This transcript features **Mayor Wayne Boucher** presiding over the meeting, with presentations from City Administrator **John Mulder**, Assistant City Administrator **Joe Wicklund**, and **David Bolf** (representing Northland Consulting Engineers). Note: The transcript roll call includes a "Councilor Jones," who was not in your provided list but is clearly present. Phonetic errors in the original (like "counselor jelly" for Councilor Hjelle and "counselor blah" for Councilor LeBlanc) have been corrected in the speaker tags. *** [0:00] **[Music/Background Noise]** [0:36] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Are there any announcements that counselors would like to make at this time? Nothing? I'd like to congratulate the Hermantown Talons robotic team on going to the national competition in Houston starting through Wednesday of this week. It's a pretty big deal for them. There's still some fundraising going on if anybody wants to help them out; that's a GoFundMe page. They were trying to raise $15,000 and I don't know where they're at right now, but help if you can. Today we have a public hearing on the Road Improvement District Number 541, Hermantown Road and Old Midway Road. Mr. Mulder and Joe, were going to walk... [1:23] **Joe Wicklund:** ...through kind of the presentation that we provided to the residents at a public information meeting. But we'll walk through that quickly. Most people have seen this, but we'll walk through this quickly. It just kind of explains the Road Improvement Program in general and then specifically how it impacts Hermantown Road and Old Midway Road in 2024. [1:54] **Joe Wicklund:** On April 6th, to members of the public, we had 40-plus members here and online as we walked through. And folks who have experienced some of the Road Improvement project presentations in the past, this one isn't very different, but obviously when I get into the specifics of Hermantown Road and Old Midway Road, that's where it kind of dives into it. And as always, we start out with the history of the Road Improvement Plan. I'll let David talk roads in a second, but on the financial side of things, one of the big starting points for this was obviously the City Council's approval of the Financial Management Plan—the FMP—in March of 2019. That allowed us to kind of target and collect funds that make significant improvements like this possible in a way they weren't before in Hermantown. And as always, well, four straight years and I would expect a fifth, where roads have been the number one issue to our residents. David? [2:39] **David Bolf (City Engineer):** Okay, thank you Mayor and Council. So this is a slide from our presentation to the public information meeting. Again, this is a slide of our road inventory. In 2015, we inventoried all sections of road in Hermantown and we ranked them from one to five: one being a new condition road and five being a road that needs to be completely reconstructed. And on the right side of the screen are the different segments of roads. We have 45 gravel sections; the rural bituminous sections, which are shoulders and ditch roads; the 20 urban sections are the ones that have curb, gutter, and some sidewalk; and then our Municipal State Aid roads are the ones that we receive state aid on. [3:24] **David Bolf (City Engineer):** So then once we did our inventory, we had to apply what we call improvement strategies. And the improvement strategies we focused on for the Road Improvement Plan were roads that were ranked three through five. And the different improvement strategies are: a mill and overlay would be a road that was ranked at like a two or a three; and a reclaim and overlay, you know, a three or four; and then a full reconstruction for roads that were ranked five. So this project before you is a combination of the reclaim and overlay and the full reconstruction improvement strategy. This slide just shows our two roadway standards that we have for the city. The first one on the left is a rural section, and that is 24 feet of pavement, two-foot shoulders on both sides, and we have ditches. And then the second one on the right is where it's 24 feet of pavement and then two-foot curb and gutter and sidewalk typically on one side. Both of these work within the 66 feet of right-of-way that we typically have along these corridors. [5:10] **Joe Wicklund:** So we pivot back to the funding pieces. And it actually even speaks to a little bit—David and I were talking about the public information meeting—that these prices at the bottom of these are from 2019 when we first started this or are out of date. We'll bring those up to date, which will speak to some of the changes and costs that come up. But so how do we pay for these types of projects? That's where the Financial Management Plan comes in, something that kind of coordinates our existing and our future debt, our Capital Improvement Plans—kind of things that we're accomplishing Citywide—but then fits in some considerable improvements to roads or considerable improvements to projects that we're working on across the city that allows us to kind of map out not only what we're doing in '23 and '24 and beyond. So for example, Hermantown Road, the project we're talking about now, is slated for 2024. [6:03] **Joe Wicklund:** Regarding payment options, there's obviously some clarity on where money can and can't go that folks are interested in when we talk about these types of projects. So these Road Improvement projects can lean heavily into road assessments to the individual property owners affected by this, and the general tax levy because we all benefit from the better roads. MSA allocations are for those roads that David talked about that are MSA certified. We talk about Local Government Aid, and we have some hopefully good news that Representatives Lislegard and Senator Hauschild will be able to make that a possibility for Hermantown, but that dollar amount is still zero at this time. And then there's specific utility funds—those water, sewer, and storm water utilities—which you'll see David has outlined in the costs. But sales tax can't be used for these types of projects; those are very specific uses that that goes for. [6:49] **Joe Wicklund:** As in our past