>> it's going to for sure. need more 69 votes. Goodmorning which time. Good morning to all of you. Thank you for joining us for this city Council meeting and workshop on March. 26. >> Madam Clerk, please call the first item. Approve the minutes of regular meeting of March 1920, 24. Are there any items to be pulled from meeting minutes? Corrections. I see Is there a motion to approve the minutes? So moved? Any further discussion? I see Madam I guess no opening role. Just a voice vote. All those in favor say aye. I all those opposed say nay. Motion passes 7, 0, Madam Clerk, please call the next item consent agenda items. One through 14. Are there any items to be pulled from the consent agenda? I have item number 7. And yet. Just item number 7. And the council members. I see none. Is there a motion to approve the agenda out item number 7? So Motion a second. Any further discussion I seen that. Sorry. Out of habit. Please voice your vote. I I oppose nay motion. Passes 7, 0, Item number 7 is regarding the Stop Violence Against Women Act. Grant. Just wanted to get further clarification this item, specifically that this is coming out of the witch Cha Police Department's budget and the important step, this grant. >> Thank you, I'm not sure we have somebody from the police department here. it will cost of the project of the position that is funded from the grant $87,000. It would Actually we continue to fund a position that was created a few years ago. >> Coming alongside victims of domestic and helping them as we're going through the investigative process as well as the court process. Make sure that they receive all the support services are necessary for them to be able to get through the traumatic of victim. It's a special victim. Assistant is what we call the position. >> And this is a matching grant. The second is it's a 75. 25. So the city's cut shares about $22,000. >> Thank you. Thank you. >> Any further discussion regarding item number 7? I see the motion to approve item. Number 7. So moved. All those in favor. Say Aye. All those opposed say nay. Motion passes 7, 0, Madam Clerk, please call the next item Board of bids and contracts dated March, 25th 2024. >> in their city council. Just Department finance. The board of isn't contracts convene March, 25th 2024 for the following engineering. We have the paving of Harrington Mount Vernon to serve Willow Creek. 3rd 3rd edition work on Specht Incorporated ABA Kansas paving and the amount of $290,424. Reversing. We have the 25,000 gross vehicle weight, cab and chassis with contractor body invoke it trucks entered EPA trucks enter companies for an aggregate total of $104,306. We have the asphalt, hot and cold mix for Pearson Materials, LLC group, one in the amount $224,400 because spectrum paraded the VA, Kansas paving group too. And the amount of 348,000 just. We have the Lincoln Street Dam cylinders, replacement for Don Ling and Sons, Construction Company incorporated in the amount of 62,000. This is how to become a vendor with the city of Wichita. These request proposals out on the street today. And I'd be happy to try to answer your questions. I recommend your approval. >> Any questions for I said one Can you go back once yeah. So this mean that you guys only got one kid? >> We didn't put it out. And the reason that we did not competitively bid, this was my understanding is that Actual dam installation. There is special equipment that bombing or had to construct the barricade. I didn't know someone from engineering speak to the item. >> I'm just kind of curious because sometimes people do comment that. We don't get multiple bids or whatever. So, yeah, someone could explain that the Great Depression. >> Councilmember Ballard, I will have to get back with you on that. I do not know the answer, but I will follow up with I appreciate it. Thank you. Not criticizing either. opportunity to learn, OK, I will find I'd be happy if we want to make a motion to defer this specific item until we get your answers that we could passing information. But my understanding when presented by the department is >> that the construction of the actual dam require the vendor to make specific equipment. And that was why was approved as a sole source. >> that's why I do want to stall the project. just curious. So thank you. Appreciate will get you information. Thank you. Any further questions for staff? I see none. Is there a motion to approve? of? All those in favor say Aye. All those opposed say nay. Motion passes 7, 0, Madam Clerk, please call the next item. Approval of travel for mayor would to attend the city leaders Academy in Manhattan, Kansas, April 12 through the 13th 2024. >> Over to approve the travel. >> see a motion a Those who would like to say I to pass this. Police say I will abstain from it. All if you're opposed, say nay, nay or abstain. Sorry. So motion passes 6 Ciro with one abstention. Now so. The question was from Vice Mayor Ballard regarding the city leaders academy. So the city leaders Academy is for new elected leaders to learn in Manhattan. Kansas, put on by the league of Kansas municipalities as a new councilmember slash mayor. I'm attending that conference. In addition to speaking at that event, for clarification. Madam Clerk, please call the next item. Approval travel for mayor to attend the 2024 delegation of U.S. women, Mayors and Zurich, Switzerland, April 20th through the 27th 2024. >> Motion to approve. Before that, I will read a little portion of what this is all about. First and foremost, this is an item that will not be paid for by the city of All expenses will be paid by the U.S. Embassy of Switzerland. This is a 2024 delegation of us women, mayors to Switzerland. This was by special invitation. Only there are only 9 women, mayors that were selected for this program. The mayor's include the Mayor of Columbia, Missouri. Tampa, Florida, McMinnville, Oregon. For Colorado, St. Louis Park, Minnesota, Albany, New York Fontana, California, Broken Arrow, Oklahoma and Wichita, Kansas. I'm very honored to have been selected as a woman mayor, the first woman to serve in this position during a full four-year elected term. And so I'm very honored again, not have been selected for this trip to Switzerland. This is an opportunity for me and 8 women, mayors of the United States to collaborate learn about safety, economic development as well as topics that would benefit which a tie in terms of collaboration between the United States and Switzerland. While I am there, I will also take a meeting with select U.S. state, which is part of the U.S. Department of Commerce and I will advocate for which talk companies while I in Switzerland. Again, one more time. This is not being paid for by the city of Wichita nor any stipend by the city of Wichita. This isn't this is an item on the agenda for full transparency awareness and approval. I move to approve. As graduations. That's awesome. >> What will you be bringing back chocolate? I hear they have a child. >> I shall bring that chocolate for Motion and a second again, I will abstain from this vote. All those in favor say Aye. Aye. All those opposed say nay motion passes 6, 0, with one abstention. Madam Clerk, please call the next item. Approval of travel for mayor would to attend the Kansas Legal Municipality meeting in Topeka, Kansas on April 5th 2024. >> Another part of item. I am one of the board members for the Kansas leak of municipality East as the largest city in the state of Kansas. We have a seat on that point that not fully sat And so one of duties will be to be a board member and active board member on the Kansas leaving municipality ease. And I will take a city of Wichita fecal to meeting on April. Get them come back that day. I move to prevent travel. Motion a second. I will again, abstain from this item. All those in favor say Aye, aye. All those opposed say nay motion passes 6, 6, 6, 0, with one abstention. Madam Clerk, please call the next item. Councilmember appointments and comments. think we have multiple shall we go district one through 6. Okay. I don't have a new appointments district to not okay. District 3. Yeah, I'd like to point a borrower and Paul Davis to the District Advisory Board. >> District no appointments. District, 5 and district 6. I'd like to point Tory a for which airport. >> I would like to point out and glass talk to the downtown, which taught at my seat. I will also nominate name submitted by downtown which tap for this Advisory Board. They include Joe Johnson. Natalie. Gosh, Chad Hansen, a Jay Beleskey, Deborah Fraser, Joe Survior. Mike smells that Joel Kelly and Don Sherman. Drive a motion to approve these appointments. motion and a second all those in favor say Aye. Aye. All those opposed say nay. Motion passes 7, 0, Madam Clerk, please call the next item. Okay. It is now time for workshop, which means City manager Bob Layton will now take over. did We will not be journey because we'll have right. I'm sorry. My fault. Thank you. >> Thank you, Mayor. We have 3 items all of and the first one has to do with the requests the council made for us to come back and provide background information regarding the pickleball complex that is proposed for Lakes Park. The Council forced to reject the bids were received for this project before going back out. You asked for more information. So but maternal Detroit, helping overview of the project. Thank you, Bob. Good morning. Mayor and council to help and director of parks and recreation. And the item again is in regards pickleball. >> So I some All-Star folks here traveled some distance to be here. And I have of our consultant is actually virtual and the chair of are really important port to share with us today. So people contacts. We have a lot of we've got to try to be detailed in brief to make sure we get you guys the facts, but also be very quick about as well. So provide bit of background city center. She's here from visit Wichita to talk a little bit about some items from the perspective of Wichita, study, Michelle Perry. She's virtual. She's going to provide some information. USA Pickleball is actually President Nicole Smith. He is here. He traveled here to be here for the state. There's we have talk a little about the study. I'm going to go over that the last push of this is the design. PC is started this here? He'll go over that portion of it. So a lot to cover, but I think we'll be pretty brief. This is a picture over at Riverside. These are some new courts that were provided by There was actually grant that helped us build this actually, I'm sorry, this wasn't mocha conduct. was another grant that came the letter Nation. So a little more background about the site. This is actually a South Lakes. And it's really interesting part that we have a lot of space here. We have some softball. And what we have here is the remnants of all of our soccer fields. This used to be a location. We had a lot of soccer and this moved up to striker these fields are still being using for football and some other activities in some adult soccer. But we do have tons of space left over. And this is one of the reasons why we want to look at this spot as a location for pickleball and other type of activities that we can do here. I want come back to this a little bit later. This is a timeline of when we came the council. These are all touch points from council one form or another and design council. I want to come back to this and go over this little bit more. But if you notice to March 10th of 2021 was when this first started and this the portion where it would council as part of this. We've actually been looking at this project for about 5 years in and work in with a lot of folks locally and nationally in regards to this project. a little bit about the budget. So came out to be 6.1, 5 million dollars and was actually initiated in April 2023. so far we've already spent about $350,000 on design. And the Sound study as some costs as well. We had to the cost a little bit because we wanted to actually have a world quality football complex for hosting tournaments, which will talk a little bit more about. budget includes the design includes utilities, earthwork and we have a special a standard. garced the courts that they're all post tension, which means that there's still it goes through the courts and actually tensions the courts together. So they don't craft. A country pass. And and the actual building as well as all the effort funny, which is for pressure, fixtures and equipment. I Just for reference. We'll talk more about the actual site plan. This is what it looks like and we'll talk a bit more about the actual design of everything that's in here. But the couple things I want give you guys a look at this and also look at the map. So you keep that your mind as we go through some of the items. So turned over to Suze. She has a lot of information to share about a local perspective of this project. Thank you good morning. Mayor council members is pleasure to be here. City Center. President CEO visit Wichita. >> And Trust me to share a little bit of the background and how we got to that March 10th 2021 day. Somebody give a little bit of the background and and how we got involved and where we met up with the pickleball recommendation. I'm Lee, the manager and I chatted in and the manager asked really there's been some potential, maybe interest in baseball out of South Lakes and Woods when a soccer moved out to strike. Iran is trying mentioned there's open fields. Does baseball make a lot of sense out there are like, you know, let's take kind of a a broad approach to this without any preconceived ideas and say what is best for Wichita at that facility. And so that point visit, Wichita, we hired a dcw sports and you're going to hear from Michelle in just a moment. We heard Michelle Perry Neuberger. And I have to tell you, they're like incredibly well respected in this field. Together, they have only Russia can tell you maybe 5 decades of involvement in sports. And so they've helped a lot of cities figure out their sport strategy. Facility needs etcetera. So went to Michelle until we said, listen, we have this property South Lakes we wanted to start important for all of us. Again, a blank canvas. You know, no preconceived ideas. What makes most sense for Wichita to come into this space? It was really important when we talk to Michelle and ill that they really stressed a few things. We're looking for the best outcome for the city. Not at that term and not at detriment of any other facility. We didn't want to displace and moved to another facility. Wanted to grow the pie of whatever was going out there from other sports need to be thoughtful, deliver it no negative outcome for the community. So we really that's where we started this process. And beginning. She started down the path of baseball asking questions about baseball. Doesn't make sense out there to more facilities. And Michelle's going to tell them more about that. But after talking stakeholders for numerous really did not find that was going to be the best course of action with the most opportunity. So that's point shifted gears. What else makes sense out there really then pickleball rose to rose to the top and really bubbled up. It was different conversations with the stakeholders about pickleball the stakeholders were very enthusiastic. They emphasize that it was a significant opportunity to grow the pie, greater capacity. The needs were not being met by the current capacity and again wanted to grow the pie. The pickleball leaders and advocates already started engaging in conversation with 2, 5, 9 about including it in PE and and really learning to are really wanting to grow the pickleball enthusiasts from his edgy, young age and what was fun to learn the project, which I didn't know it is that which Wichita has a lot of pro pickleball players and highly rate not only in the U.S. but in the world who knew where the air capital aviation, but also pickle right here in Wichita. So that really, again, a lot of advocate and then we had both tennis center's Riverside and edge Moore that had courts. But they were interested in could collaborate on those low larger events. So pick a ball after lots of discussions really became a focus and what Michelle hit home is that when you're looking at a facility, there's 3 clientele that you need to attract. So we looked at South Lakes, very important. First individuals who live near around the park. Are they going to be, you know, able to utilize this facility again, that check the box? Yes, we'll individuals throughout Wichita travel, 2 South Lakes and participate in that sport. And that check the box. And then finally, the 3rd clientele that we wanted to make sure that would be attracted was an audience that would come for special events or tournaments. All good stuff that would travel throughout the region and out the country that would come here weather too. Whether it's to play in it as a participant or spectator and that check the box. So all of a stakeholders they're enthusiastic about it and made a lot of sense. And again, Michelle her. We'll talk more about pickleball to talk about that growing sport. It attracted the clientele. We felt like we could drive the economic impact. And then finally, when you look at this project, there's opportunity from the city perspective to really own the programmatic aspects of it. So from from that sector, but there's also the opportunity on the private sector for whether it be a restaurant or managing the pro shop or a banquet space if it were out there. So it looked again like a great opportunity for both sectors. So at the end of the day, that's really where pickleball rose and their research came. And that's when the recommendation came back to the manager about after all that research. We think it's prime spot bring all these courts an NBA hub of pickleball Wichita and just up a little color on sports in which a time to kind of put in perspective visit this year we've got about 8 events. I just looked at 8 events that we're hosting over the next several months. We started with synchronized Speaker read in January. We just finished hosting NCAA Division, 2 men's wrestling championships at Hartman. We also hosted the NBA Championship wrestling Hartman, coming up at striker with the summer. We've got USC The Presidents Cup are also hosting a lacrosse of been out there. We've got pro softball coming to WSU. I say that we have a track record of when we have the facilities, we can drive the sporting events and that economic impact. So those 8 events that I just talked about this year alone. And Josh, How's incident behind with the vest on his R sports, a or BPA sports development. He'll be here to answer any questions as well. But I say that because those 8 events in direct impact, economic impact direct spending in the community about 12 million dollars. And that's the course of the events over this few months of this year. Choi and Josh and had conversations with just 2 organizations over the last 6, 8, months. Pickleball is moving along and it shovel in the ground and just 2 events over a 12 month period were interested in were going down that path of the RFP looking at it and those conservative. We were 2 million dollars in direct spending into the community. And that's to events to conversations. So we believe we have a track record when there's facilities we can get him here. Those are dollars and there's in the pockets and the benefit. All of Wichita so it's just a little bit of history of how it came to be a pickleball came back in March of 20st and the work that had been done to get to this point. I'm going to turn it over Michelle Perry again, just I can't say enough about her and Dale and their reputation in this industry. And so really we're fortunate that we picked up the phone and call them that they were willing to hop in and help us on this project. So I think she's make right. Yes, turn it over. You and your honor to All right. Thanks, guys. >> Thanks, Susie. And visit, which has been a huge impact on many, many different opportunities for us. But then a great partner regards pickleball and really quick before we go into show, I just want to talk a little about it's a little bit of history. When you talk about pickleball there's a person Vicki Middleton. Unfortunately, she passed away last year. She has in the past a driving force in regards to pickleball. She would come to my office. Weekly, sometimes daily pitching her ideas. I really can't get the ball rolling for pickleball and she was a huge part in regards to this idea. She was very intricate and talking to the pickleball community locally about this facility and help. It would really kind fit the need of what needs to happen here in for pickleball pickleball folks they like together. They like to play in large groups. to 3 courts around the city was not going to suffice for them. They would actually want a spot that actually had 12, 18. 