[0:00] **Joe Wicklund**: Joe Wicklund, I'm the communications director for the city of Hermantown and uh similar to the two meetings public meetings we've done on the community recreation initiative earlier tonight we're going to focus on a third component project the indoor sheet of ice or the new Arena and answer questions about that both how the workings of the referendum the questions and what's possible with local option sales tax as well as having our folks from Krause Anderson and dsgw talk about the design pieces and what preliminarily what we're going to look for and what's possible with what we're voting on in November um we've got a handful of folks in the audience and we know folks will be watching this online so we've got some questions already teed up but we're going to dive into a bit of the presentation out of the blocks [0:47] **Joe Wicklund**: let me call that up quick and for folks at a high level who are experiencing this for the first time there's there's kind of more of a long history to this than people are sometimes aware of with community recreation initiative there's workings on both individual projects like the arena the trails and fitness that have been the works for nearly a decade but the idea of being able to fund one or any of these projects with local option sales tax really started to coalesce in about 2018 2019. if there were two kind of driving reasons for that one was that the success that we were about to experience and have experienced since then funding the essential Wellness Center uh in that manner and getting feedback from Folks at the legislative level that the success that we were having and the Partnerships that we were making uh and leveraging local option sales tax in that way we're being viewed as a positive across the state and the second was again those kind of three individual projects and the supporters of that finding and working and to find creative ways to make something that was always Out Of Reach you know Citywide trail system a reimagining of a more Central Park at fickner Park and a much needed sense of a second ice or a second more upgraded Arena we're kind of able to find their way to to the city at the same time we were looking at local option sales tax a uh in 2019 which is when my position was hired City this was one of the first projects that we were uh faced with how do we build something as an idea that would get legislative approval to give residents a chance to [2:21] **Joe Wicklund**: vote on it and that was given a careful consideration by the state legislators and put on to the ballot approval to put on the ballot right at a meeting that was probably one of the last ones before they closed down uh everything for covet so that put a big giant pause button on everything not only in regards to this particular referendum but so many other things in the community it was an easy move forward for the legislature to then include it in this year's uh ballot but obviously there was some impacts and changes during that time that I'll talk about today but if we dial it down specifically today the local option sales tax reference random on this particular question and again I'll talk about all three questions today but again we're focused on the potential indoor sheet of ice today allows for 10.84 million dollars for the additional indoor sheet of ice a lot of the discussion about the changes that have happened since this was originally proposed to the legislator have been about the change in cost and the change uh in what it would make to construct some of the things that made sense in 2019-20 compared to 2223 where if this passes that's when some of those things would come into into favor so there were two different bills throughout the session this year one in the tax bill that allowed for increases around 10 to 15 percent on each one of the component projects the community recreation initiative and then also specific to the arena because it is a unique project that has a different type of regional impact uh upwards of four million dollars in bonding that late in the bonding Bill uh obviously those did not [3:55] **Joe Wicklund**: move forward at the legislature even though there was quite a bit of talk about it and at this point obviously a special session went from highly unlikely to whatever is more highly unlikely than highly unlikely but those questions still come up so we did you know it's important for folks to know that both of those options were existing in our state legislator and folks were working toward that but it didn't it didn't come to fruition one of the other regular questions that comes up uh are the ballot questions themselves also in the tax bill was the idea that we would combine or we would be able to combine the community recreation initiative down to one question that'll allow for a lot more clarity in what we're doing and and both from the city perspective and from the community perspective we've always looked at this Recreation initiative as one thing with three components the the driving force behind this that was also kind of the same driving force behind the essential Wellness Center was the idea that St Louis county is one of the bottom quartile counties for health outcomes and so kind of attacking that statistic in a positive through the wellness center and through outdoor recreation opportunities is how we feel like we can move that as a whole so certainly makes sense to look at these as three separate things but we've always looked at them as uh one when we went through the process changes from you know like 1819 into 2122 uh in the laws and that the legislative acts is why that has to be now three separate questions again in the tax bill we were hoping that there would be a change to make it one but no special session no tax bill no bonding bill so at this moment still three separate questions for clarity's sake [5:27] **Joe Wicklund**: one two or three of the