This transcript features **Mayor Wayne Boucher**, City Administrator **John Mulder**, and various staff members and residents. Note: The transcript mentions **Councilors Nelson** and **Hostchild** (or Housechild); though not on the initial provided list, they are identified here by their roles in the meeting. [0:03] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Thank you. 6:30, let's call the meeting to order and stand for the Pledge of Allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Roll call, please. [0:40] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk)**: Councilor Geissler? (Here). Councilor Hostchild? (Here). Councilor Nelson? (Here). Mayor Boucher? (Here). [0:45] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Announcements. Do any councilors have announcements this evening? No? I've got some procedural things to go over just before we get started. We have a lot more people here than we usually have. We have different opportunities for public input to the council meeting. We'll have one soon after communications; that's for general public input for things that are not on the agenda. So if there's an item that's not on the agenda that you're here to speak about, that's the time to get up and speak. If it's something that's on the agenda, we will have a period for public discussion during that time. Once the motion is made and we move forward after the Council has a chance to ask questions of staff, then there will be a time for public input. During public input, we ask that you limit your time to three minutes per person. If there's anything beyond the three minutes, you can submit anything to the City Clerk in writing during the meeting. We will have—I'm guessing—some people are here from the Johnson Road area. We'll have two separate items on our agenda for that: one is for the Planned Unit Development and the other is for the plat. So that you know to tailor your public input: if you want to talk about the plat, speak during the plat; if you want to talk about the Planned Unit Development—but if you talk about one during the other, we're not going to shut you off. It's just we just have that clarification between the two motions. But each motion on the agenda will have a period for public discussion. Mr. Mulder, would you address communication? [2:23] **John Mulder (City Administrator)**: We have a number of items listed on your agenda that were included in your packet. Also included in your packet was just a list of all the communications that we received. Some of them we did not necessarily include, but if you want those, we can get a copy of those. In some cases, we did receive emails after the agenda deadline on Wednesday, so there were a couple of other emails that are not listed here that have been forwarded to all the City Council members, and those will get logged and they will be on the list at the next meeting. [3:06] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Thank you. We have no presentations by department heads at this time. Next, we will move to Item 8: Public Discussion. This is a time for individuals to address the Council about any item not on the agenda. We ask that you limit your time to three minutes per person. I'm going to first call for people that are in chambers to speak, and then after that is exhausted, I will ask for people that are present at the online meeting to speak. Is there anyone in chambers who wishes to address the Council about general items at this time? If so, please step forward and state your name and address for the record. Second call for anyone in chambers to address the Council about general items that are not on the agenda. Is there anyone present at the online meeting that wishes to address the Council about something that's not on the agenda? And if anyone in the online meeting would like to share anything, please use the hand raise function and I'll call on you. [4:32] **Joe Wicklund (Assistant City Administrator)**: Regarding the record with that agenda—what's causing that goal? Uh, I think I fixed it. We just had an unmuted member. [4:47] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Thank you. Do we have a motion from Council for the consent agenda? [4:52] **Councilor Nelson**: Motion to approve. [4:54] **Councilor John Geissler**: Second. [4:56] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk)**: Councilor Hostchild? (Aye). Councilor Nelson? (Aye). Councilor Geissler? (Aye). Mayor Boucher? (Aye). [5:06] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: We have no motions under Item 10 or ordinances under 11. Number 12: Resolutions. Resolution 2021-76, resolution consenting to an assignment of the special use permit granted to David Colquist and amending Resolution Number 2005-95. Do we have a motion? [5:32] **Councilor