[0:00] Mayor Mary Fasbender: to order please stand for the pledge of allegiance [0:22] Mayor Mary Fasbender: welcome and we have a full house which is a great evening for the community of hastings so let the role reflect that all council members have been um are present and have and have an aquarium has been established tonight we have a special honor and it is to say goodbye to our police chief but it's also welcoming our new police chief our commander and two new officers so chief schaefer you know for for your work here you have put tireless effort into our community and professionalism that set a [1:07] Mayor Mary Fasbender: tone for the rest of the department was honored to be on that hiring committee eight years ago while i was on psac commission and i was so glad that you chose hastings for your next and final as we find out tonight um your position so know that you always will have a home here in hastings and i'll just say you have the key to the city we won't give you one but i'll say it i personally would love to just wish you the best in your future whatever that may be i hope you ride into the sunset on many [1:53] Mayor Mary Fasbender: days and have lunch outside and whatever you wish to do in the winter i hope it's done with all happiness and know that you have left our community and we are very proud that you were here for us for eight years council [2:16] Councilmember Dave Pemble: comments i'm sorry i do council members make a quick chief brian i i think the key that i think the community needs to know that i've seen since being on the council and since brian's been here is the word consistent um this department is one of the most consistent that we have and every decision that is made from chief schaefer down his staff follows and it's very consistent that's important to the community and i appreciate you bringing that because i think it's important that the community knows they're going to get the same answer no matter what because your department is set up to be consistent and that's so important to me um as an elected official representing the residents and brian you did a good job on that bringing that to everybody so chief wilski i think you're next you're going to have [3:02] Councilmember Mya Beck: to keep that up and show walter you'll have to follow with that too so thank you very much councilmember brox chief i just want to say thank you one thing that came out in the interview process for chief was just the culture that you created that you've created a different culture um than when you arrived one of openness and trust with each other and you just brought our police department you've evolved it so much further than it was before and i know the last eight years i can't imagine that you imagined what was going to happen in the world and in the culture within that time so i'm sure it hasn't been easy but i just want to say thank you from the residents of hastings and also as a council member that you've made a difference here and it's going to have a lasting impact that will last much [3:48] Councilmember DawnMarie Vihrachoff: beyond your career for creating that cultural change we just really appreciate you councilmember folch thank you um chief i just want to add in addition to the words that were just that i i would like to personally say thank you for your patience with us as council members because we have lots of questions and you've always been gracious and kind and and and we have always felt that and i know we i can i feel confident that i speak for all of us we feel that we can trust your guidance and your advice and so i mean that is just immeasurable and so thank you so much you're going to be so greatly missed and [4:34] Councilmember DawnMarie Vihrachoff: um thank you for having such a wonderful staff and and that um and that we can have confidence moving forward into the future with your team so thank you again [4:50] Councilmember Lisa Leifeld: council member lifevelt thank your honor chief i've it's been wonderful getting to know you the big thing i'm really thinking about everything everyone else here is saying is oh you know spot on but looking at the connection to the community over the last you know three to five years that i'm noticing and just always putting that i don't know the walking the walk talking the talk you're out in the public you're you're accessible i remember coming to you years ago about a young gal who was really interested in pursuing a career in the police force and i we were at an event together and i said oh hold on a second let me go get you know let me go get the chief and you immediately had a conversation with her and i know she has [5:36] Councilmember Lisa Leifeld: gone on to pursue a career in the direction of law enforcement so just being that piece for the community you know we always are hearing of so much turmoil going on and you know i know you guys don't always get the best the best rap and you know what you've done here in hastings for being out in the public and shaking hands and kissing babies and it's that's all so important it's such a big part of the job you know and especially in a community like this so i'm going to greatly miss you it's been an absolute pleasure getting to know you and i'm always so in shock when i go to meetings and i just learn so much and my the public safety has always been one of those i just learned so much every time i sit down with you guys and i [6:22] Councilmember Lisa Leifeld: really appreciate all you do and all you've done for the community of hastings and look forward to hearing what you're going to do in your retirement thanks chief councilmember fox thank you your honor chief thank you for your years of service to echo some of the the words that have gone before me um we really appreciate everything you've done for hastings another thing that we appreciate is your deep leadership and one sign of a good leader is how they train their team and i think what we're seeing here in in your replacement as well as the people who are coming up behind them we're so fortunate to have your guidance and your your vision for what a good department looks like so that we have a strong future in our force in hastings thank you so much [7:09] Councilmember Tim Lawrence: and council member one well you're blushing lots of great compliments and it's all true um i think one of the neatest things about you is how creative you are and how forward thinking you were in your role um you know not a lifetime council member five years six years or whatever you know but um i learned a lot about the police force and and it's uh much different than what i expected and a lot of it is because of the things that you brought forward for us to consider new things different ways to look at things um and i i know that'll carry forward so the the culture piece that that creativity [7:56] Councilmember Tim Lawrence: um i think is part of that as well and and um yeah it's a better place than when you began and i know you're leaving it in good hands as well thank you thank you council chief if you would step to the podium the council would like to read a proclamation starting with councilmember brox whereas hastings police chief brian d schaefer is one of 55 police chiefs to lead the hastings police department during its 165-year history and will retire after 39 years as a police officer and nearly eight and a half years as hastings police chief effective may 29 2022 and [8:41] Councilmember Mya Beck: whereas he has significantly changed the culture and structure of the organization and advanced the agency further than ever before and at a time when policing has undergone dramatic changes and whereas he has strengthened the department through hiring and or promoting eighty percent of the position since being hired and given them the necessary tools to do their job safely and effectively and whereas he has established management and coaching processes based on fairness accountability and a strong reward system and implemented tracking of staff training to ensure compliance with the minnesota post board requirements and whereas he has implemented technology [9:27] Councilmember DawnMarie Vihrachoff: advancements like body worn cameras and mr mvr coupled with accountability demands by the public and increased access and service by establishing online police and digital forms and applications and whereas he has updated necessary policies and procedures to ensure clean record-giving and retention strategies with the records division earning a reputation as the gold standard in dakota county and whereas during his tenure he has embedded department in the community through volunteerism fundraising and board participation and several organizations including the hastings united way hastings family service [10:13] Mayor Mary Fasbender: and the rotary along with numerous community partner organizations now therefore be it resolved that i mayor mary fassbender and the city council of the city of hastings do hereby declare may 29th 2022 as brian d shaffer day in the city of hastings minnesota [Applause] [10:50] Mayor Mary Fasbender: so put that day on your calendar so we can raise a toast to brian schaefer on and actually i think that's a sunday so yeah day before a holiday there you go he picked the right day so at this time chief will bring up his officers and we'll do a swearing-in thank you mayor and council um thank you so much for that proclamation and uh i said this was out of uh my nearly 39 years has been the highlight of my career this has been the most fulfilling uh you know i quite a history before i came here and uh this by far um made the most impression on me and i i just can't thank you enough i can't thank the community enough my staff [11:38] Chief Brian Schaefer: this is a fabulous staff and i am so very very proud of them and i i i know you are in good hands and i think the uh just like i said it's so it's overwhelming to think that uh this that we've come so far uh and what i would think i thought that i thought we were going to be here in uh five years ago so it took a while to get things where we wanted it but i couldn't be more proud today leaving the department as we are