I hereby call to order the Roseville City Council meeting for Monday, January 12th, 2026. Mr. City Manage, call the role, please. >> Council member Schwarter >> here, >> council member Grath, >> here. >> Council member Bower >> here. >> Council member Stron >> here. >> Mayor Ro >> here. Uh, and by way of introduction with us at the DES, we have our city attorney, Rachel Tierney, who's on my right at the end. Uh, and we have our city manager, Pat Trean, who's on my left at the other end. We have a number of other uh staff and guests who will be participating in the meeting uh as uh those items come up and we will certainly make those introductions at that time. Um I want to start by thanking everyone for being here this evening uh and for taking time from your schedules to uh and your busy lives to engage in local decisionmaking. Uh for a lot of you this may be the first time at a city council meeting uh and a lot of this may be new to you. uh and we understand that it can be a bit intimidating. Uh and so I want to assure you that uh uh I understand as my role as the mayor and running the meeting is to help people understand the process uh and to have people feel comfortable participating uh and make sure that uh that we hear from everybody uh who wants to be heard from uh including all different points of view that might be represented. Um and then also uh want to talk some more about some of the the rules of the road per uh you know council rules among other things uh related to public comment which I can imagine a fair number of you are here for uh as well as uh to see uh the meeting this evening. Um as I said I will make sure to help describe what's happening and uh what's going on. Um, I did want to address some housekeeping matters um that uh relate to uh all of our meetings, but specifically tonight uh we are conducting a a business meeting of the Roseville City Council, which is your local unit of government. Uh and the uh uh the way uh people uh conduct themselves this evening should be in accordance with that environment. Uh we are not here to provide uh entertainment. Uh we are not here expecting uh either cheers or applause as much as we might like to receive it uh or jeers or heckling uh from anyone of anyone. Everybody here deserves uh all of our respect whatever they might be saying and whatever their point of view might be. Uh and so that is a guiding principle that I will make sure uh and uh uh remind us of if need be uh over the course of the evening and I'm certainly uh hoping that I never have to make that reminder. Um and I think we can certainly uh conduct ourselves appropriately. But once again um efforts to express support in the form of applause or cheers or uh express disapproval in the form of jeers or heckling or other uh uh comments isn't appropriate and isn't uh productive uh to the conducting of the business this evening. I do want to note also that a number of folks have various uh types of noise makers uh and uh that can be disruptive to the meeting. So, I would encourage people to be uh as careful as you can about how you're handling those uh as you go through the meeting this evening. Um and I I hope that once again we can uh we can proceed uh on that basis. Um I do want to also note for members of the public uh that we do have extra copies of the meeting agenda available both I think in the room here uh on the back table presuming there are uh ex enough copies available. Uh we do also have copies I believe on a table as I saw coming in out in the hallway. Uh and certainly those are available for people in uh attendance this evening to help follow along with the meeting. Um also uh information is provided as to um city policies uh that exist currently as it relates to immigration and uh specifically our policing. Uh and so that is available for your reference as well. Once again we have a number of copies of those. We do also always provide uh one complete copy of all the meeting materials that's available to be shared by members of the public who are in attendance this evening. Uh and that is in a large three- ring binder at the back of the table. And I'm not sure if we've got another one outside on the meeting materials, but we do have one inside the chambers here uh right by the back door under the big clock. Uh and once again, that's uh for folks to share. Uh so please uh please uh work that out amongst yourselves as you need to work through that. Um, I do want to note that if you have a cell phone, uh, we encourage you to silence it or otherwise assure that it isn't disruptive of the meeting this evening as well. So, our first order of business, uh, after the roll call, which we just completed, uh, is the pledge of allegiance. And so, we'll ask you to stand, if you're able, for the pledge of allegiance. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> All right. Uh, next on our agenda will be consideration of the agenda, but I did want to just take a moment uh for a point of personal privilege uh this evening uh to make a a brief statement um uh and I'll begin uh this way. I want to begin uh by offering sincere condolences to the family and friends of Renee Good who was killed last week and to the community more broadly as we process this horrible act. That was a shocking event and the shock is still reverberating through our lives in the form of a whole range of emotions. That shock came on top of the impacts of the ramp up of immigration enforcement in this area and its disruptions to people's lives and the real fear that it has led to among our neighbors. Whether they are longtime or multi-generation citizens, recent citizens, legal immigrants, refugees, or have other status, people in this country should not be made to live in fear. That is a founding American principle that it sickens me to see violated on a daily basis. Renee Good should be alive today. It's that simple. Responsible professional law enforcement begins with the foundational notion that everyone should come out of every encounter alive and with their rights intact that should not even be subject to debate. The fact that Miss Good is dead and that so many rights are being trampled upon is what animates and motivates a whole host of activities by regular people. From peaceful protests to observing and recording and offering legal help to people to providing help in other ways as simple as running errands for families who may be afraid to go to the grocery store. I am grateful to live in a community that steps forward on behalf of our neighbors to meet the needs and the challenges that we are all facing together. May we all be safe and effective in those efforts and I pray that those efforts soon will be made unnecessary. And now uh consideration of our agenda this evening and Mr. Trean I'll turn to you from a staff perspective. I believe there are some changes to what has been presented initially uh as to the plan for the agenda this evening. >> Yes. Uh thank you, Mr. Mayor. As you note, uh item 8A um is city council uh direction on future agenda items initiated by uh city council member, in this case, council member Bower. That was scheduled to be at the end of our regular business meeting. Um my suggestion to council is to move that up to the first business item. So 8A would be uh the new 7A, so to speak, and take that up. We also have an EDA meeting uh later tonight if we get to it. Uh we can talk about that agenda uh now or later if you'd like, but um that's we may need to adjust that based on the time uh we'll take here tonight to get through the regular business. >> All right. And I would note that I think it makes sense in terms of the economic development authority agenda. Certainly uh business item 5D is not necessarily timesensitive and and is something we want to allocate a fair amount of time to. Um and also uh item 5B uh which is recognizing our recipients of our sustainable steward award. I think we've already indicated to those folks that we may may not get to that this evening to to work with us to reschedule that opportunity. So um but I would uh excuse me like to see that we can get to the business items of the annual election of officers which shouldn't be too timeconuming. Uh and also the request from Twin Cities Habitat for Humanity uh for some one-time assistance. Uh, and I'd certainly be open when we get to considering the EDA agenda to reversing those items, uh, if that makes sense from a timing point of view. Uh, do council members have any other suggested changes to tonight's agenda? Council member uh, Strong, >> I understand we also have a time-sensitive issue in 7B of the council meeting um, and to ensure that that is addressed in a timely manner. >> Correct. and and so yes, that would be uh one of the things I would I would like to try to see if we can't get the entire uh council agenda undertaken this evening, but we may have to look at uh 7A, which is the strategic plan update, because that may be uh fairly timeconuming. Uh and so I think we're we're going to have to play some things by ear this evening uh and uh and work things accordingly uh so that we make sure that we have an opportunity to hear uh from everybody. Uh so with that uh the suggestion is to move item 8A uh to our first business item. >> Uh and then I was going to unfinish uh I believe that would be the only change to the council agenda this evening. Council member Stron. >> So moved. >> Second. >> All right. And then to be clear that's approving the agenda with that change. >> Correct. >> All right. Council member Stron moved. Uh Council Member Grath seconded that uh approving the agenda with that change. Uh all those in favor uh excuse me. All those in favor signify by saying I. I opposed. That passes unanimously. We have our agenda for this evening. Um, and so a couple of notes uh for the public in terms of uh how this process is set up this evening. Uh and then I've got some additional background information and I promise not to be the only one speaking here this evening uh because I don't want to do that. Um so just from the point of view of how we'll uh this uh evening is set up to go. So, what we've got in item 8A is uh we've got a what we in our rules of procedure for the council uh term a request from a council member for consideration of an item uh that that had not originally been on this evening's agenda. that the process for that is that at the next available council meeting, the council considers whether to add that item to a future agenda and provides any insight uh to the staff as to uh what we want to consider, how we want to consider it uh and um that sort of thing. So, it's a fairly council centric uh decision and discussion at that point. Um and so we wouldn't typically have public comment at that point in those types of decisions. However, we know that there's a lot of people who are here this evening and are interested in providing comment to the council related to issues that are are addressed by that agenda item. Uh and so what my proposal is uh to the council is that we take general public comment on items that are not on the agenda with the understanding that because we're not necessarily taking specific actions uh as proposed this evening on item 8A other than to put it on a future agenda and provide guidance as to what we'll be talking about at that time. uh that we go ahead and and take a general public comment on the subject matter which I'm sure people are here uh to speak about uh and then uh proceed once that is done uh to our consideration of what we'll do with with uh that item on a future council agenda just so that folks kind of understand the process here. Um, and I will say by way of background too that the reason we've got that set up in our council rules is to make sure that we have time to do research, uh, get information from staff, uh, get information a lot of times from our legal counsel, uh, before we take action. A and sometimes when actions are in the form of a um, ordinance, there are state law requirements about the amount of notice we have to provide to people about an ordinance, which is something like 10 days, I believe, published notice. And so we want to make sure that we're following those requirements as well. So, uh, that is why our rules are set up to be this way so that we're providing an opportunity for members of the council to bring things forward, uh, but at the same time a process then to get them under consideration by the council. So, uh, hopefully that was not more than you cared to know about how the council works, but I I figured it would be helpful for folks understanding uh, of sort of where we're at and what will be going on this evening. I do want to also uh before I provide some of the rules of the road for public comment at the council meetings uh just provide uh if uh I may be indulged a little bit of history regarding uh city of Roseville policy uh as to immigration enforcement in the community. Um, and I want to note that uh from at least initially uh for a number of years um certainly as I understand it uh there was more of a a tacid or unwritten policy about uh the police department not uh doing immigration enforcement uh and not asking people their immigration status that was memorialized in a written policy before 2017. Uh and then in 2017, uh that was uh the subject of a council resolution which requires that if that policy is ever to be changed, it does require the approval of the city council. Uh because we wanted to add that uh that uh if you will strength or that step to the process. Um and just to give you an idea of what that policy is, and if you're interested, it is city uh of Roseville Police Department policy 413. Uh of copy of which is was the provided handout. That policy essentially uh restates that Rosal police is not involved in federal immigr immigration law enforcement. Uh officers uh will not inquire about immigration status unless it is directly relevant to a non-immigration criminal investigation. Uh the policy does authorize the department uh to assist ICE only when authorized by the department and only to provide for things like scene safety for people uh or uh safety of employees who are conducting business of uh immigration enforcement. Uh and it further limits the police department employees to only participate in task forces that are not focused on immigration enforcement. Uh the policy does also recognize that state and federal laws or uh I would add probably judicial orders interpreting those laws and making requirements on local uh cities uh may mandate Rosalo police cooperation with immigration enforcement. Uh and there may not be much that cities at that point can do about it because it is under state or federal law or judicial interpretation of those. Um and then finally the policy also acknowledges that there is federal law about uh the keeping and sharing of information about immigration status uh by the department and more details uh certainly are in the policy but I did want to provide that summary. I believe with that we can then uh proceed to uh the public comment portion of the meeting and I just want to make sure I am in order of uh what I wanted to talk about here. Uh so just bear with me for a moment. All right. So, the rules of the road for public comment. Um, and I'll start with a couple of things. Just big picture logistic things. Clearly, all the seats and more are taken in the council chambers here. And it's very likely that we've got people sort of in the overflow in the hallway who may be interested in speaking as well. Um, so, um, I'm going to respectfully request that once you've made your comments, if you'd be willing to free up a seat in the council chambers here so that somebody could come in who may be outside the room and wants to make a comment as well. Uh, that way we can make sure that everybody who once again wants to be heard can be heard. And so, uh, and certainly if you need to leave for any other reason, uh, that would, uh, provide seats for folks as well. Um, so but more specifically, and I'm trying to be brief here, um, by council rule, each speaker at public comment has a three-minute time limit, uh, which I try to enforce generously and gently. Um, keeping in mind that we have a lot of people who want to speak and we want to make sure we can hear from everybody. A lot can be said in three minutes and there is no penalty for not using your whole time uh, to say what you have to say. Uh if if your the essence of your comments is I agree with everything that's been said, that is perfectly okay. Uh you can either express that publicly by comment uh this evening or you could always follow up with an email as well if you're uh not one of those brave souls who's uh who's uh able to bring themselves to come up and speak this evening. Uh so once again, the three-minute time limit. We would ask folks if your comments are longer than that and you're not able to complete them, you certainly could hand a written copy to Mr. Trean and he will make sure and get those to the council. Uh or once again you may follow up by email to the council with additional uh feedback which you can do at any time even uh you know not specifically related to tonight's opportunity for comment. Um I also do want to say uh that uh each speaker will have one opportunity to speak during this public comment session. Uh there isn't an opportunity to come back up for comments. Um we do ask that you identify yourself by at least your name. The typical standard is also to identify yourself by your street or your address if you're comfortable with that. But I think given the subject matter this evening, we will be uh certainly a little more um uh forgiving of people not necessarily providing uh their address or their street. Um, we do encourage speakers to be uh Roseville residents or related to business being done in Roseville primarily uh because that is who we are elected to serve in this body. Uh, and that is helpful for our deliberative process. We do have uh two chairs and two microphones um so we can set it up where one person can be speaking and the next person who wants to speak can have a seat in the other chair and be ready to start their comments. that will keep things moving along. I was going to say that if you wanted to be next in line, you could have a seat in one of the front row seats, but uh there don't appear to be any available at this time, so we'll have to go to a plan B there. Uh but certainly uh you know uh don't hesitate to come up when a seat is available if you want to be the next speaker. Uh we do ask that if you have a name uh that is not necessarily one that we're going to know how to spell very readily, uh we do have the clipboard there and we may slide that off to the side a little bit. But what we typically do is we ask people to once you're finished with your comments, feel free to step off to the side and just write your name so that we get the spelling correct for the record because we want to be respectful of the spelling of your name. Um, and that way the next speaker can begin their comments and we can kind of keep the process moving along fairly fairly uh uh quickly. Um, we do want to make sure that that comments and questions are addressed to the city council uh and not necessarily to other people in the room or other people not in the room. Um, and we're not looking for uh folks to have sort of back and forth debates and arguments. We want to hear your thoughts to us so that we can use those and incorporate those into our decision-making process. And that helps with the next thing I was going to say, which is to remember to be respectful to everybody and courteous to everybody. Um, certainly that is your expectation of us. Uh, and uh should be your expectation of each other as well. So with that, I believe that goes through the rules of the road. That's all the pieces of paper I have in front of me here. Uh and so we will begin our public comment process uh with uh whoever wishes to be the first speaker. The only other thing just that I just remembered was you don't have to adjust the positioning of the microphone whatsoever. It is where it needs to be and the control room will make adjustments if your voice is softer or louder so that everybody hopefully can be heard. And I'll just say if there is any trouble that anybody has hearing, please let us know and we'll make sure to make adjustments along those lines as well. uh question. >> Could we at least start with the order of people signed in on the sheet? >> Uh we you know we don't the signin sheet actually is not how people get the ability to speak during public comment. So that was something that people did sort of unbeknounced to us. Um I don't know Pat if maybe you can grab the sheet and we can attempt to uh to do that. Um and hopefully we have another sheet available for people to sign their names on. Uh and I apologize for that. We don't that's not a process we have here but certainly other cities do that as part of their public comment process. We are sort of first come first serve typically. Uh but that's perhaps a good a good point and I will certainly attempt to be able to read these names as as clearly as I can. So uh with that then and I appreciate that suggestion. I think we've gone through all the rules of the road. Um the first uh signed up speaker is Michelle Morris Went. Hello and welcome. >> Thank you. Yes, my name is Michelle Morris Went and I am here to speak in support of further restrictions for ice in Roseville, specifically the prohibition of using Roseville public parks as staging areas for operations. I am a Roseville resident and I am the granddaughter of Howard Johnson for which Howard Johnson Park on Woodill is named. I speak on behalf of myself and my family, some of whom have joined us here tonight. If you don't know who Howard Johnson is or why he has a park named for him, he is the grandson of immigrants. Both sets of his grandparents immigrated from Sweden in the 1880s and immediately settled in St. Paul where there was a large Scandinavian community. They didn't come here legally or illegally because there were no visas, no asylum applications, and the barrier only barriers to having their family join them were financial. They came here for a better life for their families and their descendants. He was born in St. Paul in 1925. And in the 1950s, he and my grandmother, the daughter of Norwegian immigrants, settled here in Roseville near Northwestern College with their three young children. My uncle Bruce, who passed away in 2021, my aunt Pam, who is here tonight, and my mother Debbie, who is recovering from surgery, but my father is here in her absence. All were raised with the values of service to the community, welcoming the stranger, and fighting injustice. My grandfather personified those values. He earned a Bronze Star Medal and Purple Heart in World War II before becoming a Roseville police officer. He had served for 15 years when he was off duty at home having lunch on August 16th, 1972. He responded to a call of a bank robbery at Rosedale Mall. He pursued the suspect on foot through the nearby neighborhoods. The suspect had climbed a tree and shot and killed my grandfather at 48 years of age. Howard Johnson Park, known to my family as Papa's Park, stands in honor of his legacy of service and protection to community and his commitment to helping the vulnerable and the oppressed. As his grandchildren, we grew up there, learning of his sacrifice and the values he held dear. The fact that ICE agents are using it as a staging area to tear families apart, like his was torn apart, and destroying and inflicting terror on the community he died protecting is an abomination to his memory. As my aunt put it, to think that this hallowed ground for our family in the community can even be considered as a staging area for ICE is disgustingly demoralizing and a real kick to the gut for us. Um, speaking as her, my dad stood for everything good and like me, he would totally detest the cruel, inhumane things ICE does on a regular basis. Please do not let something so wrong desecrate his memory. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. Uh the next person we have on the list here this evening is Melissa Kerry. Welcome Peru in Roseville. My name is Melissa. I'm an immigrant from Peru and I live in Roseville. Um I'm a follower of Jesus. I'm a homeschool mom, a wife, and an advocate for MEM Minnesota Immigrant Movement, the grassroots organization that championed and helped pass the driver's license for all legislation in 2023. Council, I come before you today to ask you to pass a formal separation ordinance. My community is very scared. As an advocate and an immigrant, I have the honor and the privilege to come in contact with the most vulnerable folks. meme is on the ground helping folks by delivering food, diapers, and other necessities. So many people have been staying home, not going to work for fear of being abducted and leaving their children behind. On one occasion, I dropped off food to someone who did not have access to any groceries for 2 weeks. He finally found me and um we were able to drop off food for him. He was so incredibly grateful. Immigration's a very complex thing. I know what it is to be between status. It's not an easy just do it the right way, get in line thing. For some people there is no line. I know the fear of deportation. I'm okay. My family had to self-deport once and the second time we were going to overstay until we received word that our green card had been approved literally on the last day of our visa. This is not a documented or undocumented situation. ICE has abducted people with valid work permits who are in the middle of their legal asylum cases. Often these cases take years. We have heard stories of green card applicants showing up to their last interviews and being kidnapped. There are countless traumatic encounters uh with ICE um and US citizens such as myself, my USborn brown and black friends and my naturalized citizen friends are carrying their passports because they're afraid. But this is how it's affecting me personally. My eldest son is also from Peru. He's 17. He's a brilliant boy, studious, and gives back to his community. He's in high school, and he's also homeschooled. Um, but now he goes to two universities for PSO. When ICE first started terrorizing our community, we had him carry pictures of naturalization um certificates and pass and his passport. Then things got worse and we had him carrying his passport. He takes public transportation to his schools and activities. Like any other child his age, he loves the mall and often takes the bus there. He's an avid burer and photographer and takes hours at long bike rides. And now things have gotten so bad that he's not allowed to even leave the house without either his white usborn uh dad or his white passing mom. His freedom to do his leisure activities has been totally taken away from him. He loved his long bus rides to school. He would read or listen to music on his journeys. And now he has been completely stripped of that because despite having to carry his passport, which by the way is not okay, ICE will just see that he's brown and take the opportunity to traumatize him >> and I won't let that happen to me. >> I I'll enforce the time limits and I understand that there's that this has gone longer, but I do want to let uh if you can finish your your thought here. >> I'm almost done. Thank you. to our police. Please don't let ICE continue to treat us, US citizens, as secondclass citizens. They're violating our constitutional rights. This is not what America is supposed to be like. council today. As a resident of this city and a representative of Minnesota immigrant movement in behalf of my immigrant neighbors, I ask that you pass a formal separation ordinance um that has strong language as strong as language as possible to protect everyone in Roseville. No city resources should support the work of ICE in any way and they are not welcome in our parks and our neighborhoods. Thank you for your time and thank you for letting me speak a little bit longer. >> Thank you for your comments. Uh next, once again, I could admonish people. Uh I understand your support for folks, but uh we want to make sure that we're conducting this in a business-like fashion. >> Is there any way we could actually have like a clock timer so everybody knows like the speaker knows when their time is close to being up? >> I will uh provide the timing uh for this. Um the next speaker is uh Linda Gridley. Yes, I'm a resident of of Roseville. Um I am also a member of Indivisible Twin Cities and Women's March. Um so um I have this morning I dropped off petitions to petitions um letters to all of you along with sheets of 300 signatures that were gathered at do um good Roseville last Saturday. Um, and I'd like to read the petition that um has been presented to you. I am calling on you to immediately implement and support the following actions. Issue an executive directive prohibiting city employees and law enforcement from assisting ICE in civil immigration enforcement absent of a judicial warrant and banning participation in joint task forces or cooperative arrangements related to civil immigration enforcement. Number two, pro prohibit mask or unidentified law enforcement activity within city limits, requiring visible name and agency identification for any enforcement action and mandating disengagement where this standard is violated. Number three, bar the use of city-owned property, facilities, vehicles, and resources for um ICE operations, including terminating or refusing leases and access agreements. Number four, cancel city contracts and funding streams that support immigration detention, transport, or surveillance, and deny permits for new or expanded detention facilities. Number five, enact strict city data policy um privacy rules barring the sharing or purchase of warrantless location, biometric or surveillance data and prohibiting data broker access. Number six, direct the city attorney and relevant departments to investigate ICE related misconduct and enforce all allicable municipal laws including nuance or nuisance trespass and public safety violations. Number seven, convene public oversight hearings to create create a full public record of ICE activity and city involvement. This petition is based on petitions that were written in Los Angeles, Portland, Chicago, and Minneapolis and St. Paul. And one of the reasons we believe there is such an intensity of ice here in Roseville is because in Minneapolis and St. Paul, they are not allowed to use parking lots. They're not use allowed to use any public facilities. So, I would encourage the um council to consider this um petition. Thank you. >> Right. Thank you. And just to be clear, we do have copies of that petition that we did receive. Right. Mike Gregory is the next person on the list. And I apologize if you don't remember your order of signing up. Uh we'll we'll try to keep things moving because we do have that extra mic available. >> Okay. Thank you. My name is Mike Gregory. I live on Sherendale Avenue here in Roseville. I'm not going to reaffirm items that have already been stated. I'll make a briefer statement. I just want to let you know that ICE ICE had 10,000 hires as of December 1st. They've exceeded that now with a goal to hire another 10,000. They hired actually over 12,000 according to the ICE documents uh dated January 3rd. That's based on a salary of just under $40,000 a year, but a $50,000 signing bonus, a school loan uh deferment of $60,000, and this year there will be an additional uh payment of 25% of their salary. The folks who have come on board, I want to give us some background on who they are. Uh for they need to have a background check, which cannot be done for a series of months because the FBI does it much after when they come on board. They need to have a drug test, which will be taken at some point. They need to have some pre-employ some pre-employment. They need to have a medical exam. They need a polygraph. And according to the Southern Poverty Law Center, they have specifically recruited with white supremist groups and here in Minnesota as well. So I'm appealing to you as you look at hear the comments that folks are asking relative to ordinances that we do what we can to limit the association of ice and using facilities here in Roseville, Minnesota. Thank you very much. >> Thank you for your comments. Uh the next individual on the list is uh Cheryl Laurent. Hello and welcome. Mayor, council members. My name is Cheryl Laurent. I'm a 30-year resident of Roseville. A few years ago, I attended a large community meeting downstairs in this building. It turned out to be mostly about one individual and his activities bringing criminality to a neighborhood. The Roseville police officers who conducted that meeting listened to the group's concerns, gave advice, and expressed their own frustration in not being able to persuade the one individual to stop his activities. But they informed us that individual had civil rights and the police would not violate them. Our police were in a hard place and facing a room full of angry people. I appreciated then as I do now their upholding of values. The values that you've mentioned and will be in the PowerPoint presentation tonight. Integrity, holding to the law and principles. Accountability. All of the officials were properly identified. Safety. What measures neighbors could legally take to protect their homes and each other. Equity. law- abiding citizens and miscreants all have civil rights and community. We could peacefully come together to address issues which affect us all. Those values are things all Roseville residents can be proud of. Tonight, Councilman Bower has moved to ask this city to explore what restrictions we might consider when our police force must work with outside agencies. I urge you to do whatever you can to make sure that our brave, well-trained, and principled officers get to maintain the high bar that they have set. We have all sadly learned this past week what happens when such standards are ignored. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. Right. The next person on the list is uh Amy Perkins. And I'll say just before you start, I'll I'll the next person is uh Angela Burn >> so we can hopefully keep keep it moving. All right. Thank you. Hello and welcome. >> Sure. Hi. Um my name is Amy. I live near Emma D. Williams in Roseville. >> Um I'm definitely feel like a pretty average resident compared to some of these eloquent speakers. I I have a little scribble here to share. Um, and I do agree with what's been said so far. Um, I know that there's a lot I don't understand about the ins and outs of um, what's happening and how laws work. Um, but I've never seen anything like this in the 50 years I've lived in Minnesota. Um, or outside of this country for that matter. I've lived in countries where violent protesting and shutting down countries is common place, but nothing like this. Um, the moment that we're in seems to, in my mind, to have been fermenting for years. And the systems and infrastructure that have been built to allow the things that are happening right now are so strong and have been allowed to become ingrained for so long that it's going to take some really focused and concerted efforts to push back against it and rebuild the systems of law which as we can see are so flagrantly being dis disregarded on an hourly basis. As others have said, I want to see the city of Roseville as well as its police force do everything in its power um to restrain and hamper the current actions of ICE. Um, also if you council members and or anybody else here at this meeting or listening to this meeting have not participated in a rapid response action, I really encourage you to take even an hour out of your day um and go out and see what's happening. It's one thing to watch it on the news or hear it on social media, but if you can viscerally viscerally in person experience what a raid looks like, um it will change the way you think, I think it will it will change the way you think about this, whatever it is you think, um and help you understand just how farreaching the implications of what I is doing right now are um whatever form of immigration reform or um cleaning up criminal activity uh the federal government says it's trying to accomplish or promises us it is doing is not really what is happening on the ground. Um, as we can see, we have fear, terror, intimidation, and a total lack of protocol or respect for members of our community um, in all regards, no matter what their status is. Um, maybe I'll leave it at that, but I think that I'd like I'd like you to think about things like separation ordinances and also think outside of the box. The one small glimmer of hope I see in this situ in this moment is that the number of people like me who are afraid to get up and speak or maybe aren't really sure how to fit in are coming out of the woodwork. People are upset, worried, and ready to work. And I hope that we can find as many ways as possible to bring everybody into the fight. >> Thank you for your comments. I would say they're plenty equoquent unlike me. Um uh before Miss Burn, I'll just note the next speaker would be Randy Drash. Miss Burn, welcome. >> Good evening. Angela Burn, 15-year Rosal resident, proud Harambe parent, and proud Harambe Library employee. On Friday morning, a Harambe Elementary bus was blocked by an ICE detention. Children ages 5 to 12 witnessed the detention of two of their neighbors, took pictures and videos, and then came to the building to show their teachers. That is how we started Friday morning after weeks of vulnerable families having to keep their children home from school because it isn't safe for them to leave their homes. That is how we started Friday morning after weeks of running errands for our families because it is not safe for them to leave their homes. That is how we started Friday morning after needing to send curriculum materials home and making home visits because it isn't safe for these families to leave their homes. That is how we started Friday morning after a week of panicking every time we got an alert from the rapid response chat that someone was picked up in the area where our families live. In May 2017, Imagine Roseville Imagine Roseville Community Input Group recommended that the city adopt a separation ordinance preventing federal immigration employees from using city resources. I was at the city council meeting on August 28th, 2017 that discussed passing this ordinance. At the time, city manager Patrick Trean did not recommend passage. I quote from page four of his staff recommendations in item 6.1 of that meeting agenda's packet declaring Roseville as a sanctuary city and or adopting a separation ordinance will not result in any measurable difference in how the city of Roseville treats its residents and visitors. While those steps may garner a lot of publicity, it will have little practical effect on city actions and procedures given the limited role that the city has in immigration policy and enforcement. After public testimony, Mayor Ro, Mayor Row, was ready to vote for the ordinance, but council member at the time, Jason Etton, talked him out of it. The ordinance was defeated and deemed deemed unnecessary. On Saturday, I witnessed a detention blocking traffic in the middle of Rice Street. I saw no papers exchanged. We have no idea the legality of these detentions. Thank goodness my 11-year-old wasn't in the car with me. ICE has been patrolling our city for a week or more, using our parks to go to the bathroom and stake out our mobile home communities, driving without license plates, threatening and assaulting legal constitutional observers, terrorizing us. What will you do tonight? Because a separation ordinance seems a bare minimum now. You boast about being primely situated between two major cities for shopping and recreation, yet you act like urban issues like immigration raids are not happening to our residents. You have had an opportunity in 2017 during relative calm to do what you could to protect our most vulnerable neighbors. We should be enforcing and building on that. Instead, here we are mired in process among panic and terror from a federal government that continues to shred our constitution. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. >> And before I recognize Mr. Nerrash, the next the next the next speaker would be uh Sarah Barcel. >> You can skip Sarah. >> Oh, okay. All right. The next speaker then would be uh Alan Hollisk. >> I should say Sarah's Sarah's my wife and I was >> you didn't just decide you didn't just decide that that we can skip her. Okay. Thank you. >> Otherwise, you know, um go ahead. >> I'm Randy Neash. Lived in the city for more than 30 years. Um live a little bit south of the main library. Um what we are seeing by federal agencies is nothing short of state sponsored terrorism and it is appropriate at this time for the city to respond accordingly. With that in mind, I speak in favor of virtually everything that's been said so far. In particular, every item on the petition. um specifically that the city do everything possible to deny the federal agents the use of any city properties uh or facilities staging organizing any of those activities. Um this this isn't the first time I've spoken here at the council, but it's been a while. Um, I do want to say that it is gratifying to see Mayor Row that you still do a very graceful job of running these meetings and that's really appreciated. Um, with all that said, I just want to say that I hope no one in Roseville is injured or killed. Um, and like every motan during winter, I'm hoping for ice out conditions just as soon as possible. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments, Mr. Allesk. Uh, before I recognize you, uh, the next speaker would be, uh, Kathy Quick. >> Okay. >> Welcome. >> Hello. Well, I actually wanted to call up here because obviously there's been a lot of tragedy that has taken place, especially with Renee Good. But I think a big reason why what happened happened is because there's been a lot of misinformation about what ICE actually does. And so I wanted to take a minute to talk about what ICE actually does. Over the past year, we have seen a 20% drop in homicides nationwide between 2024 and 2025. That is the largest single year uh decline on in recent record. And why is that? It's in large part because of the work of federal agencies and law enforcement like ICE. I want to make something very clear. The only reason why ICE would arrest someone is if they committed a crime. Whether that is the result of this. Would you please >> I'm just I want to ask the audience once again to be respectful of all speakers. >> That's what I said at the beginning. That's the commitment we made. Uh and so I want us to live to that. I wanted to just so whether that is an American citizen impeding ICE operations, someone that came in the country illegally or someone who's committed most crimes, that's who they arrest. And just to give you an idea of what they've done, I gave everyone on that board. You have a list of a sampling of some of the individuals that ICE has detained over the past week in Minnesota. And I just want to read off a few of them. Now, bear in mind, these are people that have been walking our streets and our neighborhoods that have been apprehended by ICE. A Le Oceanian illegal alien convicted of strong armed sodomy of a boy and a girl with a deportation order since 2018. An illegal alien convicted of sexual assault sodomy of a girl under the age of 13 and procuring child prostitution with the deportation order since 2006. Another illegal alien convicted of strong armed rape of a 12-year-old girl and the kidnapping of a child with the intent to sexually assault her with a deportation order since 2004. >> Another illegal alien convicted of rape with a weapon and sexual assault with a deportation order on him since 1996. Another illegal alien from Mexico with an deportation order since 2002 that was convicted on homicide. A Somali illegal alien convicted of homicide as well as a Salvadorian illegal alien convicted of three counts of homicide with a deportation order since June of 2025. There are many other examples of this. And it is very troubling that ISIS experienced about a 15% increase in attacks and assaults. And we saw it recently, the fact that an ICE officer was hit by a vehicle and unfortunately was forced to pull out his pistol in self-defense. >> Absolutely. >> I now there's there's a minute left. And I once again ask people to respect all speakers. >> These I these are brave men and women who put their lives on the line to protect us from the people such as the ones I just listed off here. And there's been a lot of misinformation about the brave men and women of law enforcement. And I urge the city council, whatever you choose, please do not undermine the activity and the work that ICE is doing to make our streets safer. Again, we have seen a 20% drop in homicides year-over-year nationwide. And I would just put it, the only people who are making our streets unsafe are those that are seeking to undermine the work that ICE and law enforcement are doing. And I just want to give a shout out to the brave men and women of law enforcement for the work that they do to protect our citizens from criminals and make our communities safer. So, thank you very much for your time. >> Thank you for your comments. Next uh speaker and before I recognize you, uh the next person on the list is Tanner Baris. Miss Quick. Thank you, mayor and council members. My name is Kathy Quick and um I'm here to basically assert the fact that strong separation ordinances are very good for public safety. For over 10 years, I've worked throughout the state of Minnesota, locally here in the metro region, but also nationally and internationally on community and police relationships. Sometimes because of that work, people think that I'm anti- police. I am not anti police. I am firmly firmly convinced that mutual safety for community members and for police officers comes from mutual trust and therefore separation ordinances are absolutely vital to protect everyone because there is no place of business of local police becoming involved in whatsoever in civil immigration. It's a violation of people's trust in police um and law enforcement and becomes a real issue and at this point ICE is our major threat to public safety. Um therefore it's really good that you have the separation ordinance that you have but it needs strengthening in several ways. I am part of a group from Onidos Minnesota of people working across the state looking at separation ordinances and sanctuary cities policies and there are several areas in which we would recommend that the current separation ordinance needs uh improvement. One of them is that while it is certainly true that the police department should not be involved in immigration enforcement and there are good policies here uh in your existing ordinance, it needs to go beyond that to make clear that police should not be involved in perimeter control, in scene control and scene security, but also that no city resources, police department or otherwise should be involved in any way in immigration enforcement. that applies to data in particular and a number of other things that other speakers have mentioned including the use of property, cameras, vehicles um and the like. A second recommendation would be to uh clarify that no activities for immigration enforcement should be allowed within your city limits by law enforcement officers who are masking and cloaking their identities by the use of face coverings or failure to wear a badge uh that identifies them by name or number. Um, third, that there should be no exception to these policies whatsoever, except in case of a judicial warrant and no deployment of city resources to support immigration uh activities other than by a direct authorization of the mayor or the city manager. And finally, that all city staff need to be informed of this regularly and that there need to be clear lines of discipline for any violation of this and that there needs to be a a prompt, transparent and public report of any violations of this policy to the city council. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments this evening. >> Hello. And before I recognize you, uh Mr. Baris, uh the next speaker will be uh I believe Jessica Lopez Lyman. Mr. Baris, >> wonderful. All right. Well, thank you, mayor. Thank you, city council members, city staff. I appreciate being here tonight. Uh, my name is Tanner Baris. I live on Pascal Street here in Roseville. And by stating my name and address tonight, you already know more about me than any of our residents know about the ICE agents who've been operating throughout our city, often anonymously, armed, and without any accountability to the communities that they move through. This imbalance concerns me, as it should each and every one of you. I'm here to request that you take action within your authority to keep our community safe by preventing federal agencies from using Roseville resources, as many others have, um, our public land, our staff time, and the data that the city holds on its residents for enforcement activities that could cause harm and fear throughout our city. Um, this past Saturday, I was approached in a public park by four ICE officers, or I assume ICE officers. Uh, they were armed. They had their faces covered. Um, I was shouted at and threatened with arrest simply for being in a public park. Um, this isn't an isolated incident. This is an example of the terror that everyday residents feel simply for going about their lives in the places that are supposed to be safe and public. This is unacceptable. I've personally observed ICE officers driving through Roseville, and again, I assume ICE officers at over 55 mph on residential streets. Earlier today, ICE ran into a moving vehicle in Minneapolis after deploying chemical irritants on observers and members of the press nearby. Yesterday, a video was shared widely of ICE officers taking a handcuffed woman alone into a public restaurant in Brooklyn Center, not far from here. These agents are not law enforcement officers, and they clearly do not exhibit the same values as our officers here in Roseville. Public safety cannot exist without trust. When people fear being confronted, detained, or intimidated by federal officers in our city spaces, they stop reporting crimes, they stop seeking help, they stop buying groceries, and they stop participating in community life. This make Roseville less safe, not more. Mayor, city council members, I I you didn't create this situation. Um, but you have a responsibility now as public officials to act. I'm calling on you to pass a clear separation ordinance that prevents our city resources from being used to support federal immigration enforcement and ensure that they're used to protect and not endanger the people that live in our city. Thank you so much for your time. >> Thank you for your comments. Right. Um before I recognize the next speaker, uh the following speaker would be uh Joan Buler. >> Hello and welcome. >> Hello council members. My name is Jessica Lopez Lyman. I've been a Roseville resident for 5 years. When I was thinking about what I wanted to say to you today, I have several stories like my fellow residents that are heartfelt, heart-wrenching, and yet I wanted to speak to you tonight from the expertise that I have as somebody who has dedicated their life to researching this topic. For the past 14 years, as a master's student, PhD candidate, post-doal fellow, and faculty member, I have dedicated my career to researching Latino history and culture in the United States, looking at immigration, specifically the Midwest. My comments are grounded in rigorous scholarship, not political opinion or anecdote, although are those are valuable. and my comments reflect expertise developed through sustained research, making me one of the leading research experts on this topic in our state. Research clearly demonstrates the need for a strong, clear, precise policy, a separation ordinance between local law enforcement, DHS, and ICE. First, when local law enforcement, assist, a bed, or any city resources are given to ICE, residents are less likely to call 911 during emergencies. This puts entire communities at risk as crime emergencies go unreported, increasing the likelihood of preventable harm to residents, property, and public spaces. Second, failing to maintain the separation exposes the city to serious litigation. ICE is required under the Fourth Amendment to present a signed judicial warrant or subpoena. Yet, data shows that this frequently does not occur. Local law enforcement participation can result in constitutional violations, violations of immigration law for visa holders, and potential international human rights violations, leaving a city like Roseville vulnerable to costly long-term litigation. Finally, there are significant economic consequences. While DHS has one of the largest federal budgets, local governments bear the financial burden when they assist ICE. Promised federal reimbursements routinely fail to materialize, leaving cities responsible for overtime, staffing, and resource costs. Roseville residents should not shoulder these expenses when those funds could be instead used to improve public safety, and community well-being. I want to close by sharing that my daughter recently started as a kindergartener at Central Park Elementary where students are taught four core values. Being honest, safe, empathetic, and responsible. As elected officials, you have a legal and ethical obligation to uphold the mission of the city to provide ethical, efficient, and responsive local government. Be a leader like my kindergartenner is learning to be. Put the safety of our residents first. Be honest about the facts and not get manipulated by political rhetoric. Be responsible with city resources and most importantly be empathetic in your leadership. Pass a clear, strong separation ordinance. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. Before I recognize the next speaker, uh the speaker to follow would be uh Sarah Moroni or Marone. Welcome. >> I'm Joan Boler. I've lived in Roseville for over 35 years and I recently retired from a 40-year uh public health career and so um I agree with much of what's been said tonight and encourage the council to do whatever it can. But I'm going to talk about something that people often don't think about which is the trauma that our children are experiencing. not only immigrant children but their friends. When they when immigrant children don't know that their parents will be there when they get home from school, that is a huge trauma. And that trauma doesn't just go away when hopefully ICE goes away or this situation we're in. That trauma lasts the rest of their lives. And from a public health perspective, that trauma affects their mental health and their physical health for the rest of their life. So this is a problem that is going to impact Roseville children who are going to hopefully grow up and be Roseville residents for the rest of their lives. And so this isn't just something that's going to go away hopefully in a while. This is something that's going to be with Roseville for a long time. And so I encourage you, I really encourage you to think very seriously about what Roseville can do to prevent this kind of damage to our children. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments this evening. Right. And before I recognize the next speaker, I just want to note uh that the following speaker would be uh Kelly Ald or possibly ID AID or AL D or something else if I'm not understanding the ship here. Uh, welcome. >> I'm Walter. Um, dear city council, I'm very sad and scared. I first came to these meetings with my mom when I was just a baby. Now, 7 years later, I'm still waiting to see my leaders take a stand to protect my classmates, neighbors, and favorite places to eat. It makes me feel mad and anxious to know that ICE is in my community. My friends at school feel scared to leave home, play on the playground, and even get food. Please do a better job protecting our parks, markets, and apartment buildings so no little kids keep feeling so scared, worried, and sad. Thank you, Walter Vandry. >> Thank you for your parents. Before I recognize the next speaker, uh the following uh person on the list is uh Dan Aid Ride. Uh hello and welcome. >> Uh thank you. Uh my name is Sarah I live at 2136 Fry Street. Um I have lived in Roseville for almost 15 years now and one of the things I've always admired about the city is its commitment to community. However, the increase in ICE presence within the city puts that community at risk. I implore the city council to implement a strong and clear separation ordinance as soon as possible. I would also like to ask the city council to strongly consider whether accepting federal money uh is beneficial to the city, especially when it's funneled into the Roseville Police Department. All members and visitors of Roseville deserve safety, dignity, and equal treatment under the law. I hope you all will stand with your neighbors and take action quickly. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. >> And before I recognize the next speaker, uh actually I think we may have heard from Walter if I'm not mistaken. >> Okay. Uh the next speaker then um and I apologize. I'm going to really uh have trouble with this name, but it looks like Arjamand. Argamand. Does that >> sound right? >> All right. Thank you. >> Uh so you will be you will be next then to speak. Um hello and welcome >> council. My name is Kelly ID. Sorry it was hard to read. >> That's so do my best. >> Uh I didn't come here with any prepared remarks like many of my neighbors who have spoke so eloquently. Um, but as I've been sitting here, I took a moment to look at the mission statement for the city of Roseville. The words that stood out to me were community, safety, inclusivity, and diversity. Those are the things that brought my husband and I to Roseville when we moved out of Minneapolis 20 years ago and decided to start a family here. Um, in addition to starting a family here, I've been an educator here. I've been a nurse here. And what I'm seeing happening in our community, both within Roseville and in the greater Twin Cities area, is incredibly upsetting and disturbing. Like my neighbors, I strongly encourage you to to enact a separation ordinance that gives this community a greater feeling of safety. Roseville is an incredible place to live and to raise a family. You all wouldn't be sitting on the city council if you didn't feel the same. Um, I I don't even know how else to put it into words that I want our children to feel safe going to the parks. Oasis Park was the the most wonderful place in our neighborhood for our kids to go and feel safe. And now I don't feel like I can send our 16-year-old out in that area. Um, I I want to continue to enjoy living in this area and enjoy all it brings to Minnesota. And until we enact something to support this community and separate our law enforcement from ICE, it doesn't feel like we can do that. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. >> Hello. And before I recognize you, then the next person on the list is uh Dan Huer, I believe. >> Hello and welcome. >> Thank you. Thank you, city council. Thanks to everybody behind me. Thanks to everybody out in the hall for showing up in in good numbers. Uh trying times. Uh, no prepared remarks. Like my wife said, we're longtime residents. I'm a first-time caller to the city council. It's fun to see a bunch of the people that I voted for over the years in elections. But, uh, as I looked over the agenda and see a order about adjusting or controlling the police forces involvement in ICE matters. I would implore you to follow ICE's motto, protect and serve, or Roseville Police's motto, protect and serve. Roseville Police Department activity when with ICE should be limited strictly to 911 calls or actions by ICE that are observed by police officers in defense of Roseville residents, Roseville shoppers, and Roseville visitors. It should not be in maintaining a perimeter for ICE like people have mentioned with the separation order. Our police force, our tax dollars should not be deployed to support their activities. It should be to protect the residents as our federal government has gone and wiped their rear ends with the first, fourth, and fifth amendment with ICE activities in our houses and our places of business, places of worship. I am afraid that there is a day coming soon where the only thing we have left is to take up the Second Amendment. and I don't want my life to end that way. >> Thank you for your comments. >> Before I recognize you to speak, the next person uh would be and I I have to say so we've we've gone with a formalized system here of signing up. So make sure that if you do want to speak, especially for those in the room, I know these lists may have come from out in the hallway, but I'm not 100% sure of that. if you're in the room and do want to speak, um let's uh make sure that okay, Miss Olsen is is getting folks signed up. Um uh since we're under a little bit of a new system in regard to this that we're just adapting to this evening, uh I wanted to make sure folks were aware of that. Uh and we are we're adapting as we go. So the next uh person uh uh after Mr. Huer then would be uh Kathleen Winters. >> She's you missed. >> She's actually next. >> She was the previous speaker. That's the previous speaker before Mr. here, right? Yes. >> No, that should be her. >> Oh, >> yes. >> I think he was out of order in that in that order in the signup order. >> I think we've got it. But feel free to introduce yourself at the beginning of the comments and that will clear it all up. No doubt. >> RG, thank you for having me here. I wish the child was here with me because I don't think I can do as well as the child did. Um, I'm not sure if this is the right place for this. So, let me know. I'm You can stop me. Um, I want to thank everyone for supporting people like me. So, thank you all. Um, I've heard that there are fire alarms that are getting pulled unnecessarily as a scare tactic and I don't know what the policy is. If that is happening in Roseville, I would like the city to look into look into that. Um, the other thing is I'm going to call out a big corporation here today, Target. Kids shop at Target. We don't need people walking in there with their big firearms just to use the restroom or if there is an issue. And I think Target can handle it in a way it doesn't require 20 people against one. I'm not sure what they're doing with the security system that they have at Target. They could be taking that individual with the security system to a conference room to address any issues because they do have an HR department. We do support Roseville. I'm having a really hard time with the way they've handled this and to walk into a Target store with firearms everywhere. If I can't carry a firearm, our city police officers cannot walk in there with their firearms. They have a secure. I'm not sure how Target is allowing it. Thank you for your time. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. And before I recognize the next speaker, uh so as I said, Kathleen Winters and then Terry Newbie would be the next speaker. Hello and welcome. >> Hi. Uh I'm Dan Hoyer. Um I'm here to demand that this council take action in accordance with its oath of service to restrict ICE operations within city limits. I've lived in or near Roseville for my most of my life. My grandparents built their house near Central Park. My parents met here, got married here. I grew up at Roseville Lutheran Church. I moved to Roseville 2 years ago. I married my wife and I am raising two kids. The recent ICE activity has disrupted the security that Roseville has always represented to me. In the last week, my wife and I have had to have serious discussions about how to keep our kids safe. Our daughter has Mexican heritage. She does not share the privilege that I do walking around. I have heard stories of my friends cousins who have brown skin being grabbed, US citizens being grabbed just because they have brown skin. I am worried for my daughter to go out in public. As of this morning, I am now walking my daughter to and from the bus stop because I do not trust her safety walking to the bus stop alone anymore. This weekend, we had to try to explain to her that there are police in our community, quote unquote, police, who she cannot trust to keep her safe. This confused her because she has been raised her whole life thinking that police were people she could trust, people that she could turn to to keep her safe. I cannot have her think that that is true of every person anymore. And that scares me. Earlier you heard a list of names as evidence of the accomplishments of ICE to try to add to the argument of ICE doing the right thing here. What you cannot be presented with is the list of names of people who are stuck inside their homes. the list of names of people who do not make it on the news, who have been stopped on r at random intersections in their cars, who have been pulled off of the street. You will not hear their names. You cannot balance those scales because this is being done in darkness. This is the intent. It is to keep it obscure. It is to keep it ambiguous. ICE is thriving on ambiguity. They are thriving on a gray area context. They are thriving on misrepresentations in the media. This attack cannot thrive if we stand together as a community. My request is simple. Do everything in your power to strengthen the existing language and future language to protect the security of our community. I stand by all of the suggestions so far. I think that we should be doing everything that we can, everything in our power and more. This administration has proven that they are willing to do things that people know are not legal because challenging those actions takes time. They are thriving on that. We need to put an end to it here. We need to put it an an end to it so that it does not spread. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. >> All right. Uh I don't know if uh if Kathleen Winters is available to speak. All right. There we go. And then as she's coming up uh once again, the next speaker would be Terry Newbie. >> Hello and welcome. >> Good evening. My name is Kathleen Winters. I am a resident of Roseville near Reservoir Woods Park. We've been here for about 20 years. I'm also a member of the Roseville Police Department's um multicultural advisory commission. Although I am not here to speak on Mac's behalf tonight, I would like to suggest to you that the existing um department policy number 102. I think that's correct. It's the one that was adopted in 2017. >> It has been renumbered 413, but it's >> Yeah. 413. um it is inadequate in a variety of ways. Uh the first is that in my opinion, this is my opinion as a as a private citizen, the focus of this type of policy should be on the safety of the community and the safety of the community's residents um and those visiting here as well. Whereas at the moment, the second paragraph of that policy, the focus is on the safety of ICE agents. I think they've demonstrated they're capable of taking care of themselves. I would like to see the focus on our citizens and on our visitors. Um secondly, the first paragraph of the existing um policy doesn't make any sense. The second sentence says uh that well the first sentence says that federal law doesn't require the Roseville Police Department to enforce immigration laws. That's true. The second sentence says as such employees shall not inquire about a person's immigration status unless it's directly related to a criminal investigation. That doesn't make any sense to me. Um, if uh if there's a criminal investigation going on, let's say it's for I don't know, anything assault, robbery, I'm unclear what the person's immigration status has to do with the prosecution of the crime of robbery or the crime of assault. On the other hand, if unless I am mistaken, all undocumented immigrants are considered to be uh that is considered to be a misdemeanor to be here without lawful documentation. So all suspected unlawful immigration is arguably a crime. So that second sentence just doesn't make any sense to me at all. Um, at the least I would I would as a individual support those who are encouraging the council to adopt a uh strong separation policy, one that at a minimum requires an um enforcement agents to have identifying badges and not to wear and prohibits them from wearing masks and that focuses on the safety of those persons of the general public who are in Roseville. bill. Thank you for your time. >> Thank you for your comments. >> Thanks, Kathy. >> All right. And before I recognize Mr. Newbie, the uh next speaker signed up is Etien Jeffy. Mr. Newbie. >> Thank you and good evening. My name is Terry Newbie. I am a Roseville resident. I live on Church Hill Street and I've been a Roseville resident since 2001. So, in my 25 years of living in Roseville, I've had the the privilege and the honor of meeting and working with some of you on the council. And I've also had the privilege and the honor of working with uh members of the Roseville Police Department. Uh and in that 25- year time, I can say in my experience, I'm also like, uh, Kathleen and Etienne, a member of the Roseville Police Department's multicultural advisory committee. And during my during that time, in my experience, I can say that the Roseville Police Department is an exemplary force and it operates under the principles of transparency, due process, and accountability. And those are the core principles not only of law enforcement but also of effective governance and public safety. ICE does not operate under those principles. Uh without due process, without accountability and without transparency, um it is not not only not an effective law organization, it is in some ways a threat to the public. And so in my experience, given having worked with the exemplary members of the Roosevelt Police Department, um they embody what effective law enforcement should be and those core principles of transparency, due process, and accountability are not being met by ICE. So I as a on on my own behalf as a citizen fully support uh whatever separation measures can be done within the bounds of the law uh to distance ourselves from an organization that does not practice those core principles. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. Uh, and before I recognize Mr. Jeffy, the uh, next person signed up is Mark McCabe. Mr. J. >> All right. Good evening, Etnvy. I We have been here for a few years. I I think 15 years now in Roseville and I happen to be an immigrant. I have an accent as you all can see. But I do not see my accent or my immigration to be any liability to me serving u this community. I've been on commissions and like uh Mr. Terry was saying earlier uh we continue to serve on the uh Roseville Police Department Multicultural Advisory Committee and as such we've seen consistent work being done by the police department to make everyone feel welcome here and I would like that work to continue so that once this dust settles we continue to be a community that is welcoming We do have work that to do but continue to be a community that is welcoming. The idea that a person living in this country that calls itself length of the free will be walking around with my passport in my pocket every single day when I go take care of patient in clinic in hospital is infuriating. as authorities in this in this city, do whatever you can to make everyone feel welcome because I've been on commissions here. That has been the work. Let's continue that work. Thank you. Thank you for your comments. And before I recognize the next speaker, uh the next speaker after that would be uh Chelsea McCabe. >> Hello, Mr. McCabe. >> Hello. I'm Mark McCabe and I'm a 10-year resident of Roseville and I agree with uh what everyone has said here tonight or almost everyone this time tonight. Uh uh just want to uh just seeing this turnout tonight makes me inspired and makes me proud to be a Roseville resident. Uh, I want to thank the city for bringing this ordinance and discussion forward and I fully support any efforts to resist, not cooperate, and eliminate resources that support support ICE operations. I'd specifically like the ordinance to require that ICE agents are required to show their faces and display their identification. Uh, you're showing more courage than all of our Republican federally uh, elected officials combined, uh, citizens included. So, thank you. What's happening in our country is terrifying and in our community with the federal government spending millions of our tax dollars not to support our residents or provide care, but to terrorize our children, our residents, our citizens, and that's beyond disgusting and needs to stop immediately. We're supposed to be a nation of laws. We need to do all we can to protect our collective freedoms or they will be gone. Please continue to act with courage and do all you can to resist any cooperation with ICE and please get these Nazi goons out of our state and city. >> Thank you for your comments. >> All right. Uh before I recognize the next speaker, uh the speaker after that would be uh Alena Howe. >> Hello and welcome. >> Hello. Uh my name is Chelsea McCabe. I am a Roseville resident, voter, and a 20-year p veteran public school teacher. I work in a West St. Paul public school with a demographic very similar to Roseville. And these past few days and weeks, I have watched children from my school become terrified by the presence of masked, armed ICE agents near their school and bus stop. Most of these children's children are US citizens, but all of them are just kids. They should not live in fear of masked men at the very moments they are meant to feel safe. After my workday ends, I often walk students of all backgrounds to their doors because they are afraid to walk alone. I do this not because it is my job but because it has become a necessity in the current climate. If you follow a faith tradition, consider it its core moral teachings. Love thy neighbor. Treat others as you want to be treated. If you are not religious, I implore you to just simply reflect on what your elementary teachers taught you. Empathy, kindness. Would you want your child, nephew, granddaughter, or a neighbor see masked gunmen outside their school? Recently, students all around the Twin Cities, including here in Roseville, have walked out in protest of ICE activity. We know firsthand that anxiety is spreading beyond any single school or neighborhood. We are here because our children's sense of safety, well-being, and ability to learn are at stake. Please do everything in your power to ensure that federal enforcement activity does not continue to disrupt the daily lives of our children, families, and schools. Let our children focus on learning, growing, and thriving, not whether they will feel terror on their way to school. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. Before I recognize the next speaker, uh the speaker after that would be Brie Scott. Hello and welcome. >> Hi, I'm Elena Howe. I live on Parker Avenue here. I've been here over 30 years. Um, I'm not going to I am also promoting a very strong separation ordinance to be implemented and I many people have been very articulate about that. So, I'm not going to go on um both for all of our safety and our especially our kids. Um, I just want to encourage this council to take this opportunity to really lead and to speak boldly and not let the process. We have to follow a process of course to get a new ordinance in, but we can speak to our neighbors and friends and know that they have the support of our city officials and that can be done more quickly than an ordinance, I think. So, I think we need to have our neighbors know that our city stands behind our residents. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. Uh before I recognize uh and the next speaker will be Brie Bree Scott. Is Brie Scott here this evening? We're still here. >> All right. Um I'll put a pin in that one. Uh I believe the next speaker would be uh Kurt Meyer. Is Kurt Meyer here? >> Check out there. >> All right, we'll do a quick check out there. Maybe while we're doing that check. Is Kayla Olsby here? Kayla Olsby. And the person after that would be uh signed in as Eric N, the letter N for the last name. Feel free to come on up and have a seat and be prepared to speak. All right. Uh uh you're Kayla. >> Yes. Hi. Um like you said, my name is Kayla Olsby. I'm a social worker and therapist here in Roseville. I work with many individuals who are directly impacted by ISIS presence here in the Twin Cities. And those who are not directly impacted are still experiencing high levels of stress, anxiety, and fear about their friends, children, neighbors, and community as a whole. Right now, we have federal agents going to homes, stores, gas stations, health clinics, and schools to snatch people away violently solely based on the color of their skin. They are also responding to community members asserting their First Amendment rights with chemical irritants, physical violence, and as we know from last week, even lethal force. Children are afraid to go to school because they do not know if they'll be pepper-sprayed, assaulted, or taken away when being dropped off or picked up or if they go home if their parents will be there. Adults are afraid to run errands or go to work because they don't know if they'll return home at the end of the day. I have clients who have moved appointments from in person to virtual due to fears about leaving their home. And while tellahalth can be an excellent option for many reasons, I hate that it's being utilized because of real fears of leaving one's home and not returning. When humans don't feel safe in their environment, it pulls attention from all other tasks and responsibilities. We have to focus on staying safe and alive before we can do anything else. Additionally, when we are in constant states of high alert and stress, we experience long-term physical health implications, and the current state of our community is not safe. Our community members are being traumatized. Many children are skipping school due to the fears of being away from home. And if children are attending school, they aren't able to truly learn because their minds are focused on what could be happening. Families are forgoing shopping trips, going to restaurants, and other ways to pour into our local economy. If individuals are in the community, they're on high alert and distracted, which has its own safety implications. While I could go into much further detail about how the presence of ICE is impacting our community's education, economy, public health, and safety, I know I don't have the time to do so here. So, as a social worker, I am called to be an advocate for the dignity and worth of all people and to fight against systems of oppression. ICE is not upholding the dignity and worth of all and they are actively oppressing so many people in our community and we must act now. So, I call on the city council to restrict the access of ICE uh or sorry, to restrict the access that ICE has in city-owned locations, to uphold and amend the separation ordinance, and do whatever you can in your power to keep our community safe. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments this evening. >> All right. And before I recognize the next speaker, uh the speaker after that would be M. Nolles or Nles. Nolles probably. Um, hello and welcome. >> Hello. My name is Eric. I live down on Lexington Avenue and I have no prepared statements. So, this is just kind of a winging it. And I'd like to thank all of my fine Roseville neighbors to come out to see this because this is very important. I work down at the U of M and I'm basically a technical fabricational welder. And if I could tell you that, I never thought that I would be teaching people English from China, from Japan, from South Korea. Iran, Iraq, everywhere so that they would fit in more when they go outside because unfortunately they're now officially targeted. And with a brief bit of levity, it still pains me to say that I bought tickets to go see Pee-Wee Herman's Big Adventure and take three people there to go see it this Sunday. I had to actually think out how is the shortest route. How am I going to get them in there safe? That is absurd. Think about that for a minute. I'm going to see Peewe's Big Adventure and I have to dodge literal crazy dudes running around masked with guns and I have to explain to my friends it's not always like this. So when I think about that and how absurd it is and I have to tell them current English slaying so if they go out they can blend in a little bit. That's what I'm trying to do. And After everything I've learned from working with them, whoever them are, for the last 5 years, I can truly say that no one is illegal on stolen land. It is that simple. >> Thank you for your time. All right. And before I recognize uh M, the next speaker after that would be uh Sarah Coleman. Uh, and I believe there's sort of a bracket with the Sarah A as well, so I'm not sure how that's uh planned, but that's the next speaker or speakers. Uh, hello and welcome. >> Hello. Thank you. Good evening, Rosevilians and council members. My name is M. Noles. I've never been to a town hall before, but I have been a resident of Roseville for almost 10 years and a resident of Minnesota for most of my life. I'm also a Korean adopty. I don't know if anyone here is familiar, but there's been a lot of news and pain around that news for us Korean adoptes this past year. I don't know enough about my own story to know if I was one of the babies taken under false pretenses or if my mother was told I had died. I share this with you to let you know that I already have painful feelings about being an American from this mere fact alone. However, I have been an American citizen since shortly after I arrived in this country at only 4 months old. I only know the English language. Despite my best efforts to learn other languages and become a polygot hasn't been as successful. Still, my physical appearance and a slight speech impediment now makes me a potential target of racial profiling. Something our Supreme Court via Justice Kavanaaugh has said is justifiable probable cause for immigration to stop or question me. Even more important is the racial profiling occurring that has targeted and will continue to target our First Nation members who may have non-white skin or an accent. The federal government's recent illegal, unconstitutional and unethical actions up to and including the execution of Renee Good, the unlawful entry into homes and businesses, and the alarming pattern of ICE, CBP, etc., creating dangerous situations such as causing vehicle collisions and leaving abandoned vehicles on the road. Uh scaring students and citizens cannot and should not stand. I am terrified to leave my apartment to commute to work to get groceries or gas because of the activities taking place in our communities. Again, this is the second time I've left my apartment in the last week. I'm especially terrified of the unspoken threat of being kidnapped and sexually assaulted. I am a sexual assault survivor and have been deeply disturbed by the substantiated reports and whispered rumors of sexual assaults on women and children by federal agents, including the Adina United States citizen who in December alleged she was sexually assaulted while detained. I say that I've left my apartment twice in the the last week to emphasize how terrified our communities and I as an individual am, but also to emphasize my privilege. I have been able to work from home the last several days, this last week. That is not the case for many of our friends and neighbors who have had to choose between work, school, or their personal safety. I call uh in addition, I ask everyone to consider that this is not about immigration. This is not about immigration. If it were, they would not have executed a US 37year-old mother. US citizen in front of all of us. They would not have then later that day gone and gassed a public school and they would not be contig kidnapping our indigenous tribal members. This is not about immigration. I call on Roseville city officials for two things in addition to considering the passage of this ordinance. one for Roseville law enforcement to enforce the law and if there is unlawful unconstitutional activity to fulfill their oath to the people and to the law and protect and serve us. and two, if the city of Roseville is not encompassed in the lawsuit announced today by the attorney general's office and mayors Fry and her that they consider enjoining that demand for temporary injunctive relief from federal actions in our state. And I know we're not supposed to speak to Rosilians too much, but I do ask that we continue looking out for each other and to try to stay strong through this incredibly difficult time. ICE killed good. We cannot allow them to keep killing good. We should not allow them to keep killing good. Please council do not allow this. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. >> Right. And before I recognize the next speaker uh the next uh speaker after that would be Abdak Johannes. >> Hello and welcome. >> Hi. Uh, my name is Sarah Kaufman and I have been living here in Roseville for three years and I had zero uh idea that I was going to speak tonight, but my ADHD likes to make a lot of impulse decisions. So, here we are. Um, Thursday I was absolutely terrified and you know that must be bad if the white people are terrified. I ran around my house packing a suitcase for myself, my child, all of our pets, and my husband with our passport, cash, couple days worth of clothes because I was convinced the Civil War 2.0 was starting in my backyard. That was Thursday. Now I'm pissed. Now I have officially morphed into furious because at some point I was sitting in my chair thinking I get it now. In all the times that I was taught in school, I remember thinking, my god, how did they let the Holocaust happen? How did Germany just sit there and let it happen? You're seeing it. Neutrality is how it happened. And I decided to no longer be neutral because I didn't want to show my kid someone scared who ran. So, I am going to tell you I am not a Minnesota native. So, I don't have to be Minnesota nice, which is what I just told that gentleman out in the hall after he left. Neutrality is the decision of the coward. You cannot be neutral right now. As a Roseville citizen, I need all of you to put on your big girl and big boy underwear and make a statement. Do not be neutral. That is all. >> Thank you for your comments. >> All right. >> Um, we're the brackets. >> All right. Yeah, just uh just uh to keep up with keeping folks aware of uh who's next. Um I believe I announced Mr. uh or I don't know for sure, Mr. Abdulak Johannes. And then uh um I apologize again, Bo Samir, I believe. Um hello and welcome. Uh thank you. >> My name is Sarah Coleman. I'm a Roseville resident. I'm not going to give my exact address and you'll hear why in a moment. Um yesterday, so on Sunday, I did a very parental thing and stopped at Aldi to get some milk. Um while I was there, it happened that there were two vehicles in the parking lot. One white truck with one license plate and one black Jeep with zero license plates. The trucks were occupied by four men, all wearing camo, all wearing masks, and were clearly not there to do happy things. I went into the store. I bought milk. I warned a few people in the store to be careful because, as you know, Aldi is a very popular location for our immigrant population. I left with my purchase and saw that the vehicles were no longer there, which made me feel good. I pulled out over by the cat lot and the agents were hiding behind a semi-truck. I stopped. I took pictures of the vehicles and as I was about to pull out of the lot, the white truck with the Texas plates peeled out of the lot and the black Jeep without any plates rushed me, came up on my bumper as I turned right towards the Aldi store and pushed my car into a snowbank. I slowly reversed my car calmly and moved forward again around the black Jeep and turned left towards the front of the Aldi store. at which time the black jeep again rushed my car, went around me, nearly hitting several pedestrians on foot and stopped within inches of my front bumper in front of the main entrance of the Aldi store. At that point, two men rushed out of the vehicle with right hands on their weapons. One agent went to my passenger seat to take pictures of me, the inside and the outside of my car. And the other agent rushed to my driver's side window, which I had opened about a half an inch so that I could hear them. I'm hard of hearing. And screamed within inches of my window, "This is your only warning. This is your only warning." repeatedly at least five times. I did not get a picture because my phone was on the floor of the car from having to stop very quickly even though I was going probably 2 miles an hour across the front of the store. Now, what does it mean that this is my only warning? Am I going to get arrested? Are they going to threaten my family? Am I going to get killed? Now, I realize this is in Little Canada, but if I step 20 feet into the road, I'm in Roseville. I'm asking you to take action because our lives are in danger. And it's not me. I'm a tiny little boring white woman who works from home in the medical field. But that's not all of who I am. See, the other reason I'm here is because I'm making a plea. I have two daughters. They're adopted. They're black. They're immigrants. They're citizens of this country. And they're currently carrying as teenagers their passports to high school and to college. They could be abducted at any time because they look Somali. and I wouldn't know. They would disappear. Right now, we have vehicles running around Roseville with no plates. We need to enforce the laws. Just start there. Enforce the laws that we have. Please, please don't allow them to terrorize our streets when you could actually stop it now without actually doing anything more. Now, I want you to do more. Don't get me wrong, okay? Um, >> and if I if I can't ask you to kind of wrap up your little bit over time. >> I'm asking you to protect us. I'm asking you to protect our families. I'm asking you to protect me. And I'm asking you to protect our community. We moved our kids here because it's safe, because it was diverse, and the schools were good. And that's not true anymore, not if they're dead or missing. >> Thank you for your comments. >> All right. Uh, and before I recognize the next speaker, um, this I guess let's see, we've got Abdawak Johannes and we've got Bo Samir. Um, and I apologize again if I'm not pronouncing correctly. And then Dion Haidider would be the next person. >> Hello and welcome. >> Hello. My name is Sarah >> and I have to ask if you if you can uh free up a seat. Yep. Thank you. >> I'm an active volunteer in Roseville schools and in the wider community. I've spoken with probably hundreds of Roseville residents in the past week while providing mutual aid and I'm here to stand up for our most vulnerable community members. Our Hispanic, Latina, and all immigrant families feel forced to keep their students home in fear of ICE. Our dual language classes are filled with empty seats. Children can't go to school to learn. Families are locking themselves in their homes and afraid to step outside or open their front doors. Our schools are already overburdened and have been at their breaking point for years only to now have to protect our children and families from state sanctioned violence. I'm shaking because I'm angry. Our neighbors are being abducted in the early morning hours while trying to go to work. There's confirmed video footage of this. No warrants, no due process. It's unconstitutional. Our schools and neighborhoods are being staled by ICE agents with no regard for public safety, our laws, or our basic human rights. Yesterday, while doing mutual aid work, I also witnessed what my neighbor Sarah experienced at Aldi yesterday. I was in the parking lot for maybe 15 seconds when that happened. I would like to add that as my neighbor was being threatened by an armed masked man in broad daylight, worst of all was the woman who drove by me yelling, "Let them do their job, ma'am." and anyone who supports them. If their job involves harassment, racial profiling, intimidation, endangering public safety, bounty hunting, breaking and entering, making people disappear into unmarked vehicles, and murder, their job title is terrorist. If you they're fully sh sanctioned and ordered by the government, their job title is fascist, Nazi Gestapo, or secret police. And we will not allow terrorists and fascists to do their job in our city. Roseville City Council and Roseville Police and Roseville citizens, I beg you, I beg you to do everything in your power to protect our community. Pass the separation ordinance and don't stop there. Rise up, Roseville. Choose to be the light in the darkness. History has its eyes on you. >> Thank you for your comments. >> Right. And our next I think our I've announced Dion Haidider. Uh so I think we're caught up now in terms of pre previewing speakers and I recognize the next speaker. Hello and welcome. Thank you. Dion Haidider, Matilda Street. I am a Roseville employee, and I understand this puts me in an awkward position, but I am also a human being. When my spouse and I moved to Roseville, we chose Roseville because we saw a vibrant, forwardthinking community that valued resident diversity, security, and well-being. Today, our community faces an extreme threat to these values. People are being terrorized, brutalized, and kidnapped by armed agents acting without regard to law, constitutionality, public safety, or morality. These individuals are willing and proven to behave dangerously and unpredictably. The city of Roseville must separate itself from ICE actions in every way and in every way priority prioritize the safety and security of all community members. This must include enforcable standards barring immigration enforcement from all city property and data. To do anything else irrevocably destroys the trust that we have that our elected officials are acting with our best interests in heart. Please be brave and be leaders. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. >> Hello and welcome. >> Hello. Hi, Mayor Row and uh council members. My name is Abdiwok Johannes. I live just north of Dale and 36. Um I'm here to talk about maybe something that's a little bit uh intangible and that is uh the reputation of Roseville. Um I am a child of immigrants. My parents are from Aromia, which is in East Africa. Um you might not know that based off of the accent that I do not have that they do have. Um, it's come up many times in my life when needing to find a job. Um, when people see my name written down, um, but, uh, it is it has come up quite a bit. I am also a father of three kids. Um, I am a loving husband to a loving wife, um, who is enabling me to be here today. Um, speaking of our reputation, um, I want to talk about my wife just a little bit. Um, she is a birder, a bird nerd as you might know. Um, and I am learning about that and have been since I met her. Um, she and I are interracial couple. Uh, when we lived in Northeast in 2017, we found out very quickly we needed to move and find a house and we uh, we debated. I am, as I said, a child of immigrants. I've been in Minnesota since I was 6 years old. I was born in Missouri. Don't hold that against me. Um, but uh I've been to many places outside of the Twin Cities and it doesn't always make me feel comfortable to be there. My wife being a bird nerd and ecologist uh loves nature and oftentimes to get both things both be in the city with diversity and also be um in nature um requires a mix of two things that Roseville has. We have a game trail in our backyard. We have deer sleeping there all the time. We have chickens. Um that's all my wife, you know. Um, but I'm also 5 minutes away from the cities where I can see people that look like me. Um, for the first time in my life, my wife is imploring me to carry my passport because of how I look. And I have three kids. One of them goes to a Roseville prek and I have to think about them now and think about them getting passports as well. I ask you to think about the reputation of the city and what it means when people think I can live in a place that is diverse that has many different kids that live on my street of many different colors and creeds. If you want people to see Roseville as that magic ground of in between being close to the city and close to nature, you need to think about our reputation and what we do and our actions telling ICE to not be here and not be enabled by people and uh our city leaders. So I implore you to think about that and I thank you for your time. >> Thank you for your comments. Um, and before I recognize the next speaker, uh, I believe I had announced, did I announce Raphael Espinosa? That would be the next speaker. Uh, hello and welcome. >> Uh, thank you, mayor. Uh, my name is Bo Se. I'm a resident of Roseville here. Uh, I've been a resident for 5 years and as you can already tell, I'm an um, first generation immigrant. Um to start off I would say if this sitting was not before uh dark I wouldn't there's no way I would risk coming here because um as most of you know in the immigrant community we are terrified but I I would like to tell you that we are terrified. Um, as I speak now, at least three people that are are very close to me are in detention. And they are not in detention because of what they tell you that they are illegal. Uh, they are criminals. They are they came to this country legally. They are in this country legally. And I'll tell you there are so many ways pathways to citizenship in this country and the the administration made it so hard for you to to go through those uh pathways. For example, if you apply for asylum, it used to be free. We pay right now. But even the people that have paid and the their pending cases are ongoing have been arrested. people who have uh um um uh work permits have been arrested. None of you knows what he feels to be on the road, but then you're looking out to see which car is in the other lane. Uh so many big cars on on the road and the eyes people the cars they use are those cars. They look like civilian cars. You can't imagine driving but then you're looking in the side mirror, you're looking in the driving mirror. If somebody's tailgating you, you're like, "This is it. This is it." You don't know how it feels to to be in that situation. Uh, one of my friends was going to work and then he was boxed in like one car went ahead of him, another one on this side and and then two men came out. The first question was, "Who are you? Identify yourself." With his accent, they asked him, "Are you a citizen?" Truthfully, he said no. They said they told they asked him to to get out of the car. Within no time he was detained. He was driven to Brainard and then he was detained in Brainard and after they took him to Elk River. That was at the beginning of December. That was December 2nd. As I speak, he's still in detention. His uh court hearing was scheduled for last week on Thursday but because of the protests it was postponed to next Thursday. Another one was um um