foreign yeah good evening ladies and gentlemen it is 5 30 and I will call this regular meeting of the Burnsville city council to order it is our tradition to stand for a moment of silence followed by the Pledge of Allegiance and we invite you to join us I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and a justice for all this meeting uh is being conducted both in person and online and council members and our staff are in person and then we have members of the community uh and our attorney is online this evening our attorney uh is uh doing this remotely because this whole family has coveted and we don't want him to spread it so thank you Jared for thinking about us and um members of the public May attend in person or watch us on line on burnsvillemn.gov meetings or Comcast channel 16 or 859 the public can also participate through Zoom by joining us at zoom.us slash join and more information is available on the meeting web page and in the council agenda packet the first item on the agenda is our announcements and our announcements have to do with all of our upcoming meetings regular Council meetings are scheduled for Tuesday March 7th at 5 30 p.m Tuesday March 21st at 5 30 pm our work session for Tuesday March 14th is canceled and we have special work sessions we moved from March 14th uh to Tuesday March 7th at 6 pm and we have a budget meeting scheduled for Tuesday March 21st at 6 pm the next item on the agenda is Citizens Commons this is the opportunity for anyone in the audience to address the Council on an item that is not on a printed agenda and not an application form that will be coming before us at a future date is there anyone who wishes to address the council anyone as Collins anyone on zoo new one online mayor okay thank you um we then will move on the next item is for additions to the final agenda and this is for emergency items only city manager Lindbergh are there any emergency items nothing from staff mayor thank you members of the council okay we will move on the next item on the agenda is the consent agenda the consent agenda is a group of items that's considered to be routine and will be enacted by one motion however an item and a consent agenda can be removed for a separate discussion and vote is there anyone in the audience who wishes an item and a consent agenda to be removed for a separate discussion and vote Mrs Collins no one online mayor okay members of the council uh council member Keeley has asked to remove items 4 12 and 4x for a separate discussion and uh before W 4w 4w and 4x um city manager Lindbergh does staff have anything to be pulled nothing from staff mayor okay may I have a motion to uh adopt the balance of the consent agenda please second there's a motion and a second all in favor please say aye aye aye opposed saying a and a motion carries uh item 4w is the application of the Luther company LLP for rezoning for B3 General commercial to be three planned unit development um there's a concept and development stage PUD for an open sales rental lot to be demolished and the existing building and to construct a new 47 729 square foot dealership and parking area expansion at 14700 Buck Hill Road uh the the Planning Commission uh held the hearing and approved the rezoning the concept and development stage PUD and is forwarding this item to the city council for adoption they are recommending adoption of the rezoning concept developments and Stage PUD and the findings of fact council member Keeley thank you madam mayor I pulled this for public uh exposure and announcement because I feel that um in that particular area I think it's important to highlight and a lot of things don't get a lot of highlight on our consent agenda the significant reinvestment that Luther is making in that dealership actually the dealership that's there today looks pretty nice but they're demolishing it and building a brand spanking new dealership and that's a big investment into that area which is really part of I in my mind it's sort of part of that that mall area where we have car dealerships on Buck Hill Road and on the back side of the mall or south of the mall and it's a big investment in that whole area so I think hats off to Luther I appreciate that they're going to put a a lot of investment in building a brand new building and dealership and to me that's a sign of significant investment and confidence in that area so with that I would move to approve there's a motion second there's the second all in favor please say aye aye aye opposing a and a motion carries 4X is an application from Studio M Architects Inc for a plan unit development Amendment for a 15 000 square foot two story additions to the West End of the existing building located at 901 County Road 42. this is um the uh shopping center area and it's the old Gordmans site council member Keeley thank you madam Aaron obviously we are all very familiar with this particular project with the uh the investment it's been in the news uh since last year when uh the sale of that property um happened and the plans were announced and I believe there was a big sort of a ribbon cutting or shovel type of uh ceremonies what's the press conference sorry reception it was a big deal yes it was by the investors and so now we're seeing you know uh applications come through because sometimes people hear these stories in the news or read them about them in the news and then they don't hear anything for a long time and they start asking questions well did that sell and are they still going to put that in and is that happening because there's obviously a lot of time that goes by between acquisition of property and when um plans are finalized architectural architectural drawings is submitted and there's actually a permit in front of the city and so now there is and this is for an expansion of 15 000 square foot two-story Edition on the west side of the building and so uh it's uh it's it's starting to move forward and I know there's a lot of retailers inside the mall who are very excited and anticipated