24 courts. I just want to making Middleton cause. She is a huge part of of all the efforts that have moved forward. And there's several of pickleball folks behind us and that there seeking their head. So like to introduce Michelle Pierre a she was a consultant to help us with this. I mean, goes to the slides when she tells me to move the slides. But you'll hear her voice. And at the end, if I can figure this out, have her picture up so she can talk to face to face. Show a present. >> I am Troy. Good morning. Good morning. Its our viewers. Great. Thank you. And thank you to for the kind and it's great to be with you at this morning trade. You can go ahead. Switch to the next slide. There. You know, when we started this project, Dale and I we one of the very first questions we asked was what is the definition of success? And and it was very clear, again, as we talked about South Lakes that are 6 things that were important. One was this what whatever, this was whatever decision was made, it needed to serve the community, particularly the neighborhood. A close in close proximity to the park. It needed to be able to generate visitor spending in Tuesday. Talked about that a little bit. It needed to be a valuable asset that. >> participation fitness and and across the community. >> It needed to provide a different asset, something that differentiated this, this footprint from other not only from other facilities within the city of Wichita, but really across the region. talk about that a little bit later. It needed to understand and and taken to a cow sports programming and sports tourism. What was happening in the sports tourism world. And it needed to operate in a fiscally responsible way. So that was that those were the success metrics. And I know that I'm gonna try and tie some of these comments back to it. 6 principles here as we as we talk about the the work so treat, you can go ahead and switch. So those those success metrics really set the tone for our prior work flow and has Susie said at the beginning of this week, we really went into this project with no preconceived outcomes ultimately the decision on how to best utilize the footprint needed to be one that helped grow the pie. And you heard Susie use those words earlier. It was really important that whatever decision was made, it didn't just redistribute the participants to another part of the city. And we saw that very clearly what happened with the soccer clubs that were that utilizing South Lakes. They they moved They moved to 2 Stryker. And and again, there was there was not growth in that. They were simply read redistributing that. So it was important again, that. Of that, we keep that in mind that that we wanted this to be a for the community. We also we're we're really careful to make sure that we we emphasize that the plan that utilization plan was responsive and that capacity and duplication of services. So again, we didn't want to just create the same thing that was in another part of of the community. And we wanted to make sure that there that there was demand for, again, for whatever facility ended up being built it at South Lakes. So we talking with numerous baseball stakeholders about South from all walks of life from folks that facilities folks that have been involved in the baseball culture of their entire lives. And what we learned following those conversations was really wasn't exceeding its baseball capacity, that that that the current baseball complexes in baseball facilities. They they were operating at Max capacity. So adding more baseball assets wasn't really get that the outcomes that we talked at the beginning of this. So we we we pump the brakes on those and we started to look at demographic information and growing sports trend to really identify some opportunities for Wichita to differentiate Against some of the market that Susie and Josh compete on a daily basis for important events. We also spent time looking at what those competitor cities we're doing in in terms of sports facilities. We didn't again We didn't want to suggest or go down the path of of building a facility where our competition had a similar or better facility that would would cause competition. And so again, as we continue these conversations and we continue to to to look at this. At that time. And I know Karl is still going talk about the explosive nature and growth pickleball. This was this was the sport. Again, that was trending upward. That participation was growing faster than to me. And that and so we started to to to begin identify some groups, to talk to about pickleball. And so we topped with it with dozens and dozens of of individuals with varying experiences. And after those conversations, we we were even more convinced that pickleball was the right fit for her. Wichita and she stated, one of the things, again, that was interesting to us that we learn the work was the elite major players that were that we're currently living. how we can some of the top players in the country and even in the lived and competed in Wichita. And what we heard word that what's that were traveling from around the region and really from around the country. A high-level experience against elite competition. So people are coming. They were already coming to Wichita to seek out these week and and highly rank pickleball players. And again, as Troy stated, what we learned was there is a robust, enthusiastic well connected in organized pickleball community in in Wichita. In fact, I I'm still to this day and part of that pickleball Facebook group. So I know that they are again, well connected and and very enthusiastic about the sport. What we also learned was that there was an unmet demand from the community said there was more demand for court. Then Wichita had currently it within its its portfolio. So again, that that demand was a was very high, continuing to grow. The other thing that we learned in talking many of the folks that we talked to was this idea of growing the game and there was and again, as we all measure our lives, this was pre-covid there were there. There was a real push to introduce pickleball into the curriculum with school to 59. There were there were a group pickleball enthusiasts that had to teach local PE teachers about the game so that it could be introduced in PE classes and they had also begun have preliminary conversations with about making it a high school sport again so that they could introduce young people and families about the sport of pickleball with the idea driving increased utilization of the court during times when there were lessons order for competition happening on those courts. So again, keeping in mind, this idea of utilization. And so we again, what we found was that there were significant and enthusiastic support for pickup on Wichita. And at it as we looked at pickleball facilities around the country that had begun pop We talked a lot about those facilities with the local pickleball many of which travel every weekend they travel either regionally or nationally to play in these pickleball tournaments and they they shared that demand is very high, that the competition is very intense. That you pickleball bill up in a matter of. Hours. So the competition for getting into the field is again, very, very high. So again, as we talked about their experiences and what would like to see or what? What? What made them described a facility in a positive way they talked about the facility needing to be large enough to hold multi-day event they there needed to be amenities food electricity restrooms, locker rooms again, they're they're such competition for those players for their dollars that much of their is where where can they go and have a better player experience. So many of these are really important to them. It was interesting, as we saw again at that time, some of the facilities that had come online. There was a new facility in that had been bill and that hosted several major But that, again, the feedback that we got from players was it was in the middle of field. There was really no infrastructure. And at the time all they had for facilities were porta So again, that once again, this reinforcement of making sure that there was infrastructure in place to be able to provide a great player experience. Again, as we as as Troy has worked through and as he shared the site plan we think that what what's been would position Wichita very well to host significant, not just local events but regional national tournaments and they could do this while providing opportunities for the community to really engage in a lifelong sport that contributes to health and fitness. Again, all tying back to those key principles that we talked about at the you know that the the other thing into touched on his that these courts would really give them more assets to sell. And I think I think she's she shared this the recent success of visit which time important sporting events to the to the community, but certainly having new tools in their tool box would would help them drive again, increase tourism, sports tourism to which tie again, which is one of those those key metrics were identified at the beginning of this. And then finally, I would say that this investment will result in a substantial upgrade to the existing amenities currently has helped lakes. So again, that that improvement and that investment in in the said that the elevate the community there at Southlake and then as we've what we talked about several but Susie and and and then in my earlier comments this expansion would bring visitors problem not only from Wichita, but but throughout the region and nationally and this new money will come to the area and it's likely that along with those new revenue streams that their it would be assumed that there would be some additional economic development as a result of this project. Some new small businesses that might emerge in this neighborhood because of the increased traffic and the attention on the Pickleball Court and and South Lakes in general. And so I would say that we continue to support the great work of Troy and Suzanne Josh, to to really elevate that. profile of Wichita. And we certainly appreciate the opportunity to to be with you today. And I am happy to answer questions at the end. But but for now, turn it back to Troy. >> Thank you, Michelle. I really appreciate year involvement with this project just to get to next slide Mister Smith from USA Pickleball Karl has some information for Good morning. I appreciate opportunity share the subject with the mayor and city Council in the 4 decades and I've been the workforce of had to as many careers. I was a systems engineer to begin during pickup or during racquetball and 10 assists boom back in the 70 late 70's and 80's. I was a a teaching pro and and the club GM during that period following that it was in town for over 2 and a half decades. Those careers I experienced 5 The first, of course, was a tennis and racquetball boom in in the 80's that resulted in a huge infrastructure. Build out both sports intact during the 90's. I was right in the middle of so working with intelligence right in the middle of the PC boom in the early 90's. And then in the late 90's, the explosion in Internet service providers. I was involved both of those programs moving into the next decade of the launch of mobile computing. And then toward the end of that decade, a smart phones were were exploding on a space to open in Finland, supporting one of the largest manufacturers of phones those booms were nothing like this one and so it's it's been very exciting to be part of this for the last 10 I was involves an impasse. Udder as far back 2015, got involved in a number of different aspects of the sport to the first attempt, a rating system. The first go at a pro tour first peeled life media platform as well. the sport is demonstrating got Lake are some numbers with you as of this last report from the Sports Fitness Industry Association Pickler remains the fastest growing support for the 3rd year in a row as a result of that, that study just in terms of numbers of participation doubled in. 22 we increased over 50% year on year last as a result of that. That last report. And then just in terms of sustained growth over the last 4 years, almost 250% growth during that period. That the number today as reported by the Sports Fitness Industry Association is about 13.6 million other is another that's referred to frequently. It's it's but you go. They report a number in the mid 30's about 36 million we tend to to report that the more modest of the 2 for a number of reasons, probably one of the most important takeaways from this most recent report, though, is that not only the largest demographic that the fastest growing demographic is the 25 to 34 and the lifeblood of any sports growth, of course, is its use. The sport, of course, has been great Washington to some extent of its. It's filtered. It's a sport for older that that older people play. truly is. this figure right here in terms of the this demographic being the fastest growing sector. It's very exciting for us. And it's really driving a lot of our programming here recently as well. From a facilities standpoint, there was a reference earlier about the the demand for exceeding the supply just to put some numbers to it. We've got track about 12,000 known locations in the U.S. results in about 52,000 courts in North America. seeing about 130 new locations added each month. The downside of this is 70% of these are temporary their tape doubt many cases. It could be chalk out a cul-de-sac or shared dual stripe. So, for example, tennis courts with pickleball courts often estimates from a recent report that in order to meet existing and forecast demand about 25,000 courts need to be built over the next couple of years. That's a spend of close to from an infrastructure standpoint. USA Pickleball is currently engaged with about 300 million in there's some very large scale multi-sport projects which result in you know, 7 digit, a type projects but we're we're touching quite a few programs across the U.S. today. We launched this facility development function at the beginning of 22. It was more to address a lot of interest questions. It would come in. But the after launching that, we see about 10 to 15 new projects week. Some of them are conversions. Some of them are a Greenfield bill doubts as well. In some cases, they're Dreamers. You know, people that are kicking tires, looking to spend some of their retirement on their own facility. In other cases are large-scale facilities like the one we're talking about today. Part of this growth, of course, you know, many, many municipalities have taken an approach to convert existing Those that might be under used. It might be a basketball court. It might be a 2 tennis court installation in a pocket park or community park. The result of of many of these installations that that the community around it, residents around, it may have an issue with the sound. So to address that we do, by the way, believe that's fairly small percentage of the population are of than the number of facilities out there. But it gets a lot of attention in the media and so to address we launched a research project about 18 months ago. As of last year, we launched a new program to quite category. So there's a paddle is being produced today that reduce the noise by about 50% and then I actually shared with Troy and the team upstairs here. You got a sneak peek at a new quiet ball that's in development and that will be having a couple of pilot projects will headed to Southern Cal here after this meeting to do some tests there and get focus group feedback. So