projects can pass they're not linked together it's not an if this then this or these two equal this third one two or three or zero can pass but it's important for folks to realize that whether one two or three past the sales tax increase will be the same so it will be a half percent increase to our sales tax regardless of whether it's just the trails or just ficker park or just the arena um the change between those because obviously those are different dollar amounts to bring those projects to fruition will be the time that the sales tax is in effect there's definitely been some banter about how taxes never go away that is also different than a law change in regards to how local option sales tax works now as this sales tax will be sunset as part of this so when the projects reach their point where they've matured enough and we've been able to pay off the bonding that the city council is likely to ask for to allow us to start these projects right away that will be the sunset on this so current sales tax would return when this expires for folks who are you know sales tax wonks and are really into this stuff they might know that our sales tax is lower than our largest neighbor right now Duluth has that sales tax that is a half percent higher than ours if this goes forward with any of these projects or all three we would then be equal to Duluth so concerns about people making some different choices in their shopping behaviors are certainly you know a consideration in this process but in [6:57] **Joe Wicklund**: this case we won't be unlike our largest neighbor will actually be coming to the same level as them and some folks I'm a deluthian they added that half percent sales tax in the not too distant past for Duluth they focused it on some pretty specific Street repairs so that'll give you an idea of what local option sales tax can do so where they're fixing a few streets and we're doing that on the city Side this is a chance to kind of impact community-wide some health initiatives and some health opportunities some Recreation opportunities with this half percent in the blue box that you can see up on the screen it looks a little bit specific about the possibility of the indoor sheet of ice the new Arena the economic impact we did a study with the University of Minnesota Duluth at the start of this kind of possibility of this even before it was on the ballot the economic impact of adding a second indoor sheet of ice allowing folks like haha I have more tournaments to offer broader participation not just for folks in our community but outside as expected return of more than two million dollars annually so that's a pretty positive economic return even compared to the other two projects a little tougher to measure that with you know fickner Park and the trails but obviously in this case we're able to do that a little bit current Arena does not meet the community needs again there's a bit of subjectivity to that but it is a fact that we do have families who have approached us on the city side and I know I've talked to the hockey community and the school Community quite a bit that there is challenges in that we're finding ice time in other counties as far as Carlton other communities and states and Superior to be able to meet the needs of families operating in the [8:31] **Joe Wicklund**: ice a lot of that has to do with the growth of the sport primarily in the girls side of the last several years but we also have adults in the community who grew up playing hockey and it's still a big passion of theirs and they don't have a chance to really get on the ice at reasonable hours so so our Arena's done a great job of of serving the needs of our community as it grew but they're they're PR they're pretty active and pretty loud no matter how I'm pretty clear about how maxed out they are there are folks that want to be participating in this experience that are simply timed out based on the size of the indoor ice we have right now uh finalizing a partnership with the school and works in a way that works best for the school of Resident needs one of the questions that has come up through this process is hey when will we know exactly down to the nuts and bolts how this works with the school and we're still ironing that out because it's a big commitment a big partnership but on the city Side some parts have become more clear and that's kind of exciting because we've always wanted to do this in a way that fits with the school and their needs first and that in turn will kind of flow right to the residents so if it ends up in a situation where the ownership of the arena is best for the school that's the direction we would want to go as a city or if it's best to have a joint Powers agreement and the school feels that way that's the way we want to go if it's best for us to own both Arenas we've got a lot of openness to that because the bonding Bill didn't go forward there's a lot less strings attached to us what we can do in the city if the bonding Bill had gone forward then there would be more Statewide requirements about how this plays itself out so now we're able to engage the school on greater discussions that serve them not only over the level [10:04] **Joe Wicklund**: long term but in the short term will they make decisions about how they want this to go so the partnership's been fantastic in terms of figuring it out it is not Inked down today but nobody in the process is worried that it wouldn't be um so if the uh particular project here passes will definitely work to that and it'll end up in a way again that works for the school and residents uh final piece that I that comes up pretty regularly whether folks are comfortable asking about it or not or at least just kind of bantering about it online is that hockey gets everything and I think that that uh is is a little bit of a challenging piece to consider because of the notoriety and success that some of our hockey teams boys consistently