years in the Road Improvement project, we feel like an assessment is appropriate and necessary to make these projects happen. We've been able to hold that number at $9,750 for the property owners. There's two ways those can get paid: obviously, there's some folks who take care of that all up front when the project is completed, and for folks who want to choose to spread those payments out, they can roll it onto their property taxes for 15 years at five and a half percent. So that's an annual payment as part of your property taxes at $971.35. But everybody who has been through the road improvement process over the last four years since 2020 has received the $9,750 assessment. [7:38] **Joe Wicklund:** You can kind of see that as we come into 2024 projects that we're talking about in '23, we do have a bit of a history now of doing these types of projects. Although it seems like a short time ago, it was a full pandemic ago that David and I were bouncing around Johnson, Portland, and Carlson Roads for an entire summer in our first round in 2020. And you can kind of see how it's laid out the last few years, and we'll embrace the Ugstad project, which will be pretty extensive this upcoming summer. And as always, we walk the public through the expected calendar of events and schedule for this particular 2024 project. April 6th was the first public information meeting. Tonight we're at our first public hearing. And next up will be when David has the plans at roughly 30%. We’ll bring everybody back in this summer and be able to speak to real specific changes related to different property owners' properties and their kind of interactions with the road as it changes. So now David can dive into the specificity of this particular project. [8:37] **David Bolf (City Engineer):** Yeah, so again, this map here before you just outlines the project segments. We have two segments: one is Hermantown Road from Highway 2 to Ugstad Road, and then the second section is Old Midway from Midway to Midway. And this slide here is a combination of—on the left-hand side, you can see kind of a breakdown of construction costs, and then on the right-hand side, you have the construction costs at about $3.4 million, and then all the soft costs bring the total cost to about $4.4 million. And this next slide takes that $4.4 million of cost and shows how we're planning to fund this project. So part of it is storm water utility funds, about a million dollars in assessments, and the bulk of it through the general levy. [9:36] **David Bolf (City Engineer):** And again, here these are the two different sections of road that we're proposing. The top section is the section for the reclaim and overlay where we will put some new Class 5, grade the existing bituminous, and then put new bituminous down and then also do some ditching. And then the bottom section is the full reconstruction where we have two feet of subcut and we're building a brand new road base and having the four inches of bituminous on there as well. [10:30] **David Bolf (City Engineer):** Okay, I guess with that, if there's any questions that the Council has, I would be free to answer any of those. [10:45] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Any questions? Anything we need to get to from your end? [10:55] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** No, just now you would open it up to the public. [11:00] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** As part of the public hearing, we're going to open it up for public comment. If anyone wishes to comment either in person or online, we'd ask that you start with your name and address. If you're online—and if you're in Chambers and want to speak—please step forward to the podium and get a hold of the microphone there and give us your name and address. [11:27] **Dennis Lofald (Public):** Okay, somebody's got to be first. Uh, Dennis Lofald, 5464 Hermantown Road. Respectfully, the first comment is: it's about time. They've always been terrible for a long time. I'm for the project; it’s needed it forever. Especially since it's the Hermantown Road, it actually is the namesake of the city; it's kind of been embarrassing. A couple of concerns just to be added in with the project or to make sure occur with the project, I guess. One is, a number of us on the road do have concerns about once it gets fixed. It's a narrow road but it's a straight artery right through town, and people who are now taking Morris Thomas or Maple Grove are going to take Hermantown. And being that it will be a narrow road compared to those other two roads, they're going to go the same speed. It could create some dangerous conditions. So I want to make sure that built into that plan is how to figure out how to slow people down a little bit. That can happen. [12:50] **Dennis Lofald (Public):** A little concerned about there is a lot—actually a lot of bicycle and pedestrian traffic on it too, and how are we going to keep those people safe? Not as many small children as there used to be, but I got a feeling that's going to change here in the near future too. Another point is drainage. The ditches right now do not drain well. Some of them do, some don't. There's a lot of, what do I say, creeks, ditches, etc., that come through, come across the road. I'm hoping that they make sure that those ditches actually drain towards those points so that we can reduce some of the water logs coming through there. And the culverts—it seems like most of the roads that Hermantown tends to build, if there's a culvert or a water line or something like that that goes underneath the road, within two years it's become a terrible speed bump. Now, it will slow people down, it'll also take off mufflers—maybe it's planned into it that way. [14:15] **Dennis Lofald (Public):** So, I don't believe there's any plans right now for water or sewer going through there. There are some people on the road who would like it; there's some who wouldn't necessarily. But if there is any plans to put it through, it doesn't make a lot of sense to put the road in first, but I guess the road needs to be fixed. And then the Midway River bridge—it is the Midway River bridge, it's not the Rocky Run bridge like the map says; it is the Midway