recording and you can start the meeting whenever you're ready okay um all right well we will call the december 3rd 2020 planning commission meeting to order and we will do a roll call commissioner wu yeah all right commissioner varenkamp here mr schulack here mr dickman here and i am here so everybody is in attendance thank you very much all right we will stand for the pledge of allegiance for those who would like to join us please do so i pledge allegiance to the flag of the united states of america and to the republic for which it stands and to the republic and for which it's fine indivisible under god with liberty indivisible liberty and justice for all all right thank you all right we'll go to item three agenda approval anybody have any questions changes comments looks fairly straightforward and simple you all did get the city council report from brad via email today thank you brad so that was not in the packet but looks like everything is there we have one public hearing and then that's it any changes if not i'll take a motion to accept the agenda motion to accept the agenda second second second and dickman okay great thank you all right uh we'll go through roll call again um commissioner dickman to approve yay mr sherlock aye commissioner wu mr varenkamp aye and i vote i as well all right the agenda is approved all right open forum uh for our general public or um city officials um as well uh open forum is is a chance to speak about any issues that are of interest or concern to you and um i believe mike pritchard if you wish to speak if you do the raise your hand mike will tune you in and again open forum is is a is a time for you to speak about anything that is not currently on the agenda we'll have an opportunity for that when that item comes up so mike is there anybody out there mr chair i currently do not have any with their hand raised okay well uh if there's nobody that would like to participate in open forum we'll move on uh item five the minutes uh from november 5th 2020 i was unfortunately i was absent i got asked to go on a on a hunting trip with my son and so i took that opportunity i appreciate uh commissioner dickman for running i did watch the meeting when i got back he did a fine job thank you very much i appreciate you staying in so i'll recuse myself from this discussion but does anybody have any changes or corrections to the minutes from november 5th yes it should say acting chair dick moon called the meeting to order at 7 p.m not chair jacobs um and then there's some some spelling errors throughout um probably not important but i think just under call to order roll call it would be acting cher dickman okay mike did you get that thanks meredith and um maybe paul if you want to follow up with meredith after the meeting we can do some clerical corrections um we can just do ourselves without at the meeting here sounds good okay mr dickman was that the same error you were going to point out yeah because nobody can replace you dean it's only acting oh yes i can trust me and they will someday um okay any other changes all right not hearing any um do i have a motion to accept the minutes as as as corrected so moved commissioner [Music] all right so uh roll call uh to accept uh the minutes from november 5th as corrected commissioner dickman hi all right commissioner sholak aye commissioner wu hi and commissioner varenkamp hi and i am abstain so the minutes are approved thank you okay we'll move on now quickly then to uh item six new business um public hearing requests for rezoning for the property located at 23 240 county road 30 and first up is staff report so mr moretto we look forward to hearing your report please thank you chair and commission um i have a short presentation to provide to you and hopefully you can hear me i have uh donning my mask today so uh hopefully i'm clear and concise and able to be heard let me know if i'm not and i'll speak up now let me let me uh share my screen there we go so today uh we have um city file number 20 040 a rezoning request for 23 240 county road 30. uh just a quick summary for those that may step out some of the key facts of this is that the request for rezoning from a transitional rural commercial to that of rural commercial is being requested the tcr as it's known zoning requires a rezoning 2 cr or rural commercial our 2040 comprehensive plan guides this parcel for the rural commercial zone the applicant has satisfied the requirements of this particular request through the application process the applicant does have an existing conditional use for the existing operations but that should also be reviewed and considered as well that's not going to be a part of the request today but then it does exist and uh yes paul i i just want to just clarify something yes when you say that the applicant has a conditional use permit already is part of the tcr is that do they own the property as of this moment and therefore they're operating it under that it is to my knowledge that uh this is being co-applied for by the current owner as well as the the i believe it's uh trevor and missy sherbert uh so it is to my knowledge is being co-applied for i i do not know the current uh ownership status i believe it's still owned by the original owner um again that's to my current knowledge okay yeah and i only ask that because i see here you know we keep seeing the applicant and i just want to know are are we talking about uh the sherbers or the the current owner of the property as far as again i i we don't know but um i forget her last name um conan i i believe that that that conditional use permit rests with her when she owns or did own the property and i i just wanted to clarify that so thank you sorry correct it uh you know it was applied for by the cohens and they uh they're the ones that carry it it'll carry over when the new owners take acquisition um and that does come with some caveats for that property when in the future things develop and we can discuss that as well okay thank you sorry absolutely uh at this time based off of those particular facts are known to us today staff recommends the rezoning from tcr to cr uh i'll move on to the next part of the presentation just for a little bit of context we do have a map here that shows the general location of this particular property you'll note that uh we have the uh what's called uh you have to get to uh excuse me if it's the berkshire ville is it birchville area um right off of county road 30 and i believe 10 this area features some of the similar uses such as transition commercial as well as rural commercial you can see that in this context map um the applicant for the application excuse me was deemed complete november 15th of 2020. the subject property does have a conditioner's permit which includes a an allowance for a home occupation a contractor storage which is allowed but in the accessory building which is on site the current