Since there were no timestamps in your original text, I have used sequential placeholders. I have also corrected phonetic spelling errors from the original transcript (e.g., "Mayor Kefir" to "Mayor Giefer," "Council Member Corona" to "Cremona," etc.) to ensure the record is accurate. *** **[00:00] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** All right. Um, let's do the pledge of allegiance. **[00:05] All:** I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. **[00:15] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Approval of regular agenda. Can I get a motion to approve? **[00:20] Council Member John Rog:** Move to approve. **[00:22] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** I’ll say Council Member Cornett? **[00:24] Council Member Ben Cornett:** Hi. **[00:25] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Council Member Rog? **[00:26] Council Member John Rog:** Hi. **[00:27] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Council Member Cremona? **[00:28] Council Member Lindsay Cremona:** Hi. **[00:29] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Council Member Anderson? **[00:30] Council Member Greg Anderson:** Hi. **[00:31] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Mayor Giefer? I. Approval of consent agenda. Can I get a motion to approve that? **[00:35] Council Member Ben Cornett:** Motion to approve the consent agenda. **[00:37] Council Member Greg Anderson:** I’ll second. **[00:39] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Council Member Cornett? **[00:40] Council Member Ben Cornett:** Hi. **[00:41] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Council Member Rog? **[00:42] Council Member John Rog:** Hi. **[00:43] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Council Member Cremona? **[00:44] Council Member Lindsay Cremona:** Hi. **[00:45] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Council Member Anderson? **[00:46] Council Member Greg Anderson:** Hi. **[00:47] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Mayor Giefer? I. Staff agenda items. We have one item with Brad, the City Engineer—consideration of resolution to accept a feasibility report in order public hearing. Uh, Brad, would you like to talk us through that? **[01:00] Brad Reifsteck (City Engineer):** Yes. Good evening, Mayor, members of the council. Um, tonight, as you said, I'm here seeking a motion to adopt resolution 2025-14, authorizing the following actions. First one would be to accept the feasibility report for the 2026 street improvement project. Uh, the second one would be to authorize the preparation of plans and specifications. And then the third one would be to set the uh, public hearing um, for street improvements on 66th Street North and Great Oak Trail North. Um, just to give you a little bit of background on these streets, uh, both 66th Street North and Great Oak Trail North would be included with the 2026 street improvement project. Both of these streets are of similar length and width. Each of them have a dead-end cul-de-sac um, at the end of the street segment. Uh, they're roughly um, uh, 23 feet wide. Um, the forensic information that we received regarding the pavement thickness and underlying class 5 aggregate shows that there is sufficient um, bituminous material and underlying aggregate to support a 9-ton design roadway. Um, typically on our designs we include a 3-inch bituminous mat over the top of the existing reclaimed material. So, um, the only—I guess I should mention—the only significant difference between the two street segments is that Great Oak Trail North has a bituminous curb um, that is uh, on either side of the roadway to convey storm water down to uh, a pair of catch basins at a low point about 200 feet uh, south of the dead-end cul-de-sac. Um, so just to give you some particulars on the cost of the improvements, um, the total cost of the improvement is $370,187. Uh, if we break that down further uh, into each street segment, uh, the estimated project cost for 66th Street is $170,791 and Great Oaks Trail is $199,396. Uh, as in prior projects, we do have city maintenance dollars that was allocated to these two street programs—or two street uh, segments. Uh, 66th Street uh, city contribution is $18,304 and Great Oak Trail was $19,269 for a total of $37,573. Um, we did have two neighborhood meetings um, for each of these roadway segments. Um, and most were well attended. Uh, and we did not have any residents uh, that were not in favor of the road improvement project after we reviewed the feasibility report that I've prepared for you tonight. Uh, so I think everybody is still uh, greatly in favor of of moving forward with this road reconstruction project. Um, I should mention that the assessment roll—or the mock assessment roll—is also included with the feasibility report. Um, for the 66th Street segment, there are 10 buildable units along that roadway. And then for Great Oaks Trail, there were only seven uh, buildable units. Um, so the difference, or the assessment rate for the 66th Street segment is roughly $15,249 and the estimate for the Great Oaks Trail is $25,732. And basically this difference is uh, the density difference between the two streets and the number of buildable units. So, um, with that said, staff is recommending that the City Council accept the feasibility report as presented, uh, direct staff to prepare plans and specifications, and then, uh, set the public hearing for consideration of the 2026 street improvement project at the regular council meeting scheduled for uh, Monday, November 3rd, 2025. So, with that said, I would gladly answer any questions that the Mayor or the Council would have. **[05:30] Council Member Greg Anderson:** Greg, thank you. Jeff, uh, couple questions. So, you had the preliminary assessments available for the residents at the meeting. They saw the numbers? **[05:40] Brad Reifsteck:** I did, sir. Yep. **[05:41] Council Member Greg Anderson:** Okay. And then for us that are a little newer on the council, you just want to walk through the schedule of moving forward on this? And then what would be the go/no-go, drop dead, if you will, point to this where we don't go ahead? Would that be before we accept bids? **[05:55] Brad Reifsteck:** Um, so yeah, the project schedule, uh, the next step would of course be to hold the public hearing and that would be the next opportunity for residents to decide whether or not they were in favor of the project. Um, and hopefully they would uh, either attend the hearing or send the clerk or myself an email or a formal letter letting us know that they were no longer in favor of the project. So that would be the next opportunity. And then um, the third opportunity uh, would be at the time that we receive bids for the project. If the bids were to come in uh, extremely high, um, I would think that that may trigger some folks to not—or no longer be in favor of the project. So there's a couple other opportunities here before we uh, award the project to a construction contractor. Um, we are proposing that the first public hearing be uh, in November. Um, we would come back in January with uh, asking for approval of the plans and specs and go off for bids. Uh, that generally takes about a month uh, to uh, get to the bid opening and so that puts us in the middle of February. So, we're we're scheduled or or planning to uh, bring uh, bids back to council uh, for the March 2026 meeting. **[07:15] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Does that answer your question? So, basically, Brad, um, if the bids were to come in high, um, you'd go back to the folks on that um, street and then present the the new um, information for them and they would potentially make another decision at that point. **[07:30] Brad Reifsteck:** Yeah, I I do have—I would say 95% of uh, the residents living on both street segments, I do have their email addresses. So, it would be a quick uh, email to everybody just to let them know that um, you know, here are the bids, what the bid price is, and um, to let me know or to let your council members know that they're—you know—they're no longer in favor of the project. So, um, it's fairly simple to do that. **[08:00] Council Member Ben Cornett:** Any other questions? I do have a just a small question. So you had mentioned that the road has sufficient base layers to support a nine-ton road. Um, is there other cases—I think we've built seven-ton roads before? So is it—is there any consistency um, in terms of the thickness of a road that we build in these projects? Does it vary on the conditions that are present in each road or is there um, you know... **[08:30] Brad Reifsteck:** Yeah. Yeah. So, most of the roads that we've—and I can't think of one where we didn't have a sufficient um, underlying aggregate base and a bituminous material. Typically to get to that 9-ton design, you need between 8 and 10 inches of class 5 or reclaim material and then the 3 inches of bituminous on top of that. Um, so, uh, I don't remember any, off the top of my head anyway, any previous projects where we didn't meet that. Um, if you looked at the forensic report, I want to say, um, 66th Street North uh, had roughly or averaged about 15 to 18 inches of class 5. And apparently that neighborhood was built near a gravel pit or over a gravel pit. So that kind of explains why it's so thick there. And then I think Great Oak Trails um, I want to say one of the borings showed about 7 inches of of uh, class 5 material, but everything else was was greater than 10. And once you reclaim the existing bituminous material, you know, any—well, so I think Great Oaks Trail averaged two and a half or two and a quarter inches of bituminous. So, um, all the borings that we took will have at least 8 inches of uh, material underneath the new bituminous. **[10:00] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Thank you, Brad. Well, go ahead. **[10:02] Council Member Ben Cornett:** Yeah. Um, so Brad, sorry, but you know, when you talk about the seven, eight inches of gravel underneath the base and then you have, you know, two and a half or three inches of bituminous on top of that. Now, you grind that down and then you put three inches of new over it or you you you leave