uh you know seeing this type of development seeing some actual active activity because it's been a long spell where there hasn't been a whole lot of new openings at the mall there's been more closings but now we're seeing some new stores talked about opening a new restaurant a new fast food restaurant and now this Edition and and the building of this Asian market and food Hall which is going to bring tremendous foot traffic to the mall so I think it's worth calling out specifically off our our consent agenda I understand that the Planning Commission and hats off to them for a four to zero vote to bring it forward and with that I would make a motion to approve the item second there's a motion and a second all in favor please say aye aye aye opposing a and the motion carries and I would um encourage everyone in our community to go to the Planning Commission meeting and you can pull it off our website and you can see the plans and you can see everything about these developments the Luther development and the studio m architect development and it's on the website you can see it it's all there so you can even take a look at the plans and how that's going to be so it's very nicely done right here I have a fault question so yes I want to call your attention to yes since you brought it up I want to bring up the website uh I want to apologize to those going to our website that may have a hard time finding uh what Madame mayor just pointed out uh some of us work with the website on a regular basis and we even struggle to work around our way around and um I know that there's plans to do some improvements but uh recently I've been on it doing a lot of searches I was on the phone with someone from the community who was trying to find things on the website and we were both very frustrated that we couldn't find things so don't give up um you know do a different cup a couple different search words it's not like Google it's not going to come up with the most relevant you might have to page through a few things but just know that we're working on it uh it is in dire need of some improvements especially with search functions so I apologize well uh to that end I will ask our uh city manager because our Communications Department and it has been also shared with us are working to update the website city manager Lindbergh uh Madam members of the council certainly any feedback that users might have about the website we're always uh welcome uh to that information so certainly do that I'll just add for this particular item uh if the community goes out and just searches development or development project uh the first item that you'll see in the in the search returns is our development project finder map and that includes these projects and anything else that has shovels in the ground or or Redevelopment going on but certainly if there are if there are website use issues that's something that's important to us the web experiences is an important thing for you for the community so always feel free to reach out to us you can just click the content contact us Link at the bottom or the top of the website and we'd be happy to yeah respond and look at those improvements thank you city manager I just want to leave oh sorry wow that was a bad seat manager Lindbergh keyword searches are very very important important one of the things I've learned on our website is like you you just said the right words right use the word developments yeah but people looking at a mall Redevelopment are probably going to type in Burnsville mall development right or Redevelopment or something like that or just Burnsville Mall building or something like that so it does take very specific keywords and you have to really know what they are to get the right results to come back which is the problem because they're not in plain speak and what people would use off the street all the time so but thanks that's very key there is also something else that our community can also look at and it just came out this last week Mr Thompson I bet this is the opportunities belong here which is your Economic Development um newsletter that comes out and it always has all of the projects listed and if you go to one of those you will see where it is and you just click and it's right there am I correct Mr Thompson yeah mayor and Council yes that's correct we put out that Economic Development newsletter which keeps the community updated of all of our Economic Development activities and certainly all the Redevelopment projects yeah and you can find it very easily because it's it's a link and all you have to do is click and it's right there thank you well done it was nicely done okay okay now we will move on to the regular agenda and the first item on the regular agenda is a public hearing this is a resolution vacating the trail and access easements at bsli and uh our city engineered Mrs desert is presenting Mrs desert welcome uh thank you good evening mayor and council members um tonight is a public hearing as you had mentioned um I think we're all familiar with bsli there's the math that shows the location off of Cliff Road and when the Pud was approved to expand back in last August there was a condition that the existing um the expansion encroaches on an existing Trail easement and so it should be vacated and any other easements that were in in the way of the expansion should be vacated at that time so we have the application this line in red is the trail and access easement and it is part of the expansion so no Trail would be feasible in that location any longer um so we staff recommends approval with the condition that any required utility relocations are at the applicant's cost although there are no utilities we just make that as a standard condition um so it's a public hearing and I stand for any questions any questions for Mr Des root okay thank you I will now open the public hearing is there anyone who wishes to speak to this item anyone who wishes to speak to this item I just want to thank bsli for working with us on this