This transcript appears to be from a **White Bear Lake City Council** meeting. Based on the names mentioned in the text and the context of the agenda items (road improvements near North Campus, Level Up Academy, and polling place changes), I have identified the speakers as follows: * **Mayor:** Dan Boettcher (presiding) * **Mr. Copy:** Phonetic for Paul Overgaard (City Engineer) * **Paul Lisowski:** Architect from Wold Architects * **Josh Brad:** Phonetic for Josh Breitbach (Engineer from SEH) * **Miss Crawford:** Lindy Crawford (City Manager) * **Mr. Lindall:** Jason Lindall (Community Development Director) * **Council Members:** Walsh, Edberg, Hughes, and Jones. *** [3:58] **Multiple Speakers (Unidentified):** was is it yours no Finders Keepers doing well good evening you going to try to take mine [Music] [4:28] **Multiple Speakers (Unidentified):** for I do I want this oh and boy if you got that [4:52] **Unidentified Speaker:** wrong business my daughter flew home and then my son came over and my dad flew Florida so we had din three nights Canal conversations about feel like going to explode who you had for dinner never mind dark humor yeah so we had two then we had four and had four and two was [5:22] **Unidentified Speaker:** busy Monday morning at 5 [5:38] **Unidentified Speaker:** well just I've been to S many many many times I've been [5:47] **Mayor:** all right we're going to call call the meeting to order excuse me uh will the clerk please note those in attendance all will be noted please join me in the Pledge of Allegiance I pledge allegiance of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands a nation under God indivisible with liy and justice for all for all the minutes that I'm learning I trust everyone's had a chance to review the minutes from the November 14th council meeting if so I'd entertain a motion to approve the minutes [6:20] **Council Member Walsh:** motion [6:22] **Mayor:** do I have a sec [6:23] **Council Member Jones:** second [6:24] **Mayor:** motion a second all those in favor say I I any oppose motion carries minutes are approved abstain one exstension two [6:34] **Mayor:** sorry two abion two extensions all right item three adoption of the agenda I'm told that uh we've been asked to pull item 4 a resolution approving updated polling places for the 2024 presidential primary election so we'll move that under to 8B and other than that are there any other Corrections amendments to the agenda seeing none I'd entertain a motion to adopt the agenda [7:02] **Council Member:** second [7:03] **Mayor:** motion to Second all those in favor say I I any opposed we have an agenda item four consent agenda I'd entertain a motion to approve the consent agenda as amended [7:14] **Council Member:** move to approve [7:15] **Council Member:** second [7:16] **Mayor:** I have a motion a second all those in favor say I I any opposed motion carries the consent agenda is approved item five visitors and presentations the Whitebear Lake Area Schools North Campus roadway improvements update Mr. Copy. [7:19] **Mr. Copy:** thank you mayor members of the council uh tonight we have um Representatives of the school district and their Consulting team um here tonight to give a an update on some of the roadway improvements that were required under the uh North Campus uh project um they'll run through uh where we're at today obviously it it started back you know four years ago five years ago so have a lot of new uh council members and and whatnot that may not have been in on the initial phases of this so we're getting kind of towards the end of it and we thought it would be appropriate to bring them in to have a uh an update so that council is prepared and can answer any questions before we finalize plans and ask for some uh different approvals early in 2024 so not sure who is going to start I think Paul Lisowski from Wold Architects will uh start the presentation and I give you a bit little bit of background and then uh at the end we'll uh they'll be available for any questions that Council has. [8:35] **Paul Lisowski:** good evening thanks for having us here tonight I'm Paul Lisowski with Wold Architects Engineers um we are um kind of leading the whole project um all of the projects in the district for the referendum um and these are some of the trailing projects are getting towards the end and the goal is to have them the roads operational and redone in time for the the formal opening of the full High School building next year um I did want to kind of just St a little bit of a history of the projects um I know that some of the council wasn't um on the seat um when we started all this but our conversations really started in the the summer of 2019 with the city um as the district Was preparing to go out to referendum for these projects we did begin conversations about the impact of the high school within the um the improvements of the high school within the city and that did identify that there was probably going to be some need to improve roads um in November of 2019 is when the referendum passed and we began formal design in Earnest um that inv also involved uh doing some traffic studies there's been a couple different traffic studies requested by the city performed by the school district that have informed the work that we're presenting tonight um with that there were some preliminary designs um at that point we did have a neighborhood meeting um particularly about 8th Street to talk about some of the improvements that we'll show you tonight there and got input um during that event um and then continued on with the design of the high school and the roads uh in 2021 we came to the city and got approval for the conditional use permit for the high school project and that did include conditions that would ire require the Improvement of the roads so we're just here to fulfill that obligation um during that time um we've had SEH as our consultant to get through all these um uh um Road improvements and their expertise they have worked with the city the county MnDOT the railroad and the various utilities to um work on all these improvements and we are in the sort of last stages We Believe of approvals from those groups um we anticipate um into shortly into the new year we'll get sort of our final approves from those groups too and uh be back here with you to talk about formal approval of the final designs um as Paul mentioned this is kind of a preliminary tonight so we're not set in stone we do have one more um neighborhood meeting planned uh for December 7th at 700 p.m. to get some more input before we finish our designs and again with that information and hopefully some um final approvals from the other agencies we'll be able to come back and talk about actually moving forward with these projects so that's um um kind of the history if there's any questions on that I'd be happy to answer questions about how we got here otherwise we'll have Josh come up and talk a little bit about the actual proposed improvements great thank [Music] you [11:15] **Josh Brad:** thank you Paul good evening I'm Josh Brad with SEH um our firm has been engaged by Wold in the school district to focus on the design of the roadway improvements themselves especially as it relates to the Improv with in the city right away in the state and County right away as well um and so that's what we'd like to present tonight is kind of an update on as Paul said um all the improvements we're going to talk through tonight come as a result of the years of previous discussions with the city and the other agencies the requirements that were part of the conditional use permit and the recommendations of the um various traffic studies that were done and so um starting along Division Avenue um we plan an proposing to add turn Lanes along Division Avenue and widen Division Avenue to the west to create those turn Lanes