River. That's kind of a landmark around there. I know people who fish through it and people who go there just to sit by the bridge. I'm hoping it stays a nice bridge instead of culverts. I mean, it's a great flowage through there with all the rocks. It's great for kids to play; they go from one side to the other. Trout like it in there. So I really would like to see that bridge stay a bridge instead of a culvert. I think that's mostly what I had to say. Thank you. [15:20] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Thank you, Mr. Lofald. I'll ask our city engineer to address some of your points. [15:30] **David Bolf (City Engineer):** Speed—we have a speed limit of 30 west of Midway Road on Hermantown Road right now. [15:40] **Dennis Lofald (Public):** [Off-mic question about road width] [15:45] **David Bolf (City Engineer):** Good question. The width of the roadway... our survey will determine that, but we have a standard in that the road is going to look and feel very similar to LaVaque Junction. It's 24 feet of blacktop and two-foot shoulders. So anybody that lives out on Hermantown Road, if you drive LaVaque Junction, that's the feel of the road. And on your drainage and ditches, it would be similar to LaVaque Junction. So we heard both at the public information meeting and between meetings here this evening about different areas of drainage concerns. So once we have our survey and we dive into it, that's one of the big things that we do is we'll look at the centerline culverts, we'll look at the area that drains to these centerline culverts, and size these culverts accordingly. [16:54] **David Bolf (City Engineer):** And as far as culverts heaving because of frost—one of the ways we minimize that is we call it a culvert treatment where we put sand at a taper leading into and out of that culvert. So instead of having a hard dip, you have more of a soft... it doesn't move like this; it moves more on a gradual plane than on a vertical plane. And the bridge question is a separate construction project. So it's a different project, but I can answer that as well. So we hired LHB to design us a new bridge and we went through the preliminary process. We looked at both box culverts and a bridge, and because of the rock and because of elevations, we've decided it's going to be a bridge. So it'll have—instead of having two spans that there are today—there'll be one span. So we'll have two abutments and then one span on, and it likely will be about a foot to two feet higher than it is today. [18:10] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Thank you. Is there any more public comment? Would you please step forward and state your name and address? [18:19] **Susan Anderson (Public):** My name is Susan Anderson, I'm at 3959 Old Midway Road and I share similar concerns to Mr. Lofald. I'm not completely for having our road paved, but I'm not totally against it either. Our road is basically an alley to our homes used only by the people who live there and as a service road for our mail carrier and delivery services. I could deal with our road as is with some patching. However, it seems that a good number of our culverts across the road and at our driveways are a problem. With the current flooding, this has become very obvious. The most recent repairs made to our road were at the culverts crossing the road after the flood of 2012. These areas are currently the biggest problems on our road. They started collapsing right away after the repairs. Whatever is done to improve our road now must absolutely be better than what was done in 2012 or don't bother doing it—it would be a waste of time. [19:35] **Susan Anderson (Public):** If this goes forward, I ask that you keep the project as simple as possible while still providing good quality, long-lasting work. Also, as with all new roads, I'm concerned with speeding vehicles. We now have many young children on our road. In our road's current condition, we have built-in speed bumps which have kept the traffic slower. If a new road goes in, we will all need to be more vigilant, and extra police patrol would be appreciated. Thank you for listening to my concerns. [19:58] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Thank you, Susan. Is there anyone else? Please step forward and state your name and address. [20:00] **Alan Van Loon (Public):** Hi, my name is Alan Van Loon, I live at 5426 Hermantown Road. I have one request and one question. At least one person here knows that I'm an IT person for a living, and I live in what would be called an internet desert. There is no cable; there's nothing there. So if you could consider working with the cable companies to perhaps get cable down the road, you would be my heroes for years to come. The second one is just a question. The notice states that the assessment will be per parcel, and I would just like clarification on: if I have a section that's on Hermantown Road and a separate parcel tax-wise behind it, is that two separate parcels? And then I actually own another parcel farther down the road that fronts onto Ugstad Road but is the same distance back from Hermantown Road as it is from Ugstad Road—would that be considered getting a benefit to that? How is that going to be charged? Am I going to be charged one assessment, two assessments, three assessments? [21:13] **David Bolf (City Engineer):** I think as far as determining the number of assessments per parcel, we have to look at... sit down at a table during some business time and look at each individual case because everyone is different, and it would be hard to dissect and give you an answer to that right now. [21:25] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Mr. Mulder may have an answer on the internet portion. [21:28] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** Yeah, so I get to be your hero tonight, whether you like the answer or not. Mediacom has received a grant from the State of Minnesota. They are planning on running fiber up and down Hermantown Road. I think that'll happen this year or next. Their project brings fiber to the home, so it'll run fiber in front of your house, and then if you become a subscriber to Mediacom—which says it's good and bad—they'll run fiber to the house. And