particular item uh those Trails have been something that we've talked about for many many years and I'm glad to see that that easement is intact and that there will be access so thank you so much Mr Miller Madam mayor we're vacating the easement so it will not be intact after this action so no easements for the trail right so because the expansion uh is expanding where that easement would be well we don't know we're vacating that existing easement because it there it's not feasible to have a trail in these locations okay so this is would we be looking at an easement in the future in the future we would work with bsli to see if there's an appropriate location there are some rules and requirements about fencing and some barriers and so through the property is no longer feasible and so at this time we're vacating it to clean it up and then in the future we could look for a relocation but we because the plans are to expand we don't have that route at this time and we aren't rededicating easements at this time okay well thank you for continuing to work with us on this so uh members of the council any other questions if not a motion pleased to adopt the resolution so moved second there I just want to close the public hearing first you uh he's sharp yes thank you uh I will then close the public hearing and um also move again there's a motion second and the second all in favor please say aye aye aye opposed CNA and emotion carries thank you uh the next item is the approve uh to approve a change of scope for the stormwater resiliency project and presenting is our city engineer Mrs desert Mrs desert hi again so um this is I'm going to give you a history of where we've been uh in 2019 and 2020 we updated our Citywide stormwater model to be more accurate and we conducted an analysis of high-risk flooding areas at that time and then in the CIP for stormwater we've had funding set aside to start chipping away at making stormwater improvements and our first one was in 2020 and 2021 we completed a city project to expand the North Twin Pond which helped with some Regional flooding in that area we constructed a new South Twin Lake outlet and modified the Crystal Lake outlet with that project and then in September of 2021 we ordered the next project the second project in that resiliency set of projects for in the CIP and we were evaluating risk areas by Knox Circle and Hollows Park conducting a feasibility study to see what alternatives there were we've chose those two areas they were in our high risk areas per the model because they were adjacent to our street improvements in 2022 and by doing that partnering them with existing projects we could minimize costs and disruption for people in those areas the budget in the CIP was just over one million dollars but in that feasibility period we found for the knock Circle Improvement we were the solution was to expand the Neil Park pond and reroute a storm trunk line that would have been a significant tree impact and so we had to weigh the pros and cons and found that the improvements um were outweighed by the the cost was outweighed by the the benefits so it cost a lot and the tree removal and the benefits weren't significant enough to to justify and in the hollows Park area well the model showed flooding we had no reporting of property owners so it was a difficult to invest money where there was no actual on the ground scene flooding issues so we don't recommend a project in that area um at this around the same time um this Minnesota cemetery came in for an expansion and they had a cup before you and the Nicollet business campus described some of their drainage issues and they showed these pictures that are on the screen and the council voted at that time to send the application back to Planning Commission and talk about stormwater mitigation measures the cemetery chose to remove that expansion area that would have impacted the Nicollet business campus and the Planning Commission approved it and then subsequently came back before the council and and you all approved that expansion omitting the parts that was on the southwestern portion of the project since then there's continued to be drainage issues in the area so the areas in pink are areas that are draining to the Public's cities storm sewer system there is in the bluish Greener or the Highway 13 and then the yellow are all on the cemetery all of that area highlighted is draining towards the Nicola business campus Building and this can you see my pointer here okay so these lines here are all storm sewer and this shows the storms who are coming along the ditch this is 13 here the ditch section and then this triangle is where it Outlets into the ditch and the arrow shows the direction of flow and then it goes under the trail and at this point ideally it would continue along the ditch but it doesn't so the red line shows the path of where the water flows and it heads right towards molecular business campus Building here's some pictures that we've taken so these are on the cemetery property and you can see large erosion happening um on this picture on the bottom you can see the tree roots are exposed up here you can see sediment around the trunks of the trees so even in a low flow event water rushes through here and it erodes even more bringing sediment with it and into the Nicola business campus property so we're recommending that we change the scope of the project from those two projects that I described earlier as not being feasible to one that we've discussed with MnDOT and we've discussed with the cemetery owner and the Nicola business campus on roller and concurrence that this is a good project it would be to construct two new basins one would be completely in the MnDOT right-of-way that's the South Basin one would be on the cemetery property in that area where they can't expand it's too wet so it's not really usable property for them water is going through that direction the estimated cost is about a million dollars and MnDOT has a cost share policy for the South