said he might be running hot, but uh he said he was going to be here. >> All right. Thank you. Let's call the workshop to order. 5:15. Roll call, please. Council member Nordby is absent. Council member Woods >> here. >> Council member McKenzie >> here. >> Council member Schweer is absent. Mayor Mongi >> here. Thank you very much. I had a motion to adopt agenda, please. So move. Council member McKenzie. >> Second. >> Second. Council member Woods. All those in favor say I. I. Thank you very much. It's all you. >> All right. Well, we got one topic on the agenda tonight. It's discussion about the RFP solid waste and recycling collection services. I wanted to put a special thanks out to Ken Roberts, our community development director, and um Dan Winnick, our finance director that really organized a lot of this um put all this together this evening for you. Um but they've also had good help with uh Christian, uh Barbsman, and Terry, Taylor Lily. So, thanks to all them and all the work they put into this. And um I will turn it over to Dan. >> Good evening, mayor and city council member. Uh tonight we're going to discuss uh get you up to speed on where we're at with uh the RFP on the solid waste and recycling collection services. Um we've taken a little bit of a pause before we interview u short list and interview um some of the vendors that uh we've received proposals from because we really want and value your input and so we'd like to get that. But before we start, kind of want to say a little good news um regarding our solid waste. Um and a lot of this credit, well, all of the credit goes to our council members and to our city manager. Um you know, we we constantly are are hearing that our rates are going up or our property taxes are going up. Our solid waste rates have not gone up since 2020. They have remained the same. Matter of fact, when we went out for an RFP in 2019, um we actually reduced our rates into 2020 and we've kept them there all the way through. kind of a value of of doing a financial plan that we've been doing with all of our funds and you know whether it's the general fund or enterprise funds is that we looked at the solid waste. We had fund balance and even though we've been taking a loss um the last three years we still have fund balance in there which which has enabled us not to change the rates at all. good news, even better, is that these RFPs have come in with very good proposals and very good um rates that there's a heck of a great chance that we will not be having to um raise our rates at least for a few years. Um but part of it's going to be dependent on on what you see as needs for our residents um in the city. Um and we're going to kind of tell you what we learned through the RFPs as we went through them. Um, and so kind of want to get you up to speed where we're at. And then it's really to get discussion, uh, to get your input, um, because this is going to be valuable for us to, um, come up with the questions, um, that we're going to be asking the vendors, um, and then incorporate those ideas and thoughts into the contract itself that we'll be bringing forth to you later on this year. So, the purpose tonight is to update the city council on the request for proposals um and to see seek direction on key elements to the city council would like to see in that final contract before we do the interviews and negotiate with the uh negotiate the contract. Now, we've got some key elements. You may have others. Um don't, you know, please add other elements that you saw. We just, you know, as going through the RFPs, we saw some different themes. um that we thought were kind of interesting and kind of want to feel um city council to find out if if the sense is that we should really pursue those and if so, you know, if there's a cost associated, you know, should we um uh you know, what would be kind of the limit on the cost component to it so we have some sort of guidance when we get into the negotiations. Um so what has been done? Um Ken Roberts has done the the bulk of all of this. He's been the project manager on on this project and has done an absolutely excellent job. Uh you've already heard uh from our city manager. Uh Chris, myself, Barb, and and Taylor have all participated. They've been the standing committee as we we've worked through this. Uh we work with and I always get their name wrong, so correct me. FA FO in um is a consultant that's through Ramsey County. Um the city does not pay um for this consultant. Ramsey County does um they have a lot of expertise in developing RFPs for um you know garbage haulers. Um and so they've done they've been excellent to work with and and very helpful um in our process in developing the RFP and the timeline um for uh getting a a contract um so we can get it back in front of city council. Um at the end of last year, city council adopted a motion approving the draft of the request for proposals and um we uh then got that out um for uh public uh uh advertisement um with a deadline of September uh February 13th um for submitts. We're very pleased to tell you that we received seven proposals um which was quite quite good for for this and again u we did receive uh the market is is very good at this point in time. We