there's there's quite a bit of development in that area were quite quite pleased with the progress there. In terms of of how this demands being being served. We're seeing quite a few new business Old-school private club type approaches. So membership-only mixed member and drop and we're seeing quite a bit more of that. The entertainment model, I think actually originated here with chicken and pickle. And of course, that project took off quite substantially today. I'm engage with probably know less 30 of those type of facilities. Most of those are in the northern states, by the way, because they are they're indoors. What we're also seen, by the way. a lot of the these new projects that are coming up do have aspirations to host tournaments tournaments can be a huge revenue driver. It's a great way to highlight the facility and showcased facilities. Well, terms of driving the economic impact that's been addressed quite a bit. But I've got a few more numbers to add to that here in a few minutes. But the capacity plan is very important. What I see none that the project here locally is an attention to detail in terms of how do you address these crowds? Vendors officials is there enough room for operations, all of that, sir, that type of plan it is good is going into this over overall plan, which is encouraging and then one of the things to think about as well as in between these events. How do you program for for set up for a facility very important in terms of where 2 people congregate covers shades. Is there room for, you know, potlucks or barbecues, that type of thing paying attention to? That's very important because the sport does have a heavy social angle. So planning for that and the actual physical plant of the facility very important. As I mentioned before, launching this facility development function. provide a number of services and support for the design. We've got a few architects on retainer material recommendations that we want to make sure that best materials or or use of it all the way down to planning colors, color choices are very important for optics and contrast. We do provide support for kuz assessments royal touch on that There's quite bit of attention to that already in this project. Some of the other things that we do we were very hard to promote facilities. Once the ribbon spent cut, we places to play platform where travelers may look facilities are moving through town. We're going to evolve that platform as well to do even greater features on special facilities that features are there. They're large scale and they do host a lot of events. Another thing that we do is we work hard to connect to local and passengers. There's clearly a lot of work being done already over us. A pic of all investors here locally. And then as I mentioned before, after the ribbon, Scott, we provide programming, We've got teaching platforms that we're working with the PPR, which is a close relative of the PTR Professional Tennis registry. That's better than a very successful platform for us. looking at this locally. And by the way, just from a project before I came, I took a look at my my inbox. I don't file anything away. And I have I email exchanges with Josh with Troy and with PC from over 18 months ago. So we've been involved with this project for quite some time. And that's why I felt this absolutely worth worth the time to come out and meet these estimates that I've mentioned before in terms of the number of participants in the sport, if you do the math on this relative to the U.S. population, it's anywhere from 4%. But yes, if estimate all the way up to 11% of the U.S. population for Park participating in the sport. That's a mix of what they call court. And that means we play often or casual. It's at least once a month. this this analysis that I this demographic shows that wasn't about a 30 minute drive time Youve got a potential total available market anywhere between 22,060 1000. Participants. there's a large market here just in that the Wichita Metro area. But when you start talking major events, which a lot of the focus has been on that players will drive for this. So I've got 3 hours here and that takes into account several other metropolitan areas. And gets us up North 6 million in demographic. If we only look at the core participant percentage, which a little bit north 30%, that's about 88,000 participants that would drive here to participate in a large-scale event. This could be a three-day event or a four-day event over the weekend. But they will travel if they know they're going to get you experienced a nice event. That's, you there's attention to detail it's, you Well, sir, from the food standpoint and it's run professionally as well. And there's a there's a considerable focus on ensuring the players to get a great experience with a trail for tournaments. And I think that's been one of the key drivers behind growth just an That sector important point when you're talking economic impact. When you look at a tournament competitor, the factor in terms of support group family other people that are there on behalf of that participants, about 2.5, a facility like this one to 24 court facility could easily host 1000 participants over a four-day event. And of course, that means about 2500 people there for that event. That's a lot of heads in beds. A lot of cultural purchased. A lot of meals spot. And so we do. We do some light economic impact studies for facilities. I'm not sure those numbers before with with Troy or the team, but there's some some real numbers here in this area and something I wanted to drive home. Here was. This facility would be one of the largest in the country's north of the 35th parallel. there's a colleague back there on ponder. I see him very frequently at a large events. These are the pro level He's a unofficial and director the most of the large facilities that we frequent are in Florida for Texas, Arizona, and to some extent California, this would be one of the largest in the U.S. about that. The 35th parallel. And then in this through the Midwest, it would it would be probably the center of gravity many larch tournaments, regional level tournaments. But even pro level tournaments. So given the the plan that was most recently presented, this could scale with a championship court that could seat several 100 people during a major event. These events attract to anywhere between 2,1200 participants. They get great. Visibilities are generally carried on ESPN. FOX Sports and some of the others as well. So this will put you at a at the center of the Pickleball Universe here in this in this region. I get asked this question very frequently is just another fat. I highlighted something here and I got to this entire report to if you're interested looking at some of the other trends and in sports typical that typically fall within the parks and rec directive in this you see tennis pickleball are included in this but the key figures here, if you look at 5 year average annual growth well over 33%. So this case, 35 36 37% in every category. So not just casual but also core the number of people that are flame frequently continues to increase it. A significant percentage, relative to other rec and paddle sports. This is I think to me one of the key bits of data that show that the sport isn't just a COVID bump it. It so much going for it just in terms of I've been back to physiology, social impact will talk about here in a moment. Use of access the socioeconomic. The access piece of this is very important to you can be played outside. It is played inside quite a bit as well. Of course, you know, indoor facilities to cost quite a bit. So we've grown primarily outdoors but they're still about About 40% of the courts are indoors. And most of those are gymnasiums that been taped out for temporary news. But this is a key figure in terms of steady, steady growth here in the last several years. It's very sustainable. And again, having been part of several booms and in some cases busts a over the last several decades. This when I significant lakes, this last piece. Share with you. There's an article just last month in a Pickleball magazine, our surgeon was featured in it. And he wasn't talking about. But I mentioned before pickleball is is one of the few sports that delivers what I would say. A trifecta of of helps the frequency of So most players play several times a week. The duration of play anywhere from 2 to 3 hours when they play and the intensity of It's somewhere in that medium intensity or for top level players, its high intensity as well. Has a profound effect on a person's physiology for those of us north a certain age, it's even more important to increase our health span. They're so it's such a significant impact on reduce health costs and other aspects there. Now, what the surgeon general was addressing was an epidemic of loneliness. And so this sport is mentioned before in as Michelle mentioned very social. There's a huge impact for people, especially as we move into a certain stage of life. World. It's a little smaller. And so this is a a an activity function as I mentioned as a huge physical impact, but also from a social standpoint, other regaining elements, other significant. So this was a big hit for us to get this this kind of feature with the surgeon general. But again, it wasn't about physiology was about mental health, which is is important for everybody. We'll take a beat there. Any questions from accounts? Multiple questions >> which Councilmember Jaisol. Thank you. I appreciate it. Thank you. Mayor. I'm not sure if you know this one, where is the momentum going with ball being a high school sport? >> It's quite it it started most received quite a quite a bit of traction collegiate right now. But we about 18 months ago. high school programs where we're seeding them is equivalent. So that's House all's just from starter kit standpoint. And then we're looking at developing intramural and programs which will stimulate more competition and high schools. >> Gabby, she ate this one might be a little. I guess under your head, I guess from the 30,000 Where are we in Kansas? Do we know that there's momentum still going that way? Or is that something where? I mean, it's school boards that it knows of that right? So the few years that ago we started looking at see if we can turn this into a high school sport. We have touch base with we have not follow through with it. A really strong proposal yet. I think it was joining the COVID months COVID years. I should say that the idea came about but I think that's something that we want move forward with. And as COVID mentioned, a big push. Everything was take steps and sometimes a start from the top down. Universities and colleges are starting to really develop. The couple teams. And I've gotten several calls from nearby universities that are interested in using our facilities for university play. Some but test your question. We have not yet got the case yet that that's one of things on list create it. You said earlier 1,1200 participants that says that that's on them. I would assume that's on the larger and of The spectrum there is that about what we're aiming for with facility. it it certainly achievable. And so we've got to algorithms that we use to calculate just how large a event could be. >> its its scales with adding days. And so felt like to sort facility like this could host. Well, the figure we uses is 10 participants. Her court per day. And then you throw on another 10% of its lift because the length of time during the event is is extended. that number on daily basis. And then there's a factor that we use. We divide by 1.5 because wrong place. 3 events. I play one of right? So there's an average in there somewhere that we land on. So we use that that figure to calculate just how many unique participants are are and during the course of theft. And so in that by the way, I used to compete quite a bit. And 24 court facility, for right next to make in Vegas last time I played there was 1100. that was a 5 K regional event. And so the regional events of that we see now we've got 12 regions. Those typically see anywhere from 800 to 1100 participants. looking to do a couple things. We're adding something called a golden ticket, which even be a larger event many cases take oversight that the pro event. So there's a lot of visibility for those. Again, I think this facility will be at the scale to host one of those and then there are select events that really will be layering in quite a few more as well. So it depends on your appetite gala terms of how many sporting events you want to host. But something like this, you know, what's the what's the weather breaks in the spring? you could conceivably host a large monthly and then a pro grade event, at least once a season, you know, during the summer season, probably. And you know, regional level events, which would be more to the thousands. I'd say. least 2 of per season as well. So one pro 2 regional So these are 1000 plus and then many more of smaller ones which would attract those 3. Our drivers, by the way, as long as they know they're going to get a good. have a good experience. I have some great playing and competition. You would pull from those metropolitan areas for that. >> Hey, where's the nearest facility similar to this? I know Norman has won, but I think it's a dual use tennis and pickleball. Do we have anything that's specifically pickleball that would appeal to these tournaments? phone here. So within the 3 hour drive >> I don't. been some that have been converted been a participating. Many of those. >> Their tennis clubs that are converted week period or so used for the pro event and then convert So as I mentioned before, to my knowledge, no permanent facilities of this scale north of 35th. And so there. So there will be on 3 hour drives convert or double take tennis courts are double strike tennis courts. But those can the play the players experience on those isn't as good as on a permanent court like what we're considering here. And you'll find attack creates a. For more use of people want to come in and spend time here laying there versus temporary I mentioned before represent about 70% of total number ash. >> Final question. talked about a number economic impact studies that you've done. Do you guys have return on investment estimates tied with those? >> We do have got a couple of of pitches regional director, sir, put together. I'd be happy to share those with you. I appreciate commission. Just by the way, just a sidebar. I do remember what the number was for the for this This is part of the Rocky Mountain region. The economic impact of this was based around a 16 quarter facility Colorado Springs. I believe it was about a 4.6 million. Based on the events that they held or another. Leaks and things that they >> Thank you, mayor. Among the few different questions for staff member courts what would it take for a regional facility to host regional tournaments? How many quarter 24 24 national. About 60 60. Okay. Are there any area? So I was just looking at our capacity and the core of the city right now. We have 15 courts, riverside. We have 6 Seneca Park, which are 3 minutes from each other. They're about their less than a mile from each other. And so repurposing I look there's repurposing one tennis court can allow for 4 pickleball courts. The repurposing one tennis court at Riverside facility would get us to 25 courts or to get us to 20. Yeah, 25 courts, which we more than would be needed for a regional facility less than a mile within 3 minutes of each other. Are there any tournaments that you are aware of across the country where there's 3 minute transit between courts. Very few. >> And it does present logistic operational issues as well where you house to officials, for example, I've only been the one I think that was actually split like that. generally what happens? You lose a little bit of that critical mass that makes the tournament a great event to go to You're hiding off part of attendees from that that it can't. And so they're not actually all the same location at the same time that >> Sorry, Councilmember Johnson, thanks, mayor. Just have one And Greenfield development areas. You talked what type of surrounding development came from that investment of pickleball like the types of there like restaurants, hotels and everything, the kind of built up around that support pickleball. It wasn't just kind of still the Greenfield. It's a mix. >> I've seen some It it is literally a Greenfield. Jaime, as you know, that's a term you know, it's a ground-up construction. The is some that are that are built thinking is that it will attract the infrastructure over time and I've seen it happen. In other cases. It's it's built in an area where the infrastructure exists. In most cases in in that area. Those are facilities that are transition for a big event. But then their transition back. So there's there's exceptions to that. As I mentioned before in Arizona, in Texas, to some definitely Florida. Those have been built up permanent facilities. And in most cases there's a significant infrastructure around So given >> proposed location for do you think there's a lot of potential have some of the type of developments surrounding it? >> There is I mean, certainly from access from the airport so that, you know, this is a before major Certainly that will be attractive. Just the ease of access. Its is fairly close. least a flex is just just Jason very close to the airport. And then again, once there's some traction usage increases, it will be a, as I mentioned, the center of gravity and it will be problems and optimum place actually to locate to serve that much traffic. >> Carl, couple questions. Can you talk about cost for some of these? So specifically cost to building a new permanent? Just one court. One court or retrofitting a tennis court into again. I think you said 2 pickleball courts can be retrofitted from one tennis court. He talked with those cup. Those costs are for sorry. yeah. So in fact, I've gone through a couple of conversions and my local community of 2 tennis courts that were converted to 6. >> It was about a 50, 50,000 to convert. Those. This was a permanent facility. For Greenfield bills, ground upgrading everything it's somewhere between 35 and 