that and you put three inches over that? **[10:25] Brad Reifsteck:** Yeah. So, typically we reclaim the existing bituminous street and the underlying gravel all together uh, in a homogeneous material to build that class 5 base and then we'll put a new 3-inch bituminous mat over the top uh, of that reclaimed material. Now, the way we make the driveways work is we'll push shape all the excess material on the sides towards the middle of the road so that we can get a really nice steep crown on the road. And the reason we do that is so that we can shed the water better to the ditches and and off the road uh, where the storm water belongs. So, um, it's worked really well on all of the projects that we've done so far and I have no reason to think that uh, these streets won't uh, behave the same way. **[11:15] Council Member Ben Cornett:** So, do you typically put the three inches and then there's a wear course that you put on top of it like... **[11:22] Brad Reifsteck:** That is so—the wear course, the bituminous is one thick layer. It's 3 inches thick. **[11:27] Council Member Ben Cornett:** 3 inches. Okay. And that's that's compacted to 3 inches? **[11:31] Brad Reifsteck:** Correct. Correct. **[11:32] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Thanks, Brad. Any other questions or can we get a motion? **[11:36] Brad Reifsteck:** Uh, Mayor, can I ask or add one more comment? I don't know if anybody's in the audience uh, from either street segment. At our neighborhood meetings, I had mentioned that they would be more than welcome to attend the council meeting tonight to share their opinions on whether they were in favor or not in favor of the project. I did not receive—well, I shouldn't say that—I did receive one email that said they were still in favor of the project from Arus and Bruce Cath, residents that live on Great Oak Trail. Um, but I did not receive any other comments from anybody. And I asked everybody to send me comments, but of course uh, I didn't get any other than the ones I just mentioned. So I just I just want to make sure that nobody's in the audience or... **[12:25] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** I don't see anyone. Is there anyone online that might... **[12:28] Kristina Handt (City Administrator):** There's someone still online. Uh, I don't know who it is. **[12:30] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** If the—if whoever's online is listening and they want to um, provide a comment, jump in, you know, raise your hand on the Zoom call. Otherwise, we can entertain a motion. Doesn't look like anyone's online that's going to comment. So, all right. **[12:45] Council Member Greg Anderson:** I would uh, make a motion to approve resolution 2025-14. **[12:50] Council Member Lindsay Cremona:** Second. **[12:52] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Council Member Cornett? **[12:53] Council Member Ben Cornett:** Hi. **[12:54] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Council Member Rog? **[12:55] Council Member John Rog:** Hi. **[12:56] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Council Member Cremona? **[12:57] Council Member Lindsay Cremona:** Hi. **[12:58] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Council Member Anderson? **[12:59] Council Member Greg Anderson:** Hi. **[13:00] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Mayor Giefer? I. New business—consideration of council work session November 3rd, 5:30 p.m. Um, Kim, is this regarding the topic of uh, complaint policy? Okay. **[13:15] Kristina Handt:** So yeah, just to just to clarify, there was a little bit of misunderstanding after the August um, meeting with the intent of the council. So, um, going forward, we need to make sure that we're very, um, clear with what we're, um, asking to be discussed in future um, council meetings. But that uh, is the intent of that one—to discuss any gaps and potential improvements in the um, complaint policy. And um, if the council can just really confirm right now that that was the intent in the August meeting, just to make sure we're not wasting time talking about something that’s not really an appetite by the council. **[13:55] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** No, I think as we've heard even tonight, we we probably should have a little more discussion on the process. So, we're comfortable with it, we're getting follow-up and we know what the process is and then if we're asked. And that way we make sure things are getting... **[14:10] Kristina Handt:** And I think a potential outcome um, of that um, workshop to discuss this could be, you know, a mechanism to make sure we do a little bit better job of communicating. **[14:20] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Um, Ben, are you clear on on uh, that topic? **[14:23] Council Member Ben Cornett:** Yep. I am uh, fully for making sure that we got it. **[14:25] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** John? **[14:26] Council Member John Rog:** Yeah, absolutely. **[14:27] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Okay. All right. **[14:28] Council Member Lindsay