ime, we will open the meeting i prayer. We. have Deacon Wade joining us, giving the prayer. >> We want to say thank you. Thank you for another opportunity to be among the living and not among the dead. As we prepare for this meeting, bless it in a special and mighty way. Bless each and every commissioner right now. Bless the staffs' families from the youngest, oldest, to the weakest, strongest. Intervene in this meeting. Give them wisdom and understanding. We ask you in a mighty way that you bless us right now. We ask that you continue to bless the chairperson now. Strengthen her to build up what has been torn down. Bless her family. Order her steps in your word that she may do what you have her to do. We pray for these commissioners to be in one accord, for unification. Touch and everyone in a special and mighty way. As we go through this prayer, we ask you are among this forum right now. At the sound of my voice, bless their families, their households, and do what you hav requested today. We will be so ever careful an grateful to continually honor and praise you. We pray in your name, Amen, Amen AMen. >> Thank you, Deacon. Commissioner Pardo, would you led us in the pledge of allegiance please? >> [Pledge of allegiance recitation] >> Thank you. At this time, we will have a statement read to the record by our city attorney. Ms. Mendex? We are holding a final budget meeting and related second fina budget hearing for fixing the [unclear] rate, adopting a budget, and approving various [unclear] to address 2006055 as noted in the November 2023 letter from the Florida [sp? rtment of revenue. Detailed information about th process and order of business o rescheduling of meetings can be found in chapter 2, article of the 2 city code at ww. .municode. com. Lobbyists must register with the clerk before appearing. A person may not lobby a member until registering. A copy of chapter 2, article is available in the clerk's office or online at www. municod. .com. Any request concerning real property must make the appropriate [unclear] in writin Anybody requesting other action must disclose any consideration on his behalf to anybody for an agreement to hol or support [unclear] pursuant t section 2-8 of the city code. [unclear] not been provided 7 days before the meeting as part of the agenda materials is entered to the record at the commission's discretion. The agenda and material for each item is available during business hours and online at www. miamicode. com. Any person can be heard befor the panel unless modified by th chair. Public comment will begin at approximately 5:05 PM and remai open until it is close by he chair. Members of the body can submi written comments. Visit www. miamigov. code/meetinginstructions for detailed instructions for publi comments. These comments have been distributed to administration s that they can consider the comment before action. The online comment form will remain open during the meeting until the chair closes public comment. Public comment can be given live at city hall subethnicity y and all city rules. If the proposition is being rescheduled, [unclear] takes action. When addressing the city commission, the member must state their name and address. [unclear] may notify the city clerk. The city has provided different public comment method to indicate a public support, opposition, or neutrality on th agenda today. The public has been given opportunity to provide comment during the meeting and before jmeeting. ng. Commissioners are briefed on items on the agenda today. A verbatim record can be requested at the office of communications or www. miamigov. com. [unclear] of the Florida statutes and administrative code, rule 12d-unc. lear]. This meeting can be viewed live on TV or the city's YouTub channel and Comcast 77. The broadcast will also have closed captions. Thank you. >> Thank you, Madam City attorney. At this time, I ask for reconsideration for 14644, 14477, and 14645. Do I have a motion? Do I have a second? I have a motion and a second. All those in favor, say aye. motion carries anonymously. Thank you. At this time, we leave. ave a statement read into the record by the budget director. >> My name is Marie [unclear], the budget director for the Cit of Miami. Tonight, we are redoing the hearing for the budget. The proposed is [unclear] for Miami, fiscal year 2023. The operating [unclear] is 13. 30% higher than the state defined rollback rate of 6. 6055%. The rollback rate is the revenue received in the prior year. Any questions on that? >> Yes. r the record, millage [unclear] is lower than the millage that we had in the previous fiscal year correct? >> Correct. Isn't it a fact-- answer if you know or not-- that for the most part, just about every fiscal year, the rollback rate is rarely, rarely approved by any city and particularly the city a size of Miami that has the expenses, the challenges that it has. >> Yes, since I have been here I have only been here a couple of years. When you look at the history, the rollback rate has not been adopted by unearth city. >> I can tell you that you can go through the Florida and ever major city up and down, and it would be extremely rare to find any city that [unclear] with th rollback rate. That's for a simple reason. - particularly, in years like this, inflation, the costs have gone higher than any other year that I can remember except mayb back in the early years when I was a very young commissioner when inflation was between 18-22%. Every developer in Miami went bankrupt except for one I can think of. The inflation we are facing today is the highest sincere ck then, the early 2000s. Employees keep making the sam salary that they were making before because they will take a job somewhere else. My god, you see in McDonald's and other fast food places-- they are paying young kids up t 15-18 dollars an hour. That's the world we have to compete with. It is a fact that food costs have gone through the roof. It is a fact that our gasolin costs have gone sky high. It is most a fact that ranked mortgages have gone through the sky. Last fiscal year, when we approved the budget, you can d still get mortgages at 3-4%. I'm sure Mr. Pardo can confirm that. Today, what can you get mortgages for, Mr. Pardo? For the typically Joe Plumber who wants a mortgage for his home. >> It depends on the length of time and other considerations, it could be 6-7% or more. >> You made the point I wanted to make. From 3-4%, the fiscal year we approved the last budget-- this is the cost of money. It is impossible for this cit or any city-- please show me an city in Florida this fiscal yea that has gone back to the rollback rate. It is impossible to do that. With the high inflation and the high cost of everything, yo can't do it. This city? [unclear] the millage right b a little bit. We tell them that every year. Every year, we cut back the millage rate somewhat. I hope that this commission and future commissions keep doing that. But to go back fully to a rollback rate [unclear]. >> We are going to keep the order that I have. I will see if my colleague-- would you like to--? >> One of my issues for this budget-- >> Before we all have discussion, do you want to take public comment first/ we Ould. ou like to make your statement first? Up to you. >> Public comment. >> I would agree. >> At this time, I will open the floor for public comment fo the , 2, and 3. If anybody wants to speak on behalf of the items before us today, please come forward. >> [unclear], chairman of the Miami River commission. There's an allocation for about 250,000 dollars in the proposed budget. That was preparsed by the or commissioner for district 1. We would like the money to go back to the city. We are not going to use it. It is irresponsible for us to keep that allocation. We have no intention of running a boat parade between now and September 30th of next year. If it happens, it would be in the following fiscal year. For us to be hording that money is incorrect. Perhaps, you can reallocate that money for somewhere else. Thank you. >> If I may-- >> We did that already. We did that already. We put it back into the general fund. >> Yes, we did that already last commission meeting. >> Billy Corbin. Happy Hannukkah. Congratulations to the new commissioners. The mayor has been going around the world saying Miami residents are paying less in taxes. That's a lie. The opposite is true. We are paying more in taxes because the millage rate and budget rate is too. Every resident is paying a corruption tax. By my account, without any exaggeration, the [unclear] are well into the 100s of millions of dollars. You are paying for the city t victimize you and then defend those crimes through attornies fees for civil litigations against commissioners for shaking down lobbyists and exploiting public position for businesses exploiting elderly residents. You have, in this budget, millions of dollars to statelet at litigation for things like molesting a teenage boy in this facility. Thankfully, because this mayo and certain members of this commission have exposed the cit to bankruptcy, they have turned city hall into a crime scene. We have the new commissioners who have campaigned on transparency and putting a stop to this. Good luck to you. Cut the corruption tax. >> Thank you. >> Madam [unclear]-- >> No, we don't clap. We do this. >> I have [unclear] by this individual. I deserve a right to answer. >> No-- >> I deserve a right to mention-- >> I am not here to be a cowar >> I understand but-- [cross talking] >> He has a right for public comment. This is time we. e have a job to do. >> He doesn't even live in our city. He is paid by the corrupt to do this stuff. If he is going to get up here and call us from this city who have worked for the city corrupt, then he better put up and show where the money is. Him and his buddies-- I am going to take them one at a tim. >> It does not serve anyone to get into a match. Is there anyone else who want to speak on behalf of the items before us? Good afternoon. Congratulations to the new commissioners. I want to say something very simple about the budget. There's a lot of different things in the budget that I hope you can review. There are many things done throughout the years. [unclear] item as in the budget. I can review and see that the iis One of the things I just want to say is you guys are new faces for us. I hope, and I wish for you guys to be the best. That's what we all hope from you guys, to be honest and try to just do the business of the city. I want to say something from the bottom of my heart. Do not get caught up in the different reasons than just wha you are supposed to be doing. Your district should be your priority. Other people's problems might [unclear. ] I hope the two of you pay attention to just your district problems. My father lives in your district, my sister lives in th district. I want that too, just to be fair to everybody and hope to have another friend who is goin to reflect what the city needs. The budget, I hope that we ar getting all the things we need. I am going to say this very fast. When I see $250,000 for food hope you tell the seniors the money comes from our taxes. >> Thank you. >> Good afternoon. >> Cecilia [unclear. ] I'm here just to [Audio cutting out. thank you for being here to represent us. I do live in district 2 in th City of Miami and Billy Corbin speaks for me. Everything he said I agree with. Thank you. >> Thank you. Is there anyone else who woul like to speak? >> Good afternoon. >> Good evening, my name is Fernando Mondi. I am here to congratulate commissioners Gabela and Pardo who are elected on a mandate no of silent rubber stamp complicity. Rather, in a residence first posture. No matter what the political pressure or cost to themselves, because you are here to do a public service, not personal enrichment. I thank and congratulate both of you. There are many watching throughout the city asking you to take a new approach. The reason we are in this predicament is not either of your fault. There are unfortunate circumstances and the state had to intervene to say the city di it wrong. This is my tax notice. I already paid to get the discount. My taxes went up this year. The millage went down but my taxes went up. The city has $100 million in additional revenue [unclear] that is usually a good thing, w ld be a good thing to get back. I think we can be more efficient in the budget. As Mr. Corbin says, there are certain items the residents should and do not want to be paid for. Remember, we elected in your case Mr. Pardo and Mr. Gabela on a platform of standing up for residents, zero tolerance for corruption and unethical behavior. We will hold you to that standard and expect you will ru by that standard. Thank you. Good luck with your decision tonight. >> Thank you. Good afternoon. >> Thank you madam chair. [Unclear. ] Congratulations and thank yo for sacrificing your time to ru and serve. It is disturbing that we are even here at this meeting. It is disturbing that the cit ignored state law requiring thi meeting. Regarding the budget, the Cit of Miami has a long history of not maintaining its facilities and then demolishing them, then rebuilding them. That is financially irresponsible. The city administration has referred to that as deferred maintenance. It's really financial negligence. I hope that this new commission will take on that extremely difficult task of changing the group think, the culture of the crystallized in neglecting maintenance of facilities and wasting millions of dollars. Please, maintain our facilities. Don't demolish them and then spend millions more to rebelled hem. Thank you. >> Good evening esteemed commissioners. Congratulations commissioner Pardo and Gabela on your election. I wanted to take this opportunity to relive something that I had to deal with in 2008 when I got hired as a firefighter. I'm sorry if I misspoke [unclear] for the Miami association of firefighters. As a firefighter in 2008 when I first got hired, the last thing I thought I was going to end up dealing with was provide with pink slips and told, "You might not last too long because we're about to go through a tru fiscal crisis. " I have given up a lot since then. We gave it our all, we continued to do our job respectfully and passionately a we always have done. It's taken over 10 years to recover and then that time we had a true fiscal crisis. Since then, the last time we received a raise was 2017. We've been negotiating for over a year and a half to improve the health insurance, working conditions, etc. of our firefighters and paramedics. If we did anything more than reconsider the fact that this budget has already been laid out, approved, it would be a major setback to do anything more than just continue to approve it as we had done before, the correct way with al the city department budgets budgeted, planned for, and two months into this budget. I ask you today, avoid a fiscal crisis. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. Good afternoon. >> Good afternoon. Welcome to our new commissioners. I'm here as a resident [unclear. ] I'm also here as a de facto ombudsman for [unclear. ] Many middle class residents, and small business owners. We don't trust the administration anymore. We definitely don't trust the to handle our taxes. They can't even handle things like picking up garbage, police enforcement of laws. I'm here asking you to not increase the millage. We started with two commissioners but there's a lot more change that needs to be done so we can trust our government. People have been taking advantage of special privileges like the city attorney. I think all those people need to be called before us and put in question before we approve another dime to the City of Miami's budget. >> Thank you. Good afternoon. Congratulations, commissioner Gabela and Pardo. I ask that you consider the budget that was already approve and ratified before. In about two days, there's going to be a union contract that will come before you. If you roll back some things that were allocated - I understand your concern because you just got an office - changing thing will affect the contract. We bargain with good faith. You have to balance the varying and competing interests. We ask for your support because in two days our members have ratified and approved it. The manager approved it two weeks ago. I will come before you to ask for your affirmative vote. We ask you to keep that in mind. Thank you. >> Thank you. od afternoon. >> Good afternoon. Thank you chairwoman. Commissioners, congratulation. I'm here to talk about the budget. Not reconsidering the budget will hurt us. We are in the middle of negotiations. Not only recruiting but retaining officers. They are leaving for better benefits and wages. We discussed with the manager to increase our salaries so we can recruit and retain. We do need more officers. Doing anything to the budget will hurt us. I think we should [unclear] talk about certain things withi the budget. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Good afternoon. >> Good afternoon. >> David Linker. I live at 2222 Southwest 17th Street. That residents were able to have a free and fair election [Audio cutting out] these two new commissioners [Audio cuttin out. ] This commissioners Miguel Gabela was forced to sue the city to undo the efforts by the city to prevent him from runnin. It is important to know that the city continues scorched earth efforts in that litigatio to disqualify him from office. Those who voted for him need to know that fight continues an your taxpayer money continues t fund it. The residents have spoken. The new commission has a mandate. Residents demand more transparent and cleaner government. Part of that is stopping the funding of legal and other fees of taxpayer dollars to defend wrongdoing and corruption. Together, we can leave behind the ugliness, the weaponization of city resources against residents and begin writing a new chapter to improve things for residents and everyone in the City of Miami. Let's continue to do the hard work. Thank you everyone on the commission. >> Thank you. od afternoon. >> Good afternoon madam chair. Mel Meinhart, 3075 Virginia Street Miami Florida. Over the last two years you and the commissioners - I thank each commissioner for your service. Your group as the faces chang has delete with a conflict confidence. We see it in areas from redistricting, to lawsuits, and budget hearings. The challenge here is to recognize that are almost certainly is a systemic issue. Corporations and large organizations have dealt with issues of systemic responsibility by changing the way they do business. That moment is here before th City of Miami before the situation is irretrievable. Miami has been in such situations before. Therefore, I ask we bring in the best practices of accountability responsibility invisibility into the practices we have. All the elements, whether they're legal or in budget controls, could be addressed if we get the right kind of talent. My personal worry is that we don't have the talent. When I read the budget, see the number of vacancies, hear arbitration. oblems etc. I see structural problems in leadership. If you are responsible, who do you hold accountable for the actions that are here? Let's make it clear, consistent, and done right by the citizens here. Thank you. >> Thank you Is there anyone else who would like to speak? I see none. The public comment period is now closed. At this time, I will hear fro commissioner Gabela. >> Thank you madam chair. One of the things I want to talk about today is I've been doing a little research and homework here regarding the budget. Larry, I had a question for you. First, how much of the revenues that we collected were from new construction? >> That number is approximately $17 billion. >> Million or billion? >> Billion. That's value. >> I want to know the revenue. The gross revenues we collected this year. >> From the -- >> Exactly. >> While Larry's looking it u can I say something else? Got it? I'm waiting for the answer. If you needed to get it, I wa going to move onto something else while you were getting it. While Larry gets that answer, I did a little homework. It seems to me that it is tru that the homestead - those who have homestead exemption, the three percent cap.. n the value of the property has not gone up. That is true as of this year. However, we have a big proble. Part of the revenues we are collecting this year as opposed to last year on [unclear] properties, for example a duplex, has gone up 20% from last year. I use my example of 1780 Northwest 21st Terrace. This year, we paid $1,215. That's a 20% increase from th previous year that I paid. I paid $1250 extra this year. I'm part of the 20% of property owners that I'm rentin the property out as income for my wife and I. The problem I see here is thi forces the landlords to incisur the rent. These costs will be passed at some point to the tenant, to th residents of the City of Miami. This is one of the main problems I have. I hear all of you who work fo the City of Miami. I hear the negotiations going on. At the end of the day, I'm here to represent my constituents and the people who elected me to serve here. Number one, I am against raising taxes for not a good reason at all. We have a lot of problems wit ligation in the City of Miami. I have learned from the city attorney that Mr. Carollo's defense has cost the city $8 million so far. The lawsuits they have placed against my person, Male Speaker endez, number one, for taking m house out of the district. We won that and the appeal on that lawsuit. I am still, right now there i pending litigation against my person in the courts trying to overturn the appeal. I have spoken to material remains >> I understand the outsourcin of litigation in the last appeal, case 3 against my person-- which cost an excess o [unclear] dollars. Is that correct? >> The outsourcing just happened, so I don't think that case cost 50,000. >> You said to me, and I quote 50,000 is what I spent. >> I said to outsource it in the future it could be 50,000. nclear] that I don't know about >> Because you are my client, can't pursue the case. It has to be outsourced. >> The point I am trying to make here is that we do this budget deal. We say to the residents, oh, we are lowering your taxes, and I understood what Mr. [unclear] was saying, I do. Here is the problem we are going to have. This 20% that we're passing o to the property owners that hav [unclear]. That's a lot of people passin that on to their tenants. I cannot accept or vote for this. I will be candid, and then I will yield to somebody else. The other thing, the litigation going on in Miami, this has to stop. It's eating away at all corners. It's not producing anything positive for our districts, for our residents. That's why, respectfully, I have asked for your resignation. There's a hurricane, and you seem to be caught right in the middle. My question to you-- we talke about this. I was candid with you the other day. I wanted your resignation. My question to you, madam attorney, at the end of the shenanigans, how much have we spent on legal bills this year? Last fiscal year from September/October of 2021 and ending in 2022, how much have w spent on litigation total? >> I would have to check my records. >> While you check, I will yield. >> I have the answer. That number-- the tax revenue associated with the new construction, the new construction assessed value is . 6 billion, and it is generating approximately 12 million as an estimate. of property tax revenue. >> Out of that 12 million-- I don't consider that a tax hike. Why? That's new construction. You have to pay. You have a property; you have to pay. I don't view that as-- I can negotiate on that. I don't know if we can negotiate this or not. I am willing to negotiate tha. What I am concerned of again is the residents-- the average Joe trying to make a living for his family, that's who I am concerned about. >> Commissioner Pardo? I really wanted to take a second and read the first sentence of the citizen's bill of rights which starts juice arter. This government is created to protect the governed, not the governing. To promote efficient management and to ensure fair and equitable treatment. The Miami dysfunction is our inability to [unclear]. The answer cannot be a lawsui. When judgment calls don't go our way, there are consequences. That's true everywhere in the world and in government. In this case, we briefly talked about the millage and th rollback millage. Well, millage is also a function of real estate values. It may be true we have not gone back to the roll back rate but we have never experienced such high real estate values. These are important factors t consider when looking at the consequences of where we sit today. We are sitting here today because of this dysfunction. This is not how a normal situation will roll out. From having been in similar situations myself, whenever I have been. in this situation with 5 business days to review information that I don't know all the intricacies in these numbers, it never works out for residents to vote accordingly o something I was not apart of or not made aware of. >> Commissioner Reyes? >> I have heard [unclear] and the people. I think there's a tendency to generalize, that everyone that is here is corrupt. I challenge anybody to find [unclear]. I remember back in 2019 when was elected, reelected, I met a challenge through my fellow commission. That challenge simply was jus leave your personal vendettas and personal agendas aside. I've only one agenda which is the benefit of the people that you are representing, the benefit of the people that elected you and the rest of the city of Miami. That's a challenge. I welcome you guys, I really do welcome you guys, but I really hope that the challenge made you take it to heart. and that we can work together for the city of Miami and three sidents. There are people who live in my district who can attest to that. Now, I have heard all of the arguments about this budget tha we passed, and Larry, can you please come here? I have a couple of questions. How many times have you heard me to talk about being more efficient and doing a program s that every department be more efficient so that we use best pretences? I agree with the gentlemen that stood there and said we have to be more efficient. I remember that you used to d that years ago when inawe as king for this [unclear]. I came and talked to you abou implementing efficiency program. To that effect, I even became a black belt in Sig Sigma to bring efficiency. In order to do that, we need the support and the backing of the administration. You see? So, by saying we don't get it I also want to talk to you. I ask you that we reduce the millage. Remember? >> Yes. >> I even said