did receive um some very good proposals as far as cost is concerned. Um the committee independently reviewed and scored each one of the seven proposals on a scale of 1 to 10. Uh the categories were qualifications, economic and price, um community values, past performance, and value added plans. Um the staff at FA Consultants tabulated the committee scores and they also completed a comparison of the base proposals um for cost by doing a weighted percentage scoring for each of the seven proposals. These are the results of those seven um proposals. None of the vendor names are being shown because we're too early in the process. It's not public information at this point in time. It's really to get the input from city council. So, they're labeled A through G. And you can see that there's a a weighted percentage. Um on the bottom there's points and then there's the weighted percentage. You can see the top score is an 8.9 followed by a 7.99, 7.44 44 and so forth all the way down to 6.31. If we look at the second line, economics and price, you can see the first vendor had a points of 9.3, the second had a 10 and the rest of them fall off pretty dramatically in comparison. Um there is a formula that uh VA used um to um calculate the score for cost um where they take uh the cost minus the the minimum cost of all the costs and they prorrate it over from a 10 being the the the high uh the lowest price five points being the the highest price of the proposals and again the RFP contained a lot of different pricing um for you know it it's got uh yard, you know, yard waste. It's got the recycling component, it's got the garbage at different um levels, it's got dumpsters and so forth. Um and so after you see after A and B, you see quite a significant drop off. Um one of the things that you know we kind of would like to have um city council's input on is when we move to the interview stage in the negotiation component to it. negotiation would be with the the one company that we choose after the interviews, but we we really feel as a committee that we should only select the top two just because of that price component to it. Um and then when we get into these key elements, those are going to be questions that we would like to be asking um the two vendors that we select for interviews and find out where they're at for pricing. Some of some of them have included pricing for some of these different options, some did not. But because this is an RFP, we do have the right to be able to try to negotiate those um and incorporate those within the contract. Um so kind of put you on the spot right away. Are you in agreement that we just interview the top two just because of the big fall off? one in overall scoring and two pricing. >> Yes, for that >> I would I would say so. Yes. >> I do have a couple of questions if >> Sure. >> Yep. Now okay, time for questions. >> Absolutely. >> Um so what is so value added plan? What is considered value added plan? >> Well, you know, one of the pieces that we had a theme throughout the the proposal was um like bulk pickup. >> Okay. for those additional things that you know that are further not farther down but also included in here the questions for us about bulk pickup you know the app things like that those are part of the value added plan >> exactly okay >> yeah and you know we were really trying to go you know I mean >> uh in my time here at the the city that um spring cleanup the bulk pickup has has been something that continuously comes up for dialogue and and my understanding is in the past that there used to be uh a bulk pickup um that was provided um part of the the you know the garbage rate itself and that went away. So you know we really wanted to hear give us some inventive ideas how how do you handle it? What what would work? What wouldn't work? Um and we were kind of in certain ways disappointed that not all of the vendors really provided that value added and you can see the scores kind of reflect that different component to it. But again, this being an RFP that if our city council, if you have that desire that we should have a bulk pick up and we've got a question that, you know, we'll get into more of a dialogue um and get your input that we can bring that up and we can negotiate that component to it. Um and so um that's what the value added component was um that we were trying to get at one of them. We did learn some other things that uh companies are offering um which we found very interesting and so we want to share those too and get your input onto it. >> Um the results of the staff scoring and waiting um kind of just went through it and again it shows those two proposals that are the highest um and so really kind of want to make sure that we move forward um you know and kind of uh isolate those those two. Now, even though we move forward with those two, if something just doesn't work with them, we can always reach back. And that's part of the reason why there's no names at this point in time. Um, and it's really, you know, kind of uh at this point, it's it's not public information um until we actually come to city council with a contract and then we'll give you the information at that point in time. So, the next steps that we have is, you