Cremona:** I also am on board with that. **[14:29] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Okay. Yeah. All right. Um, so that moves us to unfinished business. There's none listed. Uh, discussion items. Um, this is where Kim, I don't know if if it's—if there's anything you can share regarding the um, the concerns that were mentioned in public comment. I do know that there was um, some follow-up based on just a brief discussion you you and I had. Is there anything relevant to share at this time or do we need um, uh, Jack to—and maybe yourself—to put together a more formal response to the person submitting the complaint or is there anything that you can share? **[15:05] Kristina Handt:** Uh, Mayor and council members, I'll just read from the zoning administrator's report that the complaint did come in. Uh, the city received a formal complaint that the property owner was having a large gathering over the weekend where it created noise that was disturbing the neighbors. Per the zoning administrator, he inspected the property and noticed large filled trash bags on the area where the gathering took place. I sent a letter to the property owner advising them to remove the trash bags and be respectful to the neighbors. In addition to that, um, another complaint came in on that property and it has been turned over to legal. **[15:45] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Okay. So, thanks for that update. Okay. So the next—um, anything uh, for future agenda items? First of all, um, are there any other staff updates, Kim, to share? **[15:58] Kristina Handt:** I don't think so right now. **[16:00] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Okay. Uh, anything from the council on potential future agenda items? I got a couple things. **[16:05] Council Member Lindsay Cremona:** Yes, I just have a short update. Uh, I am meeting with Representative Wayne Johnson tomorrow to just kind of touch base on status of, you know, things going on in the state. And so, if there's anything that anyone would like me to address in that meeting, I'm happy to do that. I've also reached out to our other representatives for our city and I'm trying to schedule meetings with them. I just haven't been able to get one set yet. But please reach out to me, send an email, call if there's anything you want to make sure that I touch base. Um, my purpose is to let him know what's important to residents and Grant so that that's front-of-mind um, while he's um, in office for us. **[16:45] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Thank you. Uh, anyone else? So, I have a couple of things I want to get council direction on. So, um, as most of the council members know, Grant has rarely pursued external funding um, to supplement a roads budget. Um, in August, we did um, have a discussion with Brad about the pursuit of the SHIP grant, and we gave Brad the authorization to pursue that, but there's many other state, regional, and and federal programs that could benefit the city. Um, the caveat is it takes money to spend money. So we would have to specifically um, uh, give Brad the direction to pursue these grants. And so um, it typically hasn't been something that we've really pursued, but um, I've met uh, uh, Kurt Roorig, a Grant resident. He's here in the in the big crowd today. Um, and he's offered to donate some of his uh, time to pursue some of these grants. And as a program manager with uh, many years' experience helping other governmental entities securing funding, I think he'd be well suited to this. Um, there is a—there is a key opportunity that's um, expiring in December 12th. It's called the local road improvement program. And I just want to gauge uh, council's interest in uh, potentially allowing Mr. Roorig to assist with that application and have him, you know, present findings and next steps for uh, that program and maybe other programs at future meetings. And as a caveat though, you know, um, although uh, Mr. Roorig is offering his time pro bono, you know, for the benefit of the community for our roads, um, he might need a few hours to spend with Brad to just validate assumptions. So it it wouldn't be—I don't think—anything it could be totally on his own. He would need some collaboration with Brad. And so um, I just want to float that out there, you know, to see the the council's um, how the council feels about allowing Mr. Roorig to to do most of the legwork to put together an application and then uh, potentially have Brad just do a final review and submit the application. And um, that being said, do we still have Brad on? Did Brad... **[18:55] Kristina Handt:** He's still there. **[18:56] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** So, uh, Brad, um, I just want to get your your thoughts on on that and if that's something that um, you feel would would potentially um, work. **[19:05] Brad Reifsteck:** Uh, Mayor, members of the council, yeah, I think it's a great idea. If we've got a resident that's willing to donate his time to pursue some of those grant applications or opportunities, I think that would be uh, that would be awesome. And I