that we should reduce the millage and we shoul -- the savings that we are goin to get for-- we reduce the millage or we get some of the additional funds that we are receiving and make contribution to our residents and tax payers. [unclear] the other way, and Anna, you asked me if we could wait until-- I know that. Everybody who has worked in budget, we know that we have to wait in order for us to know what really is going on. A budget is more or less a forecast. You are guessing. You. are forecasting. When you forecast your cost, you have. to take into consideration the rate of inflation that we are now suffering. You see? We have a rate of inflation because everything costs more. I ask you, how can we do that You said, you promised me, you said that we are-- everybody knows that midyear you do a review of performance of your revenues and your costs. And you are most of the time, most of the time, and in the history of the city of Miami, w have been outperforming the mean, the revenues have been greater than costs, and we coul [unclear] at the end of the yea and have substantial savings. You told me, you told me what we are going to do is-- once we get that number, which-- how much was it last year? >> We have conservatively forecast that-- we started out with a forecast of 30 million dollars. We think we outperformed by revenues and expenditures combined. We are in the year-end closin process, so we are doing our accrual. We try to be very conservativ as we end the year. We still have our hurricane set aside of 5 million dollars even though we are out of seaso Roughly, 30 millions. > Are you included the revenue we receive from the county? >> Yes. >> Okay. What I am proposing-- I know, everybody-- I pay taxes too if you don't know. I pay taxes too. What happened is that we are victims, we are victims of [unclear]. The city of Miami has become so popular and so many people are moving here and so many people are demanding houses and apartments that the cost has increased tremendously. Everybody that knows about ho to budget the millage and how i works and your taxes work, you know it's a function of the cos times the millage. You see? The market values times the millage. We have that problem. There's something-- there's n way we can correct that. You see? I know, and I agree with Commissioner [unclear] that the ones who are suffering the most are the non homesteading properties. They have [unclear] or who ver developed that-- they have the safer homes. [unclear] increased by more than 3%. Am I right? >> I think you are. >> We have been benefiting because our property value has increased. As our property values have increased, we are richer, you see? People are selling homes here and moving some place else because of the property value increase. I believe that the first thin we have to do-- see, we have a budget here. If we-- let's say that we tak away from that 100 million dollars extra that everybody is talking about-- let's say that we take 50 million dollars and do what I am asking you to do, maybe once we readjust thumb dget-- I think now I will have support in demanding, you see? In demanding a program for efficiency, you see? Maybe we can hire somebody from the outside and go apartment by apartment. You analyze the [unclear] and whatever excess you have, you get rid of it. At midyear, you see, I think that it would be best to have those funds directed back to the taxpayers' households. You see? Which are the ones that are suffering the most because they are-- in my district, I have the majority in that direct tha are barely making it. They are barely making it, an they are the ones that need it the most. I think that we, it is our responsibility to serve those that need it the most. I mean, we should be very aggressive in trying to serve those people. I believe that we should wait until -- this is the idea I am throwing out. We wait until midyear, and an - if we outperform our budgets as we have done in the past year, we use those funds. Instead of bringing it back i spending more-- because, if th government-- they have 3 dollars, and they want to spend 4. You know that. I have been in government for a long time, you see. We are the worst administrators. You see? We take those funds, and we send it back like a Christmas present to our residents and ou tax payers, you see. I want you to also-- I ask you, if we start messing up wit this budget which I wasn't too happy with that we have adopted-- let's say we 50 million dollars. What would be the consequence? Every action has a consequences. > I will let the manager address that, okay? >> Certainly, commissioner, an reduction in the current budget of the current year would more than likely impact city service and bond ratings. We issued debt, so it's more residual impact on that as well. One of the things that I thin is kind of important to point out, and you mentioned the efficiency analysis, we onboarded somebody to take on that role. >> Hallelujah. >> Exactly. Part of the sort of, I think, set of realities that come into play in addressing a budget either post-approval or midyear is that-- the reason why we do midyear adjustment is because w had an opportunity to take a snapshot of the first 6 months and have a reasonable forecast of the expenses. In speaking to revenue in particular, one of the things that gets lost in the understanding of evaluation of revenue-- yeah, we did roll bac the millage. It didn't have a dollar-per-dollar increase for tax payer because properties ar apprised significantly higher year to year. That's a process we have no control over unfortunately; we don't. There are properties who are homesteaded, nonhomesteaded, or commercial properties, they are all impacted by that increase. Those increases are a functio of market and almost a direct reflection of what we deal with on the expense side as well. As values go up, every expens in the city increases as well. Where. playing this consistent game o catch up. There was an excellent point. I want to highlight that. Over the years, the city has had a history of deferred maintenance. It's an issue we're trying to resolve. We spent the first two years was in this position working ou way through COVID. We came out of it and our priority was [unclear. ] We've done a ton of restructuring since. We're trying to align ourselves with being more efficient operationally. Also, we spent a year plus, probably, negotiating an agreement with our fire union. We're almost a year in with police as well. As much as we sometimes want to ignore it, we are competing in a labor market where we are undervalued in terms of payroll. That's a situation we're trying to address. Other municipalities have mor resources . er capita. The County poaches a lot of our people because they pay mor. Those are cold, hard numbers. We have a lot of competing interests matching expense to revenue. When it was originally proposed by Commissioner Reyes, he wasn't the only one to propose looking at a significan reduction in millage. I'm responsible for the entir budget but we had this on the other side as well. We reached a happy medium and compromise and that is the budget in front of you now. I will speak to the issue of process. I'm going to speak to that because it's long overdue. I've done it a couple times o social media and it's due an opportunity to discuss it now. I'm a big fan of history. If we go back to the discussions between the first and second reading of the budget, we had open discussion especially in the second meetin about what the repercussions ar to voting on the budget as is. commission that none of us expected. The department of revenue can agree with the position or not. I felt their interpretation o whether we had a unanimous vote with four remaining members was flawed. The city did their due diligence. That opinion is flawed on a lot of levels. I can give a perfect example of that. Up until the second meeting w had a fully constituted commission. Say one of you ended up in th hospital so we only had four seated members at no fault of anyone present. Under what scenario does it make sense that the four remaining members don't constitute a unanimous vote? I was fully prepared that if the department of revenue continued to find the process flawed, we should pursue a remedy to that. Let's address the issue of when we received notice. Very late in the process, right before the second reading. We voted on September 26th to approve a budget. Two months transpired before they issued a letter saying we were non-compliant. That's an interesting timelin. We had multiple communication with them. They waited two whole months to issue us a letter saying we were non-compliant. That should have come the wee after. We had a resolution in front of us and felt this meeting was the easier path. I'll be quite frank. If the commission doesn't fee they are ready to vote on this, I think we're prepared to address it and challenge it. I think. that interpretation of the statue is flawed. I will put it on the record again. The timing of the entire process has been unfair to the city and [Audio cutting out. ] I think we should challenge it anyway. For future consideration, if we're ever in a scenario with four sitting members of the bod and we need a unanimous vote on something, we need clarity on how that rule is interpreted. >> Thank you. My turn. On what Art said, it was lega impossibility for us to pass th budget with what the state is requiring. We did what we could with wha we had. We are here today to get our budget passed. I need Victoria to read into the record SP.. . We need to take it up first so I will have her get the procedural title into the recor before I continue. >> Thank you. An ordinance of the Miami cit commission related to taxation defining and designating territorial limits for the City of Miami levying a tax on all [unclear] in the city at a tota tentative rate of [unclear] on the dollar. For the purposes of the general operating budget and debt service for the fiscal yea beginning October 1, 2023 and ending September 30, 2024 containing a severability claus and providing for an effect dat. >> Thank you. [Unclear. ] >> Currently, our . &P rating is a . A. >> What is the highest rating? >> AAA. >> Do you know any municipalities in Miami Dade County with a . AA rating? >> No, it's like having a perfect credit score. >> What are the city's reserves? >> As of the 9/30/22 financia statements we were at $188 million. >> What are the ramifications if we cannot come to a consensu and have a unanimous vote on ou millage? >> Right now, if there's no unanimous vote there are a few other tiers we can consider. Two-thirds, which is a four-fifths vote, that millage level is at 7. 4724, which would be a reductio in revenue of $856,000. A simple majority vote, the floor on that is a millage rate of 6. 7931, so [unclear] simple majority. That would be a reduction in revenue from $49,666,000. And then, there's the rollbac rate which is statutorily the same rate [unclear] the same cash revenue you would receive in the previous fiscal year. That rollback revenue is 6. 0555, which would be a difference in $63,145,000 from what we assessed. One of the things they want m to put on the record generally, the numbers I'm giving are gros. There's also the trickle-down impact. I want you to understand there's a further financial impact. >> Commissioners, before us now is SP. 2, the millage rate. We have heard the ramifications, staff have put i before us. I understand your concerns. Everyone has had an opportunity to speak. There is no reason for us to continue. Are you ready to vote? >> I have a question. >> Go ahead, Vice Chair. 