John Geissler**: Motion to approve. [5:33] **Councilor Hostchild**: Second. [5:34] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Motion by Councilor Geissler, second by Councilor Hostchild. Mr. Mulder, maybe either Eric or the City Attorney could address this issue? [5:44] **Eric Johnson (Community Development Director)**: Great, thank you very much. This evening before us is a request to amend an existing special use permit that was approved back in 2005 for the Golden Oaks assisted living facility. As part of that special use permit, there was a stipulation that the special use permit could not be assigned to any other property or person without the consent of the City Council. This facility has been sold in the past few months here, and the new person who is going to operate it as an existing 30-bed assisted living facility is requesting that transfer of the special use permit. So, that is one item that's in front of us. As part of this other item associated with this is the basically amending of that 2005 ordinance to strike that language stating that it requires a City Council action to assign or future ownership that way. So that allows, if this facility is ever sold in the future, it would not need the City Council approval; the special use permit would run with the property, which is something that we typically see. And then lastly, when this property came before Council back in 2005, this was a much larger parcel. It encompassed a home that was located on the north portion of that. After that special use permit was approved at that time, the lot was split, so that property with the existing home on it had its own parcel ID number. The new Golden Oaks facility at that time had it separate. The problem is that special use permit runs with both properties, so we're looking to amend that special use permit as well to eliminate that existing single-family home from that special use permit. What that will do is that will clean up any title research that needs to be done should that property sell in the future. [7:34] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Thank you. Mr. Overom [City Attorney], do you have any comment on this? [7:40] **City Attorney**: I have nothing further to add. [7:42] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Any questions or comments from Council? Is there anyone from the public in the meeting in the chambers that wishes to address this item? Is there anyone attending the online meeting that wishes to comment on Resolution 2021-76? Again, please use your raise hand function. [8:38] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk)**: Councilor Nelson? (Aye). Councilor Geissler? (Aye). Councilor Hostchild? (Aye). Mayor Boucher? (Aye). [8:48] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Resolution 2021-77, resolution authorizing and directing the Mayor and City Clerk to execute and deliver development agreement with Shane W. Stokey. Do we have a motion? [9:06] **Councilor Nelson**: Motion to approve. [9:07] **Councilor John Geissler**: Second. [9:11] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Mr. Mulder, do we want Mr. Johnson to comment on this? [9:15] **John Mulder (City Administrator)**: Yes. A House—oh I'm sorry, that's an H not a G. Mr. Johnson? [9:20] **Eric Johnson (Community Development Director)**: Great, thank you again, Mr. Mayor. This is for a Planned Unit Development that was approved back in 2020. This encompassed nine lots and a 45-acre property. This is an example of a rural subdivision that was approved at that time. As part of the approval, it required that the developer enter into a development agreement with the City, which outlines their responsibility for the construction of the roads as well as the stormwater associated with this property. As I mentioned, this is a rural subdivision; this will be well and septic on each one of these properties—that'll be the responsibility of each property owner. This development agreement encompasses the rural section roadway which will be paved, as well as the stormwater ponds associated with this. There will be a requirement of a letter of credit in the amount of 475,000 dollars, which will cover the amount up to 125 percent potential costs associated with this work should the developer default for any reason. That letter of credit allows the City to sign off on the plat and would allow the developer to start selling lots at that point. In addition, the developer will be required to pay any outstanding attorney or city engineer fees associated with the review of this project. That is also outlined in the development agreement. [10:56] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Thank you. Do we have any questions or comments from the Council? [10:59] **Councilor John Geissler**: Mr. Mayor, I have one question regarding the stormwater ponds that you talked about. Are they built on private property or where will those be built? [11:06] **Eric Johnson (Community Development Director)**: They're on private properties, but there'll be an easement associated with each one and the City will have access to those. [11:10] **Councilor John Geissler**: Okay, thank you. [11:47] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk)**: Councilor Geissler? (Aye). Councilor Hostchild? (Aye). Councilor Nelson? (Aye). Mayor Boucher? (Aye). [12:00] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Resolution 2021-78, resolution approving preliminary Planned Unit Development for the Keene Creek Trail subdivision development. Do we have a motion? [12:12] **Councilor John Geissler**: Motion to approve. [12:14] **Councilor Hostchild**: Second. [12:16] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Mr. Mulder, would you like Mr. Johnson to address this again? He's on a roll; he's getting all the work tonight. Mr. Johnson. [12:20] **Eric Johnson (Community Development Director)**: Thank you very much, I appreciate not trying to monopolize this meeting this evening. What we have before us is two items: one will be the preliminary Planned Unit Development and then afterwards would be the preliminary plat associated with that. This proposal consists of three distinct pieces of property: one is a 33-acre piece of land—that's the large red portion that you see on the site that is the developer-owned property. The next is the two and a half acre Outlot A, which is just to the north and east of that—that is the Outlot A which was originally created as part of the 1995 Valley View Division plat. And lastly, in the blue is a city right-of-way—that's a one-acre Carlson Road right-of-way that once again was platted in 1995 to provide access to that outlot in the future development in this area. The developer is proposing a 29-lot single-family combination of single-family homes and eight twin home lots. There will be a total of 21 single-family lots and eight twin home lots—those will be four buildings for a total of eight units total. Regarding the zoning, this is an R3 zone property. The developer is proposing setbacks that either meet or are similar to existing underlying R3. [Detailed breakdown of setbacks and density follows]. The developer has worked quite a bit with MSA Professionals as their engineer. Mr. Wicklund, if you could advance the slide please? What we have right here is the preliminary site layout. You can see there's access off of Morris Thomas Road... [Explains road layout and sidewalks]. [16:04] **Eric Johnson (Community Development Director)**: Joe, if you'd like to go to the next slide please? It's essentially located in this green area... Joe, one more slide please? At that point, that trail system would intersect an existing 20-foot easement that exists on the west side of the existing Valley View Division. Eventually, there will be a trail that will connect all the way from Keene Creek Park leading to the north with the ability to get up to the wellness center. Joe, if you roll it back two slides please? [Explains traffic safety and two points of ingress/egress]. City staff has reached out to different professionals: the Chief of Police, the Fire Marshal, City Engineer, as well as Public Works Director, and they all concur with the benefit of two ins and outs into a development that way. Joe, roll it back one slide please? Actually one more, thank you. As part of this development, there's going to be a proposed land swap. The City owns a two and a half acre outlot; it is being proposed that the City swaps that two and a half acres of land for 12 and a half acres shown in green. What that does is it provides a number of different benefits: it protects Keene Creek, protects existing wetlands, and stormwater ponds will be located within this large green area. [21:14] **Councilor Hostchild**: I have one question. You had mentioned that it was reviewed by the Chief of Police, Fire Marshal, Public Utilities, and City Engineer. I saw the correspondence from the Chief of Police in our packet. Was there correspondence from the Fire Chief? [21:28] **Eric Johnson (Community Development Director)**: Yes, it came in late yesterday. I do have an email that we can include in the next packet for that. [21:32] **Councilor Hostchild**: Could you just summarize what that said? [21:34] **Eric Johnson (Community Development Director)**: Yes, it is their preference that they have multiple means of ingress and egress for a property for their life safety standpoint. [21:40] **Councilor Hostchild**: Yeah, I have one. So you talked a lot about the rationale for the Carlson Road connection. Can you talk a little bit about a second