so that'll widen it in towards the uh school property side there won't be any there isn't any plans to widen or really impact the residents um that are on the west side or correction I'm sorry the residents that are on the east side um with the exception of some ongoing coordination with the art center itself and some potential connections between the two campuses there but as far as the other the other homeowners and residents we don't anticipate any impacts to their property or into the the yards in front of their house so with those turn lanes and the widening the plan would be to have a southbound right turn lane into the northern entrance of the school and then Northbound left turn Lanes into both of the school entrances um this comes from the traffic study and the kind of anticipation that um for southbound traffic that the majority of um users accessing the school from the north will be making that first turn either as a parent into the drop off area student Indigo Park whereas um the anticipation is that for traffic coming from the south as they make that left turn into the site that the majority of students are going to make the first left turn into the student parking area whereas parents will continue up to the second left turn into the um parent drop off area and hence kind of the discrepancy with only having the one southbound turn lane compared to the two Northbound um and then other than that the the other Improvement along Division Avenue is the median separating those two left turn Lanes to potentially provide a crossing for um that potential connection between the school campus and the center of the-art campus and then as well to provide some traffic calming and other safety um for those left turn lanes and for the um traffic traveling through a long division and then um moving south along Eighth Street and I do apologize that this is oriented with North to the right and not up um but along a street as a result of the traffic study and the increase in traffic along here was determined that um given the width of the road and with parking allowed on both sides that there isn't enough room if there's cars parked in both sides to allow traffic through on both sides um as I'm sure um you may be aware and so in discussions with the um from the first open house and with um City staff and previous engagement um The Proposal here would be to widen 8ighth Street to the north moving that North curb line um approximately 2 to 3T North to create a wider Road section that would then allow for through Lanes in both Direction and then a parking Lane on the south side of the road um the plan would then be to in install no parking signs and um prohibit parking on the north side of the road in addition to that widening to the north on the south side behind the existing curb would be a proposed sidewalk running from bloom all the way out to us61 to connect the School site and other um pedestrians in that area out into the downtown area and across 61 where they'll be able to cross at the proposed signal that comes from the result of the recommendations of the traffic study um and the ice reports that were um prepared and approved and then as again um one of the major requirements of the schools condition use permit is that that traffic signal be in place prior to the full opening next fall with that traffic signal the additional improvements at that intersection do include in coordination with the railroad they'll be installing a new Crossing there with improved Crossing panels and then adding in the overhead railroad signals and gate arms as well and then with eth Street The Proposal would be to widen Eighth Street um at that Crossing as well to provide a separated right turn lane and then through left lane for the eastbound traffic to separate those um turning movements into their own Lanes as they cross the railroad and then approach the intersection um in coordination with MnDOT and being out in there right away in that portion of the intersection per their requirements we'll be doing ADA improvements in all four corners of the of the Eighth Street intersection and then as well as we head south of that intersection um we're extending we're proposing extending the median um and reconstructing the median to the South between 7th and eth Street to extend the Northbound left turn lane to provide additional storage capacity in that Northbound left turn lane which would then eliminate the southbound left turn lane at 7th Street and prohibit those left turns but does then allow the opportunity to create a pedestrian refuge in the median at 7th Street to provide additional safety um for pedestrians Crossing at that intersection and then the last thing um to mention along a street as well as a recommendation out of the traffic study um would be to convert the intersection at eth and division which currently has stop signs only on Eighth Street to an all stop with stop stop signs on all four corners um so to give an update um you know as Paul said kind of how we've gotten to here and then you know kind of what our plans or proposal is and then to give an update on kind of the current status of the project we're in in the process of developing two plan sets um to cover the improvements that I just discussed um those two plan sets will split be be split between um one which will show all of the work on us61 and the railroad crossing and the Long Avenue intersection which impacts not only the city property in right away but also MnDOT and County right away and railroad right away and that plan set and that work will require a Cooperative agreement um to be signed and approved by MnDOT the city and the uh School District to cover the um agreement on who's on the school paying for that Improvement UPF front and then the ongoing maintenance agreement between the city and the state um for the ongoing maintenance of the signal and then the second plan set would show the remainder of the improvements which only impact city right of way along 8th Street and Division Avenue where there aren't any other agency involvement so both of these plans were recently submitted to um City staff as well as the county and the state and the railroad um for their review at a what we're calling about a 95% level so they're not finalized yet but we are fairly far along in the process and we do have a lot of the details fleshed out at this point so those reviews are ongoing and then with a result of the comments we get back from that as well as any um feedback that we received tonight and anything that comes out of uh the open house next week that Paul mentioned we then do plan to finalize those plans and make any changes that result from any comments or feedback we get and then um plan to resubmit those for agency approvals um by the end of the year at which point MnDOT will be able to write the Cooperative agreement and then we plan to be back early next year as Paul said seeking approval of the of these two plan sets then um asking for the city to sign the Cooperative agreement our plan from there would be then to go to um bidding in the spring and construct these improvements this summer um after school's out and then be done in August before the new school year would start so that everything is done and buttoned up in time for the full opening for grades 9 through 12 at the school site in 2024 um at this point I'll open it up if you anyone has any questions either for for me on the improvements or from um Paul or the school on um schedule or other items thank you [19:33] **Mayor:** thank you for that update council do we have any questions? [19:38] **Council Member:** Mr Mayor will we have an opportunity to look at these plans to see the actual changes rather than we're just going to move this road half a foot and not park it I mean it's just hard for me to Envision or no [19:54] **Mr. Copy:** um