he had gone for a green card hearing. He had fought snailing and he was arrested right there. He was also u uh detained in Elk River and then I think um about 2 weeks ago he was flown out of Minnesota. He's in in Texas and and and like at the the next one is also still in Eric River. These guys have no criminal history. They are here illegally. They came here legally but because of where they were born from like their only crime where they were born and how they look. I let me ask has any of you if they say it's about illegal uh immigration and fraud and whatever has any of you seen them uh harassing or detaining anybody who looks like mayor? I guess no one has seen because by maybe naturally mayor is not a wrongdoer and me naturally I think I'm I'm a criminal. So are we um uh as I sit here I would ask city council like the previous speaker said the minimum is passing this resolution. City resources in in not in any way should they be used to assist ICE in crim in carrying out this criminality. We've been through a lot and we I ask that the the minimum you can help with like help us with is making sure that as I'm in my neighborhood at least I'm aware I know that ICE will not be using the city properties to harass me. I I haven't moved out of my house in the last couple of year days. Like I said, I wouldn't be here if it was during daytime because there's no way I could risk myself. Thank you so much. >> Thank you for your comments. I'm going to remind the audience again about uh the the the rules we talked about earlier. Um so uh next is I believe is Mr. Espinosa and then we have uh Cali Carper I believe would be next. Hello and welcome. >> Hello and uh uh thank you for your time. I really really appreciate it. I'm new to this city uh about a year. Um I was in another city for about 30 years and uh we chose to come here. Most of the people come here because it's a great city, want to raise kids. We did it the other way around. We raised the kids in St. Paul and and we want the peace and quiet now that we're older. Uh but here's the deal. I would really appreciate if you do the right thing. I am the perfect target. Um, I have probably lost about 20 people that I know to this and it's only a matter of time that is my time because there's too many and soon as they see me, I know they're going to follow me. So, I want to tell you that I live on 671 uh Eldrich Avenue. Not afraid to give out my uh my address cuz they follow you. So, there is no escaping this. But what I would really appreciate from you is not to let the Roseville police assist them in whatever they're going to do to me or my people when they c when they get them. The Roseville police is to protect the residents of Roseville and the visitors, not to join in the hate, to beat up people, to throw people in jails here in United States and abroad. the the job for this for the city workers in Roseville is to make this city great, is not to terrorize us. So, don't allow them to beat me up. Don't allow them to shoot me or my community. And it's not only my community. You hear from uh from other communities, they're terrified. I am not terrified of them because what they want is to make you feel like nothing. So you give up and I'm not gonna give up. I see the city that is behind me. It makes me really happy. I hope it makes you happy, too. It makes you do the right thing. And the right thing is not to allow them to do what they're doing. They're going to do that anyway on their own. They don't need your help. Don't give them the help. You know, make them feel unwelcome the same way that they're making us feel unwelcome. Thank you for your time. >> Thank you for your comments. >> As I said, I think uh the next speaker is Cali Kper and then we've got Michael uh Zajisk, I believe. >> Hello and welcome. >> Hi, thank you for having me. My name is Callie and I live on Loville Avenue in Roseville. And for what it's worth, I am a new resident. I have not been here for 30 years or even five, but since living here, um, it has been a wonderful, magical city and I'm so happy to be here. There's a lot of things to love about Roseville and that's why I'm here tonight with the entire lobby area full. I've been standing here for 2 hours with um however other many people who have been here um supporting a sanctuary um policy or a separation ordinance. And you know in my overzealous preparation, I did everything but prepare a speech. But I did read the agenda. I read the strategic plan. I read the police department policy that you guys discussed. And while I was looking over at the strategic plan, I noticed that the first three prongs are Roseville is aspiring to be a diver a diverse community. We are aspiring to be inclusive. We are aspiring for mutual trust and responsive emergency services. And as I mentioned, I've been here for two hours with people in the lobby and the Roseville that I see, we're already diverse. And tomorrow we will be electing the first Latina to the Roseville area school board. And that was a campaign that I was incredibly proud to support. And that to me shows that Roseville is already inclusive. We are diverse and we value those values. And the third one, building mutual trust and responsive emergency services. Well, we have an opportunity to be proactive. And I always read the city news that comes out and on the front page of the most recent one, we talked about a $500,000 grant that was allocated to our Roseville emergency services. And it seems like we're doing that because our emergency services already have their hands full taking care of the residents who are in Roseville. And the best way that we can assure that these strategic plans play out and in fact the only way that you can have 100% success is if you show demonstratively that you value not just the immigrants in our community but the people of color um and white people. Many people have sat up here today and told you that they're being discriminated against um at this point almost regardless of race or immigration status. And so I stand here in favor of the people who have spoken before me. I support, although I was not able to sign, everything that was mentioned that the petition calls for, in addition to a formalized, clear, and concise separation ordinance so we can show that Roseville really acts with integrity, respect, and responsibility. And we're protecting the interests of our residents so they can go grocery shopping and not be afraid to be targeted. so they can go out and get community and um you know, city resources without fear. So again, I'm here to strongly urge you in support of a separation ordinance to protect the people of Roseville. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. And before I recognize the next speaker, uh the next person on the list is uh Mary Beth um Kirwald, I believe. Hello and welcome. >> Hi. Hi, I'm Mike. My name is Michael Zichek. I'm a Roseville resident. I've uh lived here for I think six years now. Uh and I walked here if that gives you a general idea of my where I'm from. I'll try to keep my comments brief. I support um so much of what everyone has said tonight. Um I have friends, families, and relatives who are immigrants through adoption and marriage, and I fear for them and their safety. Um, I also just want to, you know, because I work with numbers, uh, I think about numbers and we were presented some by one individual earlier that I think context matters. And so when we hear that the homicide rate is down in this country, that's only because it was spiked 30% during COVID and we're back down to prepandemic levels. uh and our own government through the National Institute of Justice has found that immigrants and in particularly particular illegal immigrants commit violent crime at a far lower rate than natural or than people born here in the US. So don't let crime be an excuse for what is being done to our our communities. Um and yeah uh thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. And before I recognize the next speaker, uh the next person after that would be uh Stacy Peterson. Hello and welcome. >> Hi, I'm Mary Beth Gerwald and I walked here with my husband, Michael. Uh, I think I'm going to defer to so many of the speakers who have already come up here and spoken much more eloquently than I can, but I really want to echo their concerns. The legal activity that we're seeing from ICE, the fear that they're trying to create, the masks that they're wearing to avoid accountability are all intimidation factors. They're just meant to keep us scared and to keep us from being able to prevent them from intimidating more people. They're clearly engaging in racial profiling and it's a blatant abuse of power. Please formalize the strongest separation agreement possible and disallow the federal agents from using city property and city resources to intimidate our communities. >> Thank you for your comments. All right. And before I recognize uh the next speaker, uh Carly Ulig would be next, I believe. Uh LIIG. >> Hello and welcome. >> Hello. My name is Stacy Peterson. I have been a Roseville resident for 10 years. Um mayor, council members, first I want to thank you all for your flexibility and urgency in addressing this matter tonight and hearing these comments. You're in for a long night. There are a lot of people out there. Um, I know I certainly wasn't expecting to be spending my evening in Roseville City Hall. I've actually never been here before. Never been to a city council meeting. Um, but this is all very heartening to hear all of these comments. Um, I really have little to add, I think, to the statements of my fellow residents in favor of a strong separation ordinance limiting to the fullest extent Roseville city resources from being used by Immigrations and Customs Enforcement. I only want to reiterate what I think we all know, what I hope we all know, that it is not illegal in the United States of America to have black or brown skin. Is not illegal to speak with an accent, nor is it illegal to not speak English at all. ICE is treating members of our community like criminals for doing things that are not crimes. And if officials of our federal government will refuse to acknowledge and abide by the laws of our country, then our state, county, and local governments must step up. If anyone's constitutional rights are violated, the rights of all of us are in jeopardy. So, please, council members, hear the voices here tonight. You've heard so many of them. You will hear more. Know that we are scared for our neighbors of color. We're scared for ourselves and our families. We are looking for our elected toi officials to step up and stand up to the dangerous, immoral, and illegal actions of ICE. Please adopt this separation ordinance and protect the citizens of our community. Thank you. Thank you for your comments. Okay, >> before I recognize the next speaker, the the person after that would be uh Katie Foxen. Hello and welcome. >> Hi, my name is Karly Ulleig. I'm a proud Roseville resident and I'll actually be commenting on agenda item 7B. Um this is the new 10-year contract with Axon that would cost over $5 million. This >> actually if you're here for that item, you can speak when we consider that item. >> Okay. They told me to speak now. >> Okay. Yeah. No, this is uh this is actually, believe it or not, general public comment. Okay. About issues that aren't on the agenda this evening. Um so I I hope you'd be okay with sticking around for that item to come up because I we are going to take it up this evening. >> Sure. >> All right. Thank you. And I apologize for the confusion on that. >> That's right. >> Right. And then just quickly, the next speaker uh would be uh Praj Femi. Hello and welcome. Hi, my name is Katie Folkson and I come here as a mother of two children who are in the Roseville School District. I've been trying to find words to explain to my kids about what is going on and reflecting on their childhood and trying to maintain as much of their innocence as possible. And so right now is terrifying, but this isn't all that my 10-year-old and 14year-old have experienced in their short lives. They were tiny when CO happened and they were separated from their friends and they had to do distance learning and there was so much uncertainty. Then in the last couple of years, they have had school shooting after school shooting happen. My son's asking me, "If I'm out on the playground, where should I go and hide if a shooter comes out? If I'm in the bathroom, do I stay there or do I run back to my classroom?" And so, our children are at the breaking point before all of this happened. I want you guys to look tomorrow when you're going out in the community. Every single child that you see and then double that because half of them are hiding at home. Every single one is being traumatized right now. My son is talking about his friends that have gone been gone for months. He doesn't know if they'll ever come back. His friends telling him that his dad disappeared. They don't know where he is and it's been two months. Every day a little bit of my son's innocence is lost. Yesterday when we were driving on the streets and saw a caravan of ICE agents going by and I was trying to get their license plates so I could alert the residents so that people could find out where they were going. And he goes, "Well, what do you mean? I thought they were ICE agents because they drove around in ICE vans. That broke my heart. And so I called off work so that I can show him that I am doing everything I can to protect him and protect his friends. And he is trying to proect trying to protect the smaller kids in his school. He came home the other day and he said, "I'm really glad I didn't show up because that would have been scary for the kindergarteners." And so I ask you for our children for all that they have already endured. Every single one of them needs you to stand up and be the strongest leader you can. I'm doing all I can to show them that I am fighting for them and for their friends. I can't say yet that our community leaders are doing everything they can to protect them. Please do that. Thank you for your comments. Before I recognize the the next speaker then um the uh speaker after that would be uh Justin um Stafle I believe. Hello and welcome. >> Uh hello everyone. Uh my name is Pravdi and I live on Rice Street. Uh I also serve as the chair of the equity inclusion commission for the city of Rose. Uh for those in the audience that don't know what the what the equity inclusion commission does, uh I'll be honest, uh I'm the chair and I'm still figuring that out. Um all jokes aside, uh the people on my commission are very passionate about the work that we do. So I want to emphasize that these are my comments alone as a private citizen and not reflective on the commission at all. Um we've all been here a while, so I'll keep this pretty brief. Uh, I agree with pretty much everything that's been said here tonight and I know you, the city leaders and its government, uh, will do the right thing and keep residents safe. I want my public comment to focus on something more optimistic. Um, as you might know, I've shown up to a decent amount of city council meetings and normally there's like 10 people in the audience max. Um, but history shows that moments of uncertainty can also be moments of clarity. And I think seeing these room filled with this many people is one of those moments. And I realize it's often at our lowest points that we discover our strongest sense of responsibility to one another. And I think seeing this many people here tonight really gives me hope. Um and proud to call myself a motan. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. >> All right. Uh the next speaker, as I said, would be uh Justin Stafle, I believe. I apologize for my pronunciation. >> And then after that would be Chris Taylor. Hello and welcome. Thank you. Uh, I was going to say that I'm a longtime listener, first- time caller, but someone else already beat me to it. I'm clearly not the only dad here. >> The jokes are all going to be used, >> so I'll I'll try to do my best. Anyways, um, I just wanted to start to say that um, my family and I moved here to Roseville uh, in 2021. Um when we moved into our current uh neighborhood uh we had we have we were not from here. So people often ask us how do you like the area? How do you like things? And I I kind of always tell this story that within two hours of taking possession of our new home uh we had a knock on the door and it was uh actually an immigrant. And this immigrant uh he was there with his two daughters and he was clearly watching from a couple houses down the street just waiting to see who had who had moved into this new house and must have been overjoyed to see it was a family with with kids, two girls the same age as his. Uh and uh he introduced himself and we felt so amazingly welcome. Uh that was probably the last time he saw our house clean because we hadn't moved anything in yet. and also partially because every day since uh his two girls and ours have been constantly wrecking the place. Uh so when people ask me what I think of Roseville, that's what I tell them. I tell them I feel extremely welcome and it's hard to deny that it was in fact an immigrant who who who made us feel that welcome at first. Um, the other thing I'd like to address is I is the current situation here. Uh we've heard a lot of stories tonight of supposed law enforcement agencies uh that don't seem to want to follow the law. And um what I would like to ask is I'd like to ask whether or not whether or not they are still subjected to law when they speed down our our residential streets at 50 mph. Why aren't they being pulled over by Roseville police when we hear them boxing people in? Sure. I guess this one was in Little Canada, but we hear them boxing them in or running them into a snowbank. Why is that not grounds for arrest? Could Could I do that? Is that is that cool for everybody to do that here now? Is that okay? Uh I would expect that this sort of criminal activity is treated like any other criminal activity. I don't know why I haven't seen any videos of one of these plateless, you know, dark tinted vehicles being pulled over by by our police department. Could Could I do that? Can I just go unscrew my license plate on the way out here and face no consequences? I might I might do it right in front of the police station. Why not let them see me do it and drive out of here because apparently that seems to be okay. So, I'm not asking for any ordinances to be passed. I'm not waiting for any sort of, you know, bureaucracy in motion. Can we just enforce the laws we already have? That doesn't seem like a lot to ask and it seems like it's not being done. Now, I've also heard from the people here that uh you know, the Roseville Police Department is exemplary and they tend to be the ones that are are being compared to against this lawless uh law enforcement agency. So, I I have every reason to believe the good people here who have made those comments. Uh I would also appreciate to see it in action though. So thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. >> Once again if I can ask folks to uh be respectful of time and and allow us to continue the meeting. Hello and welcome. And before I uh recognize you to speak I will just note the next speaker is um Scott Zarin I believe or something to that effect. >> Once again I apologize. Hello and welcome. >> Uh Dr. Chris Taylor. I live on AASO. Um, I'm confident in the fact if you've ever been over there, they'll never find me because there's a million different aostas over there. >> Good one. >> So, we heard earlier somebody talking about neutrality. And I just want to say there's no neutral. Doing nothing supports the actions that they are uh exhibiting. Um, the only path forward is to do something about it. Right. I'd also like to just say that values can be interesting things, right? Um, I've been doing equity and justice work for about 20 years. I'm also on the equity commission. Um, I like to talk about espouse values and lived values, right? It's very easy to write values that sound great on paper. The challenge comes when we have to live those values in real life, right? And I feel like this is a moment where the values uh that we have espoused are being challenged and are we going to rise to the occasion and live those values? That's the question, one of the questions I have. The other question, you know, as an equity commissioner, I raise my hand to donate my time and my expertise and my skills to Roseville and the commission. I I did that because I was convinced that there is a commitment by the city on equity. There's a racial equity plan. There's a racial equity coordinator. All of these things, right? So, as we are working and doing our work, we're talking about community engagement. We're talking about trust. We're talking about all of those things. The wrong choice here wipes all of that away. When we talk about trust, that's about safety. I can't trust you if I don't feel safe. And so, if we can't help people here feel safe, the city council, the commissions, all of that, it works. It's antithetical to what we're trying to accomplish, right? And so I would just ask that you support the separation agreement um so that I can continue to serve on the equity commission because I have to live my values and so I'm really hoping that we do the right thing here. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. >> All right. And before I recognize the next speaker, the person after that would be uh Carolyn Wed, I believe. >> Hello and welcome. >> Hi. Uh, my name is Scott Zaffron as you saw he had trouble pronouncing it. Uh, the actual correct pronunciation would be Shaffron. My own family doesn't even use it. It's Polish. Uh, I I'm second generation immigrant on my dad's side. Polish. Um, his dad, his mom was from Mink. Uh, you know, uh, I see my friends who are second immigration immigrants or even further back. My one friend uh his that lives in Roseville uh her son is probably about seventh or eighth generation in the US and he is currently being targeted by ice because of the color of his skin. Um yeah sorry I I live I am in Roseville resident I live. I've lived here for six years. I'm a home homeowner now in Roseville. Before that I lived in the north end for about 8 years just down the road. Um, for 20 years of that I've lived in Minnesota, I've worked with adults with developmental disabilities. Um, on Saturday, I worked a 12-hour shift. I drove probably about 120 mi around the metro between my two shifts. Um, going to stores after stores after stores. And I can tell you around the metro, including in Roseville, I'm surprised I did not get into an accident with the erratic way ICE agents have been driving in unmarked vehicles. Sometimes with no plates, sometimes with one plate. Are they Are they subject to our laws? Because it doesn't seem that way. It really doesn't. None of us in this room anymore have a fourth amendment effectively. And what's our city going to do about that? Who do I call when my fourth amendment right is being violated? Can I call the Roseville police? I mean I I I assume now you know that I also support this amendment uh resolution, but I think the main thing here that I want to drive home because a lot of things have been said that already I I'm just going to repeat what other people have said, but really, you know, I've seen such bravery and amazing community in Roseville and St. Paul and Maplewood all around the metro with my ne from my neighbors helping support each other during this. And we really need you guys that have the bully pulpit of the city council and have the badge of the Rosebell Police Department to come and, you know, put your necks out a little bit and protect your citizens and make sure that nobody is above the law, especially a bunch of white supremacists who've been law enforcement agents for maybe 5 minutes now. It's unacceptable and it cannot continue. It is so nerve-wracking. I my I have a stressful job. When I take an individual who barely has any words to use to a store and if the store a bunch of armed thugs come in the store and start tackling people and I have no idea how this person's going to react or what, you know, of the like 30 words they might be able to say, what they're going to say and what that officer's reaction is going to be. I cannot even explain to you the stress levels I'm through right now. Like my it's through the roof. Through the roof. This morning I had to have a meeting with my bosses to figure out how we protect the vulnerable adults we care for and our staff from the federal government. I have to say that again because it bears repeating and I need everybody in this room to take action on this. I had to have a meeting at my job where we had to figure out how we protect vulnerable adults and our staff from the federal government. This cannot happen in Roseville or anywhere in the United States. And we need to stop this now. And we need you to stand up and put your necks out on the line and speak up and make sure things are done because this is cannot continue. Thank you. Thank you for your comments. Before I recognize the next speaker, uh the speaker after that would be uh Kristen uh Kadak, I believe. C A B A K. Hello and welcome. >> I'm Caroline. I'm 13 and as you can tell by the headphones, I'm autistic and I am normally not a very serious person, but this is something that I'm being serious about. Um I live in Roseville. I went to Little Canada Elementary. I've been speaking Spanish since first grade and I've been going to Mexico since I was two. And for the entirety of fifth grade, I went to school in Mexico. And it's disgusting to me that people who are only different because they speak a different language or look different are being deported sometimes back to countries that are currently in the middle of a dangerous situation that they came here to get out of. I know I'm just a white kid sharing his opinion, but I'm also a white kid with immigrant friends, including the niece of a woman who was up here earlier. I promised her I wouldn't share her name, so I won't. Last week, I was texted by multiple of my friends that didn't go to my school that ICE was outside. One of my classmates is stuck in her house because she's part of the Latinx community, and other white passing friends and classmates are bringing her and her family basic human rights. The Latinx club we have at our school can no longer do it during after school hours. They have to do it during home room time because the teacher who runs it is scared that kids are going to get taken off the streets as they walk home and get deported. Um, sorry. >> It's okay. Um, I am here to see how you all do your job because soon my generation will be the ones in charge. I sometimes get scared that something bad will happen to my parents or my grandparents. I've had to deal with this twice when my dad was sent to the hospital for a bad injury and my grandpa had a stroke. But I can't imagine being scared that every day I might come home and my parents aren't going to be there. Please, please pass the laws to stop the ICE agents. Not just for the immigrants, but for the groups that are going to be targeted after that. For neurode divergence, for LGBTQ, for anyone who could be targeted because of this. >> Thank you for your comments. And the next speaker uh after this one would be uh Erilyn uh Besan or Bessanin. Hello, welcome. >> Hi, my name is Kristen Kbeck. Thank you all for being here tonight. Um I know it's a very long night for all of you and all of us. So, I appreciate your time and thoughtfulness. Um I've been a Roseville resident since I got married in 2017. and um I am a proud mom of two daughters in Roseville and also a proud um public school teacher in a neighboring school district. Um today I started my day at school at 6:30 in the morning so that I could get my copies made so that I could be outside to do bus duty. No one assigned me bus duty for high school students. I am choosing to do it and I'm choosing to be out there every school morning and afternoon with other groups of teachers who are trying to keep our kids safe. Um well at the same time this afternoon I am explaining to my kindergartener why there were nine kids in her kindergarten class out of 18 today. >> On Friday I explained to her why she didn't go outside for recess. On Thursday and Friday of last week I explained to my four-year-old why her daycare was closed for two days while we scrambled to make a plan for her to be at daycare safely and for her teachers to arrive at daycare safely. And I am so sick of doing those things that are so abnormal in a country that I believe in so wholeheartedly and that I believe in so wholeheartedly in all of us achieving our dreams while we're here. both those of us who were born here and both those of those of us who came here and I urge all of you tonight to not only support that ordinance like so many other people have spoken so so eloquently but just continue to do little things like it enrages me to find out that ICE are using our beautiful Roseville Park bathrooms like and I have benefited from those beautiful Roseville Park bathrooms while potty training toddlers I love that they are open all the time I would take all the extra laundry in the world to have them locked for the next month so that they cannot use them. I will bring my toddlers home to go to the bathroom from the park. I just I want us to do every little thing both within your power and ours to make this a safe place for our students because right now it is not. Like so many other teachers and community members I have talked about to my students about doing mutual aid. I've talked to kids about getting rides home from work. I see 160 students a day and today I marked 42 of them absent and that has been the case since the middle of December and I have I was sitting in the lobby earlier and while I was sitting in the lobby I have been working this whole time and the work I am doing is creating plans for every single kid who can't come to school to figure out how to teach them geometry online a practice I hoped to not have to do twice in my education career. I think that's all. I wrote some stuff down, but hopefully that was the most of it. Okay, thank you. >> Thank you for your time. >> And before I introduce the next speaker or recognize the next speaker, uh the speaker after that would be Emily Graham. Hello and welcome. >> My name is Errol Bessnon. I go to Roseville Area High School. I didn't expect to speak today, but my school had a walk out today and we were on a bridge standing and we had the Roseville police blocking off the roads for us and me and multiple of my friends were all standing in one spot. And the second that we saw a vehicle that looked like an ICE vehicle and someone in a mask get out, everyone started panicking. It wasn't It was someone who was helping organize, but you could hear the fear ripple through the crowd. And every day before and after school, they have half the staff out there making sure that ice doesn't come and kids don't get taken. and I have fifth hour English and it's scary because you go on your phone 5 minutes before the bell rings and you look at your phone and everyone on my school posts on Instagram. So I look at their posts and on Friday there was a post that said ICE was outside of our school. That wasn't true. But they were near our school and it was really scary because no one knew what was going on. Everyone was scared. People were crying, hugging each other. And I know a lot of people with their whistles. They were clutching their whistles. They were looking around. And there was also an email sent out from our district that was saying if ICE is at your bus stop, the bus driver will take you to somewhere else. They shouldn't have to send that out. Masked men should not be at our bus stops waiting for kids to come and then they're going to take those kids. A lot of my classmates haven't been showing up to school and that's not fair to them. They deserve an education even if they're undocumented. Everyone deserves the right to freedom. I don't have any legal matters like all I'm asking you is to think of how the children are looking at our leaders right now. We're watching what you're doing and we see every good and bad thing. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. Right. And before I recognize the next speaker, uh, the speaker after that would be Rose Martin. Hello and welcome. >> Hi, I'm Emily. I live on Minnesota Avenue. I've only been living here for about two years, two coming up on two and a half years. Um, first I want to recognize the pain and suffering my community and all the members of our state are having to go through cuz to live in that fear is unacceptable in our day and age. And I would also like to recognize our high school students. I was there this morning just in support. I don't even have a student in the school. I'm just a proud community member. And I'd like to recognize everything that they did and also explain to you that children shouldn't have to be doing that. I am so proud of that generation for stepping up because our leaders aren't stepping up. and the fact that children have to step up, you should look to them because we feel like we can't look to you. And it's making our community feel so unsafe. And I'm coming to you as a mom of a 4-year-old who today had to come tell me that one of her teachers wasn't there. Luckily, she didn't ask me why, cuz how do you explain to a four-year-old what is going on in our world? It's com like I don't even know the words I'm trying to say. I just as a new resident, we chose this city because of just seeing what other people have said about the community. The school district's phenomenal. I implore you to not make me regret that decision. Do not make me want to leave because there was a reason we chose Roseville. We didn't just happen to end up here. We chose Roseville to be a part of this diverse community, to raise my daughter, to know what's right. I had to I chose to miss my daughter's bedtime tonight because I want her to understand that being silent at this point is being complicit. And I'm not complicit in what is going on. But I also am a mom. I shouldn't have to figure out how to tow this line of keeping my me and my family safe versus standing up for what's right. You guys need to do that for us. and protect our community just like what everybody else has mentioned I agree with everyone less one gentleman but um I everything they say that they want done please do but don't make our police department be there for the safety of the ICE officers they should be there for the safety of our residents the fact that I have to worry about my daughter possibly having an ICE agent even being allowed to walk into the school. The fact that the superintendent sent that email, I'm so happy that they are acknowledging what's going on and letting us know what they plan to do. But we already have worries of gun violence and now I have to worry about them just even being able to walk in the door with a gun. How is that appropriate? So, I just implore you to please continue to listen to our community members and what they say because everybody I'm so proud to be a Roseville resident and I really don't want you to make me regret that. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. >> Before I recognize the next speaker, the speaker after that uh would be uh Christa Kudson. Hello and welcome. Hello. Hi, my name is Rose um Martin. I live near Lake McCarron. I see some neighbors up here. Um thank you all for being here tonight and for the time you're giving to this. I'm sure it's a lot to take in. Um I'm going to share a short statement and then I'm going to invite my new friend to share her statement. She was earlier tonight not comfortable sharing so she asked me. We met in the hall. Um but now she's has the courage to share. So I'm going to read something and then it will be her turn. Um okay. There are strong moral and ethical arguments to pass the separation or ordinance as have been illuminated throughout the night. Earlier tonight, an expert shared some practical reasons to adopt the separation ordinance. I want to highlight one more practical reason to support the ordinance. The story shared earlier tonight about the woman being harassed at Aldi shook me. Especially the part where someone yelled, "Let them do their jobs." What are we to do as residents of Roseville if we see people threatening our neighbors? Are we to make the assumption that this is ICE activity? Are we expected to stand by? What is stopping bad people with guns from impersonating ICE and harassing or harming us and our neighbors? Will we feel safe enough to call the police in these cases? Will the police believe us? Will they come and investigate and protect us? Truly, I don't know the answer. Will Roseville PD respond to calls from citizens reporting harassment. If they have um Oh, sorry. Okay. I want to assume that the answer is yes. I think the intention of the city council and local police would be to protect us. But this ICE activity opens up the possibility of extreme harm to be perpetrated by bad people. And I have to point out that if this exact same activity were done by nonfederal agents, it would absolutely clearly fall into criminal activity. The Twin Cities has done so much work to attempt to repair the extreme damage that has been caused by officer involved killings. Do we want the police force's integrity to be sullied by ISIS activity? I echo what other par parents have said. How do I explain to my kids how to differentiate between which people in uniform they can trust and which might choose to harass me in an Aldi parking lot? The least we can do, the absolute least is to not help ICE. Do not obey in advance. I just want to read one more small thing after my friend speaks. >> Hello everyone. Thank you so much and thank you Rose. My name is Priyanka. I live on Cleveland um very close to that Aldi. Uh I also didn't uh expect to speak today, but just being here since 6:00 p.m. and seeing everybody speak just make me feel so much more prouder to be a resident of Minnesota and Roseville. I am I'm so happy and so proud. um except that one guy with bangs. So I became a registered nurse when COVID 19 pandemic happened. So when nurses were cool. Um I am also a future nurse practitioner with a doctoral degree from University of Minnesota and I'll be the first doctoral candidate in my family, first generation. Uh thank you. Um, and I graduate this May and I hope to continue to serve as a primary care provider in Roseville and especially focusing on underserved communities. I was initially very worried to come to this meeting because you know my skin color and um even though I carry my uh certificate of naturalization, my um passport, my driving license and I also remember to carry my Costco ID because just in case, who knows, right? I was still worried that here Rose corrected me. I wanted to call them the frozen people would just look at me and like yes that's the criminal that we want um and kidnap me. Um speaking of do you know how absurd it is that they are arresting Native Americans? I mean this is their land. Anyway um I will keep this short. I am very proud Minnesotan and making being in this room makes me very proud to be a resident of Roseville and I am very confident that our police department can protect us too. So as our leaders the ball is in your court. Show us that you care about people like us who are your residents and do the things you need to do so that I and everyone like me can continue serving our community without being kidnapped by massmen on a random Tuesday. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. >> And I just want to read one more thing very quick. Terrible things are happening outside. Poor, helpless people are being dragged out of their homes. Families are torn apart. Men, women, and children are being separated. Children come home from school to find that their parents have disappeared. Anne Frank, January 13th, 1943. >> Thank you. >> Right. If I'm uh keeping up here, Christa Kudson, and then the speaker after that would be Jamie Becker Finn. Miss Kudson, welcome. >> Thank you and thank you for hearing my comments tonight. My name is Christa Kenudson and I am a lifelong motan but a newcomer to Roseville. The vibrant, welcoming and safe city I intentionally relocated with my multi-generational and multi-racial family is unrecognizable today. The city parks where our children play and residents enjoy nature are being used by ICE agents. Our parks are not safe. Our restaurants, where we gather to eat and workers earn a living, are targeted by agents who enjoy a meal and then come back later to detain workers. Our businesses are not safe. Our neighborhoods, including apartment complexes and mobile homes, should be a haven for us to rest and raise our families. Instead, they are being repeatedly targeted as mothers and fathers are snatched away from their families. Our homes are not safe. As many have said, I am not the only one who has witnessed federal agents driving erratically at unsafe speeds. Our roads are not safe. ICE agents are repeatedly stalking school bus stops, hoping to snatch up caregivers in front of their children. Our school bus stops are not safe. District leadership has implemented detailed plans to try to keep children safe in school and in transit. It is now your turn to take decisive action to protect our community. The escalation we are currently seeing is proof that current city policy is not enough to ensure the safety of Roseville residents and visitors. I am urging you to implement a strong separation ordinance with haste. Today is a time for strong, decisive, and courageous leadership. The situation is urgent in Roseville. We value all of our neighbors. We are all Roseville and we are not safe. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. And I do want to just just pause for a moment. I'm not sure how many people still are out in the hallways, but we do have a fair number of seats in the council chambers uh that are available. So, if folks want to scout out some possibilities there, uh I want to, you know, make sure that people can be part of the action, so to speak. Uh and with that, before I recognize the next speaker, the speaker after that would be Ben Eisenrike. Hello and welcome. >> Uh good evening. Uh my name is Jamie Becker Finn. I'm a Roseville resident and an owner of a small business located in Roseville as well. Um I over the years I've gotten to know um several of you um up there and I urge you to not take my comments um personally, but um I wrote comments, but it as I've listened to our neighbors in 8 years of serving our community previously in elected office, I have never been more proud um of my neighbors here in Roseville. I I hope you know you know that like this is like this would be good testimony even at the Capitol like this is I hope you are hearing them and I am big mama bear mad about what is happening in our community and I'm really curious what you all did this weekend because I watched ICE agents roam our neighborhoods terrorizing kidnapping and exhausting our residents Hundreds of your constituents are taking time off from work and doing their best to observe, monitor, and protect their neighbors. And I really do want to know what did you all do? Ask yourselves that. What did you do? Cuz that's what your constituents are doing. Did you sleep well knowing that you are probably not going to be a target of their violence? Cuz I did not sleep well. I attended meetings and connected my neighbors and answered my kids' questions about why their classmates aren't in school. And I had to have a conversation with my teen about what he should say if an ICE agent targets him and his classmates and his friends and his uh soccer teammates because of the color of their skin. We're native and as others have mentioned, this is so ridiculous that they are picking up native people just because they're brown. That's literally what's happening. They are driving around and targeting brown people. And unfortunately, my child is 6 feet tall and brown. So, even though I have the privilege of walking around with paler skin than him, um he doesn't have that privilege. So, I have my native kid walking around with papers just in case. I've counseledled my child to have to say, what do you say? Just say over and over again that you're only 15. Um, and this makes me really proud, but also really sad that my kid can clock the ICE vehicles driving through our communities throughout the day. Can you have you been? Cuz that's what we've all been doing for the past week. Did you know that these goons are using our city parking lots and portaotties and streets that our tax dollars pay for? Did you know that they stay in the hotels here? Do I guess we benefit from the lodging and sales taxes that they're paying, but I I don't want that money. The safety of my neighbors is more important to me than that. And I really ask yourself, do you stand with some guy who doesn't live here and owns the home to Hilton over by the Walmart, or are you going to stand with all the people who have commented today? Can you stand with the kids at the bus stop? I know that your positions as city council members are nonpartisan, but that doesn't mean you can't pick a side when it comes to this moment that we are in. We need protections for our residents in law. Internal policies and platitudes about caring about immigrants and diversity mean nothing if we don't put it in law. ISIS presence in our city makes us all less safe whether you realize it or not and it wastes the resources that we have to take care of each other. You may think that your job is to get reelected. It is not. Your job is to listen to us, to hear us, to work for us, and to protect us. And why aren't any of you speaking up? I looked as I was sitting here. I looked on your face. I look, why aren't you putting out statements? It should not be hard to say that you oppose fascists. That should not be hard. And I hope, if nothing else, you walk away from this meeting knowing that we want to elect people who stand up to fascists and protect us. >> Uh, you are at about four and a half minutes. So, I if you can wrap, >> I will wrap up. This isn't a thought exercise. This is real life. The fascists are here. What are you going to do? Passing laws isn't just about solidifying policies and protocols. When we pass laws, we send a message. Please don't wait 10 days. Hear us and do the right thing. >> And thank you for your time. Once again, I'm going to ask the audience to be respectful and allow people to speak. Uh our next speaker after uh this speaker uh is Gwen Lee Irving. Hello and welcome. >> Hello. I'm Dr. Benjamin Robert Eisner. I live on Virginia Avenue in Roseville. Thank you for listening to us. Cornerstone of our rule of law is that we the people get a say. In civil matters, we get to say on juries. We get to say whether something's culpable. We get to say whether there's truth within a claim. In criminal matters, we get to say whether someone's innocent or guilty. We also have a say when we vote, when we pass laws, when we collectively get together. is very clear from the actions of this current administration. They are not interested in our ability to exercise that right. Taking away Minnesota's ability to investigate Renee Nicole Mlin Good's murder. That says it right there. A government that is just, that is transparent, that is lawful. The people don't have to fear. I don't know about you, but what I hear tonight is a lot of fear. I think it's very clear what needs to be done. what people have said, the ordinance that needs to be passed. The question is for you. Will you listen to us, the people? Will you pass the separation ordinance? Will you do what we're asking you to do? That is all. Thank you for your comments. >> Before I recognize the next speaker, uh the speaker after that uh will be uh Algra. I'm sorry, the last name starts with L. Lakshmid maybe. I apologize. Um, hello and welcome. >> Hi. Uh, my name is Gwen Leving. Uh, I'm not a longtime resident. My wife and I actually moved here within the last 6 months. Uh, we moved to Rose Roseville because, uh, we felt like we would be safe here. Not sure how safe I feel now, but um, law enforcement officers are supposed to take an oath to protect and uphold the Constitution. And right now, our constitution is being trampled. I mean, we're supposed to have rights, a right to face our accusers, a right to a fair trial, a right to not be subject to legal search and seizures without a warrant. Right now, these rights are being trampled by ICE. I mean, sending agent agents in with masks maybe doesn't violate the letter of the right to face your recusers, but it certainly violates the spirit, right? Uh arrest warrants are just being ignored in in favor or, you know, judicial warrants are being ignored in favor of just uh basically door-to-door searches is what they're what they're doing now. Uh at at this time there are 731 federal uh immigration judges with a case load of over 900,000 cases. Now, not all of those are detention cases, but the backload is so immense that that immigrants that are here legally that followed all of the rules, their visas are expiring and they're getting picked up by ICE because of it. Not only that, but the I mean with waiting lists that long and with ICE essentially refusing to uh grant bond hearings for well they say anyone that uh entered the country illegally, but that's sort of like saying we're not going to to grant a bail hearing to anyone who is a criminal, right? So essentially, people are just being held indefinitely awaiting trial. And we're talking about something that is a essentially a misdemeanor offense with a maximum penalty of more than a year. There was a recent report by ProPublica that said that in 2025 there had been 170 US citizens that had been illegally picked up by ICE. Those are just the numbers that we know about. I mean, we have about 60,000 people waiting in detention. Certainly, that some of those people are here legally. I mean, that that number that I gave you is just US citizens. I mean, the Renee Good's recent killing is proof that it's not possible to just violate the rights of non-citizens without violating everyone's rights. So, I mean, we we don't have an obligation to help ICE, right? But we also have a moral duty not to help them trample on the US Constitution. Uh thank you. Thank you for your comments. All right. And before I recognize uh uh the next speaker, the speaker after that would be uh Joanne Isdall. Hello and welcome. >> Hi, I'm Laker Lockstead. I'm sorry my penmanship was bad. Um, >> it's all operator error on my part, I should say. >> Uh, I just wanted to say, um, I'm a Canadian American. I'm newer to Roseville as well. I loved hearing that there were people here for 20, 30 years. I've only been here for 2 years. I'm on County Road B2. I love living here. I love supporting Roseville programs, our amenities, our public safety. Um, thank you for hearing our comments. It means a lot to us. Uh, I'm also in support of the clear separation orance for Roseville to not lend resources to ICE and to ensure that our city parking lots, schools, and parks stay free of ice terrorizing our community. Right now, we aren't safe, especially non-white people, as you've heard from several people who have come to make comment before. Uh, we want to protect our neighbors. This includes folks that may be undocumented. They may they are members of our community. They work hard. They have families. They grow our economies. They're part of the fabric of Roseville. If you are listening, we want you here. I just also wanted to comment uh specifically about the Roseville in uh Highway 36 area. This was the area with Aldi that um we heard from another member about. Um I have concerns based on this area just seen within the last day alone. Um first, school zones. This is like all Roseville school zones, not just the middle school in that area. Like we have seen ICE agents and plateless vehicles and tactical gear and this is traumatizing and not normal for students to see. I'm not a parent. I might not ever be a parent. Please don't tell my parents that. They really want a grandbaby. I don't know yet, but that doesn't matter. I don't want any student to experience this. Like youth should not be experiencing this. Um next, uh the plateless vehicles we've already heard about. I just want you to know that like while sitting here in this meeting, that member spoke and I had a neighbor tell me that they saw this incident happen in action. It was very traumatizing for them as well. Um lastly, I want to also point out that there's staging uh in the Tri County Bobcat business parking lot. This is like where ICE gathers to kind of terrorize nearby community complexes. We've had neighbors keeping an eye on these complexes to keep our neighbors safe. Um f uh there's also been just like incidents throughout the Twin Cities that we've heard about of ICE like basically chasing fearful community members. People are going to get hurt. It's kind of known and we've heard about it from other commenters that the presence makes everyone feel unsafe. Uh they avoid calling 911, reporting crimes, leaving their home, um all those things. Uh I do want to also call out too that ICE usually stays in cities to from 30 to 90 days. We know that they're staying in Roseville. I'm saying this not to create more alarm than there already is, but to express the urgency of taking action now. They are here. Uh I'll yield my time. Thank you so much. >> Thank you for your comments. >> Before I recognize the next speaker or the speaker after that will be Ian Foster. Hello and welcome. >> My name is Joanne Isall. I've lived in Roseville for three months. Um I agree with all the comments except for the one man. My comment is um in concern my concern about the time frame that you referenced to enact ordinances. I understand there's a process you must go through and procedures that you must follow, but this is extremely urgent and I'm asking you to expedite this process. We don't have 30 days. We don't even have 10 days to wait. Please do whatever you can to protect everyone as quickly as you can do it. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. >> All right. And before I recognize the next speaker, the speaker after that will be uh Sarah Kaufman. Uh hello and welcome. >> Hi, my name is Ian Foster. I live on B2. I was born and raised Falcon Heights Roseville area. I went to school at Brimhal Roseville Middle School, Roseville High School. I now live back in Roseville again for the last four or five years with my wife. Um, first thing I want to talk about is what's most important to me in Roseville, which is the park system. I've seen all of your campaign flyers, every single one of them. The number one thing you mentioned is the parks. It's very hard to differentiate between the candidates cuz everybody says it's the most important thing. So coming here, it's dismayed me. I know ICE has been in Minneapolis and St. Paul. did not realize how strong of a presence they already have in Roseville, including in our parks. Um, you know, it's one thing to be under siege by mass men and unmarked cars, secret police, Gustapo, whatever you want to call them. I would use all those words myself. Um, it's another thing to be a party to support them. Um you know I'm reading through your thing here what you mentioned about grow police says members of the department are authorized to assist ICE whenever related to scene safety and the safety of ICE employees as they perform their duties. Member of the department are authorized to cooperate with the task force involving ICE agents. I just I don't think that's strong enough. Um I'm going to share some quotes here um referring to the killing of Renee Good as a horrible act, a shocking event, disruptions to our neighbors. Uh we should not be made to live in fear. We are free to be alive and our rights intact. Those are quotes from you, Mayor Row, before the meeting had started. I believed you and you said those things. I know you are scared as we are. The five seven of you up there are as scared as we are. So, I'm asking you to not do anything to help them. You know, I you mentioned your minimum requirement under the law to interact with ICE. You know, everybody here wants you to do more. They want you to act stronger than the minimum requirements by the law. We want you to be leaders. A lot of you have been on this council for a long time. You've been mayor for the long time. The city has changed. Like I said, I've been here or near here for 35 years. It's become more diverse and you've done a great job and ushering in a new age in Roseville. I don't want your legacy to be tarnished by cooperating with these people. Um, so I will conclude you you can make a difference. I know it's easy to hide behind I don't know formality or process 10 whether that's 10 days whether it's inaction indifference but you know you can do more you know you can do the right thing and I'll take my time thank you >> thank you for your comments uh as I noted before the next speaker signed up is Sarah Kaufman is Sarah Kaufman here otherwise I've spoken Jason. >> Okay. Yeah, you're right. Actually, I'm sorry. Um, after that would be Rich Fry Holtz or Freyholtz >> and then uh Afton Hangar. >> Come on up. >> Welcome. My name is Rich Fry Holtz. I've lived in Roseville for about 22 years. I appreciate the opportunity to uh come before this council and also to uh speak with my fellow residents. I wasn't expecting to, but uh I think it's a good time for all of us to be speaking up. I grew up in a small town in North Dakota where people take care of their neighbors. And when I moved to Roseville, I found that it had those same qualities. people in Roseville take care of their neighbors. It's a difficult time for us all, but I think it's a time for us to speak out and to do the right thing. Uh it's been mentioned that there's a uh uh a motion to put forward a separation agreement. I think that's a good idea. I would also suggest that as being a good neighbor to our neighbors in Minneapolis and St. Paul, we might also think about sending a letter of support to those mayors, to those city councils or enjoining them in their lawsuit against the federal government or at least speaking out on behalf of that because I think that would show support and that we're being good neighbors to our neighbors. So, that would be one thing that I don't know if that's possible to do, but seems like a good idea. I would also just like to say I don't care if your ancestors came over on the freaking Mayflower. We're all immigrants in this country. Thank you for your comments. Uh after Afton hanger, if Afton is here, uh it would be Mayor Ryas. Myraas, hello and welcome. Thank you for your time. This is my first time trying to speak, so I apologize. Um to start, my grandparents have built their home here on the other side of Howard Johnson Park and have been living in this area since the 60s and 70s. Uh they have raised my mother, her siblings, as well as their grandchildren, including myself. My grandfather was a proud military man and my mother as well. They were proud to be living here and creating the community that they were proud of, even only if it was just in their neighborhood. I have been a Minnesota resident since fifth grade, having gone to St. Rose of Lima Catholic School and then went to Dlesel High School in Minneapolis, a school that prides itself as a Lasalian school and that everyone deserves an education no matter who you are. Recently, I have seen how this affects many in our city as well as in our own communities. Not even within 24 hours of good being killed, one of my friends who runs the Gothis monthly goth night in the Twin Cities as well as their partner Anna were picked up by ICE agents last week off of central and lower Minneapolis. Videos of what happened have spread on social media accounts as well as posts of her community support and aid. Anne was released first but had medical attention due to a broken hand from the incident. My good college friend told me recently that ICE agents were in her apartment building and were there after all staff members have left for the day looking for people. She teaches at a university level and have been seeing students staying home and doing their classes via Zoom for their own safety. I've seen how has shaken up our communities, but I've also seen how it has brought us together to show us what other states have called Minnesota nice. Community outreach and supporting our neighbors has always been a way to show the golden rule, to treat others as you would like to be treated. I do not want to have to see my nephew having to have his parents explain why their friends are no longer going to school and the dangers that they are currently facing. I don't want to continue seeing my friends in my communities being picked up by ICE and no one knowing where they are or if they've been hurt. I implore you to keep ice out of our city and protect my neighbors because I've already seen it happen to others and I've seen it happen to my friends. Do not let good be a fleeting thought to our community and please do the right thing. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. >> Uh before I recognize the next speaker, the speaker after that would be Elise Coleman. Hello and welcome. >> Hi, thank you council. Um my name is Myra Reyes. Um, I am an immigrant. 11 years ago, I came to the US as an engineer following the American dream. When I decided to buy a house, I chose Roseville as the safest area in the northeast of the metro. I really opened the crime map and look for Rose and look at Roseville and it was the safest place that I could find. I've been living here for 5 years and a half and I have always felt very safe. This American dream ended last week for me. I no longer feel safe because of the color of my skin. I have to carry my US passport everywhere all the time, fearing that not even that will keep me safe as men with guns and masks are terrorizing residents. I'm here to ask you to please protect us all. I understand the separation ordinance might take longer than just breaking the law like ICE is doing, but please speed up this process. We are in a state of emergency. Please keep us safe now. Keep our community safe. Have the police witness what ICE is doing. Please keep us safe. Thank you for your time. >> Thank you for your comments. >> All right, before I recognize the next speaker, uh once again, that would be Elise Coleman. Uh the speaker after that would be Gina Garang Vanhoff. >> She just left. >> I think she had to go. >> Okay. >> Unless she's outside. >> All right. Feel feel free to come on up if you're prepared. Uh, and then after that would be Carrie. Carrie Wang would be next. Hello and welcome. >> Thank you so much. I am lost. I'm not prepared. But a piece of meat said, um, I got to speak because just being here, I actually came to learn and observe and my body is taking in a lot. You know, my back hurts. Um, my body is already feeling it. And I just want to for so many of you who don't know me, I am Gina Gurung Vamhaf. I am from Nepal and I came to this country with so much hope and excitement 15 years ago. I've only lived in Roseville. I've only worked in Roseville. I have a business in Roseville. I become a mother in Roseville. Everything I've done is in Roseville. And that has been become a joke. And uh today uh my words are less. It's because you guys have all said it all. You know, everybody saying with the right English, with the right accent, with the right right whatever. When the word those people, fearful people, hiding people, immigrant, those are those are giving me triggers today. And I am a citizen. I did everything right. 