then once it's in the house, it goes to coax. [22:08] **Alan Van Loon (Public):** I'm assuming there will be an in-per-foot charge? [22:11] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** There is not. They are doing that with their own money and the State grant. [22:15] **Alan Van Loon (Public):** You are my heroes tonight! [22:18] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** I mean, it'll be a service that you'll have to subscribe to, but yes, there are plans for that. [22:25] **Alan Van Loon (Public):** All right, I'll listen for more information then on the billing portion. Thank you. [22:30] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** There may be a press release on the internet portion in the next month or two. Any other questions or comments from anyone in Chambers or online? If so, please state your name and address. [22:59] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Is there any more comments for the public hearing on the Hermantown Road reconstruction? This will be the last opportunity for public comment. If so, please state your name and address. [23:22] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** And we will close the public comment period and move on to the resolution. Resolution 2023-43: Resolution ordering improvement and directing preparation of final plans and specifications for 2024 Road Improvement District Number 541, Hermantown Road and Old Midway Road. Do we have a Council motion in relation to this? [23:56] **Councilor John Geissler:** Move that resolution just as you read it. [23:58] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Thank you, motion by Councilor Geissler. Do we have a second? [24:00] **Councilor Brian LeBlanc:** Second that. [24:05] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Now we don't need any more explanation from our City Administrator, but do any of the counselors have comments at this time? [24:08] **Councilor Andy Hjelle:** Mr. Mayor, I just had one question. Mrs. Anderson asked about the quality of the road. And I know it was discussed, but David, maybe you can just reiterate that it's not a patch, but we're building a road for a 25-year-old or what have you? [24:28] **David Bolf (City Engineer):** Yeah, so I think the question that I'm hearing is they want some kind of assurance that we're building a quality road, something that's not going to fall apart. And that was one of the questions that was brought up at the public information meeting. My response to that is we're designing this to meet our rural standard for a roadway, and so we're designing to that. And then we'll hire a contractor to do the work, and then we will inspect that to ensure that the road gets built according to our specifications. And a reminder: this is a road improvement; it's not a correction or a cure-all that we don't have control over, you know, the spring runoff or the frost. So we're improving what's there today, and the life expectancy for these types of roads is about 25 years. [25:35] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Thank you. Any other comments from Council? Can we have a roll call, please? [25:56] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Geissler? [26:00] **Councilor Geissler:** Aye. [26:01] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Hjelle? [26:02] **Councilor Hjelle:** Aye. [26:03] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor LeBlanc? [26:04] **Councilor LeBlanc:** Aye. [26:05] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Jones? [26:06] **Councilor Jones:** Aye. [26:07] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Mayor Boucher? [26:08] **Mayor Boucher:** Aye. [26:09] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Next we'll move to communications. Mr. Mulder, you have one communication highlighted here. [26:14] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** Yeah, this is in fact from the Mediacom Director of Governmental Affairs talking about the expansion of broadband services in the southwest part of the city, which includes Hermantown Road. If you want, I can provide a map of that for you. [26:30] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Thank you. No presentations at this time. Public discussion on items not on the agenda—there will be a time for public discussion on our items that we vote on later under each item. Does anybody have any items of general public discussion for the Council at this time? Is there any general public discussion for the Council? We ask that you limit your time to three minutes per person. [27:04] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Last opportunity for public discussion. If you wish to discuss anything, please state your name and address. We'll close the general public discussion and move on to the consent agenda, which includes the approval or correction of the April 3rd, 2023 City Council minutes and accounts payable from April 1st to April 15th in the amount of $437,305.90. Do we have a motion on the consent agenda? [27:42] **Councilor Andy Hjelle:** Motion to approve. [27:44] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Motion by Councilor Hjelle. Do you have a second? [27:46] **Councilor Jones:** Second. [27:47] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Second by Councilor Jones. Roll call, please. [27:49] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Hjelle? [27:51] **Councilor Hjelle:** Aye. [27:52] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor LeBlanc? [27:53] **Councilor LeBlanc:** Aye. [27:54] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Jones? [27:55] **Councilor Jones:** Aye. [27:56] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Geissler? [27:57] **Councilor Geissler:** Aye. [27:58] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Mayor Boucher? [27:59] **Mayor Boucher:** Aye. [28:00] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** We have no ordinances this evening. Resolutions. Resolution 2023-44: Resolution authorizing and directing Mayor and City Clerk to execute and deliver an agreement for engineering services with a total not-to-exceed contract amount of $339,140 for 2024 Road Improvement District Number 541, Hermantown Road and Old Midway Road, with Northland