e e e e e e e e e e I have 7 o'clock we will call the town board meeting for September 16 2024 to order first item on the agenda is the agenda Patrick yes uh Mr chair please add under old business 6C um the board will need to adopt or not adopt uh the appraisal we received on our stacker Boulevard property uh also in addition if you do decide to accept the appraisal as it was submitted uh according to Chad will need to direct staff to find a real estate agent to list it with correct that's one way of doing it yeah y probably the best way to do it okay thanks all right is that all you have yes Bo have anything nope hearing none I need a motion to approve the agenda as amended move to approve the agenda as amended second all in favor say I I I opposed all right item three is approval payment of the bills you sign Steve I signed off on payment of the bills move to approve second all in favor say I I all opposed that motion carries item four is approval of minutes from September 4th anybody have any changes I saw no changes I'll move to approve the minutes of the August 19th 2024 meeting August 19th oh mine says August 19th when are you oh I'm on the wrong meeting how's that it jumped on me forget that you you tried to help him he should have kept going and he wouldn't have known otherwise well I think it was the town clerk that called up my wrong meeting for me get thrown under the bus throw me I'll throw him under the bus well anyway all right so you still want to yeah I Pro I did read them all right Mo made second on favor say I I hi all right five is a consent agend item we have boy what about eight of them nine of them andbody have any issues with them otherwise I would look for a motion to approve so move second Fair say I I opposed all right that brings us to item six which is old business first one is Township days and our Beth Anderson our event coordinator is going to give us a little presentation no you want to come up here you just have to state your name and address for the record uh Podium Podium there with the mic you're somebody now Beth yes you are andon Day movies in the par event director so this weekend is our annual Township day everyone your fingers your fingers that's going to be a word for good weather so hopefully everything is good um this year we have some great things we have over 15 different food vendors that will be there which is more than last year and over 20 different art vendors that will be there which is also an increase from last year we have some fun new activities the Boy Scouts will be out there we actually the Girl Scouts we just confirm them over the weekend so they'll be out there as well we'll have archery demonstrations we'll have Tamar Nature Center out there doing owl demonstrations and all the other animals they bring out we have our sand boxes we'll have touch a truck with prior trucks and police cars and all the things that my three-year-old son is obsessed about so he will be out there touching all the vehicles um and then we do have uh they're called like the areial lists they're the ones that do like the ribbon dancing and things that you see so they're actually going to be performing on our main stage at 3:00 and then we have our main band that will be performing be I do have MS if anyone wants that a list of all and no finding parking lots at private property right Ed what the watch from other never mind never mind for for the public that's listening where is the handicap parking handicap parking will be right in front of the um the main building that's down there the town hall building that is where handicap parking will be okay and that will be blocked off and labeled for handicap and then all the other parking lots that are in the area most of them H questions comments St Ian You' been dealing with with the park board forever yeah um we have one more meeting on Thursday of this week to make sure every all the loose ends are taken care of which we haven't had any um we got confirmation on everything uh last year we did have an issue with our U vendor for uh the bounce house and things they they quit early because there was no lighting we've taken care of that for this year so we should uh not have that issue that we had last year so I think we've uh corrected any of the issues we saw before and looking forward to a clean but only re Jud get rain because a littley andun the only reason would were they planning on if there is rain now normally the car show is in the soccer fields yep are they looking to move it back down do they have room to even put it in the we do so alternative plan is we can fit about 100 cars in that lower lot of the parking lots and then there is that overflow parking right kind of right behind the stage that is that flat kind of gravel area that can accommodate another 40 to 50 cars which right now we're at about 160 cars so if we do get bad weather or we can't use those lots we do have alternative parking for as many of the cars when are you going to make that decision though 24 hours in advance well our goal is 24 hours in advance but that morning again we're thinking Minnesota it looks sunny and then all of a sudden at 10 a.m. we see some storms coming through the cars don't show up that day so we are able to As Long As We Know by when cars arrive kind of where we're putting people we'll be able to make that decision okay and are you looking for volunteers to help of any way shape or form we're okay with volunteers y with just getting people in and out we should be okay okay somebody really wants tote all right B any other questions or comments all right thanks Beth apprciate we'll cross our fingers for good weather cross fingers does anyone want to map or anything do you guys want to see anything I think I have copies yeah I've got copies I'll leave them here for anyone thats EXC all right than yeah just let me know I will is that is that changed all right moving on uh 6B on Old business is the North Oaks company LLC update yeah CH it doesn't look like we've got representatives