15 seconds. >> Thank you. I'm glad the manager brought this to the reason we were here today finally. A lot of what you heard has nothing to do with this. The only thing I want to clarify is the $8 million figur my new colleague mentioned is not so. I agree very much so on the increases like you mentioned, o your rental property. I'm going to tell you how bad it is. It's even worse than you thin. [Unclear] many other properties with 25%, 30%, some even higher. What I don't hear here today from but forty plus people that are here today [unclear. ] About a good third to half are faces that I recognize or activists that have their own biases either way. What I don't hear is the same arguments for Miami Dade County the school board, the chlorine' trust. A big chunk of the taxes we pay in the city go to Miami Dad County. What services do they give us for that money? I submit to my in expert gues. Look at police, look at fire. What services does the County give us for all the money they charge the residents? We're paying all this money w don't get, even to the school board. Children's trust, where's all that money going to? The vast majority of money we pay in taxes in the City of Miami are going to other governments. This is where the problem lie here. I want to be clear in what I spoke before. I spoke about [unclear] millage rate. There's a big difference from the increases that the tax property appraiser gives. The 20% that Mr. Gabela was talking about, and more that I maintained. This is where the problem lies. Why have our property values for the sake of being taxed gotten so high? Commissioner Reyes [unclear] one of those areas. We've become so popular in th City of Miami that so many people want to move here. I guess we're not as bad as some would make it sound. Everybody wants to move to Miami. The other problem, why are property values going even higher? We have a lot of rich and famous, and I'll use that word that some like to use - [Audio cutting out] are bringing millions upon millions of dollars to other countries. Their money would corrupt governments and corrupt ways. They're buying TENS . f millions of dollars in our community, paying up to 50% mor than those properties are worth. Why? Because the inflation rate in their country is so high that even by paying 50% more here they're even in a. year and a half or so. That's another reason our property taxes are going up. Once you get a couple of thes guys that buy properties in you neighborhoods at such outrages prices, when the property appraiser uses that to calculat what properties have been up to. We're all getting hit with. it. >> Commissioner Gabela? >> Sorry, a procedural thing for the record. I need to put in the record that we will add to the record the notice we received from the department of revenue regarding non-compliance, as well as the previously approved ordinance. >> Thank you. Commissioner Gabela. >> I was thinking, while he's speaking, two things. Number one, it might be well that the school board - and I don't doubt it. At the end of the day, if we pass this, the 20% I'm talking about, the tenants will get hit regardless of whoever is responsible and at fault. The other question I have for you guys, we got into this and understand that vote number two if it's a four-fifth, Larry - I believe we spoke about this las week - the shortfall was $865,000. Peanuts compared to our budge. How come this wasn't [unclear >> In context of the moment, we had - the administration had met with the sitting commissioners and gone back and forth. The millage rate consensus process takes months. We went back and forth. The mayor also participates i that process. The mayor requested we reduce the millage rate to a particula number. >> On that note, maybe the mayor might think about scaling back his detail of having six people taking care of him day and night. I've been asked if I want a sergeant at arms. I turned it down because I believe I can drive my own car, and pay for my own fuel. The resources [unclear. ] I understand on certain events, you want to use it for safety or parking issues. But, we should start by telling the mayor to scale down what he's doing with the detail. Those officers can be better served taking care of our neighborhoods. I have a big problem with crime. I was talking to a police officer and he's down at least seven men. This is going on in the City of Miami. Another waste of money in my opinion. Rather than going out and asking these poor people, the 20% of tenants, to pay more in rent, why don't we start lookin at ourselves and what's going o in this body? I include myself and will hol myself accountable. Maybe we should start cost cutting somewhere in this budge If you think about it, we're talking about $11 million divided among the districts. That's a drop in the bucket, really, for our budget on a $2. 6 or $2. 8 billion budget. The small guy who you increas his rent as a landlord, asking him to pay you another $300 or $400 at the end of the month, that's a big thing to ask that guy. I've been in the business world all my life. I'm tired of hearing you need this, this is needed, the gentleman back there, Mr. Rosario asking for the FOP.. Of course, he was head of the union, or is, of the FOP.. Why don't you guys look inward and see where you can do some cost cutting. I would be fooled, speaking for myself, saying there's a problem, and all that. Let's look at our budgets and see what we can curtail. I'm not going to be voting fo this. The accounting is beautiful. I do >> That guy only understands one thing-- that he paid a lot more taxes this year than last year. In good conscious, I cannot vote for Speaker: 2. >> Commissioner Pardo? >> I had a couple of quick questions. The increase in revenue year over year was about 100 million. Right? >> Yes. >> If we don't have 2 votes, which it looks like we are not going to, we are talking about 49 million. >> Correct. >> Less than 5%? Of Of the--? >> Budget. >> Operating budget. >> These kinds of fluctuations in budgets and operations are not extraordinary. If you were to provide maybe list of all vacant positions, salaries plus fringe-- if it's an aged list or it's a list of one-time projects that can be deferred for one year or a list of fleet purchases-- there are ot of expenses to defer, right? >> I will give you a technical answer. I heard people talked about deferred maintenance. We did a thorough analysis from last year to this year. We are looking down the barre of a 75 million dollar deferred capital reinvestment. We did a lot of analysis. There was a memo from the manager's office. That one group of expenditure was 70 million dollars. The commission thought better to reduce the millage, do some of that but not all of it, irgh. When you say "can we move stuff around," obviously we can. It does take some time. We are not going to do [unclear] cuts. We will do strategic analysis to figure out where we could. But everybody would be affected. When you look at percentages, yeah, we can say it's small, bu for instance, in the budget, we thought it fit to give each commissioner's district 2 million dollars for capital because you have your own net and district orptns. ons. You can decide what you want. That was 10 million dollars. You know, obviously, I have been an administrator here for long gimme. I advocate for what I would sa is a strategic and fiscally smart budget appropriation. We work with all budget commissioners to get to that point. >> By the way, I want to say one thing. You have been very courteous. I want to point that out. >> Basically, you are saying w do have options. We are not looking at blowing up contracts or losing our bond rating. >> When this issue came up, I had to do a disclosure to the bond rating agency and our underwriters counsel because we closed a bond deal. We oversubscribed by 5 times and got 1. 5 billion in orders which means we did a good job of keeping th interest rate for the citizens, right? When this happens, questions are going to come. What happened to the Avalon revenue? Where are we now? This is an abrupt cut at the end of the day. I don't know how the market will react to that cut. We are intending, because of the GOB that the citizens passe for affordable housing and infrastructure-- we are going. back to the market at the beginning of the year. This will absolutely affect the rating relative to that because it's a general obligation. >> You did say we had 188 million in reserves. >> Which is a financial integrity ordinance, a law passed by this city for mammy ears as a result of fiscal irresponsibility in the '90s. Once again, good policy. For the record, this is something we have talking-- myself, the manager, and the finance team, along with the finance committee you submit board members have been looking at better/best practice on reservice policies. at could be a means of sharpening our millage tool. That's something that, once again, as your CFO, I wouldn't say, hey, let's do this tomorro. I need to assess how the rating market will treat that change because-- it is a [unclear] for financial staff. We have one of the best reserve policies in the country and it is recognized as such. Dealing with it or not following it, if you will, may have ramifications. I'm not telling you not to make decisions. >> As best practice nothing al, it would be better to take the votes and have 856,000. >> Again, facts matter. Timing matters. We have-- >> Understood. >> Yeah. >> [unclear] agenda? >> One second. >> My colleagues stated that they are not interested in passing the millage as it is. What do you want the millage rate to be if you are not interested in passing what is before us now? What is your recommendation? >> I will go first here. Mine would be the equivalent of the nonhomestead properties. I want. exclude homestead properties an new construction. They have to pay anyway. What I do consider out of whack is the 20% rate hike on the nonhomestead properties. where I fear the 20% is going t be passed on to the Tennants. On that, how many properties-- what is the amount? What percentage of the 50 mil in percentage terms or dollar amount, what is that equal that? >> I don't have that detail. I would have to do quite a bi of analysis. I know you and I did a very specific example, and we did do one analysis where we looked at the average which is not-- so, your house might be more becaus it's a greater value and nonhomesteaded. An important group is seniors. There's a senior exemption ou there. There are veterans. They have these exemptions. There are senior veterans out here that don't pay property ta because they have full exemptio. I would have to look at that. I don't have that detail readily available for us hem translate that to millage numbers, if you will. I would have to do it like a gross number. >> Thank you. >> What the floor vote optione at 856,000 ever preferred? >> Not during our previous-- >> There was no motion on that. >> We were unified on the millage before us. >> I would be comfortable with the [unclear] that a second vot would create. >> A second tier. >> The one for-- no, no. >> I am looking at the [unclear] reduction. >> That's a simple majority. >> That requires 3. Commissioner Reyes? >> Yes, I do understand. I understand your concern. I have the same concern, but if we do a drastic reduction now, it is going to create havo within the city of me Inamori. ill tell you nomw. Our employees, in this new budget, they already received [unclear] increase. I want to ask Larry-- do we have to roll back that increase? Do we have to lower the increase? >> You could not lower that increase because it is in the, it's part of the union contract already. >> Okay. That's part of the union contract. Okay. Yes. >> Okay. Where else can we get those 4 million dollars? We are talking the same language, but what I am trying to do is postpone it to the midyear, and at the midyear, we can come back and apply all thi avings and-- probably we are going to outperform and then at that time, without creating havoc we would create now, we commit whatever, whatever outperforming amount is to lowering. That's what I'm trying to say. >> A rebate. >> Not a rebate. We cannot say that. It is a present from the city. Before we voted, the four of us, that was an ask that I had. You see? It was a condition for my voting. We want to lower the millage. We are talking the same language. We want to lower the millage. >> Can we ask Commissioner Pardo if he can tell us where h would like to make the cuts. I am sure you have some idea where to make these cuts from? >> I wasn't part of this process-- >> Before we go there, I appreciate that you were not part of this process, nor were you, there is a midyear budget where we can adjust. I would ask that you consider passing the millage so that we don't fall into a deficit or a negative, because we will have another bite at the apple. You will have more time to review the budget. It's very drastic to ask the residents of the city of Miami who will shoulder this burden because it will affect programs and services that the city will provide. I am asking. I understand each of your concerns. I understand your concerns. I am asking that you would consider either the first tier or the second tier where the impact is 856,000 versus 49 million dollars. You will get another opportunity at the midyear. Am I correct? >> Before you answer-- if I may, before I answer, if we at midyear, if we give credit of our 40 million dollars or something, it be close to 7 million. 7 mil. >> Yeah, it would be. Yeah. It would actually be slightly under 7 mental. >> It would be 6 something. We bring it down through that unc. lear]. We don't create the-- I mean, right now, they have to sit down and say, okay, we are going to cut this. As a matter of fact, I don't want to lose 2 million dollars. I need the 2 million dollars to repave roads as I have been doing, drainage products. You need that more than anybody else because your district was totally abandoned. You need it more than even me beach superintendent have been alone in doing that. >> As a business person that I am, I can assure that I will find, in my budget-- if you say we are going to cut the 50 million, I can assure you the 1 mil. I can assure you that I will find a way to cut it here and there and get it done. That's how you do it in business. You don't ask for more money. Like you said, no disrespect, government always has a knack to-- >> Yes, yes. >> We're a disaster. >> The government is hungry fo money. >> I understand your point. >> I don't want to lose a single penny. If we lose 800,000-- how much for a police officer do we need? >> Wait, wait, wait. [cross talking] >> Hold on. Hold on. >> I don't want to-- >> Commissioner Reyes, I don't believe any member of this commissioner wants to lose any more. . I don't believe that is any of our intentions to lose any more. What I am asking is that we pass this budget so we don't lose any money, and then we start to make the process, address your concerns, address your concerns, because right now, we have to comply. If we're not in compliance, i affects our revenue. I am asking that we pass the budget as it is. Now, it seems as if I have 4 who agree with me. I am asking you, sir, if you can-- we can address it a month two months, three months from that. That doesn't make that much o a difference. If we have to go to a second tier, I feel like, from what my colleagues have said, we have the vote. I would like for you to vote with us if there is a way that you can see fit to do that. If not, we will move on. We don't need to continue to drag this out if this is where you are. >> One of my guys just offered to me-- why not lower the millage to 7. 