connection on Morris Thomas and/or a connection on Okerstrom and what the rationale was there from a different stakeholder standpoint? [21:58] **Eric Johnson (Community Development Director)**: Sure. The City and myself met with Vic Lund, who's the County Traffic Engineer. Morris Thomas is a county roadway. Initially, what the county is trying to avoid is having multiple offsetting driveways or roadways. They were comfortable with this one... a second ingress onto Morris Thomas would create too many traffic concerns from their standpoint. Staff also looked at the potential of connecting on Okerstrom Road. That route, if pursued—there's a tremendous amount of wetland that would need to be crossed. Furthermore, right now Okerstrom as it exists is basically a substandard rural section; it is for the most part gravel and native soil. [23:56] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: We're about to open this up for public discussion. Each person is going to have roughly three minutes to speak. Consider basically you're speaking to the Council as testimony. If anyone present in the chamber wishes to comment on Resolution 2021-78, the Planned Unit Development, please step forward. [24:42] **Lisa Smith (3761 Johnson Road)**: Good evening, Mr. Mayor and Councilors. My name is Lisa Smith. On behalf of all residents of Johnson Road and Portland Road—100 percent of whom signed a petition to not allow the proposed Carlson Road extension—I'm asking you to vote no. [States concerns about road width, traffic safety, and planning oversights]. The argument of two ingress and egress points does not stand up when it applies to the City of Hermantown. The proof of this is in looking at the newest development on Patriot Drive or Patriot Lane. We implore you to do the right thing by voting no to this proposal. [27:45] **Dean Bjorlin (3750 Johnson Road)**: My name is Dean Bjorlin. I live at 3750 Johnson Road. One of the things I've noticed in my three weeks back is that the road is narrow and there are a lot of people that enjoy walking on our road. My concern with the Carlson Road and the extra traffic is just the safety and losing the walkers. So I personally would not see this as a good improvement. [29:16] **Tony Marino (3760 Johnson Road)**: My name is Tony Marino. I am the originator of the petition. It shows a lot of unity in our neighborhood. I'm not here against the development, even though I think we're trying to put 10 pounds of manure in a 5-pound bag, but this road is about doing the same thing to Johnson Road. It was also stated tonight about the lot size per acre—12 acres is given back to the city, so the development is only taking up about 20 some. That should be reconsidered. Any additional traffic is just too much. [32:50] **Jay Zierden (Developer, 4571 Martin Road)**: Hi, my name is Jay Zierden. My partners, the Wheats brothers, and myself are the developers of this property. It was insinuated that we did not think through the process. The fact is this plat was done in 1995 with this easement put in for this purpose, and it was the City's direction that encouraged us to use that outlet. We did due diligence and we're just doing what the City has guided us to do. [34:23] **Bart Smith (3761 Johnson Road)**: My name is Bart Smith. I feel we should not negatively impact the livability and safety of the Portland and Johnson Road families. Has the City put current and past families at risk because they do not have two ingress/egress in their development? Patriot Drive townhomes is a prime example. Timber Ridge properties on West Westburg Road is another. If two means of ingress or egress are absolutely needed, make both of them on Morris Thomas Road. [38:10] **Darren [Last name unclear] (Developer)**: Darren, 1990 West... the main thing I want to say is that this wasn't something I was forced through. I personally owned this property for five years and brought several proposals to the City. We want to do something that is positive for the community. 33 acres in Hermantown is going to be developed; that's just a fact. Our plan is good. [40:40] **Steve Laflamme (4749 Portland Road)**: My name is Steve Laflamme. I lived on the corner of Alexander and Carlson. When we met for the Council last time, the proposal was to make Johnson wider because we recognized it as a friendly road people use to walk. I understand the subdivision would be more money into the city, but I would suggest that if you do approve the Carlson Road easement, you make it the same size that exists in Johnson to hopefully support slower traffic. [45:29] **Georgeann Cabrera (3775 Johnson Road)**: I am Georgeann Cabrera. I wasn't planning on speaking, but I want to give you insight. This road was so safe that kids could go up and down the road and not worry