from there this evening um so I encouraged um LLC to come out and uh have a discussion with the board reminding everybody of what the obligations were to be achieved in order to go forward with looking up to water in the township now this is at Red Pine yes yep which is basically in North Oaks uh west of the condos correct um and so I asked them to come here because they were saying that they were going to be doing the water thing this week but uh they were reminded that they were going to be needing acknowledgement from two different organizations one being the city of North Oaks two being the Met Council uh I did not hear about either one yet um so that's probably why they're not here I was going to say I don't want to speculate but I wonder if they've got a hang up with that Council because it they've been bouncing back and forth y so I did encourage uh those Representatives it when status changes to please contact the township uh we do have public work going out there every day so all right so with this just an update we don't need to continue this we'll just wait to see what progresses yep all right Bo have any questions on this nope all right heing none let's move on item 6C uh the appraisal for stacker Boulevard yeah so I did email these I do have extra copies if you need them um but the appraisal came through that Chad coordinated um couple weeks ago uh did come through last week uh you'll find that the apprais value of our stacker Boulevard property was came in at $140,000 the way I understand it um from what Chad has told me is that the only thing that the board really needs to do tonight by resolution is acknowledge that you have received the appraisal uh and number two if so desired and you have approved that uh direct staff to put the property out for uh sale and with a real estate agent that's correct that's correct okay okay so I think simply accept it that's it yeah so you need a motion to accept the appraisal accept the appraisal I will move that I'll second that okay any other discussion all right all in favor say I I all opposed and then we want to by that resolution I would assume you want to direct staff to go through the process of listing the property do we I'm in no hurry I you can always wait call well this is not exactly the ideal time to be putting property on the market either I any time is ideal in this town right now that's true which is a good thing unless you're buying well I I would like to T table that part of this until we have our exact meeting and talk about it a little oh sure okay that would be my Rec that's that's easy prefer to do that I would was going to suggest the same thing so rather than go to discussion I'll make a motion to uh continue this topic until the September executive meeting okay Tom could but that's the second part of this the first part we've I did we went the first part you did this just second part I'll second on what Tom just said okay all right all say I I I'll oppos just one question Chad there was some talk originally that we couldn't sell for under the appraised value can you confirm that for us by there is no statute or case law that says you have to sell it for the market for the appraised value okay if we were purchasing property we cannot go more than the appraised yeah if you're purchasing you can't can't exceed the appraised value but in the case of sale you have the option and I would assume that final word or first R of refusal is the board has done the offer on the property yes okay because the buyer is making the offer and it's up to the board then to accept it which we'll do that in a closed meeting okay so one other quick question is relates to this a a couple board meetings ago we had a a couple that were interested in purchasing it do we have to formally read I don't remember how we left it with them did we say we were I know we were going to get a we taed it we're going to get an appraisal so we do we should probably advise them or I already did it' be fair okay perfect all right anything else no all right hearing none uh we have no public hearing that's seven 8 is new business we just went through the added agendas come to open time we I see we have some folks in the audience if anyone would like to discuss anything you have to come to the podium state your name and address for the record my name is Liz Ander 5830 Portland Avenue um I'm here because I am concerned about the talks with the city of White Bear Lake and the fire service agreement that's going on um full transparency my husband is served the your Township for 20 years as a paramedic and As A Firefighter that's not the reason why I'm here the reason I'm here um is because I I know about it and that's inside scoop really that I have and I don't feel that a lot of Township citizens probably understand what's going on and I really would like to encourage you to come to an agreement with the city of Whitebear Lake and I'm interested in what the latest is there because going to Lio Lakes is absolutely not an option for the safety of our citizens for our homes for our small businesses it's not going to be a viable option to have someone driving an ambulance or fire truck from Lio Lakes to the south end of White Bear Township where we have residents down by off of belir right so I really would encourage you to um you know stop those resources and I'm curious if you could give an update as to where we're at on on the the talks with with white the city of white bear um I've been Patrick's been really great about uh being responsive and I really do appreciate that and being transparent with what's going on I've read all of the notes I fully understand that you know you were served with something that you weren't weren't planning on there's a lot of history there as to what was needed for the fire station and the outstanding service that the white bear uh fire department serves our Township with um and there's a reasons and they've definitely upgraded their services as far as going to full-time and that's why they needed the