mayor members of the council uh we can definitely make uh plans uh available to council or uh whoever wants to take a look at them um we are uh staff is currently reviewing them so if you'd like to sit down with staff um at any time we can uh definitely do that to uh bring you up to speed on on where this has all gone since uh 2019 when it really started so I'd be happy to do that with any uh Council or that want to do that [20:19] **Council Member:** and only um I heard you say the left hand the left turn lane from 61 on 7th is going to be closed off southbound are there any other turns that will be changed taken away I obviously widening is not a thing but it sounded like you said you're going to take the leftand turn lane away on that street [20:41] **Josh Brad:** correct so um the the the left the southbound left turn lane on us61 would be eliminated and left turns would no longer be permitted at that intersection um there aren't any other locations um in the project where we'd be prohibiting or removing the ability to make a turn it would be just that one location um and with the network and especially with the signal Improvement at 8th Street um the traffic studies show that there are other um options for um drivers to get to their destination into into that area especially with um you know the improvement with of the signal at H stre allowing that turn to be um safer than it is today [21:23] **Council Member:** there are in terms of the neighborhood people use that in order to get to the gas station [21:28] **Mr. Copy:** um mayor M of the council um just one note on the uh traffic study from a uh to funnel the traffic into the north campus uh to lengthen that Northbound left turn um onto 8th Street um um in order to make that function and not direct people down Seventh Street and create confusion in the neighborhood um that's what was needed done needed to be done in order to make that function um or the signal function and and the appropriate traffic um route into the uh North Campus [22:04] **Josh Brad:** if I may add I will email all these out they're hard to read um so I'll email email those out to the city council but I think that median is also helping pedestrian Crossing as well so it's adding another safe space for people to stand [22:18] **Mr. Copy:** yeah and to uh go on that uh that is one of the things even with the uh downtown study um Crossing of Highway 61 um is quite important to the general public so that it does add that additional opportunity to allow safer Crossing at 7th Street as well [22:45] **Council Member Walsh:** well just to follow up council member Hughes's question this is an update we're we're not done correct these there's some decisions that will come to council eventually some of these agreements the the eth street issues we're gonna we're gonna have to vote on those right am I am I not correct in that we'll have a we'll have a we'll have a chance to review this when it's final we after approve approved agreements won't we [23:09] **Mr. Copy:** uh mayor members of the council as uh uh Josh had brought up this is nearing the end of that design uh that coordination with MnDOT and the other agencies um so uh um now would be the time to kind of um wayy opinions or concerns so that things can be [23:31] **Council Member Walsh:** um I don't know that I have I just a process question if we're going to widen 8th Street wouldn't that be something we would normally approve as a city [23:39] **Mr. Copy:** correct so uh staff has been working with them um again we're talking a couple feet in order to allow a full two uh one lane in each Direction a parking Lane at a sidewalk um so those plans will be brought back to council um kind of in that January February time frame for Council to ultimately vote on it [24:00] **Council Member Walsh:** yeah okay that's that's all I'm saying I think we'll have a chance to see these and I don't see any issues I I really appreciate the update it's a lot you guys are doing a lot which is [24:10] **Council Member:** well just to clarify our our our decision-making authorities with regard to that street but we don't really have much to say about what the state of Minnesota decides to do with Highway 61 am I correct in that [24:25] **Mr. Copy:** um mayor members of the council ultimately you know they are a can I put it kind of a they're not driving the improvements so they are looking at it from an overall um does it fit with their design standards um not necessarily um again they're not driving it they're not um um saying hey city of Whitebear Lake we want a signal here it is the school district um project that we ultimate you know Council ultimately approved back you know four or five years ago that is driving that need for that signal um MnDOT is just making sure that um it meets all of their requirements um it meets the railroad is reviewing it to make sure that the crossing meets all of their requirements likewise the intersection at Long Avenue that it meets all of the county requirement so um it's not really that any of the agencies are driving it uh they're just making sure that it meets their requirements [25:31] **Miss Crawford:** thank you I just want to add so if there are significant concerns now would be the time so the various uh agencies their engineering uh staff can go back and analyze things so now would be that time you will approve the agreements but now would be the time for engineering [25:48] **Council Member Edberg:** council member Edberg so just one more clarity on that design issues we deal with now the who pays how do we deal with repairs in the future how do we work together as multiple jurisdictions that's the January February conversation yeah am am I capturing that correctly [26:10] **Mr. Copy:** that's correct so it's like I wouldn't wait until January or February to have conversation or input on how white a street or blah blah blah whatever that happens to be that's what I'm getting out of the the conversation [26:24] **Council Member Edberg:** so um I am curious so um Bloom division 8th 7th off of 61 I'm not I don't have strong feelings one way or the together on those um the construction on 61 when will How long will that last what's the impact on traffic through 61 for anybody who's been driving that lately it's um it's not a onesie TWY uh set of vehicles going down the road um how do we deal with traffic during construction and how long how much um work is going to be required [27:07] **Josh Brad:** certainly so um you within 61 itself oops um you know as I said the main improvements that within 6130 impact traffic while we're um building that median itself um while we do that we will need to close a lane in each Direction on 61 um and that has been discussed with MnDOT and their staff um they share obviously your same concerns about the level of traffic um in in discussions with them and with um the designers with with our team and with Engineers with with MnDOT as well we spent some time brainstorming possibilities of ways to avoid that um unfortunately since 61 especially southbound doesn't have any shoulder um there isn't enough width to provide the required safety protection from the work Zone to the traveling vehicle and maintain two lanes of traffic um so our plan with regards to that is to include requirements and Provisions for the contractor to work as quickly as um is reasonable but um make sure obviously um our goal is certainly we don't want to be out there removing that pavement and closing the lane day one and then not Paving it back until the last day were there um so our plan would be to have Provisions to push the contractor to a reason a reasonable and feasible but not excessive period of time spent on that phase to um keep the um the long-term impact that as short as possible but certainly there will be um probably a 2 to 3 week period where um well that