would certainly be able to support him with graphics or cost estimates or whatever he thinks he needs to uh, complete the applications. **[19:30] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Okay. So before opening up for council input, um, Kim, Amanda, this is something we really haven't done before. Um, are there any governing processes or guidelines with with uh, accepting pro-bono work um, on behalf of the city? **[19:45] Amanda Johnson (City Attorney):** Uh, yeah, thank you uh, Mayor and council. Uh, yes, in this situation, we would want to do uh, an authorizing resolution. So it's just like a one-page document that recognizes the donation. It's a donation of time and services, right? Versus a money donation. And then you just accept it with gratitude. **[20:05] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** So would we need that um, resolution formally adopted before he spends any time, or could that be something that um, could be done at the November meeting? **[20:15] Amanda Johnson:** Yeah, for sure. We can have that at the November meeting. **[20:17] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Okay. So, I'm going to open up to the council's thoughts on that and see what you guys think. **[20:21] Council Member Ben Cornett:** Sounds amazing. **[20:23] Council Member Lindsay Cremona:** Any questions? Yeah, I think that's, you know, something we heard over and over is just like people want the roads to be improved. Um, there's a lot of issues. So, anyone that can help is truly grateful. **[20:35] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** And—and oh, I should—I will—it sounds like I had you. Hello. But I just had a quick uh—I got this from um, Kurt, just a quick bio of Kurt's experience and and basically his motivation um, top of the page—his motivation is to help the city to under—undertake affordable road projects for the citizens and and for more projects and otherwise possible without outside funding to result in beautiful and functional city roads. So, I think that's great that someone from the community is willing to step up and donate their time to um, such a cause that we all find near and dear to our hearts—roads. So... **[21:15] Council Member Lindsay Cremona:** Could I ask Brad a question? Brad, have you seen these applications before? **[21:20] Brad Reifsteck:** You know, I've seen the local road improvement one. Uh, and we actually uh, submitted um, an application for Muski Road actually I think back in 2018 or 2019. Uh, but we weren't successful. Um, those are highly competitive dollars and you know Muski did not score very well on uh, the system but that doesn't mean that we can't—you know—continue to go after these dollars and apply for them. If if we've got a citizen working for us on our behalf and willing to put the applications in, then it doesn't hurt to to move forward. **[22:00] Council Member Lindsay Cremona:** And what what is the typical grant size? Does it depend on the the quality of the road? Does it depend on the length of the road? Does it depend on you know how many people put in applications? How much money is left? How does it work? **[22:15] Brad Reifsteck:** Yeah, I think all those are factors um, you know they'll look at the cost estimate. They'll look at—you know, on that one in particular in the Muski, I think they were looking for regional projects more than just local projects. Um, you know, it had to be—and we considered Muski at that time more of a collector street and that's kind of why we thought we could um, score successfully on on that roadway. Um, we did have to get um, Washington—we had to get an—a letter from Washington County, uh, consent letter from them, and I think Stillwater as well. So, um, you know, there—there's a lot of legwork that goes into these these uh, grant applications and like the Mayor said earlier, you know, you got to spend a little money to put in or to get a little money out of it and and um, you know, we don't we don't necessarily have any roadways in Grant that would be considered a regional transportation um, you know, corridor. So, it it hurts us in that fashion, but um, again, it certainly doesn't hurt to try. **[23:30] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Okay. All right. Thanks, Brad. Um, next item I have to share... **[23:35] Kristina Handt:** Excuse me, Mr. Mayor? Can I just get the volunteer's name for the minutes? **[23:38] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Oh, Kurt. Kurt Roorig. R-O-H-R-I-G. And thanks Kurt for for coming. **[23:45] Kurt Roorig (Resident):** Yeah, I—I had planned on at some point if it was approved to get involved to give you—give the council, you know, a presentation of some kind of action plan of how we would submit, you know, who would have to be involved in in some ideas around that. I've done—done this for the last 18 years for state—state government. So, it's kind of—it is a lot of information and it's kind of telling your story. **[24:10] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Yep. **[24:11] Kurt Roorig:** So then for us to tell our story, you know, ultimately I