Basin so they would be contributing approximately 25 percent of that South Basin cost so working through some of those details and we'd come back before the council with any agreements on cost share and then working with the two private property owners they've so far agreed to provide easements to the city at nocosa permit easement for the north Basin and any access easements that we needed or temporary easements that we might need because both parties want to see this issue resolved so the staff recommendation is to change the scope of that existing project that we already ordered to the Highway 13 and Cemetery drainage Improvement if the council wishes to go forward we would get started with design this spring and potentially be able to have a project being constructed in the fall this does rude you have done a lot of work between the cemetery and the business owners at um the Burnsville campus and it seems to me that they've all participated and have been very engaged in a process and there's agreement between the property owners that's kind of solution that you all have arrived at and so what I like is that there was a lot of participation from the members of our community who were impacted so members of the council I'll make a motion and just thank you Jen this is great government I remember when they came in and talked about this and how is impacting their businesses and here we are taking care of the problem today and that's um I think what we're all here to do so I appreciate you all of your work on this so I will be happy to make a motion on this yeah okay councilmember Keely did you want to make comment I did um this dates back a while I remember when we were presented this and it also proves that the right work takes time you can't you can't pull a fix overnight um has there been any uh flood issues since 2021 when we presented this by Nicollet Business Park as it's just every spring and fall it's they're dealing with the same thing so mayor council they depends on the event but that inundation map I showed with all the blue is the Hundred Year event um because of that channel is so eroded even a small event brings water rushing into their property not to the extent of getting close to the building like it was in those pictures but that's a real possibility um with even a smaller rain event so it hasn't to that extent we were in a drought the last two years but we did have some small rain events and when the ground is so compacted because it's so dry water doesn't necessarily seep in so it just Overland flowed right into their property so they did see a wet parking lot but not a wet building I remember seeing the the one photo there where it shows the water coming through the fence and the the little sandbag sacks or whatever they were trying to stop it that's quite dramatically different than the new photos that show what looks like a two foot deep rut right or or wash out with a lot of sediment those photos look like they came from the shoreline of the Minnesota River in the Savior River I mean those those were extraordinarily deep with a lot of roots showing so it's just been going on for quite a while right anyway thank you great work I'm glad we're finally getting this resolved for the benefit of these property owners and mitigating the water runoff in the right way thank you councilmember Schultz question for you on clarification on this so what's causing the flooding is drainage from the highway highway 13. and storm water from the high school the stormwater from the high school floods flows into our our public stormwater system under Portland and then that collects our street drainage from Portland yeah and it's the frontage road so it's a combination High School drainage going into our but all properties eventually get into City storm sewer so that Overland or that flow that's coming into our pipe is City owned maintained it is coming from them from their from their site okay uh just clarifying on that um I guess that's my only my only question yes yes this needs to be taken care of uh yes this is something that is happening to those property owners um and it's being caused if I am correct um by by the highway which is MnDOT and also the high school because of you know all the non-permeable like their area as well but it will be our residents primarily who will be footing this bill so we're we're proposing to pay for it out of the storm utility so anyone who has an entrance Point into our storm is paying for it as a city-wide yep which I get but that means I like our our taxpayers whether it's a business or you know right so it's our people that are are paying for this correction so I'm I'm noting that we are taking care of an issue that is not caused by the city but caused by other governmental agencies and our residents will be paying for that and business owners so just to be clear the city does have water that contributes as well so any water that lands in the street is our water so it's a combination of private property city streets MnDOT right-of-way so there's there's those three components I've been working with MnDOT to have them cost contribute to a portion and we're right we're negotiating that right now I put 25 percent we're still working through those details but they are that's um their calculation stormwater calculation based contribution is 25 so partially State paid partially City paid appreciate that and thank you so the the part that they're looking at paying is so that we have two basins and then one base and they'll pay they're looking at 25 percent of just that one Basin to contribute but not 25 of the total still negotiating all right negotiate hard I'm trying the nice thing is that um we've had a storm water fund for a long time that that really manages all of these issues that have to be that's about storm water and storm water comes from everywhere but that's why we had a a process a participatory process with all of the property owners who who are by our water bodies and they all helped with the solution