median is being constructed where um a lane will need to be closed in each Direction on 61 [28:46] **Council Member:** so we clearly have had other shutdowns on Highway 61 in the not re not too distant past so we probably can survive two or three weeks [28:55] **Mayor:** Mr Copy this one might be for you as we um improve the leftand turn to going to the East toward the lake does does any of these improvements affect our street plans our requirements for additional upgrades um changing anything that uh especially that might cost us money uh on the east side of 61 that's driven by or related to the stuff going on West of 61 [29:32] **Mr. Copy:** uh mayor members of the council nothing that affects any of our future plans that we could foresee um uh just kind of circling back a little bit from a cost standpoint um as Josh and Paul had mentioned the uh School District the required Improvement so they are funding um everything 100% UPF front uh to construct the improvements that are that were described tonight uh we will have ongoing uh maintenance obviously you know we're accepting a sidewalk we'll have to maintain that longterm uh things like that we will also enter into that be required to enter into a Cooperative agreement with MnDOT for the signal um like any other sign sign that we have you know whether it be at 7th 4th second um other locations where we have um any of the legs of that intersection um in this case we would be uh uh responsible for roughly 50% of the cost of future maintenance and and operations uh replacement you know years down the road uh we would have um some ongoing cost with uh um the future signal but um up front the school district is fronting all those costs [30:29] **Mayor:** and is there any so council member Hughes uh referenced the seven Street connection to the gas station other commercial interests on the east side is there any other impacts that we should be aware of on on the east side affecting access or ESS for businesses [30:46] **Mr. Copy:** um no other access changes or impacts to either the east side or the West Side [30:52] **Mayor:** okay thank you um one second council member Jones council member Hughes did you have a follow question [30:59] **Council Member Hughes:** well no I thank you Mr Mayor if we're talking about the design at this point I guess I'd have to say I I get why you're getting we're getting rid of that left-hand turn line there on sth that doesn't mean I'm not concerned about it I mean people do take that left in order to get to the gas station so if they turn on eight that means they're driving into the neighborhood in order to drive around silver blocks and these are just neighborhood streets um to get to that gas station or they're going on it to fifth which allows what two cars in that left hand turn lane or then into 4 or three driving into the city or frankly we're just hurting the gas station um I just think it's something to note um also if you're driving and you take that e or you take the left there at 8th now you are driving right into the neighborhood there's no lines there's no this is just neighborhood streets whereas seventh is a um you know the that's a double lane wide Road sidewalks on both sides not made for carrying more traffic but designed for more traffic to get in and out of the neighborhood and I just think um that needs to be or that should be considered in terms of how those residents are going to deal now with the impact of what may be increased traffic or it it may not um for people who are again looking to get to downtown and they used to take that seventh which would go right by it goes right into it right you take that left you hit the gas station and then you're right there into downtown um and this is a couple of block or you know it's a block of way through the neighborhood [32:41] **Mr. Copy:** so U mayor members of the council um as uh the uh school districts team had had mentioned there you know the different traffic studies are done um those traffic studies try to the best they can anticipate where people will go we never know you know exactly where every car will go um the anticipation is that most people will actually bypass that a street at least from a uh you know a self bone left uh typically um and Josh can correct me if I'm wrong but or remember incorrectly but you know most people will typically go past it and and enter further down into downtown versus you know using eth as a bypass we will a certain amount of people ultimately figure it out and have it their little shortcut absolutely um just like anything um you know even even on the uh the west side of 61 with the school district traffic to try to anticipate where every student is gonna you know every student's going to figure out his little way to get in it's know this Street's a little busy the time I come into school I'm going to take the next street down I'm going to um those things kind of um um get absorbed into the system um and typically um if there are issues people figure out ways around them and they don't end up to be uh major impacts to any of the areas um but yeah definitely there will be a a slight change in traffic patterns I if you want to comment any further Josh [34:04] **Josh Brad:** sure um no I'll kind of echo you know as you said you know that including you know going into the school it doesn't you know we can't um you know predict where every single you know vehicle go but when you look in the aggregate of you know the trends of you know the average vehicle and you know when you talk about there being 10 or 100 or you know so you know X number of vehicles making this movement per day and how they distribute um you can't necessarily look at any individual one and say well you know Sam's going to do this but when you look at the a you know we can you know relatively well predict that um you know a certain percent of them are going to go this way and a certain percent of them are going to go this way and you know what changes we make will um you know to the road Network and influence that and then obviously you know you know as Paul said everyone will kind of find their own way too as as time moves on and part of that too is you know some of the existing traffic may find you know people that are currently turning in one place may find that with the improvements on a street a Street's a better option for them and so some of that maybe displaced traffic you know is replacing traffic that is itself displacing itself onto the improved road so it all kind of kind of acts as a network um you know together and like I said certainly um you know it's a change but I you know the result of the traffic study is that you know we don't anticipate it creating a major you know gridlock issue or access issue you know within the greater neighborhood or the downtown area [35:28] **Paul Lisowski:** you I just did want to clarify that the the point of the improvements on eth are in fact to get it up to the capacity of seventh so it will be a two lane road both ways with Lanes [35:40] **Mayor:** so just to clarify did the traffic studies suggest that folks that are heading southbound that want to enter around 7th are more likely to go up to 5th rather than e is that what I'm hearing that's you're indicating [35:50] **Josh Brad:** I don't remember off the exact distrib those these spread certainly some of them we would expect to you know continue past you know if they're currently turning on sabath and then continuing sou within downtown they might continue fth whereas Others May turn you know early at e and others may find other roads that were not you know they're not obvious within the small you know segment of the network that we see on screen um you know as far as other options or roads as well [36:08] **Mayor:** okay well offline I'd be curious just for a more definitive answer on that because the council