Consulting Engineers. Do we have a motion? [28:30] **Councilor Brian LeBlanc:** Motion to approve. [28:32] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Motion by Councilor LeBlanc. Do we have a second? [28:34] **Councilor Jones:** Second. [28:35] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Second by Councilor Jones. Do we need any more explanation on this, Mr. Mulder? [28:42] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** Well, you ordered the project. And, giving Council discussion, I think Councilor Geissler has something he's going to say. [28:50] **Councilor John Geissler:** I do. I actually have two things to say on this one. As we discussed in the pre-agenda, the amount of $339,140... you know, it's quite a bit less than the engineer's original estimate, and I think it's a good value for what we're getting. We had some discussion at the last meeting about whether to hire an outside consultant or not, so I think this is good demonstration that we made the right decision. And then lastly, my son works for Northland Consulting Engineers, and the result of this contract is no financial benefit to either he or I. [29:30] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Thank you. Is there any other counselors with comments? I’ll open this up to public comment. Is there anyone that wishes to comment on this resolution? Is there any public comment on Resolution 2023-44? If anyone wishes to comment on this resolution, please state your name and address. Roll call, please. [30:04] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor LeBlanc? [30:05] **Councilor LeBlanc:** Aye. [30:06] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Jones? [30:07] **Councilor Jones:** Aye. [30:08] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Geissler? [30:09] **Councilor Geissler:** Aye. [30:10] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Hjelle? [30:11] **Councilor Hjelle:** Aye. [30:12] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Mayor Boucher? [30:13] **Mayor Boucher:** Aye. [30:15] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Resolution 2023-45: Resolution approving authorization for professional services for geotechnical evaluation services by EPC Engineering and Testing. Do we have a motion? [30:20] **Councilor John Geissler:** So moved. [30:25] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Thank you, Councilor Geissler. Do we have a second? [30:27] **Councilor Andy Hjelle:** Second. [30:30] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Second by Councilor Hjelle. Mr. Mulder? [30:35] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** So this... we have a Master Service Agreement with EPC and with Braun, and as we go to each project, we ask them for a quote on this specific project. EPC's quote was lower than Braun's, and this would be to conduct soil borings along Hermantown Road so that we can have a better understanding of exactly what kind of road—what kind of conditions the roadbed is in—to see what kind of corrections we may need to make as we look at the design of that work. [31:05] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Thank you. Do we have any questions or comments from Council? [31:08] **Councilor Brian LeBlanc:** Should there be a price associated to this or is it...? [31:11] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** It is in the packet. It's $27,750, I believe. [31:13] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Just, I mean, just normally we see the price as part of the resolution, so just curious. [31:19] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** Saving on the preliminary estimate was $30,000, yes. [31:25] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** There's another $2,000 you're saving. Yeah. Any other questions or comments? Any public comment on this resolution? Is there any public comment on Resolution 2023-45? There is any public comment on this resolution, please start with your name and address. Roll call, please. [31:58] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Jones? [31:59] **Councilor Jones:** Aye. [32:00] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Geissler? [32:01] **Councilor Geissler:** Aye. [32:02] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Hjelle? [32:03] **Councilor Hjelle:** Aye. [32:04] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor LeBlanc? [32:05] **Councilor LeBlanc:** Aye. [32:06] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Mayor Boucher? [32:07] **Mayor Boucher:** Aye. [32:15] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Resolution 2023-46: Resolution creating a prioritized bridge replacement list for the City of Hermantown. Do we have a motion? [32:23] **Councilor Andy Hjelle:** Motion to approve. [32:25] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Motion by Councilor Hjelle. Do we have a second? [32:27] **Councilor Jones:** Second. [32:28] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Second by Councilor Jones. Mr. Mulder? [32:30] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** So we're asking the City Council to prioritize the bridge over whether it's the Midway River or the Rocky Run—the one on the Hermantown Road—to prioritize this. This is an important project for [the city] and we have plans to move forward, but doing this, our hope is that that would give us the prospect of getting State Bridge bonding money from the state to pay for a portion of that cost. [33:05] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Thank you. Any questions or comments from Council? [33:08] **Councilor Andy Hjelle:** How many bridges are on this list? [33:10] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** This is the only one on our list. It's the priority bridge. [33:14] **Councilor Andy Hjelle:** I'm just trying to think of another bridge in the city. [33:16] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** The Hermantown [Road] because we're going to move on [from the old one]. [33:18] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** Years ago, the city engineer gave me the definition of "bridge," and to be honest, I don't remember what it was. The other ones that we do have... I can tell you a couple of them that we