for that and that was 15 million dollars over 15 years and the result of all of that is that we have uh two Lakes out of the impaired Waters list um early Lake and uh and Crystal Lake so the storm water comes from everywhere but we are the the stewards of making sure that we can take care of that and so I commend our staff for the work that they've done and that will continue to work with our partners but we will we're solving a problem so there is a motion on the table made by uh council member Workman is there a second second there's a motion and a second all in favor please say aye aye aye opposing a an emotion carries thank you the next item is item 5C and this is an ordinance uh adopting uh revisions to city code title 3 chapter 24 Pawn Brokers second hand goods and precious metal dealers uh this is an item that was continued from September 20th 2022 and presenting is our city clerk Mrs Michelle Collins Miss Collins before you go forward I'll uh full transparency my employer is one of the license holders uh involved in this particular ordinance so I will recuse myself from discussion and vote thank you council member Keeley is recused Mrs Collins thank you madam mayor city council this evening we have before you the pawn brokers secondhand goods and precious metal dealers chapter come back to you from a previous meeting on the screen here I have a couple of the concerns that the council had one of the main um with the addition of the definition to include synthetic and laboratory created gyms with this then um cause cell resellers that had costume jewelry to have to report um jewelry the definition of jewelry itself was not in the previous ordinance because there had been no change proposed to it but when we went back and it re-examined it we did realize it specifically calls out that it does exclude costume jewelry staff felt like that that was adequate to make sure that that costume jewelry was not included in the reportable goods the code review task force reviewed this as well and also approved that with no change for the second hand Goods definition we did add two additional items the small home appliances and collectible cards council's concerns were whether or not some of these um additions would cause new businesses to be required to be licensed or to put an undo stress on some businesses or existing businesses we did reach out to our businesses including some of those businesses that might be affected in the future and ask for them to comment um specifically I even called The Dreamers Vault myself and left a voicemail on their corporate office to see if somebody would call me back to give me any kind of feedback so far we have not received any feedback from any of the businesses about our proposed changes I would note that there are a couple of new little sections that were added in here since the last time you saw this ordinance one of them one of the things we were doing was getting rid of an obsolete best practices program that was in there but instead of eliminating it completely the police department has asked that we add uh just a what would be an online knowledge assessment instead of having to have a in-person training of employees so we thought that this was a lot more business friendly for the workers at the at the program and the code review task force also agreed with that the other small addition that was made was in regards to conducting an annual audit and we looked at some of our other licensing and saw that they also had annual Audits and felt like this was the same a similar type of license and should also have an annual audit questions of Mrs Collins looks good so pardon me so going to an annual audit I missed that what was the audit before there was no audit in the code before and the police department asked for there to be one similar to how we do compliance checks for Tobacco liquor in this type it would be checking spot checking to see if a certain item was recorded in the system or if employees had taken the knowledge assessment that type of thing so we're going to spot check a can opener foreign for real yeah come forward and give us your name yes your staff heck elegant with the police department so the audits how they work is um the leads online system that we use it would randomly generate just pick one transaction from one of the stores that do the second hand goods and then we check that transaction to make sure that they're following all the rules of the the city code making sure that the serial number is correctly marked down that the the strip description of the product is correctly marked just to make sure that they're following the city code and making sure that they're in compliance with the city code so I don't know I can't open I don't know I've never had anyone sell a can opener to a pod shop I guess but um I bought one oh you did okay well so we're looking at things like you know randomly if we went to uh Pond works or Pawn America or something I would probably generate you know a tool that they have or a TV that they took in and then we'd spot check that they entered everything correctly um because the reason that we need it correct is so that we can find it if it was stolen in a burglary uh from our city from another city or um you know one of our stores in our city things of that nature okay so I I struggle with the balance on this one because I do understand people wanting to be able to recover their goods if they are stolen um but I really struggle with treating this category of business in a very punitive way um I don't see them as lesser businesses and I don't see them as bad community members so while I understand the ordinance is to have this information available the extra step of spot checking shows a distinct lack of Faith or trust in that category of business so that's what I'm struggling with because when you're doing a spot check the assumption is almost that they're Shady and they have to prove themselves unshady and I I don't really like that I'm fine with having the compliance of