I just show the debt all collective in one for easier which makes sense. All right. Thank you. Let's start the July 1st workshop. Uh, roll call, please. Council member Nordby is absent. Council member Woods here. Council member McKenzie here. Council member Schwar is absent. Mayor Muggy here. Thank you. I get a motion to adopt the agenda, please. I'll make a motion. So move. Council member McKenzie. Second. Second. Woods. All those in favor say I. I. Thank you much. Topics. Thank you, Mayor. We got uh one topic on the agenda for this evening, which will be our first kickoff 2026 budget meeting. Uh just comprehensive look. We've taken the time to meet with all the departments now. Um, and I think at first glance and first look, we're trying to keep the levy around six. Um, which right now we are. Um, I will turn it over to finance director Dan Winnick to discuss details. Mayor, council members. So, here we are tonight. We get to start off looking at the 2026 budget. Um, you've got more information today than you've had in the past years. um you have a whole comprehensive look at everything where we're at with each and every one of the budgets that we approve. So you're going to see the general fund, HRA, EDA, uh in your packet. You get to see all our enterprise internal service funds and special revenue funds. So you get to see absolutely everything um where we stand today. As you can remember that uh um we had a a goal that was set by our city manager um Brian Frandle that we were going to be shooting for a 6% levy increase and to hold our utility rates um the same. Um so what you're going to see tonight accomplish is that um kind of walk through how we got there. Um it wasn't easy. Um, and there's a big reason why it wasn't easy and and we'll get to that when we start talking about the CIP, which you do have the 2026 20 to 202035 um CIP part of this package, too. So, you're seeing absolutely everything in the package today. I have a PowerPoint that kind of summarizes things at a higher level. Um, but uh our CIP is what drives um so much of it. Um in the past years we've really um done an excellent job um as far as planning um identifying needs that the city has um from streets to facilities to parks and so forth. Uh when we look at that um right there to fund what we're going to see in the CIP, that's a 6% levy increase right there. um that's not talking about all of the, you know, cost of living in union contracts or if you start adding um staff or uh operational increases. Um so for us to come in at a 6% right now taking into all those factors is is quite an accomplishment. Um that really goes to the leadership. Um we're not going to give the city council credit because you haven't seen it yet. Um, it really goes to Brian Frannle for his leadership. Um, and all of our department heads. Um, because they they put together their budgets. Um, and they all had to meet with Brian and Brian drilled them on just about every single line item. Um, wanted to know what it was for, what it is, can you live lower, da da da, all the way through it. Um, so it was quite an extensive process with all of our department heads. as a result. That's what we're going to show you tonight. So, tonight we're we're going to just take a quick look at the budgets that the city council approves. We're going to take a look at where we're at for the proposed levy uh for 26, the general fund, heda, enterprise funds, internal service funds, other budgets, which are really our special revenue. Take a quick look at the 26 to 35 CIP, and then discussion. If there's questions that come along the way, please don't wait till the end. Jump in, ask questions so we have clarification. There's a lot of information um that we're going to be going through. So, the budgets that um are approved, there's um the general fund um and that's really the primary governmental fund used to account for all financial resources um except those that are required to be accounted for in another fund. Um and a question came up earlier. That's where debt is required to be in a different fund um to be by itself. Um HA um EDA proprietary funds are enterprise funds and other permanent funds that we budget. Um our enterprise funds consist of the water, wastewater, electric, surface water, solid waste and fiber optic. Um and our internal service funds are information technology, insurance, equipment, city mechanic, and the building maintenance funds. Um other budgets that we have are the community center fund, which is a separate fund, uh community event fund, fire relief fund, park fund, um street maintenance fund, and asset preservation fund. You'll see those last three funds, park, street maintenance, and asset preservation. they all have a levy component. Um, and that's again, it's a part of being able to have a dedicated levy to be able to afford our CIP, our our uh capital improvement plan. Um, and so it's going in for parks, goes into the parks, fund street, that's what's helping us pay the pavement preservation and also um street recon reconstruction. Um, we do a a 10-year um look at that. and then the asset preservation fund which is really for our facilities. So, like I said, our city manager set a goal. It was a lofty goal for us to hit a 6% levy increase. Um, and no utility rate increases. Good news. What I'm showing you tonight achieves that. Um, so I kind of want to take you into the middle part there where it says levy components. Um, so I I look at that there's five components that are a part of our levy. There's the general fund and that's really funding all of the departments that are within the general fund. So you're going to see fire police finance administration community development. Um, you won't see the enterprises in in there. They're all separate. So when you see water, waste water and those those are a separate fund. This is where our levy is at. If you look across for what it was in 25 to 26, it is only increasing $28,000 or about a half a percent. You have to take into consideration that there was a cost of living of 4% per the union contracts from 25 to 26. In addition, there can be step increases and so forth and we still ma were able to get it to a five um a half a percent. Street maintenance, that's that's the amount it plays off. If you remember when we built a 10-year capital plan, street maintenance and debt work the same or work together, I should say. Um what our plan was was that when we instituted it 3 years ago, we we had a