about cars. Putting another access is going to completely change the whole beauty of what rural living in Hermantown is all about. I don't think it's for the better. [48:25] **Unidentified Resident**: I've heard that twice since the new road has been built, the school bus and the garbage truck have not been able to pass each other on that curve. It's a very narrow curve. I don't think for the safety it's good. [49:15] **Kevin O’Brien (3759 Alexander Road)**: My name is Kevin O’Brien. In the last year since the road's completed, I've seen more pedestrians, bicycles, and skateboards than I ever have in 30 years. It's not safe to put more traffic on these roads; they're not designed to handle it. [51:12] **Rochelle Cleary (3782 Okerstrom Road - Online)**: Hi, actually it's Rochelle Cleary. I live on the substandard Okerstrom Road. It’s undeniable that this development is going to make more traffic also on Okerstrom Road. People are always looking for the shortcut. Also, regarding Keene Creek, just not building on something doesn't necessarily mean it's going to be protected. [53:47] **Jake Perry (3779 Johnson Road - Online)**: Hi, my name is Jake Perry. One of the big reasons that we moved here was because of the feel of the neighborhood. The reasons for not doing that extension seem to far outweigh the reasons for it. It seems to be a net negative benefit for the safety of the residents. [58:07] **Jim Sandberg (3789 Johnson Road - Online)**: Jim Sandberg. Mr. Mayor, Council, I'd really like to hear all of you hear what these people are saying. Pursue things for the Okerstrom Road; there's a much better access there. I'm disappointed that we are taking safety away from previous residents. Just because we have an easement doesn't mean we have to use it. [1:01:57] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: We're going to end the public discussion at this time. I noted a couple of questions. Mr. Mulder, is there a city staff member you would think could answer these questions: why is the city pushing Carlson Road? [1:04:14] **John Mulder (City Administrator)**: I'll try to do that. The City is pushing it because of the thought that two egresses in and out of neighborhoods are best practice. It also then follows the comprehensive plan that was thought about 25-30 years ago. [1:05:21] **Eric Johnson (Community Development Director)**: To confirm, it's 29 units. 21 single-family lots and eight twin home units. [1:05:42] **Paul Senst (Public Works Director)**: The pavement width on Johnson Road was 20 feet prior to the reconstruction. It is 20 feet that was newly constructed. The difference is we added two-foot shoulders on each side. The rural standard for the City of Hermantown is a 24-foot wide paved surface. After a lot of discussion, we landed on reconstructing it at its current width to avoid impacting front yards. [1:08:48] **Councilor John Geissler**: This is not easy for me; I know many of you are my friends. But we've got the Chief of Police, Fire Marshal, Public Utilities, and City Engineer all telling us this is a good thing. I truly believe that the majority of this traffic is going to go to the Morris Thomas Road. [1:10:19] **Councilor Nelson**: It hasn't been an easy decision. For the City and what I believe my responsibilities are, the project is a very good one. [1:11:07] **Councilor Hostchild**: I want to take a chance to thank everybody. I did my research; I had individual meetings. From a safety standpoint, it's beneficial for us to have that second situation. This new trail is going to be a whole new thing for kids to recreate on safely. [1:16:40] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk)**: Councilor Geissler? (Aye). Councilor Hostchild? (Aye). Councilor Nelson? (Aye). Mayor Boucher? (Aye). [1:16:50] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Resolution 2021-79, resolution approving the preliminary plat of Keene Creek Trail subdivision. Do we have a motion? [1:17:03] **Councilor Hostchild**: So moved. [1:17:05] **Councilor Nelson**: Second. [1:17:14] **Eric Johnson (Community Development Director)**: This is the plat that essentially mirrors the PUD. It'll have a 66-foot right-of-way that will connect Morris Thomas to Johnson Road via the Carlson Road extension. [1:18:25] **Sam Clark (4337 Lebaque Road)**: I am a member of the Planning and Zoning Commission. I'd like to note that in the Planning and Zoning Commission meeting, we did have a motion to approve the PUD with the exception of the Carlson Road addition. It was 4 to 3 against. There was consideration to not necessarily stop any connection but perhaps do something different. [1:20:22] **Tony Marino (3760 Johnson Road)**: Why is the City pushing this so hard? You have this opportunity to build a trail using the easement and make