think we're going to end up talking about what are our goals. We have a 10-year road plan right now; over 50% of our funding is is monitoring for 10 years, but we know that's not realistic... **[24:25] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** You're making a lot of good points. Um, we didn't have you as part of the agenda, so I gotta respectfully cut you off, but um, I appreciate your enthusiasm and we'll—we'll have it more formalized um, going forward. Um, so, next topic I want to get council's inputs on. Um, we're a relatively new council. I think um, this council might have some some different ideas on doing things differently with how we've done it in the past. And there's—I've gotten some um, calls before about questions on like, "How do we provide oversight and transparency and accountability?" So I think we we need to um, have a potential conversation to make sure we're clearly defining um, and understanding our roles in providing um, those things. And so it's a—since it's a complicated topic with with many facets, I think it might be um, worthy of a working session to um, ensure council alignment on, you know, how the council—what our role is in providing oversight, transparency, and accountability. And so I just want to um, get the the feedback from council on that. I mean, you think that um, everything's fine, there's no changes needed, or you think there's some opportunity for the council to be more engaged and get more information? **[25:40] Council Member Lindsay Cremona:** I think so. I mean, I think as you were saying, you know, specifically when you talk to residents, they—they may not know what's happening all the time. And I think being more transparent or getting more people engaged in the city is is only going to help. **[25:55] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Well, yeah. And specifically, I was—I was referring to um, our role. I know that um, I may have an—may have different expectations uh, of of staff and um, I don't think it's it's fair to staff for me to be imposing what I feel is the right thing to do. Um, and that's why I think it's important for the council to be engaged and it should be council. Um, I think we all know that we work for the residents and um, as Mayor, uh, I think I represent the council, but not solely. And so I want to make sure like the council is aligned on on any um, kind of ideas I might have in terms of working with staff or or setting the expectations. So I think we really need to be very clear on our expectations. Go ahead. **[26:45] Council Member Ben Cornett:** Yeah, I think that's great. I mean, I'm obviously a newer—newer member of the council and so I don't always know how the nuts and bolts work and so having an opportunity to kind of sit down and say, "Here's how you can, you know, get something on the agenda. Here's how you can—this is an agenda item versus a work session item." You know, those kind of things I think would be really helpful for someone who's uh, fresh in a seat on here. **[27:10] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** And—and a lot of that is um, outlined in the various LMC [League of Minnesota Cities] documents. However, there are some gray areas and those are the gray areas where I was struggling with. I reached out for guidance and just to name a couple examples like um, if I—what is my role as Mayor in um, attending staff meetings? I personally think that um, it would be good for me to attend staff meetings so I'm aware of everything that's going on—just for—more for information sake, not to—not to direct, but just for more for information. Because we don't get a lot of—we have a complete section on our agenda for staff updates but we don't really hear a lot what's going on. And then the other thing is, you know, looking at the example of uh, the the the confusion, misunderstanding of having the complaint process on the agenda. I—that was another thing where I was like, "Okay, well um, as Mayor uh, running a meeting, what control do I have or not have to add agenda items on my own?" And feedback from the League of Minnesota Cities is that's a gray area. You need to have council alignment on how you as a city and a council want to handle that. And so those are just a couple things with the gray area things that I think we we should discuss and and have a clear alignment on. **[28:30] Amanda Johnson:** Yeah. So if I could pop in for just one um, second. The—from a legal perspective, what you want to do is is completely in your, you know, purview. You are the council. You—you set your agendas. You set your policies. You set how you want to operate as a council. And I think um, at least in you know, cities—the other cities that I work with—it's incredibly helpful and important to have a conversation—a work session really, right?