condition is acceptable to the applicant's current operation as stated in their narrative but any increased usage may require a new condition use permit which needs to be reviewed at the time of new application in context of the 2040 comprehensive plan it does guide this particular parcel for rural commercial the proposed use is for rural commercial uses provided in the applicant's narrative and the location of such a property is planned for this particular use here's a little excerpt from the comprehensive plan showing the subject property and red circle the pink color is that rural commercial zoning type you can see there's a commonality along that corridor for that particular use from a quick analysis standpoint the current zone is in the tcr zone uh the land for future development for this zone has been planned um it's considered a holding zone for this particular cr zoning it does provide many of the different options for the cr zone but it's not meant to be permanent it's again called transitional and the new zone which is uh being applied for it does provide for a mix of neighborhood commercial uses and rural industrial it is meant to be a long-term zoning for the county road 19 and 30 area um again one of the unique features of this particular zone is that it's not scheduled to have any water sewer from the public side for public access to trunk mains and those sorts of things so uh if if this was if this was did have access it would probably be under industrial zoning but in this case since you can't get those public uh utilities it's under the cr zone so a quick evaluation based off the applicants um based off of the applicant's narrative and the documentation they sent to us the rezoning is consistent with the 2040 comprehensive plan the rezoning meets the purpose of the map amendment for the intended zoning district which is cr for the tcr zone um this zone is compatible with uh what was proposed in the narratives applicants need and the infrastructure is adequate for that particular zoning area the action that's being requested today is to conduct a hearing for that proposed rezoning to review the facts as presented and then a motion to recommend either approval or denial of the applicants application to rezone the subject property from the tcr to the cr commercial zone with that i'd be happy to take any questions you may have okay thank you paul much appreciated um um okay so what uh uh what we're gonna do now is we're gonna open the public hearing for those that will speak if you would please state your name in your address for the record and then um the the uh the way we conduct our public hearings is um we will make notes and and whatnot and at the end of that then our professional staff will attempt to answer those questions that that you may have brought up uh in speaking to the commission and those that can't be may require uh follow-up in the future but um in order to keep this process moving um we'll we'll take one at a time um we would like to limit it at five minutes but um you know we we certainly are are very flexible on that and have been in the past so uh at this point uh we'll open the public hearing if you wish to speak mike at city hall um if you will raise your hand um he'll uh he'll tap you in and then you'll be given that opportunity so i believe i see here we do have the applicants online if you wish to address the council please do so and what we have done in the past in order to facilitate some of the commission's questions we may ask those directly to you after the public hearing is closed so if you stick around that would be greatly appreciated i'm sure you will so mike is there anybody that wishes to uh address the public hearing jacobs with their hand raised really okay wow how long has it been since we had a public hearing where nobody spoke all right um all right well i will um if there's if there's nobody there um i'll take a motion to close the public hearing so move the commissioner okay second anybody second shulac okay very good all right on the motion to close the public hearing commissioner dickman aye mr shahad aye commissioner wu hi mr varenkamp hi and commissioner jacobs aye okay the public hearing is now closed commission discussion and recommendation okay so i think we're all becoming pretty good at this virtual stuff so as we have done in the past um we will go through uh by commissioner um as your uh as your mean is your sole opportunity um to ask staff questions about this or make any comments we'll go through the roster once uh and then after that we'll go through it again in case uh something came to mind or or a discussion happened and you got a follow-up so we'll go through this at least twice then before we uh before we uh make a recommendation to the city council so um anybody want to start if not i'll be glad to all right um so i i had a chance to talk with uh paul today uh about this because as i looked at this rezoning i wanted to kind of see um what were the similarities and differences to what the city did uh in the commlink and if you all remember that's the one on the southeast corner that was also a property where we rezoned it to rural commercial the biggest distinction that i can come up with between what we're seeing here today and discussing and what is um and what happened in the commlink is that comlink came to the city not only requesting the zoning and the variants and and the conditional use permits and stuff but they actually had a plan right so we went through we talked about you know parking spaces and we talked about buildings and we talked about screening and the whole nine yards this is different only in that they're not coming with a plan of any sort um they're just asking for rezoning um and initially i i of course i i have some concerns about that only because they're we're being asked to result a piece of property that apparently has a very intended type of use but without any idea as to what kind of changes they may or may not make in the future um is this going to be really be suitable now uh in in looking at a request for rezoning the city has a high level of discretion improving or design or denying the application and though and the one thing that i went to is is this you know is this an allowed use now um in the application in their narrative and in the staff report it says contractors yards a contractor's yards are a is is a really fairly undefined term as to what a contractor yard is um and and if i as i look at the application and at least right now my understanding of the intended use of this property this company is in the business of excavating and garbage dumpsters not garbage like household garbage but construction demolition and new construction materials so they're going to have the roll-on units but there isn't a whole lot of insight so when we talk about the permitted uses and the conditional use uses in the uh cr district i guess