and i was telling somebody today that i couldn't come up with a better scenario than what we have or what you have moving forward so to my staff i want to say thank you you have stood behind me and this what was [12:23] Chief Brian Schaefer: said tonight could not have been done without you it's not me it's it's getting the right people in the right places to get the job done and that is that is a testament to every one of my staff so thank you thank you so much i appreciate that so uh tonight is about the future and um so we're going to start the night out with i get a couple of things here i'm going to try and formalize this a little bit even though we've kind of talked a little bit but mayor fassbender council members commissioners staff citizens family and friends welcome as we open tonight's ceremony i think it's only fitting that we recognize our officers during police week this is ironic that we're able to [13:08] Chief Brian Schaefer: do that today at the beginning of police week honoring all law enforcement and those who have given the ultimate sacrifice and with that i would just like to ask for a moment of silence and respect for those that have given the ultimate sacrifice [13:38] Chief Brian Schaefer: thank you as is mentioned tonight i have the honor of administering the oath of office to our new police officers deputy chief and chief of police throughout my tenure we remained committed to hiring and promoting only the best and tonight exemplifies just that this was done with purpose and vision and i'm confident we have succeeded as you've heard these appointments give me great pride knowing that these new officers and new leadership team represent the best of the best taking hastings police department to the next level and professional policing i know this community supports you i know they support all that you have endured to get here and all that is yet [14:23] Chief Brian Schaefer: come at this time i want to present the first two officers for the oath of office police officer george freeman den and matthew green if you would step forward please a little bit housekeeping tonight what we're going to do for the audience is i will swear in each group of officers i will call the family member who you chose to pin the badge to come forward and once you've done that we'll do a round of applause and we'll have them take their seats we're going to save photographs for the end so we want to go through this whole process and we'll bring everybody up and get a picture with city council if that that works for everybody [15:09] Chief Brian Schaefer: so first georgian freeman den she's a hastings resident formerly served as a crime prevention specialist with the savage police department today i had the honor of accompanying her to duluth where she received the 2021 excellence in service award from the minnesota association of women police officers so that was quite an honor that she joined an elite group of female officers from the state of minnesota and her accomplishments and the chief still he makes me thank him because obviously she did all of these made all these accomplishments while she was in savage and we stole her so hastings has everything to gain by by our hiring of georgian [15:55] Chief Brian Schaefer: uh she was former formerly as uh councilmember lifefelt talked about she was actually a reservist with the hastings police department many years ago and this was always her focus to come back here to hastings to become a police officer she has a bachelor's degree from university of minnesota in sociology of law criminology and deviance and obtained her law enforcement skills certificate with rasmussen college in 2021 she joined us in january and recently started patrol on the night watch officer matthew green matt was formerly a public safety officer interim sergeant at the university of st thomas he formerly served as a store co-manager he's that [16:41] Chief Brian Schaefer: company manager i think co-manager co-manager for walmart and other sales associate positions over the last 10 years matt graduated from winona state university in human resources and business management choosing law enforcement as a second career he completed his law enforcement certificate from century college in 2020 finished his skills at hennepin technical college in 21 and joined us in january and is in now his final phase of field training so with that at this point in time i would like to administer the oath if i might [17:31] Chief Brian Schaefer: of the united states of america that i will support the constitution of the united states of america the constitution state of minnesota the constitution of the state of minnesota and the ordinances of the city of hastings and the ordinances of the city and i will faithfully discharge the duties and i will faithfully discharge the duties of a police officer for the city of hastings city houston counties of dakota and washington counties of dakota and washington and state of minnesota and state of minnesota according to the best of my judgment and ability according to the best of my judgment and ability on my honor i will never betray my badge i will never betray my badge my integrity my integrity my character my character our public trust our catholic church i will [18:17] Chief Brian Schaefer: always have the courage to hold myself and others accountable for their actions i will always have the courage to hold myself and others accountable for our i will always extreme the constitution i will always uphold the constitution my community my community and the agency congratulations [Applause] get this all straightened out here now if matt's mother mary would step forward for the badge pinning and jorjan's husband jake and sons hunter and maverick [19:22] Chief Brian Schaefer: uh please give them a round [19:46] Chief Brian Schaefer: what i neglected to mention that i always like to remind people and i'd like to remind my officers that one of the most well-known symbols of policing is in fact the badge this badge is a symbol of trust and authority given to you by the citizens of hastings with its issuance we pray that you will serve a long safe and successful career and i went back into the records and i believe with the completion of the pinning tonight that's 39 badge pinnings we've done in the last eight and a half years so we've been busy we've been busy but uh nonetheless uh you see what that it was worth it so next um i'd like to invite commander brian showalter forward for the oath for deputy chief of police and [20:32] Chief Brian Schaefer: badge pinning right there is good perfect [20:43] Chief Brian Schaefer: brian showalter is a 16-year veteran of the hastings police department showalter began his career here as a patrol officer in 2006 and was later assigned as an investigator in the dakota county drug task force where he became a team leader in 2009 brian returned to the patrol division in 2014 uh as a new chief who ordered him back immediately he still he still won't let me forget or won't forgive me for that but uh but anyway came back in 2014 the patrol division was promoted to patrol sergeant in 2017 he was appointed to the newly created rank of police commander when we were reorganizing supervising the patrol [21:29] Chief Brian Schaefer: division and department operations he holds a master's degree in criminal justice leadership from concordia university a bachelor's degree in law enforcement from metropolitan state university and completed northwestern school of police staff and command commander showalter exemplifies all aspects of a great leader and all that hpd represents he's highly motivated and balances oversight with autonomy and getting the job done and i'm extremely proud of him tonight uh brian's badge will be pinned on by his father daryl and let me do the oath very quickly you want to step forward step right here how's that where were you performing go ahead here we go raise your right hand i brian j showalter aye brian j showalter [22:16] Chief Brian Schaefer: you solemnly affirm do solemnly affirm that it will support the constitution of the united states of america that i will support the constitution of the united states of america the constitution of the state of minnesota the constitution of the state of minnesota and the ordinance of the city of hastings and the ordinances of the city of hastings and that i will faithfully discharge the duties of deputy police chief and i will faithfully discharge the duties of deputy police chief for the city of hastings for the city of hastings counties of dakota and washington counties of dakota and washington and state of minnesota and state of minnesota according to the best of my judgment and ability according to the best of my judgment and ability on my honor on my honor i will never betray my badge i will never betray my badge my integrity my integrity my character my character or public trust or public [23:02] Deputy Chief Brian Showalter: trust i always have the courage i will always have the courage to hold myself and others accountable for their actions to hold myself and others accountable for their actions i will always uphold the constitution i will always uphold the constitution my community my community and the agency i serve and the agency i serve congratulations thank you [Applause] his father daryl will be pinning the badge this evening and his collar brass his eagles first i gave it to you [Laughter] can't find the ring right [23:48] Chief Brian Schaefer: watch me [23:57] Chief Brian Schaefer: there we go [24:04] Chief Brian Schaefer: see this that's good [24:15] Chief Brian Schaefer: don't get the juggler got a first aid kit [24:35] Chief Brian Schaefer: it's not going in you're stronger than that there it is perfect [24:53] Chief Brian Schaefer: last but not least please join me in welcoming deputy police chief david wilski for the oath of office for chief of police and badge pinning david d wilski began his duties with the hastings police department in may of 2017 following a 20-year career with the university of minnesota police department he became our first deputy chief as part of again reorganization he holds a bachelor's degree