going down to State and being Champions girls not joining them in that level of consistency but it is important to note that the city provides only three thousand dollars it's the only commitment that actually exists from the city to our hockey program and that covers water for the outdoor ranks that are not only used by the school and those teams but community-wide it's the same amount the three thousand dollars that we provide in water for uh stebner park for the soccer fields and the soccer folks in uh in their season it's not dissimilar to the same amount of money and support that we provide for baseball and softball and Rose Road field and stuff like that um so certainly it's easy to see a team that's on the front page of the sports and the news at times to see as something that has a lot but in reality a lot of their success is really simply because they've [11:39] **Joe Wicklund**: been successful there isn't a extra bit that is happening for them that isn't happening for soccer or baseball or some of the other community groups that we support so it's nice to kind of clear some of that up on the front end um when we talk about the project as a whole again three component projects the trail system which some folks have some experience about we might talk about today folks are interested because they've already had some experiences on the boulder Trail and some of that that's been open through grant funding the Central Park area and fickner Park area re-turfing and reimagining some of that but today our focus is on the additional sheet of indoor ice I've got two folks with me Chad Ronchetti from Krause Anderson, Eric Largen from dsgw we're also going to walk through this Chad I'll put you on the spot first [12:26] **Joe Wicklund**: um you know this is a little bit different project than the other components in that you know as a city we've built Trails we know how to do that we feel really comfortable we can accomplish that you know as we go forward should this pass the park we've reached out for a degree of partnership with nce SAS and some of the design pieces but an arena is a different entity it's a different monster and we see that obviously in the cost associated with it so we went through an RFP process to select a partner that ended up being a group that would guide us through that and that was Krause Anderson your firm so if you could tell us a little bit about how you look at the project of the whole the work that you're doing and how that fits with both obviously this project but uh kind of branches into the other parts as a whole sure uh Carlos [13:12] **Chad Ronchetti**: Krause Anderson Construction yes been through the competitive qualifications process in partnership with dsgw the design partner we were selected as a construction management firm for our experience in the construction of recreational facilities and specifically sheets of ice and also Community event centers so we we've constructed over 400 recreational facilities and 41 sheets of ice and 62 community events centers including Bemidji the Heritage recently the iron Trail Motors up in Virginia also Grand Rapids Civic Center so our experience would come to Bear should the public decide to vote Yes and and um and get this additional sheet of ice [14:00] **Chad Ronchetti**: built the expertise that we bring to bear for you you know cost estimating throughout the entire project as we as we iterate through designs you know systems analysis making sure that systems are fitted properly for the arena and that specifics you know again reaching into our experience of additional sheets of ice and what those systems require making sure that things are on schedule making sure that things are within the budget identified you only get so much out of the sales tax right so how do we then make sure the value engineering is and systems analysis and working with the design team to make sure that we can actually meet the budget provided because there is no extra money you have what you have so and then also that things are on on Time on schedule so that the folks can the kids can start not start playing here instead of staying up until 11 o'clock at night to make sure they're getting their ice time so um that's that's the expertise we were brought on for uh we partnered with dsgw because we have a long-term partnership with them having done multiple Arena projects and I don't know the number but multiple Arena projects across the state in partnership with them so that that is the collaborative relationship we have and it um is efficient in communication uh and efficient in in design and cost estimated even scheduled scheduling so um that's that's us [15:25] **Joe Wicklund**: perfect and Chad you're at 10 10.84 is a locked in number and we'll talk more about what that means in terms of the vote and what folks can do to unlock more um but that's kind of the challenge as we talk about Eric designing something [15:42] **Eric Largen**: that fits with kind of the I don't say the bare minimum requirements but should this pass there's 10.84 million if there's uh philanthropic opportunities then there becomes more to the program than that so let's take a look at what dsgw's put together already and walk us through um what we're looking at here Eric absolutely uh thank you um oh first of all uh in the last couple months our our team of Krause Anderson dsgw uh has has multiple conversations with uh City and Arena staff and and work through some high level design conversations uh to come up with the concept in front of you today um and really the the conversations have revolved around uh kind of two main design goals or philosophies one uh to kind of improve the first impressions on the visitor and the user experience over what the existing facility offers um and the second to increase the quality of equity and availability of locker room team room spaces and other facilities within that building um so