debt of about debt payments of about a total of about 1.4 million. The concept was to keep that steady at 1.4 million and start to dedicate a levy amount to the streets. Um last year it was 3.5%. If debt goes up, which we did an issuance, then the amount that goes to street maintenance goes down, but over a 10-year look, we were able to afford everything that was in our street plan. Parks gets a dedicated amount. Um, I think they were at about a 0.55% levy. Um, and then asset preservation. If you remember last year after we got more of a comprehensive look, especially when we got the facility assessment done and looking at our needs that were in there, we ended up having to bump that up um to 2% which resulted in the $142,000. So, if you look, our city portion of our levy um is going up $466,000 or an increase from last year of 6%. Again, if you take all those other levies out of there, you know, we would have only had a half a percent increase. H and EDA right now, we're leaving them the same as we had. So if we take all three of those components together up on the top, we'll see that we're at a aggregate of a 5.84% levy increase yearover-year. Not bad. Um I will be presenting I think in September I will um present the EDA to their budget to hear if there's any comments or questions that they have. Um and um HR we've kind of left um flat. Um and part of that reason is um right now what we're doing in the HA is is a very good program. The student build housing um we have ample cash in, you know, available in that fund to be able to fund it. And then we're ending up selling it. We pretty much have been at a break even point. So we're not depleting that fund. Um, so there really isn't a need to increase levy dollars for that. Um, EDA so far, at least in the past three years, has not used all of its levy, so it's accumulated a little bit more. That may change a little bit moving into the future because um you know as some of your members I know the mayor you you sit on the um EDA um that you've started a new um facade improvement program that may drop it a little bit depending on um how many um participants um put in applications um and get approvals for for utilization of the facade improvement plan. Right now I think we're pretty good. something that we'll probably end up having to look at in years to come, especially when there's additional programs that that come up. But right now, we're sitting at a pretty good position as far as where our goal was set. Doesn't mean that city council's in agreement with that. That's for you to decide. um to achieve that 6% like I said um we had to make some some changes and and again it's been um our city managers and my approach in these budgets to be full disclosure to tell you how we accomplished um something and so how did we do that? If you remember last year, we transferred um the city council uh approved to transfer penalty um amounts u from the electric fund to the general fund. Um we're continuing that. Again, that's you know contingent upon city council agreeing with that. But for us to get to that 6% we had to transfer that. So, we have a transfer in of an additional $131,000. The Emerald Ashbore program, um, right now the plan is that there's about, I think, three after this there's about three years of funding that's available. We've been funding that out of levy dollars, out of the general fund. It will go away someday. Um, and then you would realize that savings or drop in your levy. We're taking that now. Um, and then the next three years will be funded from the asset preservation fund itself. And then we started last year reducing some of our enterprise funds, the transfers from water, wastewater, and surface water. It amounted to just under $65,000. We're reinstating that. Again, any of these components can can be changed by city council, but just kind of showing you how we ended up getting to where we're at. Those three um amounts total $287,000 or reduced our levy 3.7%. That's how we ended up making us to get down to that 6%. Um and roughly when you're going to see some of the breakdowns um you know especially when you look at general fund you look at personnel costs that 3.7 is pretty much what the which what the personnel costs um increased again um there was a 4% uh cost of living and then their step increases that um so we'll go to the next um slide here and it really kind of depicts what the city levy changes for 2026 are and that's where you're going Tennessee total personnel costs in increased approximately $300,000 or 3.84. Again, pretty close to that 3.7 that we ended up having to cut um on the previous slide. If you look at our supplies, contractual services and capital, we've actually had a decrease of $337,000. A lot of that um is is really from the community development side and both on a revenue side and on an expenditure side for inspections. Um if you remember um I think uh Brian last year was our first year with with a new contractor um Rum River. Um so we switched over and at that point in time we switched our rate structure. Um it used to be more based on value of a project. It went to more of a flat project fee. So you know most you know like a roof uh roof now costs permitting is 125. You add in some of the others it comes to 146. Each and every single roof is is the same. It saves residents when they're doing um projects. um they're not having a big bill um or a permit fee um based upon the the roof project or the value of the roof project, but what that does is it reduced our income. Um but it also reduces our expenditures. Um and so we're adjusting that down. Again, things could change. If you remember back three years ago when we ended up having a a a pretty sizable hail storm. Um all of a sudden permitting went way way up. U so what I do is based upon the contract I use a percentage of revenue and expenditures. Um, and we do make some money off of off of having that to cover a lot of our operational costs of our of our um community development staff that um handles all of those transfers. Um there's a $20,000 um reduction. Last year we had a $20,000 transfer from general fund that went to uh the uh community center. I don't have that in there right now. I don't know what the decision is on the community center, but we will see later on that the community center will need a transfer. Um, the community center is not a levy fund at this point in time. It is its own enterprise or not enterprise uh proprietary fund. Um the