e e e e e e e with that CL I add council is convened into Open Session recording in progress that all council members are present with the exception of council member Rick ad Deli mayor Pro Tim Prince the council will now council member rodelli is now here Council will now recess into executive session in the west Hardy room to hold a closed executive meeting purs pursuant to the provisions of Vernon Texas codes annotated government code chapter 551 the open meetings act in accordance with the authority contained in section 55171 to consult with the attorney to receive legal advice and discuss litigation section 55187 to discuss Economic Development matters and section 55174 to discuss Personnel matters thank you e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e check back [Music] okay e e I now declare that the Plano city council preliminary open meeting is reconvened in Open Session that all council members are present our first item on the preliminary agenda is consideration and action resulting from the executive session of the mayor protim and the deputy mayor Pro I'd like to to uh announce that the mayor protim is Maria to and the dep is Julie Homer congratulations for my condolences one of the can I say a few words Mr Mayor please I um I I actually really enjoy being a deputy mayor protm because you get the title but none the work you know I could show up whenever I want to when I don't so I um I first of all I want to thank Casey for the past few years of being in the front and and helping make sure that I don't get overworked but now Casey you don't get to get off that easy just BEC sort of U set setting aside time for your family mean that you could just walk away from being a mayor does it and uh Mr Mayor please do not set such high expectation standard for all of us it's too late so anyway I I appreciate thank you I appreciate Mr Mayor for giving me this opportunity thank you and just as a point of order I believe we need to vote on that correct yes we we should I I just wanted to make sure I thought thought we were moving on to the next item make a motion to appoint Maria as mayor protm and Julie Homer as Deputy Mayor Pro I will second that all right I have a motion a second to a favor raise your hand motion passes 8 Z thank you congratulations next item uh appointment of council leison first item is the north Texas Municipal Water District Board reappointment of Mr Ron Kelly I think Ron's in the audience Ron raise your hand okay a little higher little higher Ron that's a a great you've done it's a probably a very thankless job but we thank you very much from the bottom of our hearts thank you do we need to vote on these separately actually this is just the council liaison to appoint the members to these boards so these weren't on your list last time right so it's the council people not necessarily the people serving on the board all right I've got it uh who who's on the is it who's on the uh lons of this Water District board okay go ahead we already did that but just go ahead okay sorry um okay so it's Rick and Rick right okay uh the next one 2025 Bond referendums citizen advisory committee and uh amazingly enough I'm going to uh recommend Rick Smith and Rick horn oh my god do we need to vote on that no okay okay and then finally uh the zoning subdivision stakeholder advis advisory committee uh would consist of the mayor protim Deputy Mayor protm the chair and the vice chair of pnz all right next item item three discussion and direction of the Arts funding and Grant guidelines good evening extend a bit of an apology for some of the confusion that's been out there with regard to the Arts funding over the course of our preparation for Budget I had indicated a willingness to entertain an increase in funding uh for the Arts Community out there and somehow through my communications and translations uh things have taken a few steps further than uh probably where they should um after having a numerous discussions with some uh a couple of the the council liaison uh I think I understand the the and what has been shown to um the public is a receptivity to uh increasing the funding uh as a pool the um direction from the liaison was to stick to the million dollar in this uh fiscal cycle and then take the additional $500,000 and set that aside in a pool for future consideration after the consultant has completed their work and in looking at uh what may come out miscommunication and I think councilwoman Homer may have some more to add to that well I think really what was missing was the expectation that there would be discussion amongst Council about how uh you know increasing funding to the Arts and that clearly was something that we agreed on um but but because in um Cultural Arts commission meetings and there's been some ongoing discussion about changing allocations of funds uh which we kind of put on hold waiting for the Consultants recommendations and I had forgotten that not all of the council members are in those meetings to hear the same things that that the liais On's here so I don't know that the rest of the council are even aware that the prior liaison with me so he had heard it and Maria had heard it and I thought we were under the direction already that we wouldn't make changes until we heard what the consultant had to say so um so that's what Maria and I as liaison thought that was the we need to hear well I'd like to put it out there for discussion I'd like to find out what is that what everyone else thought um the a lot of the well the arts groups were shown the increase being put back into the the fund which was a little bit of a surprise um and just miscommunication but we didn't realize that until just last week yeah so um um that we because we were in limbo and waiting to to get this feedback that we would use the money in a manner that would be beneficial to all of the arts groups um and I had a number of suggestions and ideas and um and was also open to the idea of of looking to our our wonderful Cultural Arts commission for their recommendations as well but I just wanted to make sure that we had a discussion and discussion needs to be had and not just assumed that that that's how we're going to move forward with those funds because it is a 50% increase so I would um ask that the um the council heat our recommendation which is is to hold off on the um additional .5 million and hold that until the actual consultant is able to make a recommendation to the C there is money available to not um dispense that until we hear what the consultant has to say that's the first recommendation what was the second recommendation how long will we be waiting for that's that that since since you and I've spoken I have spoken to some other people that brought up a good point that that is long time for that money that could be benefiting the Arts Community to not be used which was why I I brought up the idea of maybe looking to the cultural arts commission for recommendation on ways the money can be used to benefit the Arts Community sooner as a whole so what when is that when are we waiting yeah when are we expected to hear back from my understanding from um from talking to Julie is that the consultant was just hire and apparently the recommendation should come with at least we're not going to use it for yeah we got to use it we can't just have it sitting there not helping it I would suggest that some type of um um I guess some type of recommendation be made by either the cultural commission or to come back to the council and make a recommendation that we can adopt yeah Anthony thank you mayor I was just GNA add one girl liaison to the cultural arts commission so please discussion that's part of the Consultants work that you mentioned about capping uh any groups share of the grant funds at 25% and so I think um uh as I understand it one reason maybe to not go all the way to just increasing the Prat a share by 50% for for some of these big groups is that then they would be so far over the 25% even of 1.5 million million that you know if they come to depend on that money and then next year we say okay we got the Consultants report you're capped at 25% they're going to I think I I agree with we we need to put this money to work there's no sense in appropriating money and then having it sit there I I think I I think the point is well take taken that maybe we we don't want to create Reliance on something that's not going to be there the next year after it comes in if the 25% cap is implemented so I I would I would recommend that maybe we look at not increasing some of the biggest recipients quite so much and looking at other you know um upand cominging Arts organizations for that well Mr Mayor I I want to add to that I mean that was the second part of um what Julie and I talked about I don't know if we're in agreement but um I I I believe that um just because some of the organizations are getting more and more I I don't think that needs to be equated to the amount of Grant they they receive from um from from the cultural art you know from the grants that we're giving out I I think um there needs to be an objective which we're probably going to be talking about on Friday day for our Retreat um the objective and goals that we want to set for um these grants and how they should be distributed and and I believe that would be better to discuss but today really what what I guess we're just trying to get a direction as to you know how how we go about you know uh with regard to the the 0.5 million funds I you know I mean like I said I originally thought when when we all said yes we want to do an increase before before I realized that that there was a presumption that I mean I I had thoughts such as as you know we we still don't have a forward- facing uh calendar uh for the Arts we have the arts groups putting their events on a calendar but it's not out there for the public um additional what if the city were to pay the rental fee for example for the Robinson to have a collaborative Arts group things like that that that would benefit um it's as a whole um you know long term we have a a need for more performance space rehearsal space things along those lines um you know I think Maria is right I think it some of this is a discussion that we need to have in our strategy session to to understand kind of where everybody is and um I know that