I think kind of a good way to to hit on those items is to is to walk through the the concept layout that we have here um and as you saw in that last image um the Arena's really at the geographic center of a lot of recent improvements to the facilities the schools the essential Wellness Center and as such uh it makes sense if there's an opportunity uh with adding a second sheet of ice to bring Focus to that corner extending Arrowhead and to have a an entrance that is the clear main entrance that brings in a lot more day life and works better for the flow of Spectators visitors and and players alike and so with that in mind the plan in front of you today is oriented with North uh off to the right uh uggstead Road along the bottom Arrowhead Road along the left hand side and and the the thinking is that the primary entrance would be oriented towards Arrowhead Road off of pedestrian Plaza situated at that corner to get cars out of that main entry area and and make that more conducive to the the flow of folks around these different facilities here uh when you enter that [17:56] **Eric Largen**: main entrance um we would anticipate a two-story uh open Lobby open Concourse area and uh at this point players and Spectators to facilitate that better flow kind of go in two different directions for spectators as you'll see on the I don't know if you want to skip ahead to the second level plan here we'll come back to the first uh but for people who are who are spectators uh they would then go up a a Monumental staircase uh in that open Lobby and filters through an open Concourse to what we call Top loaded bleachers seating now what is that that is basically to get to your seat you're approaching from that upper Concourse level and coming down the steps to your seat rather than walking in front of the first couple rows and that helps to create that premium uh premium experience in that in that main competition sheet and and just to kind of I should take a step back here uh on both of these plans the gray area is the existing building uh that sheet presumptively would become a kind of a secondary sheet of practice sheet to where most competition Varsity events would be played on the new sheet towards the towards the bottom of the page um so to kind of talk about that uh we can go back to the first floor here we'll talk a little bit about uh kind of increasing uh the quality of the locker room and team room spaces [19:29] **Eric Largen**: in the current building um as as well maintained as it is uh there's a little bit to be desired as you touched on with some of the locker rooms in there there's no two locker rooms are the same there's there's some that are on the second level not on the sheet they're not on the level of of competition and as you can imagine that that could be a challenge when you're dealing with ice skates and so uh our proposal would be to have all locker rooms and team rooms located on grade level on the same level as the ice and when I talk about Locker in team rooms essentially that breaks down locker rooms uh what we're talking about what you typically think of uh in a varsity type locker room permanent lockers sinks uh toilets showers team room on the other hand uh would be a room designed 25 to 35 uh kids that are in there getting ready for an event um with benches coat hooks and the diff the primary difference being that uh shower and restroom facilities are are arranged differently throughout the space they might be shared between two uh concurrent uh Team rooms or there could be individual single occupant type shower rooms and restrooms throughout that Locker area so that's kind of the big picture from a locker room and team room standpoint um some of the other uh pieces of the puzzle that help improve that those first impressions and that user [21:00] **Eric Largen**: experience are number one uh we're showing the ice operation so the ice plant and the zambonia resurfacer parking relocated to the north side of the building which is truly the back side of the building to allow that Arrowhead roadside to be the the face of of the facility and to be the face of the activities that are that are going on in here along with that by removing the ice plant from that part of the building in the upper left-hand corner of the page uh there's space where a dry land training room could be built out and then above that on on the second floor there's ample opportunity to fill in facility offices possibly have a meeting space that could be rented out for for various events um so at a high level again these things are all to improve that access to Quality spaces um and and a big part of this project will be finding that right balance between how much of it do you build new especially with locker rooms and how much do you renovate within that that good square footage uh in the existing building um I think from uh from that first impressions and and and entrance standpoint we also have an image uh today uh the question might be asked you know what could this possibly look like well we don't know exactly but uh some of the themes of trying to uh complement what's already happened in terms of improvements in the community with the wellness center across the street and and and around this area [22:33] **Eric Largen**: um we could bring in some wood some concrete a lot of glass to bring some daylight in on that on that new front entrance and on that south side of the building but by and large uh everything we're talking about here is is in intended to again complement those improvements that are already taking place and and create a higher quality facility for for the community [23:07] **Joe Wicklund**: perfect thank you Eric as we kind of think about some of the Q a pieces that we'll dive into in a little bit but one of the things that I mentioned in Chad mentioned was you know the difference between 10.84 million and some other number um and that's where dsgw is built