concept behind it was that um you would generate revenues from um activities happening in the community center community center that would then offset the expenses. So there is not a levy component except for this 20,000 which I we've removed this year. Again that's something that we'll end up having to discuss how we're going to handle that down in into the future. And then all other revenues there's a reduction of approximately 87,000. And again, the biggest component of that revenue reduction is is what I had explained as far as um permitting um fees and revenue. So the general fund again has a levy increase of 28,000 or just under 4%. Not bad. And then you can see where the infrastructure that's really where it's it's driving things. Um the street levy increased to 7% parks. six um and asset preservation 1.83 from from last year. Um debt increase 2.5. That's where that new debt issuance that we just um issued in the spring. Um the impact that that has. And then um so if you added those up comes to 437,000 or 5.63%, you add those two together and that's where you get the 6%. So you get to see the full break breakout at a very high level but from a categorical standpoint as far as levy is concerned. This kind of gives you an idea of what debt we have that gets paid out of the general fund. Um and there's a a 2014A which we refunded and refinanced in 2021. There's a 2016 two components um of that. one of them um the abatement part to it actually gets paid out of uh the park fund um because we give some of our LGA money to them and then and in tune they utilize that to pay their debt payment for their portion of of Casey Lake. There's 2017, 2018, 2020, 2022 and then the newest one 2025. And so that's really where the increases ca come to our debt service went up 194,000 185,000 of that is due to the new bond issuance. So when we take a quick snapshot look at our proposed general fund budget and we look at it by revenue by category I think I think you can see something very striking and that is there's a big green portion that's over half and that's property taxes. That's the burden that we're putting on our our residents here through the property tax system and it amounts to just under 57%. Another big portion that you're going to see is over to the left hand side. It's gray. It's intergovernmental and you see it's at 2.1. We collectively get a little over $1.6 million for local government aid. Um we break it up in three components. Um a little bit of it goes to the park fund for that Casey Lake. A little bit of it goes to um I think our streets, but the majority of it is in our general fund. It's important to keep about keep an eye on that local government aid from the standpoint that number of years ago there was a lot of talk that local government aid was going to be dwindled down and then it all that talk stopped. Um this past legislation there actually was talk again to reduce local government aid. um and that can have a great impact. Um it didn't happen this year, but we have to remember and and had kind of shared a little bit with you that um you know the projections the last projections that I've seen on budget deficit for the bianium for the state of Minnesota for 2028 to 29 was like a $6 billion budget deficit. So in this legislation, they were trying to make some cuts in certain areas to kind of get themselves ready for for the 2829, which is going to be a tough one. So if projections, and they do change all the time, but if if they were to come out to that, you more than likely will see coming up a reduction in local government aid. Now, that's going to have a direct impact on us um because we're going to lose something. And just kind of like a for a magnitude type of piece, if we were to lose 10% of our local government aid, that's $160,000. There's over 2% levy increase just to make up that revenue component to it. If we lost more, we would lose more. But we also have a tenant in one of our facilities, and that's the Ramsey County Library. Ramsey County gets, I think, well over $20 million of local government aid. If we get cut, they're going to get cut. Um, and so they're and and normally on at the county level, um, they lose the funding. They don't lose the mandates. And so they end up having to find some other ways to make those up. Um, part of it can be a pro a property tax levy, some of it's cutting different services. Um, had heard, um, actually today, and I haven't had an opportunity to look at it, um, in our department head meeting, it sounded like there possibly could already be like a freeze that Ramsey County has put on, kind of a hiring freeze. Um, so, you know, things are real. um you know and it can be reductions not just at the state level for the county it can also be at the federal level. So we need to be kind of aware of that but what you can see on our revenue side is that we have a heavy heavy dependence on property taxes and intergovernmental you know to the tune of uh you know what is that uh 78 79% that's huge. So we need to be aware of that. When we look at categories for our expenditures, you're going to see the biggest component and I don't think it's any surprise in our general fund is personnel and that makes up 69%. general fund. When we're looking at our our budget, um again, from year over year, both revenues and expenditures decreased 58 um,000. Um again, you're going to see on our expenditures side, well, you'll see up in the revenue side, you'll see where that permitting went down $182,000. That's again that's the the the change in in looking at um our permitting you know rum river and component and looking at it um from what we've done in the past. So actually what I'm proposing is what we've got actual for 2024 um again it could go up could go down um but then so will the expenditure side to it. So we're playing a conservative approach of of looking at our our permitting. If you look down below, you're going to see that personnel costs go up and it's, you know, rounded to just no decimals. It's 4%. It was, remember, it was about 3.8. Um, but all of our other categories, we've decreased. If we look at it by department, which is another good way of looking at things, you're going to see that um two of our uh departments that take up a significant amount of our general fund funding um is the police and fire and code enforcement. So, our public safety um when we look at that, police is at 47%. Um we have fire and code just under 16%. you add them together