there was a meeting recently where the there was discussion about the role of the commission missions and and and they've had so much discussion amongst themselves already that I I I would love to see some direction and given to them to ask for for their feedback on on how to spend the money um but I do feel very uncomfortable just putting the money back into the pool when I thought we had agreed to hold off until the consultant told us how to direct those funds so that's kind of where where I I was and I know we all do and I agree Casey I don't want to leave the money sitting there unused that doesn't help um but I want to find a way that we can use so trying to make sure I'm clear on Direction so because I heard two things one is waiting till the I think the majority of council is saying No this should this should be sooner rather than the cultural arts commission to make a recommendation back to count on the full $1.5 million and I apologize Maran I haven't had a chance to discuss this before this meeting the result of conversations over the weekend um and throwing out ideas and and and realizing that we do have the cultural arts commission as as a resource that that maybe we should hear what they have to say I think we should definitely have the million dollars in there that's already planned and then maybe set a timeline maybe during our Retreat on when we would like to make a decision on how to allocate the additional uh $500,000 so it's sounds like we don't have full Direction yet on the the aspect for the the cultural arts commission if if if I have Buy in here I would be willing to make this suggestion if others agree to um and to give us some recommendations on how to spend the money knowing that we may still have some discussion about that and is it the full 1.5 or is it just the 500,000 additional just the 500 $100,000 additional okay to let the cultural arts I mean I think we need to give them a a deadline right because we need this decision soon because of budget right but we can allocate we can go ahead and agree on the I also want the the council's feedback as to um whether or not they agree with what I just talked about that the grant should not grow um with with with the with the um organizations or or the applicants um organization we can discuss that at the retreat I think kind of I think that the problem is if they they're going to come back with a recommendation and I want to make sure that they come back with our guideline or fix our Direction so are y'all saying you do not want them to just allocate more money to organizations you want them to come up with a broader idea of how to benefit the Arts as a whole and not just diving up this $500,000 to individual Arts organizations is that our our ask of them that that was my original thought was that if we raised the money until a final decision was made on how allocations would be done moving forward benefit the entire Community I could agree with that I mean I I think for this time it it would it would make sense but in the future we could talk about that on at the Friday retreat but in the meantime dur for this for this time around the $500,000 I I I would prefer that it doesn't not just get pra share to all the organizations that are seeking Grant what I was going to say is uh what I had recalled and again we all kind of had different into the fund and that as we have done is we rely on the commission the group of citizens that everybody had appointed to review it and and make the recommendations either you give it all to one group if they think that's appropriate and then it comes to council Council has the ultimate decision but to really rely on them to to give that direction but but I still agree we need to get the money in there and and get it out because it does doing anyone any good just just sitting there we have some differing Direction Council so uh I what what I've heard over here was the the million dollars to directly to organizations Arts organizations seems to be fine it's the 500,000 and councilman to your point it's they have that would the commission have the authority to do the assign that to individual that's that that's their we just need to get the M we put the money in there mhm the uh the commission makes recommendations it's still the Liaisons work with the commission so this thing about doing something for like broad for all Arts as as Julie was mentioned may be a great idea they I don't think that the Arts commission understand that that might be a possibility so okay giving them that cause and having the funds there to work with I think would be the ultimate solution so if we get if we gave them that direction and we'll send the video so that they make sure that they hear the discussion but the but I think it's it's giving that Latitude but I I want to make sure we're hearing the same thing because that 500,000 I've heard broad Community impact and then I've heard but are we allowing that to be assigned to individual organizations or no I is that just prerogative and then the liaison in conjunction with the commission make recommendation bring it to council we we just give sort of direction we just give sort of Direction what we think should be used but I think ultimately it is the Commissioners who need to tell us how they believe it should be easy and they've done the work so they know they is that okay yes all right got it thank you next item rainy day funds for cleanup of the storm related debris Mark mayor and counsel uh um the city has a a rainy day fund and uh literally a week or two ago it was not only rainy but very very windy um and so there is a great amount of debris um out in the community the goal that we have for the organization and for the community is to get back to normal as fast as as possible and cleanup is going to take an extended period um we are working through medians and and public facilities there is quite a bit in our parks that need to be cleaned up there's quite a bit on private prop property that needs to be cleaned up so uh we actually have a a contract uh in place to be able to help expedite that um Sears is a group that's actually we have a representative in the back has given us an estimate uh of just under $500,000 to help expedite that additionally we have $100,000 in carry um to be able to to do this we think that being able to use the rainy day fund will help us expedite that cleanup and it's the the use uh of it um would uh would be uh meaningful for the community and so what I would ask is if council is comfortable with that to provide me direction to go ahead and utilize those funds and subject ratification coming back on a future agenda item for those contracts and start to expedite that that clean up so that's my recommendation and I'm happy to answer any questions mark what are we looking as a timeline here so we can tell citizens uh wouldn't expect to have us back normal councilman i' I'd love to be able to go as fast as possible part of the challenge is going to be mother nature if there's more storms coming through we're going to we're going to face that the initial timeline we were looking at was between four and six weeks um to be able to do that if we can get wood obviously uh and we think that that by having these contracts supplementing the U the existing saf service that we feel fairly comfortable with that any progress on the secondary s site for the storage of debris and grinding it is up and being deposited as we speak so that site is is up in in working so we're um we're working through that chelby ironically this is actually not what I had in mind by the rainy day fund but it's fly appropriate um I'm fully supportive of it what I would request is that what we use from the rainy day fund be to supplement the Delta on top of what our normal budget would anticipate from uh storms clean up understood thank you mayor yeah uh first thing I would say is yeah I I agree we need to do it and I also want to give us kudos to staff unbelievable job I mean the the this still a lot of brush out there but our thorough fair you know without fail uh our red lights were up in work I mean it was a great job by all so you know anything we can do to kind of help finalize that and get everything cleaned up we're going to be way ahead of the game and and I appreciate everything everyone's doing um I just have a question so once we used up the rainy day fund does it get replenished Council will have that option at the end of the fiscal year if we have uh excess sales tax and things of that put in the rainy day fund so we may have that option uh later on this fall but I agree councilman thank you for the kind words about our Public Works and Public Safety groups Parks groups there's a lot of them out there working they're continuing to work out there but we think this will put us back to normal as fast as possible and we think that's uh what the city of Excellence should do so we'll move forward and we'll bring back any of those uh contracts for ratification thank you okay everybody good all right thank you discussion and Direction regarding extra Duty solutions for the Police Department chief okay yeah yeah good evening mayor and councel uh I'd like to talk to you about our uh this secondary employment or outside employment and first though let me say that at the police department and as the chief I think having officers work out at different locations across the city churches hospitals businesses is um we can so I'm fully supporting of our guys going out there to work uh but but there are some issues and I want to talk about those now oh there we go got it okay so there are three categories of law law enforcement off-duty employment the first is what we call long-term assignments and those are businesses hospitals churches that habitually hire officers it also includes our school district uh uh as well and particularly PISD then we have what we call how those jobs are set up is that a business a church or a hospital own or the officer contacts that employer and they they discuss the need for having security at that location and so um uh the officer that becomes the coordinator for that job deter uh negotiates the pay rates for the officers how many officers they need to do that and uh assist with scheduling we have what call call-in assignments those are are typically one day or maybe two day or