it 10 feet wide. In an emergency, a 10-foot trail can be used for access, just like the Lakewalk in Duluth. [1:23:12] **Lisa Smith (3761 Johnson Road)**: Have you thought about a narrower path that would allow for emergency vehicles but not a wide road? That would solve all the problems. I wonder if the Police Chief and Fire Marshal have actually seen copies of this proposed plat as it is. [1:26:58] **Jake Perry (Online)**: People are always looking for a shortcut. That Carlson extension is clearly the path that's going to be taken for a majority of the residents in that neighborhood. [1:31:00] **Jim Sandberg (Online)**: Mayor, I heard you say best practices was to have two egresses. I was wondering where this best practice sits at Peyton Acres? [1:32:17] **Susan McGuire (3770 Okerstrom Road - Online)**: When does the City plan to notify us whether or not you're going to be claiming some of our land as part of this trail? [1:34:00] **Joel Hopps (3785 Johnson Road - Online)**: I work in law enforcement for the City of Duluth. Our road is a narrow road. Hermantown support for police is coming from Proctor or Hermantown itself. Duluth never travels this unless it's in a big emergency, and at that point, our road is still too small. [1:38:55] **Eric Johnson (Community Development Director)**: Weeks ago, I sent this to numerous parties: the Fire Chief, Police Chief, County Engineer. They've seen an actual plan of this development. [1:39:10] **John Mulder (City Administrator)**: Regarding the narrow path: at this point in the preliminary plat, we were just looking at the road standard. There is time to alter the plat prior to the final version. Regarding Peyton Acres, that projection over a number of years is for it ultimately to connect with Oak Ridge Drive. [1:42:45] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: I'll speak to the Timber Ridge development. The neighborhood opposed access which resulted in access coming off Westburg Road. Another one is the connection of Falcon and Eagle. There were fears of speeding, but the Council went ahead and none of those fears have come to light in the 20 years since. [1:45:06] **John Mulder (City Administrator)**: To Susan McGuire: there is currently a 20-foot easement in place. We would try to work within that and would not be looking at acquiring additional easements. [1:46:38] **Councilor John Geissler**: I live in Country Acres and it is one way in, one way out. But the road is platted with a 66-foot easement all the way to the west. When that developer wants to develop the next 80 acres, my neighbors are going to be wanting to know why. This was platted in 1994; now is the time to use it. [1:48:48] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk)**: Councilor Hostchild? (Aye). Councilor Geissler? (Aye). Councilor Nelson? (Aye). Mayor Boucher? (Aye). [1:48:57] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Resolution 2021-80, pay request number three for Road Improvement District 537. [1:49:15] **Councilor John Geissler**: Motion to approve. [1:49:16] **Councilor Nelson**: Second. [1:49:18] **John Mulder (City Administrator)**: This is work that continues along Lavaque Junction Road. [1:50:28] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Resolution 2021-81, final pay request for Old Highway 2. [1:50:42] **Councilor Nelson**: Motion to approve. [1:50:44] **Councilor John Geissler**: Second. [1:50:46] **John Mulder (City Administrator)**: This project now is complete. [1:51:58] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Resolution 2021-82, change order number one for Keene Creek Park trail. [1:52:16] **Councilor Hostchild**: Motion. [1:52:18] **Councilor John Geissler**: Second. [1:52:20] **John Mulder (City Administrator)**: We had to remove some additional bad soils and replace those. [1:53:35] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Resolution 2021-83, pay request number 12 for Sewer Improvement District 48. [1:54:02] **Councilor Nelson**: Motion. [1:54:04] **Councilor Hostchild**: Second. [1:54:06] **John Mulder (City Administrator)**: This is the next pay request for the sewer trunk line. [1:54:30] **Councilor John Geissler**: I have a question regarding wrap-up of the trail opening for use. [1:54:45] **John Mulder (City Administrator)**: Joe is working on a ribbon-cutting ceremony. [1:55:44] **Joe Wicklund (Assistant City Administrator)**: The hope is late August. We want to give a little bit of time to green up and coordinate signage to brand the trail. [1:56:45] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: Item number 13. Is there a motion for recess? [1:56:55] **Councilor Hostchild**: So moved. [1:56:57] **Councilor Nelson**: Second. [1:56:59] **Mayor Wayne Boucher**: All in favor? (Aye). Opposed? (None). Meeting recessed.