in some flexibility because it's really important to be clear that the uh the referendum in November has set numbers within each question and set amounts per each project as approved by the legislator um the questions themselves can be a little bit laborious they're available on our website um to be able to get comfortable with them and I'll be doing a bunch more community outreach pieces to get people comfortable with what they're looking at when they get in there but the reality is is that those are set numbers so on all three projects and especially this one there's an opportunity for philanthropic support whether it's in terms of naming rights whether it's in terms of advertising whether it's in terms of additional amenities that the city is working on both with internal and external Partners to make that happen so some of the discussions in the community about what's possible in some ways there's a limit because of what we've got in sales tax dollars and in some ways there's not a limit in [24:03] **Joe Wicklund**: terms of what people are interested and passionate about making come true we will have more information and news as those folks step forward closer to the election and as as those pieces are being able to be solidified but they're also likely to be opportunities that come post-election things like Trail experiences are are probably something that will come over time all the time something like naming an arena is something you do once you know so some of those pieces are kind of fall on different calendar pieces but um but that process is already in play and if there are folks who are interested in reaching out or being connected to that we've had a couple of different groups approach me at the city level and that's the best way to start if there's uh passion about being able to make the power of people's votes even more powerful here and to add to these amenities the best spot to reach out is to me at the city so again as I mentioned at the beginning there's a couple key questions before we open it up both here and a couple questions have been passed along uh the first and foremost again is one two or three questions uh whether one two or three projects go through the sales tax will be the same uh that sales tax uh let's talk about that we just today got the final uh report back from the University of Minnesota extension offices uh from the center of community Vitality for the research that they've done on sales tax in our community and the at least 75 percent number held and actually went up a little bit and what that means is at least 75 percent of all [25:34] **Joe Wicklund**: of the sales tax in Hermantown is paid by non-residents all right so that's important because anytime we talk about tax one that's definitely going to impact resident pocketbooks but in this particular case we can use the essential Wellness Center as an example since it's already in existence that's a project that's been funded entirely with sales tax and 75 percent of that funding has come from non-residents folks passing through Hermantown spending money in Hermantown but it is supporting a Hermantown entity um as that sales tax increases that's not expected to change uh the dollars that are expected to be raised as we budgeted for this type of piece not only made the legislature comfortable enough to a lot to be out there on the ballot for people to decide but are actually budgeted in a way where we're likely to be able to pay them off in advance the wellness center is already well ahead of where we expected it to be in terms of sales tax abilities to pay that down so to be clear 75 of our sales tax is paid for by folks who don't live in Hermantown as we get into a little bit of what this feels like at the individual level um because sales tax is unlike other taxes you don't get a bill you don't get a bill like in your property taxes which won't change at all for any of these projects the same way that did not for the essential Wellness Center um but what it does mean is on the items that are sales tax eligible and it is a robust list which we have on our website of normal purchases that do not qualify for sales tax gas groceries some of the [27:06] **Joe Wicklund**: day-to-day items are not impacted by this at all um but if you do buy something that is sales tax eligible and you spend a hundred dollars the cost now would be 50 cents more based on what we learned today from uh the University of Minnesota if this tax applied equally to all Hermantown residents which we know of course it would not um because the amount that you would shop at a place like Menards or Slumberland or Fleet Farm is going to vary person to person but the average impact annually should this have passed years a year ago in 2020 would have been 33.42 cents per resident so your annual contribution as a resident in Hermantown uh if this was a sales tax that was in place uh before today would be 33.42 cents more if you're a person who's of course on a on a set income that's a much more palatable number than has been thrown around and if you aren't purchasing items for which the supplies it not it would not hit you we know we have folks in this community who do spend uh greater uh time and greater energy and greater resources at places like Fleet Farm and Menards where some of these uh higher tax dollars come in and they obviously are providing more than that 33 dollars so again it's not equal across our entire Community but if you boiled it down to a number that's what it is um and again if you spend a hundred dollars on a tax eligible item that uh cost for that would be 50 cents more and again I should also reiterate it would be the same now as what you would pay [28:37] **Joe Wicklund**: for that item in Duluth um as opposed to a different cost the community recreation initiative this particular portion the last piece that I want to remind folks about is that oftentimes when we think about hockey