—because it's not necessarily an agenda item, but to be able for the five of you to talk about, "How do you want—how do you want to run this city?" because you are the people charged with doing that and we are the people that are charged with listening to what you want and then making it happen—of course legally. **[29:20] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** All right. Um, so the last thing I have... so then we had this, how do we now move this discussion into a work session? Is that the next step? Right. **[29:30] Amanda Johnson:** Yeah, that would be the next step. **[29:32] Council Member Lindsay Cremona:** Yeah. So is the idea that this would be on that November 3rd work session? **[29:35] Amanda Johnson:** So it sounds like you have a work session to talk about the complaint policy on November 3rd. Would you also want to talk about council roles, um, ideals, and sort of structure at that same meeting? **[29:45] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** I'm happy—I feel like they're—I'm happy to have it in the same meeting. I don't know how much time we're anticipating we need for the complaint versus... I want to make sure we give enough time to both. **[29:55] Council Member Ben Cornett:** So just a a thought starter. Um, how would it be to budget a half hour for each and then we'll start on the one? If the one goes over then we could um, bump the second topic to the to the next month. **[30:05] Council Member Greg Anderson:** I would uh, Mr. Mayor, I would say as if we're going to do that in precedence, what is the one to start with so we make sure that is the most important thing we get across? **[30:15] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Well, I think the one that’s was teed up first is the potential um, revisions to the complaint process, you know, addressing the any gaps there. And—and um, actually, let me let me talk about the last one I have um, because that might dovetail in a little bit too. Um, so, as we're approaching year-end, um, I'd also like the council to reconsider our our staff performance review process. Um, at a recent LMC event, I learned that most mayors from similarly sized company—excuse me, cities—um, follow a different approach than ours. So, um, right now, uh, our current process is we submit individual evaluations with no real visibility into the rest of the process. We hand in the uh, our our performance evaluations for each staff member, and that's—that's where it ends. I've never um, seen anything happen after that. So, in contrast, from what I've learned talking with mayors from other cities is typically what they do is they involve the full council, you know, working together, discussing together rather than just submitting their own individual feedback um, through closed work sessions led by the staff attorney with—with um, emphasis on, you know, clearly defined expectations, transparency, you know, fairness and accountability. So, I think the ability to have a council kind of discuss that um, together rather than just, you know, submitting the the individual uh, performance appraisals would result in a more robust discussion. So, just throwing that out there if that's something that um, the council feels would be a approach to consider moving forward. Any any comments for me? **[32:15] Council Member Greg Anderson:** I mean, it makes sense. Uh, as you know, I'm now in my second year of this and I have no idea how the the uh, performance process even works. So, I think that's something that we need to be able to manage and take care of. So, it makes sense. **[32:30] Council Member John Rog:** John? I'm okay with that. Sounds like a good—a good uh, a good change potentially. It's—it's fine. **[32:40] Council Member Lindsay Cremona:** Okay. Well, we we got at least three people in alignment. Yeah. I mean, when Ben and I went to the League of Minnesota—like and actually Greg, you were there, too—that training, they had actually talked about it a little bit, and it did sound like what they were, I don't know, recommending or talked about for the process was it was much more collaborative. Um, and they went through the process on that. So, that's what I was under the assumption we would do as well. So, knowing that we don't do that, I think it makes sense to to do it in a more collaborative way. **[33:15] Amanda Johnson:** Okay. So, just a quick point of clarification if I may on that. **[33:20] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Yeah. **[33:21] Amanda Johnson:** Um, so for the the staff performance um, reviews, you would like that to be done where um, some sort of form gets sent... well, let me back up. In in most of my other cities, the way that that we do it is the performance review is either for the City Administrator or the City Clerk, depending upon the size of the city, because not every city has a city administrator, right? Essentially it's the head of the of the city. And so they typically do annual reviews where they um, send out—sometimes they send out feedback to the staff seeking feedback on, you know, the clerk or the administrator, and sometimes they don't. Um, and sometimes they send out, you know, uh, questionnaire forms to the council that get filled out. Um, all of that information comes to me and then I push all that out to all of the council so everybody has, you know, all the data. So, I collect it all, send it all to the the council so