do have. The other one is on Sundby Road—I don't... that was a bridge, I don't know if it now maybe a culvert, but we have three or four bridges. We're taking one out on Lindahl Road. There's another one that we have... I think the culvert on Okerstrom right as you get into the park; that culvert might be labeled a bridge as well because of its size. [33:50] **Councilor Andy Hjelle:** Okay. I'm just most pleased to hear that it is going to be a bridge and not a box culvert. I think that will serve it well, and the fact that it's getting raised up a couple of feet, I think that's good too. [34:00] **David Bolf (City Engineer):** Yeah, and I would just like to add the quick definition of the bridge by MnDOT standards: one pipe, whether it's a pipe, a culvert, or bridge, if it spans 10 feet or it crosses the centerline of the road. So a box culvert that's 10 feet wide is considered a bridge. I believe we have six bridges in the city; we're taking one offline, so we've got five. [34:25] **Councilor Andy Hjelle:** Great, thank you. [34:28] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Any other questions or comments from Council? Is there any public input on this resolution? If so, state your name and address. Any public input on Resolution 2023-46? Last opportunity for public input on this resolution. Roll call, please. [34:52] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Geissler? [34:53] **Councilor Geissler:** Aye. [34:54] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Hjelle? [34:55] **Councilor Hjelle:** Aye. [34:56] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor LeBlanc? [34:57] **Councilor LeBlanc:** Aye. [34:58] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Jones? [34:59] **Councilor Jones:** Aye. [35:00] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Mayor Boucher? [35:01] **Mayor Boucher:** Aye. [35:04] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Resolution 2023-47: Resolution receiving bids and awarding contract for Road Improvement District Number 538—Richard Avenue, Lindgren Road, Stevie Drive, and a frontage road, and Sam's Way—in the amount of $2,209,180. Do we have a motion? [35:28] **Councilor Andy Hjelle:** Motion to approve. [35:30] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Motion by Councilor Hjelle. Do we have a second? [35:32] **Councilor Jones:** Second. [35:34] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Second by Councilor Jones. Mr. Mulder? [35:36] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** So this project will replace all of the streets in kind of what we call the Hermantown Marketplace, and between LaVaque Road and Haynes, south of Maple Grove up to Market Street. We will extend Richard from Maple Grove all the way to Lindgren. We'll replace Lindgren with an urban street, so it'll no longer be gravel; it'll be curb, gutter, and sidewalk. And then we'll repave and recondition all the other pavement in that district. Slightly over budget, but because we're getting $750,000 in state grant money, we believe that we want to pursue that this year. We originally had scheduled this for 2022, but because of right-of-way acquisition issues, planning all that, we've pushed it off into '23. [36:25] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Thank you. Any questions or comments from Council? Hearing none, is there any public input on this resolution? Is there any public input on Resolution 2023-47? If anyone wishes to speak to the Council about this resolution, please state your name and address. Roll call, please. [36:58] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Hjelle? [36:59] **Councilor Hjelle:** Aye. [37:00] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor LeBlanc? [37:01] **Councilor LeBlanc:** Aye. [37:02] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Jones? [37:03] **Councilor Jones:** Aye. [37:04] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Geissler? [37:05] **Councilor Geissler:** Aye. [37:06] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Mayor Boucher? [37:07] **Mayor Boucher:** Aye. [37:10] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Resolution 2023-48: Resolution authorizing and directing Mayor and City Clerk to execute and deliver an agreement for materials testing services for Road Improvement District Number 538—Richard Avenue, Lindgren Road, Stevie Drive, and the frontage road and Sam's Way. Do we have a motion? [37:28] **Councilor John Geissler:** [Motion] [37:30] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Second by Councilor Geissler. Mr. Mulder? [37:34] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** So earlier I heard you approved a proposal from geotechnical evaluations. You do geotechnical evaluations when you're designing the road. Then when you start building the road, you do material testing. So this, again... we have a Master Service Agreement with Braun and EPC for this kind of work. EPC was the low quote. In our purchasing policy, if the quote is less than $25,000, I can sign off on that. But if it's more than $25,000, it comes to the City Council. So this was at $25,662, so it's coming to the City Council for material testing for this road project. [38:13] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Thank you. Any questions or comments from Council? [38:17] **Councilor Brian LeBlanc:** So does the company doing the work not test the material as it goes down? [38:22] **David Bolf (City Engineer):** So the question is: is the contractor doing the work required to do their own testing? In the MnDOT world, there's a couple of different terms: one's called quality control and one's called quality assurance. So the quality control is testing that's done by the contractor. An example of that would be their aggregate coming from their pit—they have to make sure that its gradation meets the Class 5 specification, the sand specification. Additionally, any product that they're [supplying]—bituminous or concrete—they have to provide tests that they're meeting our specification. So on the owner's side, we do the quality assurance. So it's a kind of a checks-and-balances that we do independent tests once the material is delivered to the site, that in-place material meets the [specification]—it's called the material control schedule or material testing control. And so that's what EPC does on our behalf is make sure that the contractor's testing is correct and accurate. [39:35] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** The short answer in the words of Ronald Reagan: "trust but verify." [39:40] **Councilor Brian LeBlanc:** It just seems... it just seems like it's an additional cost that, I mean, I guess is out of our control. But I feel like the contractor should be held to a high standard; we shouldn't have to pay to verify that they're being held to that standard. [39:55] **David Bolf (City Engineer):** And in this particular [case], there's a certain amount of truth to that. But in the case because we're receiving money from the state, they do require this and actually a higher level of testing than we would under a local road improvement. [40:10] **Councilor Brian LeBlanc:** I understand that, but we don't inspect the lumber that goes into the homes, do we, on the job site? [40:15] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** We inspect the construction. [40:17] **Councilor Brian LeBlanc:** Yeah, but that's not what we're doing. [40:19] **David Bolf (City Engineer):** Not only checking gradation, but they're checking the compaction as well, right? I don't know... I kind of think it's a good idea that it's not just the contractor saying, "My stuff's okay." [40:35] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** We've had it happen. Yes. Any other questions or comments from Council? Any public input on this resolution? Is there anyone from the public that wishes to speak to Resolution 2023-48? If anyone wishes to speak to this resolution, please state your name and address. Roll call, please. [41:20] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor LeBlanc? [41:21] **Councilor LeBlanc:** Aye. [41:22] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Jones? [41:23] **Councilor Jones:** Aye. [41:24] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Geissler? [41:25] **Councilor Geissler:** Aye. [41:26] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Hjelle? [41:27] **Councilor Hjelle:** Aye. [41:28] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Mayor Boucher? [41:29] **Mayor Boucher:** Aye. [41:33] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Resolution 2023-49: Resolution requesting advanced funding for the City of Hermantown from Municipal State Aid funds for SAP 202-101-014 and SAP 202-104-012 in the amount of $1,480,000. Do we have a resolution? [41:53] **Councilor Andy Hjelle:** Motion to approve. [41:55] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Motion by Councilor Hjelle. Do we have a second? [41:57] **Councilor Jones:** Second. [41:58] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Second by Councilor Jones. Mr. Mulder? [42:00] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** Look, this is simply having the City Council request from the State of Minnesota to advance money that we would normally get under Municipal State Aid to fund this project, the Ugstad Road project. That money will then... but you will use the federal money to pay that back when we receive the federal money on the federal fiscal year that starts in October. [42:30] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Thank you. Any questions or comments from Council? [42:33] **Councilor Brian LeBlanc:** I just wanted to ask if... if we've looked at how this is going to affect our plans, you know, in the coming years. But it sounds like we're going to be able to pay the money back? [42:41] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** Yeah, and the funds will be available as we need them. And we have a schedule of how we're going to use Municipal State Aid throughout the year. So the nice part about this is in 2024, because we're doing Hermantown Road, we won't be using any State Aid roads. So we'll have basically to take a year off, and so that they'll be able to come up with the project later on. [43:05] **David Bolf (City Engineer):** And I would just like to add to that, Council, that it's a common practice between the counties and municipalities in the State of Minnesota. It's an opportunity to fund your project on somebody else's dollar for zero percent financing. So as long as you, you know, stay within your means, it's a good avenue to advance construct these projects. [43:25] **Councilor Brian LeBlanc:** I just didn't want to see us use, you know, our $500,000 for '24 and '25 and then go to use a project in '25 and use our money for '26 and '27... [43:32] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** Yeah, seems like a slippery slope, but as long as we have a plan and it works, that's good. I look on page 92 of your budget booklet... '24, we're going to use some for our crack sealant Arrowhead; 2025, we've got some scheduled for Lindahl Road; 2026, Denver mill and overlay; but nothing scheduled for '27 right now. [44:00] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** And I'd like to comment that through my time on Council, there's been times where the one-year amount is just not enough to do a project, and we're lucky that we can ask for early payment of a little bit of money ahead. You know, if you're going to build a mile of road and it's $1.5 million, there's three years' worth—you bundle it all together and get it done. Any other comments from Council? Is there any public input on this resolution? Any public input on the resolution for the advancement of Municipal State Aid funding request? If anyone wishes to speak to the Council on this, please state your name and address. Roll call, please. [44:50] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Jones? [44:51] **Councilor Jones:** Aye. [44:52] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Geissler? [44:53] **Councilor Geissler:** Aye. [44:54] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Hjelle? [44:55] **Councilor Hjelle:** Aye. [44:56] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor LeBlanc? [44:57] **Councilor LeBlanc:** Aye. [44:58] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Mayor Boucher? [44:59] **Mayor Boucher:** Aye. [45:04] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Resolution 