three- Day events but they they're not ongoing where they call into the police department uh they call into our Patrol services division we have what we call two administrative sergeants they work 10hour shifts different days so they they typically receive those and send them back out but uh sometimes neither one of those guys are there and pretty much any of the 20 Patrol sergeants can have that answer that phone send those jobs out to the officers and and and and they're responsible for making sure that those jobs get filled and then we have special events assignments and then those are the typical ones like you see parades and June um Fourth of July Events uh balloon Bon Fest we have an on duty person a special events coordinator a sergeant who coordinates those jobs and uh and but what's key about those jobs is that the pay for those jobs come on their regular City payroll so some of the problems that we have with our current off-duty Employment Program is we have some officers that are willing to work off duty and they don't have the opportunity to do so on those jobs that are handled by uh coordinators so the coordinators go out and and select who's going to work on those jobs those jobs AR open up to everybody one of the reasons those are a problem is we're a police department that's a benefit for officers to get out and go do that and those jobs AR since those jobs aren't open up to everybody uh and we do things by some testing process or some uh board process but here though it's done by basically clicks within the police department uh trying to keep up with the approved uh long-term locations is very labor intensive every year by the end of January coordinators should have they submit via paper approval up the chain of command up to the assistant Chiefs it's very difficult to keep track of that uh we cannot track whether the policy has been followed when establishing long certified to work certain assignments by that I mean if if a location serves alcohol then the officers that work there are required to be certified in standardized field sobriety testing basically where they're using consistency and pay rates so if you look at our long-term assignments uh we have paid that some jobs are paying as low as high as $90 an hour some of the jobs are very similar in what they we have more consistency in the call-in jobs uh we have a secondary employment committee that tries to keep those jobs uh consistent but when you have so many different sergeants that can handle that there can be some inconsistencies there so most jobs are put out at $65 an hour but you have to have an escalation rate because someone may call today and want someone tomorrow or day after tomorrow then the rate's going to be higher one person may say well you know you're calling in late it may need to be 8 an hour and we need to have some consistency there we cannot uh monitor whether officers work more hours been allowed by policy that's 16 hours a day we can of course track their on duty hours But it includes their off-duty work as well uh too much on duty time is used to coordinate off-duty employment those Patrol sergeants that take in those calls they've got to type up the jobs they've got to send out an email they're going to typically get phone calls they've got to physically post them up if they don't get them all filled by email policy does not say coordinators can't work on their off-duty employment because it's probably no way they it's probably no way they can get it done without doing some of it on on duty and that involves picking up paychecks sometimes and having to drive them across the city and distribute those uh so it's just a lot of on duty time is being consumed uh working on off-duty employment so even though there's no direct money there time of course is money uh and then we have and then we have the issue of as I said officers stopping by picking up multiple checks uh we have some jobs where officers are paid in cash after work all of those are just not a good look for a police department in my opinion and overall there's a lack of transparency in the program I get complaint go back and track that so we uh you know we check with other cities uh routinely on on many different things uh so here in the Metroplex there are about 12 cities that uh not counting Dallas and four worth that are over 100 G uh as you can see all of the Cities up there have some type of um uh vendor or outside uh software that they're using to do their work except for Arlington and Garland in the case of Arlington Arlington is in a unique situation considering the size of their City because they've got uh the Cowboys there and the Rangers they've got some contractual Arrangements these these thirdparty vendors are not going to work well for Arlington situation so they've got a entire unit that that that that handles that for them they've got hundreds of guys that don't even work for their Police Department that are part of their system and and none of these vendors are probably going to work for them so out of these 12 cities uh uh 13 County Plano that are over 100,000 um gin is the only one that doesn't not use some kind of a vendor to assist with their outside employment so these were these were the general requirements for for vendors and these were requirements that I gave to my uh person and the team that was working on this handling all categories of outside employment without charging the city uh we wanted the lowest fee for the employers on an Apples to Apples comparison uh we wanted the elimination of coordinators even though in this case we decided to Bas organizations for some spefic specific reasons we wanted to allow for the elimination of cash into their bank account some of our secondary employers can do that wanted to allow the PD to use the vendor platform to manage the city approved special events at no charge to the city uh and we wanted uh the creation of closed groups uh at the time we were thinking about closed groups there are certain jobs you may have to have certain qualifications or certifications to do and we wanted to have closed groups so that we can do that but then we've also created closed groups as I said for faith-based organization that's that holds services and for the hospitals and we with reports on demand and a so these are the five vendors that we looked at off duty management roll call extra Duty Solutions and aluno and power details pretty much all of the top four can meet those requirements that I talked about earlier all of them uh could uh handle the cash payments all of them could hand allow us to use their platform to to or or our on duty our special events work so they pretty much all could do those things they could all float to pay uh Power details is a little bit different platform uh it we would have to pay them money to use their system but then I would we would still have to use PD employees to do the work their platform is pretty good their software the problem is though it would not answer all of our problems in particular with pay it would not address the issue with payroll and and some we selected EDS um uh we have we we did not do an RFP on this program because we didn't we didn't we were able to piggyback off off someone else so the demonstrations that we're talking about were just informal Zoom meetings where they demoed this in front of members of our team and uh they would just write down what they gave them in some cases they but no one had a lower rate then the company we selected EDS roll call was at 11% here the rate that I don't have that I can't find in writing is off duty management but off-duty management was not any lower than uh 10% uh for sure there was no one that was lower than the V vendor that we selected uh uh my team also liked that EDS seemed to have the most flexibility that we wanted to do and one of the requirements that the benefits that we got out of selected EDS was EDS offered to to the city uh and uh uh and to provide us this platform at no cost to the city but roll Call's platform was not finished out and ex uh eds's platform was so we did pick up that City to do that so but I want to keep in mind and I want Str they offered that there was no other vendor that had a less than 10% fee uh and one of the reasons we didn't have to do an RFP is because we did what's called a Cooperative agreement so the City of Denton also selected EDS and we were able to basically piggyback off of their contract is how we did that our um contract was reviewed by city attorney's office and by purchasing even though there was no money being uh paid out uh by the city and because there was no funds EXP ended by the city there was no need for the so to get our EDS up and running after we decided that we were going to select them I kind of had an ad hoc committee put together with my technical service Lieutenant who kind of LED it we had members of our secondary employment committee uh Representatives on there we had members of the Plano Police Association on there volume uh employers like that for PISD and our hospitals those are the ones that use this program the most PISD is going to be our hospitals because most of them or three of them any way have gone to uh 247 coverage by our officers and and then probably the and by volume of our long-term employers it's going to be faith-based organizations of about 48 to 50 that we have based organizations so these were some of the so there were two things once we got EDS that we needed to work on policies that we're going to use and then what is what is our pay rate structure going to be like so I gave that to my ad hoc committee to take a chop at that first and so with our operating guidelines this and I gave them some general inst so this is what we came up with EDS provided us with a a go by that we had to fill out to do this it was several pages but this are the these are the key operating guidelines all police related off-duty employment must go through EDS pay rates for current long-term employers are grandfathered so the companies that and businesses that we were already using whether it was that was not going to change because the rates which I'll show you here in a minute are going to be higher typically than what we're paying now the rates going forward uh coordinators would be eliminated at most of our long-term employers except for our faith-based