know, that we're going to select vendors to interview, and it sounds like we'll we'll do the top two. Um, we're going to try to schedule those out in the next couple of weeks. Um, then we're going to negotiate terms of the contract, including the key elements, part of our discussion tonight, and we're going to finalize the contract, and then we're going to bring it to um the city council. We're we're shooting the bring the contract in June. um that will allow um you know if a new vendor is selected three months for that new vendor to be able to um be prepared to start on September 1st of this year um because the other contract ends at the end of August. Now getting into kind of the discussion components to it. one of the components that came across and we had a number of vendors that um offered this up currently today. Um the city staff um is providing our residents with that customer service. So they're the first call. Um if there's issues that happen like somebody missed a you know that a resident missed a pickup, we end up having to contact the vendor. we end up playing that middle middle role um to it which you know I you know many times creates frustrations for our resident that they're waiting for this middle person you know or the middle person waiting for some sort of a response. There were a couple of vendors that said that they they would take over the customer service. Um, and so we're really trying to find out what the, you know, what is the city's, you know, city council's desire. Do you want to see, you know, um, the vendor take over the customer service component to it? We would still retain the billing. And part of the reason for that billing is because, again, we haven't done we haven't changed the rates since 2020. We don't anticipate that we'll need at this point in time. You know, again, it'll flush out when we do the final negotiations. um and depending on what key elements are selected, but we don't plan on increasing the rate. Um but we want to be able to have control over that that rate so we're not seeing it raise, you know, raised artificially and we have no knowledge of it. Um so we would still do the billing there. there would be um uh you know language put into the contract um to make sure that they're they're meeting our standards um that there's good communication back because if they when we get to the bulk pickup if bulk pickup was done the same way today um they would be contacting the the vendor for that pickup but we would end up having to know what those charges are so we could put it on the bill and so forth. So, there's a lot of coordination that needs to to go through. Now, even if they do take over customer service, we're always going to end up, you know, playing a role into it. Um, we're, you know, you you're a resident, the first call you're going to go to is going to be to the city when it comes to the utilities because, you know, you know, you're you're providing the bill. Um, we would hope that this alleviates some of the confusion for our residents. Um, but it's really to ask the city council, what do you think of that as an option? >> Do we do we know what the volume of calls currently looks like? >> You know, uh, you know, we had invited all of the committee to be here. um Barb who um is our utility coordinator um kind of of the calls that we get um there's usually about 20% of the calls are usually related to some sort of garbage whether it's a mis call whether it's a bulk pickup and so forth. Um, so the there there are a number of calls that that do come in and then, you know, it doesn't end just there because then we end up having to send something, you know, via email or calling to the to the vendor because they're the ones who have to actually schedule it. Um, you know, we have some guidelines that we've worked out with them. But, um, you know, um, and then >> a nuisance, is it a nuisance for trying to get a hold of the vendor? >> Uh, no. They've been they're pretty good. They're pretty good response. it's just that there's a, you know, there's a a significant delay and then we end up having to reach back out to the residents and so it's really the inconvenience as far as the resident is concerned. Um, and so this is an option to, you know, at least we believe that this would end up helping that communication with the resident a little bit more and be a little bit more, I guess, seamless instead of having it to be that inter intermediate step that they're they're taking. >> I was thinking if if they really can't help, all they're doing is a go between, you know, what does it really help? >> Yeah. and you know they're very helpful you know as far as the bulk pickup um because you know we have a a pricing list so they can you know get that and do that but if there's some sort of issue that's transpired it's it's back and forth back and forth and and you know we do get some and and I do not blame it we get frustrated residents um because of that delay I want an answer yes or no you know and I don't blame them um >> do Do they monitor calls? Do they do um reports? You know, if somebody calls up and you know, tells the city, I've been calling and I'm getting no satisfaction. Do we have any kind of reporting that we