they have that ahead of time and then they do a closed work session. Um, because this can be a closed meeting. Obviously, you're talking about somebody who works for you and so that doesn't need to be something that is aired publicly. That can be something under Minnesota uh, open meeting law—you can close that to have that conversation. Um, and then it's up to the council in terms if they want the staff member in attendance at the meeting or if they want to talk the five of you privately and then bring in the staff member and have a conversation—what's working, what—what's not working, what's good, what's bad, whatever. And then typically at that same time is when they would also be talking about compensation adjustments for the following year. So, these are typically done at the end of the—somewhere near the end of the year or if they're on like a—whatever their their annual, you know, date is to um, reflect in terms of compensation as well. **[35:15] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Okay. So, it sounds like you're familiar with the general process what we're talking about and you would probably just need um, the council to answer a couple of these questions that you pose—a couple choices—and is that something that um, we could we could roll into—I know it doesn't seem like agreement of of adopting a new process needs to have a full-fledged work session—but maybe just um, part of—maybe in conjunction with what we talked about just to have you come to the council with these questions and and get the answers from the the council. I mean, I—what—what do you think is the the best um, way forward on this? **[35:55] Amanda Johnson:** I can do whatever the council wants. If—if you want as part of your sort of um, council roles, ideals, and structure session that you're talking about doing for the work session, this could be one of those things. "Hey, how do you want to set up this review process?" And then that feedback I would get from you and I can give you some samples, you know, of some cities so you can see what's done and maybe you could just say, "Copy this model, please," and then—and then we would move forward with, you know, probably having a closed session at the December meeting um, a review session—unless you wanted to have a special meeting. But if you don't want to do a special meeting then we would just put a closed session in the meeting that's already scheduled, right? **[36:35] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Yeah. Okay. All right. So, we don't—we don't need to provide any specific answers right now. That's all—all to come. **[36:45] Amanda Johnson:** You don't, if—unless you want to—if—if you want to try to wrap everything into the November um, meeting and so you want to be able to do... **[36:55] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Well, I mean, no, for—for right now, you don't need any more specific direction from the council on this. **[37:02] Amanda Johnson:** I don't think so. It sounds like that's what I'm seeing head nodding that we want to move forward. So, I can I can make that happen. **[37:10] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Great. Um, that's—that's all I had. Um, so we have the community calendar then we'll go into closed session and then we'll adjourn. So who would like to read the community calendar? **[37:25] Council Member Ben Cornett:** I would love to. Uh, Mahtomedi Public School Board meeting Thursday, October 9th and October 23rd, Mahtomedi District Education Center at 7 p.m. Stillwater Public Schools Board Meeting Thursday, October 9th at the Stillwater City Hall at 7 p.m. And Washington County Commissioners meeting Tuesday, Government Center, 9:00 a.m. **[37:45] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Excellent job, Ben. Thank you. You did a really good job. Um, so for those online and in attendance here, we're going to do two closed sessions and then adjourn. The closed sessions will be um, in pursuant to uh, Minnesota State—blah blah blah—basically, we're talking about attorney-client privilege communication to discuss pending litigation, Helika versus Grant. And then the second one is um, the same for pending litigation, Sam Scott versus Grant. So, um, that being said, uh, we will, um, give folks a—a few minutes to, um, leave and then we'll open our closed session and then adjourn after that. So, thank you everyone for coming. Sorry to have to kick you out. **[38:35] Council Member John Rog:** Do we need to move to a closed session or what? **[38:37] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Do we have to move for closed session or not? Kim, do we—we have to make a a motion to enter the closed session, right? **[38:45] Kristina Handt:** Yes. Just take—just a five-minute break and... **[38:48] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Okay, agreed. Take a five-minute break. **[38:50] Council Member John Rog:** That’s fine. **[38:51] Mayor Jeff Giefer:** Okay. All right. Five-minute break and then we'll—we'll open our closed session and then... Can you stop the recording? Right. **[39:00] Kristina Handt:** Stand by.