45. Depends. If you go post tension which you know, in that case, you create a very durable environment. You won't have to maintenance costs that you asphalt, for example, we're even the potential cracking in this in this climate that you can still see with concrete. That's not impose tension. And so we're probably talking north of 45 for a court like that. That's a one, you know, with the 4 foot fences around it. I'm not including sidewalks, lights, all the other infrastructure that goes around. >> Had an opportunity to talk to someone with PP the PPA to work. Can you explain all of us maybe the different levels of pickleball from amateur to pro the kind of the differences between these types of tournaments. And my follow-up question to that really is has the city of got after maybe the smaller, smaller scale, amateur level type of tournament, even with what we currently have not with new. But with what we currently have in our inventory. Yeah. I mean. >> see how many was at 9 at Riverside, 9 courts. Riverside you've got courts there. You've there's 15 their apologies. So you could hold a U.S. the Every site. Okay. You can hold a small scale tournament. You know, tomorrow or something like that. And amateur tournament and I would encourage it, you know, just to some sort, I would encourage it just in terms of building and acceptance or an understanding of of what a tournament experience is like. So that will have a significant impact, I think on the local community until this larger facilities built. In terms of the tearing, if you would, are differences between leaks both the PPA, a professional Pickleball Association and the Association of Pickleball Players. The A P p were launched in the same year in 2020 they both you know, a fairly substantial number of pros that play with. And there's some crossover to some extent between them. They both do significant media vice now. So hosting either one would put Wichita on in the in the frankly, as I mentioned before, TSP en FOX Sports Amazon Prime as Live on. And that's joint venture with the Tennis Channel on that one. So either one of them would be a would be positive for city to host if possible. And again, in reviewing the plans, it looks like you can scale up for a very nice center court. A championship court, which would see quite a few quite a few spectators as well. not quite sure. I've answered your questions. A few other tears. There's a senior tour called the National Pickleball League. That growing very fast. And then there is a team competitions which, by the way, the LP is that there's another team competition format called Major League Pickleball, which 36 teams. Now I think is the is the number a popular format as well. So be several leaks that you could to host events here. They all have different criteria, different formats to the league events. Don't have those are for amateurs, but they're they're great for show. And for showcasing the city the A P P P p a. >> And then USA Pickleball. We all have a defense that and case of the first to have a pro level and then in the case for us, a pickleball we're mostly focused on amateurs. Those other events, a PPP also host temperatures and will typically see north of U.S. housing participants in those pants. >> They're just answer the question. just for the record and >> tram on the city's website regarding pickleball under the Riverside Tennis Center's as 9 outdoor courts of lights for night play and 6 indoor courts. Is that incorrect? I think say indoor courts are double striped tennis in the dome. Is that right? Right? That the outdoor we don't >> total? 15 capacity with indoor courts included. actually works best on the other. course, look at double strike. does that can't can Troy, while you're up Can you talk about the inventory that we currently have regarding pickleball? Sure. know that it's spread out throughout our system, but >> I'd like to get an actual feel of the inventory of courts, indoor and outdoor owned by the city of Wichita. But then also an inventory of courts in the city of what shots that would include YMCA, some of the private businesses. I just liked big overview has that been studied? >> So I don't have the exact numbers revised all all of them, including all the private sector areas. The YMCA has just opened up a huge push for out of the West side their area that they've actually have indoor spaces that used to be gymnasiums. So they've been actually creating a lot of buzz in regards to pick the ball out there. I can speak for the city. The wait time several of our gymnasiums are take down for was a great example. I got out there to play people off with really interesting group. The pickleball players and so taping off will have 3 or 4 courts. So he's one of our recreation centers. Actually do rentals right now to see the winter time in the indoor courts. Each one of them is probably 3 or 4 courts. Outdoor courts if my memory serves me right. Councilmember Glasscock, you know, on on the Web site might be will help me out. I think we have 31 or outdoor pickleball courts. We have 36 total and that the striped ones Riverside. So actually. >> Yes, that includes instructions for site So I didn't 6 that actually bill brand-new over at Riverside. All these other ones were actually converted from tennis courts. And so one of the reasons why we really look look at this project and we have this conflict of tennis and we have this conflict with pickleball. The idea was to. growing number of pickleball courts without losing the number of tennis courts. We have taken to a test course way from the test community and they're not very happy about Ongoing different levels. But over at Riverside, in particular. We added 2 new tennis courts. For the USDA to host Lars Tennis tournaments at that location. We are going gangbusters on tennis over at Riverside. So it's not just pickleball that's There's a lot of other sports are going, but tennis is going as well. We're doing a lot more test. Wickets were doing a whole lot more tennis lessons. We have staff over there that we brought in, particularly to bolster tennis over at Riverside. So when if we were to move pickleball over to Riverside, we be pushing out the tennis community and we have to find other locations for them too. Have 20 minutes participate at the same level. that's whole reason why we're really looking at new courts, a new location. The police very specific to pickleball so they can not only do don't turn us, they could have their own gatherings. They couldn't do their own It would be a place just for pickleball. They're this will be a question for USA Pickleball. Is there a detriment for re of courts. Do you still play Henri strike courts as part of regional national tournaments? >> You still So according my calculations, if we have 15 courts, we also if we re purpose just for regional tournament, readable strike all the tennis courts to also the pickleball courts will be a total of 67 courts that we could have a Riverside, 67 court allow re striped. First up are some of the debris strike. Some of them would be just ball court to be 67 court. You can have which would have capacity for national tournament, correct? >> As I mentioned before, is a number that we've worked with in the past. We had 72 this last year Caymanions Texas. This coming year. We'll will be at 41. So it fluctuates and whatever that number is defines, just how many participants can be. So restricting does not prohibit regional or national groups are striking Typically, you know, when you you'll have dedicated courts and a facility and then when you expand for a large event, that's a that's a very typical approach. So if we had 9 courts that were singularly striped just for pickleball, plus, an additional courts Q A about route, 58 courts that or restraint. >> That would be a positive that we can. people are certainly certainly you do need to keep in mind other. And I take a look at the riverside site. >> There's a couple concerns I have initially was parking access because it's end of And it's a Second thing I'm not sure consideration has been given to this it is with the river running right by it. There's a number of just north of it. Around in in an arc the river basically. fives. No, and so while it's a 550 feet from the edge of the courts to the front porch of one of the homes, about 300 that is reversed, which positively Krista provocation. What what changes that would be to provocations. So be the equivalent of being about 250 feet from a very large-scale complex to residential area. So you may have an increased a key issue if you were to scaling like and I don't know if there's anything system now, I think the courts where they are now there's a commercial industrial. Not sure what it to west across river, which should be no impact. From standpoint. If you expand it further, you may see some. Okay. Thank you for the comments. I'm sure Council Ballard Vice Mayor ballot would love to have more trees to act as the sound barrier. Riverside, So thank you. I appreciate your question. >> That's going to add one thing, a council member and just kind of from our experience is just to try to manage expectations. checked with his organization and Josh is here, too. If you want, if you want to ask him specific, we haven't had lakes or any momentum on taking existing riverside and doing I think what you're thinking about to attract international. One of the things that we've been up maybe, Karl, you can chat with it is can taking a tournament playing some indoor and some outdoor was problematic to try to do what you're going. And so it's outdoor and also looking for that truly that facility. So just to kind of manage expectations. And we chatted about with economic impact is this is a dedicated facility with not dual striped with their own facility. And what? Yes, you can plan that we have not had the momentum to host what you're referring to yet. So just want to kind of manage >> I'll just one follow-up before a lot. Vice Mayor Matt Ballard had a couple questions. Just again after learning about all the different leagues and all the competitions that we could attract. Even with our current inventory and your challenge choices, try it. You there are small-scale amateur tournaments that we could try to pitch out with our current facilities. So I guess this is a child. and ask that to staff with our current facilities. Can we also try even now whatever happens with the future of South Lake to try to get again small winds of getting these tournaments. >> So, yes, we actually have hosted several smaller amateur tournaments. We've had folks from Oklahoma folks coming up from Kansas City to actually participate. I have spoken to pickleball folks from all around the region and yeah, they they come down here. However, it's not. The place that they really want to come to the places that they want to come to is an actual facility that's actually bill for pickleball. There is an amateur league that spoke to as well. That they have have promoted. locations throughout the region. And one of the things we really want to do is actually start creating a rivalry with which to pickleball folks against a Kansas City or Oklahoma City. Tulsa. And so there's actually an a much perspective, actually travel back and forth, but actually haven't come here to to so we we have tried We will talk more about but we are encouraged to do more. This facility would really enhance 10 times more. I'm having to think about it too space. >> this may be for try it. We've talked a lot about tournaments and trying to recreate events. What about just >> daily or weekly or So I should know this, but I'm not pickleball player. So I'm sorry. But let's say that, you know, Johnson and I want to go out and we're going to have fun evening tonight. We're going play pickleball that we reserve the courts or is it just first come first serve? >> So with this many court at one location, I mean, now with what we have with okay, depends on the time frame over at Riverside. I think we've to charge $2. Today in regards to using the pickleball courts other pickleball courts that are open to the public. There's there's no charge. So there's a lot of ways of playing pickleball with your friends in groups. If they're small group he can play. If there's a larger group that's waiting. There's different round Robins that happened in regards to getting everybody a chance to play. But we'll talk Riverside. So you can definitely call and get a And so we'll hold that reservation for you to play in the evenings depth. That particular facility is quite And that was going to be question, is it it? We find that it's at capacity. >> In the evenings, there's quite a few people plan to Yes, because I totally appreciate that would be looking for the, you know, regional tournaments or the national tournament. Of course, that's important. But I think we heard a maybe 3 or 4 weekends of the year. And so just want you know. >> Learn more if. Just the daily, tons who are using the facilities are saying they want more opportunities. I haven't heard from any of my constituents. That does it mean that my colleagues have under others haven't. But I was just curious about not just thinking about the tournament aspect. >> So we brought a professional on board his things Noi and he does tons of lessons for us. And one of his concerns. The complaint says that he does have enough court space and the same thing's happening with tennis. They're all competing for the scene. particular piece of real state. So if this was to be constructed and built be 24 courts that could be used for more programming in regards to lessons leagues and local tournaments. Let's of clinics that could be done so the idea is to really bring in a lot new players, bring in folks at the very entry level and giving them opportunities to get the basics and then learned from our staff and then be able to go to other And there's the places to play pickleball, which has well where they can continue to play. Thank This is a really important point brought up what tried to address in this in this slide. And that is up. >> first case, 30 minute drive time. Those are your daily users. And so we're talking about the big events. The pro dancer, even large, the amateur events. They these are the guys that show up several times a week. And so you got a large market already for that. And so with the 24 court facility they're they're always there. They're always open. You don't have to strike You know, they don't have to be temporarily strive to accommodate and increasing market over time. one last based on. Something Detroit I just mentioned is programming. So that. The design on this, what would actually allow almost a modular approach to programming. So typically in smaller facilities got it's all clinic during a certain period or it's all drop player plays called it's a reserved play and facility of this size. You can actually program these different court modules in different ways so that clinic's going on court through 6 through 12. You've got drop-in play of a certain level on one through 6 and a higher level on the 13 18. Having something of this scale cause you a lot more flexibility how you program, which also can impact if you're running, lessons leads, all these can generated for the city as well. question for you call me maybe Troy do facilities of multiple courts. >> Do they have and on site? Director? 24 7 or just during the day. How do they do manage that? There's a couple different approach is probably the largest facility in the country. I think it still is. It will be surpassed here fairly soon. >> Florida, it's East Naples Community Park 60 plus courts their approach been to retain a concessionaire that would come in and operate of the league's son and all of aspects of day-to-day management of it. Other municipalities are hiring talent that will act as a GM and in some cases, their dual purpose. They also teach if to programs large enough, there may be a number of a head count assigned to attempt not only would operationally run it, but then conduct conduct a instruction as well. >> But it varies. Do they charge a fee for daily play? >> Again, that various it depends on what to the municipalities strategy is. Is it intended to be a a moneymaker, you know, revenue driver for the city? Is it purely an for its citizens? it's different. Every facilities is a different approach to Typically there's there's a drop in that I'm seeing that more >> I know it's I I do. But the at the West, why and the cover of the tennis courts completely typical Baltimore basketball. Great facility I know is to come a leveling off of play, though. Still busy. But you get a game within 5 minutes. 