bachelor of science degree in physical education and sociology with a criminal justice emphasis since joining the hastings police department wilski has led the department training and development fleet management emergency management and supervise the investigative and evidence [25:39] Chief Brian Schaefer: room operations he has been instrumental in forming partnerships with key community leaders and groups wilski brings compassion vision and energy to the organization and embodies the values of pride and service of the hastings police department he is a strong and trusted leader and one that you can count on at this time i'll ask dave's son jack to step forward for the badge painting yeah i can do the oath you can stand up here with your father are you ready [26:20] Chief Brian Schaefer: all right i'm david d wilson aye david d wilski do solemnly affirm do solemnly affirm that i will support the constitution of the united states of america that i will support the constitution of the united states of america the constitution of the state of minnesota the constitution of the state of minnesota and the ordinances of the city of hastings and the ordinances of the city of hastings and that i will faithfully discharge the duties of chief of police and that i will faithfully discharge the duties of chief of police for the city of hastings for the city of hastings counties of dakota and washington counties of dakota and washington and state of minnesota and state of minnesota according to the best of my judgment and ability according to the best of my judgment and ability on my honor on my honor i will never betray my badge [27:06] Chief David Wilski: i will never betray my badge my integrity my integrity my character my character or the public trust or the public trust i will always have the courage to hold myself i will always have the courage to hold myself and others accountable for their actions and others accountable for their actions i will always uphold the constitution i will always uphold the constitution my community my community and the agency i serve and the agency i serve congratulations thank you [Applause] [27:50] Chief Brian Schaefer: it's the hot seat [28:32] Chief David Wilski: [Applause] chief wilson has a few words to say and the as i said before i couldn't be more proud of this team and the leadership that's coming forward so please stand beside them and work with them to accomplish this this sometimes incredible feat that we have so chief we'll see thank you chief bear with me i'm not as eloquent as chief schaefer he's had more practice i will get there mayor fassbender members of city council city administration public safety advisory commission distinguished guests community members law enforcement [29:17] Chief David Wilski: colleagues friends and family it is with great honor that i stand here today and accept the challenge and responsibility to be the city of hastings 56th chief of police although i have shared this story with others it is worth repeating five years ago i applied for and was offered the position as the deputy chief of police for the city of hastings within the first week of employment while walking downtown in the historic part of town i had two separate individuals approach me shake my hand thank me for my service within the first few weeks after observing officers interact with the public and the professionalism and patience that was displayed on a daily basis it became clear to me that i had found my home in law enforcement what i observed is something that many communities strive for officers respect for their community and the citizens and the community's respect for their police [30:04] Chief David Wilski: department the past few years have been especially difficult for us in the law enforcement profession law enforcement agencies in relatively close proximity have felt their communities walk away from them and show little to no support the hastings police department experienced the complete opposite we observed overwhelming support on a weekly basis and continued to see this from the community i didn't think it was possible to eat so many donuts on a weekly basis but we managed i can't thank you enough and i'm talking to the community as a whole for standing behind the hastings police department when times were tough and it mattered most i pledge to do everything in my power to address issues in our community head on i will be an attentive listener to issues being raised in our community stand behind my words i'll be responsive [30:50] Chief David Wilski: transparent and do everything in my power to make this community safer and stronger to the police department and those standing in the back of the room do you know why officers stand in the back of the room it's because they have their back to the wall and they're safe so when you walk into a room and you always see officers in the back that's why we stand back there and thank you for being here today i truly appreciate it this is overwhelming support from our department and i have i have observed nothing but excellent service from all of you over the past five years i expect nothing less as we continue to serve our community in the future many years ago when i was serving as a patrol sergeant my mantra to the team was not on our shift the translation was that we would do everything in our power to track those causing harm to our community and do everything to keep our community safe [31:35] Chief David Wilski: i expect a continued practice of patience and empathy on calls for service that you provide now and to treat everyone as a member of your family i pledged you that i will work diligently to to provide you the tools and training necessary for your success i will stand behind you when laws and policies are followed and above all i will treat you with the respect and dignity that you deserve i am thankful you allowed me to to come into your family five years ago and i could not be more excited to walk alongside you in the years to come city officials and city leaders although we have worked together for a number years i ask for your patience as i navigate these unchartered waters i have big shoes to fill but look forward to the continued partnerships as we work together to ensure this historic city continues to thrive and move forward [32:22] Chief David Wilski: i pledge to work tirelessly to maintain the positive relationships that have been developed over the years with city council city leaders public safety advisory commission our ministerial association dakota and washington county law enforcement agencies and to so many others that make this community so great to chief schaefer where do i start i've worked for a number of chiefs over the years but i've never worked for someone with your energy intelligence sense of humor and patience that that are required to be a successful leader i am hopeful that i have absorbed enough wisdom over the years to keep your legacy moving forward you are a leader you're a mentor you're a friend and i can't thank you enough for showing me once again how fun and exciting this job can be [33:07] Chief David Wilski: what it is like to truly have an open door policy and for always allowing me to yell to you from my office which happens about every day i wish you nothing but the best in your retirement i hope you can finally sign find some time to enjoy your hobbies and take a golf lesson once in a while deputy chief showalter and i are expecting huge improvements on the links in closing i'd like to honor those that have been so supportive throughout my career my father doug wilski i will not make you stand but if you could raise your hand he has not been quiet this long and i think in the history my dad always calls me on the way to work and i usually call him on the way home once in a while he asked me if my bobber [33:52] Chief David Wilski: is down and that's way of of asking if everything's okay might be a hard day at work or just a lot on my mind although he doesn't show it he worries about all of us in this profession he always has been a great supporter of law enforcement so thank you for that my brother pat wilski if you could raise your hand he hasn't really done anything so but that's my brother [Laughter] you know in all seriousness he has a great sense of humor and he can bring me up after a difficult day we talk on a daily basis and he also loves to hear about what is going on in hastings so i appreciate that my second cousin tom wilski you could raise your hand tom mielski is a retired lieutenant from the airport police department he was the first wilski to start in law [34:37] Chief David Wilski: enforcement and always allowed me to ask a million questions when i had no idea what i was doing and then finally my son jack jack if you could raise your hand i could not ask for a better son a cop can't always make the things that in the family that they'd like to on kids sporting events or boy scout meetings band recitals jack always understood there have been times when i fell asleep on the couch after working night shift and he always understood sometimes i had to run out the door head to town with lights and sirens going he never complained jack has been my best achievement and i couldn't be prouder and to my mom carolyn wilski who couldn't be with us today she's always been my biggest cheerleader we lost mom years ago to pneumonia she'll never be forgotten she loved police stories would often ask what is [35:23] Chief David Wilski: happening at work and truly enjoyed every moment that as a law enforcement officer so thank you again once for coming tonight and supporting me the police department and everyone that you see here today i couldn't be prouder to be part of this department in this city and i can't thank you enough thank you [35:53] Chief Brian Schaefer: i'd like to invite our our department chaplain jim bezoski forward for a prayer [36:12] Chaplain Jim Bezokes: i have the privilege of being with these wonderful gentlemen every monday morning i have the privilege of being with all these wonderful officers that serve you so faithfully but i would like to pray for you david and you brian in your new positions the