yes they need to keep track of things so that if if something is stolen you know you can find those things and and recover it this but the spot check I don't I don't like I don't like that I don't like it that's too far for me council member Workman thank you um I guess I'm not interpreting this so much as like um you know a slap on the hand for the type of business that they are I I think and I know councilmember Keely is accusing himself but I think this is standard operating procedure in most communities and you know I can speak from my experience in my industry I get audited annually by my the companies that I represent to make sure that I'm securing signed applications for insurance policies and it's just to make sure that I'm doing everything the way the insurance company is asking me to do it is the city doing that in this case we're already collecting the information as I understand it right I mean this is all being inventoried into serial numbers or that and this is more of us just saying you know we're just checking to make sure that best practices are being followed um and like I said I don't I don't think this is unique to Burnsville I think this happens across the country but I'm gonna ask Keely to maybe validate that feeling or maybe yeah well council member Kelly did press this button so uh he had recused him that's left from our prior item okay but what I as I understand how we do this is because one of the issues that we talked about a long time ago is that these are great businesses the pawn shops and second-hand resellers but when people come in they don't know whether the item that person is pawning is a legitimate item of theirs or if it's a stolen item you're having all of the information after they have taken all of the the data from that particular item uh allows these lost items to be found Madame mayor and members of the council I I guess um we're doing this to make sure that the entries are accurate and so that we can locate that I I guess examples would be is sometimes we find it where the pawn shops or the second hand dealers enter things vaguely and then we can't find it in the system or they just make a an error they this you know superimpose a couple of numbers on a serial number and we just want to make sure that they're doing it accurately so that we can find these things not just for our city but for victims of crimes in other cities that stuff gets pawned in our city so that's why we're doing it and then it's not necessarily I mean we do checks for alcohol compliance and and tobacco compliance and we're not doing that because we think those businesses are shady it's to make sure that they're following the rules and to make sure that they're doing things correctly and um you know I think what we would do if somebody fails an audit like they have a mistake on a ticket is it'd be form of Education with that business to make sure that they don't make that mistake again and there would only be maybe you know consequences if we saw the same business continuously failing audits over and over and over again where they're not entering property correctly and not listing things correctly and not just making errors on on those on those tickets I guess okay council member Schultz so what would that look like uh they could have their um their their license with the city suspended or revoked uh would be the most probably the worst consequences other than that it would just be education with uh with the manager of the store they employ because they have to document the employee that did the transformation so maybe just it might just be me and and officer our detective gutzman talking to the manager and saying hey you need to talk to this employee and educate them uh that they made this error on this ticket and make sure that that doesn't happen again um things things of that nature I I do understand that um and I whether we would do a compliance check or not they would need to record things and they would need to have that information available and whether we spot check or not there could be errors and I don't I don't really care if other cities do that or not like that's not a a thing for me to go with the herd or not go with the herd um I just know that secondhand stores have been highly stigmatized and I feel like this as to stigmatizing them and I think that they're they're valuable community members and I I don't support I don't support that I I like the rest of this I I do not support the spot checks city manager Lindbergh question was asked and answered yes and so thank you and so council member Gustafson um I actually like the idea of doing spot checks I believe we should trust their businesses but I also like one of our President says but let's verify and it's that's not that difficult I mean you guys it's not like you're in there every day doing a spot check just like you're not doing tobacco checks all the time you're not doing alcohol checks all these are random checks that we do just to make sure and quite frankly I don't want people that are actually doing thefts thinking Burnsville is an easy place to sell their goods to somebody I mean it just that doesn't make sense to me that invites people in and I'm not saying not doing an audible vitamin but it's just one more step that people can understand that we are we are paying attention to it I mean I know you have the lead system in that that you go over and I imagine that's a daily process for you guys and exactly how long do you guys spend on that every day um well I guess it depends you know um officer detective goodsman and I both are kind of oversee that program all of our detectives have access to it and a lot of our officers do it's something that I normally check every day we get automated um you know emails from leads online when a hit comes in the system where either something that was stolen from our city gets Pond and another city are sold to a pawn shop in another city or vice versa um yeah I mean it is a it's a daily thing that I at least check and and