the first question we should all answer ourselves is this a contractor yard type of use that that applies not a real technical thing again i know it's very vague but that was the first thing i had [Music] now as i went to the staff report in the background it was said that the application was completed on november 15th after discussion about the appropriate rezoning type for this location it was agreed that cr was the best solution for their needs at this time paul i don't know if you were involved in those discussions but what what other alternatives were discussed or possible thank you chair originally the application came in under a rezoning to industrial industrial zone and that is not compatible with the geography of that particular area in order to successfully petition for an industrial zone you have to have municipal water and sewer and so we looked at the zoning the tcr zoning which currently exists there and community or rural commercial was the appropriate zone as guided by the comprehensive plan okay mr moreno why would the applicant come in and think that they should have it rezoned to industrial is do they consider their operation to be more of an industrial based population i mean well i think um you know we have our applicant here as well i'd say that um knowing that the contractor's yard as open-ended as that may be um was a conditional use option i think the original intention was to not have to go through the conditional use process for the contractor's yard in the future but this is the intended zone that's guided for by the comprehensive plan and so that seems to be the most appropriate okay but but anything that they do outside of a residential home business they'd have to get a conditional use permit for anyway wouldn't they generally speaking in this particular zone because the the the contractor's yard type business isn't available within the permitted uses and so they'd have to end there's a current conditional use permit in place which pretty much restricts the type of operations that can go on okay well in the next paragraph i'll get down to it says uh it operates with a conditions permit it allows for home occupation with contractor storage inside the accessory building this is compatible with the applicant's proposed use of the land in existing building now am i to infer from that that they're going to occupy this property as a residence i don't know exactly that that was the the precise connotation rather that the the the condition is permit itself provides for that type of operation um being the contractor's yard um are they going to operate as like a as i don't know if they're operated as a home necessarily um and we can again we can talk to the the applicant themselves here to answer that but that is a a fair question well and i asked that because because um i recently talked to somebody about a situation that they're in and they they they're looking at buying a place for storage of equipment and and it has a house and it's in wright county and they were telling me they said well the only way we can get a conditional use permit is we have to guarantee then that as a home occupation somebody homesteads the property so in the apple in the current use that they that they have which they say they're going to continue to do is that property to be used as a house in the applicant's narrative they say they're going to consolidate all of their operations one of which is their office that they rent somewhere in corcoran so might i assume that the household will become an office and this is just a big assumption but would that negate or would that would that bring them in non-compliance as a home occupation with contractor storage i know that's kind of a difficult technical question what i would say is that um if if for example they were to again this is a hypothetical but if they were to engage in an activity that goes beyond the scope of the condition news permit then they'd be out of compliance regardless of the zoning type right so if they continue to operate as though they're a tcr and they go ahead and operate outside of the context of that condition and use permit then it'd be violation and so it invoked the revocation of a cop or at least a code compliance of the cup whether the rezoning would invoke that either way i don't know if the rezoning would have kind of a mechanism for checking that um well i i mean i would assume that that a rural commercial zone doesn't allow for residential it's it's a i've i've never heard of this zoning before before i came here so it's a little unique to me yeah that's fine i mean i understand that right well i you know i i just brought it up because you know this idea that you know again we don't know exactly what it is they're going to do with it they in their narrative they say they're going to continue to improve it but i'm just like well if we if we re-zone this to rural commercial and all of a sudden here comes all the equipment here comes the offices and and everything else um without any kind of you know permitting for all that and the and you know going back to what we required for comlink when they were going to build it now that was a dirt piece of ground these guys have existing structures um but uh there there's a lot there's a lot to be said for you know bringing in a a cr type of of contractor yard where they i would assume we're going to have outdoor storage we're going to have more vehicles and yet but we don't have anything really on our plate to say whether or not it it will be allowed or what kind of what kind of things we're going to do until they actually come forward with a development plan to build upon it so i'm just kind of wondering where's the fine line between when when when see when this is rezoned and when they actually start utilizing it to a use that is not currently permitted for right i think that's when they decide to go ahead and operate they're going to need to come in with a conditional use update or amendment or just a new conditional use permit that's really the option that's available regardless of whether or not even if they continue to operate under this current zone they would still need to amend that conditions permit to increase the intensity of use yeah okay um okay um so under the uh you know and here's kind of where i'm going to so under the current proposed use section of the report currently the applicant operates three locations where they store trucks and job materials outdoor storage space and then leased office space so currently outdoor storage job materials and offices aren't currently allowed under the condition use permit in which they are now going to be assuming and which i'm understanding here they have to be operating under then you read the last sentence it says their intention is to improve the site over time and submit a separate application for site plans in details the last paragraph it should be