new officers over here just so proud of you but you know i want to remind all of us we all need god's help and and each and every day you need to know that i'm praying for you we have a community that prays for you so if you would father i pray i thank you lord for our chief brian that you for the service [36:58] Chaplain Jim Bezokes: that he has given to our city we acknowledge that you have used him mightily to help us in our town thank you for his leadership and his guidance and again all that he's done in so many ways keep your hand on him and his family and retirement give him tons of wonderful things to do and enjoyment with his family in jesus name father for brian and david we pray for them lord to keep your hand on them and their families to keep them healthy healthy and safe give them wisdom and guidance keep your hand on them and our new officers to keep your hand on them as well as all of our officers here in this city we thank you for their service lord thank you for them in jesus name [37:45] Chaplain Jim Bezokes: amen amen now we're going to save this time for photographs if the the promotees and the new officers would like to step forward and to get a picture with the city council and then there are refreshments and cake upstairs in the community room right above us as soon as we're done with that we welcome everybody to come up and enjoy that with us thank you so much [38:34] (Ceremony Pause): [Music] [38:57] (Ceremony Pause): is [39:06] (Ceremony Pause): oh [39:16] (Ceremony Pause): [Music] all right everybody ready to look here right three two one [39:33] (Ceremony Pause): wow [40:23] (Ceremony Pause): she's [40:31] (Ceremony Pause): [Music] [40:50] (Ceremony Pause): okay [41:08] (Ceremony Pause): oh [41:30] (Ceremony Pause): ah [41:52] Mayor Mary Fasbender: okay always very exciting evening in in our community tonight we will have cindy tappan chair of the heritage preservation commission to recognize the century home contest winner and justin fortney is with us to introduce her welcome [42:20] Justin Fortney: oh here we go all right thank you very much um since the hpc had just presented their yearly preservation awards in november this year for preservation month uh may for this year they decided to do something a little different um so i'd like to introduce cindy thompson chair of the hpc to make a presentation good evening this would be kind of fun there was no shortage of style and choice in the 1920s americans were experiencing an unprecedented availability of new products in fashion i bet you're thinking of flapper dresses like the ones that were out there and bob haircuts but there were a lot of other changes in the 20s including mass produced products and cars there was an enormous surge in architectural styles and plan availability for houses in fact [43:06] Cindy Toppin: in the 1920s there were 1700 housing trade catalog issues produced the hpc wanted to promote awareness and appreciation of hastings architectural heritage and to recognize homes that contribute to this historical integrity of the city in 2019 we established a century home program well you want to be vanna white and hold it up to acknowledge the residential structures of significant historical interest within the community the program is voluntary and at the request of the homeowner the homeowner would only be required to pay the actual cost of the plaque which is currently a hundred dollars this year for preservation month the hpc had a little fun with the help of dawn skelly and had a facebook contest allowing the [43:53] Cindy Toppin: community to choose their favorite home that is turning 100 this year the winner was the home of mitch johnson and pam ponzer who are with us tonight at 613 6th street west and although they won the free century home plaque the runners-up can purchase a plaque for half the price just for participating in the facebook contest and looking through the book of a thousand homes one of the publications that justin found from the 20s there are two designs that are very similar to mitch and pam's house they have done a fantastic job of maintaining the home over the years in 2003 they built a garage that complements the architecture of the home and in 2004 they were presented a [44:40] Cindy Toppin: preservation award by the hpc and the city council for all their efforts in maintaining this fantastic property so congratulations to pam and mitch [Applause] thank you congratulations thank you thank you and congratulations council members are there any corrections on the minutes for the regular meeting of may 17th 17 may 2nd i'm sorry okay comments from the audience at this time [45:25] Mayor Mary Fasbender: we have options for comments from the audience to be mailed in prior to the meeting as well as interactive feature during the meeting for the mailed comments they have been forwarded to the city council and their receipt is acknowledged please recognize that items not on the agenda will not be discussed this evening for live comments they may either be through zoom link or in person we ask that attendees raise their hand in person or use the raised hand feature in the zoom and they will be invited to speak one at a time i also would like to remind everyone that public comment period is not intended for extended dialogue is there anyone who would like to wish to speak to the council at this time [46:11] Mayor Mary Fasbender: and anyone on zoom and no one on zoom okay council items to be considered council are there any items to be considered all right consent agenda council i would accept a motion to the consent agenda council member fox and council member lund any discussion all those in favor of the motion state by saying i i opposed to that motion state by saying nay and that motion prevails tonight we have in tech plastics at a thousand spiral boulevard and for this item we will have an introduction by our economic development director coordinator eric moss [46:56] Eric Moss: followed by a public hearing and a potential action for city council welcome eric thank you mayor if you'll give me this moment to bring up the presentation [47:16] Eric Moss: okay [47:24] Eric Moss: there we go again thank you mayor and council before the council this evening is a proposed expansion of local business in tech plastics a little bit background on that business it was founded right here in hastings in 1961 currently have 210 employees and a little over 125 000 square foot facility and it is a majority women-owned company they are considering an expansion to that facility that was identified by staff during a business retention and expansion visit which was conducted in june of 2021 again what they're looking at is roughly a sixty thousand square foot expansion to the facility that would allow for additional three extruders they produce various plastic materials for specifically window companies especially anderson windows but also allow for [48:10] Eric Moss: additional room for maintenance break room and warehouse capacity which they currently rent at a facility here in hastings to help facilitate the expansion hedra does own a property adjacent to their existing facility some or or all of that property may be utilized to help facilitate that expansion they're looking at an 8.2 million dollar investment in total on total capital expenditures 6.6 and building expansion and 1.6 in machinery and equipment 46 new full-time jobs with average annual salary of 67 000 or just shy of 68 thousand dollars an hour so quality paying jobs the reason we're all here tonight is we are competing with a city in the state of ohio for this expansion as a result of that competition staff [48:57] Eric Moss: has engaged with the state of minnesota department of employment and economic development deed to get a sense for what programs might be available for this expansion project to help ensure that we secure this expansion here in the city of hastings and for the state of minnesota two programs in particular miff and jcf minnesota investment fund and the job creation fund we're going to start here first with the minnesota investment fund and this is the portion that includes the public hearing this evening minnesota investment fund is a load and no interest program that's used to finance machinery and equipment it's typically up to a seven year term between zero and three percent interest two options uh they could we submitted the rough outline in terms of the capital expenditures to the state [49:42] Eric Moss: for initial review based on the information within that expansion plan provided by intec the state gave basically a preliminary award notice and what could be available up to 375 000 in completely forgivable funds or up to 975 000 entirely repayable in-text preferences to pursue the entirely repayable portion so what i'm asking this evening is to hold a public hearing that has been noticed in the paper for this evening we had many in the audience earlier i'm not sure they stuck around for this but i would ask that you hold that public hearing and then we have a motion for resolution to support that application and certainly i can stand for questions okay thank you eric at this time i will open the public hearing is there anyone who wishes to [50:28] Mayor Mary Fasbender: speak to the intec plastics project anyone in the audience anyone on zoom no one on zoom at this time i will close the public hearing and open the discussion for council council council member folch i'll make a motion of support for the resolution [51:02] Councilmember DawnMarie Vihrachoff: okay we have two resolutions you'll do the first is that what you're stating with the first resolution sure yes for the second council member leifelt annie discussion council all those in favor of the first motion state by saying i i opposed to that motion state by saying nay and that first resolution prevails second resolution council member fox council member brox if i could i just done discussion on this one just so i can go over some of the outline of what's in that second resolution so the second one is for the job creation fund through deed so this is a pay for performance unlike the minnesota investment fund