can get for call reporting where we could, you know, see that see how that call went and see where it went type of thing? >> You mean as far as from from them? um not that I am aware of at this point in time but those would be the pieces that if they take over customer service and that there would be some certain demands that we would we would put in our system tool to have that but I think any call kind of customer service you should have some kind of reporting and >> analyticals to see what you're doing >> exactly and that would be a part of and that's where that's why we're trying to get your input if you're interested in this then and and we've already had a very good meeting with the committee we kind of went through this PowerPoint these key elements and really it comes down to it's the details in the contract to make if this is something that we desire then how do you make it really work and then it needs to be re-evaluated every three six months until you you've got you know all the wrinkles ironed out um to make sure that it's it's seamless and the city always has has the option to pull it back out um you know and that would be something that we would put again language in on the contract that would allow us to do so. >> Do we have a direct dial number for for trash now or they just call the 2400? Is there a number out there 2480 or something like that? I think there's a a separate number that >> so we can take that and keep that number and just forward it to them so we can keep control of the number then probably >> that or have them directly you know we just publish that you call >> directly to like see it stay with our number if we can just case things change on the line type of thing you know if we can do some kind of a forwarding where you know and if it doesn't work out we're not sending out hey that didn't go well guy we're going back to something else >> sure that >> if we can keep that number and just direct it I think at least we have control over that then if something doesn't go correctly. >> Okay. >> My my thought is because we're in control of the bill, I like it coming to the city. The the last thing I want is let's say they decide on bulk pickup costing $5 an item or something. If bill if bill mixup or or or things go ary. So, so if the guest calls the the company and then there's a miscommunication between the company and us and now someone's getting charged for something that they didn't ask for, I I I can see that as a potential issue. Um, so depending on the call volume and the amount of hours you think it's saving, I I I'm not super on board or super excited about outsourcing that. Well, and I guess I would agree with Jason a bit um because not to jump ahead, but if you know the next thing on the agenda or next item to discuss is the app, a vendor provided app. If that is an option, I could see that definitely offsetting some of those calls for the not more technologically inclined people residents of the city being able to selfs serve them you provide their own self-service. you know, >> I have a question, I can do it in the app. I want to reschedule, I can do it in the app. Things like that. Um, and then we're really truly just dealing with the billing issues for those people. Um, so I guess I think it makes sense to keep us in the loop. So, >> so, so I'm hearing from two that you would like to keep the customer service still with the city. >> I would. Yes. without hearing the rest of the presentation right now. That's the way I'm leaning. >> Oh, no. That's No, no, that's good. This is good input. Well, you know, >> thing is to make sure that we can do something instead of just them gettingounded and then we're hounding. I don't know how how the call how the call response is. You know, if the call response is, you know, when they do it, they call back right away. Or if it's ours and they're calling up the city and saying or calling up the resident saying, "Sorry, I didn't hear anything back yet." you know what kind of position you know as far as staff too is it something they can really do ex you know that type of thing. So if we can, you know, if we had a better understanding with, you know, the call volume is pretty, you know, not much and it's, you know, they can get taken care of fairly quickly. But it's but I would still even if we did something, I'd still like to keep control because if something doesn't go right, I don't want to have to republish numbers because people take that and they put it in spots and then all of a sudden they're dialing that number. So that'd be the concern I would have if we did something that was not with us. No, very good very good points that are be that are being made and and um you know whether customer service stays with us or whether it goes to a vendor there's always a potential of issues. >> Um and that's where you know it really is how do you work through all of those components that are that are with there. It's just that again I think virtually every single one of the vendors um that in their proposals offered up customer service. Um they all have call centers um >> free to a dollar per month res >> and and we and these are just my throwing something out there just to kind of gauge you know um >> these aren't things proposed by vendors. this is to kind of give us throw out and say, "Hey, we would like to do this and this is >> right >> the price that we would propose >> that we would be willing to willing to pay for that type of a service and not go over it." And so to so to me underneath this, we did have a number of vendors that would do it for free. There was no additional charge to it. Um, from this dialogue, we're not seeing a huge benefit. Um, or and I'll I'll relate it back to a financial pressure are a cost savings to us. So why would I pay for something um would be the piece to it. So to me I would look at it and it would be my recommendation that if we were to entertain that customer service um with with the vendor and that would be questions that we would ask in the interview. How would it work? Um and to be able to come back to the city council if we decided to have it in there. Um, and and you can scratch something off of the contract and say, "No, we're decided not to do that." But it would be in there for my recommendation, it would be in there for free. We would not pay something to have them do that. >> And I would also say if Barb or whoever were able to provide >> some examples of these are the types of calls that we get. This is about how many calls we get, things like that. Um because I could foresee even if we had them take care of it, had you know the vendor take care of it, somebody's still going to call the city. >> Absolutely. >> Somebody's going to get frustrated if we just say, "Oh, I'm sorry. You need to call the vendor for that." And then >> we're still going to facilitate that communication. And so we're still in the loop regardless whether we're >> absolutely supposed to be or not. >> I remember when I did work for BFI, you know, back in the day when they were our garbage hauler in North St. Paul, we would talk to them directly because I used to go over there and take care of their call center. That's what I did was, you know, call center work. So, they would just call in directly to there for your for your stuff. I don't want it switched to here, but that was another option. >> Okay. >> Now, our system that we have now for phone system, we can't get any reporting or anything out of it as far as if we need to do stuff, reporting, recording, anything like that. >> I think we get call volume um through the metro. Yeah. basic stuff. Yeah. Uh, one of the other things, not not all vendors proposed this, um, was to provide an app um that customers could access with information about pricing, schedule changes, delays in pickup, pickup options, vacation holds, and etc. Um, and that's where, you know, really our question is is city council, do do you see that as a something that's desirable for our residents? Um, and if so, um, would there be a cost associated that you would be willing to pay? >> So, your can text you on Monday night and say, "Hey, dummy, put me out in the curb. You forgot." >> You got it. >> There you go. >> Fine. I I could see I am I tend to be technologically inclined and so I could see this being super valuable for me. I know I've got a vacation coming up. I'm going to put a hold on, you know, just like I do with my mail. I would put a hold on my my garbage pickup. Don't worry about picking up mine because I'm not going to be there. You know, granted my cans wouldn't be out either, but >> um >> holidays remember pickup or it's a day late. >> Yep. >> How many calls they get for that? >> Yep. And then, you know, you know, if we do the bulk pickup, being able to schedule that bulk pick up in the app, you know, this is what I've got. This is what I want it picked up. Super easy for me. So, I would say yes, I I would like this option. But that's just me. And for me, where I fall is uh on the list you provided, um I would entertain it up to the 50 cent per resident per month. That's kind of the value I >> place on an app as as long as it's 24 hours and you know a looks like it's decent app not a now now part part of this as we go into interviewing and I and I can't remember off the top I don't know if this is something that both of those um uh vendors provide but what we would do is we would say in the contract, in other words, it wouldn't be a deal breaker, but in the contract, it would say that you have to be moving towards this and we would give them some sort of a timeline. >> Um, you know, and again, um, just like Council Member Nordby said that we would end up having to to basically accept or approve whatever app that they end up coming with that it's making sure that it's it's meeting, you know, what we perceive as the needs for the residents part to it. Okay. Any other comments on the on the app? Um 50 cents um per resident per month. >> Yeah. >> 2550 helpful. And then the another interesting component that you know you know as we're going through the RFPs was there were a number of vendors that talked about uh truck technology um you know of having um you know cameras showing the driver and the load and and GPS so you knew where the the truck was at all at you know at all times um that a resident could access you and that would end up then going through that app in some way that there would be a map and that