0668, a reduction of 30 million dollars. Is that agreeable? Does anybody want to do that? >> As I said before, I am shooting for reducing about 50 million dollars, but the way that we can do that without creating all this commotion tha we're going to create now is by-- we have the power to revie the budget whenever we want. >> You can pass it. I will be voting now. >> Hold on a second. Our CFO wants to say somethin. >> If you are considering a lesser operating millage, I nee to make sure that, when we pass it, in includes-- >> entiendo. Entiendo. I understand. I want us-- the first busines with all of us here, I want us to be united. I want us to present a united front to the residents of Miami. I have a 4/5. If we cut, we cut because we cut being fiscally responsible ourselves, not because we lose the money to the state is what am trying to impress upon you. But I respect what you are saying. >> I don't come here for chaos. or any stuff that has been said. I come here to do the busines of the resident. . As of such, I respect what you are saying. I want to come along, but I can't do. it. I'm sorry. It's also been called to my attention now that there's no such thing that's able to do done to change the millage in the middle of the year. Can somebody elaborate on tha. >> I think there's confusion here. Commissioner Reyes is not proposing a reduction in the millage. At the midyear budget, we loo at the numbers. At that point, if you feel there's a ability through a surplus or a reduction in the expense, whatever that delta is we propose a rebate to there residents. We discussed that last year. >> Therefore, we don't forfeit 56 million dollars. >> The other issue-- if you reduce the millage today, the residents aren't going to get a check this week. They will get a reduction credit for next year. >> I wasn't part of your budge meeting. I didn't have anything to do with that. Now, you know, I'm saying, I would like to vote with you, bu I cannot with what I promised i my campaign to go against the citizens. No due respect to you or anybody here. That's my position. Unless you tell me, hey, we can lower today to the 7. 0668 and it equals 30 million, I'm out. >> Commissioner Pardo? >> I would love unity and collaboration. We cannot do it this way. I would love nothing more tha that. That's not where we're at. >> I'm going to say this. I am not willing I am not willing to lose that money to the state now and reduce services because we have to adjust the budget. There will be an increase in the [unclear. ] You're going to go to the millage that we had before. I am not. - people are going to keep paying the same taxes. You are not reducing the taxes; you're reducing the revenue. >> Vice chair. >> I've been kind of quiet on this last part. In all my years I've been watching budgets, this is a doozy. The problem is that someone i the state of Florida decided to use the revenue department against us to create havoc for short time and something they know they cannot win in court. Let's look at the logic of what the state is saying. You have four elected commissioners. The state itself through the governor took out an action of the state - what you have left for a majority is four. How in the world can you have a majority of five when you onl have four remaining and it was the state itself that took one out? This is not logical in Miami or anywhere else in the world. But, someone wanted to play games with the city because. [unclear] wanted to create havo so some would get their way in trying to destroy this city. It is impossible to have gotten five votes but we only have four. Now, I've asked my colleagues if they want reductions, to explain to me where they want them from. Where are they going to come from? "We're going to reduce the budget by . amount. " >> How about we start with [unclear. ] How about we start there? have a couple of ideas. >> Commissioner Gabela, let him speak. >> I apologize, I don't want to get anyone upset. >> You're not getting me upse >> At the same time, we need to see, if this is going to go this way, where the changes wil be. This will create havoc, like Commissioner Reyes stated. Furthermore, in the previous meeting as I remember, but I could be corrected if I'm wrong the commission made it clear it wanted it challenged if it needed to be challenged. But, here we go. We're going to be told, "You can't spend any money" and defending the residents of the city, which is what we'll be doing. The idea that this is easy to do, each district gives up $11 million as I heard, it doesn't work that way. Chairman King's district is the poorest in the city. You can't take $11 million from the poorest. It will hurt so much more tha if you take the same $11 millio from the richest. It's not an even seitan. on. [Unclear] if this was approve or if you were planning on running for elected office, commissioner here someone running for elected office has the responsibility of becoming aware of the budget. The first thing I did when I ran again, back in '17, I asked for a meeting with the then cit manager. The meeting was to go over th budget and get copies of the budget and other budgetary materials. That's what I did. So, to me it's a non-excuse that we weren't here. >> Now I need to answer. Now I need to answer. >> Mr. Gabela, no. You can answer when it's your turn. Not to interrupt. >> These are facts, logical facts. If the position that two members of this body want to take us to, for the sake of those in the media that are so eager to bring Miami down is that we're going to immediately have $50 million, maybe more, that we have to cut from this budget. I will tell you the first thing that is going to happen. You will give the bond market major concerns. It might affect our bonds by the beginning of next year. This could increase what we pay out. The bottom line is that whatever the will of the two ne members, that they want to do here today, let's do it, let's finish it, let's get it done an stop playing anymore games. >> One second. >> [Unclear] because we have no other alternative. This law that's being applied to the City of Miami only will not stand in court. >> Before you respond, I'd like to remind everybody here, you do not have to attend every argument you're invited to. u don't have to attend every argument you're invited to. >> [Unclear] >> Just so we can manage. Now, I ask the question. I understand you're a no on .. . . >> I'd like to speak. >> You're a no on the millage rate of 7. 8078 and I believe, Commissione Pardo, you're also a no. Let's do away with formalitie and get this off the table. Do I have a motion for 7. 8078? >> The motion is to approve? >> To approve the mileage rat at 7. 8078. We're on SP. aker: . ave a motion and second. In favor, say aye. l opposed? >> I have two no's.. >> [Unclear. ] Understood. >> When you can, I did want t just -- >> When in order. Commissioner Gabela. >> I just wanted to add that district 2 is a donor district. It generates 70% of the revenue for the City of Miami. It could use some relief. I don't think this fear mongering is appropriate and I think we should move forward given the circumstances. >> Do you want to speak? >> Yes, I do want to speak. If you want to spend all this week [unclear] acting reasonable, like adults, I am going to do that. I am not here, Mr. Carollo, to please the media. I simply have my thoughts and opinions. I am respecting yours and everybody else here. I respect what all of you hav to say. Please, when I speak give me the same courtesy. Don't accuse me of pandering to the media. I was elected like yourself, and I have the same right to my opinions. If we could respect each othe and this body we could get a lo more done. >> I don't know what you're talking about. >> You said I'm cowtowing to the media. >> That's not what I said [Multiple speakers. ] >> So, next up is . P 2 at tier 2 at 7. 4724, which will - operating. SP. 2 7. 4724 operating. Do I have a motion? I have a motion and a second. All in favor? >> Aye. >> Aye. Commissioner Gabela? Commissioner Pardo? >> No. >> For the record the motion fails 3-2 with commissioners Gabela and Pardo voting no. >> There is nothing else to vote upon here. The city attorney has to file suit against the state and hopefully this will be heard in an emergency basis so that we can get some relief. >> The only issue about the [unclear] we will prosecute the case. However, these things are being done by the two commissioners. I don't know that we will get the answers. It's not a four-fifths or unanimity question now. It's something that was done. >> So there wouldn't be a remedy? >> There may not be the ability to litigate this becaus you're not doing a four-fifths vote. >> It could affect the litigation but the actual vote we will be going on would be th original vote. >> We will make that argument. >> I think the interpretation [unclear] needs to be addressed. We need to have clarity. Since that opinion was writte by a mid-level individual at th department of revenue, I think it needs to be addressed. >> Hold on one second. I see our mayor has joined us. Mr. Mayor? >> Thank you, madam Chair. How are you doing? >> No complaints here. >> Welcome, guys. I just want to get a couple things on the record. I think it's important for there to be factual clarity. First thing, Mr. [Unclear] please come up. Thank you. There's been discussion about whether we have raised or lowered taxes. We control the property value rate, the assessment of propert taxes in the City of Miami. Does the City of Miami contro that? >> No, we do not. >> What do we control? The millage rate? >> Only. >> Did we increase or decreas the millage rate? >> We decreased it. I wanted that out for factua purposes. Second question, historically what does the millage rate set in September rank in terms of low or high? >> It's the lowest in 40 years, maybe ever. >> I think last year we reached that level. [Unclear. ] It is the lowest ever tax th City of Miami residents in the history of the City of Miami. Is that correct? >> Correct. >> Is the city able by law to affectuate labor contracts? >> [Unclear.] >> In the absence of contracts, do increases in labo roll over to the net fiscal yea? >> There are already several in our compensation structure. >> With this new revenue, tha is a result of lowering our millage rate, isn't it right that our only management right as a city is to furlough employees to cut custos? >> Process wise, it is one of the relief points. >> If we pass a budget that i $50 million out of bounds, we have limited tools in the toolbox to balance the budget. Correct? >> Yes, it's limited. >> [Unclear. ] Do you see that happening? >> No. >> One other option would be to furlough our employees. I was here in 2009. I was the only elected official in 2009 elected withou union support. It was a very hard fought election.ry onby 260 votes. rec because I refused to raise taxe. It was very difficult to have to cut 12%, 9%, 7%, 5%, and pensions from our labor employees. But, we did that to balance our budget. At the time, our reserves wer like $15 million? >> We got to $40 million. >> No, 15. I remember it very well. We had $188 million reserves. What does that rank in terms of our highest reserves ever? Is It's the top two or three. >> [Multiple speakers. ] We have. the highest reserve we've ever had. Have we ever had a higher bon rating? >> I don't think so. >> We went from a [unclear] surplus - a do nothing deficit, e city would have been bankrupt. Now, the highest reserves, th highest bond rating with the lowest taxes in history. Is that accurate? >> That's accurate. >> By the way, what is our homicide rate this year? >> I don't know that number. >> Do you know the historic o homicides? [Unclear. ] >> Are we on budget or talkin about crime? We're going on and on and on. >> Commissioner Gabela. >> Yes, ma'am. >> I do not let anyone else interrupt you. Please. I have allowed you to speak. There may be some who have felt that any one of our statements wasn't at the issue. That's not for me or you to say. Let everyone speak and say whatever they need to say. So, please. >> It's important to recogniz that the police department is a large part of the budget >> I think it is important to note that we started recording homicide statistics in 1947. I asked the police chief to tell me about he. He gave me 1947 as the first year. We had 32 that first year. 32 homicides. The high water mark, the year with the most since recorded history was 1980. Do you know how many? 220? 