at 63% of our general fund is for public safety. Again, this just shows what the graph shows, but you get to see all of the numbers. Um and you'll see that um pretty much across the board um you know uh there was decreases from inspections, street maintenance, urban forestry, general parks. Um you're seeing a lot of decreases on our expenditure side to it to be able to to make this budget. And again, a lot of credit goes to the department heads. Um this is really the second year that they've been requested to really tighten their belts. Um, and I think that they've responded very well. HA and EDA again kind of simply that we've leaving the HRA the same. We're leaving the EDA the same. Um, kind of gives a little description and I know you all know uh kind of what what they're you know the purposes of those two um levies are for and and so forth. Enterprise funds gonna kind of give you a walkth through high level of everything. So water fund uh revenues of a little over two million. There's a decrease again a conservative approach. Looking at last year um we had a real big reduction in our revenue on water um just because of the usage. Um and so we've adjusted that uh downwards. Again, if we have a nice hot hot summer and people are utilizing more water for their lawns and so forth, um our revenue could go up higher than that. Um but that's where we're at right now from our projection. Um the budget um increases 595,000. Um but 538,000 of that is is due to capital. It's what's in the capital improvement plan. That's why I've kind of been saying year after year after year that that capital improvement plan is what really drives our budgets. And you can see it that there's a 6% commitment um to be able to fund that on a levy component to it. But it also impacts other funds because there's equipment that needs to be replaced. Um over overall revenue and expenditures, we should still see a fund balance increase of about $100,000 in the water fund. Wastewater fund. Um revenues pretty much stayed the same. Um we're at about 2.6 $2.7 million. Um our budgets at 3.1. We're seeing an increase of 992. Don't get alarmed. 853,000 of that is again capital. Again, it's you'll find that same number in the capital improvement plan. If you look at the report that says um you know, funding sources um you'll see those tied up those tie out. Um and so they would see a decrease in their fund balance which um you know was all part of our plan. Um electric fund we're seeing again last year we we had you know a decrease in our revenue. Um and so we've made our adjustment um on our revenue side to it. So it's uh about 11.7 million revenue um decrease about 243 from what we had budgeted in 2025. Um the budget amount is 11.5 million. That's a decrease of 682,000. A lot of that um uh it'll show $560,000 reduction is just from the contractual service. So we we pay a lot to MMUA um as for usage. So but so if the revenue goes up, the expenditure will go up, but we still make a profit off of off of those. So they kind of tie together. Um and so we reduce the revenue, we reduce the expenditure on the side to it, too. Um still shows that the fund balance will increase almost $200,000. surface water. Um virtually the same revenue as we had in 2025. Um the budget's increasing again um of that $356,000 increase, 246,000 again is due to capital um increase. Um and then there's uh some increase again you'll see in debt because remember we're we're we increased our debt um for the street project. solid waste. Um we're pretty much again revenues pretty much stayed constant. Um the budget's increasing 103,000. Um you're seeing the the bulk of that increase is in contractual services. Um, and that's really, uh, a number of years ago, um, about three years ago, there was about $650,000 that was in the fund balance of solid waste. There's not a lot of capital that's spent um on the solid waste really just for garbage cans, recycling cans, and so forth. And so the decision was not to increase that rate um that we're charging our our customers and trying to draw down that fund balance. We will be going out um for an RFP. Um if you remember about a year ago, we brought an amendment that we exercised with our current vendor for two more years. We'll end up having to go out for an RFP this next time. um maybe the same vendor, maybe a different vendor, but at that point in time, we would look at um adjusting the rate um at, you know, at that point after we get all the you know, proposals, bids in from from contractors. So, this will show the way it's it's budgeted that there's almost a $200,000 decrease. And again, that's part of that plan of drawing down that fund balance in our solid waste. And then fiber optics. Um what we're seeing in fiber optics is our revenues decreasing almost 29 thou and and the mayor is already on the edge of his seat. Um is decreasing almost $29,000 and that's due to the libraries have made the decision to get off of our fiber. Um our budget is a slight increase and that's and and that may be even adjusted moving forward here. Um, and that's what we pay um, for fiber maintenance. We have there's a contract with with Zo for that. Um, and and I believe it'll be could be even higher than that. Um, Brian and I will be looking at that. Um, so it shows an increase of $74,000, but if you recall, we got a $2 million negative fund balance. Um, so with a $29,000 reduction in our revenue side to it, I think we pretty much have guaranteed ourselves we'll never pay off that $2 million that negative. So at some point in the future um you will have to find money somewhere else um to make that fund hold because you can't have a negative balance forever. Um so that's kind of where we're at with that. Mayor, don't say anything. Our internal service funds, we have the information technology. Um, our revenues, so in in internal service funds. Um, so the kind of the difference between an enterprise fund and internal service fund, revenues from enterprise funds come from outside sources. Revenues from internal service funds funds come from within. So, in other words, these five internal service funds, we charge out to all of our different departments, enterprise funds, and so forth. Um, we've left the revenues the same, so we haven't changed what we're charging um our departments. Um, the budget has increased about $47,000, and I know the mayor is going to love this one, too. Um, a component, there's two components. one. Um, guess what increased