they would end up being seeing seeing that. in as our city manager when we kind of went through all of this stuff, you know, that we'd like to be able to to see that map and see the route so they know where they're where they're at in that route component to it. Again, we we look at this again as you know because it was overarching of of all of the vendors, but it was like it struck us as this isn't a bad idea that you know you know we can see some value to it. um would not be a deal breaker if somebody didn't have it today. But again, they have to be moving towards um that component to it. And again, it would be something that whether we're providing the customer service or they are, it's something that helps our residents with that customer service component to it. So, is this something that um that would be desired by city council? And >> no, for me, >> no for you. No, >> I would see this less as less valuable than the app necessarily. Okay. Um, I think it's more of a it's more it would be more beneficial to pro to the provider uh from the standpoint of knowing where their trucks are, knowing if their truck gets in an accident, you know, having that camera footage of what happened and things like that for accountability. Um, but for the residents, I don't see this as a as big a deal. >> Okay. Number one, number one, one of the residents would do, he'd look on that, go up, drive up and find that driver and say, "I need you to come over pick up my garbage right now." That driver's got his other stuff to pick up. Then you're going to have a war. >> Only thing I could see is if I forgot to put the can out and I could look up and if it was free, I wouldn't pay anything for it. Go, oh, he's still down the block. I got time to go throw it out. >> It's for us procrastinators. >> Yeah. I mean, I I'm If it's free, sure. But but I I would have a hard time attaching a a you know a fee to it. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> Then bulky pickup um bulky pickups uh would be so what we're thinking is a bulky pickups would be picked up at residences on a regular basis as at no additional charge to the resident outside of a monthly charge. Um and then we kind of look at in two different components. The frequency of it and then the cost um per resident u and first of all is that something that's kind of some sort of interest um for you know city council to to look at. For me yes ve very much so very much so >> I do like it but I sure hated the way it was abused when we had it. So, I don't know how we have to have a lot of, you know, be able to put some stipulations on it because people were every week pile crap everywhere. >> Yeah. >> And and that's where, you know, you know, we could set the number of items. >> Yeah. >> Um that are there. Um and again, it's that frequency. It could be two items per month. Um we could, you know, have it two per quarter, two per semianual, annual, or it could be four, six. But we would set some parameters on there and part of that is is because they're going to have to provide at least some sort of pricing that would be associated with with doing that. Um >> my question is people put stuff out, they're going to come through at night, your scrappers are going to take it. That stuff's not there. That guy's going to get charged for it not being picked up, but he's still getting charged. Well, see, in in this way, there would be a uniform charge is what we're talking for, you know, all residents. Um, and we would be looking at, you know, flip to the next. Again, we're not looking at it being a very high cost component to it that they would have to offer. Now, we have had a vendor that it part of their proposal. Um, there there were two vendors that addressed this. Um, one vendor um had proposed two items per year um at no cost. Um one proposed uh two items per month at I think 72 cents per resident. Um so what we're looking at is not a high cost component to it. Um but it's really to kind of get city councils and then we would go in, you know, and try to negotiate and and find what the vendor can do. um what the cost, but we want to kind of have a parameter of what that ceiling is. We will not go above that. >> Well, this will then cancel our yearly pickup then that we do for the How would that go? >> That that's definitely something that that's that's to me a different issue and and city council would have to have that as a discussion on to it. >> Well, it's got to be an issue that we're going to have to do because we're not going to have both. I don't think it' be, you know, it's a lot of work and effort if we're going to be doing it on a monthly basis or something. They still did it even back then when um they had the bulk pickup that the city handled it and there was no restrictions on it which was part of the problem. But then we also did do a spring clean up. Once upon a time we did a spring and a fall cleanup. So and if I may the idea with this also would they residents would still have the option if they had a special need. They got six items this week because they did a clean out. they get to still call in to either the city or the hauler and arrange that special pickup and pay extra for that. This would be a built-in charge