2-3 days, there was a homicid. I think everybody would agree that Miami looks different in 2023 than it did in 1947. Is that accurate? I find it important to note that in 2023, year to date, we are on the 11th. We have 20 days left in the year, and we have 27. That's 5 less than in 1947, the first year of recorded homicide rates. There are only a couple of years in the entirety of recorded Miami history where there have been fewer homicides. The year-to-date reduction in homicides is important because we are budgeting for police. We have to make sure the officers are doing their job. Has much has that number gone down? More than 10%? >> Yes. >> More than 20%. >> Yes. >> More than 40%? >> Yes. >> Last year, we ended with 50 homicides, and that's close to 509%. By the way, hopefully, for the next 20 days, we do ' have any homicides. We have one of the lowest per capita homicide rates in the country. I think the other cities abov us are cities we wouldn't recognize. The officers in our departmen are doing a good job. Our fire department is doing good job as well. They get there within 4 minutes. If we analysis the 911 calls for fire resource, that number s not remained stggnt. t. It's important to contextualize this information for the services our residents will receive. If we pass a budget and do no enter union negotiations, we will be left to Furlow employee s to balance our budge. . We cannot use one-time revenues to deal with recurring expenses. >> Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Commissioner-- >> Can I ask Larry a quick question? >> Go ahead. >> The millage went down this year, right? >> Yes. >> By how much? >> . 0696. >> Basically . 07. How much on a house of 500,00 more or less? >> Well, the only calculation- >> On a value. >> We looked at the average which was assessed value of 369 which yielded at 25 dollars on the city operating. Now, there are other-- >> Last year's millage, did we go up or down? >> Down. >> How much? >> Let me get that number. >> Okay, sure. >> So, we went from 7. 99 the year before to 7. 877. >> About 10-12. >> Of a mil. >> Yeah, yeah. In the same two-year period, what happened to real estate values? >> The last year, we went up 1. The year before-- >> My point being that it is not unusual to see high real estate values with a lowering o a millage. >> Correct, but-- >> [unclear] it would not be unusual to be at all-time lows for a millage. Right? >> We have-- >> Exactly. My point was raised in a different way. When we said one of the relie points was furloughing employees, you never said you were doing that. >> We have not done analysis o that. >> You said that's an option that's out there. We also mentioned we had strong, great reserves. Given all these elements, we should be able to manage where we're at. >> I'm an implementer, sir we hatever the policy decision is, we do. >> I appreciate it. Thank you. >> Madam City Attorney, we don't have a consensus here. The feeling is that you may move forward with the litigatio against the state to accept our vote of the 4 majority. Is that an issue? You looked uncertain. >> We can obviously move forward with the state and advise them that we disagree with their position. Because of the vote, they may say that it is not an issue tha they can address. It would be a non-issue because we voted, have not vote by the 4/5 vote. We have now gone beyond that to a 3/5. We will proceed with the litigation. I cannot tell you if they try to move it out. That's what we would have to try and figure out. >> Okay, so I believe our business is concluded here. >> I believe we may have to take one more vote. >> Two more votes. You have to vote on the three at least get the 3/5 on the budgets. >> What is remaining is a vote for 6. 7931 operating. Do I have a motion? >> Madam Chair, can I say we more thing? >> Yes. >> I wanted to remind the new commissioners that, as you said even if you vote for the higher millage, you are able to amend your budget in January, like literally-- you don't have to wait. I know they prefer midyear, but you can amend your budget a you see fit at any meeting. I want to bring that up as well if that changes anything for a 4/5 vote. >> Thank you. >> Can I offer another alternative. If we are left with a 3-2 vote, the millage dictates a 49 million dollar reduction. That's what we're left with. I think we sort of take on Commissioner Gabela's profer of a "somewhere in between" compromise for purposes of not initiating a drastic reduction. >> I don't want to vote on 49 million dollar deficit. we go with the remaining one, the three, the simple majority- >> What I think he is alluding to-- are we talking about the 6. 668? >> We are left with a vote tha a 3-2 majority is a 49 million reduction. >> 49 or 56 or 60. We are basically there. >> We can do the unc. lear]. >> I don't see why we need to take any other vote. The one we took before with 4 members of the commission [unclear] to consider leaves us with a [unclear] gap. >> I think-- >> Madam-- Larry, the vote tha we took when we had a four-member commissioner, that the state does not want to consider-- even though we only had 4 members, they said a fift had to come from heaven somewhere. Like manna from heaven. What would that leave us but gift? >> Commissioner, you reconsidered that vote, so it doesn't exist anymore vote. >> I vote [unclear]. And that was reconsidered, so now, you need to Voight Eeiauo something. e best case scenario is a 4/5 with an 856,000 dollars impact. That's the best case scenario. We can go-- January gives you enough time to look at the budget, and then weave. e taken action. I am not in favor of going th simple majority with a 49 million dollar impact on this city nor am I in favor of takin some action that will bring about a 30 million dollar impac for the city. I am asking again if we can reconsider the 7. 4724 which will have an impact of 856,000. No one is happy. You won't be happy. They won't be happy. But we would come to a consensus, and we can move forward from there. >> Can I speak? >> Yes, you may. >> Thank you. From my perspective, I offere the equal to the 7. 0668 which equals roughly 30 million dollars. Okay? You guys, what I don't understand from all this-- on September 28th, you could have done the 4/5 vote to lose the 865, and you chose not to do. >> That is not true. >> That is not true? Okay. >> We passed the budget unanimously with what we had. Commissioner Gabela, irspsctv hat you have been told, we did the best we did with what we ha >> Excuse me. You up there, [unclear], I would like to ask you. On the 28th, had you taken th 4/5 vote, would you have lost only 865k or not? Am I correct or incorrect in this? >> You are spot on. We would have only lost 800,000. >> Why wasn't that taken? >> We did not agree. >> Commissioner Gabela-- [cross talking] >> As long as you did the 4, you had the [unclear], and that's why we are here today. Now, somebody wants to use scare tactics that the police will be defended. What you did on the 28th, that's on you. If you don't want it, nobody is using scare tactics with me. We will have to cancel here and find a way to cut that budget. >> I understand. Please don't raise your voice. >> No-- ma'am, I am not raisin my voice. >> That's what my brother says too when he yells at me. It is loud. >> Mr. [unclear] is loud and nobody i saying anything. I am a city commissioner like anybody else here. Let's respect. each other. This is my tone of voice. This is the only one I have. What I am simply saying-- I a stating. You could have taken that vot of 4/5 to lose 865. Your city attorney advised yo ill. Since we are in this predicament now, certain people want to make me feel bad becaus the police might be defunded. >> No one is trying to make yo feel bad. I have said repeatedly that w respect what you are saying. That was not an option on the 28th. >> [inaudible] >> It was a business decision. >> [inaudible] >> I am asking point blank-- o the 28th of September, was the 4/5 vote an option to lost 865, yes or no. >> That was an option and you And you didn't take it. >> Hold on. Hold on. What I am saying to you is yo are right. That was not an option given to use. It was not laid out to us because we didn't have 5. That 4 didn't constitute unanimous, and our option would have been-- that was not available to us. It is available to us today. If your argument is that she didn't do her job and give us that option, we have the option now and you are not in favor of it. u are not in favor. Is there an appetite of this body to revisit the 4/5 vote where we would lose 865,000 versus millions? Commissioner Pardo? >> No. >> Okay, so here we are. That's it. We don't need to discuss anymore. We will move forward with the litigation with the city. We're at an impasse. There's nothing else to do. >> You have to take a vote on something. You cannot leave it. >> Understand. If we have to take a vote on something. >> Well, well, well, well, wel. If you want to set up a bonfire, let's make it big. Let's go back to the roll bac rate. >> What is before us-- >> We want to play Robin Hood? Let's bring it back to the roll back rate? >> We have before us the third option which is the simple majority of 6. 791 operating. Do I have a motion? >> We are waiting on Commissioner Reyes. >> He stepped away for a minut. >> It's okay Commissioner Reye. I understand. I to understand that we do not have a choice? We have to go to the third option? >> No, you can profer somewher in between if you want. It doesn't require to go simple to the 6. 790. We can do something in between that. >> I got it. I got it. I believe Commissioner Gabela has an option that he would lik to profer. >> I would like to present a motion to vote on the 7. 0668, 30 million reduction. We don't lose the 50 mil. We are talking 30. I am willing to negotiate. >> 7. 0668. I have a motion. Do I have a second? >> Second. >> All in favor? >> No. >> No >> The motion fails with commissioner Reyes, commissioner King and [unclear] voting no. >> Commissioner Pardo, do you have a recommendation? >> Not at this time. >> Not at this time. I can't make a motion, but I' like to come somewhere in between 7. 8 and 7. 0. Can somebody proffer a motion to come somewhere in between 7. 0668 and 7. 8078? Can we find a middle ground there? >> I'm joining the liberation army. I would not vote for anything other than rollback rate if thi is where we're going. I expect my two new exteemed colleagues [unclear] the City o Miami -- >> Commissioner Carollo pleas. That doesn't count. >> [Unclear. ] >> Okay, we are at a difference of 0. 741 with the two. What Commisioner Gabela has offered and what the city has offered. That's not a huge difference. Can we come to -- commissione Reyes? >> [Unclear. ] I still want to lower the millage and lower the revenues that we are going to receive. I'm not willing to vote on something at the moment that is going to create a big problem. If we have a motion to direct the city manager to find a reduction of $30 million minimu by mid-year, and that $7 millio should be passed, whatever it is, to the taxpayers in a form of rebate or whatever form that it is legal. But, madam, to find no less than $30 million at mid-year so we can have that reduction in - basically, it's a reduction in the millage. You see? >> That would require a four-fifths vote, which would reduce by the $865,000 and then the directive that would - that you're asking for. >> I vote for the loss of $800,000. I don't like to lose it but with the directive to the city manager to find x amount, by mid-year that will be returned to the taxpayers. >> Commissioner Reyes, we do not have the votes for that. Hold on a second. What if we go 7. 2? 7. 4, down to 7. 0. In between would be 7. 2. Would 7. 2 be acceptable to this body? Please. >> Just a flat u. 2? >> That would require four votes. >> I understand. I'm trying to have a compromise here. >> 7. 2 even on the operating millage would result in a reduction of $20. 5 million. >> That's less than than what I'm proposing. >> It would still require a four-fifths vote. >> Commisioner Gabela. Commissioner Pardo? >> I would be comfortable wit the $30 million. That was pretty much where I was willing to go. >> Now we're at 20. >> This isn't an action. . >> I'm trying to get the two of you and the two of them -- >> We've given our vote and opinions. We have to respect - >> The 8. 