again this year? Metro Inet. Oh yes. What? Metro Inet. Metro Inet. Uh, it our it up to $390,000 is what they're proposing for for the 2026 budget. Um, as a reminder, when I came here, it was about $221,000. and and this month a little bit later this month I'll have been here for four years. So that's quite the increase um component to it. The other part to it um that's increase in there and you'll um hear about that later tonight at city council is um for uh an HR payroll um payroll services um system. So we had to increase um the the budget for that um to be able to cover that contract. Um what does it do in in the information services? It decreases the fund balance 64,000. At the end of last year, we were at 280. So if you take the 25 budget, 26 budget, that's 81,000. We have enough in our fund balance to cover the two years. insurance um revenues uh increased a whopping $4 and uh our budget um increased a whopping $4. Uh so basically there's no no change in the fund balance where we're at. At the end of 2024 we had $198,000 just under $200,000 in our budget or in our fund balance both 20 this current year budget and 26. Um I have no changes on the fund balance. Um the equipment fund um and this is where where all of uh you know anything that's in the general fund all of their equipment and everything gets paid out of this this fund. revenues are the same. Um the budget of $62,000 comes from our capital improvement plan. Uh our equipment replacement schedules. Uh it would decrease our fund balance $64,000. The fund balance as the end of last year was $3.4 million, but there's a footnote with that 3.4. Um is it No, no, we're actually at the 3.4 million. There's a footnote on something else. Um so we're at 3.4, before, but you're going to see later on that everything that we have in that capital improvement plan, we'll go through that and we're also going to have to start increasing our allocations to our departments by about 5% a year. And so we'll talk about that a little bit later when we get into the CIP. City mechanic fund revenues and budget are the same as 2025. Um and we have a fund balance about, you know $52,000. Building maintenance, um the revenues are the same. Um budgets increased just a slight amount. Um it increases our fund balance about $70,000. Our fund balance at the end of last year um was about $28,000. other budgets that we have um community uh community center fund. This is where we kind of talked to a little bit before right now projecting no revenues. Um we will need about an $85,000 transfer from somewhere. That'll be something that we'll end up having to discuss and and um and talk about u moving forward, but there's still a lot of decisions that need to be made on the community center. Um, that's with a budget of about $97,000, the same as we have in 2025. So, we had some about $90,000 left in 2024. You can see that, you know, if you add up the the minus77, the minus 97, that's where that $85,000 is going to need to come from. So, we're we right now it's not funded. We wouldn't be able to do this. We have to transfer something from somewhere. Um community event fund revenues are the same. Um the budget um has increased a little bit. It's a decrease of fund balance about 15,000. We've got about 59,000 in our fund balance at the end of the the year. So we're we're okay where we're at right there. Fire relief is basically a a transfer in and out. We get revenue from uh the state of Minnesota um as in the form of fire aid. um and we have to give that money out to the fire relief association. So, it's pretty much just a neutral um budget, but it has to be um captured in its own fund. And then we have the park fund. Um we got uh we're estimating revenues of about 332,000. That's an increase of 46,658. That's the levy component. That's we we have a a levy um that we do for our park system. Um the budget's at uh $748,000. Um 681,000 of it comes from our capital improvement plan. Um there's also that you see that $65,000 transfer. That's what I was referring to as their portion of the Casey Lake bond debt that we that they pay for. Um fund balance decrease of about 415,000. They had 704,000 at the end of last year. street maintenance fund. Um we get revenues of just under 1.6 million. Uh that's an increase of about $533,000 from 2025. Um and uh you know a large part of that what you're going to see is is really coming from um we got two different components. we're going to start to receive our well the biggest component is is that we're going to start to actually get money from the MSAS program. Um if you recall when the city made the decision to um build the Sentinel building and they did the roads on right there by McNight and 7th Street um we borrowed about $2.6 $6 million. And so we've been repaying that. Um and so this year we'll have full repayment of that and we get approximately about $460,000 on an annual basis in return. Pardon? Return in return for that 460 on a return basis or is that that's what that's about what our annual right now has been but we just haven't actually received it because we took that loan out. So, it's been re removing or lowering that that debt, that loan. And so, it'll be paid off this year. So, we'll receive it um this um in 2026. And then the capital is is what's coming out of the the again the capital improvement plan. Um so, this will show a decrease in the fund balance of 1.1. Um we had or decrease in the fund balance of 1.1 million. We had 34 million at the end of last year. There is a change that needs to be done here and you're going to see the next fund, the asset preservation fund that um we do need to um again it requires city council approval. If you remember the ARPA funds, the $1.3 million funds that we received and last year, city council um approved the use of it for public safety. Um, and so we had parked that money in here in street maintenance. It really needs to go over to the asset preservation to be able to fund that. This street plan, this street maintenance plan, we take it wasn't earmarked with that. It'll be okay for the 10 years as long as we keep levying approximately 3 and a.5%. um we'll be able to fund our street maintenance program, but the asset preservation will not be able to fund all of the needs unless that transfer takes place. That'll be something that'll be brought as a separate item to the city council for approval later on. We just, if you remember, we we parked it in um street maintenance at that point