10 minutes. So. >> Yes, it's a So in terms of the leveling off, you do want. And she asked Rick organizers, you know, year. Organizing drop-in play to make sure that everybody gets a good. It's a good workout. If your running socials and things like that, there's a number of things that can be done to to continue to pull in new Troy mentioned newbies. And I think that's that's very Any people acquainted with the sport comfortable with the rules and scoring that type of thing that will continue to drive growth over facility without leadership or some type of organizing element on cam. You know, you can off. Thank you. So highly recommend someone on site or some of is there quite frequently The other questions. Thank you very Appreciate it. >> So we still have a few more slides to go through. But I think we got through most of the meat potatoes. But I'm gonna rescue. These are the ones pretty quickly. Nick, I'm going to go ahead and do your person just so we can get there a little quicker. So we get a the study at this South Lakes. We're very concerned about making sure that we were going to be compliant and good neighbors. And so once we start learning a little about the issues with sound and it's great to hear comments saying that there's things that are mitigating ways to we used to send the issue. We decided to do research about this. We were actually going to actually host put in the is that. ball facility up here on the north end of all the feels the know how close it is to neighbors. We did own study and we found that it would might be impacting them a little bit. It was a very quick and easy redirection down to the bottom or the south and using the very south in fields mitigate that situation. So. This is a little bit more information in regards to all the details. But the short version of all this is we just moved from the north to the south to address any kind sound issues and we're way beyond any impact to the community. Here's a little bit more about the actual decibels that we. would be looking at. And so we definitely fit in within all the criteria. little bit more about the design. Another reason why we really can light this area and the idea of hosting a large tournament here. We have over 900 parking We have plenty room to add in tents for VIP ease location for the players and referees opportunities for our sponsors to put out their tables which and ice from which and I sing another information can happen here as well. So it becomes an event where we can actually bring in a stage and maybe there's a little bit of music, but definitely an awards ceremony that's would be very, very worthy. Talking to to the different professional leagues are out there. Nobody else is being able to do that. And that was one of the reasons why this location is really exciting to riverside can be but there's a lot of different issues and guys to space lot issues in regards to parking and logistics. Here's a spike space. That's not impact. Anybody in regards traffic and we can really whoa some great events here. you need to go back a little bit as well. Also building up brooms all the way around the court. And there's actually a big hill over here. Our former Parks and recreation director. name is Doug Kupper he did constructed a large mound of dirt there as we call it now, cover. everywhere around here, there's actually going to be built up berms for several reasons to kind of make it a little bit more inclusive inside the well area and help reduce the wind. We'll be putting trees on top of berms as well. It's kind of spread out nicely. So is broken up in sections. You see a lot of other designs just a straight land of court says kind of breaks up a little bit. The championship court. I'm here actually you can take one of the court's out and put in temporary seating in there to make that the quality massive, championship court that they would really like to see. So just really kind stickley pleasing. Really, really Clubhouse clubhouse would have restrooms offices and opportunity for concessions as well. And a little bit more about Jade. I'm sorry, husband, Justin us little bit about staffing. Could we have a pro and all of the programming and activities from Riverside would transfer will be here and he would get an officer here would probably have one on site manager both of these positions will probably be contracted. That would be very much associated with department and directed with us. We would be using part-time seasonal for the front desk activities the program that we have. So this gives a really nice basic foundation for day-to-day with support all of the toilets as well for the really, really likes will probably have to bring in some extra port-a-potties because this restrooms probably would not be enough. for everything else, these would be really adequate. Here's a quick look at the championship courts. With the seeding and shade. A little bit about the lighting as well. We when a little bit of a different direction using LED lights and these lights are efficient and they're actually a little bit and the reason was because we really want to reduce the light pollution and these lights really hit to the courts. And I really directed to the courts. So want to this one this summer. We're hosting a 3 on 3. Sand soccer professional tournament over O J. Watson, what he wants and we have all of our volleyball courts and we're going to be renting that space out for this traveling professional tournament. They going to be going from the east to west. And so they just becoming all the way across. They sports or We'll bring in one more items into like this and to which a tough so this could help put which time the map trying to going after those other bitterness. So just pick a ball will help put which on that. Now I'm going correct myself because I just looked over defender here. And actually, she told me that is on the map for all these tournaments that that she brings it in House. So this is just be another one of those really county excited because things like Ardis golf Ulrich lap is expanding and we're going to be hosting some large It's there. Also Lap are going to be hosting cross-country to WSU. So we'll have collegian cross-country over clap. These are all things that we're working on. Not just pickleball. It keeps moving and moving. couple things. Just to wrap up a little bit. This location has tons of potential for naming rights and sponsorships. But he's brought in a group that has been talking to all of our departments about opportunities for sponsorships. The ice rink is another great example that we can actually use for sponsorships. We've actually we see the couple one particular letter foundation has provided a grant for the Senate courts to be named after picking Middleton. I talked to a little bit earlier by rebuilding will be able to actually start looking at other contractors to they on this project. And by the first bid we were. $600,000 below the estimated costs. the sooner we redid the sooner we might have those opportunities to have. low cost estimate. So the end of the our recommendation is to go back out for bid for construction. we answer some questions, but you might have some more. >> I'll start with one question. First and the current price tag for this specific project. It got inflated from where it first started. And I think community wants to know number why got inflated that at the same time. How much maintenance would have been required for this new project versus what we currently pay for maintenance on that land right now with really not a lot of amenities currently because I'm getting very concerned that the next topic that we're going to talk about is the actual budget. And we've gotten this presentation before. And I think it's a nice reminder to community that. In 2025. We are going to be out spending more than we're receiving. And so we're going to have a shortfall. Yes, and so we're going to have to be responsible about these tough decisions. And I know that this is part of cip. But I see on here that financial priorities for Cip will be existing debt service is number one, number 2 projects in progress. Number 3 projects in design number 4 projects in prior Cip. And then finally, new projects. And so I'm trying to be responsible with these very large price decisions. And so if you can explain to me the current budget for this, how it got inflate to its current price tag. What maintenance would look like right now versus with a new facility. Sure. >> So currently project is actually been initiated. So the dogs, every been an issue for this actually a prior project it certain already passed design because it's already been designed and it's relief. It's actually been been bid. The bid actually came out underneath the estimated costs. We very close to actually constructing this. It was ready to go out the door. So reason why it was increased. From about 3 million dollars to a 6 million dollars was to add the additional courts to make this a facility that's going to be able to host larger events and the construction cost increased. first, we're talking about this project. This goes back almost 6 years ago. Here's a timeline of all the different step points that we need to hear going to design council going to council the prior to 2 and a half years before that is when we were actually discussing a lot items regards to pickleball. At that time. The pickleball inventory courts was very, very low. So we started comparing a few more and what if we add There's always going to be increased demand. I think if we add this is really going to suffice. Many of the needs of the pickleball community and I think they would be extremely happy. very, very grateful. Qasem regards to operations. And maintenance currently right now, its grass irrigated. So we mow that grass a once a week. We probably 2 or 3 times a week. I couldn't tell you the exact cost for that particular square acreage it's it's not a whole lot in regards to the overall budget. The weird thing about courts with basketball court. Tennis courts. All right here in particular, pickleball courts concrete we will probably have to spray them down once or twice a week. Staff that would be staff duty but in general, the courts, you know, the infrastructure around really doesn't take a whole and maintenance of the actual building. We'll probably its bases as well as hitting in there. probably have to some mean it's costing me guards to maintaining they say HVAC is was the heating costs, but it's not anything that we not can't fit into our current budget that we have right now. So I don't think that's going to be really going to have a huge impact in our maintenance budget. question. I'm sure you already have operating budget for this Can you tell us what that budget is? >> For for the pro there. The part-time HVAC replacement cost. I'm sure put some replacement cost in there to to get a breaks down. that's going to be very similar to what we have over here at the tennis center. >> It's roughly about 250 to $300,000 of that. A lot of the revenues that come in since we use contractor staff 4 lessons and helping us with some of the 20 minutes. Those revenues hope pay for those a particular salaries. So what's the net? Actually cost versus income? What's the net operating cost of that facility? project last year and the year before was first time in several years that we were actually in the black. This year. We're going definitely be in the black because we have really got a big, huge moving forward. This is on the tennis center. Yes, and the same protection you have for that this facility, actually, I think we might have a little bit more because there's more more courts. Okay. Does that include capital cost of replacing? Things went breaks. Makes downers that come from your budget or that would probably work in later on in regards capital dollars of capital other projects might have. Okay. So it does not right OK? But again, so a tour of the tennis center. items such its face. really haven't had any major. mean, its concerns, the parking lot. These the That's been terrible. Yeah. Well, all parking lots. Yeah. question. >> actually have someone text me a question and ask if there is a cost recovery model that describes user fees as they define revenue component. >> That's what we're talking about. So a lot of the revenues will come from fees. Most of them probably lessons least 20 minutes. small amount regards to daily rental. So just like we have over at Riverside, you're paying 2 bucks to use it for an hour. And that's supposed to larger dropping fees at chicken n Pickle and and over at the Thanks >> I don't know where go with this, but this proper pre. this entire presentation kind of reminds some of the conversation we tend have and the city. So talking about what we currently have, the double stright. It's good. But it's not what the sport wants. Looking at an opportunity for which is taught to do something bigger, which is what could be a regional attraction, especially in South Wichita. Versus just. Kind of accepting what we have. And feel like we're kind of a how Wichita, 6 Epps being good, rather that pushing for have a great opportunity like this and thoughtfulness, an expansion and even seeing the potential expansion 6 more course that could happen. And a space like this that is dedicated solely to that. And just thinking about the whole pickleball group that. blew both up for a couple years trying to get as more converted. This could be. Pretty big and thinking about the development that could happen around listening to the potential regional tournament says, of course, with everyday use. The Senate actually starting to make me think a little bit different about it. I think this could pretty big, but I come down to. Do we want to settle for what we have. Is good enough or push for something that really could push us into a different stratosphere? And bringing folks here this presentation really kind of helped me to see that a little better what I saw before. So. Just want to say thank you for Because I hear the double strike. Complaint and also the kind of tension between tennis and pickleball part of But looking at those different lines on there, I think this could be something cool if we catch on to it now, we really could be for the region for something like this and much like the ice because there's spaces within one in 3 minutes. You know, there's opportunities to before you get to a facility like So I just appreciate the work that that you all have done and having all different folks come in and get that information. >> I think if we get sponsorships naming rights really have an impact in regards to the operations as well as budget for the cut for the construction. Councilmember blue ball had really look at this as an opportunity of. An anchor for this community to bring in more development. Not necessarily to the bank, it to striker, I think that's kind of things that he was looking forward to. to seeing with this. And there's plenty of space in the. And the rest of the. The park area for any more activities or amenities that could just bolster this this area to be really big. Jim. >> If this was approved with there be challenge versus the park director who could plan? And the city You would you lose every time which you live. >> Haha. I would make sure I win. Haha. and that judges any time. well hope the answer to questions. I I know this went really long and I apologize. There's a lot of information and a lot of facts I thought was very important that we share this with you so you can have all the information, have informed decisions and have all the facts. If you have any more questions. And I think you guys met with one of my friends that Mayfield and he provided us with a lot of information. If there's anything more you would like information, please let me know. >> I just want to make one closing comments. Thank you for the information and thank you for the guests who joined us today to answer all of our questions. When I joined this council in 2019 was when striker was being completed. And I remember the very last project management meeting for Shaker was my very first meeting. attend it. And one of the comments that was made as they were giving me some background is that we moved soccer from south, which is tied to district 2 to striker and then a promise was made that we would replace something in South Wichita for the residents there, but also for the whole community. So that's something that's also going through my mind as we're having these discussions is we did make a promise that we would try and replace the soccer that was removed from south, which top so thank you again. Try welcome. Thank you very much. The mayor. I have some as this resides in District 4 in South all turns become half of that as well. >> First off ball I appreciate I play together. That would be the few And so I enjoyed the opportunity to go out there and play with some members of ball community and different throughout the past couple months to be able to understand more about problem. And this is all the emails I've got or are pickleball most. You've also got regarding sense elected. I have put off every single and I have tried to review it as well. In addition to I think there's different components to this presentation that I think are different conversations. I think there's a well member Tuttle said and regarding the need for southwest some amenity, I think there's a neighborhood component of how do get to the neighbors and that separate the regional component to I think the regional component make sense at Riverside where there's a capacity and I'll get to that in a second. But I think there is a need for something at the South Lakes complex that supports the neighbors and that doesn't have to be the regional approach. Those are 2 different things. In addition, what mayor we said, we are facing budget shortfalls in the coming years to so how would be good stewards realizing that? Yes, the IP and budgets different, but they do go hand in hand and are decisions that regard Cip as Councilman Johnson said, affect the operating budget long term as well. That will have an effect on our budget process. So I was trying just run some quick numbers. And first off, the quality of life again as important south, which tigers, the quality of life of what amenities can we offer quality of life. But there's a quality of life as theirs. Homeless encampments at the Southlake Sports Complex on the right side of the encampment are right side of the photo as well. But I get comments from neighborhoods off. Yes, right around there is where we have homeless encampments. And so there's a quality of life component to of how do we balance additional amenities while also making sure we have quality of life for forsman of our laws, too. And I do believe that there's a way that we can balance all of these. And I think we have to balance all of them. I wanted the councilman Blue ball for all the work he's done on this and trying to bring investment. It's unfortunate. I support your Windows. soccer. I grew up here every single weekend playing soccer and I was sad to see it leave this area because I think is a great facility. But striker is a fantastic facility in east Wichita as well. looking at numbers that were that was mentioned by USA Pickleball. I understand everything the government touches usually balloons in terms of the cost analysis of that. So these are exact reflections of it. So 34,045 1000 court is what was estimated. And that's a Greenfield development. So let's say adding in U.S., Councilman Johnson's point, not just re striping, but adding new courts, riverside, and all we need to do is at 9 courts for a regional facility based on their current capacity. There be maybe a couple course of the restart, but based on those numbers that would cost $306,000 of the city budget understanding that there