station and things like that so I just want to make sure that everyone is aware of that I want to bring awareness to it I don't want to have to start talking to some of my neighbors about this no one's really aware that this is going on but as a citizen I'm I'm greatly concerned that um you know this much time and resources is is is going into potentially looking into a solution that is is really not viable with going out to to other nearby cities that would cover our Township for for fire okay well kind of to start with the this is more of a budget issue than it is a eventually if something does change it will go to a public safety commission to review but still every all our options are still on the table right now and and and in fact um because our attorney is also dealing with the city of Whitebear Lakes attorney we're a little bit hand tied about talking about this too much only because this is a contract dispute which affects our budget obviously and it also affects the city of white Bears budget yeah so what can be done like um I and I'm not familiar if you're going out with a a levy for this next voting cycle or anything like that but like what can be done now right like they came to you with that a a year ago so now I don't I don't know how much has been pushed since then other than talk can I just say one thing before you continue um just in response that nobody on this board or staff um has a problem with the service sure we find it we find it all to be excellent our Public Safety feel that in any of them out see that I just wanted to make sure that yeah go ahead sorry guys well and not only that um we weren't informed this in a timely manner this came to us I think a month before our budget was supposed to be set so there was no time to a lot a lot of money it's 182,000 a year for 20 years years which is about $4 million that's a big chunk of money for our Public Safety for our town residents so that that has to be taken seriously and we are taking that seriously yep but as of right now we're still in negotiations yes so and I very much appreciate you watching out for our money right but it it honestly is not going to be any cheaper to go to Venice Heights you've already realized that it's not going to be any cheaper to go to liono Lakes you're going to increase our insurance cost if you would go to Lion Lakes because you need to have a fire department that has a would you like to respond to that Mr insurance guy to your residents right well first off if you don't mind yeah um I think you're speaking without having the foundation for the actual knowledge of of what we've been told we can get by via other Ser well I realized that but you're you're not a subject matter expert we don't I I sit on the board and I can't tell you what Badness Heights Lio lakes or anybody else has said as far as what services and costs would be because we're not at that point it's a contract we're looking at it actually have been notified by Patrick that the Vanos Heights is out of budget so the line of lakes we don't have any clue with line of lakes and I have not I have not seen is hired their own consulting firm is my understanding hopefully we're not paying for that but to find out what that would look like so I actually am very knowledgeable on this I I it comes down to there's been no formal discussion at a board level sure of any outside service other than white bear and and so that's why I said it's a contract matter and we've got to keep it as such because it has terms and and if either side disagrees that the terms of the contract are being followed they have to discuss to get through that is it is it one are they following the rules on either side on on items of importance as it relates to the contract and that's what the discussion has been as far as I know is contract discussion it's just strictly a contract discussion it's a it's a dispute over one term of the contract so my understanding from my reading is that the dispute is on the interest on Deb service de service yeah that's on what they paid for the fire station M which it is you you the township pays the city for like if they buy a new fire truck they needed a new fire station so that would fall into that actually how it works is as part of the pricing component is depre straight line depreciation of the equipment and buildings over their useful life and we do that and that's clear that's very clear it's explicit in the contract we all agree with that's the question is what depreciation are they talking about how are they calculating the depreciation and that's the key and that's the key dispute right now so you're saying over 20 years you shouldn't have to pay $200,000 like in 20 years from now because the building is depreciated or just so I fully understand the depreciation piece what they're saying is there they're they building is obviously new we know that yep and they're depreciating over 20 years fine that's uh according to our finance director that's an acceptable useful life for the building it's a question of what are they using in terms of actual physical costs to calculate that depreciation that's where the dispute stands right now okay so what's the next steps and how keep talking keep keep talking yeah yep and no Nei whitee lake or the township have in any way uh foreclosed further discussion where it's ongoing I will say this it for a while there we weren't getting a very good response from the city that has changed the city has become quite more responsive and I appreciate that we Now understand their position so what we just don't agree with it we just don't agree with we don't agree with their calculations so they've they've come to terms with all the other municipalities well keep in mind not necessarily but also keep in mind the fact that of the other municipalities the township pays 28.4% of the actual costs right cuz you're larger we're the larger larger yeah the and so the rest of them pay small much much smaller percentages so to them it's not worth arguing about to the