2 is $20 million. Is that acceptable? >> Commisioner Gabela we can' hear you. >> How about we go halfway? Not to 30 and not 20, but 25. Whatever that equals to. >> I'm amenable to that. I think we need to -- hold on. >> [Unclear.] >> And it's not an auction, I'm just trying to get us to a place where we can agree. I don't even know if my colleagues will accept that. I'm just trying to find a pat forward here, for the residents. >> On the record, I'm not voting for any of these other i between. I would have voted for the first, I would have voted for [unclear. ] Unless you want to come with what I said. Light a bonfire, let's do a big one. Let's do a rollback. >> I'm going to put in the record I'm the most agreeable person in the world and want to find common ground. But, in this case being part of the budget process not only in the City of Miami but also the school system, I see and I know the problems you can cause by having a cut of that magnitude. now without knowing what our costs or expenditures are going to be, and without any further analysis. I want - what I'm agreeing to losing $800,000. We should have taken that. I agree with you Mr. . abela. If you agreed with that at th beginning, you should agree to it now. >> I don't agree with it now. >> That's your prerogative. I want a reduction, but an orderly reduction. I want to commit the city manager to find no less than $3 million by mid-year. That will require savings tha could be analyzed and the effec those savings will have on our services we provide our citizen. At mid-year, the funds, no less than $30 million, we would return it to the taxpayers in the form of a rebate or whateve is legal. That is my opinion. I don't want to throw out $800,000. Millions and millions of dollars, it will create a problem with the budget and a problem of the magnitude we don't want to create now. I won't be a participant of that. Now, I want to reduce the amoun of taxes people are paying but want to do it in an orderly and smart fashion. I want the administration to start working and maybe also by doing it that way we will bring the efficiency that we are so much in favor of. That is my opinion based on m experience as a budget analysis. You have a commitment, you hav to do it, you are responsible for it. I could add that inclusive yo ome up with $30 million by mid-year, please present your resignation. I'm going to ask for it. >> I would go along with your proposal with a caveat to make it even easier to achieve it, that a milling and a half comes out of the budget of each elected official. You have $9 million right off the . at there. All you have to do is find another 21? >> Or $30 million. >> I will go along with that. >> That is my proposal. I will vote no against any other. I'm really glad that you two want to reduce the millage, and you two want to return to the taxpayers. Give them a little help. It's not going to amount to much but it's going to amount t something. You see? [Audio cutting out. ] There are people. having a very hard time paying taxes. That little bit will help the That's my proposal. I want to do it in an orderly manner, the smart manner, the professional manner to do it. That's my opinion. You can raise it to $35 million or 40, or 50. >> [Unclear.] >> We can't hear you. >> I'm not quite sure if what I heard before is what I heard. Madam city attorney, we prove d a millage rate before when there were four members. The fact that we came back to see if we would reconsider [unclear], what stands as law i what we approved before. That doesn't mean we did away with that. >> Mr. Clerk? >> The vote that was taken on the 28th? >> No, the motion to reconsider the vote that was taken on the 28th and then it was today - >> That motion failed. >> Yes, but if it failed then you go back to the original motion which was approved whatever the day was when there were four of us here. >> So, the motion - I understand what you're saying now. The motion you took at the beginning of the meeting. Correct me if I'm wrong. Essentially, the motion to reconsider means you rescinded the action prior. This is different because it pertains to the determination o millage and budget. From Mason's rules of procedure, when you reconsider an item you. are rescinding the actin previously taken. >> Did it pass? >> Yes, that's how we were able to begin discussing SP.. , 2, and 3. >> If it doesn't pass, you go back to the other one. You don't keep going and goin >> No, we would have to do another motion to reinstate wha we did on the 28th. >> That would be a majority motion correct? A three vote majority motion. >> For me, the notion of reconsideration means you have rescinded the action previously taken. That's why SP 1, 2, and 3 are all in play. >> How could we go back to ou original -- >> . P 1, 2, and 3 are all in play. >> So then, I believe what Commissioner Carollo is asking, is if you moved to withdraw the motion then the previous motion would stand. >> What would that require? >> But we've already reconsidered the item. >> You're saying we cannot go back. >> Can we withdraw the motion to reconsider? >> I didn't vote on a motion to reconsider. >> Yes, we all voted unanimously on the motion to reconsider. That's why we're here. >> Before. >> If the motion doesn't pass -- >> No no, the motion -- >> You have the motion that was to reconsider. If that doesn't pass, you hav a right to go back to the original motion that was there. >> No. No. We did a motion to reconsider our actions. That motion passed, so our previous actions are gone. That's what you're saying. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Is there a way - is what they're asking - withdraw our actions now? What it seems you're saying i no. >> Because the motion to reconsider passed, which is why we're even able to discuss . P 1, 2, and 3. >> So, we have to take some action right now. We don't have anything in pla. >> Purely from Mason's. I don't know if the determination of mileage, if there's another rule that would apply. >> If there's a majority vote to rescind the motion for reconsideration [unclear] and then we negate. The only problem is then we'r dealing with $56 million versus $49 million. >> I think we came to maybe a consensus at 25. >> [Unclear.] >> I believe we came to a consensus of $25 million. Would that be amenable to my colleagues? I need a four-fifths. >> We can also recess the meeting until the 18th. We still have time to think this over and do that. I mean, we can still recess it, and come back. Everybody comes with -- just think it over and think what is best. >> Do I have a motion? >> We're checking - we have t readvertise. We need to check the date. >> So do it. >> The 17th or 18th. >> We won't make it. Give us one moment to calculate all that. >> Go ahead. >> Javi? >> Mr. Manager, what are we doing? >> Madam Chair, we have a couple of things-- we have a deadline to the Florida department of revenue to tell them what we are doing. We have to have some type. of vote today as well because, if not, that can lead to other noncompliance issues. Then, if we were to reset thi hearing, we could potentially b in noncompliance personate to lorida statute because this is in circumstances beyond our control which requires the recesses-- for a recess today. >> You are saying we must take some action today? >> That could be a-- yes, according to the state statute, due to circumstances beyond our control of the taxin authority. >> We must take some action today. What is left for us either th simple majority vote which is 4 million dollars or the 25 million dollars that were proferred by Commissioner Gabel We have to take some action today. >> Additional action-- if of went with the millage rate that we had before, [unclear] the 5 votes they claim, we only had 4. That brings it up to 56 million. What is the millage rate on that? >> The 56 million is the forfeiture associated without doing anything. That's the loss of the sales tax. If we do the simple majority, that millage rate is [unclear], and the estimated revenue is 49. 666. You asked about the millage for 25. That is 7. 1364. >> That is at 25 million? at requires how many votes? >> That still requires 4/5. That's the thing-- everything we are discussing above 6. 7931 requires a 4/5 vote. >> Entiendo. Do I have a motion to pass th operating budget at 7. 1346? >> How much? >> 25. >> Did I make the Marmoiton? >> That's the same motion I made. >> Do I have a second? >> I will second it. >> It requires a 4/5 vote. All those in favor, say aye. >> No. >> No. >> Aye. >> I still believe we should d it in a different way. >> That's a 3-2. It failed. We need a 4/5 vote. >> I still believe in my conscience that we should pas the [unclear] for 800,000 and then demand that we-- >> I understand. >> It's going to-- now, we are reducing the 25 million dollars. That's it. We are trying to-- I don't want [unclear] 25. None of that is-- now, it wil create problems. I want commitment that we are going to get there. That's what I want. >> Commissioner Reyes, we don' - these are not the votes to do the-- >> [unclear] >> We need a 4/5 vote. Unless we go with the 6. 793 operating which is a 49 million dollar deficit-- we hav to do something today. We don't have the vote for 7. 4 with 865. If we don't do something today, we won't be in complianc with the state and will lose th - we will lose the sales tax. I am trying to mitigate the damage here. >> Madam Chair. I want to be clear with it. I want a reduction. I want a reduction. I want a reduction that will be greater than that. We don't have -- I mean, they can vote anyway they want it. I will vote my conscience and what I believe is achievable and beneficial to the residents. I don't want to tie it tenth residents. >> I am explaining that we do not have the votes. Nisei will. l not be vote in a thing that I don't believe in. >> If we do not make a decisio today, we are going to jeopardize 56 million dollars. >> Let me ask you something-- why, why, why do I have to vote in something I don't believe? >> You don't have to. I am merely explaining the ramifications. >> I want to ask, I want to ask my fellow commissioners to consider what I am saying which is more than 25 million dollars. We will keep track every mont about it, and we are committing the administration to over 30 million dollars. of reduction. You see? >> Why don't you think about what we're considering? >> You are considering 25 millions right now. ose 25 million dollars, believe it or not, it is going to creat problems. you don't care about that-- I do. >> Don't make it that I don't care about that. [cross talking; yelling] >> Commissioner, commissioner- Commisioner Reyes. Body language. Please, please just ignore it. Where we are today, the facts. We have to take an action. Most of them require a 4/5 votes. The only action we can take that will require 3 votes would have a 49 million dollar impact on the city. I understand what you are saying. I agree with you. I would prefer the 7. 4724 that will have an 865,000 dollar impact, and then we can work. We do not have the votes for that. We don't have the votes for that. >> There was one vote that floated, but I don't know whose it was. It was a potential 9 million dollar reduction at 1. 5 each. >> That's right. >> [unclear] 4/5, and then maybe-- but it didn't finish which was maybe you had the 20 million looking in the future. At least, that would give tangible results to the commissioner of an 11 million dll hit. it. It didn't come into fruition, but there was discussion among- >> It did. Let's take a smaller hit now. [unclear] you know, we have t preach by example. We have to preach by example. If we are asking all departments to take a hit, somewhere and sometimes, if there's a commitment of 30 million dollars, third partments are going to take a hit. We start by taking a hit ourselves. That's 10 million dollars, right. out of our budget. That's 10 million dollars fro our budget, and then the commitment to go right ahead an ey should have found 30 million dollars more. You see? That's my proposal. >> Can I have a motion? >> I move it. >> I second it. >> All those in favor, say aye. The motion is for 7. 4724. What is your motion? >> My motion would be for the 4/5, the only thing that we nee Take a hit from 800,000 dollars, 10 million dollars coming out of-- >> Tier 2. >> This motion is for-- >> Tier 2. [cross talking] >> 7. 4724. I have a motion and a second. >> Chair, at some point-- 7. 4724 operating. >> All those in favor, say aye. >> No. >> Okay. We are not going to do that one again. >> I'm sorry; the motion faile. >> This was the second time that motion was taken up. We don't have that on the table. I'd like a legal opinion on i we take no action today what happens. >> If you take no action today it would be potential noncompliance with the state of their 56 million, yes? 56 million, and then potentially we still have the hole in the budget because we are not-- >> Wait, wait. This is the one piece we're missing. If we don't vote today, we automatically go back to there ll back rate. No, you're complaint. If you don't vote, you go back to the roll back rate. They cannot tell you are not complaint. That's a 63 million dollar impact. >> nclear], City Manager? >> Unfortunately, since the state is the one that makes these decisions in a vacuum, th could see a potential for a 100 million, a 49 and the 56 technically, so we are not-- we have to vote [On screen. Now, we are out of compliance with the state based on the dat. >> I don't have the vote eithe way. I can get 3. I cannot get 4. What happens? I don't have the votes. >> On the 3, it's 49 million. >> I don't have 3 votes for 49 either. I don't have the votes. >> Let's go back on the 49. This is reductions. The state is not taking any moneys from us. >> That's our internal policy. Right. >> The state is not taking any money from us. >> We are not receiving money [unclear] revenue from the stat I mean, it's just like losing it, you see? >> Right, but, okay, we have a alternative from commissioner Pardo-- I'm sorry, Commissioner Gabela for 7. 1346 operating which will be 25 million. Do I have a motion? >> I motion. >> Do I have a second? >> I second. >> All those in favor, say aye. >> No. >> Yes. >> Commissioner Reyes? We have a motion on the table with a 25 million dollar hit versus a 49 million dollar hit. >> No, I want to reduce it a little. Let's reduce it now, and commit then to a bigger [unclear]. >> The City Clerk is trying to tell me somjog. >> The motion failed 3-2. >> Here we are again. I do not have 4/5 in any direction. It's time to adjourn. Nothing is getting done. >> We might as well go down this rabbit hole. >> Until when? >> We could be exposed upwards of 100 million dollars. I don't necessarily want-- >> Do I have a motion for 6. 7931 operating? >> I will make the motion. >> Hold on. Are you saying--? >> That's our last option. >> I propose that we go 7. 