would probably cost because we're working in a process and might be a little bit different South Lakes to address the need for a neighborhood facility. Let's say we had 6 courts which will be the 3rd most courts of any facility in Wichita behind Riverside and edge Moore to be tied with Seneca. So between Seneca and Southlake. So total 12 courts out of our 36 would be in my district. So it's a huge capacity and itself and actually more than that because you have Osage. So that actually be what 14 courts out of the 36 would be in district 4 to 6, a huge passing. So again, understanding things to be ballooned. You have $204,000 that are costing that one may cost more because you have to add amenities without lighting infrastructure. So let's blew that up to a million go for to report 1000, 2 million to build a neighborhood facility. Riverside, you know, 306,000 is what the price per court is. Let's blew that up to a million dollars as well. So we have 2 million dollars that we could offer a regional facility that we could also offer a neighborhood facility and then to address the pressing need that I hear from individuals and especially given the states decision yesterday to likely not move forward on funding for a component of emergency shelter and enforcing the laws say we advocate for million of the 6 million so we can enforce our laws, which is the quality of life issue that I think has an effect on building a park in South Lake said you have an encampment over there as well. So it's that we have 4 million dollars of the 6 million dollars that goes towards investment, enforcing our laws. You have 6 million dollars. You get a regional facility. You get a neighborhood facility at South Lakes and you better allocate money in terms of priority later on. And you can do everything for that type of money. I that probably the best way to spend our money. We can get every single objective and we can make sure to better dispersed our funds right now. So those are kind my thoughts. I think Troy said, quote, that I wrote was that Riverside, quote, Can be used currently. But the question is, are the traffic impact? And I think those are questions that we can address as communities. We know council Johnson said that will probably have to redo a parking lot to make sure that it's more accessible anyway. We also bring people in the downtown core, which is one of our objectives of visit, which caused encouraged all of the downtown core as well. And I think we can be the regional destination for many sports. And you do all these things, spending money wisely and addressing everything. So I know that was long. I read a lot of those but I'm happy to hear the rest of the discussion. I don't have any. It >> I would like to ask you how this feasibly could move forward. I see on our packet a recommendation was to go back out to bid for construction and again, that's for the 6 million dollar plan. Do you have a council member with? This idea? How does this now move forward? >> What we look for some consensus today, but all possible you can fold to right. But we're looking see if there's direction you want to go. It wasn't 9 court in Riverside that you. >> 9 courts would get up to the needed. 24 for us. >> If the idea is to a neighborhood complex in South Lake sits 6 courts like opportunity to go back and look at what that would look, you know, who would be, I think just 6 courts without shade structures and all of that would be difficult given the openness of it. We have to look at some of that. But so if we're not, if were. With the courts and then you ask us to come back with some As for part of the cip, we can do that with the remaining whether its 4 million are slightly less going is if I understand it right to shelter as part of our MAC concept, right? But specifically for shelter. Than what we would do is incorporate that into our planning going forward. As we put the pieces together on Mac as well as prepare the cip for you. We and then we would bring pickleball courts if we can get the final project, a project will bring them to you for approval an authorization to go out to bid for this work. >> question is the money that was a lot set aside for this project. I mean, it is if it's arpa money or they're like rules to where he wants to shuffle around them. We could still do We should be able Thanks >> I would like to Councilmember Glasscock the U.S. a sense we're looking for consensus. I would like to see that just put so much thought into what does that look like in the different areas that you talked about and then also some feedback from visit Wichita Pickleball USA just to see what they think how a tractor >> Thank you, mayor. I would also like to see options just to see what these all these options look like, including possibly keeping the pickleball court. you know, with with some of the movement here in the last week funding for the It's definitely something that we need to look at. So I appreciate that. But I just options where council is on us. Not not to be partisan at all, but I think there are 2 city-owned pickleball courts in district 5. >> part that's correct. So we can look at putting a few more district. 5, 2, I'm not just saying that. You know, the the how many courts in the city. 36. 36. So 2 of my district, 5. deserve little more It said and I recognize that don't include building out infrastructure. And so there will additional costs that I I like the managers recommendation of building. What would these cost? And then we can look at how much. >> Make not the priority. But having a regional component having the neighbor component and then what can we divert towards the emergency shelter space I think would be the priority. I would like to clarify one thing. Centcom Park is actually your district. is district district. 4. You're just. your does in district 6. They took it away from district 5 putting district 6 couple miles there. just like to make Of course, I'm always open for options. explore everything that we can before you make a good decision. >> My only concern and I'm neutral at this point. I want to be a blank slate until we see this new information presented to us. But I do have a concern of South Lakes that if we go from 24 courts to 6 courts. What is the viability that if that project and is that even a good use of funds? I'm not saying yes or no. I'm just saying that needs to be something that's looked at because when this project doubled in cost is it was because we were presented with information that, you know, if we to something good and made it great, we get a bigger return on investment. And so if we take something and and strip it down so much is the return on investment going to be so diminished that it's not worth it. So I don't know why that's well look forward to seeing more information as it's presented. I do want to look at that the big picture and where we want to go. I've seen. You know, the success of sporting events at striker in District 2 in the economic impact that it can have. I don't know if it can hear that for people who are smarter than me to help us determine. But again, as my my good friend in Councilmember Johnson said, I don't I don't want us to not think we deserved nice things because we do. Thank you. I do want to echo councilmember totals point realizing that when I knocked on 4,000 doors. >> One person and district 4, was in favor of the pickleball at South Lakes. And so do I think we have capacity. I think neighbors around that area might use the complex. Is there a better way that we can engage the is it pickleball at South Lakes is going to be next track. Is it something else that neighbors would want in that district? And so I'm open to those conversations. But I do think the party has to be. The regional in terms of talk about football, the region about how do we attract people and how can do most cost efficient way utilizing the resources we have while still has comes with Johnson said not just re striping, adding court and make in a world class facility, but having maybe better serve the neighbors in the neighbor, maybe some people may be have X, maybe just a and just to add on, if they can, kids were last CAC. I I appreciate those comments. I also seeing said >> you some of the amenities that we have in the city. Certainly it's in your district, but its city-wide like I don't consider striker this to be a district to amenity the impact that it has in the entire city is significant. You know, I I was getting texts from people in my district saying that good pick. They go south, likes to play pickleball there like bubble. So I I think we need to look at like as a city, right perspective. And then also, as you mentioned, regionally. >> I may point out that that I'm sure councilmember realize this. striker is privately run. Not city, run. So country with? Yeah, contract. So. You know, we spent a lot a lot of time out there watching grand kids play soccer and it's all hours of all days, Sunday morning, every every which time. would it be possible for the tennis complex? And or all the tennis and pickleball to be an enterprise fund. Is that a possibility stand on his own? So if the budget. >> We treated as it is as as enterprise. We. Track in and monitor the revenues or expenses. our goal is always to be in the black it's way different than some of operations, especially Quad IX aquatics is not a moneymaker whatsoever, but it's an amenity that the community wants and needs. So it is really exciting when we have. Increased the Riverside brought quality staff over The tennis pro grant. He came from Genesis. He's bringing in a lot of great ideas. He has great connections and contacts with the USDA. United States Tennis Association. The USDA is taking huge notice regards to all of our tennis activities along with all that is all going over there as well. And so we're definitely moving in the And when when you look at these Troy D do you take in account HR a fee for a job, fees for finance or does it just purely? >> Direct costs. >> look at direct cost because it have built into my budget. From my supervision of that staff and that facility Enterprise Fund would be assessed. Indirect cost. Could be depends on how we set it up. That there's a lot of different ways to do OK? Yeah, thank you. >> have a couple when we get from staff, more information regarding this idea expanding permanent courts at Riverside. Couple of things have have been brought up regarding parking and accessibility. So I'd like to know number one is actual Okay. So the answer is yes. There is actual space 9, possibly may or we need to master plan and have to figure out what we can get on that space and what we can sport with the infrastructure. Yes, then the other question I would have just >> we >> no longer have a parking lot across the street from the Mid-American All Indian because the weight of vehicles is just too heavy for our water infrastructure underneath. And I know that this has been talked about in the past regarding can this be green space and open space? How else can we activate that space? And so I'd like to throw that also as a possibility. What could that look like as a maybe I don't know what the weight of a pickleball court will be on top of that land. But I'm just trying to think outside the box again to try to utilize a lot of already city-owned property to best utilize more about big master plan in the core. >> I think we'll some even that load on top of ceiling or the roof but will we can take a look at? >> Just one last I appreciate the creativity of of all of this. But I do want to highlight that. The state legislature. Has huge purse of more than a billion dollars because of a lack of action. We're now looking at changing our quality of life plans. To support something that they should be supported. And I think that's unfortunate. >> I something to the discussion. So right now it looks like is a million dollars for some sort of improvements and expansion of Riverside, a million dollars for a neighborhood expansion of courts perman again, permanent courts for pickleball. Would it in South Lake and then 3 to 4 million homeless shelter specifically for our multi agency center, one-stop shop location. Is there any way maybe instead of Alex? Thinking about it just as a budget for that facility. If we add it, the 1 million to riverside, how can we best utilize that location for expansion of pickleball that may be might not just permanent court outdoor. Could it be the bubble that gets expanded? I'm just asking questions that again, pushes us beyond just thinking we just need to build outdoor pickleball courts. >> will take a look, mayor, and what it would take to make this a viable regional facility. And again, here in that, there's some concern about indoor When you're doing tournament. So we'll take a look at that. >> Thank you very much. Try and thank you to all who came here to support pickleball and we appreciate your time. the next item was scheduled to be a discussion economic development and given the length of time that we've had on pickleball, we can't do justice to this and really get good feedback from going So we're going get this is OK with the council will push this back to the next workshop and make try to make that your primary discussion item, which means that we move on now to a discussion of the budget year, kind of a next step in the budget to seek some guidance from you, especially in the area of Cip. So if that's okay, mayor, that will move forward. >> city manager Elizabeth. >> Good morning. I'm everyone's getting situated. I'm Elizabeth culture, a work in the but Finance Department in the budget office and today is our 3rd City Council workshop regarding the budget so far this year, there was already a workshop on January. If you're just joining us for the first time today, there's a workshop on January 23rd where the survey results are presented overview of the performance measurement framework was presented as well. And then last month on February, 27th, the financial plan for the General Fund was presented and you can find all those materials and the presentation. Those are all available online. And then a few weeks ago, I guess one week ago I march 19 quarter for financial report for for 2023 was presented. So these are all you're joining us for the first time. These are all some elements of budget process We've already been there is so just jumping into the next topics today. That's okay. So they are looking for today to talk about budget resident engagement. We've had some exciting things happen in January and February March to connect the resident engagement schedule to the calendar for the budget process. And then to talk about the capital improvement program. So there's a lot of different elements that go into proposed budget. And we talked a lot last month about financial forecast. The community survey results have been addressed. And so this month, the focus and this presentation will be our and resident engagement. Just as a reminder, we're continually updating the financial plan for the Things like the labor market overall, economic conditions, both regionally and on a larger scale impacts the budget. And then also keep apprised of policy changes. So those could be things that happened in city Council meeting on a given Tuesday or those could be maybe at the state a federal level and then every month that we have more experience that helps solidify or forecasts. Just a reminder from last time and the 2024 budget is expected to be balanced. And that's because there's strong cyclical revenues that are offsetting increase public safety costs. And the out years of the budget. We're expecting that revenue growth. Will begin to and those large revenue tight, the large. Tech, the large revenues that they comprise or revenue portfolio says of the local sales tax franchise fees and property tax. We're expecting slower growth there. We're also expecting a decrease in interest earnings. And we're still expecting as always to have continued wage pressure and the general fund. And I'm just a reminder that 75% of the budget. And the general fund is for those top priority services. And a lot of it is for wages, salaries and benefits for police. So we're very much Service business and general fund so wage, which changes make a big difference. budget? And this is a repeat from last So the goal here is to be able to and India the right side of the site and to no longer have the whitening deficits, but to be able to get those 2 lines got together to be structurally balanced. So the good news is that in the left side, Les, I did this visual. We were able to transfer funds to the permit to the stabilization Reserve. And this site is also presented at the quarterly report presentations. So we were able to transfer funds to the stabilization reserve when we had those cyclical surpluses. However, there's not enough funding and the stabilization Reserve 4, on an ongoing basis. There's really the funding could be available to invest in innovations to help us be more sustainable in the future. But it's not an ongoing source of general fund support unless your time horizon is incredibly short. So I wouldn't that wouldn't work in the long term. That's just to catch you up on the budget process or the budget financial plan. So just every iteration on the community. Survey sir, presented for the first time in January. The discussion then was to focus on services rated by residents is being a high price higher priority. And we asked them. What, 2 great things as being a hyper, what kind of a priority they were would be in the next 2 years which aligns nicely to the budget process. So there's been more of a focus on incorporating survey results into the budget process. And it's been much more intentional than it's ever been. And so it earlier workshops. The consensus was to continue to provide highly rated services and the upper right or orange quadrant. But then to focus our attention, focus attention and potentially resources, I and the lower right project, which that's the mission to one where services are rated is a high priority for residents that are of lower quality. So just a reminder, crime prevention is 95% of the survey respondents rated. That is being a high priority in the next 2 years. Which that's pretty over pretty overwhelming