in time with a decision to be made later on um by city council. So just for your awareness and then you'll see in the um the asset preservation um and and you can see clearly why it's got a fund balance of 1.7 million and what's been approved in 25 and what's in the CIP for 26 you know totals almost $3 million. So, needs a little help and that's where that 1.3 million um will need to come from the street maintenance component to it. So, I'm going to stop right there. There's a lot of information, a lot that's all of your budgets that you approve at a very high level and just kind of, you know, any questions and thoughts of where we're at right now. So, the library is moving on to some other fiber then. Is that what is happening? Correct. Uh, city manager, you want to Yeah. Um, the county actually has their own fiber system. Um, prior to this, uh, the libraries had come on to the the city fiber. I think they had, correct me if I'm wrong, less restrictions with um our fiber than some of the things that they had over there. So, it just was a better fit at this point. Um I think they're being pushed because due to future expenses and costs that they can see coming down the road as well, they're starting to tighten their belt a little bit where they can and so they're going to be going on to their fiber. So, you're renting out to people or if you're, you know, doing things, you don't know how long it's going to last. Part of the calculations that, um, you know, that Dan and I figured out, a lot of it, Dan, um, he brings up really good points. I mean, he's really got a good 10-year outlook for um, the CIP now, which is is critical. you know, as you've seen in our SIP, uh we have the next uh three road reconstruction projects, but it kind of stops there. So, we need to continue those conversations and consider those costs. There are some unknowns coming our way that Dan kind of touched on of, you know, we don't know what's going to happen with the state fiscal budget, you know, come 2029. Um, you know, we don't know what's going to happen with the community center for sure just yet. But these are some large expenses that could really hit us hard, especially even with the LGA and other costs. So, trying to tighten our belt up a bit now to uh in a little bit of anticipation of some of these things that be coming our way. Other questions, thoughts to this point? Last year, um how much did we receive and tax disparity? uh in uh fiscal disparity. Uh you're going to make me go look. Yeah, I didn't see it in there. Um I think about 1.3 millionish somewhere about there. And if we would have raised our levy last year, roughly $131,829, how much would that have increased? Um it's not that simple. I I I know. Yeah, it's not it's rough guess. I really don't want to wager a guess. Um I'll I'll just shoot out maybe 50,000. And so much of it's dependent on, you know, we're going to see and I anticipate that we'll see some sort of shift. Um and I haven't looked at all of the the numbers from the assessors. Um but there's been article after article um just because of the vacancies in downtown St. Paul area um as far as commercial properties are concerned. So if they valued them downwards um that's going to shift that whole and and they're going to have a big impact and so is the city of Minneapolis because it's you know it's a it's a metro um countywide um program for fiscal disparities. So there could be a negative impact on to us. So that's what's harder to tell this year than than regular. But I' I'd say maybe about 50 if the other things didn't change. The the the reason I'm asking this question is I'm trying to figure out how much benefit there is for our residents. If instead of transferring the penalties to the general fund, if we levied for the same amount of the penalties, but then refunded those penalties to our residents because right now we're going to transfer $131,000 of penalties people paid. into our general fund. But the more we levy, the bigger amount we get as a city for fiscal disparity. So if it's a $50,000, and I'm calling him to the carpet here a little bit on information he doesn't have. It's a if it's a $50,000 bonus to the fiscal disparity, it's actually a $50,000 net income by raising the levy this amount but refunding that to the residents. Something to think about. Yeah. So, so what he's saying at the end of the day is that we would levy 130 I'll call 130,000. um if fiscal disparities increases 50,000, the net impact that would go to property tax owners would be the delta or the $80,000 instead of the $130,000. So, you're saving collectively overall. Um and then you're refunding what um council member Nordsby is talking then you would refund um all of your electrical users some sort of small amount um that would equate to that $130,000. Um and and it's a concept you can definitely look at. Um I'll I'll say kind of a piece to it. I mean, especially when we start to look at the CIP and again, I've kept saying how much of a driving force this is. Um, you've heard um the city manager just kind of allude to and make a little bit of a mention, you know, about our streets and where we're at and um you know, um some more uh major reconstruction projects that are going to be needed. The one safety net, I'm going to call it, that we have in this city is our electric fund. Um, you know, uh, two years ago, we transferred $1.1 million to start advancing our street projects by doing, I guess, a second tier of what we call pavement preservation program. Um, without that, you wouldn't have been able to get started onto to that program. So, it's kind of our it's kind of like our only safety net that we have. Um, and we are going to be levying 6% year after year after year after year after year as a base to afford our capital improvement plan. And so, and and then whatever other decisions are are going to be made. Um and so we're going to be putting a good burden onto our residents through the property taxes one way or the other unfortunately. Um and that's where um you know the decisions that we make are are very critical. Um so I don't disagree um with your component to it um in in what you're saying. Um so I mean it's definitely something we can look at. Usually we don't get uh the first blush of of uh fiscal disparities and so forth um till like about middle later August. Um but that'll be you know and then I'll then I'll do tax impacts and everything like that um for you. But roughly a 6% on a median value home and home values um went up 2.4%. Last year they went up 1.5. That's pretty stagnant. in consideration the postcoid days where we were seeing double digits year after year. Um so the median value home value is just under $311,000. A 6% levy increase is roughly about $100 um is what the 6% would would create um for a medium value home for our residents. So that's not a small amount for for our residents to have to absorb year after year. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. So, it's it's it's yeah, it's it's a it's a tough tough place that we're at, but I remember the story of the one year they didn't raise uh they did zero levy and then that bit us because then we didn't get our fiscal disparities. It's a onetwo punch. It was a one-two punch. You don't feel that second punch till the year after. Exactly. A and the way I in my mind, the way I look at it is he's talking about a $100 increase for that median home is their value and making it a $115 increase, but being able to give that home a $20 rebate rebate. So, in the end, it saves them $5. That's kind of where how my mind works with that rebate versus fiscal disparity is it it would charge them more, but with the rebate it in the long run it should be less. They wouldn't know what to do with it. That's the electrical rebate getting through that, right? Rather rather than transferring the penalty back to electric, right? Yeah. Through the electric bill to get it back. Is that what you're How do you get that back to the Yeah. Some sort of rebate on their electric bill. Okay. Do everybody have North St. Paul have is there any spot that's in on NSP or NSP I'm going way back XL or not on our underneath North St. Paul? Do we have customers? Yeah, we have many. Um there's probably pushing a thousand. You know, we have a decent slice of Oakdale and then we have some Maplewood customers as well. But do we have is there any of our residents that are on XL? No. No. No. Okay. Okay. I just want to make sure that we didn't cut a line somewhere where somebody is off and get their ping in North St. Paul. They wouldn't not for the electric, but there's water customers that have Excel Energy because they serve up into Maplewood. Okay. They have Excel water. our our water department that serves uh some residents up in Maplewood get XL um gas and XL power up there from them. Yep. Any other questions right now? I'm just thinking as a just shoot it out. just a homeowner, you know. You know, if I had these, if I looking at these bills I had and if I'm looking at what the future looks like, I'd be shoving some nickels in the couch Christians. Yes. That's about uh we really don't have a lot of extra that especially if we're asking staff and everybody to uh you know, cut and be at the minimum of things that there's really not a lot of extra that can go through to anything else. and our income, you know, middle to low income. You know, we have a lot of people that are on fixed incomes, a lot of older people, too. And like taxes, you know, years ago, $600 with a, you know, 6% increase is a lot different than 35 $4,000 people are paying now on top of that, which is, like you say, round your $100 for the Yep. Yeah. Correct. Plus, we have a lot of tiff districts, apartment districts that haven't started paying in on any of the real estate yet. So, yeah, they're not in your they're not in your tax base yet until they I get that a lot for people. They go, "Well, look at all these new places, all the all the taxes they're paying." Well, it's not yet. So, it's you're we got 20 years or some 25 years. You're betting on your future with that. You're not getting it now. But we had to do a lot of construction and things to get to there too and we paid for as a city. So it's it was it was not an easy. Now, can I ask with that fiber that we're losing from Ramsey, is there a way that we could offer to some other area or is it so outdated that it is something that we should look to go into a different menu for fiber now? Or should how how does that all work? Because I realize it's in the community center. How do we go about offering it to other locations? Or is it so outdated that if we did the community center options, we would move it to possibly another location? Is there somewhere we could offer some more fiber to some other locations that could use it our system? I I'll ask Brian to help me out on this one, but I I think from the time the inception of the fiber network, technology has changed so much, right? It's it it is it's it's cheaper to go and find a different alternative for for other the biggest user right now, unfortunately, is the city. So, we're we're utilizing it. So you would have a cost one way or the other. Um for the city, we also have two two three agreements, Oakdale, Maplewood, and I think Roseville that you know have long-term agreements. We got about seven or eight more years with that. They prepaid money up front. They pay maintenance on an annual basis. You know, I certainly would anticipate at the end of that their their contracts they would get away um because there's cheaper ways to do it. And I think at that point in time is where you're going to have to pay up the negative and you're going to have to come up with potentially a different um plan alternative use a different resource um onto it. I can't speak to and Brian correct me if I'm wrong in any of that. But I can't speak to is if there's really any resell value um that you see. There's some um I know uh Roseville is certainly or Metroid at this point uses some of that and then they turn around and then release it out. Um I know they have needs for it. Um as far as outdated I mean I guess I don't know how technologies changed when the actual fiber strands themselves but there's probably technology updates in the IT rooms the way they split it down and break it down. Um, but yeah, the there's so many companies putting fiber in out there and people who do it for a living and have all the infrastructure for it there, they're probably going to find better ways to get it from then from us at the end of uh these contracts. Okay. How many strands are in it and you know everything? No, there but there are potentials and we're actually in the process of talking to one now um a company that might be interested coming and do literally doing fiber to the home. Um, but we have a lot of empty conduit around town that we installed um through the electric department. We'd put in the conduit that we