organizations and that hold services in our hospitals the reason that we need our coordinators at our hospital at our faith-based organizations is if if um if we have a church service and we have to and you have to get them out and you have to set up a comb pattern I could well I probably because I'm not a real Pol David could probably set up a safe conb pattern and Terry could set up a safe cone pattern but it may not be the same one every Sunday you know the people at that church need to see the same thing as they are coming in and coming out every Sunday and so uh so that's why we decided to keep them primarily and at the hospitals there are some special requirements some of the hospitals have some of that is ease up because of covid some wanted to see Co vac covid vaccinations some wanted them to take a little you know one or two hour little test on some safety related out but there but but the hospitals the Eds are a unique scenario and we thought that we needed to leave them there as well and so uh so we're going to keep the coordinators there but with but even at the other locations where we have coordinators the officers that are currently working there can continue to work there however as they leave though and if that employer needs more people they Wills EDS will send that out at that position can put in for it on the first com first then we've got some special requirements for for locations that serve alcohol uh if if they're if they're wanting to do that on a long long-term basis then we want to review that and because we've got uh have more intense dealings with than others and so we just want to look at that and make sure that we're putting our guys out at locations that are not going to be a image for the police department and then if anybody wants to use officers in a plain close assignment we also want to look at those a little bit more so these are the pay rates that we came up with uh so initially I gave the ATA committee the uh I asked them to come up with some pay rates they were a little bit high for me they basically wanted to start out at an officer's uh overtime rate which is about top that overtime rate which is about 79 and some change so we they just bumped it up to $80 an hour to start and then they would go up roughly $5 increments from there and I thought that that was kind of high after just doing my own internal polling was down by about $10 an hour for the officer rate so these are these rates employers are long-term employers so but but for people who are calling in uh uh that's what they would would pay term folks coming in now would uh pay these ration we have to escalate the pay as the job gets closer and no one has signed up you've got to raise the pay eventually they will but you got to have a system for that and now it's just kind of ad hoc how that works depending dep on who's working the call they they they decide on what that rate ought to be so we've given the company instructions on how to do that so that we've got a consistent um escalation of pay rates and so this is the timeline for this uh we signed the contract last year about a year ago June 6 June 6 we went we've already gone live with the call-in assignments and special events on April the Fe on that we intend to go live with our long-term current long-term employers on July 1st first of this year and uh we'll go live with PISD on October 1st of this year one of the reasons that we extended it for PISD is in a unique scenario because they have they are as I said by volume not even close they're our biggest employer they're outside of our city now I don't let our officers work outside of the city but they also have got um guys outside of the city that's working on that app and and they've got a cover down on different cities and they've just got so many people that's why we we went live with them on on one October so L what questions do you have thanks G appreciate it Shelby thank you um on that list of uh Solutions in the air force uh extra using the Cooperative purchasing agreement with Denton but that was the only city I saw using EDS uh you mentioned uh roll call I saw four different cities using roll call um two of which are similar in size to us mcken and Irving in addition to Lewisville and Richardson did we contact the police departments in those four cities to ask about their experience with roll call obviously we've spoken with Denton about ads any Lewisville Richardson and Irving no we didn't uh mckenny uh was using something called Power details that I showed you where you buy it we buy it and then you use your team to use it uh and they just switched over two weeks ago to uh roll call so they wouldn't have had an opportunity to do that uh and uh and then also uh details they're also switching over to roll call as well uh no we didn't call those cities was we looked at what they offered us uh roll call offered to to do a on duty app that was not finished EDS was doing it for 10% and could provide us with an on duty app that was finished so uh but so we didn't formally reach out but again I meet with the chiefs of our those cities that you saw up there every month and every Chief is not there at all of them and you we've talked about most of these guys are pretty close in what they do quite frankly I I use I them I use them in in a different city out west similar size as our police department they did a fine job the only thing I told my team with that group is I said just make sure we include them in the demo uh but uh they were pretty close and I believe they were also at 10% but the reason that my team went with this one again is because they offered that on duty solution and O and odm did not offer that okay did we only evaluate um eds's off-duty Services compared to roll calls off-duty services or we also the off the on duty the on duty software was not a part of my criteria that I gave the team to look at so what are they going to charge the employers and can they handle all the functions that we needed handling including payroll the other thing that was kind of important I didn't put it on my slide but it was kind of important to my adoc committee was the workers comp and I wasn't setting in on those meetings and I wasn't aware that was a big deal but the companies were were providing our workers comp and at the workers comp when they can do all of the things that was on the the chart before that and they could uh cover the payroll they were all pretty close they were all within one or two points of each other quite frankly okay and when you say roll Call's software isn't finished do we know from roll call when the anticipate having a completed product it was it wasn't even important enough for us to ask quite frankly yeah so no we don't know now and if I understand correctly fris understanding mckenny just came online with roll call but mcken I'm sorry Frisco is about to so that makes five area cities that are going with roll call do they know something we don't I I don't know I mean I I I know that roll call was 1% higher than EDS that's what I know okay you um if and I don't know what they offered and and at what point they offered them you know uh uh I don't know how long some of those cities have been with roll call you know I I don't know but what we what we can do is based our decision on an Apples to Apples comparison was going to be more expensive than EDS okay but we are planning on implementing the on duty software the Eds is providing us if we can uh as you know I've got you know I've you know those those solutions for law enforcement are much harder to implement than they are for for say a fire department or a Dispatch Center so we're working on we still don't have it up in running so uh but it partly because it just takes a long time to get them set up and all of the uh you know if you look at the fire department you've got they're they're pretty much all you know it's not that way at the police I got units with three people some with 20 people and they different hours it is very very time consuming and labor intensive to set up but if we can get it and use it we will okay okay I appreciate that um I think it would be worth uh contact implementing the on duty solution um it makes sense if it isn't finished or at least ask them when they're anticipating having a finished product I haven't heard any of the other cities complain about roll call but I haven't heard any of the other cities complain about any any of the other uh companies out there as well again they all did a good job on their demonstrations but uh they had the most extras that they were going to throw in throw in so that's why we went with them all right thank you chief thank you concerns that I'd like to bring up um first is communication to the organizations how this was rolled out I think um you know we have a lot of great Community Partners and I think um they whether they're for-profit nonprofit so many of them give back to our community in such a great way and I think we could have done a better job of including bur to these organizations who a lot of them this is going to be a major cost increase to and some of them are going to be forced to choose to no longer work with the plan OPD and that's going to lead to in private organizations it's not a public event it is better for us to have more officers out throughout our city than it is to not right when we have more officers in different places it makes our whole it makes our whole city safer so um the fact that we may have less officers at these that is not something that that I feel is good for the safety of our city overall um and then PLO ISD they can't afford this we all know they're in a major budget deficit so adding this extra cost to them to me is uh troubling and then the lack of support I've heard from our own police um Association is concerning to me and then finally just getting of the off-duty platform um at the expense of these organizations so I know that we don't get to V vote on this it's not something that's coming to us but I just felt the need to um express my concerns with this and um uh how it's moving forward I would suggest that if it's possible that the city take on some of this cost instead of the full burden going on um to all of our community organization on the point you made about PISD I I would agree with you maybe we could have done that one