and then street repair. I think it was around maybe 88 or 89% priority. So this is the quadrant. It's the same thing that's on the poster and then and just a reminder to see up close. These are the ones in the orange that are hired by higher quality, but also higher importance to residents. But then the focus this year that it would be on the magenta quadrant, which those are things that lower quality ratings that are higher importance in the next 2 years. So a little bit about resident engagement and what the requirements are for that and how we've handled resident engagement in the past. And it has changed over time. But by state statute, we are only required to hold 2 public hearings and make a formal notification. We've added 3 additional budget from the time that the budget is presented to adoption. And one of those public hearings in the evening. On a longstanding, it's been a longstanding history of presenting district advisory boards and other community groups. Maybe a 12 or 13 years ago. We added online engagement to reach our residents and then the budget simulator was added in 2019 and that can be used online as individual. But we've also taken a community meeting, some people the simulator together. And then on top of all that the annual survey which we've been doing since 2006 provides year to year. Comparisons. So that some background. So in January, 25th after the last we had 2 meetings that were followed up workshops and those are both of the Advanced Learning Library. invited participants who mostly graduates of the Civic Engagement Academy and also a lot of members of boards and other committees and commissions to join us. It was I highly civic engagement Academy graduates to anybody looking to engage in resident to do resident engagement. They're a wonderful group of individuals and very knowledgeable about the city of Wichita, our budget and the services we provide is a really wonderful experience at the first meeting. And the discussion was on the lower quality, higher important services. And then at the second meeting, we broke up into 2 groups and we discussed how to use some of the tools that we've used for budget and online engagement in the past to connect those 2 that magenta quadrant and the survey to get meaningful feedback this year. That will guide the budget process. Just a little bit about the social media town hall 13 years, Israeli It's been a long time. So our foes for social media town halls in 2012. >> And we started on Facebook. We added next Orange. What are now called acts and the magic of the social media town halls that we catch platforms that they already regularly use throughout the day there used to be a lot higher engagement through social media town hall than there has been recently in 2022, though, we say comparable. We have 65,000 impressions in 2022. 3400 engagements. And which would be like likes or dislikes. then 500 comments still a considerable amount of feedback when you would compare that to maybe a line of people at a city council That's the social media town hall. And these are just examples of that I just to show you topics that we've had in the past because they align somewhat to the mansion to I'm one of these was placing or maintenance expanding the street network or maintaining it. And then the one on the right was about us or is schools. >> So they would have the video. asked people what they think. was usually worked. The badges simulator was first used in 2019 and the last use that tool in 2022. so. When you set up the budget simulator, you can start with the balance to unbalanced budget. What we found and what other people's research is part now is that you have a lot higher participation win. The bout budget is not balanced to start with. Because there's more of a call, more of a call to action them with a balanced budget. Services are grouped by categories. And in 2020, we launched the Budget simulator in People are really interested in local government in 2020 for a variety of reasons. And online simulator was a great way something to do just so funny. And but to think pack for years, we 3100 budgets completed over 3 weeks. I wouldn't expect that kind of participation in the future. was 2020? It's easy to use. No logging is required and it's really easy use on a mobile device because you just different There's a slider. You move left. So that's some background on what we've done for social media and in the past budget engagement the past, you'll notice that in 2023. We kept a more traditional budget engagement approach just and I think a lot of that was because of the arpa funding that was available during for the budget, especially on the Cip slight site. And so now we're pivoting to a different arpa funding will be an available starting in 2025. Things are are little getting a little more stable. But when it comes to economic outlook and it's time to check in on priorities, we have proposed it in you. updated approach to resident engagement during the budget process. So the first ad I would be to have a social media town hall that would be focused on the lower quality, higher importance quadrant. So that's the magenta rectangle that there would be to social media town hall events. So one may be focused on crime prevention and will be focused on streets. So in the past, we would have one or 2 social media town hall events and they would be about a variety of topics. But this would be that there would be theme for each of the events and then there would be topics during that day and then we would stakeholders and partners in each of those topic areas the weave one of the magic parts of the social media town hall has always been that we've matched up subject matter. Experts to staff and the budget office and the communications team to respond to the topics. So we would have those people available that day. So kind of a hybrid it So there'd be online component and a lot of people in person responding to topics. So that's the idea for And then this is also a departure from how views the online budget simulator in the past. But it would be in the past. We grouped topics by what type of service they were. So we have public safety together and then maybe. Parks and libraries together. What we would predisposing here is that we would group services together by what quadrant they were in. So that lower quality high importance would be grouped together and so forth. And so increase decrease options would be based on the quadrants. So there could be some services were decrease or keep the same would be the only option. And then there in other quadrants increase or decrease could be options. That would be available. And so the idea is to have the social media town hall first. So that we include concepts from that event into the online budget simulator. And the feedback we got from the rant able to discipline to really our special group of people because they participate in the simulator. But in the past was that it's helpful when services that are compared are about the same size because it can be really hard to use. The simulator went police patrol services and fire emergency response in particular are so large compared to other services. So that was a challenge that they presented. And so something we're going to work on. So this is the budget calendar. So the concept is that this social media town hall events would be held in April and that the online budget simulator would be stood up in May. And hopefully if everything goes to plan that would be available for made meetings. but that's the idea. And so then there would be a workshop again in April. So the social media town hall results could share that and then add may at the end of May, the simulator results and then we move into finishing up the budget wants receive the AB notice in June. And these are the rest of our meetings. >> Before we go on to the capital improvement discussion, any comments or thoughts regarding the engagement? >> And that regarding social media town hall with this speed just virtual and no opportunity for people who wanted to come in person and ask. I think they can kind of person if they'd like to. Yeah, the participants and a budget around tables are really excited about that opportunity. They were all so excited about taking the budget simulator out to groups that they participated. >> A wonderful bunch. >> I had me We are. I think we're trying to do some public engagement around public safety. >> Anyways, as far as possible town halls or breakfast or whatnot. Is there room too? Tie the 2 together? I mean, I don't want to go in the streets when we're talking public safety that would that be another opportunity to engage people on the budget during the public safety townhomes. I'd like to keep the social media of that because we have people that interact with us that way that won't attend former public. public meeting. >> But we could see if that. get help. The discussion and help frame the discussion at the town hall meetings using maybe something, you know, what's in that tool or what we learned from social media may help shape the of town hall meetings as well. But yes, we can link the 2 together. I just want make sure we don't lose the integrity of the social media. know, I definitely want the system opportunity for more engagement on the issue. And the second one >> Before I was in office, I did play around with the budget simulator. I'm a warning to the public. It's a lot more difficult when you're sitting in this on the computer to to make these decisions. So I just wanted to to offer that as well. And it's so hard. >> I actually behind the scenes, I don't think people bells to 0 and a little grace. So. Every ready for the cip. I just one could know. Sorry, I'm sorry. that's fine. >> On that. But it's a leader last year. There wasn't a lot of room to kind of play with us. Like far as the dollars with me, I don't believe is like 2 or 5 million dollars there. I mean, in some aspects, that's not really that much money in our budget to kind of play with is. >> Yeah, that makes sense. I Ashleigh, what she's explaining for those of you who haven't been exposed to it, everything starts at 0 and then we can set up in there. Do we want to do? Plus or -5 or -10 plus or -1 plus or And so because millions percent certain has it. And so usually have pretty. >> Small amounts of change in the simulator simply because know that it seems like we're facing like the deficits are large. Is that dollar amount? >> But usually we're not looking at things that are that dramatic. But then what comes back is people like, I would have loved to have cut this by 50%. like we didn't need to cut it by 50%. So it is developing the options is hard. And so that's could see fact to have and I think that we have maybe 2 increment surf or increment each way. So that's really good Yeah, and I can't give you the specific situation, but I just remember last year. >> People that were kind of playing around with there were like, you know, you can only move like 2 million dollars or some whatever it was, but it just didn't in the grand scheme didn't really seem like you're really moving the market for which maybe is good, maybe as bad. If you're trying to kind of shift some money around. So anyway, for what it's worth. Yeah. Now that you mention it, I have I remember being a top-six getting all they see that it was 2 years ago because we can do this simulator. Instead we and yet we still remember. So, yeah, it was good feedback. So. >> No, all. >> It's it's great to hear people using it and providing feedback. And so we thought we were being nice by being more incremental like no, we want to okay. you what? OKC AP Okay. Are you ever ready to up? I feel like you guys are pretty warmed up for the cip to Okay. So what is this for the city of Wichita? The Cip is a 10 year plan for capital assets. The Cip includes financing element. So it includes the expenditures for projects and includes the debt service, existing and future debt service and then also revenue projections. The projects are grieved by category. So there's categories for water, Bridges, Park, 6 cetera, and then the financing sources are also is enough. I-2 ideas, financing sources. I would be things like local sales tax debt service fund revenue. And what have you? develop? And when we develop the it's driven by the city of which is hot mission and goals and by the community investment plan and the community Investments plan is the comp plan. A comprehensive plan for which on Cedric County. And that was endorsed by the city of Wichita in late 2015. This year. It is also guided by Needs-assessments a master-planned strategic plans and priorities Ation criteria that we have for all the projects that we intake. And the the cip, of course, is structured to be financially viable for the planning period. And the expenditure of our view. despite connects to all the different project groupings in the cip. So what you'll notice is that two-thirds of the cip is for utilities, freeways and special assessment project. So today spent a considerable amount of time talking about a park project, which is a surprisingly small slice of the cip. But part of the safety that we talk about the most because it's funded property tax. And then on funding source of this cip. If you flip back and forth, you'll notice that water and sewer match. Exactly because water finds water 100% and sewer. Likewise but on some other things, for example, on them, freeways, freeways have it for 80 of funding sources and and so forth. So geo out large revenue and local sales tax for about one quarter of the cip. But when we talk about the cip and all the tradeoffs all the decision-making in the those are the 2 categories and we talk about the most. And if you're interested more in the funding side there. So a bunch of 10, your financial plans and the cip for the funding sources. So this cip is aligned with policy parameters for the city of Wichita and the debt service fund. No levee is consistent 7 mills throughout the planning period. A cip and then the water and sewer rates are consistent with modeling and that cost of service analysis that stunned by the public works and utilities, hermit. Geo at large debts or is so that's general obligation. debt service is funded by property taxes to the debt service time is consistent with their guidelines and then our fund balances are maintained at appropriate levels. So as I alluded to, there's 2 main focus areas. talk about cip development. That is general obligation and it funds mostly parks I think parks are entirely geo with the exception of golf improvements, public safety, heavy equipment and public facilities, maintenance and improvement. So all those are competing for the same revenue and then local sales tax funds, freeways, bridges and streets. This is a really when I talk policy parameters. This is very important This is reflects the current adopt to see a piece that 24 to 33 cip. The idea is to have this stacked bar chart the below the yellow line, which is the revenue projection. call this the debt service a lot of the diet is short term and some a lot of it's about half of that long-term. So ideally, it would be a 50 50 mix existing service and then also pay as you go, which is the right one. And of course, a different wrinkle that we've had for the last few years, which has been great. But that's been arpa funding and a lot of dust and directed. To the cip for projects that would be funded by the debt service fund. So that's me the fueling of ongoing are new projects and projects construction. Feel a little bit different than it will be in the future. So when it's time to develop the cip, this is kind your your of operations for putting it together. So the first thing we look at is are existing debt service. We look at that for all of our different funds. We look at our projects in progress. So those are projects you can. There's tab in the cip called ongoing projects and only look at how much has been permanently. What's left to be financed projects that are under design projects that were in last year cip. And then finally, it's time to look at new projects. So if you were to look at it, compare their prior commitments to new projects. And this is not to say that we can do the entire cip and and new projects. This is just to say we're to look at this cip and take out everything that hasn't been initiated or doesn't need funded or isn't in progress. But just our current commitments, this space out on the right side new project capacity. Cover can tell you from the slide. That was a couple. The 4 ice like 30 that we've already filled it all. This current Cip has already filled up that space, right? But those projects have been initiated. Yeah, there are out years. And the other thing this is site tells you that there there seems to be a lot of interests and new items in the near term. And I think that we've been able to do that in some cases because of the arpa funding. But this cip doesn't have hardly any capacity in the near term and less the yellow line. We're really but otherwise, there's just not a tremendous. there's currently not a lot of capacity here in the near term. So if you're talking about new projects are reaffirming that the projects that were already in this up. It's really looking into the future. As I read it. I Tanner talking as I read somewhere. It's it's this is normal budgeting. But it feels like after our 5th period, it feels like ISIS terrority. So this is not this is just normal budgeting. But It's kind us. I feel like a new killer, I'm sure the next slide. The community investments planned. As I said, that's our comp plan for which it on Cedric County. They did a lot of looking at infrastructure priorities as part of that comp plan, their first priority. that is to maintain and replace that we currently have. And we go through actually the planning to to make sure that we're in conformance with the comp plan. They review the cip over half of our cip aligns with that first priority. About a 5th it is enhancements to currents, infrastructure and then a little over a quarter is to expand. But we currently have. That's that's currently in the CHP. So when we can actually operate, it's important to connect the operating budget again as the AP. And I don't I think we've done