in our community we think very much about our high school teams and their Champions uh both on the boys and girls side but we do not often think about the countless youth kids who play in these types of programs and actually a surprising number of old guys who are still hoping to stay healthy and use sheets of ice that have become kind of in demand so so sometimes again I think the success of of some of our high school teams kind of overshadows the reality of what this particular Community entity is facing uh any questions comments suggestions anything that we can dive deeper on here uh related let's start with related to either the arena or the sales tax initiative and the operation of it as a whole [29:46] **Audience Member**: [Indistinct Question] [29:57] **Joe Wicklund**: yeah so the question you know in case you didn't hear it online was you know based on this new facility regardless almost of how it gets designed it's going to cut into some parking what what kind of uh ramifications that and what are the fixes for that Eric I'm gonna let you answer it first but then I'll kind of come at it from the way that we've been talking about it [30:19] **Eric Largen**: and that's a that's an excellent question and and that hasn't been looked into in a lot of detail yet um but what we have talked about is that yes no matter what expansion is proposed it's going to cut into some of the existing parking um there is some space on site to create some new parking um there's also some potential you know existing spaces at the high school and at the wellness center which you know during game times uh could potentially be available for use and and some new connections easier pedestrian connections to those be made but that conversation kind of needs to happen at the at the next level of our design process [30:58] **Joe Wicklund**: and what that looks like on our side is obviously we know there's there's kind of like how you dream of it working and then how people actually utilize it and I think of big games where I've driven by and there's countless cars parked up and down the road and it's functional but not ideal uh and in essence part of what Eric was talking about the beginning is we want to make an experience happen for people differently than it has been before and so what it's not ideal then to have that same parking configuration where people are using the road in front of what is supposed to be a very specific experience um so obviously the essential Wellness Center has different hours as to when the games are going to happen and sometimes I think lost in the shuffle of this is not too far away is an entire high school parking lot it's not super convenient as it is designed today to go from all of those empty spots down to the arena but it would not take a Herculean effort to make that part of the experience as well and so there's discussions afoot about how do we leverage the resources that are already there that maybe even feel a little bit further away but aren't and turn them into part of the experience as well [32:09] **Audience Member**: [Indistinct Question about outdoor rinks] [32:14] **Joe Wicklund**: thank you so the question is with does this current design do anything negative toward the outdoor ranks and the reality is not only does it not it likely is able to enhance them so we won't lose any of the outdoor ranks both for this or for parking in terms of that but it may help in terms of configuration and being a smarter design all the way through no no and those that's a really important question I think that maybe focus on brain up because a lot of the not only Hermantown specific but when people think about hockey in Minnesota their their picture is you know these little Rink Rats who grow up and become these incredible folks and they do it on these somewhat wonderful somewhat unforgiving outdoor ranks um and especially here we have a reputation for leveraging that resource you know both for hockey growth but character growth and all kinds of incredible experiences for kids and so no those aren't in Jeopardy of of going away at all in fact we're hoping that the spillover allows them to be even a little bit nicer [33:16] **Audience Member**: [Indistinct Question about location] [33:48] **Joe Wicklund**: yes yeah as Eric mentioned this particular diagram has that presumption we do have other diagrams that Eric has worked on where the presumption is it's on the other side yep and in those cases to answer the question then it reconfigures uh the outdoor ranks even further um and moves them into different locations but at this point both the discussions we've had with the school district is that this is probably I mean we wouldn't be presenting it if this wasn't the spot that we wanted to do it makes sense if the school board comes back and says that building is not moving and staying then we can pivot to the West one and then we move those outdoor ranks accordingly but again they'll still be four is it four Dave outdoor rinks they're there six right now and again that's yep [34:58] **Joe Wicklund**: yeah and so for folks at home the question is is there's also a design that folks have seen both in public meetings at the school and here where the design that's on the screen right now is is literally flipped so the the gray box the existing Arena stays in the same place and then the new sheet of ice ends up on the other side of it and Eric if you want to speak a little bit to that design [35:49] **Eric Largen**: yeah those are those pictures that that design piece exists too and in essence really to be honest that's part of when I go back to as we've worked together both the school and uh the city to be able to maintain a high level of flexibility for the school to be able to say this is what really works best for us and that can be a administration building on I'm terrible with directions we'll say on the ugstad roadside of the uh new Arena or on the