noted the development in use beyond the bounds of the original conditional use permit may require an amendment to the condition use permit the cr zone does not does provide for contractors operations as a conditional use so if they're going to bring in i don't know what job materials are and they're going to start storing i don't know where you put these roll-offs but i i don't know that they would keep in a building i don't think there's enough building space on that site so if they're going to start storing them on the site now you got an outdoor storage thing you got materials you got equipment and you got office space in a house which are not currently in the in the allowed under their condition use permit so before they actually do stuff would they have to be required to come in and go through the amendments to that in order to do that when the intensity of use increases beyond that condition you sprint which you know as you read and eloquently stated they will need to revisit that conditions permit to continue okay all right um um i um one of the uh things that i also well i i won't go into talking about all the specifics that that we required for comlink because again they actually had a plan but um i'm i'm satisfied with what you're telling me that you know because again i just thought well is this just a you know the fact that they didn't come in with a plan maybe they don't know what they want to do but hey once it's zoned you know cr you know just bring everything in and we'll deal with the aftermath later i just kind of wanted to know what what's going to come first and so that's those were really the most important questions i had so i will uh thank you very much and we will go to uh commissioner varen camp um we talked about the tcr that's dr and all of those things my biggest concern i don't have a lot of concern with anything changing out there as far as what happens with that property i do have a concern with once they do start bringing in the traffic and stuff will all access come off of county road 30. what improvements to the intersection of county road 30 and county road 19 as everybody knows that's probably the most one of the most miserable intersections we have in town being a stop sign on county road 30 and then 19 is going north and south i know our county group has they say they've improved it with that onboarding lane if you turn north on county road from county road 30 on to 19 you merge into that uh into 19 but i drive it frequently and i just see a miserable intersection still so that's my only concern about this once they start bringing in traffic what are the improvements to that corner um that the city has responsibility for those property owners at that intersection what what responsibility do they have and then again is it just traffic on the 30 and in and out driveways on the 30 or is there an in and out on 19 if you can answer that at this time oh well let me if i may paul so dean in the uh in the comm link you know as i read through that packet hennepin county won't allow ingress or egress from 19. i know i understand that i'm asking i'm asking just about this property okay yep right i think um when an application comes in for evaluation for the site design that had to be something we need to take a look at um and it's totality to make sure that you know we have um thought this through and this is something i can take to our group as well to kind of wrestle over and come up with a really good solution and then the other question that i have is i'm sorry go ahead brent no i just wanna i don't know what paul is saying you know with the current design not changing and no additional axises it would remain as is with no further improvements but as paul mentioned if they had a new site plan coming forward that would be under further evaluation okay the other question i had is what if those property owners of the property owners that we're talking about weren't to change it to commercial residential what if they were to change it to light industrial down the road and stuff that obviously would need to have city water city sewer to do that is that correct correct and then what changes anywhere else in town if we do have city water city sewer if we choose or if someone comes and requests a change from um mixed residential or residential or commercial to something else do people have that option if things make sense in the city or do we follow the comp plan specifically um the comp plan is our guiding plan it kind of tells us what needs to happen on there is an opportunity to amend the comp plan in the future if council met council and as well as our council of course deem it appropriate and uh that's a very labored process that requires a lot of review and a lot of consideration and won't be done on a whim all right um that's all i have there's no neighbors obviously uh concerned about this and uh this is a piece of property right out in the middle of nowhere so uh it's it's hard to see after all these years seeing those horses roam around that piece of property and such and the current landowners using it the way they do and such um i'm interested to see how it would change and still be somewhat appealing obviously if if we go to the next step and have dumpsters those kind of things um brought in obviously the fencing screening and everything would be part of that comprehensive use or excuse me conditional use permit change or request correct right thanks that's all i've got thank you thank you dean all right uh commissioner wu you're up yeah i have a question for the applicants for trevor and missy sherbourne um based on what you're hearing and what we're reading you you need to do an amendment to the conditional use permit in order to operate your your business on this property so can you elaborate on what your plans are moving forward here as far as transitioning from the different sites that you have spread around the area and amalgamating it to just one side and then you know doing a site plan so um i is our video not working can you see us we can hear you but i don't see anything okay just one moment already here we go um here we go hi how are you i'm missy sherbert this is my husband trevor hello um so i i liked your hypothesis that you were coming up with potentially from um the narrative that was written um to be honest with you we were really upfront with kendra on what we were thinking and and kind of the current use what we need to do to just get in there and maybe start using the offices as we develop a site plan and this was the path that she recommended us taking which was to first um and and i did ask her are you sure we shouldn't try to rush this and do that and and this was the past she recommended was to let's see re do the reason request get that in um work on our site plan which we started working with an engineer for a site plan that's you know appealing to the neighboring community