of the problems though is the system we have now I'm not even sure we know who all of the long we didn't even know who all the long-term employers were we just didn't have a system it's the officer setting it up and it's the officers that are doing it in the case of PISD though uh they are heavy hitter here they are important a very important partner with us when I met with the superintendent and their chief of security and others on her staff about a variety of things we talked about this as a sidebar the only thing their chief of security brought up to me was his his his problems much bigger than that what he wanted to find out is if I the officers from the other cities if they if we could load them into our platform so that if our officers don't take a job in Plano that he can rely on those other guys to do that and we were able to work that out with the request that they've made to me they haven't I haven't had heard any complaints from PISD about the cost Rick thank you mayor uh Chief primary questions some of us had was do we need something like this and I think you've explained through your presentation that there's a lot of reasons that we really do need to coordinate and have uh knowledge about where our staff is and how they're being so so I think that's good uh uh with the other things you explained I would think would would you consider being able for our and uh churches business whatever to receive off-duty service by our uh license PD uh a public safety benefit uh that that they get well well does it contribute to Public Safety yes I think if we've got uh uniformed officers in particular out at Banks hospitals churches wherever and yeah I think that benefits Public Safety yes right and and and the group I like the idea about the grouping because that allows stay at a certain location and I I Believe In some cases they're actually even considered they're actually W2 employees at some of these organizations that that's correct we're we're GNA we're going to allow that to continue as much as we can but but this the the the issue of coordinators cops going out and hiring other cops in general is not a good look not contribute to good order and discipline uh we have had situations where some officers are working at a job and the the coordinator is an employee of their and so uh and then if there's a job that becomes open it should be available to anybody in the police department that meets the qualifications for that job it shouldn't be I get to hire him just because he's my fishing buddy I get to bring him on my team and he's my you know my running buddy and I get to bring him on my team it needs to be opened up to everybody on the department on an equal basis that that's my position on how it should go right and and I think I see some real benefits of that but I think you also had made you know simple thing about cones out there and they're there on a regular basis they know how to set them up and the parishioners or the people there know you know how how to move in and out based on they've had experience with these two particular officers on a long-term basis so I I do believe there is a definite benefit to keeping people especially ones who were W2 employees keeping people with the organization that's the place they've been for a long time because because know them know what to expect so what I'm getting to is with this whole public safety thing I I I don't think there's a doubt about the the need for this type of service I think it's about how is the cost the administrative fee for that going to be handled and I think as uh going to say mayor protim former mayor protim prinet that that U um it was a shock to a lot of our faith especially our faith fa organization set officers for for a long period of time so giving direction what I would say I think it's it's a necessary program but I think being the public safety benefit that it is and the public safety service and having uniform plain OPD on a site can also take a load off of our other staffed employees that are out there in their zones I I would say covering that as a city as a part of our Public Safety budget and I would certainly be in support of doing that and so looking for a Direction that's Direction i' give you I I think the the need for the program has been established but I think we as a city should pay for it as an extension of the Public Safety Services that we provide to our community appreciate it so Mr Mayor I I I actually I I concur with um um Council protan prce um Chief TR I I I you know I applaud you because I think what you're trying to do is to make sure that this um this system is um is given opportunity to all officers rather than just you know the um the you know the I guess the buddy buddy system or you know you know in a what is that what is that word the inside Circle type of deal and you're trying to make sure that it equally applies to everyone costing it's it's throwing burden onto the organization that um have been used to not having to um uh incur all that cost so I would suggest also the same direction is I guess um even the police department have to come up with the budget right to work the budget system I'm sorry to work quite into the bud work the this um this fee into the budget of the police department to pay it but to pay to pay well the um uh allocating the budget to the the police department it's a big number it would be a very very big number well I I think we should try Okay um if we could I mean I think the the consensus here is that we want to make sure that you know um we we get because it's Public Safety but weiz are not harmed by um not being able to use our wonderful Police Department right just one of the things I want to point out is the chart that I showed that had the other cities we are outside the lines not using something we were using this in out the lines and most of those cities not all of them some of them are using power details the the employer is paying the fee that's the way that's the model that it goes across the country and what's going on in law enforcement today because because the problems that we have here are you not are not unique to Plano Dallas just even did an audit on theirs that's how they got ended up getting the company that they got because of some of the problems so I'm just trying to get my arms around a problem that I had to set aside because of Co now that that's over I need to get back need to get back on it I I think one of the main things that I I need to know what kind of money we're talking about and I need to to know what Rick which which would be fine but I think we all need to kind of understand and Direction what the possible number might get dat if it's a half cent you know on our proper I understand it's Public Safety we we are second to none in public saf so uh Chief I'm supporting I mean no one is suggesting that we shouldn't have this I mean I think that's been established we need this type of organization it's just a question of do we pass to our businesses or do we covered as part of the larger Public Safety envelope that we're providing for the city of plan that's that's what I'm saying I think that's what mayor real quick if you don't mind but thank you mayor so I I just wanted to Chief dra um I I I do think that pursuing uh some sort of cost recovery makes sense it's kind of like building permits you know uh that's a a public service issuing building permits but what's really important to me here is that it's only the actual cost that we're passing along and that it's the lowest possible cost and also you know as as uh now former mayor proest frce was talking about Casey was talking about you know if if we're getting an on duty solution that we're going to use then I think you know we're also receiving a benefit on that public Side Of The Ledger and I do think it would be appropriate for taxes to to pay for the value of whatever we might use on the on duty Side Of The Ledger um I also you know because we're in the middle of a budget year for us because a lot of organizations are in the middle of a budget year delay implementation for six months that would avoid a midyear budget impact to organizations and and or to us and I I'd also love to see us maybe go through a you know when they have to actually compete against each other and sub than you know any of the existing deals um you know I I just when I look at how much this might cost you know in numbers around like 500,000 or a million I just talking about taking it on as a city it's a big number it's a big number for you know for anyone who's paying it in effective way uh to do this and and and and you know maybe like the power details way if if we can hire an outside bookkeeper to you know to to to run it and power details is not going to address the the issues that we have because I would need to use and the reason having staff in it is because of relationships that I can't control when I've got 600 employees there's if another employee comes and says well he's giving that to his buddy I don't I don't else to do this for us and get that off of our plate and so so using something where we buy an application but now I've got to have unit or two or three guys that that's all they do all day is still not and that's still not going to address the pay issue uh that means somebody still got to go pick up the checks or they've got to mail them to us and then we've got to go put them in mailboxes so it's not going to you know having just the application like what Dallas is doing with roll call is not going to work for us here in Plano okay not to meet those criteria Chief I'm a big proponent of using technology to make organizations more efficient I do it for and I I see the value of using a solution the more I think about it we're looking at implementing an on duty solution which will effectively be paid for by Our Community Partners and nonprofits because the benefit we're getting from the on duty solution is borne by their fees um but we're not even ternatives but it's going to be employed by the city of Plano which Prides ourselves in the quality of our Public Safety I would feel much more comfortable if we're actually doing an on duty comparison of EDS versus roll call versus other leading Solutions um before we before we ex um especially effectively borne by the uh payments of Our Community Partners so mayor