15 years you guys have been there for me and I've called this home and I think I've done my dues of showing up to this community. I called my good friend Kathy just few days ago saying, "Is this true? 3 or 4 days ago in the morning I walk at 5:30 in the morning and I said today for the first time I'm afraid to go for my walk and I still did and I will go tomorrow morning I'm ready to be dead but I will not stop because people see me as a light if we don't show up if I don't show up what will the other brownkinned men or women do so for all of you guys are doing the best at listening but please that every religion says there's been like you know so many things that you it's easy to listen and a piece I'm like do I really speak also said the sentence that came also was the lost time is never found and you guys have the time you guys have the power we have given you the power we trust you you know we are pleading you today Roseville is my home I love this city so much. And it's so hard to believe that there's so many people scared at my home, at your home, at our home. Home is not where we live to be fearful. That's all I want to say. And I just want I just will say that we are all here for you too. You know, make the right decision and please act as soon as you can. Thank you. >> Thank you for YOUR COMMENTS. RIGHT. AND after Carrie Wang, the next speaker would be uh Christina Cone. Hello and welcome. >> Good evening, council members. Uh my name is Carrie Wong. I live near >> I didn't mean to mispronounce. >> No worries. No worries. Uh I live near Keller Mayflower Park. Um I wasn't expecting to speak at this meeting, so I'm mostly winging it right now. Um, I've been in the Twin Cities for about 14 years and as of as as of a year ago, I became a homeowner and resident of Roseville and I love it here. Um, I support what others have recommended on strengthening the separation order. I'm not going to add too much uh more substantively to that uh which many of my neighbors and community members have already mentioned. I do want to advocate for something that would work well alongside the separation order. I'm not a privacy or cyber security or legal expert, but I want to talk a little bit about one source of data that uh ICE depends on. That is from automated license plate readers or ALPRs deployed by companies like Flock. These are AI powered cameras that capture and analyze images of all passing vehicles, storing details like your car's location, date, time, any identifying features, stickers, uh, roof racks, dents, um, and turning these into searchable data points. Um, these cameras are typically privately owned and the data is owned by Flock, a private company. And ICE can search months of movement history of people without a warrant. Um, so ICE might be able to query things like, "Show me every vehicle that visits this mosque or or place of worship." Um, or everyone who visits a clinic or a community center. Um, show me where this person goes every day. That's probably where they work. Um, it's totally understandable that residents are trying to minimize their time in public, not only to avoid direct contact with ice, but um, also because their movement patterns are likely being tracked for potential targeting later. There are about 800 known flock cameras in the Twin Cities metro area. Um, 10 of them identified in Roseville. There's one down the street on County C, a few around Harour Mall, a few around Rosedale, and scattered uh, everywhere else. Um, a stronger separation order would ideally limit the sharing of city data with ICE. ICE often accesses Flock data through local police portals with Flock. Um, but I also encourage the council to limit uh one of the fundamental data sources that are likely being used by ICE for immigration enforcement activity and that's not owned by the city. Um, so banning these kinds of uh AI powered cameras would be a twofor one opportunity. This is a meaningful way to protect citizens from ISIS harmful, illegitimate, and unprofessional so-called law enforcement activity. Um, but we'd also be protecting just the privacy of thousands of Roseville residents. So, uh, that's all I have. Thank you for your time. >> Thank you for your comments. Right. Before I recognize the next speaker, uh, the speaker, uh, following would be Victoria Sulia. Hello and welcome. So, I'm Christina Cone. Um, I am a Roseville resident. I could have walked here, but I drove here from work. Um, I work as a physician as a hospitalist. I care for both adults and children. Um, I'm proud that several of the other healthcare workers already spoke about several of the things that I hoped you guys would hear about today. Thinking about the effects on our children. I've cared for so many children who have had mental health crises over the years. Um and I expect that after this week I will care for many more and over the weeks to come um there will be more children who will be traumatized by these experiences. So the sooner you can act the better in my personal opinion. And as somebody who does hospital medicine I never get to prevent care uh harm. I only come in after harm has happened. Um, you guys have opportunities to also continue to mitigate harm and to do what you can uh to help people heal. Doing this listening time now is already part of that. But as we've said, we need to continue to do what we can to heal to prevent further injury. Um, in addition to being a hospitalist, I've worked for many years working with refugee patients specifically, hearing their stories of what they've gone through, what they've experienced, and helping them heal and become part of our communities. I had not anticipated that I would want to use those skills with my neighbors here who had never left. But that is something that we can and should do now. We should look at how do communities heal after they have experienced such things. Part of it includes documenting what has befallen the community. So when we talk about people hiding their faces, hiding behind darkness, darkness won't drive that out. Light does. We talked about not having information used against us as community members. We should also do the same to get the information that we can. So when that time comes, we can hold people accountable for the laws that they have broken. I'll yield my time. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments this evening. >> All right. And after the next speaker, the speaker after that would be um Bruce Orura Orca. And once again, apologies for misprononunciations. Hello and welcome. >> Hi, my name is Victoria Soya and I am a Roseville um resident. I am also a first nations out of South Dakota. Um this I want to share a short story with you uh what happened this last weekend. I took my older son. Um he has graduated from the University of Minnesota. He went to Roseville High School. Uh both my boys did. I'm very proud of them. Um we've built a life here for our kids and it's been a good life. I took my son with me out to visit relatives in Sicon, South Dakota. On our way home, we got to um around St. Cloud and my phone started blowing up with messages, with emails, with Facebook, and it was all, "Are you okay? Where are you? Are you safe? Please don't answer your door. They're going door to door with guns. Uh, please make sure you have your tribal ID, your make sure that your husband has a photo copy of all of your identification. And I looked at my son and we were in St. Cloud and we had pulled into a takaria, like a taco place there. And I looked at him. I said, "Do we go forward and go home or do you and I turn around and go back to Sisin, South Dakota and wait this out?" And he looked at me, he says, "Mom, I have to go to work tomorrow." And I said, "So do I." And he goes, "We're going to go home. I want to come home to a safe city. I trust that you guys will make it. So, I want to come home. I want everyone to be able to come home every evening to a safe city, to safe homes, to families they love, and not to be living in fear. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments this evening. >> Right. And before I recognize the next speaker, the speaker after that would be uh Aliyah Barry, I believe is how it's pronounced. Um, and I did want to note once again that we've got a number of open seats here in the council chambers. Uh, and I understand if folks are more comfortable out in the hallway. I'm not forcing anybody to do anything they don't want to do. Uh, but we do have those seats available if folks that are out uh in the overflow area do want to uh come into the chambers. Totally at your option. Uh, hello and welcome. Thank you for your being here this evening. And um, we look forward to your comments. >> Hi, I'm Bruce Ona. Uh I live on Levelville Avenue in Roseville for 24 years. I'm a volunteer at um nursing home and um we may want to look at some of the good uh aspects of immigration and consider them. Um, how many knew that at 518 unit 2 on Levelvel Avenue, we had human trafficking going on there? Were you aware in this city council that we have human trafficking going on in Roseville at 518-2? And um I consider human trafficking slavery. And so uh when we have slavery going on in this city, like I'm going to take action, some sort of action. I'm not going to allow it to continue. Um, we had 12 unmarked vehicles come to that unit and young Asian girls were rescued from the slave holders. Now, would you support these illegal protesters who are blocking ICE? Would you support them blocking ICE? ICS's ability to rescue these young Asian girls from slavery? Seriously, you would block them. Then I guess you think slavery is okay. Um, how about murderers and rapists and child rapists that were among those arrested by ICE? Do we really want to block ICE from arresting these violent repeat offenders who are a threat to public safety in Roseville? Perhaps we've waited too long to get ICE involved. We should do something for the people here to keep public safety. Perhaps we should build headquarters for ICE here in Roseville. We could maybe renovate the Department of Education that's I think is sitting empty and we could save a lot of taxpayer money. If if uh Roseville police and ICE and Border Patrol work together, they can avoid making unfair arrests and they can more target the truly criminal public safety threats that we all want removed from our neighborhoods and our society. So, I would say not to adopt the separation ordinance. Um, based on some of those thoughts about good immigration policy, we have federal immigration laws in this nation. And the Democrats and the Republicans passed those laws. And those laws are for the benefit of the people to protect immigrants, to protect illegal immigrants, to protect citizens, to protect everyone from the criminal element. >> All right. Uh, sir, you're at four minutes now, so I'm going to ask you to >> Oh, is that right? >> Yes. >> Okay. Um, I love immigrants and foreigners of all colors. I also want immigrants and foreigners of all colors to be protected from repeat offenders. And um, you know, we saw Tomas Espen. >> Uh, thank you for your comments. You have exceeded your time quite a bit here. >> Thank you. And, uh, thank you for listening and I appreciate everyone's comments. Thank you. And before I recognize the next speaker, uh the uh speaker after that will be Leila Naro, I believe. >> Hello and welcome. >> Hi there. Um my name is Aaliyah. I'm going to refrain from using my last name just because I don't want to like put my family in any danger by speaking. Uh I've grown up in Roseville since I got here when I was like eight and stuff. Um, born and raised Minnesota, went to Rams, Ros. I'm an older sister, and I have two younger siblings who have both been in the Roseville district and are currently in the Roseville district. And I come to you now with the mindset of love and a lot of hope. Um, but I am very afraid and I just want to add more to I guess the perspective and just current state of where we're at. Um, I have uh smudges of numbers written on my arms in the case that I do get detained, numbers of people that I love, uh, my best friends, uh, my girlfriend, my mom, the lawyers guild. Um, the first time I had training on how to handle ICE, which I can't even believe that we're in the situation that we're currently in. I would have thought that when ICE first got here that we would do something about it. There is absolutely no need for us to have people who are actively being abductive abducted um people who are being murdered by these terrorists. Um, I'm sorry. I'm like really nervous. Um, >> take your time. >> Yeah. Uh, it's just it's really it's really it's really scary. Um, for one, I am a US citizen and I am a mixed black woman and I am terrified for not only myself but for my friends who come from immigrant parents. Uh, I'm terrified for my father who is a black man. I'm terrified for my younger siblings. Uh on Friday I had to rush out of work because we got a call that ICE is in the surrounding area near Ros and I have been told that I actively cannot call the police by the rapid response line that I use because police are possibly or actively working with ICE. Um I already don't trust the police as a black woman, but I'm more afraid of ICE than I am the police. And so I'd at least like to have that support in this. um the fact that I as a 20-year-old had to go and patrol and look out for ICE agents um in the hopes that um there would be none and that I wouldn't have to worry about my friend's family being abducted or uh my brother's girlfriend being abductive. Um the only safety I truly feel is when I'm in my home or when I'm in my car. But because I am a citizen, I need to do my due diligence and protecting my immigrant community. And as we can see, our community is showing up. And so I just ask that you show up as well. You guys are in this position because you guys are here to take action. You guys have a sense of power that we don't have. We need you to take that power. That's I guess all I uh have to say. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. Before I recognize the next speaker, uh the speaker after that uh would be uh Joan uh or Joanne D or Dao. >> Um hi, my name is Leila Nayo. Um I'm 20 years old and of my 20 years of life, I have spent 19 in Roseville. I was born here. I was raised here. Um that was my best friend Aaliyah. We've known each other for the past nine years and we've spent a lot of time in this city. Um, and as we got older and we we started going places and hanging out in the city, if we ever doubted our safety, we could always fall back on the thought that it's okay, we're in Roseville, we're safe. That thought has now gone from it's okay, we're in Roseville to we can't go outside because we're in Roseville. It's not necessarily that we we just feel like we're in danger. We are in danger. I'm a cit I'm a citizen here. I was born here. I'm also the child of immigrants. My parents came here legally. They are citizens. Um, but I'm scared every day when my mom goes to work and I'm watching her location to make sure she gets home. There is currently um a humanitarian crisis going on in Tigra. And if me or my family were to get sent back, I say back as if I've ever been there before, but if me or my family were to get sent back, we would likely be killed. It's not safe. Um, my parents went through due process. It's not fair that they are walking around in fear of their lives. And even if they didn't, we're seeming to forget that people who came here illegally are still human. These are still people, you know, like they shouldn't have to walk around in fear that they are going to get kidnapped and sexually assaulted by the federal government. This is completely inhumane. And I'm reading here that members of the department are authorized to assist ICE when it is related to scene safety andor the safety of ICE employees as they're performing their duties. um pro protecting people with guns who are standing in bulletproof vests against the citizens of your community is completely ludicrous. Um a quote from Becca Good, Rene's Renee Good's wife, um from the day that she was murdered, she said, "They had guns. We had whistles." All they had was whistles to warn people in the surrounding area that they were in danger. Their lives were in danger. Protecting the people with with the guns and the bulletproof vests over the people who have spent years building and fostering this community of of love and hope is is wild completely and I hope to see you guys step up. Um, I am also completely in favor of um the separation ordinance and and joining in the lawsuit that Minnesota has began against the Trump administration. Um, I want to see our people protected. I want to see our black and brown citizens protected. I want to see our immigrants protected. I just want to see our people protected. And we have to know at this point um If you stand for nothing, you will fall for everything. Thank you. >> Before I recognize the next speaker, the speaker after that would be Phil Norcross. Hello and welcome. >> Hello. Um, my name is Joanne Dao. I am a resident here in Roseville. I have been here long enough to see Mayor Rose's entire mayorship. I have been here long enough that Wayne, Commissioner Wayne Gra and I were on the same human rights commission and served many years together. I am I have been in the city long enough that I've gone to school with comm uh council member Julie Stron's children. Okay. My parents bought a house in Roseville in 1994. I have been here the entire time of my existence. And so we have been longtime residents, taxpayers, I am the child of refugees from wartime. So while I am so um incredibly moved, I came here late and I know having been at this oval table back in, you know, the mid2010s how long these meetings can go. I have been here when we made the ordinance and made a stance on the was it um marriage equality act and the room was just as packed if not more so in 2012 as it is today. Now I also know the history of Roseville. This was a Levit town. This is a this was a place where neighbors would uh commit to redlinining to buying houses where black and brown people could not buy a house. I lived knowing the level of racism in this city firsthand. I know the level of inadequacy and the what we hide behind for bureaucracy firsthand being part of this human rights commission and why I left. I am immediately surprised by all the members, all the neighbors, all the citizens that have shown up today that helps maybe rewire what I think about Roseville even though I have been here the entire time. How it's changed where my neighbors are more brown, my neighbors are equally as educated, um we have more professors from the University of Minnesota choosing here, we have younger families coming here. And so for the longest time, Roseville was this old retirement um city where I had gone to school, where I had participated in um sports, where I had participated in writing grants for the Roseville Foundation. I want I didn't plan to come in today. I would like to believe that for people I used to call colleagues esteemed so people I looked up to people who worked on projects on immigration just as much as I have to take a much stronger stance than what has been put on the table today. we cannot support ICE and for the fact that I'm hearing that the entire council has been hemming and hawing deciding and I understand there's bureaucracy involved but to even hide behind the hesitancy for what it stands tells me a lot about this council it says a lot to the people here I trust in the people of Roseville what has been shown today tells me a lot of how we care about each other how we've care and we've continued to care about each other and how it's shifting. I'm urging the council to see this shift and actually stand by the people because I'm looking at you as people not only as your friend, as your colleague, but also as your resident. And what you do after this tells me everything I need to know. You don't have to tell me pretty speeches. Everyone will know. I yield my time. >> Thank you. And after Mr. Norcross, the next speaker would be Noel Bakan. >> Hello and welcome. >> Hi, I'm Phil Norcross. I've lived just a few doors away from McCarron's Lake Park for 30 years. And I come at the urging of my grandson. He doesn't know it, but we're uh lately we've been in the habit of cutting up cardboard boxes to make cars and trucks and houses and castles. And the other day he said, "Grandpa, do you know how to make a trap for bad guys?" I says, "What bad guys?" He says, "You know, like you dope, it's obvious. You know, the Trump police who are coming to kill Americans." >> And after I caught my breath, I promised him that I would work on it. And uh I hope we all will. Um and it's not enough to I don't think you know much of what we talk about here is the city not helping ICE. That's not enough. We need to defy those bastards as loudly and as meanly as we can. And if it means breaking a few rules or even a few laws, good. It's worth it. And a note to one of the previous speakers, um, the idea that opposing ICE is the same as promoting sex slavery is just preposterous. What ICE what what policing like ICE does is it forces us forces us to fight the people who should be arresting the sex traffickers, but they're making it impossible for us to work with them. It's just like it reminds me a lot of the ICE agents going into an apartment building and pulling the fire alarm. next time that building catches fire, people are going to die because they're afraid to leave. And and I and I'm struggling in my head to find a nice way to make that analogy and I can't, but it's it's very very similar arrangement. These are these guys are very bad. And trying to fight guys that bad while being good takes a lot of creativity. Some of it under the table. Maybe. And so if your rules, you know, say it's going to take 10 days to do this, well, maybe it's time to uh look the other way. >> Thank you. Thank you for your comments. >> All right. And our next speaker after this speaker will be um I should just keep these on. Elizabeth Omiso or Omiso. >> Hello council members. Uh my name is Noel Bachan. I live on Carol Place in Roseville. I'm been a resident of Roseville with my husband here for 11 years. We have owned our house in Roseville as of o uh Halloween this year for 10 years. Um, I'm also a member of the Rice and Larpenter Alliance, which is an organization that supports immigrant residents and businesses in the Rice and Larpender area. And most importantly, and unusually, I'm also a staff member of the city of Roseville. I've been in front of this council many times as a staff member. This is the first time I've ever been here as a resident. Um, when I was first considering a career in public service, I often wondered whether I should, as a white woman, be doing this job and taking up space for a non-white person who could provide more lived experiences and understanding to the communities I was hoping to serve. But as I listened to the speakers at home online tonight, I realized this was a moment for me to use my privilege and speak for those communities that are vulnerable to ICE in our area. I've carried around these know your rights cards in my purse since February 2025 and I no longer know if these will work. Now I carry a whistle, you know, there it is. Uh, thanks to Kathy and Do Good Roseville's efforts, I carry that now because I don't think that knowing your rights really seems to matter anymore. Um, I want to affirm all the things that have been said so far already with a couple of exceptions. And I want to urge our police department to just focus on protecting our residents. And not only our residents, as staff members are very well aware, we have over 17,000 plus people that come into our city every single day to work, to recreate. It's not just Roseville residents that are affected by this. There are thousands of people that are being put at risk by the actions of ICE. And so I strongly support a separation ordinance as a resident um and that our PD protects our residents whether they are documented or not. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. >> Before I recognize the next speaker, uh the speaker after that would be uh Carrie Gelli. Hello and welcome. >> Um my name is Elizabeth Omiso. I was born and raised in Roseville. I have lived many places, but I chose to move back here and raise my young multi-racial family here in Roseville. Um, we have loved the community here and um, I want to urge you to take action. The actions of the ICE agents in the Twin Cities have created a situation of public safety hazards and human rights violations. They have not been following the laws. And now nobody is safe, whether they are legal citizens or not. I urge you to not allow the city of Roseville in aiding ICE agents or even allowing them to use city property or resources. The Roseville Police Department is supposed to protect this community, not the ICE agents that are terrorizing the people here and not following the laws. They are the criminals. This is not benefiting the community. Please consider joining with the lawsuit with Minneapolis and St. Paul. Uh we need ICE out of Roseville and out of Minnesota. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. Right. And before I recognize uh the next speaker, the speaker after that uh would be uh Brooks Fluger Levit is my attempt. Hello and welcome. >> Hello. So I'm Carrie Galley. Um so you can see me for a minute and then I'm just trying to not get sick again because I was sick over Christmas. So, not I don't have germs, but I'm going to protect myself from germs. >> Um, so thank you for allowing me to speak. Um, >> and I'm longtime Roseville resident, live near uh Dale and 36. Um, and I wasn't planning to speak either. I knew there I was hopeful there'd be a generosity of speakers and there has been. Um, but if babies and children and teenagers can speak tonight, um, if immigrants can come and speak tonight, if people can leave their homes, um, from watching the stream and come and speak tonight, I can speak. So, I appreciate everyone's courage. Um, and I hope to not duplicate what's already been said. Um, so just briefly a little bit about me. I've lived I have chosen to live in Roseville. I came here from another place. Um, longtime Minnesota resident. Um, a US citizen. My family's been in the states for generations, but I've lived in Roseville 36 years. I've raised two kids to, um, their mid30s. They went K12 in the district. Um, I've been a substitute teacher in the district. And, um, I work at I'll be working at the high school tomorrow um, and Thursday. Um, so let me keep track of my thoughts. All right. So, um, as you've seen and heard from, um, what our Roseville citizens are testifying to firsthand, right? Like Sarah, uh, I can't even list all the people, but we have enough evidence that due process is not being followed. We have enough evidence that ICE is acting illegally. So, you know, some people might, well, are they really? We You've heard the testimony. Um, and you know, I don't know if you're like me, but I'm like a fan of the legal TV shows, and my family knows like my guilty pleasure is Judge Judy. So, um, I'm like thinking very analytically in that we have the evidence. Um, and um, I just do not want I don't want to experience what Sarah experienced if I go to Aldi, which I do a lot. Um, I don't want to accidentally be next to the wrong vehicle. Um, I don't want to experience what Renee Good experienced. Um, but as as a privileged white woman, US citizen, these are the thoughts going through my head. Um, and I certainly would echo what everyone else has said, but um, I guess what I want to say, and actually, by the way, I want to thank Council Member Bower for putting this on our agenda tonight. Um, and I really want to thank all the community members that have flooded the chambers and the overflow area. Um, but I don't want to experience those things. I don't want it for any of our fellow citizens or any of the babies, the children, the immigrants that have already spoken. But I want to say we are a hair's breath away. We are a hair's breath away from somebody in Roseville dying and it might happen like before we wake up tomorrow or it might happen on Wednesday. So my point is um multiple people asked for it. I'm just echoing it. Um, please accelerate your procedures. Please, let's not wait 10 days. Please not let's not, you know, I I don't know if this is accurate. You guys will let us know. There could be an emergency meeting called. Whatever is the right procedure to accelerate this. Roseville is in a state of emergency. It's a state of emergency. Um, so I'm asking you to accelerate it, get something to happen fast. And what I would say also come from corporate America. I understand bureaucracy. I understand um strategy and analysis and making a plan. That plan is already done. The homework has been done. Um, if we go back to 2016 and 2017, as has already been mentioned, >> above 420. >> Oh, I'm so sorry you guys. Let me just super quick. super quick. The work's been done. Go back to the documents and the conversation from 2016 and 2017. Um, and go to the petition from Linda Gridley. Go to the indivisible um resources. They tell you what can be done. I don't want ICE anywhere in our city. Um, we can all we can give 33,000 whistles out there or we could actually ban ICE from being here. So, anyway, thank you. I appreciate the extra time. Before I recognize the next speaker, the speaker after that will be uh Gustav Beaton. >> Hello and welcome. >> So, hello. My name is Brooks. Uh I am not actually a resident of Roseville by the quirk of about 200 yards down the street. Uh but Roseville has been the center of both my life, social life, and my career for the past decade and more. Uh I support a stronger separation order and the other mother measures proposed uh particularly including joining the lawsuit uh launched or announced just today by Minneapolis St. Paul and the state. Uh however, I want to talk about something slightly different. Uh that this is not just about ICE. This is not just about immigration. When I was at the federal building last week again after having to go there to protest ICE numerous times in past years, I was struck by a difference. The difference in uniforms and in personnel. Few or no city police as there had been in the past. Still DHS agents and federal security personnel. That's their building. But overwhelmingly, there were militarized border patrol agents in tactical gear, as well as people without IDs of any kind, but still armed and equipped for a war zone, pretending to be or possibly being law enforcement or federal agents. I want to underscore that everything that is happening right now is not just about ICE and it is not just about immigration. That is only their excuse this time. We all know it is about power and control and lack of accountability. The actions of this administration to block local and state investigations into the murder of Renee Good by one of their agents only underscores this. As do the agents day-to-day efforts to conceal their own identities on foot and in vehicles. This direction is coming directly from their superiors. We know this from documents that have been published by DHS. And as city administrators, regardless of your political beliefs about this, about any particular issue, accountability is part of your job. Even if you do not feel personally threatened by the administration's current rhetoric, there will be other issues and there will be other cases of federal overstep and there'll be other examples of accountability being unable to be performed because you cannot or are not able to overcome federal uh opposition in identifying who is responsible. This undercuts everyone's safety. Uh even just as I had finished writing what I was going to say a few moments ago, I received some messages from friends that there were once again right-wing agitators, Proud Boys and others like them who were threatening legal observers. This has happened in the past, but there's a crucial difference now. We cannot be sure of the difference because many people, many of the agents involved in these stops, are not wearing any outright identification, are driving powerful muscle vehicles and driving recklessly on our roads. These are all things that the police department should in fact be enforcing and it's something they can do right now to make everyone safer. >> Right. And I have to apologize. I I didn't time your remarks, but >> I have that was my main point. It is not just about immigration. It is about lack of accountability and control. >> All right. Thank you for your comments this evening. >> Before I recognize the the next speaker, uh the speaker after that will be uh Cynthia Miller. Uh and then the last person signed up is Darwin Isdall. And I just wanted to note that we are approaching our 10:00 meeting curfew uh this evening and all of us have been here for four hours or more. Uh and and so if it's uh all right, I I think uh we will make Mr. Isdall the last speaker uh because that's the last person I have signed up here. Um >> pardon me. >> Oh, I'm sorry. >> We need to make a motion to >> Not quite yet. Uh we've got a few minutes here. So uh um I will recognize uh Mr. Beaton. Uh, and then once again, Miss Miller will be next. Hello, Mr. Beaton. Welcome. >> Hi. Uh, I'm a longtime Rose resident. Uh, as you heard, um, Gusto beaten Gus. Um, and I'm also an anthropology student here at the University of Minnesota, Minneapolis. Now, I am damn proud of being a motan and of being a Twin Cities boy. Um, I'm also a German speaker, as were many of my ancestors as recently as the 1980s, and my German speaking great-grandfather fought in the Pacific theater of the Second World War. Now being a German speaker and a student history means I can't help but remember one thing and that is history is always watching. It watches me. It watches you and it watches all of us. There are things it forgets. Most people who I guess I'm sort of distantly related to don't know that their you know families were German farmers not even 100 years ago. Um and they're really not aware of their ancestry or family history. But what is not forgotten by history is what sides we take as people living through it. Now, we're a small suburb of the Twin Cities. We're not we're not even 50,000 people. Um, I don't think. And our actions really only speak loudly when they are truly significant. And if we are remembered for doing nothing, for sitting or letting our people be terrorized, what will they say about the city of Roseville, about its people, about us, but all of us? I urge you to adopt the separation resolution. We don't really have another choice if we want to be remembered and not as seen as part of the problem and of the movement that has terrorized this country and this state in particular and our cities here. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. Uh and once again the last person I have signed up uh to speak after Miss Miller is Darwin Doll. Hello and welcome. >> Hi, thank you for this opportunity. My name is Cynthia Miller. I've lived in the Twin Cities for about 30 years, but the last eight years in Roseville, it's the longest I've ever lived in one place since I've been here. Um, I was a little disappointed though to hear that in 2017, just before I moved here, that uh action was not taken to, uh, secure a separation that is as strong as it should be today. But, uh, as the granddaughter of an immigrant, I could tell you a story about that. but instead I decided to tell you something that's more local and more up to-date. I am in my 11th year as a Girl Scout leader. I love it. Uh it's one of the things I'm most passionate about and in the last week the problem that is coming up in our forums in our Facebook groups is what do we do about cookie season? And that may seem like a small thing, but I know all of you love cookies. My daughter has sold cookies in the Roseville area for the last eight years. But we have leaders in South Minneapolis who say, "My families will not allow our girls to go doortodoor." Uh, many of you have maybe walked into a Cub and saw your local friendly girl scouts at what we call a cookie booth. And others are saying, "Do we do cookie booths? What do I do if I have daisies and brownies who are five to seven years old and ICE comes in and starts to do something? How do I protect them? How do I keep them from this? What if they're coming after one of my kids? What do I do? And I'm also a leader trainer and we have no answers for them. My troop is high schoolers. They're very active. I'm sure they'll be walking out this week at some point at their various high schools. I don't have to worry about their safety, but they worry about their younger scouts. And some of you may not know that the last time we fought fascists in World War II, the Girl Scouts rose up to help their country and their communities. They grew victory gardens. They taught other people how to grow victory gardens. They collected the food from the victory gardens to pass out. They rolled bandages. They created babysitting clubs so that the women who were going to work because the men were overseas would have somebody to take care of their children. They learned first aid. They learned how to spot airplanes. I'm not so much sure about Minnesota because it would have taken a lot for a, you know, an access plane to get to Minnesota, but they learned these things. And now we're fighting fascists again, but they're here. They're us. And we don't know what to say to these kids. We don't know how to tell them how to be protected. All we can say is part of the Girl Scout law is respect authority. Look to your leaders. You're our leaders in Roseville. We don't have other people to look to. So again, as many of the white women had said, despite what happened last week, I feel fine. I feel good. I feel safe. But I've got kids, my own and other people's that I have signed up to help and guide and protect. And we need your help with that as well. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. Hello and welcome. >> Thanks. My name is Darwin Isdall. I am uh I live on in the Midland Hills area of Roseville. Um and uh I I certainly didn't intend to speak, let alone be the last speaker, but here I am. So, um what I want to I've only been a Roseville resident since October. Uh and unlike one of the other earlier speakers, I didn't do my research. which I didn't u you know know much about Roseville. It just happens to be where I found a place to live. And so you wonder you know how what is the community going to be like? um what is the leadership going to be like, you know, and so far just sitting here tonight, I've been so proud of the uh people that have spoke spoken and uh you know, it it really makes me feel like it was a good decision that we really picked a great community to go to. And I don't know what's the history. I don't know any of you as far as where you stand on things, your history. So, I'm coming in fresh with uh an opinion to see, you know, um where who who will I vote for, who is, you know, the the uh the people I stand with, who are the people that I I disagree with. Um but, uh you know, we'll we'll find out. A lot of this is going to come down to this kind of thing. And I strongly disagree that uh stopping human trafficking or any of that some of these these people that were had deportation orders since 1996. Why are they still here? Can we not catch them with our law enforcement? Is it a matter of if we put this budget for the ICE toward local law enforcement? Can we get you know we nobody wants human trafficking. I I'm sure every speaker here does not want that. It's It's just a logical fallacy to say it's going to take terrorizing all of the communities, uh, people of color and all that to catch a human trafficking ring in one particular building, that kind of thing. So, um I I don't again I don't know the history behind um this group. I don't know much of the history behind Roseville, but I do know that this is the time that we need to step up and do everything. Whether it's a separation ordinance, whether it's the standing be standing with the cities, the city of Minneapolis lawsuit or Henipin County or whatever that lawsuit is, Minnesota maybe. Um, anything we can do, get creative as far as that goes. We do. We cannot be terrorizing our neighbors, our fellow citizens. There's other ways to do this. Um, if it's if it's crime we want to stop, let's find other ways to do that. This is not stopping crime, is creating crime. And I urge you, and I hate to say this, but I urge you to protect our neighbors from our federal government. That's really what we're doing. And I do appreciate your opening comments, Mayor Ro. It's uh it's it's good to hear that. So I I I urge you to make us proud. Thanks for your time. >> Thank you for your comments. >> Do want to note uh hating to get back to bureaucracy, but uh we do have a rule about our meetings ending at 10:00 unless we do take a vote to extend them. Um I also know that we had a number of things uh planned on our agenda this evening. And I think it's fair to say uh that uh probably uh other than this item, I'm going to look to Mr. Trejudge. Is there anything else we need to take action on this evening that we really must uh include uh before we finish? >> Yes, it would be the Axon contract. >> The Axon contract. Okay. >> The only things we need to >> I I think we're going to have to probably defer the uh EDA completely and hopefully that that uh can work with things and certainly we can schedule EDA meetings. >> We still need to talk about it. So you shouldn't leave that. >> Excuse me, counselor. We we can schedule EDA meetings at any time we wish and so that that that's we can do some flexibility there if we need some time sensitive things >> go forward >> right um I do want to uh ask the council for a motion to extend and I believe it would be for uh 8A and uh 7B. Is that correct? >> Second. >> All right. It's been moved by council member Grath to extend the meeting for those two items. Seconded by council member Stron. Uh I can't remember at this point on our rules if we're we allow discussion on a motion to extend. Uh all those in favor signify by saying I I opposed. That passes unanimously. We'll extend the meeting for those two items. >> Um and the council uh we can either take a short break or we can continue. >> All right. We're going to take about a fivem minute break then. All right. Sorry. We've been here before. All right, we're back from a short break. Uh, and, uh, the two remaining items on our agenda are item 8A, uh, which is the, uh, council direction on the future agenda item, uh, initiated by council member Bower, uh, related to ICE, and then also item, uh, 7B, which is the, uh, axon contract. And I was reminded that we had a member of the public to speak to that and so we'll make sure and provide for that opportunity. Um, as to uh item 8A, Council Member Bower's uh item, um, I'm going to make a suggestion to the council and and see if this uh is workable, uh, that we take, uh, the, uh, document from council member Stron, uh, provided before the meeting and then also the petition and use that as the basis for, uh, seeking uh, insight and in and information from our legal council as well as staff uh, as to those various items uh, and potentially uh, the drafting of of perhaps uh, some sort of ordinance language with options uh or whatever makes the most sense that we can publish notice of and meet those requirements uh to the extent that we are going to do that. Um as was requested by some folks in the audience. Um and so uh then the direction would be that the staff come come back a with the information in response to those various items. Um, and then also looking at timing, uh, and whether this is something that comes back on the 26th or if we if we are able to schedule something, uh, prior to that as a special meeting. Um, and I don't know that we know the answer this evening as to that. So, we're going to have to probably depend on staff a little bit and the attorney to see what their time frame works out to be or looks like and how we can uh how we can work that. Uh, and I'll defer to either Mr. Treor, Miss Tierney, uh, with some feedback as to that suggested approach uh, to make sure that that is workable from your perspectives. >> Sure. Well, we need to know what you want us to do. So, it may be hard to um, say exactly what the time frame would be. I would mention that uh, the ordinance that's been talked about or any type of ordinance >> under state law, we required to post it for 10 days. So, it's not a local thing. So, I I'm not quite sure if we can get around that, but we could have special meetings uh as early as next week to consider language to kind of get that motion rolling unless you give us very specific directions on on what language you like to see and we can try to expedite expedite it, but I don't think we can work around the state law uh that says to that. Um and then obviously any policies or other information you want, we can come back as soon as we're able to gather it. But I guess it depends a little bit about what you're looking for. Well, I think the the the the fallback would certainly be the meeting on the scheduled meeting on the 26th. Um, but I I wanted to, you know, give the opportunity, I guess, for more expeditious work, but I don't know how long. I didn't want to prescribe that, you know, we pick a a date and time that that didn't work for for staff or the attorney in terms of providing that feedback. And I think it's important uh that we have an understanding of how the how all those various requested actions um you know can be accomplished um and then impacts you know on the city and the ability to do those things or even if they're relevant to the city's powers that we have and those types of things. Um and so it would be important I think to have that information in order to to consider something. I think what council member Bowerer asked for and I'm certainly going to defer to you on on that is the request based on the use of the facilities for certain purposes. Uh and that maybe is a baseline for ordinance language and then if there's other things that make sense to incorporate into an ordinance uh that that may be uh something where we can we can tie some things together at the recommendation of staff and our our attorney if that makes sense. Uh Council Bower, your thoughts and then open it up for the rest of the council. >> That is correct. Mayor, when looking at this, I was initially looking at one, our policy has been around since 2017. It's uh does seem to be serving. I know that we have not been involved with ICE at all. Uh our police department and talking with other council members and other cities uh the same. It's one of the issues that we have is unlike other law enforcement agencies at the state and federal levels, they just don't work with us. So, we have no idea. So, that policy is serving us uh at least serving there. So having something uh brought back uh taking a little bit time, analyzing it, bringing it back uh would be the correct thing. I brought up not using city property just because that is something that most likely is something that we can put in. Um doing analysis of figuring out what other limitations we're able to do will require additional legal work both far as US statutes and Minnesota statutes. So that will take time just like it took time for uh the Minnesota Attorney General to bring forth their lawsuit uh which they filed today. I was looking at that lawsuit but it wasn't filed yet when I had to leave here. So I believe that that would cover all of Minnesota. But going forward, yes, I would direct uh city staff to at a minimum look at uh adding something to our policy to not use city resources. Uh and that being uh data um what I also said data resources and people and see if we can add that in there as well as what other limitations are possible. We did receive a petition here. There were some things in there. Um I will note that in that petition it um did not have statutes or other things for us to reference. So it will take us time to go through that. Also, it did look like um we are a plan B city and some of the with a weak mayor and some of the things that they noted in there uh don't necessarily or are able in my opinion to apply here, but I would defer to the attorney for that. All that will take some time. So I'm uh comfortable with what you propose, mayor. Um and I would encourage that if it's done uh sooner that we uh look to uh meet sooner as well. >> Oh, for sure. Yes. Uh council member Strong. So I presented um in kind of in summary of the 50 plus emails that we received from residents um a summary of nine different points as you all received. This is very similar to what is individually composed in a um separation ordinance. And just for the public's note, the only person on this council who was um on the council in 2017 was the mayor. Actually, the rest of us were not on the council at that time and not part of a decision-m um in that particular time. Um but very specific items. Um this is not it. What's presented? Is that what is listed? Oh no. Yeah. >> Yeah. So, um, some of the things that were presented were, um, items, and this was also after consultation with someone who advised the city of Falcon Heights after the killing of Philando Castillo, um, on what items they had for their separation policy with the, uh, police um, and their ultimate decision to no longer employ the St. Anthony police. So, these items are kind of a summation between those. the one item that has been um so this does include many of the items that were addressed today by people including the real-time data requests. I think that does speak somewhat to those flock cameras that were mentioned. Um that the not denying use of the data, but that they wouldn't be available in real time for someone to be um actively used against them and that to include no city staff, including the city police um to participate in civil immigration uh enforcement. And so then really making more actions out of um um council member uh Bower's um piece, but also then going on taking some of the items that were suggested and um put into place in Minneapolis. And if as a weak mayor, I'm sorry to say it again. >> It's the name of the system. What can I do? >> I'm not sure that you're in a position to be able to write a have an executive order as they did in the strong mayor scenario. >> Certainly. Um, but I think some of the things that people mentioned and the reason I kept it in there was the um the covered face masks. There was some concern about whether or not that was enforcable. But I think it I would see it more as an ability for residents of Roseville to be able to differentiate the Roseville people. >> And I do have to stop. We have to sort of have a differentiation between putting this on a future agenda and having the discussion then and having a discussion now. So, and I understand you're just kind of listing things off, but I I just want to be careful that we don't sort of >> cross over that, >> right? Um, so if there's no objection, then that would be the direction to staff uh as as we've outlined here. >> Can you repeat that again? So, it's very clear. >> So, once again, um at a at a at a basis, it would be uh council member Bower's uh recommended language related to the specific items in his request. Uh and then uh to the extent that uh items that are on the list uh from council member Stron and the petition relate to ordinance uh and are appropriate to be done with an ordinance that can be looked at as additional ordinance language. Um and then uh feedback as to some of these other things that are maybe staff actions or policies or things like that. uh so that we can understand how those things uh need to be adjusted because certainly uh changes to that policy 413 for example by our own resolution do require council approval and so we would certainly want to make sure that we uh we incorporate that. Uh and the one thing I'll just note about that having been the only person that was here in 2017 is that it was a a a pretty different ICE at that time. Um and so the the notion was um you know that we wanted to make sure that we were providing a safe situation more broadly and certainly the the the the other part of that language was the the public was the the uh people to be protected. So um but anyway that being said I'm I'm now straying from what I said I didn't want us to be doing. So, uh, have you I think that's the direction that we've got to staff and the attorney and hopefully I've articulated in a way that at 10:20 in the evening, uh, staff can follow. >> So, we will, uh, follow up on Council Member Bower's uh, um, requests as part of the case as well as council member Stron's listing of items. We'll come back at a future meeting and um, provide information uh, options, considerations for the council to consider. So, as a minimum, I think there should be some sort of draft ordinance related to council member Ber's request. If there are options to add to that ordinance, I think those should be provided. Uh, if those are recommended as ordinance language, uh, if there are other ways to address some of the things, uh, then those can be recommended, I would say. Um, whether it's policy changes or other things. Um, and it's it's also the petition items, I think, just to make sure we don't miss something that was brought forward. Uh, both the list from council meron and and the petition items. Is that what the council is understanding? >> Yes. >> Okay. All right. >> Just for clarification on the public's um part then. So we're looking at bringing back some draft language. Then it would be 10 days after that draft language were be to be adopted. >> Well, I think if the as I understand the state statute, please uh correct me if I'm wrong, we only have to notice the consideration of an ordinance and certainly provide the draft that we're going to be considering. If it includes a number of options, that gives us the ability to decide which items to include and which items not to include ultimately. So that and please once again correct me if I'm not getting that right. Mayor, I think that you have it right that you would need to you need to have an ordinance on uh an ordinance published 10 days in advance. Um but that you're not locked into that ordinance as to what you adopt. I'm I'm a little concerned um with the idea that there would be kind of maybe language in there. >> Well, I guess it would be, you know, you could certainly draft it as an ordinance inclusive of a bunch of things and then we could certainly decide if we want to include all those things or not. Um that was my only thought. Or there could be two alternates to consider or something along those lines. I wasn't I wasn't looking at it as necessarily sort of a laundry list to pick from or maybe language, but rather that we had something that was out there for the public to uh understand. We were be be considering um that gave us the ability to look at what we wanted to do. So if it's a if it's a draft that includes a lot of things and we have the ability to to adjust if if we so uh consider that appropriate or or or includes uh two alternatives or something like that. That's that's really what I was talking about. >> And so are you asking that I work with staff and that we create an ordinance based on staff recommendations of those options with some perhaps some legal advice included or how? So, so >> I'm just not and maybe I don't want to step on Mr. Trojan's totes here, but I'm just trying to understand how we make the judgment calls about what should be in the ordinance. >> Well, I I guess some things uh that are being requested may be most appropriate handled through staff policies or things like that. I don't believe that we need to put those things in an ordinance. I think if there are things that should be enforcable by an ordinance, you know, hopefully those things tend to uh stand out as such and can be included for our consideration. That's that's really what I'm talking about is that I can't tell you tonight the things that should be an ordinance and shouldn't be in an ordinance necessarily as to the the things that are being requested of the council to consider. So, that's that's where I was coming from on that. Does the um separation ordinance from 2017 still exist and would that be be a potential something that we could use as a base set of language? >> Well, it certainly is it's in the materials that we've got archived for that that discussion. So, um but I don't know I can't remember offhand how that related to what we're talking about this evening. So I my suggestion is to start from uh council member Bower's request. Look at the things that are in council member Stron's list and the petition to the extent those things would be worthy of putting or appropriate to put in an ordinance. Worthy isn't the right word. Appropriate to handle with an ordinance, put them in the draft that we can consider. If it's things that are most appropriately handled through other policies, personnel policies or things like that, make those recommendations as staff. Um >> if it's legal. >> So I hope that's helpful. So, so I think I we're hearing let's take a look at everything that was been presented to the council, brought forward to the council and sort out what maybe could be considered as policies or options for policies as well as ordinances >> and kind of work through that. So, I will say at a minimum we cannot have that ready until for consideration till the 26th. >> 26th. Okay. >> Uh because we get to pack it out the week before. So, that gives us, you know, seven days before. >> Yeah. Um so, and think there's a lot for us to >> work on. um and digest and get legal opinion and and talk through policy options. So, we we will try to do our best to expedite it, but um I think it's important to keep the conversation going. So, we don't want to slow that down. So, we'll make our best effort to bring what we can forward and then from there hopefully the council can give us precise direction. We can start taking some action as deemed necessary. >> Right. Council Strong, >> would there be a possibility of um erecting signage on Roseville City property, including the parks? >> That's one of the items on the list and so we can get the recommendation on that. >> Not necessarily an a way to recommend uh implementing something of that sooner than >> I I don't think we can put a sign up for something that we haven't taken action on as a council. >> We could take action tonight, I suppose. >> Yep. Yep. Do it >> with a policy. Well, but I once again I think it's appropriate that we figure out what the most appropriate process because we're being asked to do this as an ordinance. We certainly can't put up a sign if it's an ordinance. Um, and I want to make sure that we're taking the actions that are most appropriate and most effective to do what we're looking to do. Um, and so that's my concern >> and we have done no analysis of staff on >> right and there's a legal question there too as far that needs to be just evaluated as well. So, >> right, I think we need to get We need to get advice. >> People for who? Who's going to tell you not to put signs up in your own city? >> Yeah. 14 awful long time. >> Well, once again, we are not here to have a discussion about the details of the of the plan. I think we we need to be I completely understand people's concern about what is going on. And and believe me, I am not at all happy about it. And I'm I deeply deeply sympathetic and and and um understanding as as best I can from my position of people's actual fear in the community. Um but I also want to make sure that what we do is the most effective thing we can do. Um and that it has the best impact it can have and I want to make sure that we we have the ability to have the advice that can get us to that point. And so that's really what I'm I'm talking about this evening. Um uh so I believe we've got our direction to staff. >> All right. Is there any objection? Hearing none. We have our direction to staff. All right. Thank you. Uh and and I do want to say thank you to everybody in the community uh who spoke this evening, most of whom are still not here this at this point. Um there are many things that that I heard that were um that were things that were worth uh considering and taking a look at. One of the things was we do actually have a data policy related to the flat cameras uh that the city of Roseville is participating with in terms of I believe at at Harar uh and so we can look at how that is currently structured and if there is a way to um you know improve that or or or you know if there's any vulnerabilities there. So I think that was a a helpful thing that was brought up um and and and the like. So, um, you know, more to come on that, but I think once again, having the input from the community was very helpful and important to this process. All right, with that, we have item 7B, uh, which is to consider approval of a contract with Axon, uh, and records for a records management system. Uh, and I'll turn it over, I believe, uh, to our chief and others. Good evening. >> Good evening. >> Hello and welcome. >> Sorry, just give us one second to get set up. Um, >> not a problem. >> I know it's late. Um, and it's obviously been um a difficult evening. So, our plan is to really just we originally were going to do a little bit longer PowerPoint, but we obviously included a lot of information in the packet. So, our plan is really to just touch on a few of the slides. With that though, if there's questions, we can certainly go back and uh cover or get into more uh information. This is timesensitive and this is not because of a sales pitch. Um the reason that this is timesensitive is St. Paul has started a project that we have an opportunity to jump on. But the vendor needs to start moving forward to meet all the deadlines of St. Paul's project. So that's why they they originally gave us a December deadline. That wasn't obviously possible since we didn't have any other council meetings. That's what brought us here tonight. So they extended that deadline, but this is not a sales pitch of like you have to make a decision by the state. It's just the timing of St. Paul's project. We're we're kind of tied to that. So, really quick, we've we've um we currently have a contract with Axon uh that's going to be expiring in 2026, the end of the year. That's what kind of started this whole conversation is we were starting to look at some of the technologies, looking at negotiating some of the pricing for next year for like our body cameras, our squad cameras, our interview rooms. And during those discussions, we learned that St. Paul had recently uh signed a project for a new uh record management system. that's kind of like the hub of your police department. Through those conversations, we learned that there might be an opportunity that we could jump onto St. Paul's project, um, which is not only would save a ton of money, but it also would give us a much better product than than we're currently working with. I'm going to skip over some of these slides again. Happy to go back to them, but I know you they were in the packet and you had a chance to review them. RMS system. I mean there was think there was a better or a little bit more in-depth uh uh description of what it is, but it's really the hub of everything we do. Everything from an initial police report that an officer might write all the way up to submitting things to courts. It really is kind of the backbone of the police department and the system that really touches just about everybody in the in the police department. kind of how we got here is um we had a different RMS system back in 2010 that we got through a grant. Um in 2014 the uh Ramsey County approached us about jumping on to theirs and at the time we weren't super impressed. Um we decided to stay with the system we we had which I was a great product. St. Paul also ended up backing out of that county ride project. Unfortunately, 2020 came and we found out that our vendor for our RMS was no longer going to support the product. And so, we were kind of stuck. There was we didn't have the money, the resources to go on our own. And so, really, our only option was to go to the countywide system. I did that with a lot of reservations just knowing there's a lot of issues and a lot of concerns. So, we did transition and sure enough, there have been quite a few uh problems and those were highlighted in the Axel report. So, I won't go into all of them. And then this opportunity came up um that we were able to possibly jump on to St. Paul's. As we mentioned that there's a deadline um just because Axon needs to move forward with St. Paul's project and if we're tagging along, we need to um move forward with that. I won't get into all of these um since they were in the uh Axel report as well. But there's just a lot of um sec cyber security concerns. We've got um a lot of frustrations with our officers. We have an online reporting system that we used to have before we went to this new RMS new RMS system that hasn't worked for over two years despite numerous calls to the vendor. We've had to get our legal team involved. And so when this opportunity came up, um we were really excited that maybe there was going to be some solutions. I won't go into it again, but I'll just reference the Axel report typically does not look at RMS systems as part of their studies. In this case, one of the comments they made afterwards is, you know, you have a problem, right? And I think I realized just what a frustration this was for our staff. So really, the opportunity is for us to join on to St. Paul's project. Um, the way I describe it is we're not moving into St. Paul's house. Um, but they're building a house and they're willing to build us kind of the same house just next door. So, we would be on our own system. Um, we would be have our own data. Um, not sharing there could be sharing agreements in place, but we would have our own uh data. And it allows us to have access to that same platform. Systems would be nearly identical. And one of the big things with this with this project is if we don't join with St. Paul, unfortunately, Axon is no longer supporting agencies under a 100red um sworn officers for an RMS product. So, this is really our only opportunity and as I mentioned before, to go on our own would just be way too expensive um to build that whole system. So, we're kind of at a crossroads where we can either stay with the system we have and there's a lot of uh vulnerability and some data issues and some concerns or we have this opportunity to join on to St. halls. With that, I'll turn it over to Jeff who's kind of been uh running the project. I forgot to mention just as it's getting late, we also have a rep from um uh Axon here tonight, Brandon. So, if you have any technical issues that you want to ask about, he is here to answer that, but I'll turn it over to Jeff to just kind of highlight a few things with the uh Axon project and then we'll open it up for questions. >> Thanks, Chief. Uh know most of you. Uh I'm Jeff Lopez. I'm the investigations commander for the police department. Uh I I put together I've been working on this project for about three months. So I from a couple different lenses. One I've been a police officer here for a number of years. Worked elsewhere in a larger city. I'm also a resident here here as most of you know and raising my family here. So I'm looking at this. I understand it's a it's a it's a large investment. But um after working on this for the last 3 months, hearing some of the feedback from the Axel report um and there's a lot of workflow issues and uh frankly we're just trying to get caught up to the rest of of the nation here and to steal a word from you mayor in one of the most recent meetings I watched as I said both as a resident and an employee. But you acknowledge in one of the last meetings that for a number of years the police department has run lean and under Chief Shider and Deputy Chief Adams leadership we've been pretty savvy at doing that and applying for and receiving a number of grants and this is one of the ways that we can kind of uh um work with the growing you know with the as you learned recently the the amount of crime that's happening at the mall. Last year we had the highest crime per capita in the state of Minnesota. So, we've got a police department that's equipped to roughly serve about 37 38,000 people, but as we all acknowledge here, and EDA reminds us every every so often, more people come into the city every single day than then leave the city. So, uh, one thing I want to touch on for the Axom, one of the big reasons why us partnering with St. Paul's incredibly beneficial one