that is understanding of the traffic um that's going to take a little more time for us to come up with and so she kind of thought the best path was request the reason second step this is all new for us so i appreciate your patience as we learn the process as young business owners acquiring property um in a community that we've been in for a long time and really love um so she said kind of go through this step and then the next step is a cup um i didn't really know that we'd be grandfathering in conan's cop i i understood that we were going to have to come in and present to you guys a full site plan our full intentions kind of spend another big chunk of change you know we got to get through this one and then the next one um but what i understood was that would be kind of step two it is a full cup with our site plan and everything and we've already started having those conversations with scott and kendra but we just we aren't fully there yet we're just kind of learning a lot in the process so our goal really is our slow season is in january february and march and we would love to um we do not plan on living there we live on a family our family farm just down the road um we'd like to come in and just get the offices set up during our slow season we know that's an immediate need we'd like to use it as it is kathrati the excavator that is using it now under the cup has six trucks we have three so we don't feel like we're gonna be adding any traffic or any concerns through this step one of the process and we kind of hope to really work well with with all of you on step two in the process to come up with a good good plan that everyone feels good about so i hope that answers the questions we're not living there um we are going to come with an amended cp that we understand would need your approval and your advisory um and i think that's it okay all right thank you oh the dumpster dean i don't have any further questions okay go go ahead go go ahead uh miss sherbert uh yes so the dumpsters we have a dumpster yard up a highway 55 and really with the type of business that we do we primarily store our dumpsters at the landfill for logistics sake and we're looking at a partnership right now that has storage yards in downtown minneapolis so we're not really looking to come in and do you know have a bunch of garbage disposal materials bins that's not what we're really looking for we're looking for a good clean um headquarters where our team can all be together um and the dumpster business is really run in minneapolis from landfill um and all of our bins are typically out uh not not sitting around you know like that so we haven't fully thought that piece through yet because we just didn't see it as relevant right now with the yard that we have on highway 55 okay well i great uh thank you for your explanation and i think you know and i and i don't i don't know that maybe um uh i think maybe kendra gave you the you know again it's a little unusual that that you you you know we don't have both of those pieces together and we don't go through this a lot rezoning for this especially this district but since we did go through it um and yeah so phase two um it would make sense then to to do all that together i think at least for my my own personal opinion i think the thing that would probably cause the most alarm would be as if all of a sudden you had all this outdoor storage all sudden showing up yeah i mean we you know uh um you know i know that they've been out there for several years and and you know you drive by that place a hundred times i maybe have seen this pickup truck out there twice you know and he probably stopped in at the shop to get something there so i mean i've really been impressed and i didn't even know really what the i mean i know that we did that cup back in 2013. um i of course i can't remember that far back but um but i i it how that worked has done really really well and you never see the the vehicles out there i mean you drive by that it looks like yeah you see the horses back there it looks like a family farmstead you really would never know that that cult ratty was storing you know big trucks and equipment in there you never would know and so um i don't think you'll have any any problems doing that so i guess maybe the only issue would be you know you're you're you know not using as a residence and setting up office but um if if you're not going to be storing anything out there you know talk with kendra and talk with brad and see how we can maybe just kind of maneuver around that one little issue maybe it's not an issue because like i said once you get it zoned cr i don't know that you can have a residence in there okay god so we were told i'm sorry that's what we were told and that was our intention yeah yeah so so this may not this may be a non-issue right from the get-go um but uh you know as a planning commission we're you know we're trying to we're trying to go three you know three feet deep into this thing to make sure that we cover all the bases so that we don't all we don't all get embarrassed at some point in the future because we you know we weren't doing our job right and we do like as a contractor if you look at our website like we really pride ourselves on our appearance our site presence um you know we're a diverse contractor and and we've always just i get embarrassed by driving by yards like you're thinking and i never want that with a commercial property that we are have our name a part of and you know community there is peaceful our daughter goes to the daycare step by step there um we're friends with several members of the community right over there and we would never want to impede or do something that wouldn't be visually appearing we are a contractor there is that reality but we don't work with you and the surrounding community to come up with a good plan that that is respective of being a contractor but also just perspective of like you said you're used to seeing horses there and we don't want to ruffle feathers oh well yeah horse i have horses and you know i don't have anybody coming up to me and going don't ever sell the horses you know we like looking at them you know well you go out and feed them yeah okay um oh good um uh commissioner sholak you're up mr chair i have no questions or comments at this time oh okay commissioner dickman thank you mr chair um i'm excited to meet the applicants knowing that they are corcoran residents and already have offices here in corcoran um also excited that they're thinking about expanding and consolidating their business um especially in that birchville 90 1930 corridor i think that makes a lot of sense i i i think with you guys talking with kendra that i can see the linear path that they're trying to go through i think the difference here too is you just happen to have a property here that already had a conditional use permit from 2013 that seemed to fit maybe not