPOKEN TO THE ADJACENT APARTMENT OWNER, AND ASSET MANAGERS. THEY'VE HAD NO COMPLAINTS FROM A NOISE PERSPECTIVE. I STILL UNDERSTAND THE CITY'S POLICY AND WHAT YOU GUYS ARE TRYING TO ACHIEVE FROM A QUALITY OF LIFE PERSPECTIVE. AND WE SUPPORT THAT. BUT THERE HAS BEEN NO INDICATION TO DATE THAT THEY'VE HAD AN ISSUE WITH THAT. AND WHEN THEY WERE APPROVED, THERE WAS NO SPECIAL PD LANGUAGE EVEN ABOUT INTERIOR NOISE LANGUAGE. AGAIN, IT WAS A DIFFERENT TIME, SO I UNDERSTAND. BUT AGAIN, WE'RE TRYING TO LOOK AT IN THE ENTIRE CONTEXT OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD SO. >> Ratliff: DO YOU KNOW, FROM TALKING TO THE NEIGHBORS -- MY EXPERIENCE WITH DEVELOPMENTS LIKE THIS IS THAT THAT PARTICULAR ROW ALONG THE FREEWAY IS GOING TO BE RENTED AT A DISCOUNT. >> THEY'VE INDICATED THAT IT'S NOT. THOSE ARE MORE TOWNHOME-STYLE UNITS ON THE SOUTHERN PORTION OF THEIR SITE AS WELL, RENTED, NOT FOR SALE. BUT THEY WERE IN HIGH 90s OCCUPANCY WHEN WE SPOKE LAST WEEK, SO THEY HAVE NOT HAD ANY ISSUES FROM AN OCCUPANCY PERSPECTIVE, OR A DCOUNT. >> Ratliff: OKAY. SO, WOULD YOU BE WILLING, IF WE COME UP WITH SOME INTERIM SUGGESTION, TO CONSIDER AN INTERIM MEASURE? WOULD THAT BE SOMETHING THAT YOU WOULD BE WILLING TO CONSIDER? >> YES, ABSOLUTELY. >> Ratliff: OKAY. THANK YOU. >> YEAH. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF. >> Brounoff: THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN. TO ME, THE ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM IS THE STAFF OBSERVATION THAT YOU'RE NOT ACTUALLY COMMITTING TO BUILD THE NONSINTIAL. THE ONL THING YOU'RE COMMITTING TO DO IS IN PHASE TWO, TAKE OUT A BUILDING PERMIT. THAT DOESN'T MEAN YOU'RE GOING TO START PILING BRICKS ON EACH OTHER. AND WITHOU THE NONRESIDENTIAL, YOU LOSE WHATEVER MITIGATION YOU WOULD HAVE GOTTEN FROM THE NOISE STANDPOINT THAT THE BUILDINGS WOULD HAVE PROVIDED. >> CORRECT. SO I THINK OF THOSE AS TWO SEPARATE ISSUES. ONE IS THE NOISE AND ONE IS MORE OF A PHASING FROM AN ACTUAL COMMERCIAL COMPONENT. AGAIN, FROM THE NOISE PERSPECTIVE AGAIN EVERYTHING IS N NECSARY FROM A PURETHAT IT MITIGATION STANDPOINT TO PROTECT THOSE RESIDENTS. SO THAT'S ONE ISSUE. THE SECOND ISSUE IS JUST FROM WILL IT GET BUILT. IT'S A SIGNIFICANT INVESTMENT TO GET THROUGH CONSTRUCTION DOCUMENTATION AND PLAN CHECK TO GET TO THE POINT TO BE ABLE TO ACTUALLY PULL A BUILDING PERMIT AND ALL KN FEES ASSOCIATED. SO THAT'S NOT TAKEN LIGHTLY. WHERE WE HAVE FOUND THAT MOST BENEFICIAL FROM A PURE CONSTRUCTABILITY STANDPOINT IS PRODUCT TYPES SUCH AS OFFICE AND RESIDENTIAL ARE USUALLYINANCED SEPARATELY, UNLESS THEY'RE IN A VERTICAL MIXED USE COMPONENT. FROM A FINANCING PERSPECTIVE, AS YOU CAN IMAGINE, FROM A LENDING, AN EQUITY PERSPECTIVE, TYING THOSE TWO TOGETHER ON -- ONE IS A HIGH RISE BUILDING AND ONE IS WOOD FRAME. THEY'RE DIFFERENT CONTRACTORS. YOU'RE TWO TOTALLY SEPARATE BUILDS. WHERE WE HAVE BEEN MOST SUCCESSFUL -- WE JUST DID THIS ON ANOTHER PROJECT. WE PULLED BUILDING PERMITS AT THE SAME TIME. ONE STARTED EARLIER, SO WE' ALSO THINKING ABOUT STU LIKE TIMING OF WHEN WE'RE DELIVERING SO THERE'S LESS DISRUPTION TO THE OVERALL DEVELOPMENT. YOU DON'T FINISH THE APARTMENTS, YOU KNOW, A YEAR PRIOR TO FINISHING THE OFFICE AND THEN ALL OF THOSE RESIDENTS HAVE TO LIVE THROUGH THE CONSTRUCTION OF THAT. SO THERE ARE A LOT OF COMPONENTS ABOUT TYING IT TO SOME FURTHER STAGE OF DEVELOPMENT. AND WHAT WE'RE OF THE OPINION OF IS IT'S SUCH A SIGNIFICANT INVESTMENT FOR US TO JUST GET TO THE BUILDING PERMIT STAGE THAT THAT'S SHOWING OUR GOOD FAITH EFFORT TO BE ABLE TO BUILD THAT. OTHERWISE WE'RE OUT -- I MEAN, IT'S MILLIONSN PROJECTS LIKE THIS TO BE ABLE TO GET TO THAT STAGE. >> Brounoff: DOESN'T IT SEEM IRONIC THAT YOUR BASE ZONING DISTRICT THAT YOU'RE BUILDING UNDER IS CORRIDOR COMMERCIAL AND THERE -- WE MAY NOT WIND UP WITH ANY COMMERCIAL IN A COMMUNITY -- IN A CORRIDOR COMMERCIAL DISTRICT? >> AGAIN, THAT'S OBVIOUSLY NOT OUR INTENTION WHATSOEVER. WE THINK WE ARE TAKING A BIG STEP AT PROVIDING WHAT WE THINK IS A HUGE AMENITY TO THE AREA IN HAVING TS PLAZA GREEN AREA. YES, I UNDERSTAND YOUR POINT. ALL WE CAN DO IS ACT IN GOOD FAITH FOR WHAT WE KNOW THAT WE CAN GET DONE AND WHAT WE CAN EXECUTE ON. AND SO THAT'S KIND OF WHERE WE ARE. >> Brounoff: I UNDERSTAND. I AM NOT QUESTIONING YOUR INTENTION. I'M QUESTIONING -- AS CIRCUMSTANCES DEVELOP, IT MAY NOT HAPPEN. IT MAY BE CONTRARY TO YOUR INTENTION, BUT IT STILL MAY NOT HAPPEN. >> YEP. >> Brounoff: ON ANOTHER SUBJECT, WHAT IS THE -- DOES THE PLAN PROVIDE FOR NOISE MITIGATION FOR THE OUTDOOR AREAS IN THE 65-DECIBEL ZONE? >> THERE'S A SETBACK ASSOCIATED WITH THAT AREA. THE VAST MAJORITY OF THAT IS IN EH1, SO OUTSIDE THAT CONTOUR LINE. AND THEN WE COMMITTED TO PUTTINE EXACT LANGUAGE IS, THE TREE SCREEN THAT GETS UP TO A CERTAIN HEIGHT I THINK WITHIN TWO YEARS. I DON'T KNOW THE EXACT LANGUAGE. >> Brounoff: DID YOUR STUDY ADDRESS THE MITIGATION OF THE OUTDOOR AREAS IF THE COMMERCIAL IS NOT BUILT? >> I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT. >> Brounoff: CHRISTINE, CAN YOU SHED SOME LIGHT ON THAT? >> Chair Downs: ASK THE QUESTION AGAIN. >> Brounoff: OH. DOES HIS PROPOSAL, OR THE STUDY THAT HE SUBMITTED, ADDRESS THE QUESTION OF WHETHER OR NOT THERE WOULD BE SUFFICIENT NOISE MITIGATION IN THE EHA1 DISTRICT IF THE COMMERCIAL IS NOT BUILT? I'M TALKING ABOUT OUTDOOR AREAS. >> RIGHT. I'M GOING TO HAVE TO SAY THAT I AM NOT A HUNDRED PERCENT CERTAIN ON THAT. I HAVE NOT LOOKED AT IT THAT CLOSELY IN THE LAST COUPLE OF WEEKS. MY UNDERSTANDING WAS IN LOOKING AT IT, WAS THAT IT DID INCLUDE THE COMMERCIAL, BUT I COULD BE MISTAKEN ON THAT. SO, THAT WAS MY UNDERSTANDING, THOUGH, WHENEVER WE DID OUR ANALYSIS. >> Brounoff: OKAY. IS THE WHOLE OF THE RESIDENTIAL AREA WITHIN THE EHA1 DISTRICT? >> IT IS. >> Brounoff: AND THAT MEA THAT IT WOULD BE SUBJECT TO NOISE LEVELS BETWEEN 65 AND BELOW 75 DECIBELS. >> THAT IS CORRECT. OUR POLICY IS THAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR PEOPLE TO MEET THE 65 THROUGH MITIGATION. >> Brounoff: SO THE SETBACKS WOULD NOT TAKE THEM OUT OF THE 65-DECIBEL ZONE? >> IT WOULD NOT. >> Brounoff: THANK YOU. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER CARY. >> Cary: A COUPLE QUICK THINGS. WHAT DO YOU ESTIMATE -- CRYSTAL BALL -- PHASE ONE? >> YEAH. SO, IF WRE APPROVED IT'T A 12-MONTH TIMEFRAME TO GET THROUGH CONSTRUCTION DOCUMENTATION, CD WORK, DRAWING OUT AND DESIGNING THE BUILDINGS AND THEN WE'D BREAK GROUND AND IT'S A TWO-YEAR BUILD. SO IT'S ABOUT -- I GUESS IF IT WERE APPROVED TODAY ABOUT A THREE-YEAR TIMEFRAME. >> Cary: GREAT. THANKS. I THINK I HEARD YOU SAY THAT YOU GOT REPORTS THAT THERE WAS AN UNDER SUPPLY LONG-TERM OF MULTIFAMILY OR SOME KIND OF HOUSING IN THIS AREA? DID I HEAR THAT CORRECTLY? >> YEAH, THE STUDY THAT WE HAD COMMISSIONED BYHE GROUP, A NATIONALLY RECOGNIZED FIRM TO DO ANALYSIS LIKE THIS, PROJECTED -- AND THEY TAKE POPULATION GROWTH, AND ALL KINDS OF VARIABLES. THEY HAVE A BIG MODEL THAT'S ALL DONE IN A REPORT. AND THAT SHOWED IN OUR -- WHAT THEY CALL CMA, COMPETITIVE MARKET AREA, WHICH FOR US I BELIEVE INCLUDES EAST PLANO, CENTRAL PLANO, AND RICHARDSON SUBMARKETS. SO THAT'S THE AREA. AN UNDERSUPPLY OF 3400 UNITS OVER THE NEXT FIVE YEARS. >> Cary: AND THAT TAKES INTO ACCOUNT T UNI THA ARE APPROVED AND NOT BUILT? >> CORRECT. >> Cary: AND I THINK YOU SAID THE OCCUPANCY OF CITYLINE WAS 90%, DID I HEAR THAT RIGHT? >> I WAS REFERRING TO THE ORA 190 190 APARTMENT COMPLEX ACROSE STREET FROM US. >> Cary: DO YOU KNOW THE OCCUPANCY OF CITYLINE? >> THE LAST I SPOKE TO AN OWNER THERE, THEY SAID THEY WERE DOING WELL FROM AN OCCUPANCY PERSPECTIVE. BUT -- >> Cary: AS SOMEONE THAT'S GOING TO BUILD ONE OF THESE, WHAT DO YOU THINK THAT WOULD BE? >> DOING WELL IS NORTH OF 95% OCCUPANCY. >> Cary: COOL. I'VE BEEN AN INVESTOR IN SE MULTIFAMILY. THAT WOULD BE DOING REAL WELL. SO, WHERE DO YOU ANTICIPATE IN TERMS OF PRICING, YOUR MULTIFAMILY UNITS TO FALL INTO? AND YOUR TOWN HOLMES. TOWNHOMES. WHAT DO YOU EXPECT? >> FROM A MULTIFAMILY PERSPECTIVE, WE ANTICIPATE IT BEING A PREMIUM TO THE ORA 190 DIRECTLY ACROSS THE STREET FROM US. WE WOULD OBVIOUSLY BE SIGNIFICANTLY NEWER FROM THEM AT THAT POINT WITH THE DIFFERENT SET OF FINISHES AND BUILDOUT. WE'VE ALSO SET DESIGN STANDARDS KIND OF ABOVE AND BEYOND WHAT THEIRS WERE. SO WE SEE US PRICED ABOVE THEM FROM A MULTIFAMILY PERSPECTIVE. FROM A FOR SALE PERSPECTIVE, I'M NOT SURE I CAN GIVE YOU A GREAT ANSWER ON WHAT THE SINGLE-FAMILY MARKET IS A BIT CRAZY RIGHT NOW. AND SO -- >> Cary: A LOT OF MOVING PARTS. >> I'D HATE TO GIVE YOU A NUMBER. >> Cary: THAT'S FAIR ENOUGH. WITH THE TENANTS, OR THE PEOPLE THAT ARE GOING TO LIVE HERE, THEY'RE PROBABLY GOING TO HAVE TO SHOP SOMEWHERE ELSE, IT LOOKS KE. AT THIS POINT THERE'S NOT SHOPPING IN PLANO THAT'S PROXIMATE. THOSE SHOPPERS ARE GOING TO GO SOMEWHERE ELSE, WOULD YOU AGREE? >> YES. WE SEE IT AS ANY OTHER NEIGHBORHOOD WHERE PEOPLE HAVE TO GET IN THEIR CARS AND GO SHOPPING. DOES SOMEBODY HERE HAVE THE ABILITY TO TAKE A JUST UNDER ONE-MILE WALK TO WHOLE FOODS? YES, I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S YOUR WEEKLY SHOPPING RUN. WE DO A LOT OF PROGRAMMING INTERNALLY TO OUR APARTMENT BUILDINGS FROM A MAIL STORAGE PERSPECTIVE AS FAR AS, LIKE, COOLER, REFRIGERATED STORAGE FOR DELIVERIES OF GROCERIES IS BECOMING MORE AND MORE POPULAR, AT LEAST IN MY FAMILY IT IS. AND SO WE'VE STARTED PROACTIVELY PROVIDING SPACES FOR THAT WITHIN OUR APARTMENT COMPLEXES. SO FROM A GROCERY, LIKE EVERYDAY, YOU KNOW, WE COULD SEE THAT BEING A LARGER COMPONENT. >> Cary: THAT'S SMART. WHAT TYPE OF HOTEL DO YOU ANTICIPATE ULTIMATELY, ASSUMING IT GETS BUILT? >> IS PROBABLY MOSTLY LIKE A HOMEWOOD SUITES TYPE OF HOTEL. WE DON'T SEE THIS BEING A SUPER HIGH-END HOTEL. IT'S PROBABLY MORE SERVING THE BUSINESSES AROUND HERE, WHETHER THAT'S ON OUR PROPERTY, ACROSS AT CITYLINE. PEOPLE BEING ABLE TO FLY INTO DFW, HOPEFULLY SOMEDAY HOPPING ON SILVER LINE, BEING ABLE TO BE RIGHT HERE AND NOT NEED TO RENT A CAR. >> Cary: MY GUESS IS YOU ANTICIPATE THERE WOULD BE DEMAND FOR THAT. THERE'S NOT -- >> RIGHT. OBVIOUSLY TODAY WE DON'T THINK THERE'S ENOUGH DEMAND TO BUILD IT TODAY, OTHERSE WE'D SAY WE'RE BUILDING THAT RIGHT AWAY. >> Cary: AND THAT LEADS TO PROBABLY MY LAST QUESTION HERE. AND THAT IS, WE SPEAK AND I THINK WE GET IT. I THINK THEY WERE YOUR WORDS. THERE'S A GLUT. AND THERE'S UNDERPERFORMING COMMERCIAL IN THE AREA. SO MY QUESTION IS THIS. YOU'VE GOT A PRETTY SUBSTANTIAL INVESTMENT HERE. YOU'RE GOING TO MAKE THE MOVE TO GET THE PERMITS FOR THE OFFICE SPACE AT THIS POINT, OR AT LEAST PUT THAT IN PROCESS. >> PUT THAT IN PROCESS. >> Cary: SO, WHAT'S YOUR BEST ESTIMATE OF WHEN YOU ACTUALLY BUILD THAT? >> AGAIN, THIS IS A WEIRD ECONIC TIMRIGHT NOW. YOU COULD SEE IN THE LETTERS OF SUPPORT THAT WE GOT FROM OUR ADJACENT OFFICE OWNERS, IT'S TOUGH OUT THERE FOR -- FROM AN OFFICE PERSPECTIVE. WORK FROM HOME IS BECOMING MORE OF A THING. I CAN GO INTO OUR ALTERNATIVE SLIDES IF YOU WISH, BUT THIS IS THE MOST AMOUNT OF VACANCY IN DFW SINCE THE 1980s. >> Cary: THERE'S NOT AN END IN SIGHT AT THE MOMENT, WOULD YOU AGREE? >> WE DON'T THINK SO. WHERE WE THINK THAT THIS PROPERTY CAN OUTPERFORM, IF YOU WILL, IS EXACTLY WHAT I WENT THROUGH WITH WHAT DO YOU DO TO CREATE DEMAND HERE. YOU PROVIDE SOMETHING SO UNIQUE THAT IT ISN'T ANYWHERE ELSE. WHERE ELSE IS THERE 125,000 SQUARE FOOT OFFICE BUILDING THAT EFFECTIVELY HAS THEIR OWN PARK RIGHT OUT IN FRONT OF IT? BEING ABLE TO BRING AMENITIES LIKE FOOD TRUCKS INTO THAT PARK. WE'VE PROGRAMMED STUFF LIKE THAT TO BE ABLE TO MAKE IT BE SUCCESSFUL, SO THAT AT THE TIME THAT JOBS START COMING BACK AND OFFICE OCCUPANCY STARTS GOING UP, WE CAN BEHE ONESHAT TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THAT INSTEAD OF THEM OTHERWISE GOING SOUTH INTO RICHARDSON. >> Cary: RIGHT. >> AND THAT WAS OUR GOAL. >> Cary: OKAY. >> IN CREATING THIS. >> Cary: AND SO -- BECAUSE THAT IS UNKNOWN. I GUESS, COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF WAS HINTING AT THIS. THERE'S NO GOOD ESTIMATE OF WHEN PHASE TWO OF THIS WILL GET BUILT. WE AGREE WITH THAT. SO MY FINAL QUESTION -- I'M ALMOST SURE -- IS THIS. IF THIS HOTEL AND THIS MEASCOMMERCIAL PROPERTY BECOME UNFEASIBLE, DOES THAT PUT FINANCIAL STRAIN ON TH RESTF THIS PROJECT? >> NOT THE WAY THAT WE'RE FINANCED TODAY. OWNING THE LAND IS VERY DIFFERENT THAN ONCE YOU GO VERTICAL ON IT. THE FINANCING FOR THE VERTICAL CONSTRUCTION OF PHASE ONE WILL BE SEPARATED FROM EFFECTIVELY THE OWNERSHIP OF THE REST OF THE PARCELS. WE WOULD REMAIN ON AN OWNERSHIP PERSPECTIVE, BUT THE BANK DOESN'T NECESSARILY HAVE A LOAN ON THE EXCESS LAND PARCELS THAT WOULD PROVIDE STRAIN ON IT. SO, NOT AS MUCH. AND OF OUR OPINION, AGAIN, OF THE OPINION OF ALL OF THE NEIGHBORS THAT WE SPOKE TO, EVEN A PHASE ONE KICK-START TO THIS TOTALLY TRANSFORMS THIS NEIGHBORHOOD. BEING ABLE TO AT A MO MINIMUM HE A 1.4-ACRE PLAZA GREEN, THE OFFICE USERS WHO ARE STRUGGLING RIGHT NOW, THAT'S A NEW AMENITY FOR THEIR PROJECT. THE APARTMENT OWNERS ACROSS THE STREET MENTIONED THAT WOULD BE A HUGE AMENITY FOR THEIR FOLKS, REGARDLESS OF IF PHASE TWO EVER COMES, NOT THAT WE WANT THAT TO HAPPEN. >> Cary: I REALLY APPRECIATE THAT. THANK YOU. >> YEAH. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER BRONSKY. >> Bronsky: I HAD TWO FOLLOP QUESTIONS. >> MHMM. >> Bronsky: I REALLY LIKED YOUR FIRST STATEMENT. WHEN YOU FIRST STARTED YOU TALKED ABOUT BRINGING THE COMMUNITY TOGETHER. CAN YOU DESCRIBE TO ME WHAT THE CONVERSATIONS YOU HAD WITH THE RESIDENTS THAT LIVE CLOSEST TO YOUR DEVELOPMENT? >> SO WE SPOKE WITH THE OWNERS OF THAT PROPERTY. THE ONLY RESIDENTS ARE THE APARTMENTS. WE SPOKE TO THE OWNERSHIP GROUP OF THAT AND THE ASSET MANAGEMENT ASSOCIATED WITH THAT TO GET A SO JUS TO BE CLEAR, WE DIDN'T SPEAK DIRECTLY WITH SOMEBODY LIVING IN ONE OF THOSE UNITS. >> Bronsky: AS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT YOUR CONVERSATIONS WITH THE RESIDENTS, YOU DIDN'T TALK TO THE RESIDENTS THAT ARE LIVING THERE CORRECT? >> WE DIDN'T TALK TO THE RESIDENTIAL RESIDENTS OF THE APARTMENT COMPLEX. >> Bronsky: SECOND THING -- I REALLY APPRECIATE SOME OF YOUR ALTERNATIVES. I KNOW WE'VE HAD SOME COMMENTS AND SUGGESTIONS. I'M REALLY CONFUSED, BECAUSE I REMEMBER BEFORE WE'VE HAD DIALOGUE ABOUT FOCUSING ON THE ITEM THAT'S BEFORE US RATHER THAN TRYING TO FIX THINGS FROM THE DAIS. I GUESS I'M JUST A LITTLE CONFUSED WHY WE ARE OFFERING ALTERNATIVES. BUT MY LAST QUESTION WAS THE TIMEFRAME. AND THAT WAS REALLY ANSWERED BY COMMISSIONER CARY ALREADY. SO I THINK THAT'S ALL I HAD, WAS JUST THOSE TWO COMMENTS. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER RATLIFF. >> Ratliff: THANK YOU, CHAIRMAN. A COUPLE FOLLOWUP QUESTIONS. YOU SAID THE APARTMENTS YOU THOUGHT WAS A THREE-YEAR PROJECT FROM THE TIME YOU GET IT SIGN, PERMITTED, TWO YEARS TO BUILD? >> ONE YEAR TO DESIGN, TWO YEARS TO BUILD, THREE YEARS TOTAL FROM THE TIME WE WOULD BE APPROVED. >> WHAT IS THE TIMELINE ON THE OFFICE? >> OH, ONCE WE PULL PERMITS ON IT EFFECTIVELY? IT'S A SIMILAR TIMEFRAME, ABOUT TWO YEARS FROM THE DAY THAT YOU PULL THOSE PERMITS. TYPICALLY A LITTLE BIT LONGER TO DESIGN THAT BUILDING. SO, 12-15 MONTHS MAYBE IN THAT DESIGN PHASE AND THEN ROUGHLY A TWO-YEAR BUILD FOR A BUILDING OF THIS SIZE. >> Ratliff: FOR THE PHASE TWO APARTMENTS AND THE COMMERCIAL BUILDING, THE TIMELINES ARE SIMILAR? >> THEY'RE SIMILAR, BUT STAGGERED. SO WHAT WE BELIEVE -- JUST TO BE CLEAR -- IS WE NEED TO CREATE THE SENSE OF PLACE FIRST SO THAT THE COMMUNITY, BOTH THE FINANCING COMMUNITY, THE TENANT COMMUNITY -- TO BE ABLE TO BREAK GROUND ON A COMMERCIAL COMPONENT, WE NEED TO SHOW WHAT THIS CAN BE ABOVE AND BEYOND PICTURES. IT JUST DOESN'T WORK IN TODAY'S MARKET. AND SO WHAT WE'RE SAYING IS LET US BUILD THIS FIRST PHASE WE THINK STANDING ON ITS OWN IS BENEFICIAL TO THIS AREA. THAT GIVES US A FIGHTING SHOT TO BE ABLE TO HAVE A CHANCE TO BRING ECONOMIC ACTIVITY TO THIS AREA NOT ONLY ON OUR PROPERTY, BUT FOR THE SURROUNDING NEIGHBORS. THAT'S OUR GOAL IN THIS. >> Ratliff: THAT'S MY FOLLOWUP QUESTION. WITH THAT PREMISE, IF I CONCEDE TO YOUR PREMISE -- >> YEP. >> Ratliff: PHASE TWO, WHICH IS YOUR PHASE TWO APARTMENTS, IF THAT TIMELINE IS VERY SIMILAR TO THE TIMELINE FOR THE BUILD -- FOR THE COMMERCIAL BUILDING AND YOU COMMITTED TO HAVE PERMITS IN HAND PRIOR TO THE START OF CONSTRUCTION OF THE PHASE TWO APARTMENTS, IS THERE ANY REASON WHY YOU WOULDN'T AGREE TO TIE THE COs TOGETHER INSTEAD OF THE PERMITS? >> FOR PHASE TWO? >> Ratliff: AND THE COMMERCIAL BUILDING. >> RIGHT. SO THAT GOES BACK INTO MY DISCUSSION WITH THE OTHER COMMISSIONER, WHICH IS ONCE YOU START TYING THOSE TOGETHER TO COs IT MAKES THEM EXTREMELY DIFFICULT TO PRACTICALLY BUILD, BOTH FROM A FINANCING PERSPECTIVE AND FROM A DELIVERY PERSPECTIVE. SO WHAT WE HAVE FOUND HAS BEEN MOST SUCCESSFUL TO US -- AND WHAT WE'RE COMFORTABLE WITH -- IS WE'RE SHOWING ENOUGH OF A COMMITMENT AND INVESTMENT TO GET TO THAT POINT, TO PULL THE PERMITS, PAY THE FEES ASSOCIATED WITH THAT. THAT IS OUR COMMITMENT THAT WE'RE GOING TO DO EVERYTHING WE CAN THEN TO MOVE TO FORWARD, OTHERWISE WHY SPEND THE MONEY. SO THAT'S OUR -- BUT YOU'RE RIGHT. IT'S A CHICKEN AND EGG, A LITTLE BIT. >> Ratliff: HOW MANY UNITS ARE IN PHASE TWO? >> I BELIEVE 249. >> Ratliff: WHAT'S YOUR LEASE? >> SOMEWRE BETWEEN 20 AND 30 UNITS A MONTH, SO A YEAR, A LITTLE LESS THAN A YEAR. >> Ratliff: OKAY. I THINK THERE'S A COMPROMISE IN THERE SOMEWHERE. I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT IS. I'M NOT TRYING TO SOLVE IT TONIGHT. BUT I THINK THERE'S A COMPROMISE IN THERE SOMEWHERE TO DO SOMETHING OTHER THAN PERMIT. I THINK THE PROBLEM IS A SKEPTICISM OF THE COMMITMENT TO CONSTRUCT THE OFFICE BUILDING, NOT JUST -- >> I TOTALLY UNDERSTAND. WE THESE DISCUSSIONS A LOT, RIGHT? AND IT'S A REALITY OF OUR BUSINESS TO BE ABLE TO GET SOMETHING OUT OF THE GROUND, TOO. I'NOT COMINGN HERE PROMISING YOU SOMETHING THAT I KNOW I CAN'T DELIVER. AND SO I HEAR YOU. I UNDERSTAND THAT SKEPTICISM. WE'VE NEVER DONE THAT. YOU CAN LOOK AT OUR TRACK RECORD. AND THAT GOES A LONG WAY, I WOULD THINK. BUT AGAIN, WE'RE WE'RE COMMITTO WHAT WE KNOW WE CAN DO AND CAN PROVIDE THE CITY. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER TONG. MICROPHONE PLEASE. >> Tong: SORRY. THANKS CHAIRMAN. JUST A LAST QUICK CLARIFICATION ON THE USE OF THAT GARAGE IN YOUR, KIND OF, PLAN THERE. IS THAT A GARAGE SPECIFICALLY FOR THE OFFICE BUILDING, OR IS IT ALSO GOING TO BE USED BY THE RESIDENTIAL? >> NO, THEY'RE SEPARATE USES. SO I THINK YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE SOUTHERN-MOST GARAGE. >> Tong: RIGHT. >> THAT IS JUST FOR THE OFFICE. >> Tong: SO THAT WILL BE BUILT TOGETHER WITH THE OFFICE IF IT WERE GOING TO BE BUILT. AND THE RESIDENTIAL APARTMENTS HAVE THEIR OWN GARAGE? >> THAT'S CORRECT. IT'S A WRAP CONSTRUCTION GARAGE. AND THEN THE UNITS WRAPROUND IT. >> Tong: GOT YOU. THANK YOU. >> Chair Downs: WOW. NOBODY ELSE -- NOBODY PUSHED A BUTTON. [ LAUGHING ] >> Chair Downs: WHAT HAVE YOU GOT? SHOULD WE HAVE A FOLLOWUP? GO AHEAD. >> WHILE THE APPLICANT IS STILL HERE, I HAVE A FOLLOWUP FOR COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF. YOU ASKED THE QUESTION ABOUT THE HMMH NOISE STUDY. I THINK WHAT GAVE STAFF THE IMPRESSION THAT THE GARAGE AND THE OFFICE BUILDING WERE INCLUDED IS ON PAGE 19, SECTION 6, IT STATES THAT THE MOST EFFECTIVE OUTDOOR NOISE MITIGATION HASEEN INTEGRATED INTO THE SITE DESIGN, THE SITE CONFIGURATION UTILIZES A SIX-STORY GARAGE AND A 64-FOOT TALL OFFICE BUILDING LOCATED ON THE SOUTHERN PART OF THE PROPERTY. AND THE SITE PLAN REDUCES NOISE CONDITIONS ON MOST OF THE SITE TO BELOW THE REQUIRED GUIDELINES, BUT THERE ARE STILL SOME LOCATIONS THAT EXCEED THE NOISE THRESHOLD. SO THAT'S THE LANGUAGE THAT GAVE US THAT IMPRESSION. SO. >> IS THAT BASED ON SOME KIND OF DATA? >> I CAN GIVE YOU WHAT I'VE BEEN TOLD. >> YES. >> WHICH IS THE UPPER-MOST UNITS OF THE MULTIFAMILY IS ABOVE ALL OF THE COMMERCIAL STRUCTURES AND THEY'RE AT SIMILAR HEIGHT TO THE HIGHWAY, WHICH MEANS THAT THOSE ARE THE LOUDEST UNITS SET ON THE PROPERTY. AND SO WHAT HMMH SAID IS EVERYTHING BELOW THAT IS GOING TO BE LEVELS BELOW THOSE. THOSE AT THE TOP, WHICH HAVE THE HIGHEST, AREN'T ABOVE THAT 75-DECIBEL REQUIREMENT. AND SO IF WE APPLY OUR MITIGATIONS FOR EVERYTHING ELSE, THEN WE WOULD COMPLY. >> RIGHT. I THINK THAT MAYBE WE'RE JUST TALKING PAST EACH OTHER ON THIS, BECAUSE THE STANDARD IS 65. MITIGATE BETWEEN 65 AND 75. SO ANYTHING ABOVE 65 REQUIRES MITIGATION. >> RIGHT. AND SO OUR MITIGATIONS FOR BEING ABOVE 65, FOR BEING BETWEEN 65 AND 75 ARE THE TWO ACTIONS OF NO BALCONY OR PATS OR OUTDOOR SPACE ALONG THE ENTIRE SOUTHERN FACADE OF THAT. AND THE MITIGATION OF -- THIS KIND OF GOES INTO THE SAME COMMENTS ON THE TOWNHOMES OF WHY DIDN'T YOU STUDY THE THREE OTHER FLOORS. WELL, THERE'S NO OUTDOOR SPACE IN THE OTHER FLOORS. SO IF WE'RE PROTECTING THE INTERIOR OF THE UNIT AND THERE IS NO OUTDOOR SPACE ON THOSE UNITS, THEN WE'VE REACHED THE MITIGATIONS NEEDED IN THAT 65 TO 75 LEVEL, MY UNDERSTANDING. >> I'L JUS STATE THAT THE REPORT DOES STATE THAT THERE ARE SOME LOCATIONS THAT EXCEED THE 65 LEVEL EXTERIOR NOISE THRESHOLD. >> WHICH TRIGGERED THOSE MITIGATIONS, WHICH IS WHAT WE APPLIED TO OUR PD STIPULATIONS. BECAUSE IF IT WAS BELOW 65, MY UNDERSTANDING IS THERE'S NO MITIGATIONS NEEDED, IS THAT RIGHT? >> AND THERE'S NO MITIGATIONS BELOW 65. I THINK THE CHALLENGE IS THAT THE PD LANGUAGE IS NOT CLEAR THT THE LOCATION WHERE IT STATES THAT NO BALCONIES WILL BE ON THE SOUTHERN FACADE IS PART OF A PARAGRAPH THAT FOLLOWS A SENTENCE REFERENCING MULTIFAMILY. AND SO IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S ONLY REFERENCING MULTIFAMILY. >> AGAIN, I WISH I HAD THE PD LANGUAGE IN FRONT OF ME. >> Chair Downs: THERE'S OBVIOUSLY CONFUSION IN THIS ISSUE AND I'M NOT WILLING TO PUT THIS TO A VOTE IF WE CAN'T GET THIS STRAIGHT. AND SO IF YOU'RE NOT -- YOU'RE INTERPRETING IT ONE DIRECTION. STAFF'S INTERPRETING IT ANOTHER DIRECTION. IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU GUYS NEED TO TALK, MAYBE WITH THE NOISE PERSON IN THE ROOM, TO FIGURE THIS OUT. >> WE HAVE THE NOISE CONSULTANT, I BELIEVE, ON THE LINE. >> Chair Downs: IS -- I UNDERSTAND THAT. BUT LET ME ASK THIS QUESTION OF STAFF AND IN PARTICULAR MS. DAY SITTING RIGHT HERE. IS SOME COMMUNICATION FROM THE NOISE CONSULTANT AT THIS MEETING GOING TO CONVINCE YOU, OR ARE YOU GOING TO FEEL COMFORTABLE SAYING YES, THEY'RE MEETING THE REQUIREMENTS, OR ARE WE GOING TO HAVE TO MAKE SUBSTANTIAL CHANGES TO THE PD DOCUMENT FOR US TO CONSIDER? >> I THINK WE NEED TO CHANGE THE PD LANGUAGE FOR STAFF TO BE COMFORTABLE WITH IT MEETING THE STANDARDS THAT ARE BEING EXPRESSED. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. SO, THERE'S TWO OR THREE THINGS GOING ON HERE. AND I THINK -- I DON'T WANT US TO GO BACK AND FORTH ON THIS ISSUE, I DON'T. I DON'T WANT US TO -- RIGHT NOW I GET A SENSE THIS ISN'T GOING YOUR DIRECTION WITH THIS KIND OF UNCERTAINTY. AND THE REASON I ASK STAFF ABOUT THEIR ABILITY OR WILLINGNESS TO SAY YEAH, WE'RE GOOD WITH IT, BASED ON A VIRTUAL PRESENTATION BY SOMEBODY -- I WANT TO GIVE YOU EVERY OPPORTUNITY TO SUCCEED. AND THIS IS NOT GOING T HAPPEN TONIGHT. THERE MIGHT BE A VARIETY OF OTHER REASONS THAT THIS ISN'T GOING TO MOVE FORWARD. BUT IF THIS ISSUE ISN'T CLEAR FOR EVERYBODY HERE, IT'S NOT GOING TO BE GOOD. >> UNDERSTOOD. >> Chair Downs: SO, I'VE GOT A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS FOR YOU, AND THEN WE CAN KIND OF DECIDE WHERE WE'RE GOING TO GO FROM THERE. >> CHAIR DOWNS, WE DO HAVE ANOTHER REGISTERED SPEAKER FOR ITEM 1B. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. THANK YOU. THE PHASING. I GET IT. NO DEMAND FOR OFFICE SPACE, WHY WOULD YOU BUILD AN OFFICE SPACE THAT'S GOING TO SET EMPTY FOR WHO KNOWS HOW LONG. YOU COULD BUILD A VERY UNIQUE OFFICE SPACE AND MAYBE YOU WOULD CCANNIBALIZE PEOPLE FROM SOUTH F 190 OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, BUT CERTAINLY THE FINANCING MAKES A LOT OF SENSE. RIGHT NOW INTEREST RATES ARE GOING UP. THEY'RE HIGH, WHATEVER. THREE YEARS FROM NOW, MAYBE YOU'RE IN A DIFFERENT ENVIRONMENT. THE FINANCING IS SEPARATE. PULL THAT APART AND LET'S FORGET ABOUT THAT. HOW YOU'RE GOING TO PAY FOR IT IS YOUR ISSUE. OUR ISSUE IS LAND USE, OKAY? AND WE HAVE A COMPREHENVE PLAN THAT SAYS PHASING IS IMPORTANT. SO WE'RE ALL HUNG UP ON THE PHASING ISSUE. YOU'VE SAID I'M GOING TO BREAK THIS HOUSING INTO TWO PIECES AND TIE THE HOUSING -- HALF OF IT -- TO THE COMMERCIAL. WHY NOT DO THE COMMERCIAL AS PHASE TWO AND THE OTHER PART OF THE HOUSING AS PHASE THREE? BREAK IT INTO THREE PHASES. THEN YOU CAN'T DO THE THIRD PHASE WITH THE REST OF THE HOUSING UNTIL YOU'VE STARTED ACTUALLY DOING THE COMMERCIAL. THAT MIGHT BE THREE YEARS FROM NOW. IT MIGHT BE TWO YEARS FROM NOW. IT MIGHT BE 18 MONTHS. WHO KNOWS. BUT THAT MIGHT BE SOMETHING ELSE TO CONSIDER THAT ALL OF US WOULD BE A LITTLE MORE COMFORTABLE WIND UP WITH HOUSING AND NO COMMERCIAL. JUST A THOUGHT. SEE A FEW NODS. I'M LOOKING FOR A SOLUTION AS COMMISSIONER RATLIFF HAD SAID TO HOW DO YOU TIE THIS TOGETHER FROM A FINANCING STANDPOINT. I UNDERSTAND YOU CAN'T TIE IT TO THE C.O. OF SOMETHING ELSE. >> YEP. >> Chair Downs: SO THAT'S A THOUGHT. I WOULD ASK AT THIS TIME, WE HAVE ANOTHER SPEAKER. SO BEFORE WE CAN JUST GO ON AND TAKE A WHOLE LOT OF ACTION HERE -- I'M SORRY, WHAT? >> [ OFF MIC ] >> Chair Downs: I UNDERSTAND. SO BEFORE WE START TAKING ANY ACTION, COMMISSIONER RATLIFF, YOU HAVE A COMMENT. >> Ratliff: I HAVE A QUESTION FOR STAFF. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. SPEAK. >> Ratliff: KIND OF A FOLLOWUP QUESTION FOR STAFF. AND I DON'T KNOW IF WE KNOW THE ANSWER TO THIS. AND SO MAYBE IT'S AN OPEN QUESTION THAT NEEDS TO BE ANSWERED. DOES IT MATTER PHASING-WISE IF IT'S THE COMMERCIAL OR THE HOTEL? DOES THAT MATTER FROM A MITIGATION STANDPOINT? HAS THAT BEEN LOOKED AT? AND I THINK IF IT HASN'T IT SHOULD BE. IF IT HAS, I'D LIKE TO KNOW WHAT THAT ANSWER IS. >> WE CAN GET INTO MORE DETAIL ON THIS, BUT I THINK BASED ON THAT PARAGRAPH THAT I READ THAT SPECIFICALLY CITED THE OFFICE BUILDING AND THE PARKING GARAGE, I WOULD SUGGEST THAT THAT IS NOT WHAT THE NOISE CONSULTANT CITED AS THE MITIGATING FACTOR. SO I THINK IF WE'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT -- IF WHAT YOU ARE CARING ABOUT IS MITIGATION AND WHAT YOU ARE CARING ABOUT IS THE OFFICE BUILDING, THAT THE PHASING NEEDS TO BE EXPLICIT TO THAT LOCATION AND THOSE STRUCTURES. >> Ratliff: MY OPEN QUESTION IN MY MIND IS, I UNDERSTAND THERE ARE CHALLENGES WITH OFFICE BUILDINGS IN THIS ECONOMY. WOULD THE POTENTIAL CONSTRUCTION OF THE HOTEL BE SUFFICIENT MITIGATION AS AN EITHER/OR? AND I THINK -- I'M NOT SUGGESTING WE TRY TO ANSWER THAT HERE TONIGHT. AS AN OPTION. I THINK THAT'S JUST A QUESTION I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW AN ANSWER TO. >> Chair Downs: I THINK THAT'S A REASONABLE QUESTION, AND I THINK THEY'RE QUITE CLEAR -- WE'RE ALL CONCERNED ABOUT THE PHASING. THEY KNOW THAT. THEY CAME IN AND ASKED US THIS KNOWING THAT THAT WAS GOING TO BE AT THE TOP OF OUR LIST. YOU'RE GOING TO BUILD ALL THIS HOUSING AND NO COMMERCIAL? BUT WE ALSO WERE ALL SMART OUGH TO REALIZE THA IN THE CURRENT ECONOMIC ENVIRONMENT, JUST THROWING UP AN OFFICE BUILDING IS REAL EXPENSIVE IN ORDER TO BUILD A FEW APARTMENTS. SO I THINK WE JUST LOOK FOR A DIFFERENT KIND OF SOLUTION THERE. WE MAY HAVE MORE QUESTIONS FOR YOU, BUT I DO WANT TO GET TO WHOEVER THE OTHER SPEAKER IS ON ITEM 1B. AND THEN WE CAN CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND HAVE SOME DIALOGUE. SO. >> MR. MIKE ARTY. >> GOOD EVENING. I'M BE VERY BRIEF. WE ARE NEIGHBORS. >> Chair Downs: PLEASE GIVE US YOUR NAME AND THE ADDRESS THAT -- >> MIKE ARTIS, 701 TAYLOR DRIVE. JUST NEXT TO PLANO PARKWAY. SOME OF OUR PROPERTY IS ON PLANO PARKWAY. AND WE MANAGE A HOUSE THERE. AND I SUPPORT THEIR PLAN. I THINK THERE NEEDS TO BE MORE RESIDENTIAL THERE. AND THAT'S WHAT I WANT TO SAY. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. THANK YOU. >> MHMM. >> Chair Downs: THANK YOU. OKAY. IS THERE ANYTHING -- SPECIFIC QUESTIONS IN THE PUBLIC HEARING SPOT FOR THE APPLICANT AT THIS POINT? I THINK MIKE, YOU HAD YOUR BUTTON ON, BUT -- FOR CHRISTINE. OKAY. I'M GOING TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. THAT DOESN'T MEAN WE WON'T HAVE ANOTHER QUESTION FOR YOU ONCE THAT'S CLOSED, BUT LET'S CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. GO AHEAD, COMMISSIONER BRONSKY. >> SHOULD WE BE ABLE TO FIGURE OUT A WAY TO RECONCILE THE EHA ISSUE, WILL ALL OF THE OTHER ISSUES STILL EXIST, AND STAFF WOULD PROBABLY STILL BE IN THE SAME POSITION OF RECOMMENDING DENIAL FOR THIS? >> I THINK THE EHA IS AN IMPORTANT ISSUE, BUT I DON'T I THINK SOME OF THE OTHER. COMPREHENSIVE PLAN ISSUES ARE IMPORTANT ON THE PHASING, PERCENTAGES, AND SO FORTH. SO I THINK WE'D REALLY HAVE TO WEIGH THAT PRETTY CLOSELY. I DON'T THINK WE'VE REALLY THOUGHT THROUGH EXACTLY HOW THAT WOULD FULLY IMPACT. SO, IT WOULD HAVE A SIGNIFICANT IMPACT. >> Bronsky: TO BE CLEAR, THE STUDY THEY'RE PRESENTING ON THE FIRST PAGE AFTER THE MAP, IT SAYS THE RESULTS OF THE ANALYSIS INDICATE FUTURE NOISE LEVELS AT THE BUILDING PLANNED FOR A SENSITIVE LAND USE RESIDENTIAL WILL NOT EXCEED 75, NOT REFERENCING THE 65 THAT WE ARE AT. SURE EVEN IF FIGURING OUT THE ANSWER TO THE EHA STILL DOESN'T GET RID OF THE PHASING -- DOESN'T REMOVE SEVERAL OF THE OTHER ISSUES THAT WE'VE GOT WITH THE ENTIRE PLAN. THANK YOU. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. ISES WITH THE PLAN.RE STILL I'M ACTUALLY GLAD THAT THIS MAP WAS LEFT UP. I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S WHAT'S SHOWING UP THERE. IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS. THE IDEA THAT WE LOOK AT THIS NOT IN -- THROUGH THE LENSE OF THE 19.1 ACRES BUT OF THIS CORNER, THIS CORNER RIGHT HERE, I THINK IS VERY IMPORTANT, BECAUSE WE'VE GOT APARTMENTS THERE ALREADY THAT ARE ISOLATED. THEY BY THEMSELVES AREN'T ENOUGH TO DRIVE REVITALIZATION OF THESE AREAS. AND SO I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WE REALLYOOK AT THIS A LITTLE BIT MORE HOLISTICALLY IN TERMS OF HOW DO YOU APPROACH THIS CORNER OF GEORGE BUSH AND 75. THERE'S NO OTHER GREEN SPACE. THAT'S A CHALLENGE, OBVIOUSLY, FOR THIS AREA. AND SO HAVING THIS PARK THERE I THINK IS IMPORTANT. WE TEND TO DISCOUNT -- WE'RE LOOKING AT THIS PHASING AS WE'RE BUILDING THESE RESIDENTIAL AREAS BUT WE'RE NOT BUILDING ANY COMMERCIAL TO GO ALONG WITH THEM. BUT THERE'S ALREADY COMMERCIAL SITTING THERE. IF YOU WERE TO STEP BACK AND SAY THEY WERE GOING TO GO AHEAD AND BUILD THAT BUILDING, THAT OFFICE BUILDING THAT'S DOWN ON THE BOTTOM LEFT THERE AND THE BUILDINGS THAT ARE ON THE UPPER LEFT, AND THIS RESIDENTIAL, WE WOULD SAY WE'RE PROBABLY FINE. SO I REALIZE THAT THE IDEA IS HERE YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO LOOK AT A DEVELOPMENT THE WAY IT SITS CONTAINED. BUT THIS IS KIND OF A UNIQUE SPACE. THE OTHER THING ABOUT IT IS IF THIS WAS IN A NEIGHBORHOOD AND THEY HAD 100% SUPPORT OF THE NEIGHBORS AROUND THEM WE'D BE CHEERING THEM ON. HERE, BECAUSE THE NEIGHBORS ARE COMMERCIAL, WE'RE KIND OF LIKE, OKAY, IT'S COMMERCIAL BUSINESS OWNERS. IT'S IMPORTANT THAT THE NEIGHBORS AROUND THEM ARE HOPING THAT WHAT THIS DEVELOPMENT DOES IS REVITALIZE THEIR BUSINESS AND BRING VALUE TO THEIR PROPERTY. SO I THINK THE APPLICANT'S HIT ON SOMETHING KEY, WHICH IS WE'VE GOT TO DO SOMETHING TO JUMP-START THIS. WE ALREADY KNOW THAT COMMERCIAL'S A PROBLEM. SO THE CHANCES THAT THIS THING IS GOING TO GET TORN DOWN AND TURNED INTO A BIG OFFICE PARK IS SLIM TO NONE ANYTIME SOON. IT COULD BE A LONG TIME FROM NOW. THE OTH THING THAT I'M ENVISIONING IS THAT PLANO PARKWAY CROSSES OVER 75 AND NOW YOU'RE AT COLLIN CREEK. IT'S GOING TO HAVE A TON OF RETAIL, DINING, A LOT OF OTHER OPTIONS. WHAT'S BEEN TALKED ABOUT FOR YEARS AT THE CITY IS, PART OF THE COLLIN CREEK DEVELOPMENT IS A TROLLEY THAT RUNS DOWN 15TH, AROUND THROUGH COLLIN CREEK, UP PLANO PARKWAY TO AVENUE K AND DOWN AVENUE K, WHICH WILL SOON BE DEVELOPED ALL THE WAY TO DOWNTOWN. SO YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE A LITTLE TROLLEYYSTEM WCH I THINK WILL PROVIDE A TON OF OPPORTUNITY FOR ANYBODY LIVING IN THIS AREA TO EXPERIENCE A LOT OF DIFFERENT TYPES OF ENJOYMENT. SO, I RECOGNIZE THE CHALLENGES WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN AND WHAT IT'S REQUIRING, BUT WHEN I LOOK AT IT OVERALL AS PART OF A BIGGER ZONE HERE, WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING. AND I DON'T THINK THIS IS NECESSARILY A BAD IDEA. I LIKE THE FACT THAT THEY WENT FROM A MUCH HIGHER DENSITY DEVELOPMENT TO ONE THAT CONTAINS SOMEWNER-OCCUPIED THE TOWNHOMES. THEY'LL BE UNIQUE. THEY'LL HAVE SOME CHALLENGES. BUT WE ALSO KNOW WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH RESIDENTIAL IN THE CITY. HOME BUILDERS ARE NOT BUILDING ENOUGH HOUSES IN THE COUNTRY. SO I THINK THE IDEA THAT ORA 190 IS 90 PLUS PERCENT RENTED AND THEY ARE RIGHT UP AGAINST THE HIGHWAY -- THESE ARE GOING TO BE EVEN NICER AND NOT AS CLOSE. THEY'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE ANY TROUBLE SELLING ANY OF THESE UNITS AND THEY'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE ANY TROUBLE RENTING THE MULTIFAMILY WHEN IT GETS RENTED. I SEE FAR MORE POSITIVES TO THIS DEVELOPMENT. WE HAVE TO RESOLVE THE NOISE ISSUE THROUGH MITIGATION EFFORTS. I UNDERSTOOD -- AS I MENTIONED TO MS. DAY, I THINK WHERE THAT MISCOMMUNICATION TOOK PLACE THERE, I THINK IT CAN BE RESOLVED. I DO AGREE -- AND ALTHOUGH -- TO COMMISSIONER BRONSKY'S POINT, I DON'T WANT THIS TO FEEL LIKE WE'RE DESIGNING FROM THE DAIS. BUT WHAT I AND COMMISSIONER RATLIFF HAD PROPOSED WAS SOME SOMETHING THAT'S TEMPORARY ALONG THAT SOUTHERN LINE JUST TO MAKE IT A LITTLE NICER ENVIRONMENT UNTIL SUCH TIME AS YOU GET THE STRUCTURES IN PLACE. ONCE THE STRUCTURES GO UP YOU HAVE A WHOLE OTHER LIST OF ISSUES BECAUSE THAT ONE ROW IS GOING TO BE LOOKING AT PARKING GARAGE. WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO TO MAKE THAT NICE? THERE'S SOME QUESTIONS STILL TO BE ANSWERED THERE. BUT OVERALL, I SEE THIS AS A VERY POSITIVE OPPORTUNITY FOR THIS ENTIRE CORNER. SO THERE'S SOME ISSUES TO BE RESOLVED. I THINK THE PHASING AND THE IDEA OF MAYBE DOING PHASE TWO COMMERCIAL, PHASE THREE THE REMAINING OF THE RESIDENTIAL GIVES YOU AN INCENTIVE TO LOOK FOR A GOOD TENANT FOR THAT COMMERCIAL AREA AND MAYBE GET THAT STARTED SOONER RATHER THAN LATER. SO THOSE ARE MY THOUGHTS AND KNOWING THAT WE HAVE SOME DIALOGUE, ULTIMATELY MY GOAL IS GOING TO BE TO MOVE TO TABLE THIS. CAN WE TABLE THIS TO THE 20TH, OR DO WE HAVE ENOUGH TIME FOR NOTICE, OR WHAT'S THE THOUGHT PROCESS THERE? OR IS STAFF COMFORTABLE THAT YOU CAN GET THE ANSWERS YOU NEED IN TIME TO CHANGE THE PD LANGUAGE SO THAT WE CAN NOTICE FOR THE 20TH? >> I THINK THERE'S NO NOTICE ISSUE, BECAUSE YOU'RE CONTINUING THE HEARING TO THAT DATE. I THINK THE QUESTION -- WHAT I'D REALLY LIKE TO DO IS COME BACK TO HEAR WHAT THE COMMISSION HAS TO SAY AND THEN WE COULD PROBABLY AT THE END OF THE DISCUSSION GIVE YOU A BETTER IDEA OF BEH BASED ON THE FEEDBA, HOW MUCH TIME IT'S GOING TO TAKE. >> Chair Downs: THERE'S A WHOLE LOT OF SPEAKER LIGHTS ON. I'VE GOT TO GET USED TO LOOKING AT THIS BOARD. IANT TO LOOK AROUE WHO'S DOING THIS. PICK ME, PICK ME. COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF. >> Brounoff: THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN. YOUR COMMENTS SEEM TO DESCRIBE THIS PROPOSAL AS A DIAMOND IN THE ROUGH. I AGREE. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE IT LESS ROUGH. I THINK THAT TABLING THIS WOULD BE THE BEST WAY TO ACCOMPLISH THIS. I WOULD LIKE TO GIVE THE APPLICANT THE OPPORTUNITY TO MEET WITH THE STAFF AND THE CONSULTANT IF NECESSARY AND SEE WHAT COMPROMISES THEY MIGHT COME TO THAT COULD ALLOW US TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THIS. I THINK YOUR PROPOSAL AND MR. RATLIFF'S PROPOSAL AS TO THE PHASING ARE WORTH CONSIDERING. THOSE ARE POSITIVE SUGGESTIONS. SO BASED ON THAT, I'D BE WILLING TO MOVE THAT WE TABLE THIS TO WHATEVER DATE CHRISTINA MAY COME UP WITH. >> Chair Downs: LET'S GO THROUGH THE REST OF THE COMMENTS AND WE'LL LET SOMEBODY MAKE A MOTION. BOY, THE LIGHTS ARE GOING ON ALL OVER THE PLACE. COMMISSIONER OLLEY. >> Olley: I'M STRUCK BY THE SUMMARY. SO THIS REQUEST IS TO REZONE FROM CORRIDO COMMERCIAL TO BLPLANNED DEVELOPMENT CORRIDOR COMMERCIAL. AND THIS THIRD SENTENCE BY STAFF SAID THIS REQUEST WILL AID IN THE CITY'S GOAL OF REDEVELOPMENT. RIGHT UNDER IT, GOES, THE PROPOSAL DOES NOT HAVE THE ADEQUATE ZONING STANDARDS TO ENSURE THAT THE CITY'S GOAL OF REDEVELOPMENT IS -- GIVEN THAT A LOT OF THIS PROPOSAL IS UNCLEAR BASED ON ECONOMIC CONDITIONS, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, YOU KNOW, AND SOME UNCERTAINTY AND WHAT HAVE YOU, I WOULD LOVE AS MUCH CONCRETE CLARITY IN THE PROPOSAL AND IN STANDARDS TO FEEL COMFORTABLE TO MOVE FORWARD. SO, I'M ALIGNED. I THINK IT'S A GOOD SOLVE FOR THAT PIECE OF LAND. BUT TO PROTECT PLANO IN THE FUTURE, AS MUCH CLARITY AS POSSIBLE IN THOSE STANDARDS IS REQUIRED. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER RATLIFF. >> Ratliff: THANK YOU, CHAIRMAN. I WANT TO ECHO SOME OF THE COMMENTS YOU SAID ABOUT TREATING THIS AS A LARGER AREA. I COMPLETELY AGREE THAT THAT IS KIND OF THE WAY I WAS LOOKING AT THIS. BUT TO ELABORATE ON THAT POINT A LITTLE BIT, I REALIZE IT'S NOT IN PLANO, BUT THE CITYLINE DEVELOPMENT HAS ANCHORED THIS INTERSECTION AND THEN WE'VE GOT THE OTHER ANCHOR AT COLLIN CREEK. I SEE THIS AS MUCH AS A BRIDGE BETWEEN THOSE TWO AND TURNING THAT INTO ONE -- I'M NOT GOING TO CALL IT A COHESIVE DEVELOPMENT, BUT AT LEAST A CONNECTED DEVELOPMENT. THE OTHER THING THAT IN MY MIND IS VERY POSITIVE ABOUT THIS -- AND I'VE ALREADY SAID THIS ONCE, BUT IT BEARS REPEATING -- IS THAT IF WE'RE GOING TO TRY TO DO TRANSIT -ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT, THERE IS NO BETTER PLACE TO DO IT THAN WALKING DISTANCE FROM A D.A.R.T. STATION THAT HAS THREE LINES, OR WILL SHORTLY HAVE THREE LINES. AND THE PEDESTRIAN CONNECTIVITY IS BETTER THAN MOST DOWN THERE. AS A DOWNTOWN RESIDENT, I LIKE THAT THEY CAN WALK DOWN THERE, GET ON THE TRAIN, COME DOWNTOWN, AND HELP OUR AND SO I SEE THAT BEING BENEFICIAL TO THE DOWNTOWN AREA AND THE COLLIN CREEK AREA HAVING THIS ADDITIONAL POPULATION DENSITY. AND THE OTHER THING THAT I I THINK ONE OF THEAID IS THAT- RESERVATIONS THAT WE OFTEN HAVE ABOUT MULTIFAMILY IS ADJACENCY TO ANY SINGLE-FAMILY AREAS. THERE IS NONE OF THAT ISSUE HERE. THERE'S NO SINGLE-FAMILY WITHIN PROBABLY A MILE OF HERE, AND SO THERE'S NOT A RESIDENTIAL ADJACENCY ISSUE THAT I CAN EVEN IMAGINE. AS A RESULT, WHEN WE LOOK AT THE OPPORTUNITIES FOR REDEVELOPMENT AND UNDEVELOPED LAND WITHIN OUR CITY, IF THERE'S ANY PLACE THAT WE SHOULD CONSIDER ADDITIONAL MULTIFAMILY, THAT SEEMS LIKE THE IDEAL OPPORTUNITY. SO I THINK WE CAN WORK THROUGH -- OR I HOPE THE STAFF AND THE DEVELOPER CAN WORK THROUGH OUR PHASING CONCERNS AND OUR MITIGATION CONCERNS BECAUSE I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF REAL POSITIVES ABOUT THIS, I JUST THINK WE'VE GOT TO FIGURE OUT THOSE DETAILS TO GET US WHERE WE CAN BE COMFORTABLE KNOWING THAT BOTH IN THE SHORT TERM AND IN THE LONG TERM THAT IT'S A QUALITY PLACE TO LIVE FOR THE RESIDENTS THAT ARE GOING TO MOVE THERE. I LOOK FORWARD TO HOW YOU SOLVE THOSE PROBLEMS. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER CARY. >> Cary: YEAH, A LOT OF GOOD COMMENTS HAVE BEEN MAD AND A LOT OF GOOD QUESTIONS ASKED. YOU KNOW, THIS IS AN IMPORTANT PIECE OF PROPERTY TO OUR CITY AND WHILE I GUESS THERE WAS A COMMENT MADE THAT MAYBE THIS IS A CHALLENGING PIECE OF PROPERTY TO GET TO BUT IT ALSO SITS AT THE INTERSECTION OF SOME VERY, VERY VIBRANT ROADS, AND SO THAT MAKES THIS A REALLY IMPORTANT PIECE OF PROPERTY. I GO BACK TO THE LAST TIME SOMETHING VERY SIMILAR CAME IN HERE AND THERE WERE I THOUGHT SOME GOOD QUESTIONS ASKED AND IT GOT PHED OFF BECAUSE IT WAS BELIEVED THAT THERE MIGHT BE A BETTER USE FOR THIS PROPERTY THAN A LOT OF MULTIFAMILY. AND SO, YOU KNOW, THAT WAS THE LAST TIME THAT SOMETHING SIMILAR CAME IN. YOU KNOW, THIS POSSIBLY COULD JUMPSTART THE AREA BUT I WOULD SUGGEST THAT COLLIN CREEK IS PROBABLY THE REAL JUMP START OF THE WHOLE AREA. YOU KNOW, THERE ARE A LOT OF LOOSE ENDS. THERE'S A LOT OF POSITIVES IN HERE. WE LOOK AT THE GREEN SPACE AND GO, THAT'S GREAT. YOU CERTAINLY COULD MAKE A CASE THAT MORE DENSITY HERE WILL PROVIDE MORE ENERGY TO THIS AREA. THAT'S PROBABLY TRUE. BUT I THINK COLLIN CREEK WILL JUMP START THIS, AND THERE'S A LOT OF WORK TO BE DONE THERE YET AND A LOT OF UNKNOWN. WHILE WE'VE GOT AN ESTIMATE THAT THERE'S A LOT MORE HOUSING DEMAND FOR THAT HERE -- I GUESS WE'LL FIND THAT OUT ONCE COLLIN CREEK GETS BUILT, HERITAGE GETS BUILT. BUT THE COMMENT FREQUENTLY GETS MADE THAT WE NEED MORE HOUSING -- AND A LOT OF PEOPLE BELIEVE THAT'S TRUE. D SOME PLANO CITIZENS DON'T AGREE WITH THAT. THEY THINK WE HAVE ENOUGH CITIZENS HERE. MY QUESTION IS -- NOT TAKING EITHER SIDE -- DO WE NEED MORE HIGH-END MULTIFAMILY HOUSING? THAT'S WHAT THIS IS. THIS IS AT THE HIGHEST END MULTIFAMILY HOUSING. AND IN THIS COMMISSION A LOT OF TIMES IT'S NOT WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT NEEDING MORE HOUSING. I HEAR EMPLOYMENT HOUSING, AFFORDABLE HOUSING. I DON'T HEAR HIGH-END MULTIFAMILY HOUSING. I DON'T KNOW THAT I HAVE A CONCLUSION TO THAT BUT I THINK IT'S WORTH US CONSIDERING. AND THEN THERE'S SOME OTHER THINR PROJECT THAT CAUSE ME TO PAUSE. YOU KNOW, I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF GOOD DESIGN ELEMENTS IN HERE. ONE OF THE THINGS I LOOK AT. GOSH -- AND IT'S NOT FOR ME TO DECIDE, THE PEOPLE WHO WOULD ULTIMATELY BUY THESE WOULD. WOULD I WANT TO LIVE IN THE CANYON BETWEEN THESE TWO HIGH-RISES. I WONDER ARE THE TOWNHOMES PUT THERE KIND OF AS A PLACATION TO THIS COMMISSION. IF THAT'S THE CASE SHOULD WE EVEN WORRY ABOUT THAT? SHOULD WE GO WE'RE MESSING AROUND HERE AND DON'T NEED THOSE SINGLE-FAMILY HOMES. I DON'T KNOW. MY BIGGEST CONCERN IS THE PHASING, TIMING, AND THE GLUT OF COMMERCIAL AND THE FACT THAT WE HAVE NO IDEA WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN. MY FEAR IS DOWN THE ROAD WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN IS THAT WE WON'T HAVE 501 APARTMENTS HERE, WE'LL HAVE 1,000 APARTMENTS HERE BECAUSE THAT'S GOING TO BE THE BEST USE OF THIS LAND. BECAUSE I DON'T THINK WE HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT'S REALLY GOING TO HAPPEN. BY THE WAY, I'M NOT THROWING ASPERSIONS AT THESE GENTLEMEN'S INTENTIONS BECSE I THINK THEY CAME IN VERY WELL INTENTIONED AND THEY EXPECT TO DO WHAT THEY SAID THEY'RE GOING TO DO. BUT NONE OF US KNOW IF THAT'S REALLY GOING TO HAPPEN. THOSE ARE MY CONCERNS AND I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF LOOSE ENDS TO TIE UP. FOR THAT, YOU KNOW, I FULLY SUPPORT TABLING THIS TO SEE IF WE CAN WORK THROUGH MORE THINGS. IT IS AN IMPORTANT PIECE OF PROPERTY AND I THINK THESE GUYS, YOU KNOW, THEY HAVE DONE SOME INTERESTING THINGS SO I DON'T WANT TO THROW STONES. BUT I THINK THERE'S IMPORTANT QUESTIONS THAT NEED TO BE ASKED. THAT'S MY TWO CENTS. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER TONG. >> Tong: I AGREE WITH WHAT THE COMMISSIONER ALREADY SAID. THIS ITEM IS VERY IMPORTANT TO US, TO THE COMMISSION, TO THE CITY OF PLANO. IT'S A GREAT LOCATION. UNFORTUNATELY, IT SUFFERS VERY POOR ACCESSIBILITY. SO THAT'S WHY I THINK ONE OF THE REASONS WHY THE RETAIL, THE OFFICE, EVEN THE HOTEL MAY NOT SURVIVE AT ALL, EVEN IF WE BUILD IT BECAUSE THERE'S NO WAY TO GET TO IT. IT LOOKS GREAT. IT'S VERY HARD TO GET TO IT. SO THE RESIDENTIAL PIECE IS VERY CRUCIAL FOR THIS WHOLE AREA TO BE REVITALIZED, TO BE USEFUL IN SOME FORM AND FASHION. SO WE NEED TO HAVE RESIDENTIALS THERE. SHOULD WE HAVE HIGH-END RESIDENTIAL MULTIFAMILY SINGLE FAMILY? OUR PLANNED DEVELOPMENT OR OUR KIND OF COMPREHENSIVE PLAN DICTATES THAT. WHAT KIND OF USE WE CAN DO WITH THAT LAND. I THINK FOR THIS PARTICULAR PROJECT WE MAY HAVE TO BE A LITTLE BIT MORE CREATIVE, AS A WHOLE, AS A COMMISSION, AS A PLANNING AND ZONING. WE MAY HAVE TO BE A LITTLE BIT MORE CREATIVE. I'M NOT SURE IF HAVING THE PHASES IS THE SOLUTION HERE BECAUSE NO MATTER WHAT, I'M THINKING THAT EVEN IF THEY SAY WE HAVE PHASE 1, PHASE 2, PHASE 3, WE'RE GOING TO BUILD OFFICE, WE'RE GOING TO BUILD HOTEL. PERSONALLY, I THINK THOSE ARE JUST PLACEHOLDERS JUST TO GET THROUGH AND PERMISSION TO BUILD THE APARTMENTS. THEY MAY NEVER GET BUILT. I TOTALLY AGREE WITH THE STAFF MEMBERS' FEELING ABOUT THIS BECAUSE IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE TO HAVE ANYTHING THERE. IS THERE ANY ROOM OR ANY CHANCE THAT IN OUR PLAN WCAN WO IN SOME SMALLER PERCENTAGE OF COMMERCIAL WITHIN THE CURRENT PHASE 1 AREA? YOU KNOW, IN THE EHA-1 AREA INSTEAD OF HAVING ANYTHING REQUIRED IN THE EHA-2 AREA. HAVING GREEN LAND IS GREAT, I THINK THAT'S A GREAT IDEA BUT STILL I THINK THAT'S JUST A PLACEHOLDER THERE. THINK ABOUT ALL THE PLACES WE'VE BEEN TO. IF WE HAVE HOUSES THAT HAVE A BIG BACARDUT IFHERE'S A HIGHWAY BEHIND IT, WOULD YOU GO INTO THAT BACKYARD? ARE YOU GOING TO STAND IN THAT GREEN SPACE TO TALK TO ANYONE WHEN THERE'S A HIGHWAY OR CARS FLYING ABOVE YOUR HEAD? I THINK THAT'S A GREAT IDEA BUT IT'S NOT REALISTIC. SO THIS IS A QUESTION TO OUR STAFF MEMBER. SO I HEARD OF THE TOWNHOMES ARE KIND OF REQUIRED OR THEY HAVE TO BUILD SOMETHING LIKE THAT TO MEET THE REQUIREMENTS THERE. IS IT POSSIBLE THAT IF WE TURN SOME OF THOSE -- I'M JUST COMING UP WITH AN IDEA TRYING TO MAKE THIS WORK. IS IT POSSIBLE TO TURN THOSE INTO A CERTAIN PERCENTAGE OF COMMERCIAL SO THAT WE CAN FIT INTO THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN? I MEAN, I KNOW COMMISSIONER BRONSKY IS SHAKING HIS HEAD. I'M JUST TRYING TO THROW SOME IDEAS OUT THERE, TRYING TO MAKE IT WORK BECAUSE I THINK THIS IS AN IMPORTANT CORRIDOR THERE TO KIND OF MAKE SOME USE OUT OF IT. AND I THINK THE APPLICANTS HAVE DONE A LOT OF WORK AND TRIED TO MAKE IT WORK. IS THERE ANYTHING WE CAN DO TO MAKE IT HAPPEN? SO I FULLY SUPPORT THE SUGGESTION TO TABLE THIS, BUT HOW LONG I'M SEEKING STAFF'S SUGGESTIONS. IT MAY REQUIRE SOME WORK FROM THE APPLICANT. MAYBE THE APPLICANT IS WILLING OR NOT WILLING. THAT'S ANOTHER QUESTION. SO THAT'S JUST MY TWO CENTS. >> Cir Downs: MMISSIONER BRONSKY. >> Bronsky: I'M GOING TO START WITH A STATEMENT GOING BACK TO I'M REALLY STRUGGLING WITH THE IDEA THAT WE CONTINUE TO TRY TO REWORK A PLAN FROM THE DAIS. IT'S GREAT. WE HAD COMMENTS ABOUT GOOD SOLUTIONS, A LOT OF THIS OR A LOT OF THAT. REAL POSITIVES BUT WHEN WE CREATED THE COMPREHENSIVE LETTER THAT MR. WOLFFFACT THE SUBMITTED TALKING ABOUT THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN SAID THROUGH EACH OF THE STEPS OF THE PROCESS WE BELIEVE THE DEVELOPMENT PLAN HAS GOTTEN BETTER AND BETTER AND NOW BEST REPRESENTS THE NEEDS OF THIS PARTICULAR NEIGHBORHOOD IN PLANO AND BEST COMPLETES THE EXISTING MIXED-USE TOD NATURE OF THE AREA. THE IDEA THAT WE'RE GOING T FILL OUT FINDINGS FORM, THE ENVISIONMENT OF THAT WASN'T SOMETHING THAT WAS GOOD, WASN'T SOMETHING THAT WAS -- HAD A LOT OF POSITIVES BUT IT WAS SOMETHING THAT HAD A WOW FACTOR THAT WE SAID, YES, THIS ABSOLUTELY MAKES SENSE. BUT WE CONTINUE TO TRY TO FIND WAYS TO MAKE THIS FIT. THE APPLICANT HIMSELF, IF HE'S WILLING TO STAND BY HIS WORDS AND IF HE BELIEVES SO MUCH IN THIS COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, AS HE SAID HE DOES, THEN I'D BE HAPPY TO HAVE THIS TABLED SO THAT HE CAN THEN MAKE THE ENTIRE TNGN CONFORMANCE WITH THE PLAN, IF IT IS REALLY THE BEST REPRESENTATION OF THE NEEDS OF THIS PARTICULAR NEIGHBORHOOD. I WOULD GLADLY SUPPORT IT BUT I'M REALLY STRUGGLING WITH EVERYTHING ELSE THAT WE'RE TRYING TO REWORK THIS RIGHT HERE FROM THE DAIS. I DON'T THINK -- I MEAN, I RESPECT EACH OF YOU. I'M NOT SURE THAT THE TIME AND ENERGY THAT STAFF AND THE APPLICANT HAS ALREADY PUT IN, THAT WE'RE GIVING THEM A DUE BY CONTINUING TO TRY TO REMANUFACTURE THIS FROM THE DAIS. JUST MY THOHT. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. HAVE YOU HEARD ENOUGH? SO FROM A TIMING STANDPOINT, FOR THE 20th OR DO WE HAVE ALREADY -- I KNOW TWO OR THREE ZONING CASES ON THAT MEETING, ALTHOUGH WE KIND OF TALKED THIS ONE TO DEATH, HONESTLY. WE'RE EITHER GOING TO COME BACK WITH INFORMATION THAT ANSWERS OUR QUESTIONS AND GIVES US WHAT WE NEED TO MAKE A DECISION OR I'M KIND OF LIKE MR. BRONSKY, IF WE WENT THROUGH ANOTHER TWO HOURS AND TEN MINUTES OF DISCUSSION ON THIS PROJECT AFTER TONIGHT, IT'S PROBABLY NOT A GOOD FIT. >> WELL, I THINK THERE'S DEFINITELY A NEED TO CHANGE THE STANDARDS AND I THINK WE NEED TO TALK WITH THE APPLICANT ABOUT WHETHER AND HOW MUCH THEY'RE WILLING TO CHANGE THE DESIGN BASED ON THE COMMENTS HERE TONIGHT. SO I WOULD SUGGEST THAT WE TABLE IT, YOU KNOW, AT LEAST UNTIL APRIL 3rd, IF NOT APRIL 17th BECSE WE JUST CAN'T GET MEETINGS IN AND GET THINGS TURNED AROUND ON THE 20th. BUT IF WE TABLE IT TO THE 3rd IT MAY BE WE NEED TO TABLE IT FURTHER BUT THAT AT LEAST GIVES THE APPLICANT AN OPPORTUNITY TO MAKE SOME TEXT CHANGES, KIND OF A MINIMAL OPTION AND IF WE NEED MORE TIME, WE MAY BE ASKING FOR IT. >> Chair Downs: FIRST OFF, AS WAS MENTIONED A COUPLE OF TIMES, THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT PIECE OF PROPERTY SO I WAS A LITTLE TONGUE-IN-CHEEK THAT WE TALKED ABOUT IT FOR TWO HOURS. IF WE HAVE TO TALK ABOUT THIS FOR ANOTHER 15 HOURS OVER SIX MEETINGS TO GET IT RIGHT, I THINK IT'S WORTH IT. I THINK WHAT'S HERE IS SO CLOSE TO BEING AN EXCELLENT SOLUTION FOR THIS BUT I DON'T WANT TO THROW THIS AWAY AND START OVER. SO I'M HAPPY TO HAVE IT COME BACK A COUPLE OF TIMES WITH US TWEAKING IT UNTIL THE DEVELOPER'S WILLING TO DO WHAT THEY NEED TO DO FOR US TO BE HAPPY THAT WE HAVE A PJECT THAT IS WORTHY OF SITTING IN THAT LOCATION. SO THAT BEING SAID, I SAID YOU WEREN'T COMPLETELY OFF THE HOOK. CAN I SUGGEST THAT WE JUST GO TO THE 17th OF APRIL TO GIVE YOU PLENTY OF TIME? >> [OFF MIC] >> Chair Downs: I HAVE TO COMFORTABLE WITH ARE YOU APRIL 17th? >> SO FIRST OF ALL, I WANT TO THANK YOU, GUYS FOR RECOGNIZING HOW IMPORTANT A PIECE THIS IS. WE OBVIOUSLY THINK THAT AS WELL. WE'VE BEEN IN THIS PROCESS FOR THREE YEARS TRYING TO GET IT RIGHT. AND SO HOPEFULLY THAT'S RECOGNIZED BY THE CITY THAT THIS IS NOT SOMETHING THAT WE CAME IN AND SAID THIS IS WHAT WE WANT TO DO. IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT, WE'RE OUT OF HERE. THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE BELIEVE IN JUST AS IMPORTANT AS IT SOUNDS LIKE ALL OF YOU DO. I, LIKE CHAIR DOWNS, BELIEVE WE'RE CLOSE MAYBE SOME OF YOU DO OR DON'T. AGAIN, WE'VE GONE THROUGH, YOU KNOW, DOZENS OF ITERATIONS OF THIS THING SO I WOULD HATE TO START OVER AGAIN. I THINK THERE ARE CERTAIN ASPECTS OF THIS THAT I DO THINK WE CAN COLLECTIVELY COME TO SOLUTIONS ON, EHA, PHASING, PROTECTIONS OF STUFF LIKE THAT. IF THE COMMISSION THINKS THAT IT'S A MUCH BIGGER REDESIGN OF THE PROPERTY, THEN I WOULD PROBABLY SAY IT MAY NOT BE WORTH IT BUT IF WE THINK THAT IT'S SOME OF THE SMALLER ISSUES -- AGAIN, WE'VE BEEN AT THIS FOR THREE YEARS. WE'RE NOT GOING TO LET IT GO& BY THE WAYSIDE FOR A COUPLE OF WEEKS. I GUESS WHAT MY REQUEST WOULD BE, IF WE SHOOT MAYBE FOR THAT -- AGAIN, THIS IS MORE TO CHRISTINA AND STAFF. I THINK WE'RE CLOSE ON SOME OF THIS STUFF. I THINK GETTING EVERYBODY ON A PHONE CALL CAN HELP IN A LOT OF WAYS. THAT MAYBE WE CAN SHOOT FOR THAT APRIL 3RD, I BELIEVE. THE EARLIER ONE. IF WE CAN'T GET THERE IN TIME FOR STAFF REASONS AND WE PUSH IT ONE LATER , AGAIN, WE OWN THIS PROPERTY AND IT COSTS US MONEY EVERY MONTH TO OWN IT. AS A FIDUCIARY WE WAN TO MOVE THIS AS QUICKLY AS WE CAN. THAT'S WHAT MY POSITION WOULD BE. BUT WE WANT TO GET -- WE THINK THIS WOULD BE REALLY -- AGAIN, WE'VE SPOKEN A LOT TO A LOT OF OUR NEIGHBORS TO GET TO THIS POINT. I THINK WE HAVE MADE MASSIVE CHANGES FROM WHERE WE HAVE COME SO I THINK WE'RE CLOSE. IF Y'ALL THINK THE SAME, THEN I WOULD BE IN FAVOR OF THAT. >> Chair Downs: IS THAT OKAY WITH APRIL 3RD? >> YES, I THINK THAT'S FINE. WE'LL DO APRIL 3rd. >> Chair Downs: I'M GOING TO MAKE A MOTION TO TABLE THIS TO APRIL 3rd. >> SECOND. >> Chair Downs: AND I HAVE A SECOND BY COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF. NOW DISCUSSION. A VOTE YES WE'RE GOING TO TABLE THIS TO APRIL 3rd AND THAT'S BECAUSE YOU BELIEVE THAT WITH A FEW MINOR TWEAKS WE CAN GET THERE. A VOTE NO WOULD MEAN THEY COULD SPEND THE NEXT SIX MONTHS AND WE'RE PROBABLY NOT GOING TO GET THERE OR I DON'T WANT TO DESIGN THIS THING FROM THE DAIS. >> I WOULD LIKE US TO DELAY IT A LITTLE BIT LONGER. ONE OF THE REASONS WE DELAYED OUR NEXT MEETING IS BECAUSE WE'VE GOT SPRING BREAK AND THINGS COMING ON. AND I WOULD HATE TO COME BACK, IF WE DIDN'T GIVE THESE GUYS, EVERYONE ENOUGH TIME TO GIVE THIS THE FULL ATTENTION. I DON'T THINK ANY OF US WANT TO KEEP GOING AROUND AND AROUND AND THESE GENTLEMEN THINK THEY'RE CLOSE. I WOULD STRONGLY REQUEST THAT WE GIVE THEM A COUPLE MORE WEEKS TO THE 17th AND REALLY BRING THIS IN HERE AND LET EVERYBODY DO THEIR JOB AND TRY TO BRING IT IN ONE MORE TIME TO SEE IF WE CAN GET THERE. I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF POSITIVES AND A LOT OF QUESTIONS. BUT THAT'S MY SUGGESTION. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER OLLEY. >> Olley: THANK YOU FOR SPRING BREAK. I ALMOST FORGOT ABOUT THAT. AS A FATHER, I DON'T KNOW HOW I DID. BUT TO THE SENTIMENT THAT WAS -- FOR ME, I'M CLOSE. I JUST NEED THE CLARIFICATION OF THE STANDARDS. I NEED TO SEE HOW BEST WE CAN PROTECT THE CITY AND HOLD THE DEVELOPER AS CLOSE TO STANDARDS THAT CONFORM TO THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN AS POSSIBLE. I'M NOT TRYING TO DESIGN THE PROJECT, I JUST WANT TO SEE THE STANDARDS. >> I WAS JUST GOING TO ADD, I HADN'T THOUGHT ABOUT SPRING BREAK AS WELL, SO THAT'S A FAIR POINT. SO IF THAT'S -- I TOTALLY UNDERSTAND THAT, BOTH FROM OUR PERSPECTIVE AND FROM STAFF'S AND YOUR GUYS' PERSPECTIVE FROM A REVIEW. AND THAT WOULD BE OKAY WITH US. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER BRONSKY. >> Bronsky: IN THE PRESENTATION THEY MADE IT VERY CLEAR THAT TEY WERE NINE AND ONE THIRDS OF THE WAY BEING IN CONFORMANCE WITH THE PLAN THAT THEY SAY, QUOTE, BEST REPRESENTS THE NEEDS OF THIS PARTICULAR NEIGHBORHOOD. IF THEY CAN COME THE OTHER TWO-THIRDS OF THE WAY -- AND I THINK IT'S CONCEIVABLE AND I WOULD LOVE TO SEE IT BECAUSE I REALLY WOULD LIKE TO SEE AN EXCELLT PN. I THINK THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT PIECE OF PROPERTY WITHIN THE CITY AND I EVEN THINK THE CITY STAFF MAKES THE COMMENT AS TO ONE OF THE REASONS THEY WERE OPPOSING IT WAS THERE MIGHT BE A BETTER USE WHEN A TIME IN THE FUTURE DOES COME. AND SO I'D LIKE TO SEE THEM BUT I DO BELIEVE WE NEED TO AT LEAST GIVE THEM UNTIL THE 17th BECAUSE I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THEM COME THE OTHER TWO-THIRDS OF THE WAY AND BE IN CONFORMANCE WITH THE PLAN THAT THEY BELIEVE BEST FITS THIS AREA. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. SO I AM GOING TO RESCIND MY MOTION. DO WE NEED A SECOND? I DON'T THINK SO. I WILL CHANGE MY MOTION OR REVISE MY MOTION TO TABLE THIS UNTIL APRIL 17th. >> I'LL SECOND. >> Chair Downs: AND I HAVE A SECOND BY COMMISSIONER CARY. ARE WE READY TO VOTE? VOTE. OKAY. WE ARE TABLED ON THIS ITEM UNTIL APRIL 17th. THAT'S FOR ITEM 1A. I WOULD MAKE A MOTION OR MOVE -- MY WIFE'S GOING TO YELL AT ME IF I DON'T SAY IT RIGHT. I MOVE WE TABLE ITEM 1B UNTIL APRIL 17th. >> SECOND. >> Chair Downs: I HAVE A SECOND BY COMMISSIONER BRONSKY. PLEASE VOTE. THAT ITEM CARRIES 7-0. THANK YOU, GENTLEMEN. >> AGENDA ITEM NO. 2. PUBLIC HEARING - REPLAT, REVISED SITE PLAN, & CONCEPT PLAN: VAN TUYL ADDITION, BLOCK 1, LOTS 1 & 2 - MAJOR VEHICLE REPAIR ON LOT 1 AND PROFESSIONAL/GENERAL ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICE ON LOT 2 ON 13.1 ACRES LOCATED AT THE SOUTHEAST CORNER OF LEXINGTON RIVE AND PREMIER DRIVE. ZONED CORRIDOR COMMERCIAL. APPLICANT: VTC PLANO RENTAL PROPERTIES LLC. >> GOOD AFTERNOON, COMMISSIONERS PARKER McDOWELL, PLANNER WITH THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT. STAFF RECOMMENDS THIS ITEM FOR APPROVAL AS SUBMITTED. I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS. >> Chair Downs: THANK YOU. DO WE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF ON THIS ITEM? EVERYBODY STILL HERE? MR. BRONSKY'S DOZING OFF OVER HERE. ALL RIGHT. SEEING NONE, THANK YOU, SIR. I'LL OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING. DO WE HAVE ANY SPEAKERS ON THIS ITEM? >> WE DO NOT. >> Chair Downs: THANK YOU. I'LL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND CONFINE THE DISCUSSION TO THE COMMISSION. >> I MOVE WE -- SORRY. I MOVE THAT WE APPROVE THIS AS SUBMITTED. >> Chair Downs: THANK YOU. I HAVE A MOTION BY COMMISSIONER BRONSKY WITH A SECOND BY COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF. PLEASE VOTE ON ITEM 2. THAT ITEM CARRIES 7-0. THANK YOU FOR ANYBODY ELSE THAT WAS SITTING AROUND FOR THOSE FIRST TWO HOURS. THANK YOU. APPRECIATE YOUR PATIENCE. >> AGENDA ITEM NO. 3. PUBLIC HEARING - PRELIMINARY REPLAT & REVISED SITE PLAN: MIDDLEKAUFF ADDITION, BLOCK A, LOT 1R - NEW AND USED VEHICLE DEALER D MINOR HICLE REPAIR ON ONE LOT ON 4.0 ACRES LOCATED AT THE NORTHWEST CORNER OF RUISSEAU DRIVE AND U.S. HIGHWAY 75. ZONED CORRIDOR COMMERCIAL WITH USED CAR DEALER, NO. 304 FOR AUTOMOBILE LEASING AND RENTING, AND NO. 338 FOR TRUCK LEASING. APPLICANT: 3401 N CENTRAL EXPY,. >> STAFF RECOMMENDS THE PRELIMINARY REPLAT FOR APPROVAL SUBJECT TO ADDITIONS AND ORLTERATIONSO THE ENGINEERING PLAN AS REQUIRED BY THE ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT AND FOR THE REVISED SITE PLAN, STAFF RECOMMENDS THE ITEM FOR APPROVAL AS SUBMITTED. I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS. >> Chair Downs: THANK YOU. DO WE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF ON THIS ITEM? COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF. >> THIS PROPERTY IS THE CENTRAL KYIV AUTO DEALERSHIP. >> THEY ARE PROPOSING TO DEMOLISH THE SITE AND REBUILD IT. IT'S STILL GOING TO BE THE NEW AND USED CAR DEALERSHIP BUT WITH A NEW BUI BUILDING . >> Brounoff: ALL RIGHT. >> Chair Downs: ANY MORE QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? SEEING NONE, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. I'LL OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING. DO WE HAVE ANY OTHER SPEAKERS ON THIS ITEM? >> WE DO NOT. >> Chair Downs: THANK YOU. I'LL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. CONFINE THE DISCUSSION TO THE COMMISSION. COMMISSIONER RATLIFF. >> Ratliff: I MOVE WE APPROVE THE PRELIMINARY REPLAT SUBJECT TO THE APPROVAL OF THE ADDITIONS AND ALTERATIONS REQUIRED BY THE ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT AND THE REVISED SITE PLAN AS SUBMITTED. >> SECOND. >> Chair Downs: THANK YOU. I HAVE A MOTION BY COMMISSIONER RATLIFF WITH A SECOND BY COMMISSIONER BRONSKY TO APPROVE ITEM 3. PLEASE VOTE. THAT ITEM CARRIES 7-0. THANK YOU. >> AGENDA ITEM NO. 4. PUBLIC HEARING - PRELIMINARY REPLAT: LAKESIDE MARKET PHASE 1, BLOCK A, LOTS 1R, 5R, & 6R - RETAIL AND RESTAURANT ON LOT 1R, RESTAURANT WITH DRIVE-THROUGH ON LOT 5R, AND VACANT LOT ON 22.0 ACRES LOCATED AT THE NORTHWEST CORNER OF PRESTON ROAD AND LORIMAR DRIVE. ZONED PLANNED DEVELOPMENT-447- RETAIL/MULTIFAMILY RESIDENCE-2 WITH SPECIFIC USE PERMITS NO. 423 FOR PRIVATE CLUB AND NO. 56 FOR WINERY AND LOCATED WITHIN THE PRESTON ROAD OVERLAY DISTRI MARKET, LLC. THIS ITEM IS FOR A. >> STAFF RECOMMENDS THIS ITEM FOR APPROVAL SUBJECT TO ADDITIONS AND/OR ALTERATIONS TO THE ENGINEERING PLANS AS REQUIRED BY THE ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT. I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS IF THERE ARE ANY. >> Chair Downs: THANK YOU. ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF ON THIS ITEM? THANK YOU VERY MUCH. SEEING NONE, I'LL OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING. DO WE HAVE ANY SPEAKERS ON THIS ITEM? >> WE DO NOT. >> Chair Downs: THANK YOU. CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. CONFINE THE DISCUSSION. COMMISSIONER OLLEY. >> Olley: MR. CHAIRMAN, I MOVE THAT WE APPROVE AGENDA ITEM NO. 4 SUBJECT TO ADDITIONS AND/OR ALTERATIONS TO THE ENGINEERING PLANS AS REQUIRED BY THE ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT. >> SECOND. >> Chair Downs: A MOTION BY COMMISSIONER OLLEY WITH A SECOND BY COMMISSIONER BRONSKY TO APPROVE ITEM 4. PLEASE VOTE. BEFORE WE MOVE INTO THE NON-PUBLIC HEARING ITEMS, DOES ANYONE NEED A BREAK? WE WOULD LIKE BREAK? WE'RE GOING TO RECESS FOR FIVE MINUTES AND THEN WE'LL COME BACK INTO REGULAR SESSION. [FIVE-MINUTE RECESS] >> Chair Downs: OKAY. NON-PUBLIC HEARING ITEMS, NO. 5. >> NON-PUBLIC HEARING ITEMS: T PRESIDING OFFICER WILL PERMIT LIMITED PUBLIC COMMENT FOR ITEM ON THE AGENDA NOT POSTED FOR A PUBLIC HEARING. THE PRESIDING OFFICER WILL ESTABLISH TIME LIMITS BASED UPON THE NUMBER OF SPEAKER REQUESTS, LENGTH OF THE AGENDA, AND TO ENSURE MEETING EFFICIENCY, AND MAY INCLUDE A TOTAL TIME LIMIT. AGENDA ITEM NO. 5. DISCUSSION AND ACTION - PLAN: CIGNA POINT ADDITION, BLOCK A, LOT 2- PROFESSIONAL/ GENERAL ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICE O ONE LOT ON 5.6 ACRES LOCATED ON THE EAST SIDE OF THE DALLAS NORTH TOLLWAY, 1,539 FEET NORTH OF PLANO PARKWAY. ZONED PLANNED EMPLOYMENT AND LOCATED WITHIN THE DALLAS NORTH TOLLWAY OVERLAY DISTRICT. APPLICANT: SCARBOROUGH PARKWAY II, LP. >> THE PURPOSE OF THIS REQUEST IS TO INCREASE THE PERMITTED PERCENTAGE OF AN ALTERNATE CON CREASE MASONRY MATERIAL FOR THE PROPOSED OFFICE BUILDING AND GARAGE ON THIS LOT. THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS ZONED REGIAL EMPLOYMENT. THE REGIONAL EMPLOYMENT ZONING DISTRICT REQUIRES AT LEAST 80% OF ANY EXPOSED WALL OF MAIN BUILDINGS TO CONSIST OF GLASS, NATIVE STONE, CLAY-FIRED BRICK, FILE, OR A COMBINATION OF THESE MATERIALS. THE REMAINING 20% MAY CONSIST OF ANY ALTERNATIVE BUILDING MATERIAL PERMISSIBLE UNDER THE CODE. THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION HAS THE DISCRETION TO ALLOW OTHER MATERIALS IF ADOPTED BY THE BUILDING AND FIRE CODES. THE BUILDING MATERIALS ACQUIRED E DISTRICT ARE INTENDED TO ENSURE THE USE OF HIGH-QUALITY DURABLE MATERIALS TO CREATE WELL-DESIRED AND CREATIVE ARCHITECTURE. THIS VARIANCE REQUEST IS FOR THE OFFICE BUILDING AND GARAGE ON LOT 2. ON THE SCREEN IS A SOUTHERN EL GAS STATION OF THE OFFICE BUILDING. THIS IS THE OTHER PORTION OF THE SOUTHERN ELEVATION OF THE OFFICE BUILDING . THIS SCREEN SHOWS THE NORTH ELEVATION OR PORTION OF THE NOH ELEVATION. IS IS THE OTHER PORTION. AND THIS SCREEN SHOWS THE EAST AND WEST ELEVATION OF THE OFFICE BUILDING. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING TO USE AN ALTERNATE PRIMARY MATERIAL THAT IS NOT IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE RE ZONING DISTRICT. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING TO USE A CONCRETE MATERIAL FOR THE OFFICE BUILDING. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A 19% VARIANCE ON THE NORTH ELEVATION, NO VARIANCE ON THE WEST ELEVATION, 15% VARIANCE ON THE SOUTH ELEVATION, AND A 38% VARIANCE ON THE EAST ELEVATION. ON THIS SCREEN IS THE NORTH AND SOUTH ELEVATION OF THE PARKING ARAGE. AND THIS IS THE WEST AND EAST ELEVATION. FOR THE PARKING GARAGE, THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING AN 80% VARIANCE ON ALL ELEVATIONS. BUILDING MATERIAL PREFERENCES AND TECHNOLOGIES CHANGE OVER TIME AND CITY STRIVES TO BE RESPONSIVE WHERE APPROPRIATE, ALLOWING FOR INNOVATION AND ADJUSTMENTS. TERNIVE MATERIALS MAY BE APPROPRIATE IN INSTANCES WHERE A SIGNIFICANT ARCHITECTURAL BENEFIT CAN BE CREATED. HOWEVER, STAFF DOES NOT BELIEVE THIS REQUEST WILL BE IN THE BEST INTEREST OF ACHIEVING THE DISTRICT'S STATED GOALS. THE RE BUILDING MATERIAL STANDARDS WERE ESTABLISHED IN 1996 AND HAVE SINCE BEEN REVIEWED MULTIPLE TIMES IN 2011 TO ALLOW METAL. IN 2016 THE PERCENTAGE OF GLASS WERE INCREASED TO 80% AND IN 2019 THE STANDARDS WERE EF HB 2439 . THE REQUEST DOES NOT CONSTITUTE ENHANCEMENTS IN INNOVATION OR AESTHETICS BUT ARE DESIRED FOR SITE DESIGN AND CONSTRUCTION PURPOSES. THIS IS VISIBLE FROM THE DALLAS NORTH TOLLWAY AND THE ADJACENT NEIGHBORHOOD TO THE EAST. THIS MAJOR DEVELOPMENT WILL DEFINE THE APPEARANCE OF THE CORRIDOR FOR YEARS. THE DEVELOPMENT SHOULD BE CONSTRUCTED WITH THE REQUIRED MATERIALS. STAFF RECOMMENDS DENIAL OF THE REQUEST AND I'M HAPPY TO APICAN IS ALSO HERE AND HASE A PRESENTATION. >> Chair Downs: QUESTIONS FOR STAFF. COMMISSIONER BRONSKY. >> Bronsky: I DO. THIS WAS LOCATED ON THE DALLAS NORTH TOLLWAY JUST SOUTH OF PARK AND I SEE NEXT DOOR TO IT IS A SUSHI WINE BAR. THERE'S AN EXXON GAS STATION DOWN THE STREET. ACROSS THE NORTH DALLAS TOLLWAY IS A DISCOUNT TIRE, A COSTCO, AND A U-HAUL MOVING. THE REFERENCE STAFF MAKES TO HB 2439, CAN YOU GO INTO SOME DETAIL AND EXPLAIN TO ME THE IMPORTANCE OF WHERE WE FIND AN EXEMPTION FOR THAT? >> YES. LET ME PULL IT UP. SO IT WAS DETERMINED THAT THE RE DISTRICT IS AN ARCHITECTURAL DISTRICT INTENDED TO PROVIDE FOR OFFICE AND LIMITED MANUFACTURING USES IN HIGH-VISIBILITY LOCATIONS WHICH ARE REGIONAL, CULTURAL IMPORTANCE TO THE COMMUNITY. THESE ARE CONSISTENT WITH THE REGIONAL STATUS OF CERTAIN TOLLWAYS AND EXPRESSWAYS -- AND THIS IS PULLED FROM THE RE ZONING DIS DISTRICT . >> Bronsky: CORRECT. YOU'RE SAYING THAT WE'RE GOING TO -- WE'RE EXEMPT FROM HB 2439 FOR REASONS OF HISTORICAL? >> YES, CULTURAL AND HISTORICAL -- ARCHITECTURAL AND CULTURAL DISTRICTS. >> Bronsky: CAN YOU EXPLAIN TO ME THE CULTURAL SIGNIFICANCE OF COSTCO, THE WINE BAR, AND DISCOUNT TIRE? >> SO THIS WOULD BE FOR DEVELOPMENTS GOING FORWARD. WE'RE LOOKING TO CREATE AN ARCHITECTURALLY-PLEASING NEW DEVELOPMENT SUCH AS THESE OFFICE -- THERE IS QUITE A BIT OF UNDEVELOPED LAND FROM THIS SITE AND SOUTH TO THE -- I FORGET WHERE IT'S AT. >> Chair Downs: JUST A LITTLE POINT OF REFERENCE, I RECALL THESE DISCUSSIONS AND AT ONE POINT WE HAD CERTAIN DESIGN STANDARDS AND ACTUALLY AND WE HAD TO REVISE IN ORDER TO COMPLY. BUT BY THAT TIME A LOT OF THE BUILDINGS THAT ARE ON THERE ALREADY EXISTED AND WE CAN'T GO BACK. ALL WE COULD SAY MOVING FORWARD. AND THERE WAS A LOT OF DISCUSSION AROUND THE LOOPHOLE, WHICH WAS CULTURAL AND HISTORIC SIGNIFICANCE. >> Bronsky: I STRUGGLE WITH THE IDEA THAT AN OFFICE BUILDING HAS HISTORICAL SIGNIFICANCE. >> Chair Downs: THERE WAS A LOT OF DIFFENT DISCUSSIONS AROUND HOW DO YOU DEFINE A DISTRICT SO YOU CAN HAVE MORE CONTROL OVER THAT? >> Bronsky: I APPRECIATE THAT. I TOLD MY WIFE MULTIPLE TIMES I APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY THE CITY HAS ALLOWED ME TO SERVE HERE. I GET THAT. I THINK THAT'S VERY IMPORTANT. I HAVE FRIENDS IN HOUSTON AND I'M VERY HAPPY WE HAVE ZONING HERE THAT ALLOWS US TO HAVE THOSE CONTROLS AND I CERTAINLY DON'T WANT SOMETHING SLOVENLY THROWN UP. I WANT TO MAKE SURE WE'RE VERY CAREFUL BECAUSE THIS IS RLLY PUSY AN OFFICE BUILDING HAS HISTORICAL SIGNIFICANCE. OR, I MEAN, OR TO GO DOWN THE LINE TO SAY WE CAN CONTROL FACADES BECAUSE IT'S ARCHITECTURALLY SIGNIFICANT NEXT TO A GAS STATION AND DOWN THE STREET FROM A BAR. >> Chair Downs: LET'S LET -- GO AHEAD. >> SURE. IF YOU WOULD LIKE ME TO CONTRIBUTE ON THIS. THERE ARE TWO DIFFERENT ZONING DISTRICTS UP AND DOWN THE DALLAS NORTH TOLLWAY. REGIONAL COMMERCIAL AND REGIONAL EMPLOYMENT. REGIONAL COMMERCIAL IS -- THAT'S WHERE COSTCO IS. THAT'S WHERE A LOT OF THE THINGS YOU'RE REFERENCING ARE AS FAR AS THE RETAIL CENTERS. REGIONAL EMPLOYMENT IS THE OFFICE COMPONENT. AND SO I THINK THE CITY MADE THIS DECISION BACK IN 1996. WHILE THERE WERE -- THERE WAS QUITE A BIT OF DEVELOPMENT IN THE TOLLWAY AND THERE IS A SUBSTANTIAL AMOUNT THAT'S HAPPENED SINCE THAT TIME. I THINK FOR ARCHITECTURAL CONTINUITY THERE'S A DISTINCT DIFFERENCE WHEN YOU ENTER A COMMUNITY, ESPECIALLY IN A CORRIDOR WHERE IT'S SO INCREDIBLY VISIBLE. THE IDEA OF CREATING THESE MATERIAL STANDARDS WAS YOU'RE GOING TO KNOW WHEN YOU'RE IN PLANO. YOU CAN TELL A DIFFERENCE,- ARCHITECTURALLY IN WHAT'S HAPPENING HERE VERSUS WHAT'S HAPPENING IN OTHER COMMUNITIES. AND SO I THINK THAT'S THE INTENT. YOU'RE CREATING A CULTURAL ARCHITECTURAL DISTRICT. WHETHER THAT'S HISTORICAL TODAY OR NOT IS A QUESTION. BUT I THINK THE IDEA IS YOU HAVE TO START WHILE YOU'RE BUILDING THE BUILDINGS TO CREATE THE CONSISTENCY THAT GIVES YOU THAT VISUAL IMPACT. THD THE DISTRICT. AND SO THAT'S THE HISTORY I HAVE TO OFFER. >> Bronsky: AND MY CONCERN IS I GUESS THAT WE DON'T DENY THIS AND DID NOT PERMIT THEM ONLY TO FIND OUT WE END UP IN TROUBLE WITH HB 2439 BECAUSE WE HAVE WORKED TO GO AROUND IT, AS YOU MENTIONED, A LOOPHOLE. THAT'S MY BIGGEST CONCERN. I DON'T WANT TO SEE THE CITY END UP BEING IN VIOLATION OF STATE LAW BECAUSE WE'RE TRYING TO SKIRT SOMETHING. >> Chair Downs: I DON'T THINK THAT WOULD BE THE CASE HERE BUT YOU MAY HAVE MORE INFORMATION IN RESPONSE TO HIS QUESTION. >> Bronsky: I DON'T KNOW. >> AS MS. DAY MENTIONED, WHEN THIS WAS LOOKED AT THAT IT WAS DETERMINED THAT THIS IS THE ARCHITECTURAL AND CULTURALLY SIGNIFICANT CORRIDOR INTO PLANO, IT ALLOWED US TO REGULATE THAT. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. COMMISSIONER TONG. LET'S JUST -- YEAH, JUST KEEP TO QUESTIONS AND THEN WE'LL -- GO AHEAD. IF YOU HAVE A QUESTION, GO AHEAD. >> Tong: MY QUESTION IS REGARDING THE LOCATION OF THIS BUILDING. I UNDERSTAND IT'S IN THE CORRIDOR, KIND OF I GUESS RELATED TO THE SOUTHERN AND NORTHERN BOUNDARY OF THE CITY ALONG THE DALLAS NORTH TOLLWAY. BUT HAS ANYONE FROM OUR STAFF MEMBER GONE ON THE TOLLWAY TO LOOK AT THE BUILDING? I FEEL LIKE THAT AREA, THE HIGHWAY IS ON A BRIDGE AND THE BUILDING IS KIND OF LOW. IT'S NOT THAT VISIBLE. I FEEL LIKE EVERY TIME I GO AROUND THAT CORNER -- IN ORDER TO SEE THAT BUILDING I HAVE TO GO UNDER THE BRIDGE AND MAKE A U-TURN. IF I'M ON THE BRIDGE GOING OVER, I PROBABLY WOULDN'T SEE IT. >> I HAVEN'T HAD A CHANCE TO GO OUT THERE AND DO A SITE VISIT FOR THIS ONE, BUT I KNOW RESEARCHING OTHER PROPERTIES AROUND IT THAT THE CIGNA BUILDING TO THE NORTH OF THIS PROPERTY, THEY DEVELOPED IT AS -- I BELIEVE IT'S THE FIRST FLOOR HAS THAT NATIVE STONE KIND OF COAT AROUND IT AND THEN THE REST IS OTHER MARIALS. BUT I CAN'T SPEAK TO SEE HOW VISIBLE THAT FIRST FLOOR IS FROM THE DNT. >> Tong: SO IN OUR REQUIREMENTS, IS THERE ANYTHING RELATED TO THE VISIBILITY ITSELF, INSTEAD OF JUST THE LOCATION ALONG THE HIGHWAY? >> I THINK THAT THE -- THERE IS NOT EXPLICITLY. I THINK THERE'S TWO -- THE VISIBILITY OF THE CORRIDOR WITH REGARD TO THE REGULATIONS REALLY ALSO RELATE TO THE NARROWNESS OF THE CORRIDOR. BECAUSE FROM PARKWOOD ON ONE SIDE AND EITHER PLANO PARKWAY IN THIS AREA, YOU KNOW, IT CHANGES AS YOU MOVE NORTH, BUT THESE ARE FAIRLY NARROW PIECES OF PROPERTY SO YOU'VE GOT RIGHT OF WAY ON BOTH SIDES. SO THE TOLLWAY ACCESS ROAD, PARKWOOD, AND THEN THE ELEVATED DALLAS NORTH TOLLWAY, THERE'S JUST A LOT OF OPPORTUNITY FOR VIEW SHED. >> Tong: THANK YOU. >> Chair Downs: OTHER QUESTIONS? WHO IS POINTING? OH, POINT THERE. I THOUGHT YOU WERE POINTING AT COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF AND I THOUGHT OF COURSE HE HAS A QUESTION. HE DOESN'T. COMMISSIONER CARY. >> Cary: SO THE WEST FACE OF THIS LOOKS LIKE IT'S ALL GLASS. IS THAT CORRECT? >> THAT IS CORRECT. >> Cary: DO WE HAVE ANY CONCERNS WITH GLARE OFF OF THAT, ESPECIALLY LATER IN THE DAY TO ALL OF THAT TRAFFIC ON THE WEST SIDE? BECAUSE SOMETIMES I FIND THAT WITH SOME BUILDINGS THAT ARE ALL GLAD. DO WE HAVE ANY CONCERNS? ARE THERE ANY REMEDIES FOR THAT? >> I BELIEVE IT'S IN THE BUILDING CODE THAT THEY DO HAVE A CERTAIN PERCENTE OF REFLECTION THAT HAS TO BE MET WITH THAT. AND I CAN DOUBLE CHECK, AND THE APPLICANT IS HERE AND THEY CAN PROVIDE MORE DETAILS ON IF THEY HAVE THAT EXACT NUMBER. >> Cary: PROBABLY SOME KIND OF MITIGATION TO KEEP IT FROM BLINDING EVERYBODY DRIVING DOWN THE FREEWAY. OKAY. THANK YOU. >> IS THERE ANY WAY -- NOT US BUT HAVE YOU GONE WITH THE APPLICANT ENOUGH TO GET ANY FURTHER ON THIS WITH THEM? >> YES. WE'VE MET WITH THEM A COUPLE OF TIMES JUST TO OUTLINE WHAT THEIR RE DISTRICT, WHAT THEIR REQUIREMENTS ARE AND THE GOALS OF IT. WE HAVE HAD MEETINGS WITH THEM AND ALSO BACK AND FORTH WITH REVIEW THAT THE MATERIAL PERCENTAGE IS REALLY THE LAST PIECE OF THIS FACADE PLAN. >> BECAUSE I KNOW MY CONCERN FOR THE 2439 DOES ALLOW FOR VOLUNTARY -- A VOLUNTARY RELATIONSHIP FOR IT. AND THAT'S SOMETHING MAYBE WE COULD JUST FIND A WAY FOR THEM TO BE SATISFIED VOLUNTARILY. >> YEAH, WE HAVE HAD MEETINGS. WE GOT TO THE POINT WHERE WE VARIANCE JUST TO GET THE FINAL DETERMINATION FROM THE COMMISSION. >> Chair Downs: I WAS CORRECT. COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF DOES HAVE A QUESTION. >> Brounoff: I DIDN'T WANT TO DISAPPOINT YOU. THE PARKING GARAGE HAS A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF PATTERNED CONCRETE. IS THAT WHERE THEY STAMP THE CON CONCRETE BEFORE IT CURES? >> THAT IS CORRECT I'M NOT SURE OF THE EXACT PROCESS BUTT IS SUPPOSED TO SIMULATE THE LOOK AND THEY CAN PROVIDE MORE INFORMATION ON THE PROCESS AND HOW THAT'S DONE. >> Brounoff: WHAT IS THE STAFF'S POSITION ON THE AESTHETIC AND VULN VISUAL APPEAL OF THE CONCRETE AS OPPOSED TO USING ACTUAL BRICK? >> I KNOW AS FAR AS A MATERIAL PERCENTAGE GOES, WE VIEW THAT AS JUST CONCRETE MATERIAL. >> RIGHT. IT DOESN'T MEET THE ORDINANCE IN ANY WAY. WE CONSIDER IT CONCRETE. SO ION'THINK THERE'S A VALUE FROM THE -- AT LEAST IN THIS CASE IT'S NOT CONTRIBUTING TO THEM MEETING THE REQUIREMENTS. >> Brounoff: I'M JUST WONDERING IF IT LOOKS AS GOOD AS BRICK OR NOT. >> AT LEAST AS FAR AS IN MY REVIEW OF THE FACADE ITSELF, IT DIDN'T APPEAR TO ME TO BE BRICK. >> Chair Downs: MY UNDERSTANDING IS WE HAVE A PRESENTATION FROM THEM. >> CORRECT, YES. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER RATLIFF. >> Ratliff: THANK YOU, CHAIR. THIS IS A PROCEDURAL QUESTION -- I'M NOT SURE WHO TO ASK THIS TO. IS THIS ND OF AN ALL OR NOTHING BUILDING AND PARKING GARAGE OR COULD THERE BE DIFFERENT STANDARDS APPLIED TO THEM DEPENDING UPON THE SITE PLAN? >> I THINK THE COMMISSION HAS THE DISCRETION TO GRANT VARIANCES AS YOU WILL, SO YOU COULD, YOU KNOW, APPROVE, APPROVE IN PART, YOU KNOW, TABLE DENY. ALL THE OPTIONS ARE ON THE TABLE. >> Ratliff: OKAY. THANK YOU. >> Chair Downs: I THINK WE'RE DONE. THANK YOU. AND NOW WE WANTED TO HEAR FROM THE APPLICANT. THANK YOU FOR YOUR PATIENCE, SIR. YOU'VE BEEN HERE A LONG TIME. >> I'M WITH MBW STUDIOS, THE ARCHITECTS ON THE PROJECT AND I HAVE A VERY BRIEF PRESENTATION HERE. >> Chair Downs: YOU'RE JUST TRYING TO GET ON OUR GOOD SIDE. >> YOU KNOW, THE DIAGRAMS THAT WE DID TO DEMONSTRATE THE PERCENTAGES OF MATERIAL AND SO FORTH DON'T REALLY COMMUNICATE THE CHARACT OF THE BUILDING, SO I HAVE A VERY FEW SLIDES TO REALLY SHOW THAT AND I'D LIKE TO TALK ABOUT WHAT WE'RE THINKING ABOUT FROM AN OVERALL POINT OF VIEW ABOUT THE DESIGN. AND SO THIS IS A VIEW LOOKING AT THE MAIN ENTRANCE. ND BASICALLY THE BIG IDEA OF THE DESIGN IS THAT IT IS A STRONG BUT VERY SIMPLE CONCRETE FRAME THAT PRESENTS AND ARTICULATES LARGE AREAS OF GLASS. AND THE GLASS IS -- I CAN'T REMEMBER WHO ASKED THE QUESTION ABOUT THE REFLECTIVITY, BUT THE GLASS IS BELOW 20% EXTERIOR REFLECTANCE, SO IT MEETS THE CODE AND IT'S ACTUALLY QUITE TRANSPARENT BUT IT HAS A BLUE TINT TO IT AND WHEN IT PICKS UP THE SKY IT'S EVEN MORE SO. WE LIKE THE SIMPLE WHITE GRID BECAUSE IT REALLY ACCENTUATES THERESENCE OF THE GLASS. GLASS IS AN ARTICULATED CURTAIN WALL WITH A VARIETY OF DIFFERENT MULLONS TO GIVE IT SOME TEXTURE. YOU'LL SEE THE GRAY AREAS. THAT'S REALLY NOT THAT GRAY. WHAT THAT IS IS THAT'S SORT OF A FLUTE, LIKE YOU USED TO SEE IN A VERTICAL-COLUMN DESIGN. IT IS CAST. THE CONCRETE IS CAST OVER THAT AND SO THAT IMPRINT IS THERE. SO YOU GET A LITTLE ARTICULATION, WHICH HELPS US WITH THE PROPORTIONS OF THAT SPANDREL. IT HAS SHADOWS WHEN THE SUN HITS IT RIGHT BUT IT WOULD BE THE SAME WHITE AS THE REST OF THE CONCRETE. WE ALSO LIKE THE WAY THAT THE FRAME CAN BE PULLED OUT FROM BUILDING AND LET THE GLASS RETURN, AS IT IS DOING HERE AT THESE BALCONIES. IT HELPS TO ARTICULATE AND EMPHASIZE THE ENTRANCE. I'LL GO TO THE NEXT ONE. WHOOPS, RIGHT HERE. THIS IS JUST ANOTHER VIEW LOOKING FROM THE EAST BACK TO THE WEST OF THE WHOLE FACADE. ONE OF THE THINGS WE HAVE DONE, INSTEAD OF JUST LETTING THIS BE A CONTINUOUS GRID OF CONCRETE, WE HAVE BROKEN THE BUILDING IN HALF AND OFFSET IT SO THAT HELPS TO CREATE THIS SENSE OF ARRIVAL AND PLACE. AND THEN THIS IS THE SOUTH SIDE, WHICH IS THE SIDE THAT HAS MOST OF THE SURFACE PARKING. ON THE NORTH SIDE WE'RE UP CLOSER TO THE PROPERTY LINE. IT'S JUST ONE ROAD AND SOME PARKING, SO THIS IS THE PRIMARY ENTRANCE INTO THE BUILDING. AND THIS IS LOOKING AT THE WEST ENTRANCE WHERE WE HAVE THIS PIECE OF CURTAIN WALL, WHICH IS ARTICULATED BY PULLING IT OUT AND LETTING THE SPACE GO AROUND IT. THE EYEBROW GO ACROSS. AND IT SEEMED TO US THAT THIS SORT OF GESTURE ON THE COMMERCIAL SIDE OF THE PROPERTY FACING THE TOLLWAY WOULD BE A REALLY IMPORTANT SIGNATURE PIECE. AGAIN, EVEN THOUGH THIS IS A SECONDARY ENTRANCE ON THE SOUTH SIDE, YOU CAN STILL SEE HOW THE OFFSET OF THE BUILDING HELPS TO CREATE THAT SENSE OF PRESENCE, THAT SENSE OF ARRIVAL. AND THEN WE ARE PLANNING QUITE -- THIS IS ACTUALLY SORT OF AN OLDER RENDERING OF THE LANDSCAPE, WHICH HAS BEEN DEVELOPED MORE. BUT THERE IS A 15-FOOT WIDE CONCOURSE THAT RUNS UNDER THE BUILDING CONNECTING UNDER COVER THE PARKING GARAGE TO THE ENTRANCE OF THE OFFICE. BUT THEN ALL OF THIS IS ENVISIONED AS BEING ACTIVE OUTSIDE LANDSCAPED AREA WHERE PEOPLE CAN BREAK OUT AND SIT AND TAKE PHONE CALLS AND IT'S BEEN DEVELOPED A LOT MORE SO THAT THERE ARE TABLES AND CHAIRS UNDER THE CANOPY AND PLACES TO HAVE INFORMAL MEETINGS AND SO FORTH. AND THEN THIS IS AN IMAGE OF THE GARAGE AND IT'S SORT OF SEPARATE FROM THE OFFICE BUILDING. WE DID THIS QUICKLY JUST TO DEMONSTRATE THIS MASONRY-IMPRINTED -- THE CONCRETE IS CAST OVER A FORM LINER TO CREATE THIS. THIS WOULD NOT BE OUR PREFERENCE. WE WERE JUST TRYING TO DO THIS RATHER THAN JUST HAVING, YOU KNOW, SOME RANDOM BRICK OR STONE OR TILE ON THE BUILDING THERE. IF TEXTURE IS WHAWAS DESIRED, WE REALLY THINK THAT IF THE GARAGE IS SIMPLE AND IS REALLY WELL DONE, QUITE PRECAST -- ONE THING IT DOES WITH THE WHITE FRAME OF THE OFFICE BUILDING, IT TIES THOSE TWO BUILDINGS TOGETHER. SO ONE'S NOT QUITE SO UTILITARIAN. THIS DOES NOT SHOW THE CANOPY. IT WOULD BE -- I CAN'T POINT HERE BUT THIS ENTRANCE ON THE WEST END, THAT'S THE PEDESTRIAN ENTRANCE AND THERE'S A CANOPY OVER IT. THE PLACE WHERE I'VE DONE A GARAGE LIKE THIS FAIRLY RECENTLY, WHICH WAS ALL-WHITE PRECAST HERE IN PLANO, WAS AT ONE LEGACY WEST, WHICH IS RIGHT ACROSS FROM TOYOTA ON LEGACY RIGHT AT 121. THAT WAS SOME BEST WHITE PRECAST I HAVE EVER SEEN AND WE ARE PLANNING TO USE THE SAME CONTRACTOR ON THIS. AND IT TIES VERY WELL TO THE BUILDING. IN FACT, THERE IS ALSO A PEDESTRIAN CANOPY CONNECTION AND A SECOND LEVEL WALKWAY ACROSS THERE. SO OUR PREFERENCE WOULD BE TO KEEP THE CONCRETE BOTH ON THE FRAME SIMPLE AND ON THE GARAGE AS WELL, AND LET THE GLASS AND THE LANDSCAPE STAND APART FROM THAT, RATHER THAN TRYING TO APPLY MATERIALS THAT DON'T ADD FUNCTION TO THE FRAME OR TO THE GARAGE. WOULD BE LESS DURABLE AND ONE OTHER NICE THING ABOUT THIS CAST FRAME -- AND IT'S NOT A SOLID, SOLID WALL OF CONCRETE WITH PUNCHED OPENINGS. WE'VE STRETCHED THE GLASS TO THE STRUCTURAL LIMITS THAT WE CAN DO WITHOUT HAVING A SEPARATE STRUCTURE. BUT THE NICE THING ABOUT IT IS IT IS BOTH STRUCTURE AND EXTERIOR FINISH AT THE SAME TIME, WHICH IS A VERY EFFICIENT WAY TO DO IT. I DON'T JUST MEAN FROM A COST POINT OF VIEW BUT I MEAN IN TERMS OF MATERLS USED, YOU KNOW, CARBON CREATED, EMBODIED CARBON. IT IS A IS VERY PURPOSEFUL AND FUNCTIONAL AND STRONG ARCHITECTURALLY, IN MY OPINION, AND ESPECIALLY THE WAY IT MAKES THE GLASS STAND OFF AND THE LANDSCAPE. IT ENHANCES THOSE THINGS. AND THEN MY ONLY OTHER SLIDES YOU'VE ALREADY SEEN. THIS IS JUST ANOTHER VIEW WITHOUT THE LANDSCAPE THAT WILL BE IN THE FOREGROUND. AND THE DETENTION POND. THERE ARE TREES ALL ALONG THE GARAGE. AGAIN, WE WERE QUICKLY TRYING TO DEMONSTRATE THIS IS WHAT YOU WOULD HAVE IF WE USED EITHER BRICK, EITHER INSET BRICK OR CONCRETE MADE TO LOOK LIKE A BRICK PATTERN. AGAIN, OUR PREFERENCE, WE'D HAVE IT JUST BE PRECAST. AND THEN I WILL SKIP THESE, BECAUSE THESE ARE VERY SIMILAR TO THE SAME THING THAT STAFF SHOWED. THE NUMBERS ARE SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT, BUT BY FRACTIONS OF A PERCENTAGE. AND THEN THE GARAGE WITH THE TEXTURE. SO ANYWAY, THAT'S ALL OF YOUR TIME THAT I WILL TAKE. WHAT WE'RE ASKING FOR, WE'RE HOPING IS THAT YOU CAN SEE THAT ADDING THESE OTHER MATERIALS, WHETHER IT'S TILE OR PIECES OF STONE, LITTLE BITS OF BRICK OR WHATEVER -- BECAUSE THIS IS GETTING US TO -- I MEAN, OUR PERCENTAGES ARE NOT THAT FAR OFF. WE'VE GOT A LOT OF GLASS HERE. ON THE WEST END WE'RE OVER 80%. BUT WE DON'T THINK AESTHETICALLY IT WOULD ENHANCE THE PROJECT TO JUST ADD SOME OF THESE, SIMPLY BECAUSE THEY WERE LISTED. WE THINK IT'S BETTER TO HAVE IT BE A MORE DIRECT AND SIMPLE EXPRESSION. AND WE'RE ASKING FOR YOU TO HEL, OBVIOUSLY. >> Chair Downs: SO I THINK THERE WILL BE SEVERAL QUESTIONS. I'LL START OFF WITH ONE. I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND, MAKE SURE I'M UNDERSTANDING. SO THE EXPANSES ABOVE THE GLASS HERE ON THE FRONT YOU'VE SAID WERE FLUTED, BUT IT'S A CAST IN. IT'S HORIZONTAL CAST IN WITH A FOAM OR SOMETHING ON THE INSIDE OF THE FORM THAT GIVES IT THE FLUTED LK? >> IT IS A METAL LINER. IT GIVES IT THE FLUTED LOOK. BUT THE STRUCTURE GOES RIGHT BEHIND IT. THIS IS NOT A PIECE THAT GOES UP THERE. IT'S ALL CONCRETE. >> Chair Downs: I UNDERSTAND. IT'S ALL CAST IN. AND THEN ON THE GARAGE THOUGH, YOU SAID YOU WERE USING A BRICK PATTERN. WHY NOT JUST USE THE SAME PATTERN ON THE GARAGE? >> WE CAN DO THAT. >> Chair Downs: FOR CONSISTENCY PURPOSES. >> NO, I'D BE HAPPY TO DO THAT IF YOU WANTED TO DO THAT. WE THOUGHT THERE W A SPECIFIC REQUEST TO MAKE IT LOOK BRICKLIKE. AND THEN WE FOUND OUT AT THE END THAT THE FORM LINER IS NOT ACCEPTABLE. SO THEN WHAT WE WOULD BE DOING IS THIN BRICK ADHERED TO THE CONCRETE, WHICH WILL NOT HAVE AS LONG A LIFE AS JUST -- >> Chair Downs: I UNDERSTAND THAT. AND THIS BUILDING IS GOING RIGHT NEXT TO THE OTHER CIGNA BUILDING. AND IT HAS A SIMILAR APPROACH WITH THE WHITE CONCRETE AND STUFF, BUT IT HAS MUCH LIKE A BRICK FIRST STORY OR SOMETHING? >> WHICH BUILDING? >> YOU'RE GOING TO BE RIGHT NEXT TO THE CIGNA BUILDING? >> WE'RE ACROSS A VERY LARGE PARKING LOT. AND THEIRS IS NOT WHITE CONCRETE, I DON'T THINK. I THINK IT'S SORT OF A TAN WITH A TAN BRICK. >> Chair Downs: I WAS TRYING TO IN MY HEAD ENVISION THESE TWO BUILDINGS SIDE BY SIDE. WHEN WE THINK ABOUT HAVING AN ARCHITECTURAL CONSISTENCY OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT THROUGH HERE, I WAS JUST TRYING TO GO, WELL, WHAT MIGHT THAT LOOK LIKE. SO, I THINK YOU'VE ANSWERED MY QUESTION, WHICH WAS T REASON YOUS THAT YOU THOUGHT AT WHATEVER POINT THAT THAT WAS AN ATTEMPT TO MEET THE STANDARD. BUT BECAUSE IT'S JUST A CAST MOLD, IT'S NOT THE SAME. SO, ALL RIGHT. COMMISSIONER BRONSKY. >> Bronsky: I ACTUALLY HAD MY FIRST QUESTION WAS ABOUT THE PARKING GARAGE. I AGREE WITH CHAIR DOWNS ON THAT ABSOLUTELY. I PERSONALLY THINK THAT THIS DOES -- THIS IS QUITE A STUNNING AN I BELIEVE THAT -- I THINK IT WOULD BE AN INCREDIBLE WAY FOR PLANO TO BE SHOWN OFF FOR SOMEBODY COMING THROUGH. AND SO MY ONE QUESTION WAS TO CHRISTINA. YOU REFERENCED USING THIS SAME MATERIAL IN PLANO AT 121 -- >> AND LEGACY. >> Bronsky: AND LEGACY. DID THEY NOT NEED AN EXEMPTION FOR THAT? >> THAT'S NOT UNDER THE -- >> DIFFERENT ZONING. >> OVERLAY. IT'S NOT UNDER THE REGIONAL -- >> Bronsky: WHEN I ENVISION SOMETHING THAT WOULD BE CULTURALLY OR ARCHITECTURALLY SIGNIFICANT, THAT AREA IS SOMETHING THAT WE WOULD NOT WANT TO SKIMP ON IN ANY WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM. IF IT'S GOOD ENOUGH FOR THAT AREA, COMING INTO PLANO, IT SEEMS TO ME THAT GRANTING THE EXEMPTION HERE OR ALLOWING THIS TO GO THROUGH MAKES MORE SENSE TO ME. THE FACADE ON THE PARKING GARAGY APPEAL, BUT I'M HOPING THAT YOU GUYS ARE GOING TO DO SOME WORK ON THAT. AND THIS WAS SOMETHING YOU JUST PUT TOGETHER. BUT PUTTING -- WHAT I THINK IS A BEAUTIFUL GLASS BUILDING NEXT TO THIS -- WHAT YOU'VE PROVIDED AS THE PARKING GRAN GARAGE, I STRUE WITH. >> THAT WAS AN ERROR IN JUDGMENT ON MY PART, BECAUSE THAT GARAGE -- WE WERE JUST TRYING TO SHOW THIS IS THE AREA THAT WE WOULD DO IT IN. BUT THE GARAGE -- I'M HAPPY TO PROVIDE SUPPLEMENTALLY RENDERINGS OF THE GARAGE THAT WE HAVE DONE THAT AO EMBRACEHE LANDSCAPE AROUND IT. I MEAN, THE GARAGE IS A SIMPLE THING, BUT IT'S COMPLETELY SURROUNDED BY LANDSCAPE. >> Bronsky: AND THAT WOULD BE MUCH MORE APPEALING. I'VE SEEN WHERE WE'VE PUT GARAGES UP IN PLANO THAT I'VE NOT BEEN HAPPY WITH. AND SO I LOOK FORWARD TO SOMETHING THAT IS JUST AS SIGNIFICANT AS YOUR BUILDING IS. THANK YOU. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER RATLIFF. >> Ratliff: THANK YOU, CHAIRMAN. COUPLE OF QUESTIONS, JUST BECAUSE I WANT TO UNDERSTAND THE SITE PLAN. IF I'M READING YOUR ELEVATIONS RIGHT THE BUILDING IS ON THE TOLLWAY SIDE OF THE PROPERTY WITH THE PARKING GARAGE TO THE EAST OF IT, IS THAT CORRECT? >> YES. WE ORGANIZED IT SO THAT THE END OF THE GARAGE, WHICH IS ON THE GRADE PLUS TWO LEVELS, IS 157 FEET FROM THE PROPERTY LINE OF THE RESIDENCES ACROSS THE -- >> Chair Downs: PARKWOOD. IT'S >> IT'S A VERY LOW PROFILE. STTS 4 FEET AWAY FROM THEING RESIDENCES. SO WE'VE PUSHED THE HIGHER BUILDING TOWARDS THE TOLLWAY. AND THE GARAGE BACK TOWARDS THE -- AND OF THE 157 FEET, WE HAVE A 65-FOOT LANDSCAPE SETBACK ON OUR SIDE OF PARKWOOD. >> Ratliff: FROM A VISIBILITY STANDPOINT, WHEN I'M RUNNING DOWN THE TOLLWAY I'M GOING TO SEE THE BUILDING, NOT NECESSARILY THE PARKING GARAGE. >> ABSOLUTELY. IT'S A VERY NARROW LOT. AND SO -- AND ALSO, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE WERE DOING WITH THE ARCHITECTURE, WE FELT, BECAUSE IT IS A UNIQUE SITE FROM A VISIBILITY POINT OF VIEW -- YOU HAVE ELEVATED VIEWS. YOU HAVE LOWER VIEWS. I MEAN, YOU SEE IT BRIEFLY, YOU'RE DRIVING QUICKLY. IF YOU'RE IN SOME OF THOSE PLACES. BUT THESE ARE SORT OF BIG MOVES, STRUCTURAL MOVES AND THE BIG PIECE OF GLASS. SO IT'S NOT LITTLE BITTY THINGS TO SEE, IT'S A BIG OBJECT AND BIG IMAGE YOU SEE, YOU PERCEIVE QUICKLS YOU'RE DRIVING ON THE TOLLWAY. >> Ratliff: TO FOCUS ON THE BUILDING -- I THINK THAT'S WHAT MOST PEOPLE ARE GOING TO SEE -- THIS STRIKES ME LIKE SOME BUILDINGS I'VE SEEN IN OTHER PARTS THAT ARE MULTISTORY TILT WALL. IS THIS A MULTISTORY TILT WALL PRODUCT? >> YES, IT IS. IT'S HEAVIER TILT WALL. IT'S 11.5 INCHES THICK, WHICH IS UNUSUAL. SO WE CAN GET THE EXPANSE OF THE WINDOWS THAT WE WANTED AND THE HEIGHT THAT WE WANTED. AND THEN, OF COURSE, T TOP FLOOR IS NOT. IT'S JUST GLASS ALL THE WAY AROUND. >> Ratliff: I THINK, YOU KNOW, NOT TO COMPARE YOU TO OTHER PROJECTS, BUT THERE ARE A LOT OF SIMILAR BUILDINGS GOING UP IN SCYPRESS WATERS. A LOT OF THEM ARE ATTRACTIVE. MY CONCERN IS THE PRECEDENT THAT WE SET IN THE R. E. DISTRICT. AND I'M STRUGGLING WITH THAT. I DO THINK IT'S AN ATTRACTIVE BUILDING. BUT I AM WORRIED ABOUT PAIED TIL. I THINK ONE OF THE REASONS FOR THE STANDARD IS TO HAVE A TIMELESS PRODUCT THAT WILL WEAR -- MASONRY IS FOREVER, YOU KNOW. USUALLY PAINTED TILL WALL IS NOT. IF YOU PAINT IT ONCE, YOU HAVE TO REPAINT IT. >> IF IT'S A GOOD PAINT, IT WILL LAST LONGER THAN I WILL BE AROUND, I CAN TELL YOU. >> Ratliff: DITTO, BUT IT WON'T LAST AS LONG AS A BRICK. [ LAUGHING ] SO THAT'S WHAT I'M STRUGGLING WITH. I DO LIKE YOUR ARCHITECTURE. I THINK IT'S WL-DONE. I THINK IT WILL BE WELL-DONE TO SEE FROM THE FREEWAY. I AM STRUGGLING A LITTLE WITH THE PAINTED TILT WALL PRODUCT. AND SO I SURE DO WISH YOU HAD AT LEAST A MASONRY FIRST FLOOR. I'M NOT AS CONCERNED ABOUT THE PARKING GARAGE. I THINK THAT CAN BE FINE, ESPECIALLY A TWO-LEVEL. I'M NOT AS WORRIED ABOUT THAT. I AM STRUGGLING WITH THE BUILDING. SO THAT'S WHY I NEEDED THOSE QUESTIONS ANSWERED. IS THERE A THIN PRODUCT THAT YOU CONSIDERED TO USE HERE, A TILE, A LARGE FORMAT THIN BRICK OR ANYTHING THAT WOULD MEET YOUR ARCHITECTURAL GOAL? IF WE TOLD YOU NO, WHAT WOULD YOUR SOLUTION BE? >> WELL, THE THIN BRICK WE COULD MAKE WORK. AND THE TILE WE COULD MAKE WORK. BUT THOSE WILL NOT HAVE THE DURABILITY OF THE CONCRETE. IT WILL BE SUBJECT TO FREEZE/THAW CYCLES. WATER WILL GET BEHIND IT. AND ANYTIME YOU SEE WRE THERE'S THIN STONE OR THIN TILE OR THIN BRICK THAT IS ADHERED, EVENTUALLY IT WILL BEGIN TO POP OFF AND IT WILL BE A MAINTENANCE ISSUE. TO USE REAL BRICK AROUND THIS THEN MEANS THAT WE HAVE A WHOLE OTHER FRAME, STRUCTURAL FRAME INSIDE AND THEN YOU WRAP THAT AROUND. AND I WORK WITH BRICK A LOT. I'VE -- I DID THE EXPANSION OF NORTH PARK IN 2006. AND WHEN I FIRST CAME TO DALLAS, I WORKEDN THE OLD NORTH PARK AND I CAN TELL YOU THEY SPEND YEAR AFTER YEAR A LOT OF MONEY TRYING TO CLEAN BRICK, TRYING TO RE-GROUT IT, POINT AND GROUT IT. IN A COMMERCIAL SETTING, I DON'T BELIEVE IT'S AS DURABLE AS THE CONCRETE. THAT'S MY HUMBLE OPINION. IT'S JUST WHAT MY EXPERIENCE HAS BEEN. >> Ratliff: BACK TO MY ORIGINAL QUESTION, IS THERE A PRODUCT YOU CONSIDERED? IF WE TOLD YOU NO, DO YOU HAVE A POTENTIAL SOLUTION? >> NO. I THINK WHAT WE WOULD DO IS -- I'M GOING TO GO BACK TO THOSE AWFUL SLIDES OF THE GARAGE FOR JUST A MINUTE. YOU CAN'T REALLY SEE THIS. WHAT IS DONE HERE IS THAT WE HAVE -- WHETHER WE SET THE THIN BRICK IN AS OPPOSED TO CASTING CONCRETE AND PERHAPS PUT SOME SORT OF A CAPPEDST STONE ON IT. BUT WE WILL PUSH IT IN AND THEN LEAVE A BIT OF THE CONCRETE THAT'S EXPRESSED LIKE A SLAB SO THAT IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE BRICKS HANGING THERE. BRICK DOESN'T WANT TO BE A BEAM. BUT IT GIVES US A BETTER LOOK IN TERMS OF THAT. AND SO IF WE HAD TO DO THAT, WE'D DO SOMETHING LIKE THAT. >> Chair Downs: JUST FYI, THIN BRICK WOULD NOT BE ALLOWED. WE HAD TO DO A VARIANCE RECENTLY FOR THIN BRICK. >> Ratliff: THAT'S RIGHT. I FORGOT ABOUT THAT. THIS WOULD HE TO BE BRICK BRICK. WE CAN GET CLAY-FIRED THIN BRICK, BUT THIN BRICK'S GOT PROBLEMS. >> Chair Downs: YEAH. >> Ratliff: OKAY. THAT ANSWERS MY QUESTIONS FOR RIGHT NOW. THANK YOU. >> Chair Downs: I DON'T SEE ANY OTHER HANDS UP OR ANY OTHER DEALS, SO I GUESS THERE'S NO MORE QUESTIONS FOR YOU AT THIS POINT. SO REALLY IT'S KIND OF UP TO US. IS THERE ANYONE ELSE HERE THAT WANTS TO SPEAK ON THIS ITEM? IT'S NOT A PUBLIC HEARING. OKAY. THANK YOU. I'LL GO FIRST. IT'S A BEAUTIFUL BUILDING. I KIND OF SAID THE SAME THING BEFORE WITH THE OTHER PROJECT THAT CAME TO -- US FOR A VARIANCE IS THAT I THINK -- I'M NOT UP TO DATE ON ALL THE MATERIALS THAT ARE OUT THERE FOR US TO USE. AND AS YOU SAID, THIS PAINT EVIDENTLY LASTS -- NO OFFENSE. I LOOK AS OLD AS YOU ARE. I'M NOT SURE SAYING IT'S GOING TO LAST LONGER THAN YOU'LL BE AROUND IS A LONG TIME. JUST SAYING. >> IT IS A LONG TIME, YOU KNOW. >> Chair Downs: NO OFFENSE. >> THESE THINGS ARE WARRANTIED FOR 20-25 YEARS. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. SO IT'S A 20-25 YEAR PRODUCT. OKAY. SO I'M TRYING TO THINK OF BRICK BUILDINGS THAT AFTER 20 YEARS DON'T HAVE CRACKS IN THE MORTAR AND STUFF LIKE THAT. SO I TEND TO BE A LITTLE MORE LENIENT. I STRUGGLE WITH TOO MUCH RESTRICTION. WE'RE BEING PRESENTED WITH A PROJECT THAT LOOKS BEAUTIFUL AND I DON'T THINK WE'LL HAVE ANY ISSUE WITH SOMEBODY COMING INTO TOWN AND THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE DOING TO SEE. I DON'T THINK I HAVE AN ISSUE WITH THAT. THERE'S NOTHING SO OUTLANDISH THAT IT WOULD STAND OUT IN A BAD WA AGAINST ALMOST ANYTHING ELSE THAT CAME THROUGH. SO, I TEND TO BE IN FAVOR OF GRANTING THE VARIANCE, PERSONALLY. THAT'S WHERE I STAND ON THIS. ANYONE ELSE? COMMISSIONER CARY -- NOW WE'VE GOT ALL KINDS OF LIGHTS ON. WE NEED A BELL. [ LAUGHING ] >> Chair Downs: I CAN'T KEEP LOOKING -- >> Cary: GO BACK TO JUST CALLING OUT. >> Chair Downs: I COULD JUST DO THAT. >> Cary: THANK YOU, SIR. I'M WITH YOU, COMMISSIONER DOWNS, ON THIS. AND I THINK COMMISSIONER RATLIFF DOES RAISE A GOOD POINT THAT WE SHOULD BE THOUGHTFUL ABOUT WHAT IF ANY PCEDENTE'RE SETTING, WHAT THE RAMIFICATIONS OF THAT MIGHT BE. I THINK THERE'S WISDOM THERE. WITH THAT SAID, I FIND THIS A STRIKING BUILDING. AND I ALSO BELIEVE THAT FROM A LONGEVITY POINT OF VIEW AND THE OTHER THINGS THAT IT MAKES SENSE TO ME. AND SO IN A NUTSHELL I THINK I'M FOR THIS. AND BY THE WAY, THE THING YOU SAID, CHAIRMAN DOWNS, IS THAT I THINK WE'RE WORKING ON THEM, BUT SOME OF OUR CURRENT STANDARDS ARE MAYBE A LITTLE DATED. SO TO MAYBE JUDGE A BUILDING LIKE THIS THROUGH THAT LENSE -- I DON'T THINK I'M IN FAVOR OF THAT. SO I LIKE THIS PROJECT. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF IS NEXT. >> Brounoff: THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN. I DON'T WANT TO BE PICKY, OKAY. THAT IS NOT MY INTENTION. >> Chair Downs: [ LAUGHING ] >> Brounoff: THE LITTLE METAL STRIPS, THE SCREENING AROUND THE ROOF, THE STRIPS ACROSS THE TOP OF THE WINDOWS -- FINE. THEY SERVE A PURPOSE AND THEY'RE NOT MAJOR. ALSO, THE EAST FACADE OF THIS BUILDING IS EFFECTIVELY SCREENED BY THE PARKING GARAGE, AS IS THE WEST SIDE OF THE PARKING BARRAGE IS SCREENED BY THE BUILDING, OKAY. SO WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT ESSENTIALLY ARE THE NORTH AND SOUTH SIDES OF THE BUILDING AND THE OTHER THREE SIDES OF THE PARKING GARAGE. I AGREE THAT THIS IS A VERY NICE ATTRACTIVE-LOOKING BUILDING, AS WE'VE SEEN IN THE RENDERING. IF IT WERE MOVED OUT OF THE REGIONAL EMPLOYMENT DISTRICT TO SOME OTHER LOCATION IN THE CITY, I COULD BE VERY HAPPY WITH IT. MY ONLY CONCERN IS THAT -- SINCE I'VE BEEN ON THE COMMISSION THIS IS THE SECOND CASE WE'VE HEARD IN WHICH SOMEONE IS SEEKING A VARIANCE FROM THE ARCHITECTURAL MATERIALS ORDINANCE. OUR FIRST CASE WAS A SUPERMARKET THAT WANTED TO USE CINDERBLOCKS IN STEAD OF BRICKS. WE GRANTED THAT VARIANCE. THIS APPLICANT WANTS TO USE CONCRETE INSTEAD OF THE LISTED MATERIALS. AND I AM CONCERNED THAT WE'RE IN THE PROCESS OF THROWING AWAY THE ORDINANCE, BECAUSE I CAN SEE FUTURE APPLICANTS JUST LINING UP JUST WAITING TO COME TO US TO ASK TO BUILD WITH SOMETHING ELSE. IF WE KEEP GRANTING VARIANCES WE'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE AN ORDINANCE LEFT. WE'RE IN THE PROCESS OF KILLING IT. SO YES, THIS IS A BEAUTIFUL BUILDING, BUT I'M CONCERNED ABOUT THE PRECEDENT EFFECT GOING FORWARD. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER BRONSKY. >> Bronsky: I AGREE WITH YOU, CHAIR DOWNS, ON THIS. I THINK AS I SAID, I THINK SOMETHING OF THIS QUALITY WOULD BE A STRIKING ENTRANCE FOR PLANO. I DON'T OW AS MUCH AS COMMISSIONER RATLIFF AS IT RELATES TO THE TILT WALL AND THINGS OF THAT NATURE, BUT EVERYTHING THAT I'VE SEEN I DEFINITELY THINK WE SHOULD GRANT THE VARIANCE. AND TO COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF'S POINT, I THINK HB2439 HAS DONE QUITE A BIT TO THAT ALREADY. I STRUGGLE WITH THE GROCERY STORE AND WHAT WE DID THERE. TO ME, I SEE A SIGNIFICANT DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WHAT IS HERE AND WHAT WE SAW THERE. AND FRANKLY, WHAT THE BIGGEST DIFFERENCE I THINK FOR SOME PEOPLE WAS, THEY ACTUALLY GOT TO TOUCH WHAT WAS BROUGHT IN. I WAS SURPRISED THAT WE BOUGHT A SALES PRESENTATION ON A TYPE OF MATERIAL. BUT I LIKE THIS AND I'M GOING TO VOTE FOR ITS ACCEPTANCE, NOT FOR THE -- >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER OLLEY. >> Olley: I THINK SIMILAR TO COMMISSIONER BRONS. I SEE A LITTLE BIT OF DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THIS AND THE GROCERY STORE, JUST FROM THE IMPACT TO FOLKS LIVING AROUND IT. IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN, THE CLOSEST RESIDENTIAL DWELLINGS TO THIS SHOULD BE FAR ENOUGH THAT YOU CAN'T REALLY SEE WHAT HAS BEEN BUILT. I'M TRYING TO REMEMBER THE CURRENT CIGNA BUILDING. THE ONLY THING I CAN THINK OF IS THIS IS AN ENHANCEMENT TO THAT, MAKES IT LOOK BETTER. BUT COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF'S -- THERE YOU GO. YEAH. COMMISSIONER BROUNOFF'S POINT IS WELL-TAKEN. IF WE'RE GETTING, IT FEELS LIKE EVERYTHING IS COMING AS A VARIANCE OR AN EXCEPTION, THEN PERHAPS WE NEED TO LOOK AT THE BASELINE ORDINANCE AND UPDATE IT TO AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE, BRING IT TO ACCOMMODATE THE REALITY OF THE PRESENT. SO YEAH. I PROBABLY AM IN FAVOR OF GRANTING AN EXCEPTION TO THIS. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. COMMISSIONER RATLIFF. >> Ratliff: THANK YOU, CHAIRMAN. I THINK -- I SIT HERE CONTEMPLATING THE PRECEDENT WE'RE SETTING AND TRYING NOT TO SET A PRECEDENT THAT OPENS THE DOOR FOR JUST A SLEW OF TILT WALL BUILDINGS. AND THAT'S MY STRUGGLE. SO -- BUT I THINK -- I REALLY DO LOVE THE ARCHITECTURE. I THINK IT'S FABULOUS. AND WHAT MAKES IT GREAT IS THE ARTICULATION THAT'S IN THE BUILDING. IT'S NOT YOUR STANDARD RECTANGLE AND I REALLY LIKE THAT. BUT I THINK WHAT I REALLY LIKE ABOUT IT -- I WAS JUST DOING SOME QUICK MATH -- IS THAT THE TWO FACADES THAT YOU'RE REALLY GOING TO SEE -- MOST PEOPLE ARE GOING TO SEE RUNNING DOWN THE TOLLWAY ARE GOING TO BE THE SOUTH AND WEST FACADES, BECAUSE THAT'S THE PEOPLE HEADED NORTH ON THE TOLLWAY, THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE GOING TO SEE. SOUTH FACADE HAS 73% GLASS A METAL. >> Chair Downs: MHMM. >> Ratliff: THE WEST FACADE HAS 98% GLASS AND METAL. SO WE'RE REALLY NOT TALKING ABOUT THAT MUCH IS SURFACE AREA. IF ANOTHER BUILDING COMES IN WITH SIMILAR PROPORTIONS, I PROBABLY WOULD FEEL THE SAME WAY. IF IT COMES IN WITH 60% CONCRETE AND 40% GLASS, I'M PROBABLY NOT GOING TO FEEL THE SAME WAY. AND SO I THINK WHAT GIVES ME SOME PAUSE IN ALLOWING A DEVIATION FROM THE STANDARD AND SETTING A PRECEDENT IS IT'S NOT SETTING A PR PRECEDENT. IF SOMEONE WANTS TO COME IN WITH A 98% GLASS FACADE, I'D PROBABLY CONSIDER IT AGAIN. SO WITH THAT SAID, YOU TALKED ME INTO IT. I'LL BE HONEST. I LOVE THE ARCHITECTURE. I JUST WAS TRYING TO FIGURE OUT THE REST OF IT. >> THANK YOU. >> Ratliff: SO I'M IN FAVOR. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER TONG. >> Tong: I JUST WANT TO SAY THAT YEAH, I AGREE WITH CHAIRMAN DOWNS. AND ALSO, AS WE'RE TALKING, I PULLED UP PICTURES OF LEGY WEST, OUR MODEL PROJECT ON THE TOLLWAY. AND I UNDERSTAND THERE ARE A LOT OF RETAIL. I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S NOT CONSIDERED AN EMPLOYMENT CENTER, BUT IT'S CONSIDERED RETAIL. BUT THEY'RE -- THERE ARE OFFICES THERE TOO. SO I THINK AT LEAST FROM THIS RENDERING IT LOOKS GREAT. IT LOOKS BETTER THAN WHAT THE GOOGLE MAP LOOKS -- THE LEGACY WEST BUILDING LOOKED. SO I'M IN FAVOR OF THIS. AND I APPRECIATE WHAT COMMISSIONER RATLIFF JUST DID THE CALCULATION. AND TT KIND OF SUPPORTS MY OPINION TOO. SO I'M IN FAVOR OF THIS. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. SO, WOULD SOMEONE LIKE TO -- >> I MOVE WE APPROVE THE VARIANCE. >> Chair Downs: WE HAVE A MOTION BY COMMISSIONER BRONSKY WITH A SECOND BY COMMISSIONER CARY TO APPROVE THE VARIANCE. PLEASE VOTE. THAT ITEM CARRIES 6-1. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >> Chair Downs: BEAUTIFUL BUILDI. ITEM 6. >> AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 6, DISCUSSION AND ACTION. CONSIDERATION OF PORTIONS OF THE COLLIN CREEK PATTERN BOOK/DESIGN GUIDELINES FOR URBAN MIXED-USE-3. APPLICANT: CENTURION AMERICAN DEVELOPMENT GROUP. >> URBAN MIXED USE THREE WAS APPROVED BY THE CITY IN 2018 AND WAS AMENDED IN 2020 AND 2021. AS PART OF THE ZONING REQUEST, THE APPLICANT PROPOSED A VISION FOREDEVOPMENT THAT INCLUDES PRELIMINARY DESIGN ELEMENTS FOR THE PROPERTY. ADDITIONAL TIME AND STUDY WERE NEEDED TO DETERMINE THE PRECISE DESIGN STANDARDS TO BE UTILIZED THROUGH THE ZONING PROCESS. DUE TO THE SIZE AND SIGNIFICANCE OF THE PROPERTY, THE CITY ADOPTED A REQUIREMENT TO ALLOW THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION TO APPROVE A PATTERN BOOK DETAILING THE DESIGN ELEMENTS FOR THE DEVELOPMENT. THE PURPOSE OF THIS APPROVAL IS TO VERIFY FURTHER THE PROCESS THAT THE INITIAL VISION OF THE REDEVELOPMENT REMAINS INTACT AND IS BEING FULFILLED AS DETAILS ARE AVAILABLE. STANRDS FOR THE DEVELOPMENT THROUGHOUT THE PROJECT. STAFF AND APPLICANT HAVE BEEN COLLABORATING ON THE BOOK SINCE 2019. WITH THE SIGNIFICANT SIZE OF THE PROPERTY, INCLUDING THE VARIOUS SITE PLANS, THE BOOK HAS BEEN REVIEWED IN TWO PHASES. THE FIRST PHASE OF THE BOOK WAS APPROVED LAST JULY AND STAFF -- IN THE STAFF REPORT, IT WAS INCLUDED IN THE PACKET FOR THE BACKGROUND. THIS SECTION INCLUDES THE REMAINDER OF THE SECTIONS AS SHOWN ON THE SLIDE. I'LL BRIEFLY WALK THROUGH THE NEW SECTIONS OF THIS PRESENTATION. E URN CORE DISTRICT FOCUSES ON THE COMMERCIAL AND MULTIFAMILY RESIDENCE. THIS PORTION OF THE BOOK PROVIDES DETAILS REGARDING RETAIL BUILDINGS ASSOCIATED WITH THE REFURBISHED BUILDING, MULTIFAMILY, AND INDEPENDENT LIVING DEVELOPMENTS AND OFFICE AND HOSPITALITY DEVELOPMENTS. THE URBAN CORE PARKING SECTION PROVIDES INFORMATION REGARDING PUBLIC PARKING SITUATIONS INCLUDING GARAGES AND ON-STREET PARKING SPACES. AS PART OF THIS EFFORT, THE DEVELOPER AND THE CITY WORKED WITH CONSULTANT TO IDENTIFY FEATURES THAT WOULD BENIT PESTRIANS IN A MIXED-USE ENVIRONMENT. THESE IMPROVEMENTS INCLUDE WAY-FINDING ARCHITECTURAL IMPROVEMENTS INCLUDING HIGH CEILINGS AND LIGHTING CONSIDERATIONS. BLOCK LANDSCAPING INFORMATION IS ALSO PROVIDED IN THIS SECTION. THERE ARE A VARIETY OF PUBLIC-PRIVATE OPEN SPACES WITHIN THE DEVELOPMENT. THE PATTERN BOOK INCLUDES CONSHE INFORMATION TO HIGHLIGHT THESE SPACES. THIS IMAGE IS REPRESENTATIVE RENDERINGS OF THE PASEO THE CITYS WORKING WITH THE DEVELOPER AND IS GOING THROUGH THE PUBLIC PROCESS TO DESIGN THE PUBLIC PARKS. THE LAST SECTION OF THIS PHASE IS FOCUSED ON STREETS AND AMENITIES. INCLUDED IN THIS SECTION ARE ELEMENTS IDENTIFYING STREET TYPES, WAITING AND LOADING AREAS, AND TRAFFIC DIRECTIONAL ITEMS. PUBLIC SEATING, BIKE RACKS, AND OTHER AMENITIES ARE ALSO INCLUDED IN THIS CONSIDERATION. IF CHANGES OCCUR OR NEW SECTIONS ARE NECESSARY, THE PATTERN BOOK WILLE BROUGHT BACK TO THE COMMISSION FOR FURTHER DISCUSSION. AT THIS TIME, STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF THE PRESENTED SECTIONS OF THE BOOK. I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MIGHT HAVE, AND THE APPLICANT IS ALSO AVAILABLE TO ANSWER QUESTIONS. >> Chair Downs: THANK YOU. I HAVE A QUESTION. THIS PRESENTATION IS AMAZING, THE AMOUNT OF INFORMATION THAT'S IN HERE. WAS THIS CREATED BY THE DEVELOPER, OR BY STAFF? >> I BELIEVE IT WAS A JOINT PROJECT. >> I WT TO GIVE CRET TO THE ARCHITECTURES FOR THE DEVELOPER. THEY'RE THE ONES WHO REALLY DID THE HEAVY LIFT ON THIS. WE GAVE THEM COMMENTS, BUT REALLY THEY GET THE CREDIT. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. AMAZING STUFF IN HERE. AND A LITTLE DENSE. THERE'S A LOT OF INFORMATION THAT'S COVERED, BUT YOU READ THROUGH IT, I GET EVEN MORE EXCITED ABOUT WHAT THIS PLACE IS GOING TO BE WHEN IT GETS DONE. IT CHECKS EVERY SINGLE BOX. SO, KUDOS TO WHOEVER PUT THIS TOGETHER AND THE VISION THAT BROUGHT THIS TOGETHER. SO, I SEE COMMISSIONER RATLIFF HAS A COMMENT. >> Ratliff: FIRST OF ALL, DITTO TO ALL THAT. THIS IS AN INCREDIBLY HEAVY LIFT FOR THE TEAM, SO WAY MORE DETAILS THAN I CAN ABSORB. AND WHEN I DID DRILL DOWN ON THE DETAILS, THEY WERE VERY WELL THOUGHT OUT. I HAD ONE QUESTION BECAUSE IT'S A GRAPHIC, BUT IT DOESN'T SEEM TO MATCH THE NARRATIVE. SO I WANT TO SEE IF IT'S JUST THE GRAPHIC THAT DOESN'T MATCH THE NARRATIVE. ON PAGE 36, THE BLOCK S MULTIFAMILY CONCEPTUAL DESIGN, YOU CAN PUT THAT UP ON THE SCREEN. IT MAY BE THAT I CAN'T SEE THE DETAILS IN THE PICTURE. IT LOOKS LIKE THERE'S A LOT OF BROWN BRICK ON THAT WALL. IS THERE VARYING MATERIALS? THE NARRATIVE TALKS ABOUT VARYING MATERIALS VERTICALLY AND HORIZONTALLY. THE PICTURE DOESN'T SEEM TO PORTRAY THAT. AND SO I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THERE IS VARIATION, BOTH VERTICALLY AND HORIZONTALLY IN THE MATERIALS SO WE DON'T GET THIS MONOLITHIC LOOK THAT APPEARS IN THE PICTURE. >> Chair Downs: RIGHT. >> I'LL HAVE TO DEFER TO MR. H HALE OR MS. DAY. THEY HAVE DONE MOST OF THE WORK ON THIS. >> I WOULD SAY THE ARCHITECT IS HERE MICHAEL. THIS WOULD BE GREAT. HE'S BEEN DOING THE BUILDING DESIGN. I THINK THIS WOULD BE A FANTASTIC QUESTION FOR THE APPLICANT. >> Chair Downs: SURE. AND THIS IS NOT A PUBLIC HEARING, BUT YOU'RE WELCOME. PLEASE, THE ARCHITECT. THAT WAS THE ONLY PERSON THAT HAD A QUESTION, SO WE'RE GOING TO GO AHEAD AND DIRECT IT. >> MICHAEL, BUSINESS ADDRESS 1800 VALLEY VIEW LANE, SUITE 400. PERSONAL ADDRESS, 3625 SPARKLING LANE PLANO. SO, ARCHITECT AND RESIDENT. SO THE IMAGE THAT'S IN THE BOOK IS SOMETHING THAT WAS DEVELOPED MONTHS AGO. WE HAVE THAT SAME BUILDING IN CONSTRUCTION DOCUMENT PHASE RIGHT NOW. ACTUALLY PREPARING TO SUBMIT IT FOR PERMIT REVIEW AND CONSIDERATION. THE BOOK ITSELF ESSENTIALLY LEANS INTO THE CITY OF PLANO REQUIREMENTS FOR ALL THE ARCHITECTURE. THERE ARE SPECIFIC COMBINATIONS AND I GUESS STYLES THAT REFLECT WHAT WE PRESENTED LAST YEAR IN THE SINGLE-FAMILY, BUT MODIFIED TO BE MORE COMMERCIAL IN NATURE. WE'VE GOT OFFICES, THE RETAIL, AND THE MULTIFAMILY AS WELL AS THE RESTAURANTS RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF THE SITE. SO, WHAT I CAN SAY IS THAT THE VARTION BUT THERE ARE A LOT OF WOOD TONES AND STONE AND DARKER BRICK. AND AS WE ZOOMED OUT, I THINK IT GOT MUDDIED, ESPECIALLY WITH REGARD TO AN 8 1/2 x 11 IMAGE. THAT'S THE SHEET OF PAPER. THE IMAGE IS EVEN SMALLER. SO, HAPPY TO -- >> Ratliff: IS IT FAIR TO SAY -- BECAUSE I SEEM TO READ THAT IN THE NARRATIVE, THAT A LONG RUNNING BLOCK OF MULTIFAMILY THERE WILL BE VERTICAL CHANGES IN MATERIALS. I CAN READ THAT INTOHE PICTURE, BUT I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT IS THE INTENT. >> ABSOLUTELY. AND ALONG MAIN STREET, WE HAVE OUR OWN UMU FOR THIS PROJECT. AND IT IS URBAN IN NATURE. SO ALTHOUGH WE'RE RIGHT UP TO THE PROPERTY LINE WITH SETBACKS AND VARIATION, THAT CONTOUR AGAINST THAT PARKING GARAGE THAT EVERYBODY IS FAMILIAR WITH FROM DRIVING PAST IT, I'M SURE. THE MAIN STREET CURVES AT WHAT TURNS INTO A BOOMERANG SHAPE. THERE'S A LOT OF STEPPING AS WE HIT EACH OF THOSEORNERS FROM THE TWO S BLOCK MULTIFAMILY BUILDINGS. IN SOME CASES IT FOLLOWS THE STRUCTURE. IN OTHER CASES IT PROVIDES A RELIEF FOR BALCONIES AND MATERIAL CHANGES FROM, YOU KNOW, I THINK WE'VE GOTSTO STONE AT TE LOWER LEVEL TO PROVIDE THAT SENSE OF WEIGHT AND PERMANENCE. AS YOU GO UP WE'VE GOT BRICK. THE THREE-STEP STUCCO, WHICH IS A CITY REQUIREMENT. A COMBINATION OF GLASS AND BALCONY DOORS AND JUST EVERYTHING WOULD MATCH WHAT IS CURRENTLY REQUIRED BY THE CITY OF PLANO, IS WHAT I CAN SAY. >> Ratliff: GREAT. JUST WANTED TO CLARIFY THAT. OVERALL, OUTSTANDING WORK. I'M EXCITED TO SEE THE FINISHED PRODUCT. >> GREAT. >> Chair Downs: COMMISSIONER TONG. >> Tong: I ALSO HAD A SIMILAR QUESTION TO COMMISSIONER RATLIFF REGARDING THE LOOKS AND COLORS OF THE BUILDINGS. SO ON PAGE 39 -- AND I'M NOT SURE IF THAT RENDERING MAYBE JUST HAS A SLIGHT COLOR THAT MAY BE EXACTLY THE SAME, OR DIFFERENT FROM THE REAL PRODUCT THAT YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE. FOR SOME REASON, TO ME, THAT BUILDING LOOKS LIKE AN OLD NEW YORK-STYLE APARTMENT BUILDING. SO, I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S YOUR INTENT, OR IF THAT'S JUST THE RENDERING JUST LOOKS OLD. I JUST WONDER WHAT YOU'RE THINKING ABOUT THAT. >> OKAY. >> Tong: IS THE BUILDING GOING TO BE LOOKING JUST LIKE THAT? >> SO TT IS THE OFFICE AND HOSPITALITY SHEET. >> Chair Downs: YES. >> AND WHAT WE WERE TRYING TO SHOW THERE IS JUST THAT THERE WOULD BE A DEPTH WITH REGARD TO THE FACADE OF THE BUILDING. MATERIAL CHANGES, COLOR VARIATION, BUT THIS IS NOT THE DESIGN FOR ANY SPECIFC PROJECT CURRENTLY ON-SITE. IT'S JUST A REFERENCE POINT TO GET AN IDEA -- >> Tong: WHAT KIND OF MATERIAL IS ON THAT WALL THERE? >> SO THE BROWN COLOR IS A BRICK. AND THEN IT LOOKS LIKE TRE'S METAL PANEL SYSTEM. OR IT COULD BE SOME SORT OF A PRECAST CLADDING WHICH IS GRAY THERE WITH THE SIGNAGE. AND THEN WE'VE GOT ADDITIONAL BRICK AND STUCCO SURFACES BEYOND. BUT AGAIN, THAT'S A REFERENCE POINT. YOU KNOW, THE ELEVATIONS ARE ALL PRELIMINARY. IT'S VERY CLEARLY STATED THAT NONE OF THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT WOULD BE SUBMITTED WHEN IT COMES TIME FOR PERMIT REVIEW. ULTIMATELY IT DOES BECOME, YOU OW, THE BUILDING INSPECTION DEPARTMENT OR PERMIT REVIEW THAT WOULD VERIFY THAT WE'RE IN COMPLIANCE. OTHERWISE I'LL BE BACK UP HERE AGAIN ASKING FOR A VARIANCE, SO. >> Tong: OKAY, SO IF WE APPROVE THIS TODAY, THIS PICTURT MAY NOT LOOK LIKE THIS AT ALL, IS THAT RIGHT, OR . . .? >> IT WILL NOT LOOK LIKE THIS EXACT IMAGE. >> Tong: OKAY. >> BUT IT WILL HAVE A COMBINATION OF MATERIALS, AND COLORS, AND A DEPTH TO THE DESIGN AND FACADE THAT WE THINK ENHANCES THE EXPERIENCE AND MATCHES EXALY WT THEISIO IS FOR THE PROJECT. >> Tong: AND THAT WILL BE SUBMITTED TO THE STAFF FOR ANOTHER REVIEW? >> THAT WOULD BE SUBMITTED TO THE BUILDING INSPECTIONS DEPARTMENT. AND THERE WOULD LIKELY BE SOME COMMUNICATION TO ENSURE THAT WHAT WAS SUBMITTED MATCHES THE INTENT BASED ON THE DOZENS OF MEETINGS THAT WE'VE HAD WITH CHRISTINA AND ERIC AND THE REST OF THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT. >> Tong: OKAY. THANK YOU. >> Chair Downs: OKAY. I DON'T SEE ANY OTHER -- >> MY TURN TO THANK CHRISTINA AND ERIC. TH PYED A MAJOR ROLE IN THIS AND THEY DEFINITELY HELPED BRING THIS TO THE LEVEL OF DEVELOPMENT THAT YOU SEE RIGHT NOW, SO, THANK YOU. >> Chair Downs: THANK YOU. >> A LOT OF TIME WENT INTO IT. >> Chair Downs: GREAT JOB. >> I WANT TO SAY I AGREE WITH EVERYBODY. I'M THRILLED. I HAD THE SAME QUESTION THAT COMMISSIONER RATLIFF HAD ON PAG. I'M VERY EXCITED ABOUT THIS COMING FORWARD. AND SO I WANT TO MOVE THAT WE ACCEPT THIS AS SUBMITTED. >> I'LL SECOND THAT. >> Chair Downs: WE HAVE A MOTION BY COMMISSIONER BRONSKY WITH A SECOND BY COMMISSIONER OLLEY. DO YOU HAVE SOMETHING ELSE YOU WANT TO ADD? >> [ OFF MIC ] >> Chair Downs: OKAY. VERY GOOD. SO PLEASE VOTE. THAT CARRIES 7-0. CONGRATULATIONS. GOOD WORK. CAN'T WAIT FOR THIS TO GET BUILT. I KNOW YOU'RE WORKING. A LOT OF UNDERGROUND STUFF FIRST RIGHT? >> [ OFF MIC ] >> Chair Downs: YOU'LL STAY? [ LAUGHING ] OKAY. MOVING ON. >> AGENDA ITEM NUMBER 7, DISCUSSION AND ACTION: REQUEST TO CALL A PUBLIC HEARING TO UPDATE THE THOROUGHFARE STANDARDS RULES AND REGULATIONS APPLICANT, CITY OF PLANO. >> I'M A SENIOR MOBILITY PLANNER WITH THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT. AS YOU'RE AWARE, CITY STAFF HAS BROUGHT MULTIPLE SECTIONS OF THE THOROUGHFARE STANDARDS, WITH THE PURPOSE OF INCORPORATING NATIONAL BEST PRACTICES AND A FOCUS ON SERVING THE CITIZENS OF PLANO. I THINK THE MOST IMPORTANT MESSAGE THAT I WANT TO GET TO YOU TODAY IS THAT THEECTIS THAT WE HAVE PRESENTED OVER TIME SINCE OCTOBER AND ALL THE OTHER SECTIONS ARE AVAILABLE ON planocompplan.org/STREETS. ALL THE SECTIONS ARE AVAILABLE NOW. WE HAVE A PUBLIC OPEN HOUSE SCHEDULED TO DISCUSS THE DOWNTOWN STREETS PORTION THAT I BROUGHT TO THE COMMISSION. I BELIEVE THAT WAS IN FEBRUARY. OR IT'S LAST TIME. IT WAS A WHILE AGO. AND THEN WE'RE COLLECTING PUBLIC COMMENTS. AND SO WE INVITE THE PUBLIC AND YOURSELVES TO GO TO THE WEBSITE AND VIEW THE SECTIONS. >> Chair Downs: THANK YOU. >> HAPPY TO ANSWER YOUR QUESONS. >> Cha Downs: WE'RE AT THAT POINT WHERE WE NEED TO CALL A PUBLIC HEARING AND GET INPUT. >> CORRECT. SO IT'S AN EXCITING TIME. >> Chair Downs: IT'S A SIMPLE ASK FOR US TONIGHT. WE NEED TO CALL A PUBLIC HEARING. >> I MOVE WE CALL A PUBLIC HEARING. >> SECOND. [ LAUGHING ] >> Chair Downs: THEY MIGHT NEED A LITTLE MORE DETAIL, I DON'T KNOW. IS THAT SUFFICIENT, CHRISTINA? >> I THINK THAT'S SUFFICIENT. >> Chair Downs: THAT'S SUFFICIENT. I THINK EVERYBODY'S AT THE END OF THEIR ROPE. WE HAVE A MOTION BY COMMISSIONER BRONSKY WITH A SECOND BY COMMISSIONER RATLIFF. WITH NO HESITATION AT ALL TO CALL A PUBLIC HEARING. [ LAUGHING ] >> Chair Downs: AND DISCUSS OUR THOROUGHFARE STANDARDS, RULES, AND REGULATIONS. PLEASE VOTE. EVERYONE'S REALLY EXCITED ABOUT THAT ONE. IT CARRIED 7-0. [ LAUGHING ] THANK YOU, EVERYBODY. 10:38, LONG NIGHT. FIRST TWO HOURS ON A VERY IMPORTANT DECISION, SO IT WAS WORTH IT. WE HAVE TO SPEND THE TIME TO DO IT. THANKS SO MUCH TO STAFF. YOU GUYS, YOU'RE SALARIED. YOU'RE NOT GETTING OVERTIME FOR SITTING HERE, SO I'M REALLY IMPRESSED AND YOU'RE SHORT-HANDEN MAKING IT THROUGH THE EVENING. DO WE HAVE ANYTHING ELSE? I GUESS ITEM 7 WOULD BE ITEMS FOR FUTURE AGENDA? >> YES, SIR. >> Chair Downs: OH. [ LAUGHING ] >> Chair Downs: NOW THEY'RE YANKING MY CHAIN. [ LAUGHING ] >> Chair Downs: ITEM 7 CARRIES 7-0. SO, COMMISSIONER OLLEY. >> Olley: I'LL PUT ONE OUT THERE. BACK TO THE EXCEPTIONS AND VARIANCES TO THE FACADE, I WONDER IF THAT'S SOMETHING THAT COULD BE BROUGHT UP FOR US TO LOOK AT THAT ORDINANF THE ARCHITECTURAL DESIGN. >> Chair Downs: I THINK IT WOULD BE WORTHWHILE. I'VE MENTIONED TO MS. DAY THAT MAYBE WE OUGHT TO HAVE A CONVERSATION WITH HER AND ERIC AND JUST GATHER A LITTLE MORE INFORMATION THAT THEY COULD BRING TO US JUST AS -- LET'S GET A TIMELINE ON THAT. IT WOULD BE HELPFUL TO UNDERSTAND THAT PROCESS THAT WE CARVED OUT FOR THE HOUSE BILL. A LITTLE EDUCATION WOULDN'T BE BAD FOR US. AT THAT POINT, MAYBE WE DECIDE WE WANT TO MAKE THIS A DIUSSI TOPIC OR REVISION. BUT UNTIL THEN, MAYBE WE JUST NEED A LITTLE MORE EDUCATION. SO. WIWE WON'T PUT THAT ON THE AGENA JUST YET. BUT, ANYTHING ELSE? OKAY. >> I HOPE THE REST OF THE STAFF STAYS HEALTHY. >> Chair Downs: YES, ME, TOO. ALL RIGHT. WE ARE ADJOURNED AT 10:39. ♪