member us this point there's a big difference between a lot more traffic on eth versus a lot more traffic on Fifth which is right by Ace and CVS it's downtown it's a more of a commercial area so we can talk offline but I'd be curious to hear a little bit more about that um council member Jones did you have something [36:40] **Council Member Jones:** uh just a reminder yeah I don't want to see the left turn go away I'd love to be seeing it in there but at the end of the day the Improvement at eth and what it does for the entire area I think we're benefiting greatly at zero cost the downtown is benefiting I mean don't forget that the east border of cook is that's the east border of downtown and that comes right up that connects to the new mcne music center connects to Rudy's r at Red ey it gets it does give a really good connection uh east side of this so we're certainly I think benefiting greatly over losing a left turn lane in my mind but I yeah that's about it thank goodness we didn't have 12 buses an hour adding to this that's a cheap shot that I get to take you want to go there we'll go there second then [37:25] **Mr. Copy:** may if I could just add to um some of council member Jones's comments um it also helps to connect the arts district with the new mcne music center and as he said um Rudy's and and wiper country in but it also connects people to a city- own parking lot um which is just on 8th Street versus seventh that you can't see it on that screen but 7th is already wonky with a couple of medians in there so adding more traffic at 7th um you know I I I don't disagree about the left turn lane I use it too but it does add a little bit more confusion with the existing meetings at 7 so um but just wanted to say that we do have an existing existing City owned parking lot and this will um definitely improve not only District traffic but also traffic for the Arts District [38:11] **Mayor:** final thoughts or comments on this thank you very much for the update appreciate it thank you thanks all right item 6A first reading of an ordinance establishing the 2024 fee schedule Miss Crawford are you taking this [38:22] **Miss Crawford:** I am thank you um mayor members of the council um so tonight we will have a first reading um and a public hearing for the fee schedule so um City staff reviews the fee schedule every single year um and makes proposed adjustments as needed um the fee schedule is then presented to the city council for approval at the end of each year and um adjustments are determined um by each department um and they're determined by um then the amount of staff time and materials necessary to provide services um in addition utility fees um are determined Again by um Personnel costs capital and operating costs um needed to provide those uh those utility services so I will briefly go over um uh what I would say maybe are the more major um uh suggested improvements or adjustments to the fee schedule uh before you have your public hearing if that's okay um okay so when we look at uh business licenses which is on page one of the fee schedule most of our alcohol rated business license fees were last amended about 20 years ago um comparing with similar and other metropolitan cities uh wiper lake is behind in almost all of our business license categories um the purpose of the adjustments uh that is to keep up with the market and increasing staff costs and time to administer these licenses uh the applications as well as to conduct comp conduct compliance checks um to ensure business owners don't feel the burden of the adjustments as this was shared at a work session where we're going to ease into that um over time um but you know we staff acknowledges that we can't just kind of bump up to where we really need to to cover our costs again we're not making money we're covering costs but um so we'll take a gradual approach to that that's that's what I'm proposing ambulance r we are recommending a 3% rate increase to support operations and capital expenditures um when we look at the sports center um the 24 fee schedule includes annual skate Show tickets skate competition birthday parties and pro shop items those um fees were not previously listed in the fee schedule they're not new we have been charging them but they've not been in the fee schedule so they're they look they appear new in the fee schedule but they um they're in fact not changing in in the dollar amount uh for the marina we are recommending a 3% increase to the resident rate as well as a non-resident rate for slips for next year that's on page five um when we talk about sewer utility fees uh the most significant expenditure in the sewer budget is U met council's Wastewater service fee and that service fee uh shows a rate increase of about $92,000 for 2024 so to account for that um we do recommend a 1% rate increase for our sewer Services when we look at water rates and infrastructure fees um the fee schedule recommends an increase to both water consumption rate and the infrastructure fee to ensure that the fund does not operate in a deficit uh the commercial water meter fee increases by 1% to ensure um collections will cover future replacement meter uh replacement costs and surface water management fee the 2024 fee schedule recommends a residential quarterly fee increase to $11 commercial and multif family housing unit uh quarterly fees increase to $10 commercial entities with an actual residential equivalent unit or reu of 1 to 7 um will pay the $10 rate multiplied by their actual reu each quarter and Commercial entities with an actual Ru of greater than seven will pay the $10 rate multiplied by 7even um again that eases into um the the fees that would be associated with uh commercial entities reu if you have uh larger space uh a larger parcel have more um uh impervious uh surface on that space you would be paying you will be paying more um to account for the storm water that is running off of your site um and not collected on site by by perious surface when we look at refuse and recycling um the 24 fee schedule recommends a rate that incorporates the 2024 vendor per unit collection and huling contract fee and a 17% increase to the Tipping fee portion to cover the expenditure increase from the recycling center so again those uh those costs are not borne by the city um they're born by our contract as well as um the recycling center um so those cover the the major um fee increases I can I can discuss any of the fees that are listed here if you uh have any questions but we do recommend um or you will hold a public hearing tonight um and conduct the first reading of the 24 fee schedule uh we will have a second reading the final reading of this ordinance um on December 12th prior to adopting the ordinance and then the fee schedule would go into effect J uh January 1 2024 [44:03] **Mayor:** thank you m Crawford at this time I will open it up to a public hearing for anyone who would like to speak to this issue I will note that no one is on the signup sheet having said that if you want to speak now is your opportunity seeing none it will close the public hearing and bring it back to the council um there was only one thing that really really jumped out of me and that was the fee increase from $100 to $500 for the on andof sale Malt Liquor application and background so my knee-jerk reaction is that's that's insane that's crazy that's five times the amount however upon looking at a little further if it hasn't been raised since January of 20 2004 I look at what is what was the salary of a police officer back in 2004 versus versus what it is now what was the cost of a squad car same with other staff that helps uh administer what that application is so while I still am concerned because that is a huge increase I think the city manager makes a pretty compelling argument that yes costs have gone up whether or not it