that is loan money up front this is money that is paid on performance so once they actually create [51:47] Eric Moss: the jobs the state then provides it and form a basic rebate based on the level of pay for those jobs that have been created um up to 725 thousand dollars with with the jcf award potential so and are you still okay with that motion councilmember fox and council member brox okay any discussion any further discussion counsel all those in favor of the motion state by saying aye aye aye opposed to that motion state by saying nay and that motion prevails too thank you eric [52:27] John Hinzman: community development we have appeal of administration decided decision the hudela property at one five two one three ravenna trail welcome john and it will this will be followed by an appeal by mr houdella in potential action by city council please note that the reversal of the decision by an administrative official requires six of seven votes welcome john thank you mayor city council members before us tonight is an unusual role that the council does take and that is that of the role of the board of adjustment and appeals within our city code it stipulates the criteria in which a individual can appeal to the city council acting as the board of [53:13] John Hinzman: adjustments and appeals over a decision that is made by staff so i will get into some of the details of the issues tonight mr hudel is here as well to present information on his behalf so what we're looking at here is mr hedela's property at 152 13 ravana trail so you can see it on here glendale road rivanna trail mouse isn't working there it is and the property that he owns here and there's a swimming pool in his property that was constructed and there's rules pertaining to how the fence is constructed around the swimming pool in the packet we note one provision and that is city code section 15505 subdivision f4 let's go to this that's easier this is part of the zoning [53:58] John Hinzman: ordinance it states that fences installed around swimming pools from the ground up must be a minimum of four feet high which this is and be non-climbable and that's really the issue that we're looking at today essentially whether this is non-climbable or not we also have similar provisions under city code chapter 1509 this is construction regulations saying something very similar the offense shall be of a type not readily climbed by children so these are the regulations that we as the administrative official in particular our building official travis dunn has made the interpretation that the fence installed by mr hydella is climbable and therefore in violation of the ordinance regulations here what we're looking at is a fence that [54:44] John Hinzman: looks something like this this is mr hadel's pool we're looking specifically at the fence gate here it's a cable wire design in which the cables are strung across here in our interpretation we believe that this is a climbable fence within your packet there's some information related to the ins and outs of your role as the board of adjustment and appeals the important aspect today as the mayor had pointed out is that in order for an appeal to be successful it requires six of seven council members tonight to vote affirmative to to overturn staff's uh assertion on that the fence being climbable a little background information within your packet itself we had an original permit that came forward back in february of 21 [55:32] John Hinzman: by performance pool and spas it was a permit for the pool which also included the fence on it so this is what looked like in the original fence the pool fence document showing the house showing the pool and then stipulating some of the construction of the fence itself being a four foot tall decorative aluminum fence so that came forward in february was approved in february construction began in july of 21 we received an email from mr hidella stating that he would install the fence instead of the pool contractor so essentially the pool contractor i believe went through the work to install the pool and mr haldella would take over the installation of the fence we had inspection of that fence back in [56:18] John Hinzman: october by our building inspector craig schultz who determined that it didn't meet our code because we termed it to be climbable that was confirmed as well by our building official travis dunn and had some other communications back and forth with mr hadella and leads us to the point we're at today and that is a determination of whether this is climbable or not within your packet mr adela had provided some information that he can provide a little more detail what he had stated was there's three residents in town that were not required to have a fence of this type because of a lockable heavy duty auto cover there's a auto cover that goes over this pool and there's some letters from commercial contracting companies explaining that [57:03] John Hinzman: cable rail systems are widely accepted and considered no more climbable than a chain link fence and then there was some email traffic in which there was some discussion as to whether a separate fence permit should be submitted back in july we made the assertion at that point that we would just cover it under the original permit at that time so from our opinion here as staff we believe that this is a climbable fence and so that's the assertion that we're bringing forward uh essentially tonight your role as the board of adjustments and appeal is to make a determination as to whether you believe that this fence is is climbable if you believe it is it would be uh it would be in defense of what staff is asserting on this one if you believe [57:49] Councilmember Tim Lawrence: that this is non-climabble as mr hadella would believes then you would be looking to overturn staffs and so mr shane adele is here present if you'd like to have him address the council i can stand for any questions thanks john councilmember vaughn thank you this question is for staff before we get to the applicant um i take a step back here on this process that we're going through here tonight we have something that's brought in front of us that we got to make a decision on on my opinion that it's an ordinance is subjective so now we're going to be a subjective answer but i'm curious about how many pools in this community and other communities went through the same thing [58:35] Councilmember Tim Lawrence: that never got a chance for a hearing so if we make a decision nowhere which way it goes when does an ordinance ever get reviewed because in my opinion this ordinance is subjective because the word non-climbable is poorly written because it puts a lot of pressure on staff and then it puts pressure on the community puts pressure on us to say all right who's going to be the decision maker but we also got our packets on thursday and we got to make a decision by monday i go to the process that i don't think this process is very well done that there should be almost a hearing and then we come back in two weeks after we do our due diligence and figure out what the right answer is if we're going to be put in these situations i personally like to be put in a situation on a thing that came on thursday [59:21] Councilmember Tim Lawrence: about something that's subjective and i'm curious about as a community representing us are we at liability i read the packet and the packet said you know soon later the homeowner has to take some liability too and it sounds like they did their insurance is saying yes but with that it's their property so i i question a lot of this stuff because even if i back up all the way to the applicant john has had it up there if you could put on the blueprint john it says four foot tall decorative there's nothing about horizontal there's nothing about vertical that's that's misleading what's decorative this is decorative to me that's put in front of us but so is the vertical i i think our ordinance is poorly [1:00:09] John Hinzman: written and my question for us to make a decision today is wrong we should not have to make it on an ordinance that we're just catching up to speed and now we're going to put us between staff making a decision i don't like the process i'd like to listen to my colleagues on this but i'm hung up on that we have to make a decision we have to have six of seven to overturn a staff that we're we're here to support staff too on decision making and that's not fair to staff either so i just share that that i don't like the process that they want to start with it there thank you you could come to a member fund councilmember folch i think your honor this is for staff i was just curious as to how is it that these applications for the installation [1:00:55] Councilmember DawnMarie Vihrachoff: how i see this map and it's very simple and it's just you know perimeter map for the most part and so is there a step in the process that was missed because i i feel terrible for shane to be quite honest and very sympathetic i i mean it was probably a huge investment to have that particular fence installed and you thought you were going through all the proper uh channels um and so i'm very sympathetic to that i can't imagine if i was facing the same financial implications of having to remove that entire offense and have a new one put in place and so um i'm i'm curious as to how it is that it was missed you know we're in the process is there opportunity for improvement [1:01:42] Councilmember DawnMarie Vihrachoff: because um and if you could please just if you could please just answer that first because you know if there was something that we should be doing better right you know so that um you know as a for instance if they have to give more detail as what is the proposed fence i think that would be very helpful and so is that question asked in the in the application process when these plans are submitted sure council member yeah i mean there's a situation here it would have been much better if we had further clarity on this that if we provided more clarity as to what we thought we were reviewing as the fence on this uh that certainly would be helpful we don't like to be in a [1:02:28] John