council I know that Friday we have our Retreat we will have a budgetary item for this on there to get final direction from you on Friday thank thank you Council thanks sorry mayor having a sidebar here um I Rick and I actually talked about um the potential of a issue um now that we sort of settle Str Str um there there's a concern that's coming up with regard to multi- room rent uh in a in a single uh in a single house um residential um right kind of like the boarding houses and I kind of would like before I actually get on the agenda to have some prelim information if there is some and the concerns from the resident spend the resources and going down that road it out to council all right thank you we'll move on to our regular meeting I now declare the Plano city council has reconvened an open session that all members are present we'll begin tonight's regular meeting with the invocation led by Pastor Sam fenroy with the Mount Olive Church of Plano you need to tell me how you do that please join the council in reciting the Pledge of Allegiance after the the uh invocation please rise father thank you for your faithfulness I knew I was late but you got me here on time I appreciate that I pray God for the meeting I pray God for those who you've chosen to serve this city I pray God that you just continue to in every situation that you might be glorified in the things they do we thank you honor you we give you praise in Jesus name amen I Al to the flag of the United States of Amica America to the for it stands na indivisible for all flag St thank you be seated I have one Proclamation uh unfortunately being in this temporary uh new Proclamation so unfortunately I have to present it here at the dis but uh next week uh will be juneth and so I'd like to read the proclamation regarding juneth whereas on January 1st 1863 President Abraham Lincoln issued a final Emancipation Proclamation which declared among other things things that all persons held as slaves within the rebel states are and also known as Freedom Day Jubilee Day Liberation day and emancipation day is a holiday that celebrates the the emancipation of those who have been enslaved in our nation and whereas the procl 1865 when Union ma ma Union Major General Gordon Granger and his soldiers landed in the city of galvaston Celebration of the 19th of June began in Texas the following year in 1866 whereas in 2014 juneth celebration was revitalized in all its Glory with a bold mission of educating all Plano Colin County and the entire DFW metroplex to the realization that juneth is a celebration of Freedom that we should all honor because we know if all are not free none of us are not free none of us are free and whereas direct descendants Andy Drake Mo stemson continue to embrace their Heritage by memorializing past achievements and by their resolve to inspire others in the mission to educate all of Plano Colin County and the entire DFW DFW metroplex in knowing juneth is a celebration of Freedom now therefore I John muns Mayor of the city of Plano Texas do hereby Proclaim Monday June 19th 2024 as juneth day in Plano and the state of Texas and I do thereby encourage all citizens to join me and the Plano City Council in honoring the in the city of Excellence as we look to celebrate the blessing of Freedom this day and every day thank you very [Applause] much consent agenda the consent agenda this consent agenda will be acted upon in one motion and contains item items which are routine and typically non-controversial items may be removed from this agenda for individual discussion by a council member the city manager any citizen presiding officer will establish time limits based upon the number of speaker requests Mr Mary maker second thank you I have a motion a second to approve the consent agenda all in favor raise your hand motion passes 8 to zero next item public hearing items applicants are Li time with five with a five minute rebuttal if needed remain limited to 30 total minutes of testimony time with three minutes assigned per speed officer May amend these times as deemed necessary item number one public hearing and consideration of an ordinance to Grant the appeal of the planning and zoning commission's denial of zoning case 2024-the east corner of toolan drive and National Drive from Regional employment employment and located within the State Highway 121 overlay District good evening mayor council and Executives I'm Christina day the director of planning and I'm here to present zoning case 2024 005 on appeal after a denial by the Planning and Zoning commission so the information that you have in front of you as far as the maps it is looking to be rezoned it is a portion of an existing lot which is North Glenn 2 Block B Lot 4 R uh there is within the building today approximately 980 square fet of lease that is a retail type lease based on the portion of the property and the fact uh that is visible there that's looking to be resed so this is really about the distinction between two zoning districts that are along the 121 Corridor as well as the Dallas North Tollway Corridor the districts were implemented at the same time they're identical in the area yard and bulk requirements but there the primary distinction is really related to uses the RC or Regional commercial Zone district is focused on retail and service uses like you would typically see in along these highways um I put in the zoning area there's 980 Acres of regional commercial and 134 undeveloped um the this does allow retail and restaurant uses by right the regional employment district is really focused on more of office type development and it is 63 it does allow a small portion of retail and restaurant uses under certain circumstances So within the area of this request the requested uh lot is shown in yellow you can see there is an existing 17.8 acre retail Shopping Center in the regional commercial zoning within this vicinity it is uh anchored across to the West a 26 acre parcel um there's an existing gas station there but that is under construction today so a little bit about the history of zoning on this property it was um when re and RC were enacted this was the zoning was established based on parcel lines so you can see it splits the parcel today in because the initial development in this area was the residential development you see to the South that's North Glenn 1 and the drive connecting North Glen 1 was established based on safety of residents in the neighborhood so there wasn't direct access off the highway extending into the neighborhood and so that created this existing split zone property through that development this is another example showing you the zoning layers the sf6 zoning of the residential neighborhood to the South and the way the ex existing zoning lines uh BCT the parcel as well as the request that would established RC along the property line of the lot 4 r with regard to conformance to the comprehensive plan this is within the expressway corridor's future land use map and in that regard looking at retail and office use uses it does meet the land use standards of the city from a strictly mix of uses perspective um so you can see it meets the descriptions and priorities and mixes of uses it's really these kind of uh fine grain policies when you get into looking at that you start to find that there are conflicts with the city's standards so we did have one individual in support and that was from the property owner so you can see because of the kind of triangular shape of the request the remainder of the property is within the 200 foot buffer so that's indicated then the responses from the N uh one in support um of total and that is the property owner one neutral which is a nearby commercial property and three in uh residential lots in the adjacent neighborhood that are in opposition this request was denied by a 5-3 vote at the Planning and Zoning commission and so is up for consideration on appeal to the city you might have on this case thank you Christina any questions for staff Christina thank you for the presentation just for clarification again what we're looking at in the Triangle here he's wanting to change that part of the triangle from uh Regional employment to Regional commercial is that correct that is correct currently it's the employment zoning not the zoning not the essentially retail type zoning under Regional commercial in typical Regional employment we we we tend to look at offices correct and light industrial that it is a kind of manufacturing office it would allow medical office or general office any type office use do does religious organ they can okay what about medical facil surgical centers is that Regional employment center it is thank you Shelby thank you Christina um under the site specific considerations we see that the property is currently developed with a structure approximately 95% within the regional employment zoning District uh it says as the re District this is not a minor adjustment uh but would result in significant changes to the land uses previously allowed on the site um minor adjustment can you please explain that um I'm I'm not clear if 95% is already there and presumably the building's not going to be knocked down um what would be not a minor adjustment it I think it means that the property itself the vast majority of this building is ining is in re zoning so we have records that a zoning verification letter was received by the applicant for this property when it was developed initially on the property so it's a known condition it was built with the known because the property was built under this known condition and will take the majority of the building from RE to almost entirely 100% in RC would that would or equally in compliance with re or RC if are you saying if the zoning is approved yes if the zoning is approved to turn the whole thing to RC um would that building then be out of place in RC I believe there today that would be allowed under RC there's also a bank that exists there today that would still be allowed under the RC zoning facilities are allowed universally in any zoning District so it would bring some of them into compliance but nothing not into compliance am I hearing that right it's it's currently all in compliance I think the the staff allowed because the property is partially zoned Regional commercial we've allowed the single lease of the 