32312 which is 11 million dollars and a commitment of 30 million more dollars at midyear. >> 7. 3 what? >> 7. 3212. It's a commitment of the administration bringing additional funds. >> It's 7. >> It's 7. 3312. >> 8. 3312. Do I have a motion for 7. 3312 operating? >> Yes. >> I second. >> With a commitment of over $30 million. >> From administration to reduce the budget. >> I have a motion and a second. >> Can you explain that again What does that equal in dollar amounts? >> $11 million. >> No. >> No. >> Okay, so here we are. >> Madam chair, if I may. Hold on a second. I vote in favor. That's a 3-2. >> 3-2 with Commissioner Gabela and Pardo voting no. >> Can I ask a question from staff? >> Please. >> Larry, the one that we can get passed on a 3-2 vote is what millage rate? >> That is 6. 7931. >> Okay. >> Operating. >> Operating, yes. This operating one, and mayor let me explain to you why I looking to head this way. I want you to hear me, Commissioner Reyes, because I think you're right on. The exposure we will have and then I will tell you something else you haven't thought about with what's going on here. You're not only opening up th door for the state to hit us with a double whammy on the $56 million and then the $49 millio. Then, you are opening up the door to remove them all from office. So, here is what I'm going to propose. I'm going to propose the 6. 17931. >> 6. 7931. >> That's what I said. 6. 7931. It's approximately $49 millio out of which I will find you a quick, easy $12 million. $2 million from each of the elected officials. Then, you have to find $37 million more. >> Commissioner, there is a motion in play. We have to address that. >> It was never seconded. >> You're willing to lose $49. million but aren't willing to lose $25. >> If we're going to have a bonfire, we're going to have a real bonfire. >> The mayor is here. >> I just want to impress upo the council we have two votes. First, the millage rate. That will set in essence the amount of revenue we will get. [Audio cutting out] it's a significant amount. The second thing we have to d is pass a budget. We are constitutionally required to pass a balanced budget. There are certain things we can do and there are certain things we cannot do. We've been here for a long time. Some people would say too long, and that's fine. There are certain things we can do and certain things we can't. If the decision of the body was to roll back the millage to - what would be the projected deficit under the rollback? $49 million? You would have to find $63 million of savings today to balance the budget. I don't recommend using reserves because that is not fiscally prudent. You don't take recurring expenses and peg. them against a one-time revenue. That is what the federal government has done to build a $30 trillion deficit. We don't want to be back in 2009 when we were on the verge of bankruptcy. All I'm asking, whatever decision the body makes, they find the cuts to balance the budget. Whether it's 9, 10, etc. we have to find the cuts tonight to balance the budget. I hope everybody is prepared to do that. >> We have to balance the budget anyway. We have to start cutting it anyway. >> I propose the $12 million and I made the motion for the 6. 7931. If anybody would like to second it, they're welcome to. >> Is there a second? >> We lose how much? >> $49 million with $12 million coming from the six elected officials, two million apiece, so you're left with 37 to look for. [Multiple speakers.] >> Could commissioner Carillo's amendment be included in SP. 3 or is it just SP.. ? >> The first vote is on the millage. The second would have to include whatever budget cuts yo do tonight in order to match th millage. >> Okay, where we are right now is we're considering the worst option. $49 million. There is an option on the table for $25 million and then we can find the cuts. I don't think we should go to the $49 million. That is not prudent. Okay, it is not prudent what we are doing here, one. But, I understand that we don't have the votes. It makes more sense for us to pass the rate with the $865,000 [unclear. ] I understand that. If we don't have the votes fo that it doesn't make sense that we go all the way to the $49 million if there's a midpoint. We have to consider the residents of the City of Miami. Not our personalities, we hav to think about the residents of the City of Miami. If we were truly thinking about the residents of the City of Miami we would go with the 865. Less than a million dollars. We are talking about now the difference between $49 million and $25 million. That is not good governance. We could fix everything else in time to not take the option of the $865,000 is shameful but this is where we are. It's worse if we go all the way to the $49 million. I'm willing to go somewhere i between but be clear, the most prudent action for us to take is for us to go with the $865,000 hit [Audio cutting out We address [unclear. and not be forced by the state to lose revenue. I don't have a consensus for that. I am willing to come somewher in between. I think $25 million is a middle ground. It's still shameful but it's middle ground. $49 million should not be our option. It should not be our option. We should go with the 4/5 for the $865,000 and then we move forward and do the things the two of you are asking. If I don't have the votes for that then let's go forward. I need 4/5 on each side, for here and for here. >> Madam chair, I have put $1 million on the table that would come from the elected officials. That should be the ones that lead on this. We could approve whatever the millage rate would be, minus those $12 million, and the request from the administration that they will look to, by mid-year, see what we could find another $30 million. At least it would give us fou months or so. The fiscal year started October 1st. Three and a half months to go about this in the most responsible way to see where th cuts are coming from, like you were taught. Whether it's $25 million or $49 million, we have to get a balanced budget. We're going to have to make cuts percentage wise across the board so that we can give the state a balanced budget with whatever we approve. That's why by only taking a millage rate that would take th 12 million you identified from the elected officials, and then going about it in a prudent way where the administration will look to see where we can find another $30 million. And then that is brought up i the six month fiscal year revie. It's a prudent way of doing things. To begin with, you have most of your people who have paid their taxes already. You will create even more expenses in trying to get that money back to them. How do you do it with some an not others? It's a mess that would be created on top of another mess. This is not like if we're starting with four people who did not pay their taxes. The vast majority of our residents in November paid thei taxes already for the 4% saving. The easiest way we could do i [unclear.] >> Commissioner Pardo? >> Madam Chair, I trust that staff knows the budget better than anyone. I'm not sure if it's $2 million from each. I would rather leave those decisions about what things can be deferred and timed to silvae e money. I've gone as far as I can wit the proposal at $25 million. >> Madam Chair, do you know that if we cut $25 million we have to look to every project, every item, where are we going to cut. It's going to be a budget minus $25 million. We have to find, tonight, pas the budget. What we are doing now is passing the mileage. Once you pass the millage we have to pass the budget. It's required that we pass a balanced budget. We have to do the cuts tonigh >> I understand that. >> What are the projects that - I mean, the budget. What do you purpose. >> Don't you think it's worth the $25 mil. to the $49 mill. >> I know where you're going. We are doing the same thing. We're talking the same language. You want to cut the - I want tax cut. I want to do it in an orderly manner. We have to - if we can identify projects that we don't need, and I know for a fact there are projects there that w can cut. I know. Everybody knows there are certain expenditures that shoul be done away with because they are unnecessary. Maybe we can get more than $2 million. Maybe we can get $50 million. [Unclear] it would be easy fo us to find the budget that we can cut. It gives you time to each one of you or us to look at the projects with a magnifying glas and say, "Why do you have this here? Let's cut this. " I propose that we don't do this. We can find consensus because we will be saving money. Those savings will be passed to the residents. That's the only thing that I' saying. >> Commissioner Reyes, we hav to have a four-fifths vote to either accept his motion or we have to go with the simple. -- >> I do understand. The only thing I'm asking my colleague is to do it in a different way. We need to cut now and we don't have - I don't want - you see what I don't want? I don't want Larry to go back there and just take this off, take this off. [Unclear. ] We can do it. $50 million. And then, we make the commitment that we have to find another $30 or however many million dollars you want. We can - you, you, you, you, and I. - we can go through the budget and identify the expenditures w don't want, work on it, and start cutting this. That's what I want. That's a way that I think wil be -- >> Commissioner Reyes, we don't have the four fifths. They are not going to vote fo the $865,000. It seems as though you are no going to vote for the $25 million. >> I'm proposing $15 myelin. >> They are not going to accept that. >> How do you know? >> Make the motion. >> >> I'm going to make a motion for 27 million dollars and [unclear] today. That's it. 27 million dollars. A motion that, instead of 35, we will go with 27 million dollars. I know that we go through the budget, and we will find 27 million dollars. That's better than what I wanted. >> He's offering 25. >> I am offering 27. [cross talking] >> Now, you are fighting Gafoo e money. >> All right, let's go. >> I will make a motion for 27. million dollars. We know the budget. We studied the budget. I know there are items that w can do away with. My motion is 27 million dollars, and that's it. Okay? Now, that will be easy. Then, the commitment to find another 25 million dollars. >> That includes the 864? 000? >> The millage rate for-- Commissioner Reyes, he is offering milgete o25milln Tt's. >> The problem here is you don't want my motion. No problem. I will go for your 27 million. How about that? >> We identified it all ready. >> You were fighting 10 or 11, and now you go up to 27. >> I will offer 7. 18705 million. >> Okay. >> Don't take it personally. >> I am not. You were fighting for less money. I proposed the 25. You went around the table, an now, you pop up with 27. I will go with you. >> Let me tell you why. We were analyzing the budget and found where the money is. We found 2 million dollars. If you want to reduce it, the reduce it. >> But he offered 25 million. [cross talking] >> That's 2 million less than what you are offering. >> We are almost there. It's the same thing. Are you willing to accept his 25 million, the millage rate that will impact us 25 million versus 27? >> He said yes. >> I will do 27. >> No, no, no. He said. He said yes. He said yes to the 25. >> I motion for the-- >> The millage rate that will impact with 25 million. CFO? I am going to get him to say it. What is the millage rate for 25 million? >> 7. 1364. >> I have a motion to set the millage rate at 7. 1634. Do I have a second? >> Second. >> All those in favor, say aye. >> No. cause if we're going to have a bonfire, it should be a live on. We have a 4/5 vote, and that' what we needed. [Applauded] > As amened. >> I went along with this because it was very easy to fin expenditures that added up to 2 million dollars. Now, weave. we take SP1 and SP3. >> What was the final amount? >> 25. e millage rate is 7. 1346 with a 25 million dollars mpact. >> No, no, no. >> Madam Chair. >> I am an old man. I need a recess. >> He is going-- KIW >> That would reduce it for a total budget of $1 billion [unclear] balanced budget. >> Do I have a motion for . P3 as amended? >> I have a motion. Do I have a second? >> Who's making the motion? >> Commissioner Reyes. l in favor? >> Aye. >> Aye. >> Since we have to present the state a balanced budget, by when are you going to have the balanced budget you will send the state with the millage rate and budget we approve? >> We do that immediately. >> Once we certify the vote. >> You will have to show wher you got the money. >> I read that into the recor I read the changes here. >> When are you going to show us the details? >> Our plan always was, commissioner Carollo, to bring another budget amendment that would still be equal to this appropriation but would detail more detailed cut, which we would speak with each of you. >> When will that be? >> Our plan will be by the January meeting. >> Sometime in January. >> I want a meeting with you so we can submit to the rest of the commission what we found, the $27 million that could be cut without hurting the city [unclear.] >> Absolutely. >> Thank you. >> Just so I can put it on record . P 3 as amended. >> For the record, we are adding an amended exhibit for record for the budget. >> Thank you everyone. This meeting is adjourned.