that better than ever. maybe the last decade or so they obviously have a connection from a financing standpoint because no levees split between the debt service fund in the general fund. And you'll notice that I said that we have 7 Mills. Modeled for the remainder of planning period. But it didn't used always used to be a different know Levy for the debt service fund in the past. So because of that shifting, we've had to integrate those 2 things together, but also they're integrated because a lot of times there's operating cost particularly for park projects that are expansions or enhancements. And it's important for the operating budgets, reflect those. And then also from a standpoint of strategic alignment, both the cip and the operating budget should align with the community survey and they should both be financially sustainable. And I think when we talk about the cip, when we talk about financial sustainability, we focus a lot on the 10 year what we call pro forma us for each of the funding sources. But it's also really important to look at financial sustainability related to the CIP has its impact on the operating budget. So when you prioritize maintenance projects that are just truly maintenance here, repaving something are replacing an HVAC system. Your custom will be the same or they may go down. But when you're looking at enhance meant and expansion projects, there could an impact on operating budget that in turn makes financially unsustainable. Even though maybe your debt service caso from the cip side are okay. So just some examples of all the maintenance projects that are in the cip with these are in the cip every year. So these are 10 your mouse. So for bridge rehab and repairs and million dollars a year. So 10 over 10 years. And then street maintenance is the largest one at 145 Million. For all of these different asset tapes, public and utilities department has a decision support tool. The objective of the decision support tool is to keep the assets for for asset in our inventory. The same. So when they're doing maintenance are truly doing maintenance or not, it can sing it. They're doing maintenance, a shooting at the same. Have a quick question. >> Rather paving money. Is that come out of this street? Pavement maintenance for? Is that separate? It's a separate line item. I think in the cip and it's not maintenance. It would be an enhancement yeah. Our next thing I think it's would be considered an enhancement. >> So a little bit about enhanced been an expansion projects. So and maybe the past 5 to 10 years, 7 of them weren't included in the cip because there were plans for each asset. Hi, I'm sending samples of plans that lead to projects being included in the cip. We're, you know, the Blanche Branch Library system plan, for example. And there's a bunch of there have been branch library and has been now that those are ongoing. And then some enhancement expansion projects are to capacity considerations or asset scores. So, for example, the fire station replacements, those are in the cip to to that that the asset scores and the police station were and are in the cip to just to the capacity at at the fire stations relative to staffing levels. And that really came to a head during COVID and then arterial street something that they look out and they include those in the cip. So back mention to was considering this clear today actually that budget to square. So. >> Again. >> You know, when when people look at this here, look at just the city which is high and they and they call an email, you they probably aren't thinking this is a capital improvement versus a maintenance thing. And we ran into it's interesting focus group for street maintenance is people who are delivery drivers and they have a lot of feedback about lots of different streets. And so there's someone talking about streets in this training is maintained in the 18. And actually it's actually it's in the cip for enhancements. So a lot of times that gets lost, particularly for street repair. Is it a cip or is it operating budget so that again goes back to the whole concept of integration. So when we're working on the next cip, which will go all the way to 2034. The community survey could be used to prioritize projects in the cip. So as I use local sales tax for roads, bridges and highways. But there is. There was a priority to maybe change how and maintenance funding for streets is allocated or increase or decrease those types of things that could be something that would be the kind feedback that would guide cip development. And going back to the grass that has the space in the out years for those projects that aren't in-progress aren't, you know, moving along in the process he has those could be reviewed in future years. And that's also where one would consider putting new projects. And then another concept would to consider doing planning efforts more. Probably. I think that looking back at the site about it can I think there's been planning efforts about specific things I don't know that it connects probably entire looks scary. So that's high. Something that could be improved So that's you know, what's next for the cip getting together a little bit. If you can that slide on. >> So what we're looking for today is maybe some direction or agreement on a direction that we're contemplating for the cip. I'm using the quadrants. What you could expect is to see more money for street maintenance that we have. Traditionally Putin are projected to Putin. We've been looking at that for a and the feedback we've gotten initially on drilling down in the survey was it was residential streets of people are most concerned with. So we'll put more money into residential, not take away from local currently doing our Arterials and other streets, but had which means that we'll have to subtract someplace In terms of crime prevention you in the Cip. Would you be funding things like the real time crime Center and facilities are possibly the substations, even though there look, they look, we look at enhancements, they can help us in terms of our crime prevention initiatives. On the operating budget. We're going to try to bring to you a more comprehensive approach and it may have some capital implications as well in terms of other services that have an impact on crime prevention. We know that there are certain things we do and housing in Park and recreation library can have a long-term impact on crime rates. And so we're as a staff working through that strategic approach right now. And it may impact our recommendation cip as well. And then what we'd like to do is kind of go through the enhancement expansion projects. Was you were to try to get your thoughts if if this councils. issue maintain first, what we have right to maintain and that's to get us to a certain high-quality, I believe in terms of the existing infrastructure, we have. That's the case. Then it will need your guidance on what that means to some enhancement projects that are already in the cip or contemplated. He added to the cip. So if you're okay with that framework, that's what least from your initial discussions. That's where I think we would be And you can expect to see documents from us in that regard. It maybe even the workshop. We can start talking about some of that as are trying to put together the draft cip an operating >> So when you're talking about increasing areas such as public safety, the real time crime center and residential streets. Are you talking about bending the curve on what we're spending on other cip projects. Are you talking about literally going in and taking what we have a lot of for those in putting it towards the the other 2, probably going to be a little bit of both, mostly on the ladder it's going to Elizabeth, the show and we don't have a lot of capacity in this 10 year program that was adopted last year, which means that some projects are going to have to probably be shifted out beyond 10 years if they're in the enhanced mint category, but that you're going to make that decision. What I the only caution I have is not to get above the line because it's watched so closely by a grand which Some examples. I mean, >> some of us that on the council are working on some projects for a couple community feedback. asked for districts and things like that. >> All for maintenance and all that. But I don't just want to like shift gears completely to like stop anything that could potentially be new for our district that we've been working Just shift over here to completely change the way that we've been doing. >> yeah, I do. And that's difficult because I everything in district 6 what I think what we would and again, as we haven't strategized another about this yet. But I think what we probably do is first didn't find those that are very early stages or haven't even been discussed. But there's a place holder for them in the cip right? So we bring those first to you. And then there may be some tough discussions regarding projects that are at some phase of discussion in your district. And you you need collectively talk about, you know, how do you work through that? There's any kind of a framework we can think of. We will do that to provide some guidance so that your uniform what and how you apply it. But, you know, if public safety continues to be a high priority, you've got, you know, and in the enhancement category, you've got substation new substations and enhancements to and new fire stations. Right? So those are all things that you have to talk about. probably going to be others that are maybe more quality life amenities that we would have. want to talk through those? I think much like Vice I Korea. >> Maintain what we have is important. But the enhancement and expansion is too. And there are parts of our city would love to see some enhancement and expansion. I think we should consider using one project in the works right now. I think it's a great example is the person so we we maintain it as it was for enhanced and expanded like we did. There's just a whole lot of excitement about that. Many people it's about time. And I think there's a lot of parts of Wichita that may feel like that's what we're looking for. Cip. I think it is good to have with that. Looks like this to maintain what we have. the enhancement expansion projects that we've been working on think is key as well. >> If we could use the Brewer Center Plainview Center's examples. We I think we've got data that shows from, you know, nation, the national data that shows that what you do for recreational opportunities after school programming. All of that has an impact. Short-term and long-term on crime prevention, So again, you if you follow that framework, that will be part of a comprehensive strategy as we move forward and try to move the And I was going to bring up the example of thread great and having a trail that's better maintained in more utilized. Also is a crime prevention strategy. >> And that's something that I've been working on red but expands not expansions or enhance meant for years. So. >> We're thinking along the same lines. >> Mayor, I have a quick comment. I would be hard pressed to support any new development outside of the wreck or and I think. Yeah, we can talk about crime coverage. You could probably say every single thing we do in some ways crime prevention probably put a justification on that for every single thing. But I would lean far more towards taking care of our current facilities before building new facilities. That haven't already rejected an already moving forward unless it is in the right side of can be directly associated crime prevention because you could say, though, some things in the blue category or the green category to prime prevention say new Pools are it say that, you know, golf course are it's a recreation. So these are we can say that bus and transit service are. We can great sidewalks but I think we have to be able to be very pinpointed on crime prevention. First and making sure you have to for minutes and not just use that as a everythings crime prevention. And I do think there are some I mean, there's truth, recreation facilities, but I think we have to very clear connection. The crime prevention from me to be able to support a lot of those projects writing again, if we're in that quadrant to not to get into a debate today. But >> if you talk about transit service, for instance, you're talking about economic development, which is also in that quadrant. Yeah, a lot of the things on the right. I'm even stormwater management. I think a lot of people probably consider that as part of street compared ask the general public. So I think those things are probably similar. >> Based on how the questions asked individuals. I'd like echo message I mentioned last week report 2 weeks ago regarding the park study. So I feel like we have a lot of really great conversations. Even the lot the last few hours regarding quality of life and how that is important. And that is. A part of the mission of the city of what should you look at the mission statement for the city of which shot? It's number 3 and so I would like to know where we're a park study, a comprehensive park study to try to figure as I was just doing some research. And while I was here, I mean, city of which 5,000 Acres, 144 parks, according to our website. Des Moines, Iowa, has 77 parks and 4,000 acres of land. Tulsa has 6500 Acres 135 parks. We're very spread out community. That's what has happened with our community. And so we have started trying to make efforts to focus on the things that we believe need to be maintained because we've made investments. I think we have to. When we talk about. Possibly making tough decisions, if we can have more of a comprehensive idea of we're the park's and why they are important. I do believe parks are important and I want more people to We just had our press conference on Thursday at Fairmount Park. But I also believe that we have a lot of them. And if we maintain them are more focus, maybe on some areas like McAdams Park. And just yesterday we had over, I think possibly 200 people attending the college Hill neighborhood conversation and Parks was brought up multiple times and so I'm trying to be cognizant that that's what community is asking. Also as part of quality of life that I feel like I don't have enough data to move forward with what should and should not in our cip. We can give thumbnail sketch of where we are today. >> You're obviously I can have a study done before you have to approve the cip. I will caution you in terms of the numbers, how you use the numbers on Parkland because our models switched Eastside and Westside Development started to expand. There are a lot of green space opportunities in park opportunities that are provided in subdivisions by homeowners associations that are credited as public open space. And so in many communities, the park, green space would be part of a pub public park system. And I happen to know the Des Moines area that people would actually dedicate, you know, some of their land in subdivisions, the developer maybe would develop the land and then turn it over to the city of McAllen, this green space. And so we have a different model in that regard. And my biggest concern and all this and again, you have to give us direction. But what I'm concerned about is the quality of the parks that we that exist today. Right? What are we doing to enhance the playgrounds? What are we doing to maintain that green and to make it modern and usable and reflective of how people want to interact with us today are interacting with parks spent a lot of in last couple years. >> Are you know, the day after pool and was like 40 to 50,000, I mean, just so many so much being to listen we did have plans for are they just keep getting pushed back because of a bit sensitive and expensive 20 per part of the perfect example that every single week the park it's vandalizing asked. >> Look at the success story and Riverside. As time has gone on. We have continued to him for making improvements in Riverside that makes it relevant and you can't go there on a Saturday and Sunday and not fly to just really activated. So. >> just maybe follow up with your conversation, your comments, which really appreciated about modernizing parks, for example, I think probably the genesis of that was the master aquatics plan. Great. The kind of give us a blueprint of how to proceed. And that's why I think we have our our a park plan. And I mentioned a couple weeks ago from the bench that also making sure we include how the wrecked senators are dealt with and not only maintained enhanced in some cases, maybe even expand just to make sure that that's included because we have a really good example serve where we've used plans to make sure that we are heading in the right direction. >> What I really enjoyed conversation is you're moving in the strategic direction, right? And that helps a Watt as we start to put plans together. >> Well, I definitely like the plan idea. And I think community center's, I think we some really good examples to start games. in other parts of the city with person plain and looking other areas. And kind of using that to maybe even, you know, making that specific to that part of the community. So each one is unique. have got next. Elizabeth marks anything else you think we need? >> Thank you. That's all we have for workshop today. Thank you for all the presentations. Think it was Again. Thank you for everyone who's still tuning in to the workshop. We are not adjourned because I have a request I am moving that the City Council recess into executive session for 40 minutes to receive information on civil actions pursuant to KSA 75 Dash 4, 3, 1, 9 b, 2. Free legal consultation with the city attorney. Which would be deemed pending litigation and legal advice. As well as protect attorney client privilege and the public interest. It is almost total 5, 1, shell. Should we say 12? 45? We executive session and return it 45 PM. For the remainder of council for workshop. Thank you, Mayor. I'm sorry resume here in first for boardroom. That. Just so we're clear. think the my mistake on your form. Their second. Is there a second second? All council members who are in favor say Aye, aye. All those opposed say nay motion passes 7, 0, Thank you. We're here right?