perfectly but at least there was a venn diagram of activities that you guys are looking to do that fit within your business model and what the property already had so i think this does make sense within the 2040 comp plan it's the next step and then um it gives you guys time to potentially do some minor operations of what you're already doing and consolidate and figure that portion of the business out during your slow period while giving you time to figure out what additional conditional uses you're looking to apply and figuring out how many pergolas you're going to need on the top of a building because i think that was a pretty big discussion at council for the uh comlink piece so um there will be some design things and other things that staff will help you through but that might be a good one to just reference on what are some of the things i know part of the thing with comlink was the proximity of the bike trail um on 19 which you may or may not have um at this particular property so um excited to have you back when you guys figure out what you want to do for a cup but supportive of this within the confines of what we have as a com plan and and what we're trying to do with that area on 19 and 30. back all right well um got any follow-up questions or discussion um okay um uh paul i in the in the uh in in our packet we didn't we didn't actually get the we we didn't get the uh uh we we didn't get the uh the rezoning paperwork here yeah that's a a new uh item for me for this city and uh the city that i worked in previously we didn't present the ordinance or resolutions we went to council so i apologize for that i didn't know that that need to be part of that but uh i think a motion to make a record to make a recommendation for that rezoning would be appropriate let's prepare members just to follow up on that and i apologize i obviously didn't bring paul all the way through the process with everything i did speak with both paul and kendra today and there would be an ordinance for the rezoning and then the resolution would simply be the finding of the facts to support that so really what it comes down to is if you the commission believe that the rezoning should take place as paul mentioned a motion to recommend that action and then the ordinance and resolution that will be drafted for the city council formal approval um and i i personally apologize for that okay i mean it's you know obviously where i don't think we have any changes uh to it um but um you know when it comes down to a lot of conditions and things like that you know that that's vital to uh our understanding of what we're voting on so um in this case uh no harm no foul uh is everybody comfortable with just voting uh without the resolution in front of you okay so i guess no changes then by anybody no no okay well uh we'll uh we'll take a motion then to um does this have an um mr chair yes sir can i uh try this to just kind of make it quick um i'll make a motion to adopt the resolution that needs to be written up approving this uh change from tcr to r does that sum it up pretty good and then the and then the findings of fact yeah and just okay sister chair and commissioner varenkamp just a friendly amendment just to recommend approval versus approval um just uh oh yeah okay so we've got a motion to recommend approval of the resolution and the findings of fact do i have a second second shoe like okay uh roll call aaron a uh commissioner dickman yay commissioner schulack yay commissioner wu commissioner varenkamp and commissioner jacobs yay as well so um mr mrs scherber good luck glad to uh yeah you know well you all live in the in the community so we're not gonna welcome you but uh you know well i i did uh i did look at your website the bacon wrapped ribs look fantastic i mean in in my semi-retirement state i was looking for any kind of desk job just so i could come to the thursday meals you're hired there you go but uh yeah so um well good luck and and and we'll probably see you sometime down the road is as you continue to grow so thank you so much thank you we'll bring ribs to the next meeting okay all right thanks everybody thanks all right um we will move on now to item 7 reports and information 7a planning project update anybody uh have any any uh planning questions or comments boys this thing used to be about three four pages long and now it's uh about one and a half maybe things are getting closed out now streamlining there you go um i i don't have any um other than i i don't know uh paul brad uh what's the latest and greatest with tavara i i expected to see all the trees cut down by now they're are they are they gonna are they moving forward or i see utility work are they putting sewer water over there yet so or water piping is going on yes chairman that's actually part of the city project for the southeast water main connection project i believe paul is looking through they did submit the first edition for final plat so i think paul's looking through for completeness is that correct paul correct i'm working with kendra to come up with uh a completeness letter if if so and then come to planning commission either i think january or probably likely february i believe correct okay all right um paul i had a question on number three it's the kieran emmy edition i know that we spent a lot of time on that as a commission and council and development rights and whatnot and there was some big hurdles to go through with that one i didn't see any dates so am i to assume the applicant is still working on that one on number three i believe you're correct on that um they're still working through some of those issues and uh we'll bring a update as soon as it's available okay all right any other questions or comments or discussion with the planning update all right we'll move on uh 7b city council report uh council member schultz thank you mr chair yes sir um i'll probably i'll just focus on the things that have come before the planning commission and then happy to answer any questions on any others so in our last meeting uh creek reserve which i will probably forever call sawgrass as long as i'm on the console it came before us the minor amendments uh with regards to garages and exterior materials the exterior materials followed meredith's comment in the planning commission about having them include at least two options from the list to break up the backs of those large buildings and not just let them pick you know one of the simplest forms so it's up to them as to what they would would pick but when we weren't going to let them just get away with you know adding some window trim and call it a day with that um the garage the garage size had to do with the uh the variance for the front edge of the garage um they asked for one number planning commission came back with a lower number there was a lot of discussion in the city council and we ended up going with um their requests but added