2023-50: Resolution receiving bids and awarding contract for a second water connection to the City of Duluth in the amount of $42,400. Do we have a motion? [45:20] **Councilor Brian LeBlanc:** [Motion] [45:23] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Do we have a second? [45:25] **Councilor Andy Hjelle:** Second. [45:27] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Second by Councilor Hjelle. Mr. Mulder? [45:30] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** So this is [to] put in a pipe connecting to the City of Duluth water system under Haynes Road so that we can connect to that in the future, but we'll get that work done prior to St. Louis County redoing Haynes Road. [45:42] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Thank you. Any questions or comments from Council? [45:45] **Councilor John Geissler:** Seems like a relatively cheap insurance policy to buy in the event that our one connection goes south. [45:50] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** So, and I like the idea of doing it now before the road’s constructed instead of having to wait if something went wrong in the future. Any other comments? Is there any public input on this resolution? We have an opportunity for public input on Resolution 2023-50. This will be the last opportunity for public input on Resolution 2023-50. Roll call, please. [46:25] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Geissler? [46:26] **Councilor Geissler:** Aye. [46:27] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Hjelle? [46:28] **Councilor Hjelle:** Aye. [46:29] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor LeBlanc? [46:30] **Councilor LeBlanc:** Aye. [46:31] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Jones? [46:32] **Councilor Jones:** Aye. [46:33] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Mayor Boucher? [46:34] **Mayor Boucher:** Aye. [46:38] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Next is Resolution 2023-51: Resolution approving a grant agreement between the City of Hermantown and the Twins Community Fund and authorizing and directing the Mayor and City Clerk to execute and deliver such grant agreement. Do you have a motion? [46:58] **Councilor John Geissler:** Motion. [47:00] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Motion by Councilor Geissler. Do we have a second? [47:01] **Councilor Brian LeBlanc:** Second. [47:02] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Second by Councilor LeBlanc. Mr. Mulder? [47:05] **John Mulder (City Administrator):** So we applied for—I should say Eric, we'll give Eric Johnson the credit for this—Eric applied for a grant to the Minnesota Twins Community Fund for some grant money that we could apply for a particular park. So we did receive a $10,000 grant. We're going to put that toward improving the dugouts in the renewed—in the new fields—so that they kind of match what baseball is expecting. [47:35] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Thank you. Any questions or comments? [47:37] **Councilor Brian LeBlanc:** Is there a time limit associated with this grant? Like are we going to get the fields turned and get the dugouts where they're supposed to be before this grant expires? [47:45] **Eric Johnson (Community Development Director):** When we made the application for the original grant, it indicated that this would be a '24 project and we made the award so, no, we fall within the timeframes that there are. [47:55] **Councilor Andy Hjelle:** Any other comments or questions? Could we ask for it again next year? [48:00] **Eric Johnson (Community Development Director):** There's always the opportunity. This is the second time that we've received the same grant. So I'm willing to look in any and all grant opportunities that come up. And I do want to thank Jim Sonneson of our Park Board; he's the one who originally did come up with this as well, and I just followed it from there. [48:25] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Thank you. Thank you. Anything else from Council? Is there any public input on Resolution 2023-51? We have an opportunity for public comment on this resolution; if so, please state your name and address. Is there any public input or comment on this resolution? Roll call, please. [49:05] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Hjelle? [49:06] **Councilor Hjelle:** Aye. [49:07] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor LeBlanc? [49:08] **Councilor LeBlanc:** Aye. [49:09] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Jones? [49:10] **Councilor Jones:** Aye. [49:11] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Geissler? [49:12] **Councilor Geissler:** Aye. [49:13] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Mayor Boucher? [49:14] **Mayor Boucher:** Aye. [49:15] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Next we have a motion to close the meeting of the Hermantown City Council pursuant to Minnesota Statutes section 13D.05 subdivision 3 to consider confidential information under the attorney-client privilege in regard to the City of Hermantown's settlement negotiations of a PRA health insurance claim. Following this closed session, the Hermantown City Council will reconvene in an open session. Do we have a motion to move to closed session? [49:50] **Councilor Andy Hjelle:** Motion to move to closed session. [49:52] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Motion by Councilor Hjelle. Do you have a second? [49:54] **Councilor John Geissler:** Second. [49:56] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** Second by Councilor Geissler. Roll call, please. [49:58] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Hjelle? [49:59] **Councilor Hjelle:** Aye. [50:00] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor LeBlanc? [50:01] **Councilor LeBlanc:** Aye. [50:02] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Jones? [50:03] **Councilor Jones:** Aye. [50:04] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Councilor Geissler? [50:05] **Councilor Geissler:** Aye. [50:06] **Alissa McClure (City Clerk):** Mayor Boucher? [50:07] **Mayor Boucher:** Aye. [50:08] **Mayor Wayne Boucher:** We are now in closed session.