non-ugstad roadside of the arena or as part of the arena or not on that site at all so we've tried and we'll continue to maintain a high level of flexibility for them you know for the school board to be able to say our administration building fits best here [36:47] **Audience Member**: [Indistinct Question about ownership and governance] [37:24] **Joe Wicklund**: better than me yeah and so let me I'm going to blur your question down to what I hope is the nuts and bolts of it which is it one of the TBD but flexible questions is what rules and regulations are in place that govern the school as to who owns both the land and the arena and going forward and that's a spot where we'll work together with the school and I've continued to get their clear answer to because they're the rules that govern I I do not envy the school's task in where they are governed where their money can go in terms of being able to you know run referendums for schools for ice time for all kinds of different things and so in essence the easiest way to think about this is a 10.84 million dollar opportunity regardless of pictures exists for hockey and the school in our community and that's going to be the city's contribution if that opportunity comes forward and makes sense to be on top of land owned by the school that works perfectly if the opportunity exists for the school to say all right as part of that why doesn't the both Arenas be run by one entity a joint Powers the school as the current one is the city also works fantastic part of what is the good negative of the bonding Bill not going forward is that bonding bill which would have added four million dollars to this project which is fantastic and certainly much needed would have had stipulations about that for the city and we no longer have those strings attached so as long as so we have a lot of flexibility to meet those requirements as laid out by the school [39:28] **Audience Member**: [Indistinct Question about special session bonding] [39:37] **Joe Wicklund**: so the question is if that in a in a I believe if I use your term correctly a mythical world magical or mythical it would be both yeah if a special session happened and we'll say after the election in the next year yeah then it it is it's not irrelevant but it's a different set of circumstances because that property and that ownership and how that operates would have already been decided so part of the delays and the process to find out what works right is way it was waiting to find out about bonding and now it's an opportunity kind of like Heather mentioned like what is the absolute best setup for this to exist for our school district what is the absolute best setup to also support whatever their needs are going forward on their Administration Building um I think that yeah so the question from the audience was the timeline for ironing all those types of things out some of that is you know people would say out you know the election day is November 8th that's going to be what decides it in reality the opportunity to make that fit best is going to be driven by two calendars one is going to be to be able to to have the school take the time that they need to be able to determine what fits best I.E their Administration Building and if the calendar moves faster than that that may close one or two doors an East or a West choice but it may open other ones across the street uh at the central Wellness Center there's property available uh there are different sections that they're looking at as a whole it doesn't even have to be on this particular piece of property if the let me wrap back to your question so at that point if there was bonding around the idea of adding additional support to this building that bonding would already know who the owner is uh in some ways I would smile and say we hope that the right folks see this and then why because every Community wants bonding for everything but the reality is is that would be great if it worked out that way whether we were talking about an arena whether we were talking about Trails whether we were talking about fickner Park whether we were talking about all the different things that communities are hoping for it's it's kind of been a a challenging time and and again with the expectation that a sales or a special session is a zero possibility right now they'll definitely be um you know some different types of legislation coming up next session because of that [42:15] **Joe Wicklund**: any other questions for us tonight for both the folks online uh watching this um today's the 21st of September you are likely to see both uh from my actions and the folks on the city side that we will be a lot more out and about information sessions will be less formal uh than this one you can find on our website at hermantownmn.com backslash vote all the places where we'll be doing tabling information sessions starting as soon as tomorrow and the next day at uh to Hermantown High School events and then there are Open dates on the calendar so if there are groups who would like me to come out and be able to talk specifically to them about this as it continues to progress I'm welcome to be scheduled to run around and do kind of some of these information sessions in different spots in the community the goal is that when you walk into the ballot booth and make your vote on November 8th that you are clear on what you're voting for you're comfortable and confident and you have an understanding of both what it means to fill out yes or no on these Bubbles and the impact of it and there are plenty of folks who know in the community who are still working toward that understanding so lots of opportunities between now and November 8th to be able to do that also knowing that early voting starts even this Friday so lots of Education happen and if folks have questions they can always reach out to me at City Hall otherwise thanks for being here tonight everybody appreciate it