Hinzman: situation in which someone does an improvement and then we review it and find out that it wasn't as we expected it and so be able to have clear understanding between our rules and what is being proposed by the applicant certainly could have been better here i mean we point out within our ordinance and within our handouts that it needs to be non-climbable but if we would have seen the wire fence the cables defense to begin with it would have been much more cleared and we could have avoided this i believe okay so the city doesn't ask for any more of the specifics as to what kind of fence it is that was being installed but rather just a parameter depiction as to where it where it was being installed we typically do [1:03:14] John Hinzman: in this in this case we did not in this case it was not so he didn't get the opportunity to submit because it wasn't asked okay right the extent of what we had on here was a four foot tall decorative aluminum fence which we assumed would be uh meeting our requirements on there now if uh i don't know if the cable stave fence is what was uh proposed and what was thought of at the time this permit was was done i don't wouldn't think that of that necessarily as aluminum but as something different but again it's more of an in more of being having a better clarity as to what is being proposed that would have been more helpful here on both sides okay and then when they put in the application it what was provided as [1:04:02] Councilmember DawnMarie Vihrachoff: you know what's the exchange of it of instructions because you know i myself i i'm gonna be honest i don't know what all the codes are and so how is it that when a when a submission is being provided like what kind of exchange of information is there that happens with applicants sure typically we have a site plan drawing which is shown here we'd have some detail that would show what the fence would look like which was not part of this typically what we would have too is have a separate fence permit from the pool permit itself this one we combined it into one it would be best to have those not combined as one sometimes we we do have that as a single permit sometimes we don't but i think it's more clear when [1:04:48] John Hinzman: you're looking at these two separate items and that you have the full information on it sure so is there anywhere that they have to sign off something that says i promise not to install a um offense that meets the requirements that are within the code that it's non-climbable is there like a waiver form or something to that effect so that there's a disclosure that hey it has to be like this at a minimum sure councilmember nothing specific to the claimable provision but i believe on the building permit itself there's a there's a sign-up provision that states that i understand and will follow the ordinances of the city of hastings now again we're looking at a provision here that might not be as clear as some on that one but we do have that on there okay and then it's up to the applicant [1:05:34] Councilmember DawnMarie Vihrachoff: to actually look up to find what the city code is that pertains to the application that they're putting in well we have a handout that goes along with the fence permit and pool permit and it goes through a paragraph of these provisions and one of those being that it'd be non-climbable so no we don't expect that an applicant to look up section 155 whatever on that one but on the handout there it goes to the steps of what you need to do and it does have that language in there that's that has the non-claimable pointed out so it is pointed out and they do have to sign off on it at some point that they're going okay so that they're agreeing to the city code when they're putting in their application okay all right thank you don't remember life felt thank you okay john so [1:06:21] Councilmember Lisa Leifeld: trying to get an idea so the fences the gate is about from ground to top four feet how far apart are the cables well let's go back to the gapping yeah the gap between these you it's kind of hard to see with the with the gate picture here i'm taking a real wide judgment here between these posts here that this is something that might be about six feet or so okay and i mean um horizontally between the oh horizontally yes between these two i think i believe they're three and a half inches three and a half inches yep so there's really no play there to go through depends uh if if they're well tensioned no if the tension is easing in this for [1:07:08] Councilmember Lisa Leifeld: whatever reason it could be but that's what would happen with these over time potentially thank you john so my question then comes in with the fencing that we show in the in the packet the chain link fence chain link's okay chain lick has been deemed to be non-claimable correct so within the packet itself i when we were looking at potential solutions for mr hidallah this was one solution that was proposed so that he could utilize the fed's post that are there and instead of having the wires apply a chain link mesh fence on there so thinking back to what council member vaughan had said when we're looking at what's in front of us and given the time frame of this [1:07:54] Councilmember Lisa Leifeld: i'm a 54 year old out of shape woman and i can guarantee you i can get over that chain-link fence if i have to i know i can as a child i could get over it in like less than two seconds if i was being chased um i'm concerned about this i i this is sharp looking i mean i'm i'm a few years out from needing a fence so i've been looking at lots of different ideas and this is really really sharp i don't want anyone seeing in my backyard however so based on where i live i don't want people seeing in my backyard no one needs to see me at the pool um but i i have a problem voting one way or another on this at this time i'm concerned the way the [1:08:39] Councilmember Lisa Leifeld: ordinance is written and the gaps because to me that is very subjective that word climable to me is this to me i'm envisioning myself trying to climb over this it's funny but i'm feeling that flexib you know that give in the cable so that's going to i feel like it's going to cause some footing issues as opposed to the chain-link fence which i'm just gonna pop my toes in and climb that this to me looks like a jacob's ladder you know it's been years since i've done that but you know that flexibility of that when you're trying to climb the that jacob's ladder but i i don't feel comfortable voting on on this variance [1:09:25] Councilmember Mya Beck: just based on the fact of the way it's written the way the ordinance is written i feel like there's far too many holes and it's far too subjective thank you your honor thank you council member lifeville councilmember brox so i think the legal language is problematic but i don't think that that's exclusive to the city of hastings because i went and found the city of rosemont city of burnsville city of egan and all the ordinances they have have similar language so we're not unique in that aspect so this has to have been settled before so then my next question was because i'm a dork and i like to look at legal language was well where did that language come from so i went to the state ordinance the state law and the state law actually says [1:10:13] Councilmember Mya Beck: has similar language in it that says that the fence uh fencing needs to in provision um four seven one seven dot one five five zero um there's two there's several parts but under the fencing part which is subpart to the the letter e it says the fence may not be a readily climbable design so we don't have the word readily in our ordinance we have the word climbable but certainly our language for our ordinance must have been derived from the state language which is equally vague so then my next question would be would probably be for council which is maybe not a fair question because i didn't ask you in advance but is there a case law or another point of reference that that [1:10:58] Korine Land (City Attorney): language is coming from that we could reference as to what climable is actually supposed to mean uh your honor members of the council i appreciate that you preface it with i didn't ask this in advance because obviously i can't do case law at the table but that's a great question and i just want to point something out for the council we are here because of what i i believe is a technicality in our code the code allows appeals to the committee of adjustments for zoning decisions that's in state law the committee of adjustments is intended to interpret zoning decisions when there's a question that's the job you act as the committee of adjustments the only reason we're here is because this provision for the climbable fence [1:11:45] Korine Land: is in two parts of our code it's in building code in the building section which is totally totally the jurisdiction of the building official if he if that's the only place climbable appeared for a swim for a fence around a swimming pool this would not be in front of you this would be a decision of the zoning administrator of the building official and appeals from the building official who is a state appointed building official then goes to i believe it is the department of labor and industry for an interpretation so the building official has authority over building code the reason we're here is because that also those words appear in your zoning section [1:12:32] Korine Land: i believe it's a mistake to be in the zoning section because this is a building code issue so it's something that's correctable but this is you're right this is absolutely not a fair appeal to you this is an appeal that should go to those that understand construction and building codes i don't know how we fix that tonight other than maybe we ask for an interpretation from the department of labor and industry i think that might be the solution here to get what does the definition of climable mean what have you used have these cable types of fences be deemed to be climbable by your office they're the ultimate building code officials so i believe that's a better [1:13:17] Councilmember