township it's a different it's it's quite different it is worth arguing about it's a sizable amount of money given the size of the budget of the township it's it's it's important it's material issue in the budget which has to be dealt with so what can I do as a citizen who's definitely does not want you to go to anyone else when White Bear Lake is right down the road and they're fulltime and they're going to respond way quicker than anyone else is we we've taken all that into consideration yeah all that is on the table nothing nothing's been eliminated surprises me that you would go to Lion lakes and even you keep saying go go go when we have a you got you got to listen to me now when we have contract disputes or contracts that look too high we go out and look around to make sure we're getting the bang for our buck that's that's that's exactly what this board is you do on a regular basis you go to RFP for fire service we we've tried it with police and look we're very conscientious board we're we're very frugal and we watch every dollar that's our responsibility and that it would if we didn't do our due diligence the residents would be have worse of a problem than us jumping around right now a little bit of shopping does not hurt the township and and that right now where we're at is uh in negotiations our lawyers are talking to their lawyers I've been talking to the mayor I we're still talking just so we're clear neither side has burned any Bridges we're still talking may get a little heated at times but I will say this both sides have been very civil with each other and I think the the discussions have been constructive but we have not reached a resolution sure we do have some deadlines that are coming up and we will we will have some resolutions coming up what what our what our path will be is probably in the next month or so okay great and I mean I guess I'm just saying like from as a citizen right I would pay $50 more in taxes if it meant my insurance wasn't going to go up because you're not going to another fire department see I I don't know I can't speak to that no Steve's an insurance guy this is our insurance expert you need you need a fire station within six minutes of your home or your insurance goes up well that 6 minutes is arbitrary number for for call for service too it's probably an insurance company actually it's not the fire departments have to have to tell you what their response well that's true and I sat in meetings where the response time isn't that good so yeah no and but you but you should be comparing what the response time would be from the city of Whitebear Lake and the what the response time would be from Lio Lakes oh yeah we're very well aware of the geographic problems with uh separating or getting away from so it's it's I would ask you to con concentrate on moving along those talks with white bear knowing that's really honestly the most viable solution for for your citizens we take all input into consideration I agree and this is back on our exact agenda yeah oh yeah so we've been a discussion for meetings public absolutely absolutely okay just not televised so will that be on this month's executive yeah yes okay all right what's the day of that uh 27 yeah week from this uh Friday so you understand that in the event the city threat City litigates this matter starts a lawsuit we will be that will that will no longer be open session that'll be closed session all litigation is closed so nothing I can do about it provide feedback yeah accept our numbers M and they would I say that I say that I say that I say that tongue and cheek I mean I'm not on any I'm just saying I really think it's important to come to an agreement just the last St of my mind was tongue and cheek because again we respect the city I hope they respect our position too yes we respect theirs they I expect them to respect ours as any citizen is listening to what you said and and what we've said we're not dissatisfied with the service if it was that it would we would be doing that regularly it's just a contract matter that needs to have discussion and it we're still in the discussion because the contract also dictates how this thing gets resolved eventually one way or the other but it's all in the contract at this point we're talking s okay all right well thank you all right anyone else White Bear press hi uh yeah Logan gon G IO n uh 125 9 europ Avenue North Hugo um Minnesota uh I am here because I have a funny question to ask um you want a funny answer Logan what you want a funny answer you're I mean you're gonna laugh at the question and I don't know what the answer is going to be n but uh take it seriously don't worry I what we'll take it seriously don't worry oh okay so um in the last maybe two Township meetings ago uh you mentioned an item about the medians on Highway 96 and how you are looking with vness Heights um to help repair restore the conditions of them and you very in my opinion watching very clearly said early stages early days you know we'll get back to you when we have something newsworthy so I didn't even put it in the notes lo and behold we get a letter to the editor this week that's printed and said they're so ugly I hate these medians and I was like like oh okay well if people are publicly complaining about it I and I don't I have no control I have no idea what goes into the letter of the editor um so I uh asked my editor and she said yeah follow up with them see if there's anything so here I am asking you about medians again um and I I didn't expect that to be a theme of my life when I started the year um but here we are so has there been any forward movement on uh The Joint to agreement I'm not sure if that term is correct but the joint venture with vness Heights on the 96 Islands so what the board asked uh at the last meeting was for staff to follow up as to see if there was a formal bidding process that gave us the the cost share um um approximation that would be with ad's Heights there wasn't there was only one bid and it was for roughly $14,000 