is that we're going to receive a product that we just wouldn't have access to normally because of the size of our agency. But if we take part in this buildout process, um it also affords us the opportunity to provide say and input into what this product looks like for us. Whereas previously with Central Square, we didn't have that. It was kind of like a one-sizefits-all. This is what the county said and this is what this is what you get. And that's as chief cited pretty been incredibly problematic for us. Whereas in this case, already in the number of meetings we've had, I'm sitting with engineers, I'm talking with the rep, I'm talking with engineers again and followup, and we get to kind of have a say in what it looks like. So, that's pretty pretty crucial for us. Uh, benefits >> jumped ahead. Sorry. >> Partnership. Okay, we're we're moving right along here. Um, one of the biggest reasons why us going to St. Paul or with St. Paul deploying this roughly the same time as one not only the size and scope of the capital city uh but um we've had a number of conversations with the county attorney um or I have specifically with the pre-trial director we met recently with the executive director at the range of county chiefs meeting and presented uh me alongside the chief um then the amount of technology that we're getting this and the way we're looking at responsibly deploying it uh with our agency and integrating it into our workflow and providing cases to the Ramsey County Attorneys office is going to be incredible. And it's one thing for little old commander Jeff Lopez to go up and representing uh a department of roughly 67 people. But when I can call uh deputy chief at St. Paul who's going through the same process as us and we know that they're looking at using and integrating some of the same technologies that um in their their contract that is incredibly beneficial for us when I can bring a deputy chief from St. Paul or other command staff instead of just us. That's honestly one of the biggest impacts that we can have and it'll be a much more collaborative approach instead of us just kind of asking and begging the county attorney. Uh let's stop at this one just briefly real quick. This is um um we know this. So right now uh some of you may know but right now we're doing a number of things with a number of different programs in the in the agency. And while that certainly saved us some money upfront, we're learning just like everything else when you address the budget that those prices continue to go up year over year. And uh the largest challenge that we see or that our patrol officers talk about and my investigators talk about is that we're depending on a number of different products or programs to speak together uh effectively. And um frankly over the last couple years that just hasn't uh been very beneficial to us because something goes wrong. We've had to be frank pretty poor customer service from Central Square. Uh and we learned recently in the meeting it's not just us. It's a number of the Ramsey County Chiefs. Um, and so, uh, throughout this project and as I oversee as the administrator for the sworn member of the agency with Axon, the level of customer service and the responsiveness is impressive and it's been incredibly helpful for me as we've looked at this pro looking at like entering this whole project. So this slide kind of highlights above uh though we don't use all of those uh programs or companies we use a number of them and right now it's depending on one to speak to another and then that has to plug in effectively we have to be able to integrate that into a third program whereas with Axon which we you'll hear me reference as the ecosystem Axon uh and a number of agencies in the metro area have gone to this where you're no longer worrying about everything speaking well together. So, Axon, we would fall under the same thing and it is a web-based system where everything for a specific case is on that page instead of going to separate tabs as the chief kind of references >> and maybe I know this was in the packet so we're not going to go over it but with the Axon product we would get the entire bundle so all of these are included and I know there's quite a bit of detail so we won't go into each one but again happy to answer any questions you might have at the end I think we're just going to jump right to the financial thing because I think that that's a key piece with this. The big thing with um the way I described it to some people right now we have kind of a basic cable almost like a dish that just gives us basic access. Going with the Axon one is kind of like going with the Comcast top cable. You get all of the channels, all of the premium ones. And so it it is more there is a cost difference especially in that first year um which would be 2027. Um I meant to mention this earlier but uh in 2026 there is no additional cost and we have already budgeted for what they would bill us which is about 142,000 that is for our squad cameras, our body cameras and our interview rooms. We're you start looking at the different costs and I'll try to break this down to to make it make sense. If we stay with our basic cable, we're looking at about 466,000 is what we predict in 2027. going with the bundled savings for Axon which gives us all of the products. So not just an RMS but everything um those prices uh for 2027 would be about 534,000. So in those first years, we do expect it is going to be a little bit more than what we're currently paying for our basic cable, but we're getting much better product with a lot of technology built in >> the >> to include >> and as you as you >> anything new that comes out, >> correct? So anything new that they come out over the next 10 years would be included in our package. When you start looking at the cost over a 10-year period, one of the big benefits of going with Axon is they are locking in the price for 10 years. There is a lot of unpredictability with our current prices with all of these different vendors. Um, we know our RMS vendor is probably going to raise prices significantly that'll be passed on through the county to move to a web-based system. We're kind of guesstimating what those costs likely are, but we don't know if there'll be significant increases. So from a budgeting perspective, although those first couple years we do expect it to be a little bit more, I think as you look at 10 years, I think eventually those are going to be very close, if not more, if we stayed with our current system. And again, that's not adding on new technologies. So hopefully that kind of made sense. I know it's we're not really comparing apples to apples, so it's a little bit difficult and with bundled savings, it's hard to break it out and try to compare, but um and again, I'll just add there was quite a bit of information I know in the packet. Um so hopefully you had a chance to review that. And again, I I know we went through this really quick, so we're happy to go back and answer any questions on specific items. I just I recognize it's getting late, so I wanted to get through and just leave it more to the things you have questions on. >> All right. Thank you. Are there questions from the council? I see. Council member Schroer. >> Oh, yeah. Well, you talk about it costing more, but really if you take Have you taken into consideration the manual cost? So, so because I'm reading here, you're talking about having to manually reenter information into these reports and the amount of labor that takes. That's a cost as well. So, in a way, I I I really wonder if it's closer than if you took that into consideration. We yes, we did think about trying to put that analysis together because you're right, what we're doing right now, we're spending a lot of staff time. There's a lot of redundancy going on. We were going to try to break out those costs for you and it we just didn't have the time. But there is absolutely a staff time to deal with the inefficiencies. So, you're absolutely right. If you factored those in, it gets closer and closer and in some cases, you could probably argue we're spending more just with those inefficiencies. Well, and exactly because this this isn't what we want to have uh your your staff working on, your officers work. This is definitely um really a waste of their time. So, I think not only is it costing us more, but we then the opportunity cost that they could be doing other things on top of it. So, I just wanted to make sure and point that out. Yeah, we've included civilians into the like project or workflow examination and uh Kelly Roberto and Emily Thorson have been incredibly helpful as they helped deploy Central Square when we did that and their response or feedback to us has been like overwhelmingly supportive and and um they have bared a lot of the burden for the ineffectiveness of our current RMS right now and they are pretty excited at the opportunity of having to take some of that off. And um honestly, what we've done is moved that over to sworn officers, unfortunately, in the investigations unit. And as the o someone who oversees all them, I'd rather have them spend more time on a felony crime than having um to do uh put together um digital evidence packets to be sent down like that should be automated, which this would be in this particular case. So, >> thank you. >> Right, Council Member Bower. >> Yeah, I was kind of following up on um Council Member Shorter's point. I was wondering if you can give an example of like maybe how long it takes the cost time savings you're thinking maybe like with like a a DUI before I know those take a long time to fill out right now looking at other departments how long I mean how long does it take us now for an officer to do that and what do you think it would be with like this system >> sure so I actually sat down was sitting next to a chief who happened to deploy the the Axon kind of ecosystem typically for a DWI in their agency it would take about an hour and that's pretty close to what we would spend here Um, and with the new um, assistance of just the technology, the AI report assistance, it's not writing your report for you. It's just helping fill in some of those blanks. They had an officer complete it in about 15 minutes. So, to your point, instead of being tied up sitting writing a report at the police department for an hour, if we can cut that down to 15 minutes, that gets our officers back out on the street, back out in the community, and really doing the work that they want to be doing. They found that it's roughly what did they say 25 minutes savings per report time per officer. So like I have the mall officers right now tracking how much time they're spending on reports as like my kind of like control. And um I mean it's pretty remarkable at the like I think we would all agree and I know certainly the chief would that's time that our officers are out forward facing helping people responding to calls in the mall's case walking around engaging with people and to me I see far more benefit from that than being stuck in a squad car or behind a computer. So >> thank you. >> Great uh council draft. So, it sounds like there's a lot of efficiencies when I was reading through this and efficiencies in the paperwork. I don't think I've ever heard of a police officer who said, "I'm going into this to do more papers." So, that that stuck out in my mind. But my question was on the uh it's on the full list of available training modules. And I I was reading through that and I thought I was impressed by that because it said uh addressing Alzheimer's disease, autism 1 and two, uh bipolar disorder, domestic, English as a second language. It sounds like those can be handled much more quickly and efficiently efficiently using those. How are those modules uh how are they available to um our officers and how would they be used? >> That's a virtual reality training system I believe you're referring to. And so what that allows us obviously that doesn't take away or diminish the fact that inerson or um practical application is incredibly important and that that helps you know introduce stress and that's how we want to see how our officers are going to respond. But where we see some of the greatest impact of that is onboarding brand new officers or giving them more repetitions to go through certain things. So whereas right now it's like you got to pack them up in the academy and then you're driving 45 minutes out to an off-site location and then you're training them in person and then Chief Shatter's paying uh several officers to go and assist and be role players for that for the day instead of working on the street. Whereas this is something where you can give them the VR headset and you can plug in I mean the rep behind but we've got to sit through like it could be scenarios where it doesn't involve use of force at all. It's just going through the pattern or or creating these rhythms of the the neuro the neuropaths where where they're learning to how to talk to somebody who's in crisis or they're learning to take a report and then the training officer can be sitting off to the side like watching what they're seeing and then writing down critique or you can have all the trainers set up in an entire room and they're watching everything. So instead of doing that offsite, they're just doing it here. or let's say if it's someone in field training, hey, we're going to take an hour off the street and we're going to come go over some things that we need some remedial training and that's where we see the greatest time savings and money savings for that as far as the virtual reality and and um a vast majority of what we do is you know one one study I read about 94% of what we do is effective communication and I think that's a that's a huge uh opportunity for us. >> Thank you. And just one other thing I'll add on that. We have one of our lateral officers um that came from a different agency that was utilizing this tool and was really impressed with the quality of the training. Just it's just another tool. Again, as Jeff said, you still need to do regular um training, but being able to have that as as another tool that we can and train our officers on would be really valuable. >> I did have a a question. So, what is the future with the Ramsey County RMS system? I'm presuming because they implemented it in a certain was it at least 10 years ago that they must be looking at uh the next generation of what they're going to be doing. Um it you know I don't know what's out there as choices or what they're what at all they're thinking about. >> My understanding or at least the information we have is that in 2026 or 2027 that they're going to move from serverbased the server-based RMS to the web-based. The only difference in those two systems is where the data is being stored. >> It's still the same vendor. >> It's the same system. Um I can tell you there's a lot of frustration across Ramsey County with other agencies and there's actually another agency that's looking to do what we're doing. Um and so our understanding is there's no meaningful improvements coming. It's just changing the data that it'll be cloud-based, too. >> And just if we went on our own to do our own RMS system, um it obviously sounds like very costly. I mean, what are the vendors that are out there that can do it for an agency our size and what are our options in that regard? >> Very limited for what we have here in the Midwest. um having just gone through or attended the International Association of Chiefs of Police conference in Denver earlier this year, I should say last year. Um that was one of my homework assignments is to kind of kind of go and vet out and see and frankly we do have a limited uh options here that would be effective for us. It's also really important as I know we referenced or we didn't get to talk about as much but partnering with another agency. The information sharing is incredibly critical especially for a neighboring agency for us. Can't say there are other agencies looking exploring options. Um and also worth noting that some of the um changes that the the chief referenced um though I do applaud their move for cyber security reasons and they are talking about adding some of the technology some of the changes that central score is trying to do those are things that Axon has been doing for several years and so we just feel like it's incredibly beneficial for us to go to an industry leader somebody that we can look back at a proven track record as opposed to kind of hoping and praying that um our current vendor is going to make the changes that we request and frankly I don't think we've seen that over the last couple years. So that's problematic for us. >> Right. Thank you. >> And one other thing I'll just add with that is the there's a big expense to build the system that goes from dispatch to our to the RMS. St. Paul is going to be paying a big chunk of that because they're already moving forward with this project. >> We just would not we'd probably be looking at it four to five times the cost to go out on our own. >> Right. Thank you. Um, and I did want to provide an opportunity for members of the public to speak to this. We certainly had somebody here earlier. Um, and so if we can uh uh provide that opportunity at this time um and then we can look to uh council consideration. >> Hi, welcome. Thank you for your patience with our process here. >> Oh, of course. Thank you for giving me the opportunity to speak. Um, my name is Carla Ulig and I'm a proud Roseville resident. I'm here to comment on the new 10-year contract with Axon that would cost over $5 million. Um, as you know, this contract is supposed to help our town's police department keep up with evolving technology and integrate with St. Paul's Department Tech. I do want to note that I really appreciate the department's comments and recognize the difficulties that they experience operationally. I learned a lot from that presentation. Thank you. Um, however, after researching the proposed contract, I believe much of what is included is unnecessary, possibly dis disadvantageous, and a bad financial deal. I'd like to encourage the council today to reconsider the terms of this contract by delaying a vote and renegotiating terms. To start, data on everyday citizens is already being gathered at record speeds without much oversight. There is no opting out of license plate trackers or public space facial recognition. I believe data privacy is one of the biggest issues that we're not yet ready to grapple with, but there are small changes that can be made to slow the progression of a full-on surveillance state. So, after terminating a different contract, which actually was Flock, the company that I believe mayor row you said that the Harar mall cameras are um due to an audit revealing the provider was allowing US Customs and Border Protection to access data from Illinois's traffic cameras. The city of Evston made sure to include limits on data retention in their 7-year Axon contract. As it is now, from what I've read, our contract with Axon has no provision regarding data retention, which is something that we should look into adding if the council still wants to move forward with the partnership. Um, and not all Axon contracts are 10-year terms. Rapids in Minnesota, for example, signed a similar 5-year contract recently. Locking into an extended term of 10 years seems aggressive and a bit unnecessary when contract renewals and retention officers are certainly on the table. It's not surprising that two cities, Augusta, Maine and Howell, New Jersey, have sued Axon for antitrust violations. Citing one of the filings, Axon continues to unlawfully maintain its monopoly power through bundling and excessive excessively long supply contracts, which often stretch up to 10 years, sorry, 12 years. These tactics have prevented new entrance from challenging Axon for market share and have led to higher prices than there would have been in competitive market. This is a good opportunity to remind the council that terms are negotiable in business contracts and if Axon claims that they can't be changed, it might be worth asking a further why. So, Axon's been going around the country signing towns to similar contracts. These are all public record and after an analyzing 10 towns, I found that the average updated Axon contract cost per citizen to be $12.16. The 10-year contract for Roseville's population of 36,810, I believe we're being overqued at 1532 per person per year. If the contract proposed for Roseville is meant to align with a pre-existing timeline and additions to St. Paul's larger police department, why is our cost above average? One case study I'd like to bring up before I'm done is Puma County, Arizona. In 2021, Puma County signed a 10-year contract with Axon. And then in 2026 again, Axon asked for double the price or $45 million to extend the contract until 2036. The supervisors unanimously voted to reject the contract with one supervisor saying, "We're being asked to come up with another 45 million for AI and 0% for the deputies." Almost a quarter of our contract, over $1.2 million, is directly going towards Axon's AI era leaders program, which enriches Axon's privatized nationwide database. By the time by the time data is collected, individuals in small towns have no power over the usage of this data by Axon or whomever they may decide to sell the data to. Our town and its residents deserve a council that fight to protect their privacy and safety without giving up either one. Thank you for listening today. I hope that you are inspired to reconsider the necessity of or at least the terms of the proposed Axon contract um to and then sorry I understand that it's been a very long night and that Axon has proposed a due date of tomorrow. Um but please recall that the current contract expires in 11 months and you are a sales lead. There is a great opportunity here to make the changes that you think are right for your community. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Right. All right. Is there anyone else from the public who wishes to speak to this item at this time? All right. Uh if not, uh we do have a question about uh certainly about data that I wonder if we can uh attempt to answer this evening as to uh you know, how it relates certainly to how um Minnesota requires cities to handle data as opposed to other parts of the country. and then and what our policies already are in terms of that and what what data is being made available outside of the city of Roseville through any of these systems. And if you if you don't necessarily have the answers on it, we may have to get some >> I can I can take this having said there are two audits, one for body cam and one for license plate readers recently with a consultant. Um our policy mirrors that of state statute and we fall in line with that and we work with an admin assistant and a consultant who keeps us on top of that. The audit is completely independent of any employee here. So they come and take a look and we provide all of the data on us. She gives us a long list of things that we need to provide to her well before she comes so she can take a look at it. And then she does random audits of certain things, asks policy questions or for the license plate specific things. Anytime we search certain things, I have to provide. So I provide search warrants that were uh written and authored and submitted to a judge and signed or show that any search of certain uh license plates or creating of a hot list mirrors that or um is linked to an active or open case uh involving ex exigency. Uh as far as the flock cameras, we do not disseminate. Our our flaw cameras are only visible to our agency or anybody that um signs a written agreement with us. We do not share any information with Homeland Security and we did confirm that in the middle of that. We heard that question come up. Um and as far as the Axon cameras, yes, license plate readers are a part of that. But um all of that is retained for what the state statute requires from us and then we have to get audited by that at the end uh every uh calendar every other year for that. So we've got body cameras one year and then license plate readers uh the the off year of that. Um, and we can turn that if it were ever to become an issue or someone or council were to were to reconsider that portion of it, we wouldn't have to nullify the entire agreement, it's as an admin, the chief and I both. But, um, if the council were to request at some some point, we could just turn that feature off until you wanted to examine it further. that doesn't wouldn't impact any of the other technology which isn't collecting data as you know we could cover more but the technology in large part and the rest of the agreement is mainly for workflow or integration of our system so the RMS system it's not facial recognition the license plate readers would be effectively the only thing where it is collecting information and we could turn that on and off and we already um restrict what it can and can't search for for the agency >> only other thing I would add is the um state statute is very specific about what what data can be shared and with who and so um I'm very confident in the system that Axon has and making sure that people's data is protected when it needs to be. And how is the what is the access that Axon has to the data that any of the agencies have especially in Minnesota given our data practices requirements? >> They would not have access to our data. They build the system but it is our data. There's audit trails of who's accessing that information. So they would not have access to our our system if we were sharing data with like for instance St. Paul. We can set limits on what type of data we're sharing. So that they wouldn't be able to see all of our records, but they might be a be able to see that we dealt with somebody on a assault or whatever kind of case, but then they would have to contact us for those records. >> All right. And once again, that's another law enforcement agency, not a private entity at that point. >> Correct. And the way best way it was described to me is Roseville would be its own silo of information. And so that would include the RMS system or any of the other technologies as described in the agreement. So all of that information stays in our silo unless we were the ones that authorize it. Right now essentially the only thing that we would share from Axon is to aid or assist in the prosecutorial process. Essentially that's us sharing digital evidence with the county or city attorney when we're seeking charges for somebody. >> Well, once again, you're not sharing that with Axon. You're sharing that with other agents. >> Correct. That's correct. Yes, sir. Yes. >> And just as as an aside on the flot cameras, we have I know our data policy is very strict on that. We don't even keep the data for any length of time really beyond what it's needed for. No. Um and it's kind of rotated out. Um but once again sharing with with private companies. I'm imagining we're not doing any of that. >> None whatsoever. No. >> Right. Thank you. >> And that's also codified into policy as to what part of the agreement that we signed with Flock >> in that particular case for Flock. >> Right. Thank you. Were there other questions from council members? Council member Strong. I didn't know if the representative from Axon was interested in speaking to the antitrust or any provisions that have been put into place as a result of those uh those legal actions. >> I'm I'm personally not familiar with the antitrust. Um I know our legal team is heavily involved on that side, but as far as an acts on being in good standing typically in these t these situations, uh I' I've heard no further news on it. So just that was an off mic but uh not a lot of information available on that just because of your lack of connection to the information. Yeah. Okay. >> If I may as well one of the other questions that I heard come up. Yes. The 5-year agreement uh was an option but it it would came at a significant cost. >> Um the 10-year agreement secures us a lot of the technology for a longer period of time. Anything new that comes out but it also reduced the cost on the RMS deployment significantly. like I can't say numbers for certain reasons for privacy of other agencies but it's a rather significant number. So >> all right, Council Member Strong, >> I was just wondering how do we plan for year 11 then what that what kind of contract or kind of pricing we would have when we would get come in at the end of that 10-year. >> Sure. As someone who just kind of went through this this uh 3month or so project, I'd say I uh we're foreshadowing quite a bit here, but I would imagine um I mean a lot has changed. Chief can certainly attest to this in the last 15 20 years and an immense amount technologically speaking has changed in the last year. Uh I don't really feel like I mean I think the process would probably say the same. I would probably say year 7 8 we take a look at what's effective and what's working for us, what's created better workflows or made our employees lives easier, work lives. Um, and I'd probably say year eight or nine, um, as as I did this time, I would be proactive. This was the first time we were proactive in kind of bringing the Axon rep into it. It was just kind of like, oh, we think we need this. Um, and I would probably start pricing that out. And again, Axon is the industry leader in this stuff right now. So, there's nothing. It's kind of hard for us to look ahead and say in in 8 years, but I I think just the same with this process. It's not like we just went directly to Axon. I spent a number of hours looking at other companies as well. >> Well, certainly I would hope that maybe in years one and two we're also getting some sense of how it's working for us. Y it's not just that we wait till year seven. >> Chief and I probably won't be sitting here at this point either. So, >> right. Thank you. Are there any other questions for staff? Uh we do have the requested action uh to authorize uh that uh uh agreement or that I'm sorry I've lost my train of thought here. Uh the axon uh project here. >> So moved. Second. >> It's been moved by council gra uh seconded I think by council member Bower by a hair. Uh discussion on the motion. Council Gra is the maker of the motion. We really just touched on a little bit tonight because of the time and there's a lot in this packet that you you out in the audience here probably didn't read, but we've read through this and it's very thorough. There going to be a lot of efficiencies for the department. It's going to make us a better police department. It's going to help us serve the residents of Roseville better and it's going to add a lot of training that's available for our officers on um issues that I think are important. uh how to address mental health issues when you come into a policing situation, how to de uh address domestic and other things. So, I'm really very supportive of this uh contract. >> Great. As the secondary, council member Bower, >> uh thank you for being so proactive on this and really, you know, taking those considerations in the Excel report and needs of your officers and jumping on this and looking for a solution. Really appreciate that and look forward to seeing it uh in a future ride along. Council member Schroer, >> I wanted to say thank you for getting this to us ahead of time because there is a lot of information here and so so I know it seems like we went through the slides really fast tonight, but we've been having the opportunity to go through this. So I appreciate that and it and it really makes sense. So yeah, I'm very supportive of it. >> There discussion on the motion? Um I think the only thing I would add is that uh uh we have a lot of things to weigh in these types of decision processes. Um and and certainly uh you know given the the marketplace sometimes we don't have a lot of options to choose from. Um, and given some of the experience we've had that influences our decision- making. Uh, but I would agree both with the the the staff perspective from the department as well as what's been said by council members that this seems to be a good uh good investment for our future and productivity and once again having our our officers out in their jobs as opposed to a lot of the the administrative aspects of it that uh that as Council Member Grav said are not what people sign up for. Um and so I'm certainly supportive of that and ultimately um you know if there if issues do arise and we need to take a look at things you know we've we've got some options related to that as well. So with that we've got uh the motion before us to approve the contract. I finally found the language. Uh all those in favor signify by saying I I opposed. That passes unanimously. That contract is approved. Uh there is no further business before the council this evening and we only extended for those two items. Uh so a motion to adjurnn would be in order. >> So moved. >> Second. >> Moved by council member Grath. Second by council member Sharter to adjurnn. There is no discussion on a motion to adjurnn. All those in favor signify by saying I. I. I opposed. That passes unanimously. We are adjourned at 11:05 p.m.