Mya Beck: interpretation for them and if the council wanted to postpone any decision tonight i think that might be might provide some clarity okay thank you counselor council member brox i think that makes a lot of sense only because i think my what i'm hearing from my colleagues and what i feel uncomfortable about is making a determination about a building code interpretation that i am not in the industry nor do i understand everything that's involved in the industry nor do i understand building fences materials required i mean i have a very basic knowledge i think we've created you know an obstacle for a mem for a resident so that concerns me because it doesn't seem that the communication was clear on the front end to the extent that it needed to be for that person to [1:14:03] Councilmember Mya Beck: make it an informed decision about what kind of fence they built but also i want us to follow our ordinances so and i want to back up our city officials who are making these kind of determinations on a daily basis and i don't want to make constant exceptions because then we're creating problems in the future i think someone referenced precedent you know once we established that there's an exception are we going to get more requests for these same kind of exceptions i think those are all things that we need to take into account and have been really solid points so personally i like the idea of getting an opinion from the department of labor and industry who are professionals who do know what climbable means can then define it for us and maybe give us categories of what a climbable fence looks like so that i can make a more [1:14:49] Councilmember Angie Haus: data-based informed decision thank you councilmember fox your honor um this is a really unique position for us as a body to be in being a board of adjustments and appeals none of us are in the field so as has been said however i would like to point out that our staff is in the field and they do work in this every day um and they we are trusting them to read our ordinances and and city codes and do our do their jobs help us do our jobs by those codes so i think ultimately in discussing this earlier today it it came to light that [1:15:35] Councilmember Angie Haus: we are supposed to see if this ordinance was read wrong by our staff and i'd i'd just like to point that out as we continue talking about it i would also support if we would like clarification i think that's smart and then we can have a little bit more discussion as well but i i am i lean towards supporting staff in their decisions thank you councilmember fox councilmember vaughn agree but i also say we have an ordinance and there's maybe many ordinances that are probably poorly written and i mentioned this with the police about consistency they follow laws they they're consistent in how they do it i want to be able to set our our staff up so they can make a consistent decision not subjective because it's not [1:16:22] Councilmember Tim Lawrence: fair for them or it's not fair for the applicant that's my question probably to our attorney then saying that's why i asked about the process how do we pause something that says here's a hearing coming and then we can make some decisions saying this should not be in front of the appeals this this has got some poorly written stuff let's help the staff out it just maybe it's in a committee structure that it sends it to bores it up to staff just to say keep keep grinding it there's a that ordinance book is big how do we get through them all and how do we are we just going to react to ones that somebody doesn't agree with that's poor practice that's what i talked about with the process i don't want to be reacting to a bunch of different subjective ordinances how do we fix them i don't know the answer but um going back to this applicant one and i [1:17:08] Councilmember Tim Lawrence: think that's why i asked about this we're focused on word climbable but there's also investments out there and there was precedence from what we're hearing that we the last building official had made some decisions yeah they're probably not to the book but there was also if you see in the picture that was prevented a cover that was put on that is allowed by some cities so now we have inconsistent between cities that's bit policy if you ask me we need to help our staff by writing it the correct way what is acceptable so it's pretty cut and dry when they go into the application process so i don't want to fix that but uh i'm going to support that this gets tabled until we at least get the one review of it but i don't know if that should be the final review thank you thank you councilmember vaughn [1:17:54] Councilmember Mya Beck: yeah and not that you're not including the residents in your comments but we're talking a lot about how do we make this easy for staff to make decisions on and read um they are the experts and it's kind of a little bit here and there so you know put it on somebody that's not doing that day to day to interpret um some of that which it's there's not a lot of not a lot of words in that you know it's a couple sentences right um and sure we have a lot of ordinances and and your your point is well taken how do you how do you eat that elephant right but um [1:18:41] Councilmember Mya Beck: i think it we also have to take into consideration the the residents and and you know no one is necessarily trying to skirt the the rules or get around something necessarily but they put in an application spent a lot of money thought they were fine and then they're surprised and we shouldn't be doing that either right so thank you councilmember line council member life out thank you in luck gotta love the web right in just searching fences pool fences had the fence been vertically it's not climbable um but in addition to that very few chain-link fences are listed [1:19:27] Councilmember Lisa Leifeld: here the chain is a much tighter chain not a right not a toe in a chain because like that okay that that is and that's where my concern comes in if we're going to deem that as not climbable that's where my issues at you know but it's that cover that that cover is i know it's got amazing weight restrictions and anyone who owns one that is it's key to everything that's happening in that backyard the fence is just a a deterrent right the fence is a deterrent and for a lot of pool owners the fence is a [1:20:15] Councilmember Lisa Leifeld: we talk about it in crosswalks it's that false sense of security whereas that pool cover on the other hand is the safety feature of this backyard so i'm going to support you know everyone's recommendation to get further consideration here and as much as i want to support uh city staff because they are our experts as councilmember fox had said i'm i'm having a hard time putting my hat on that's okay when you're pointing to this isn't but that is i don't i can't support that so thank your honor thank you councilmember lifefelt uh councilmember folch i think [1:21:00] Councilmember DawnMarie Vihrachoff: your honor i agree with you council member leifeld i have many times jumped fences just like that myself and so uh i've been there done that yeah i was a little tomboy back in the day but um you know i i feel that honestly i feel that something was also missed though in the permit process where if it sounds to me like that there should have been two permits and for some reason it was determined that one was allowable and then this review of what the fencing material was was missed for review and so i mean i i don't believe that anyone did anything that they thought was inappropriate i'm sure the contractor wasn't trying to get around something um and so [1:21:48] Councilmember DawnMarie Vihrachoff: i've just to ask you know if i you know this gets complicated because we're asked to make a determination on a very specific issue and and it's my understanding and ms land can correct me if i'm wrong but we're being asked to determine specifically if this was climbable or not climbable and that's what the specific question is correct but i i also feel that there is some obligation on the part of city staff for in the process of trying to make a review process more efficient that it wasn't as thorough of a review as it should have been so that this would have [1:22:35] Councilmember DawnMarie Vihrachoff: been caught before it was signed off on because if staff signed off on decorative aluminum fencing um i mean that's what they installed isn't it if it's if it's aluminum cable or no it's not so it's not meaning that so that's just what i'm asking is if if and so last in in the in the write-up it had said that there was there has been some inconsistent application of this fencing just for clarification on that from staff if there truly has been um in the past under the previous building inspector if that's true and if they're [1:23:21] Councilmember DawnMarie Vihrachoff: you know if if that has been done i would like to hear that from staff specifically um verifying whether or not that's been allowed in the past for just for the pool cover to be allowed and um and in those cases if they did so occur if if the applicant had to sign off on something you know like they're assuming the risk and the liability of not um you know of adhering to the city's code and so i'm just trying to find if there's any possible way that we can find a compromise in this situation and that's only if it's true that this hasn't been applied consistency consistently in the past [1:24:10] Mayor Mary Fasbender: thank you council member folks you know john i think there's a missing puzzle because the first applicant the builder stated that it was aluminum fence which there's no see-through it's uh it's aluminum correct non-climbable then mr hydella states that he's going to do the he's going to put up the fence that's where i think the missing puzzle is because he didn't have a description of the fence he was going to put up am i correct i believe more description be helpful absolutely okay so i think i think it's both parties that might have needed a little more interaction um yeah i you know he it's beautiful my fear is [1:24:56] Shane Hudella: one second i'll let you talk sheen my fear is children of course um can climb over anything this looks very climable to me and that's why we're here is the discussion of is it climable personally i think yes can we resolve it it's a hard question for us i've stated to you and dan and others that you know you could keep it and maybe can you put plexiglass on one side of it so you can't make it climbable so you can still see the beauty of it and still make it safe so if shane if you wanted to come speak [1:25:42] Shane Hudella: a little bit you could he raised to stand to see sure um if you would go to the podium please and state your name and your address even though we know who you are all right no problem my name is shane hudella my address is 15213 ravenna trail and hastings mayor council members thanks so much for giving me an opportunity i've been chomping at the bit over there this is a tough one right i'm a play by the rules kind of guy and would certainly abide by council's decision tonight on this i'm also a former licensed contractor i was a contractor for six years held the license passed the test [1:26:28] Shane Hudella: there was a disconnect i like travis i work with him and john frequently on some other developments and stuff we're doing on there i offered to submit plans on this fence when i notified travis that i was going to do the fence instead of the pool company he tried to do me a solid on it so i feel bad being here tonight he said hey no sweat just ensure that it's four feet tall with self-closing self-latching gates so the cable rail i i went ahead just based on my experience in the construction industry consulted with a couple of the licensed construction folks that you have letters in the packets that i sent [1:27:14] Shane Hudella: yep hey the aluminum cable rail that you installed widely used in the industry and they i think council member life i'll hit the nail on the head if you've ever tried to walk on rope or cable it's incredibly difficult if this would have if i would have been joe holman a homeowner that just installed horizontal [Music] wood across there like a farm post almost it would be 100 climbable so the the whole controversy comes into what's our personal interpretations of climable or not and i think travis got this one wrong i've got some industry folks too that [1:28:01] Shane Hudella: say hey yup this this is good the fence has passed my wife's state licensed uh day care inspection as well as our insurance inspection and i'm not going to go on and on i know the late night's getting late i would ask i want to get the fence issue behind me and i would love to have council take a vote tonight on it even if it's not in my favor i know i think john mentioned he's only seen six or seven of these instances where homeowners have come to council on an appeal like this so i think you have time before the next shane hudella shows up to dispute a building official so i think there's time to do policy there but [1:28:46] Councilmember Angie Haus: thanks for the time to speak any questions for me before i go sit back down council dan for clarification when you submitted that you were going to be taking over that application what did you say you were going to build so i emailed travis um in the dialogue was travis hey i'm going to do the fence instead of the pool company the pool company wanted 8 500 to put a chain-link fence up like that one and it's about a thousand dollars worth of materials from menards for that so i emailed travis hey i'm gonna do my own fence would you like me to submit a separate permit and plans for it travis responded with no not necessary you can keep it under [1:29:33] Councilmember Angie Haus: the pool permit that's already been drawn just to ensure that it's four feet high with self-latching self-closing gates did your email correspondence with our building official indicate that it was consistent with the original application that was a decorative aluminum uh no sir i would argue though that the cable is aluminum but i did not specifically point out that it was going to be different from the original permit that performance pool and spa had however i did offer to submit plans on the design [1:30:19] Councilmember Angie Haus: which in my opinion would have prompted well maybe it's something different than what performance pool had originally permitted [1:30:32] Dan Wietecha (City Administrator): dan for clarification the email dated july 27th of 21 when you were indicating that you were taking it over and you emailed uh quote uh fence install four foot high decorative fence with two self-closing self-latching gates covered under the as covered under the uh pps performance plus pools or something or do you need to stop and draw so your question actually looking at the email indicates it was as as applied by your former contractor and indicated that it was a decorative [1:31:18] Shane Hudella: offense i'm not sure i understand your questions i i i believe that this fence changed from what the original application was and saying that our building official dropped the ball is incorrect i i don't believe it was intentional no i believe that what you presented to the building official and what you're saying here today are inconsistent i i think there's some blame on both sides and i don't think it's intentional for either one i i think that i stand by hey i offered to submit new plans for it travis said hey don't worry about it keep it under the permit you know it i probably own a little responsibility in saying hey well it's [1:32:06] Shane Hudella: it's different than what performance pool and spa had i i i at this point i don't know that i had even seen the plans the performance pool and spa had submitted to the city i would have to go back and look at that but it you know i don't think there was any ill will on either side sir i think it comes down to the discretion of what's climable and what's not and like i indicated i get along well with the city we've got lots of other projects to do um i just didn't agree with travis on this one and and thought well i'll come see the council and and get another opinion on it [1:32:53] Dan Wietecha: dan back to the earlier discussion i'm sorry council on um interest at what the industry definition is of climable there was discussion earlier about sending it to department of labor and industry i'm pretty confident that there is precedence existing or definitions as pointed out earlier chain link hey if it's a standard two and a half inch gap you betcha that's climbable under the industry if it's one and three quarters or less it's considered non-climbable i think there really is a specific definition you can get on the cable stays but the the answer to that isn't [1:33:38] Dan Wietecha: here at the dais it's it's up in saint paul and really advise go back to that earlier discussion about asking them asking department of labor and industry thank you thank you dan councilmember fox your honor i would move to table this discussion and send a question to the department of labor and industry to clarify what climable or non-climable fencing is and the second by councilmember brock's additional discussion non-debatable tabling is not debatable okay tables can be discussion there can be discussion councilmember vaughn you can discuss it's just not debatable [1:34:25] Korine Land: yes i just wanted to confirm i mean we're gonna pretty bag we're gonna send something up there to ask is this is do we send the whole packet i don't know how i've never had to do this you're under members of the council i have asked dolly for interpretation questions before so we will provide very specific facts that they can apply the the definition to and give us an interpretation so we're not just basing it on is our ordinance vague is in this situation is this climable we'll send a specific question okay thank you okay another discussion all those in favor of the motion state by saying i i opposed to that motion state by saying [1:35:10] Mayor Mary Fasbender: nay and that motion prevails thank you thank you john thank you shane [1:35:23] Mayor Mary Fasbender: okay council members do we have any announcements okay i do have a couple this week is national ems week national police week and national public works week please join me in great and heartfelt thank you to the employees in these departments for their service to our community tomorrow may 17th we have public safety night downtown in honor of our police ems and fire teams all are invited for the free event the minnesota department of transportation and collaboration with the city is being as is bringing a study be beginning a study to highway 61 to evaluate transportation improvements an informational public meeting is on [1:36:10] Mayor Mary Fasbender: wednesday may 18th from 5 to 7 at city hall presentations are 5 15 and 6 15. city offices will be closed monday may 30th in observance of memorial day the hastings police department in collaboration with minnesota commerce fraud bureau announces the launch of a catalytic converter marking program in the community marking kits are in partnership with local dealerships valley chevrolet hastings chrysler and valley buick and gmc please see the city website for a list of eligible vehicles makes and models on tuesday june 7th join us for summer kickoff to our 2022 [1:36:56] Mayor Mary Fasbender: levee park events live music bollywood dancers inflatables face paintings caricature artists balloon artists and more all ages are welcome to this free event tuesday may 17th heritage preservation commission has a meeting at 7 p.m wednesday may 18th planning committee has a meeting at 7 a.m thursday may 19th public safety advisory commission has a meeting at 6 30 pm monday may 23rd planning commission has a 7 p.m meeting wednesday may 25th arts task force has a meeting at 6 00 p.m and monday june 6th city council regular meeting at 7 p.m [1:37:44] Mayor Mary Fasbender: at this point i would accept a motion to adjourn although council member brock's and council member vaughn no discussion all those in favor state by saying i i post to that motion state by saying nay and the motion prevails we are adjourned