a caveat that the front exterior with both levels could not exceed 40 percent for a garage so because we looked at it as if you could have a house that has a two level house and there could be a large garage front but the whole upper story over that garage could be house front and that really breaks up the look of the garage so that's why we added that no more than overall forty percent um i think that was the only really two items that that were changed by council there was other discussions but nothing else moved forward that i can recall and then the 15th and final on ravinia was passed so it's amazing how fast that project moved along the testimony weber properties was approved and then a minor subdivision on saint teresa that just split up the property that they're purchasing from the city of corcoran to the piece that they're retaining versus the linear park and the portion that the city is retaining and so that was the that was the three real items that came before council related to planning items but happy to answer any questions on those or any other questions you guys may have well uh thank you did um say therese go ahead meredith alan did say therese give an idea of their um uh timeline brad you might want to comment on that if you've heard any updates from saint therese i don't think they've presented anything to council in quite a while so correct so they're still in the design phase chair and members and councilmember schultz um their goal is to submit something early in 2021. um they have actually the purchase agreement needs an application by december 12th that they have to um put some more cash towards the project so they're going to be doing that extending the purchase agreement so they can navigate the process um one of the things we're actually looking at in order for them to finalize their plans they need to know the elevation of the roads surrounding their project so with the staff level are considering how we're going to establish the road elevation parallel with their project and we don't have a road design yet so we're kind of chicken and egg rushing to get that move forward at this point so hopefully in january or february the latest we'll get an application but they're moving full steam ahead okay thanks um so i was the liaison for that last um city council meeting and uh the discussion um around that garage uh issue uh was pretty interesting um i believe it was a developer that kind of came and said well yeah but you know if you're only looking at it from you know a street level first level you know deal but you know if you look at the fact that we have such a larger front that garages it was actually pretty interesting and an interesting way to look at it so my question to the the commission at large and maybe to mr moretto mr martens and mr schultz do you guys see this as being an issue that the planning commission will you know should we address that you know all of those percentages and and start considering how that that second floor stuff might factor into that that maybe might make this all a little bit easier what your thoughts on that i mean is this something we should maybe actively pursue in in reviewing and making any necessary changes they brought it up the council made a condition um i just wonder without maybe aligning that maybe on future projects we're always going to leave it to the city commission or the city council to do that um i would say personally i've gotten a sense that there may be some some future interest in redesigning some of these ordinances so that there isn't as much flexibility with puds that's kind of the sense i'm getting from discussions that i've heard um it'll be interesting to see what the future council says i would say once we have a work session planning session um for the future council what comes out of that will probably be some direction to the planning commission to think about having those discussions but yeah i mean it seems like we've always had this request for changes to what our ordinances have been with these puds and the 40 percent two kind of came into the fact well if you just straight up said no you can have up to 75 percent what was to stop somebody for coming in with a single level home that's 75 garage front right or 80 percent garage front so it seems like every time every time a new project comes in there's things we've never thought about in the past that maybe we should be putting on a list and starting to hammer out and you know i would say the planning commission is the right commission to be thinking about those things and making recommendations to to the future council mr chair yes sir it would be nice if we could lock some of this stuff down i know a lot of frustration for everybody everything coming to us is a pud instead of uh having kind of some rules and and by and uh expectations set in the ordinances so that'd be cool to see that come yeah yeah well i again i i enjoyed my conversation this morning uh with paul um and you know he came from multiple different cities the last one uh was um um oh i'm thinking of it paul it's on the tip of my tongue um starts with the v yes victoria victoria um and and we discussed you know puds and things like that and uh you know i think paul's got some very interesting stuff meredith i know you and i have talked uh a lot about you know and put it in our our our future plans for the planning commission a tree preservation you know deal uh actually paul has has worked on that kind of stuff in his previous jobs and has had has had some success in getting some of that implemented so i suggested to paul that maybe there's a there's a maybe a future work session for us and for him to you know kind of go through i think he has a lot of new viewpoints that that he can offer us and and you know maybe we can address some of those things i we're certainly not going to solve it as mr varenkam says we everything that comes down the pipe it just seems to change everything and and so i expect we're going to always have that but anyway it was it was a nice discussion and i look forward to you know maybe having some kind of work session along those lines okay uh anything else for um council member schultz and the uh city council report mr chairman yes sir somebody else talk i'll i'll go um just a quick question i've got people asking when does the new roof go on the ice shack and uh in our park brad you may have an update on that but i don't think we were going to do anything until it dried out correct or is the roof coming on i'm almost certain it's done oh yeah it's okay um we weren't doing anything on the inside until it dried out i knew that correct yeah i i'm 99 sure that's done the roof the new roof is on they were working on when i was running at the ball field two weeks ago bro and at least they were taking the shingles off so okay good just i haven't seen anything and uh be nice if we can preserve that