needs to go to 500 I'm going to assume that the city manager has looked at what other communities are doing and has taken somewhat of an appraisal of what our actual costs are um and not treat it as a profit Center by any means but simply to reimburse us for for what the actual cost is to administer that [45:34] **Miss Crawford:** so mayor I'd like to address that uh that $500 is consistent with the other background checks that we do already perform for other um you know for example adult establishment application and background that is $500 that was from 2017 there are others in here um are edible cannaboid products uh application and background so $500 is consistent with what we are charging with for other licenses [46:11] **Mayor:** so can you explain to me maybe give me a little bit of a precedential perspective with what other cities do so we haven't touched it since 2004 so is it is it reasonable to assume that since 2004 most other cities have incrementally upped it over the years and that's why they're at there so this is effectively a catchup because I think for those listening at home or in the audience are just going to look at it and see a huge increase just a little more commentary on that might be helpful [46:42] **Miss Crawford:** um yes uh mayor uh members of the council um it is common so as I said uh City staff evaluates this ordinance every single year um typically you do see every category updated every I don't know every every year at least every five years um we are significantly behind in that category but um again the $500 is is very standard for what we uh presently charge in all all of our other categories for backgrounds and then I will note you know for example on sale Malt Liquor License was is currently 175 or proposing $200 um you know some are so some are we're talking $25 increases um here but this it by no means Catches Us up to what other communities um pay for or or charge for uh their various uh business licenses it will take several years in order to get to that if we wanted to get to that again this is to cover cost these do not cover cost um as of now but to help businesses we're we would like to I'm recommending that we phase that in [47:45] **Mayor:** okay and these are licenses that we go through every single year well this is our first reading so I think it it'd be we're going to discuss this at the second reading and when we actually approve it but if there are any glaring issues that people have it probably is better to to discuss it a little bit now um so that if we need to make some changes City staff can bring back something that is maybe a little more palatable if that's the route we want to go by the time we get to a second reading so anyone on the council have any thought on this or do want [48:16] **Council Member Edberg:** council member Edberg thank you Mr Mayor I wanted to uh comment on the last set of comments that Miss Crawford uh just made about what is the proper basis for comparison in setting fees and I'm not going to object to what we have in front of us I want to Signal though that particularly with regard to the rental cost of Pioneer Manor we are at a point we're approaching a point where our bonds will be paid off um the economics of maintaining and operating that um uh that um housing uh are about to change now I'm not assuming that just because the bonds are paid off that there are no more expenses okay I'm not making that assumption but I do want to note that um setting rental prices for city-owned housing is and basing it on what the market prices I'm not sure that that's the right yard stick to make and so I want to put a marker down now for a robust conversation a year maybe two years down the road when we are approaching what are those needs what do we need to refinance how do we pay for them over time etc etc etc so I'm just putting a marker down now for when we have that but it ties directly into what our philosophy is on how we set pricing and and so forth I don't have okay I only kind of sort of remember what the prices of malt liquor were back in 2004 and how many cases you had to sell in order to uh pay your city fee and compared to what they are 20 years later that one doesn't really bother me a whole lot but that's just a personal anecdote [50:06] **Miss Crawford:** mayor uh council member Edberg thank you I should have also uh discussed Pioneer Manor the reason that we are looking at that rate increase um of 3% for Pioneer Manor for next year is um all we're very excited that the bond will be paid off that will certainly help us um in to keep keep rents low that isn't looked at as a by market that is looked at by the building needs and we're looking at an elevator several um areas of carpet um replacement and other um other maintenance items so that is what that is driven on [50:41] **Mayor:** any other comments from C Council on this all right we've had our first reading we'll take it up again the second reading item seven unfinished business we have nothing scheduled item 8 a Level Up Academy performance agreement who's taking this [50:57] **Mr. Lindall:** Mr Mayor that would be me uh mayor members mayor members of the council the item before you tonight is a performance agreement with Level Up Academy the recommendation for staff here is to uh adopt the resolution that's included in your packet which would allow the city manager to uh negotiate a final agreement and enter into that agreement with LevelUp Academy um to secure completion of their site improvements and allow issuance of a final certificate of occupancy um really the spirit and intent behind this is uh the applicant began you know was through the de the development review and land use approval process and was issued um U approval of those in the fall of 21 they then in the early uh part of 22 um got a building permit began their project and it is all but completed um they for internal reasons are in need of a final certificate of occupancy and and up to this point because of just a few minor outstanding items um the city has issued a temporary certificate of occupancy and that no longer fits their internal needs so uh we City staff consulted with Level Up Academy and their needs and the City attorney was able to come up with this agreement that just basically puts down on paper the city's expectation to finalize the project and giving them a what we feel is a reasonable six-month extension uh to complete these improvements and still meet their needs of receiving a a final certificate of occupancy staff has worked with the city attorney to uh draft a document that's been provided to representatives of level up um and they are reviewing that but the goal here would be to have them sign off on that agreement execute it by the basically the end of the month um to meet uh their internal needs um the City attorney is here to answer any technical questions we've drafted a document and again that's in the hands of a of the of level up to just offer any comments on at this point um and uh there are a few representatives of level up here if you should have any questions of them and with that we take questions [53:13] **Mayor:** thank you Mr Lindo Council any questions on this [53:18] **Council Member:** move to approve [53:20] **Mayor:** Council I have a motion [53:22] **Council Member:** second [53:24] **Mayor:** I have a motion to Second any further discussion on this [53:27] **Council Member Edberg:** council member Edbert thank you Mr Mayor so I don't have issues with the proposed resolution I'll I'll defer to you mayor if you want if there are other conversations you want to have that's Germaine to the motion I have a related cup conversation about level up so if you prefer now or later I'll let you choose [53:49] **Mayor:** um now it's good go ahead it's relevant [53:53] **Council Member Edberg:** so uh I'm glad that level