980 sare F feet of retail okay but if it's all rezoned RC as the applicants requesting that would be out of compliance it would mean that vacant Suites would be able to be leased to retailers not just to The Limited uses in the employment category thank you all right thank you thank you I'll open the public hearing do I have speakers we have one speaker Nelson low who I believe is the applicant okay good morning Council um excuse me for my address I just came straight from work so I'm the developer um let's see if I have the next my slides on here okay so these are my slides um we built it um no it's a 9,000 foot building currently obviously you guys know it's regional employment we have 2400 Square F feet left since Inception so it's been six years and our property is the only property along this the 121 Corridor that's split zoned uh when we bought the property in 2016 I know um the city said that we knew it was re and not RC but at the time our broker was asking back and forth and they were like we don't know we think it's RC um and so they uh I think it's called the pre- zoning whatever thing um we asked and it said uh the employment mix would be remain in would be remain inconsistent but they said it was still no problems with it it was it was still a positive pre-application meeting so I I was I applied to get rezoned and then we had you know we had all these uh tenants that were about to kind of go see so we had to turn these people away and that's part of what I wish we had more public here to kind of actually talk about some of the tenants that we had and some of the opposition that we had and I know why because we had in I don't know if you have the information but some of the people at the opposition were complaining about some of the tenants that we had we have a smoke shop in one of the bu in one of our buildings and they were complaining about being having being a smoke shop there they had some car shows and I mean I wish we had RC in the beginning because then we would have been opened up to better tenants along the way we wouldn't have to rent to some of these other people that we are now forced to you know we could have had at AT&T store there we could have had a multiple jewelry stores there that would have been closed at night time and not have the issue of people complaining about car shows and people coming to get things like that I mean it would have helped the community quite a bit actually um um and some of the we talked about what the planning zoning committee that you know they love Plano we love Plano too I live in Plano and it would be nice to not have a empty spot in a in a strip center for six years uh and it would helped it would have helped our neighbors in the area also um so this is what happened on on the last uh vote these are some of the questions that they had um if uhing retail Eastward but we're the only splitstone property so I don't think that's going to be a matter of that um our property isn't connect to the rest of the retail next to us but we are because we have we actually have you don't have to get on the toll the the frontage road to get over there there's actually a road behind um ccil thought that you know I you know they thought that I own buildings to the east which you know we don't um which is kind of funny because there's another building next to us but they to us we didn't we don't own that so we don't want to change all the zoning to the east of us at all we just want to change that little kind of triangle and it's literally on the the line that runs that zone for the zoning is right down the middle of our building next one my slide just stopped so to kind of go back to I didn't know that I was talking to the city council L of time to to the zoning committee again because this is our first time doing this so going back to what they were kind of having an issue with is we did call the city uh my broker called the city and they said it they said it was RC and then so we thought we were going to we bought the land already we bought we're going to build a building and it came back as re so we tried actually to try to get reone when we first buil area so let's try to do the building in re which is fine um but then we realized after six years that we have an empty space that we couldn't find a good tenant we could have that we could have found if we had RC so we have a empty space for six years um so now we're trying to get re Z to try to open it up to more tenants and we do have uh potential tenants that that want to go in but we have to kind of honing we have a dyal pizza that want to go in there and we would love to rent to them uh and serve the community but we can't right now because we're already at our limit of the 10% of our our Flor space for retail um so there's no like we talked about there's no CH reaction of rezoning to the east because we were the only split zone property you can see how confusing it was when we first bought the building or bought the land and built the building building um so we yeah like I said we are connected to the rest of the retail and there's also no uh vacancies in that Kroger uh Plaza that are west of us right now there's no vacancies at all so there's plenty of room for people to that want to they want to have open a business in our in our in our building but we have to refuse them because we can't open our space up to anybody that's that's a you know like a like a like a restaurant is unfortunate so we have a empty space there but can can you switch sides next but that's my kind of confusing kind of uh issue that we had for the last six years and I hope that the city can kind of understand why we want to open up that little 2400 foot space in our building to more tenants so we w't have an empty space and be able to serve the community and get better tenant into our building do you have any questions for the applicant Maria well same thing I mean I I want to I want to hear your perspective so you obviously went through pnz and they've denied you so tell me why I mean it sounds fairly logical to me that you know it should be one zone and and not two zones not split zones but yeah what is the the rationale they gave you to go back and say sorry this is not we talked about was that they were afraid that a chain reaction of people wanting to rezone um east of me but where the are the east of you are they all re they're all re east of me I'm the only property that's like literally the line runs through the middle of it and so I said that's not going to happen because we're the only split zone property um but in the planning zoning meeting I I only get to present what I my case and I get to sit down and I listen to them deliberate and I don't really have a chance okay oh my question is for staff so oh okay yes mayor thank you so thank you for that presentation I know this was discussed at the pnz meeting as well but just to make sure that I'm clear on the timeline 16 at some point was it before or after the purchase uh uh you had a a a representative called the city and they state that they were told that the entire property was RC so that's we called before we bought the property our broker called one time and they said it's RC which is weird and then the next time so we like okay let's let's buy the land and everything um and then the next time they call went into we found that the shivil engineer actually told us it's re so we better go try to do a reone and they was still land at that time we didn't try to we didn't build yet because they said that there was too much retail in the district already and so that was I guess the other thing that I was trying to understand because at the at the pnz meeting there was discussion about um I think maybe the staff mentioned that the building is built and but the the timeline as I'm understanding it was um 2016 there are conversations uh you know you you mentioned confusion about is it RC or the zoning case in 2017 where there's a request to remove the split zoning make the whole thing RC and that's um that's turned down and so then the building is built in 2018 no the building was already built we were so in the middle of all this we already had our architecture and everything already set so when we found out there was re we went away right away and tried to uh do the rezone and we return down so we already had the retail building already designed and we were going to build already okay okay gotcha that that removes my confusion on that issue then I was also just uh Googling just now because the thought occurred to me as you presented of retail space that we have in the city of Plano um some of the tenants that you mentioned like AT&T obviously you had to turn them down do do you know where they went where they I have get an Loi and so once we get the Lo we when we know that we're not zoned for it we can't do anything about it you know we have to just tell them that we can't do it okay gotcha but I guess to the point about like if this is reone competing with you know what retail does that leave vacant somewhere else do you know where we only have these tenants that you to turn down do you know where they generally I have no idea area in that low Corner we don't have any vacancy at all at all okay so so I don't think it's an issue I think we have you know we we I think we can get a retail tenant in there which would be great for the community and also we do have right now uh Domino's Pizza is actually waiting for us to to get in and we only have 2400 square feet it's not a lot we have pretty long leases and everybody else so I'm really what I'm really asking for is that hopefully that we can change the zone that my 2400 ft can be filled and so that we don't have an empty space there sitting for another who knows how many years okay well thank you for that information I appreciate that all right thank you very much appreciate it I'll close the public hearing confine the comments to the council Shelby um to your question councilman cadelli I'm looking around and it doesn't look like there are a lot of other retail options nearby um I do think have an overabundance of retail in the city as a whole but it's a big city 72 square miles um and I'm I'm sympathetic to the split Zone here and the need to staff bring us a split zoning case recently which we and with the re the re versus RC designation um this is