generates a lot of cases that uh that detective gutzman and I uh in particular work typically okay yeah thank you I think if we're going to add a layer of compliance it needs to be compelling that we add it and I don't think thank you correct me if I'm wrong we have not done these types of spot checks like this has not been something that we've had before correct we did do them before I think so you did them but it was just like an informal it wasn't in the um you know I wasn't in charge of the the system at that point um they did do them before it was the same kind of thing it was under a different system at the time because we weren't under leads we were under APS which was run by the Minneapolis Police Department it was the same thing it was randomly picking an item making sure that they were filling out the tickets correctly and accurately uh to make sure that they were complying to the city code we were doing that before different detectives were doing it at the time and again it was just like I guess I just like I said uh before is it was normally an education piece if there was mistakes on it with the employer the employee I don't think it very ever rare I don't think it ever came to a point where we were getting the city involved to revoke or suspend licenses right just to make sure that things were being done accurately and and so if we had it before why is it being added I don't think it was in the city code officially now it reflects current practice so we were we were doing something that was not in city code well the police were just making sure that the businesses were safe we're doing what the the city code covers what they have to enter in these tickets and the information that needs to be put into those and if I remember correctly when we went through all of this in the past and we had the pawn shop owners and in Burnsville we only have two one is upon America and then the other one is spawn Works correct they're the only two pawn shops we have other second-hand resellers correct in the city but those are the and they all came to the meeting I remember that it was very participatory and they gave their feedback and part of the thing is making sure that we have a safe City and that we're not a city where people can come in and say oh well if it's a stolen piece of item you can you can do that in Burnsville you can either sell it to a secondhand reseller or a pawn shop and they and they won't know about it because and I believe back then uh the owners were very much a part of this process and it it didn't reflect negatively on their business it just makes sure that the uh the community is um is safe and it's not a place where people can come in and and and pawn stolen items councilmember Schultz nothing in this conversation is about no longer recording items or doing away with that system like that remains no matter what so no I don't think people are going yes we should definitely Pawn our stuff in Burnsville because they have no system and there's no recording and it's a wild west like that's that's nothing that's being said here the small portion that we're talking about is putting into our ordinance that there can be random checks and a yearly license review which is the new parts of this and so what I'm questioning is do we need to do that do we need to treat these businesses differently now I'm finding out that we were doing it without it being in our city code in our ordinance well and these business aren't being treated differently as we have said that we also do to check it um for tobacco and for liquor so they're not selling tobacco and liquor they're not like if they're selling tobacco and liquor okay I mean because that's under state state ordinance like I get that okay so no I get it I'm gonna I'm gonna lose this battle I get it and uh but like I'm I'm so I was gonna be a further discussion yeah so um Mr Shepard we have one council member who's recusing himself and uh I need two votes here one is I need uh well an affirmative vote of four but I only have four members that that are voting Madam mayor council um the ordinance itself only requires a simple majority yeah it's only the summary ordinance publication that will require four yeah the summary ordinance requires four but a simple majority so I'm looking at the complement of the council I have one council member that has accused himself so for the ordinance I only need three votes yes okay mayor and Council I would I would split these into two motions if you can and that's what I'm I'm uh I'm talking to you about because I need two votes simply because the summary takes a super majority and the ordinance takes um a simple majority so I'm going to ask for a vote on the foreign should I take these summary ordinance first or the simple the zoning or the mayor I would take the uh motion on the approval of the ordinance itself which is a simple majority first okay uh that's what I'm trying to understand okay may I have a motion to adopt the revisions to the amendment so moved there's a motion and a second all in favor please say aye aye aye opposing a nay and um the clerk has a division of the house and now we uh we will vote for the summary ordinance and I need to have four affirmative votes or three affirmative votes because one is recused for affirmative votes that America okay for affirmative even with one recused that's correct okay uh may I have a motion motion on a summary ordinance please so moved second there's a motion and a second all in favor please say aye aye aye opposing a but she said hi I said I okay I did I did my vote on the first one this is just a procedural thing I I didn't okay the clerk has the division with the house okay thank you um members of the council there are no other items to come before us this evening and a motion to adjourn is in order so moved second there's a motion in a second all in favor please say aye aye aye opposing a and a motion carries good night and thank you for being with us be safe drive safely and get home safe thank you