and what they're looking for is a split 50/50 um to help those medians essentially um they also asked that Chad look into um a maintenance agreement that we had was it with the county it was actually yes with when when the when 96 was rebuilt there was a agreement regarding that intersection yep got with the county yep and I read it and there's a question as to who is actually responsible to maintain those medians MH because they refer to documents that only the county seems to have so we'll have to get a hold of those okay we're talk now I say docum talking about the contract contract documents contract documents so yeah it's well I'll let Pat handle it but you know I've looked at the contract and there's a question as to who's responsible for in fact actually I don't think there's really a question it's pretty clear who's responsible but to know to pin it down completely we have to get some more detailed contra documents from the county to really answer the question that makes sense well I'll make a comment you know when it first came up a couple meetings ago you know I think it took us by surprise that that the township or vness Heights because that's where it really originated from had had much to say in it because it was a it was a state highway turned back to the county and rebuilt by the county yes so the legalities of it we had we had to spend some time doing it and that's what Chad's role and responsibility is as directed by the board to see who is legally responsible for that and so that's why these things take a while but having said that um you we know it's a Gateway into our communities we're we're not proud of it I thought it was the County's responsibilities all along so um it it has changed dramatically because of the emerald ash as an example they had planted tons of trees along that Boulevard and most of which were moved gone um then there was a communities of Arden Hills and sheview who have taken a very aggressive approach in their community and put in uh prairie grasses and Native things again they maintain it maybe I don't know if they paid for it maybe the county paid for it I don't know that but that's all the stuff we have to find out so we have not slammed the door on it as far as I know yeah we haven't right and that certainly wasn't the question I was more I I thought you guys were clear uh in a couple meetings ago that it was on it way but these things take time and well part of the Logan part of the problem with when we deal with the county they have a lot of turnover it seems like just we're on a path to get something resolved that leadership changes and then we're starting all over yes I um yeah there was a um I I I did I was here well not here but watched the meeting with the H2 illegal parking issue and that was similar it seemed where it was it's a county road is it you know how much do you guys do and that's and you don't want to set a precent so I definitely understand that um on that matter uh this is again not asking uh legality wise I don't want to create any ethical quandaries for you all um but uh there have been a couple of instance uh in previous meetings where I uh feel it's necessary to report on things and then the T of the report is there's nothing to report yet so um I do you have I would be I'm not looking for you to tell me but if you have ideas for instance um recent I don't know if you know this but there was a recent dispute with um contract with fire that I reported on and it's said uh I think everyone said you know we just have a difference of opinion you know it's it's open session because it's not litigation that was all pretty well explained but um do I even report on that you know that's I guess that's kind of my open-ended question I was going to say that's that's your call Logan yeah I don't we there's no way in the world we're going to tell you what to report what not to report if it's in our meeting notes if you feel it's valuable I there's no it's public information so you should report what you feel is important from our meetings fair enough um I understand that my my concern is I don't want it to get overblown into something that's not so anything that's actual gets a formal motion and passes that's that's now law any other discussions like we just talked about that are forwarded onto exec meeting that could be another three months of talk so yeah that was actually the answer I was looking for so I didn't know I needed that answer uh I think I think that's everything um there we go okay yeah I I loan before you walk off I I think you have communicated with Patrick as our as our administrator between you two probably can pretty much decide what yep happy to answer your question answer your behind the scene questions about where it's at and then you can determine whether you want to report it or not well and I mean this can go on record uh Patrick has been really great at uh pointing me to the person that that is best to talk to and just actually uh uh the desk staff as well uh especially had to do a brief thing on um Township day this Saturday and the desk was like oh you want Beth she's the events director you want you know this person that so yeah the staff has been fantastic um well we just don't want to have a middleman and get confusing stories you go right to the source then you got it exactly where it's supposed to be can you come and say that stuff when it's my annual no I have a bone to pick with you Patrick okay in July I you said keep white be Township boring I have written an article about whare Township every two weeks since then so I don't feel you so I'm going to shut up now yeah I don't feel you've made good on that yeah how misleading yeah right thanks all right anyone else going once going twice all right we're gonna move on I need a motion to receive agenda material and supplements so moved second all in favor say I I I all opposed the motion carries I need a motion to adjourn at 7:33 so moved second all in favor say I that's the alarm to stop thanks guys all right we e for