up is in our community I'm glad that they offer a an educational alternative all good um I'm appreciative that uh rooftop screening is going to be installed um that's been noted to me by other residents that hey and it's coming so that's good the issue that I would raise and seek some comments perhaps from Mr Lindall um is around traffic and parking and the adequacy um so I grew up literally across the street from this location um the uh part lines on Kandy Road East of parents uh seeking to either drop off or pick up children particularly in the afternoon at 3: 3:30 um strikes me as being a a challenge um and it's probably exacerbated by how much parking space has been constructed how much is is there whether there's any plans for anything else can you comment on traffic management particularly at busy times of the school day and its impact on over overall safety and design [55:04] **Mr. Lindall:** um mayor members of the council uh council member Erber thanks for that question um the having had a chance to just do a little bit of research on this before we came into the meeting um and talking with staff that was um part of that review process at the time the record and the best recollection of staff was there were a few comments during the land use review process related to Traffic concerns um but they didn't um bear a significant change in design or that kind of thing at the time um since their project has been ongoing um we have received um one comment um from one um resident in the neighborhood um that notes the same concerns that you have and that concern came basically in the spring time of last year in that time frame um close to the end of school and so School kind of well School stopped during the summer and then in this new year we haven't received any additional um complaints or feedback about traffic in the neighborhood but certainly you raise a question um that we certainly can now monitor more closely um and get some you know real time you know experience and data on um and um see if there's an an issue that needs to be addressed [56:39] **Council Member Edberg:** okay I'd welcome that and um I don't necessarily have a solution it is sporadic it's relatively short during the day but the lines can go quite long up Kandy Road and um that's the ones that I would be most concerned I'm less concerned about once they've made the turn and can clear on the rolling View Drive um uh and what and mostly it's an Ingress as opposed to an egress there there seems to be a traffic pattern that takes them out uh around the the pond and and elsewhere uh so we don't necessarily have them backing up on rolling view coming on to E but that whole process of cars stacking up troubles I won't say it's dangerous necessarily but it troubles me and it's just a highly dense area so whatever uh you can do to Monitor and assess uh that would be welcome [57:37] **Mr. Lindall:** yeah certainly staff with in coordination with um the engineering department and um um the county as a County Road uh we can look at those things and try to coordinate and um take a look at it more closely cool thank you [57:51] **Mayor:** discussion on this if not all those in favor of approving the resolution granting the performance agreement with Level Up Academy say I I any opposed motion carries the resolution is approved item 8B updating the polling places uh for the 2024 presidential primary Miss Crawford [58:19] **Miss Crawford:** thank you um mayor members of the council uh since 2017 all municipalities must designate their polling place locations for up an upcoming election year by December 31 of the previous year so at the August 8th uh regular council meeting uh the city council approved polling places for the March 5 2024 presidential primary election with the anticipated construction of Sunrise Park Middle School and their unavailability to be a polling place for Ward three for the 24 August primary and 24 November presidential election Ramsey County um who administers um our elections for us worked with uh City staff to identify a new polling place for w 3 Parkview United Church of Christ was identified as a new po polling place for for w 3 at that time separately St Steven church Lutheran Church uh previous polling location for w five re-offered uh their building as a pulling place for the 2024 elections to create consistency for voters during the all of the 2024 elections uh Ramsey County and City staff concluded it would be the best it would be in our best interest to amend the 2024 uh March presidential primary polling place um to designate Parkview United Church of Christ and St Steven Lutheran Church as the polling places for w three and five so to create less confusion for um all three of the elections uh for w 3 and Ward five next year so this scenario keeps polling places the same as I just said for all 24 elections um recent changes to polling places have been due to the new um March presidential primary school building construction and accommodation of when uh school students are um are in class so you'll see um in the resolution um updated uh polling places for the 2024 presidential primary um scheduled for Tuesday March 5th for the 2024 August primary election and November presidential election it is the intent of uh City staff to maintain those same polling places again as I just said um formal action on that designation will take place after the March 24 um uh March 24 presidential primary so um and we do have a you know kind of an informal Communications plan to get this out to to our residents which includes updating our various websites so City website County and then find your polling place um hopefully the newspaper can run something as they usually do we've already um put this in our newsletter we'll do that again um again and social media and then the county um will send post cards to to voters as well so with that I can stand for any questions thank you [1:01:03] **Mayor:** thank you Mr Council any comments or questions on this [1:01:07] **Council Member Walsh:** council member Walsh well thank you Mr May I'm the one that asked to remove this from the consent agenda and really just as a way to further communicate this is a touchy thing and it makes me nervous when we change polling locations because people get set on where to vote and then they are disappointed when they go there and it's not where you vote and confusion ensues and maybe they don't vote which is not what we want to have happen so um I'm I like the communications plan that the the manager laid out um and so I just thought with one more touch would be to talk about it here in this meeting and just and I I'll also like the idea that it's in 2024 if you live in W 3 or live in W five or any of the wards you're going to vote in the same place all three chances you have to vote you know the this March primary and the primary and the general so uh once once we get that down we're going to stick to it so that's that's why I wanted to do it so thank you for doing that [1:02:04] **Mayor:** very good Council any other [1:02:07] **Council Member Edberg:** council member Edberg thank you Mr Mayor so I'm looking at w four and the primaries both are going to be at a are not going to be at um Orchard Lane um is the general election going to be in Orchard forward 4 where it has always been [1:02:24] **Mayor:** do you want to speak [1:02:26] **Miss Crawford:** mayor and members of the council um so with the construction of the school district um and with school being in session in March we I'm I'm sorry let me back up we have had some Churches step up and offer their location as polling places and we believe and this is Ramsey County election staff and the city working together that they would be able to provide more consistent polling place location for some of these so when there's changes with the school year calendar