before it falls down not now as we need is cold weather to freeze ice bring on winter i got snowmobiles ready to go um okay anything else all right we'll move on to item 7c any other business okay um mr chair i know you brought up um just the tree preservation plan i i know with the new council coming in just wanted to state it for the record some things that we've talked about i know we talked about um tree preservation is something that's come up garage facing which is something that's come up we've also talked about conservation easements and and just not being familiar with that as a city and perhaps that could be something we look at as as what maple grove or even victoria or you know shoreview has done um within that as we're talking puds i think a lot of that stems around preserving rural character i know that's up for discussion and debate about what that really means um but i think when tavara came in we talked about you know what is that contiguous forest or at least things that are identified in the comp plan as ecologically sensitive areas um we're really sticklers for holding things within the comp plan but it seems like anything that's ecologically sensitive as long as the esa is done or the official letter is done through the county we kind of give carte blanche if we get sewer water and pave roads to developers so i think it's worth discussing what's uh what's valued um and then aligned with the with the new incoming council of how that charts forward within the the comp plan so i wanted to bring that up just with paul here and the council member and mayor elect here on the on the call and just stated that for the for the record yeah well thank you and you know i apologize uh council member thomas uh mayor mckee um and mr nichols thank you for joining us uh tonight uh we normally don't we normally don't get a lot of outsiders at least from the you know from the council i you know alan uh alan has always been our go-to guy here now for quite a while but uh thank you for joining us and of course you know any any feedback that you may have for our meetings and and whatnot we'll certainly uh certainly love to receive that but sounds good congratulations on all your elections and and again i think we're all looking forward to um you know to uh to working with you and and seeing uh you know really what what you know what your ideas are about uh some of these issues and you know a lot of this stuff now you know we're all new to this even though some of us have been doing some of this stuff for a long time right um we we we are certainly understanding some of the shortcomings of of how our codes and ordinances are set up um you know when we can all point to examples as we as we go through this but we're all learning and um and we're all trying to make sure that we get it right each and every time but um you know some i i think one thing we all learn in here real quick is you're never going to please everybody all right and and you're never going to have the answer for everybody they're they're right there's there's too many answers there's too many options and uh you know i think the only solace that i take out of you know being in my chair versus yours is that we just get to make recommendations there you go you know your vote is certainly much more um important uh than ours and so well it's definitely a a team effort and i'm looking forward and i i think i can speak for for everyone on the everyone new on the console at least that we're all looking forward to uh diving into a lot of this stuff together and starting to figure it out yeah yeah well um well my goal is always to make new mistakes and not make the same old mistakes over and over again so we will at least there you go i think i'll be in alignment for some change to make things better we're not going to get right every time to your point d um so we can at least make for some progress i think we will see a lot of things tighten up in the ordinances if we can put the time in to work on it yeah yeah yeah well i mean we we all have such very diverse you know interests and experience and properties here we all have our own personal biases and i think one of the hardest things about any of you know my job or your job or any of the other volunteers here and especially maybe like brad you know it's just you you um you're going to have these biases and but trying to ignore that and be fair you know to to the overall best interest of the city um you know i think is uh that's a hard thing to do but um you know we all love the city there's no doubt about it we all love here we moved here and there was a reason actually i'll tell you a quick when i was when i was young right out of college um and i got into snowmobile and i had a high school buddy who lived uh up on bechtold and he had a landscape business uh that he ran out of here and he says come on over let's go snowmobiling we got trails all over the place so you know um i lived in plymouth and so we trailed our snowmobiles out of here and i'm coming downtown and i see this sign corkering and i just like what uh that is such a goofy name and i said to my wife i go there is no way i'm ever gonna live in a town called kirkland you know and well you know what three years later we got five acres and we're building a house you know and i've never regretted it but um uh yeah so all right well um item eight commissioner liaison calendar um we have mr sholak up on the 10th uh from today uh mr varenkamp on the 21st and commissioner wu on the 14th of january um beyond that i don't know how how accurate your calendars are but i probably can't really go past mid mid-january here but does anybody have any changes anybody going to be out of town need to switch we're all good okay good all right well item nine adjournment um i'll uh entertain a motion or i'll make the motion to uh adjourn do i have a second second there you can all right proving uh adjournment for tonight's meeting commissioner dickman aye mr shaw aye commissioner wu all right and commissioner jacobs i vote i this meeting is now adjourned and i thank you all for your uh time and uh mr moreto you did a fine job today and uh we look forward to working with you again thank you paul it looks like you're probably sitting in the mayor and the chairperson seat right there aren't you you see that flag in that exit site right behind you in that calendar paul you might since since we haven't been there since like march you might want to make sure that the calendar behind you is flipped to the current month don't don't look at it make any decisions all right we all look forward to the day we can get back there and and i i'm i'm anxious to see the remodel so hope it's going well brad and paul and everybody else who works there so uh with that i beat you good night and thank you very much happy holidays to see you next year everyone happy new year all right take care bye thank you