need, but we'd also put in a couple of conduits uh for the potential fiber when once upon a time we were looking at it. And we continued that on for many years after we looked into it. So, that has a lot of value. There's only so much real estate. There's only so much room down there, especially in the road rightways. So, that has value as well that we'll be talking to that company about. So, you're figuring probably within 10 years we're going to have to pay the Viper on that more than likely. Yep. Which is okay. Simple. Yep. Um, take a look at this 2635 CIP. Again, this is high level. You have all the detail behind it. So, it'll talk by the different funding sources. It'll show you each and every year. It'll give you the total. But if you look at it, and this is why I I keep saying because it's really a huge driver because over 10 years it's a hundred million dollars. Um and so um that's where really need to spend time to go through that and have city council be comfortable. Um to fund that you need to have the street and streets debt increasing at 248,000 249,000 year after year for 10 years more. Um right now that's a 3.2% levy increase. Parks um if we look at their plan um they have put some additional needs. A lot of them have come from um some have come from um the HGA study that was done um last year. Um but to fund that you would need to increase it um $30,000 beginning this year. Um so their total would be up to 76,000 or almost a percent. And then the asset preservation um is 142,000 or 1.8% of the current levy. The asset preservation does not include the $3 million addition that has been talked about from the EAPC consultant regarding community center that has not been included into this. Um but as you can see that totals $467,000. That's a 6% levy increase. Um it drops down a little bit as a levy increase because your levy keeps getting bigger and bigger. the percentage goes down. But there's there's nothing that said that all of the numbers that are within that capital improvement pan plan are lock solid and and we see costs of equipment and projects continuously going up up up. Um so that's kind of where that looks. In addition to that, um, our internal service fund, we're going to end up having to charge additional, um, charges on our equipment and building maintenance of approximately 5% per year. It's not the huge huge increase, but for for the levy, it would be about a $28,000 increase or just under 4% levy increase. For non-levy increases, in other words, our enterprise funds and so forth would be about a $14,000. um enterprise funds looking off into the future of of rate increases. Um still need to to do some work on that um before I present that to to city council. That's everything all 401 pages. I was thinking that we would do kind of a Senate approach today and I was going to read each and every single line of those 401, but I decided we'll just do a summary onto it. So, it's it's really to get your your your your thoughts and and and direction on the on the budget. And then I just because I'm corny, I want to leave kind of just my last slide after this is is just a little saying. Um, and there's to me there's meaning behind that saying. Um, but I want to leave you with that. But I want to give you opportunity to ask questions. Your thoughts. Are you your first blush at it? Are you comfortable at that 6%? We, you know, we've heard the um council member Nordby talk about maybe ch changing that $131,000 transfer to be more of a levy increase. There's also the potential of um parks to fund theirs that you would have to increase the levy $30,000 or that whatever just 4% levy increase um that would be needed. Don't know about the community center that's still out there. Um, city council, you have to make decisions on onto that coming into the future. So, those are still out on the table. Those aren't included in that 6%. Thank you, Dan. Very good report. Appreciate it. Anybody have any questions? I Okay, now I'm going to leave you with my corny little thought. And here's it's going to come up here in a second. And the reason behind it is cuz in the time that I've been here, every time we present the financial statement to city council, um, in the time that this gentleman has been our mayor, he asks me the same question about that fiber optic. And I think we can collectively say, don't know how the decision was made. I think there was really good intention, but at the end of the day, it didn't work out. So, I leave you with this as a final thing. Your decisions today will define your tomorrow. That's true. Anybody? Thanks. Yeah. Thanks. No pressure at all. How many years do we have to go? So, I'm just trying to do the math when we're looking at different things and projects where we have that $2 million coming up. We have the $3 million, you know, for the community center plus the ongoing stuff. I'm just I'm It's very concerning. There's not a lot, especially when we're already cutting or staying neutral is I guess is pretty much where we're at right now trying to do it. So, I just don't see the numbers trying to hedge against a potential decrease in Yeah. government. Yeah. I mean, it's just going to roll down to us. It's going to be the feds and the state and the state and the county and then it rolls to us and then we have to go out to the taxpayers for a lot of it because that's the only place we can go. We can't grab out anybody else's pockets. Our hands only fit in our own ear. Anybody want to discuss anything else or as far as Well, we had two two great presentations. We had the the community center which was eye openening. I've received quite a few comments about uh how, you know, the the amount we got to and and where things are. And now after today, hopefully people will be watching and be able to absorb and and see where we're at so we can make some of these tough decisions because we have it's going to be tough decisions coming up for all of us here. where we have to. I mean, our main thing here as a as a city is infrastructure, you know, roads and public safety. Once we get those three right and good, then we can work our way out to other things. And I still think we have a ways to go on on what we're supposed to be doing. So, before we can really focus on some of the other stuff. All right. If nothing else, call for adjournment. So move. So move. Council member Woods. Second. Second. Council member McKenzie. All those in favor say I. I. Thank you. Thanks, Dan. You bet.