construction that it would um cause less confusion the area Learning Center I don't believe could have they could not have been a polling location in March um so then we would have had to change them again in August and November so the purpose of this is to Redeemer Lutheran Church has stepped up to say that they can be polling place for all three elections so to not cause confusion we opted to have all three of those elections at Redeemer Lutheran Church than to have it first at Redeemer and then change to ALC [1:03:45] **Council Member Edberg:** and so is that likely to uh reverse itself once the uh School District's construction project we've been voting War for has been voting at at Orchard Lane for a long long time uh decades is that being changed now on a permanent basis or just to reflect the temporary nature of construction [1:04:14] **Miss Crawford:** uh the intention would be to the proposed locations for 2024 uh we intend to keep it going that way as to not switch back and forth um Ramsey County election staff have worked diligently communicating with these um sites to ensure that they can provide a polling place consistently for City elections because they too don't want to have to switch back and forth [1:04:41] **Council Member Edberg:** this is a u another part of the communications plan that would be a whole lot of news to folks in the fourth ward [1:04:47] **Miss Crawford:** I mayor council member Edberg um so postcards go will go out to all residents as they usually do we will continue to do all of that um all the notifications that we always do for every single election um as well as this was already in in one of our newsletters um so we will continue to do that and as I shared the city must uh designate polling locations every single year so um if if voters find it you know unsatisfying we can certainly work with Ramsey County to find other Solutions as well [1:05:31] **Council Member Jones:** council member Jones I'm going to throw my two cents in I can see Mr Ed BG's concern W 3 is moving right along with you but I'd like to see it more permanent I'd like to see it taken out of Sunrise um I don't think you'll ever hear anybody from the school district level complain about polling location being at Sunrise but the teachers do they don't like it it they feel the that it is unsafe not because of the people going in to vote the school is more open to PE strangers coming into that building that are not identified and I know there was a lot of concern over the last that I've had uh talks and and sunrise has done their best to limit that um connectivity to the rest of the building but that shuts down their building that shuts down a big chunk of it and if you've got a church that is willing to step up and do that now again vetted by the county and they do it every year i i would support seeing a location change out of at least Sunrise um I don't know how the other schools feel that are uh I don't know how the ls School feels but I would support moving that I think it's a good trial for at least war three thank you Mr Mayor [1:06:46] **Mayor:** thank you any further comments on this if not I'd entertain a motion to approve the resolution [1:06:54] **Council Member:** I so moved [1:06:55] **Council Member:** second [1:06:56] **Mayor:** motion to Second any further discussion on this seeing none all those in favor say I I any opposed motion carries the resolution is passed item N9 discussion we have nothing scheduled item 10 communication from the city manager Miss Crawford anything tonight [1:07:23] **Miss Crawford:** yes just a couple of slides I have a couple of events and meetings um to share with you maybe I don't have the memorized [1:07:31] **Mayor:** we need one of do we need do we need one of the high school kids to come up the high school kids can come up and help us I'm sure so much better at they're so much better at technology than we are tell us your password what's your password [1:08:02] **Council Member:** go Bear's exclamation point wa way that's right wa way [1:08:11] **Miss Crawford:** um that's okay we from what I well maybe I can find them on my phone here shoot so tomorrow evening is the downtown uh mobility and parking study steering committee meeting here at uh City Hall um at 6:30 p.m. Thursday we have a ribbon cutting for good things Cafe um uh they recently um moved into the previous Grandma's site so that is at 3:30 p.m. on Thursday and um I'm going to keep going with what I know for right now so uh zoning code update um meeting so now we're talking about city meetings um zoning code update meeting is December 5th at 6:30 p.m. at Boatworks Commons that is a community advisory committee meeting um the mayor and uh several city council members will receive a tour of the water treatment plant Wednesday December 6th at 6 p.m. we will have our truth and Taxation hearing and our 2024 budget presentation Tuesday December 12th at 700 p.m. right here at City Hall and then as I said uh ribbon cutting for good things um th this Thursday the greater White Bear Lake Community foundations share the Joy event is Thursday November 30th at 5:00 p.m. the chamber numbers um roaring 100th Gala celebration is Thursday December 7th at 5:30 p.m. um RSVP is required for that um I think council member angster is going to come with staff so thank you and then Winterfest um is downtown on Saturday December 9th from 11:00 a.m. to 300 p.m. so that's what I have [1:10:04] **Council Member Jones:** council member Jones or something no I'm not ready I'd like to add something after that I was just going to comment I don't know why you couldn't memorize all that call so off topic a little bit but because of our truth and Taxation our next meeting my last meeting yeah um the city staff put together a really great video and I just wanted to say thank you for doing that and hopefully people are seeing it hopefully it's out there um but little corny yeah no Academy Awards going out any acting but man it's outside that it's a really good video and I think it really does State very well what uh kind of the whole process in two minutes so that's not easy to do so good job [1:10:50] **Miss Crawford:** thank you thank you Mr Mayor [1:10:53] **Mayor:** and where can folks find that M Crawford is that on YouTube [1:10:56] **Miss Crawford:** what uh folks can find that on YouTube on the city's Facebook page and on the city's website and of course if people have questions about um their the budget or taxes or how to maybe interpret their um property valuation um notice we're happy to help um anyone who wants to to come in and talk with finance department or myself [1:11:18] **Mayor:** very good thank you any questions or comments from M Crawford all right so very briefly before we adjourn to the high school students that are out there you guys won the you guys won the city council meeting lottery tonight because the group that was here last meeting stayed here until 9:50 and we're just about done so good job picking this meeting I'll give you guys the same shiel 20 years ago sat right where you are when I was in Mr. Mum's class I know other teachers have extended this this uh project uh to their classes as well so I hope you got something out of this I hope you learned a little bit about local government it is very important to your everyday lives it's all the little behind the scen things like the water and sewer and streets that are often thankless jobs but it's incredibly important so I hope you use this as a catalyst to stay involved in local government through uh as you as you get older and maybe one day you'll be sitting up here if you so choose so thank you thank you for being here tonight we appreciate it and with that I will entertain a motion to adjourn [1:12:12] **Council Member:** I have a second [1:12:14] **Mayor:** all those in favor say I I we're ajour thank you