less than an acre I don't this isn't going to be the next Mall built in Plano so even if there is a little additional commercial um that's probably a benefit in this microcosmic area the way I see it the the um the comments that we've had against this uh seem to hinge on the traffic around the Islamic Center so if we're filling in um some um some additional square footage with um retail versus other commercial uses it's all commercial if we're filling it with additional retail uses verus versus other types of commercial I don't see that as even a drop in the bucket compar uh thank you Mr will to confirm what you're were saying councilman Williams I drove by the facility today to look at it to get a go back to my PN you have the Islamic Center to the Far East next to it we have a vape shop and then we have the smaller retail that's empty and then we have the bank if you go immediately to the west across uh Talon drive that was a former former surgery emergency East we have a uh skin um we have doctor facilities for Dermatology and even further west where or east where you start seeing multiple uh story buildings those are all geared toward medical so we we seem to be in this area here where it's you know we have one side part of this split Zone unfortunately that is commercial and then the other is employment so I can feel for the owner of this building there are some that was in building shame on you but I I sort of empathize with the fact it's a split Zone I mean there's no way he's going to fill that space unless he puts a small dentist office in there or something it's just it's just unfortunate s circumstances and I think just by Happ happen stance that we split this Z came from the early ODS I guess we can change those lines all the time so I think to change this to Grant his appeal to make it U you know Regional commercial for this small building certainly not going to affect the rest of the the the area that's just my opinion where you is that a second or no that was a motion yeah I would second that motion all right any other comments sorry Anthony you know th this is a tough zoning case for me because of how serious y know I am about the comprehensive plan so when the staff says it doesn't comply with the comprehensive plan that's a big deal for me but I'll tell you I also sympathize with the split Zone and you know the apparent confusion in this situation at the time that the build out a drop in the bucket in terms of you know uh the percentage of of uh and and just given the the split Zone and the hardship on the applicant I I think they the this is the kind of unique situation that the comprehensive plan did not foresee so I'm I'm I'm okay uh yeah uh for clarification because it's an appeal we have to have a super majority is that correct yeah okay I just want clarification on it all right so I have a motion Rick you yeah I just GNA make the one thing I don't think there now that you drive path that to go into my only concern is what the the opening of what type of tenant could fill that 2400t facility with with the change of zoning and I and I think you know neighbors we you know we've seen some less than desirable types of businesses go into small places over time and I can feel shop and you know I don't particularly care about the car shows I think that's that's kind of cool but again it's different and and it buged the homeowner so you know I still have to kind of feel for the homeowners and it's it's a tough thing but as I think uh Rick one of y'all said that that it was a known situation when the property was put in there so you know I'm I'm I'm still not convinced that it would be in the best interest of the neighborhood to to a type of business that they can go in there okay thanks I hadn't thought of this question until you brought that up does um hours of operation would those change based on the type of zoning is there no we don't regulate the hours of operation by changing the zoning my guess is because people that don't want it there are dealing with kind of normal office hours now and this could put someone in there that would be operating in later hours only just the Practical considerations of retailers uh hours versus office hours okay but there's no work around with that I mean we we can't control hours okay ask may I ask um I I like to ask a question Christine I applican so what did you believe is the reason for the um denial and the appeal ultimately right um from pnz I'm sorry right I believe pnz was really represent was concerned about the city's policies overall we've had a number of of considerations over time of changing to ad retail and I think the city's held a pretty tough line on that by the I think real structure of the zoning today where there are the retail nodes on the corner and that the rational zoning line here should be along tokalon Drive um so because that makes a clean break between the re to the West I'm sorry the RC to the west and the re to the east um also the addition of the 26a a lot more retail to this area in the very near future so I think those were considerations so do do you think that they would have been more um prefer it turning into a re rather than the RC is that is that what you I believe that's the cleanup there was even discussion of calling a public Hearing in the future but uh they were advised to wait for this process to play out the The Vape Shop is considered and and approved use for re it is a retail establishment so the 10,000 the 10% retail allowance that they have that is the V shop yeah that's it oh you only get 10% I see yeah okay I was okay I was confused everybody oh mayor I'm I'm sorry I just wanted to bring up something because I do think council member Smith brought up a good point one thing that was persuasive to me in in saying we should let this uh resoning to RC go forward was the idea that uh some of the existing uses are not uh perhaps as amenable to the neighborhood as the uses that that could come like a domino or an AT&T store under RC but of course other uses could cations that we could add to this in uh in approving the appeal that would um that would better I guess protect the neighborhood make it's the kind of thing that that the owner is is proposing here in AT&T a dominoes something like that certainly um I'm not aware of a means to do that because it is a straight zoning request it's not a plan development or even an Su where you can provide restrictions okay gotcha so there there there's no no stipulations whatsoever I think the only way to do that would be through a development agreement of some type or resoning to a plan development District which we typically don't do for a just it's just 2400 square feet I mean okay and that and they already have the The Vape Shop to the east of there so that that eliminates one of them I mean we already have vape shop so it's like yeah what else so all right so I have a uh on item one all in favor raise your hand and let me see it okay one one two three four five oh all oppose okay so it's passes seven to one make it a good one all right item two public hearing and consideration of a resolution to adopt a new Heritage 24 Heritage preservation plan and approving it plan and approving it as The Guiding policy document for the city's Heritage preservation the city of Plano repealing the former preservation plan providing an effective date good evening mayor and Council I'm going to try to follow Christina Dez I'm a little bit taller than her this microphone but I will try to speak up uh this item is consideration of the 20 the city's initial Heritage preservation plan was adopted in 1981 the most recent update occurred in 2018 with preservation plan a 150 this process to update this current plan began in 2023 is recommended in the comprehensive plan uh there's been VAR changes proposed to this document um but I'm going to cover these uh in chapter one it discusses the purpose and the vision of the plan updates to this chapter include how the development of the 2024 plan progressed as well as community outreach details and accomplishments which have been occurred uh with the plan since 2018 chapter 3 uh you may all be aware is a great addition to the plan it's a graphical timeline updated to include events through 2023 chapter 5 includes the most uh substantial changes to the plan the city worked with a consultant to survey pre-1975 properties and based on the results of that survey this chapter provides a modified list of potential Heritage resources and a new list of potential neighborhood only they don't initiate or create any Heritage destination or zoning change but they are included in the plan just for some fun imagery here there's uh some of the properties before you just two I wanted to note that are particularly interesting the country Burger site is listed at the top right corner of the screen off 14th Street and in the bottom row second from the left is the Thunderbird Roller Rink these lists are uh a map of the updated map of the potential Heritage resources and we have a map of potential neighborhood conservation districts as well chapter six includes uh key components of the preservation plan program with the goals responsibilities and prior to in this current plan however we did modify some actions and add new actions based upon the property survey so the update is in conformance with two actions within the comprehensive plan which are listed here and the 2024 Plan before you is a culmination of over 10 months of work by staff and hhm the project survey consultant the updates are intended to keep the document current by noting surveyed property overall the plan will provide support for the city's Heritage preservation program for years to come um The Heritage commission recommended approval by a vote of 5 to Z I'd be glad to any questions and Mr matal the Heritage preservation officer is also available for questions thank you thanks Eric any questions for staff all right thank you I'll open the public hearing public hearing any speakers there are no speakers on this item I'll close a public hearing confine the comments to the council motion to approve second thank you I have a motion a second to approve item number two all in favor please raise your hand motion passes 8 to zero next item comments of public interest we have no speakers this evening oh being no further business me