in everybody's bill whether they use it or not. And more than likely you would get some sort of a sticker. you know, you would be getting, you know, let's say you say, you know, two per quarter, you'd get two stickers that would be mailed out to you and you would, you know, be able to utilize them. You'd stick them on whatever is out there so that the the hauler knows what's going to >> When we had bulk before, was it a certain was it a set price? >> Yeah, it was like 235 a bill is what I remember. A month or something. Yeah. And they stopped it because of abuse. Was that >> it was going to raise uh if I remember right, it was going to go from like 235 per month bill to I want to say like 580 or something. Um and they just felt that was too big of an increase. >> But was that prior to the former vendor to the new one we have now? Was there a discrepancy in there? because the newer one did not have bulky pickup at that time because I know our other one did. >> I I I'm just know what >> I really Yeah. >> When it was included in my monthly bill. >> Yeah. >> It it it it said it on the side and I want to say it was $2 and change. >> Yeah. >> 230 is what I remember. And then they the city sent out a survey asking what what they wanted to do. Um because it the the current vendor at the time five and change is what's remembering in my head and it was decided that they they weren't going to go for it because they felt that was too much of a burden on the residents and then they went to a cost per item at that time. I think from res from a resident's perspective, there were all there were those that did not take advantage that didn't need it. >> I don't want to say take advantage of it, but those that did not use it and therefore were upset that they had to pay for some a service that they were not >> I remember from I was hearing from >> um so I think I don't know if we even pursued it when we went with our current vendor if we just said you know what we're not going to do it. we're going to try this other thing. And you know, I think I think moving back to bulky pickup makes sense. >> I think keeping it on the low end, you know, two items per quarter, one item per month, something like that, I think makes sense in my mind. >> Um, one from a number of items that a general household can come up with in the course of a month or things like that. Um and two in keeping that cost minim that cost increase minimal so that even if there is an increase for people who don't take advantage of it it's not an overly burdensome charge >> and you said you can add more if you need to is that you >> yes if you had yet yes you could always call and schedule you know the just like now >> and one of the reasons why I'm somewhat passionate about this and uh glad we're pursuing this. And this is anecdotal evidence, but I I walk my dog a lot and to me, I notice the amount of junk in people's yards, in my opinion, has significantly gone up since the bulky pickup went away. Um, you know, you you walk through the side streets, you walk through the amount of stuff that I know people, if they didn't have to pay for it, would put out in front just to help the city be a little bit nicer and cleaner. Um, but again, minimal cost, not, you know, I if you have, you know, 10 or 20 items, yeah, you're going to pay for that many, >> but just a So, I guess I mean, to me, we're all going to answer this individually, but but I kind of agree with what Troy um I'm anywhere from like one item per month or uh to six or eight annually per household at the most >> um One quick thing I was wondering too is it you know if they do it quarterly quarterly is it cheaper than monthly? I mean as far as gas I mean what what is there any different in charges that because they have to get trucks out more if they say you know quarterly if you can have three three items quarterly. >> These are all things that will get negotiated. >> That's one thing as far as you know is that cheaper if we just instead of doing it monthly just say quarterly or type of thing >> and we can come up with your top four of what you'd like to get quotes on and see what comes back. I mean that you know travel the the you know somebody here and there type of thing if you can do it you know in sections or in quarters where it's not maybe that will help too on pricing. >> Absolutely. And I I would imagine any vendor would follow the same routes that they have. Um so you've got the four days a week that they're providing you know trash. They would probably follow that same type of a schedule with with the bulky pickup. Yeah. if you can push it off instead of having it every single month, if you did it on a quarterly basis and you could move it up to, you know, three items um on the quart quarterly basis or or or four items on a quarterly basis. Um um you know I mean it's it's really we'll go back to you know looking at the frequency you know do we have kind of a consensus that we want the number of items and then the frequency month per quarter semianual annual um it could be every two weeks or every two months um those are up to you somebody want to start kind of throwing out different options and thoughts on to that >> you want to cut this off in December mber. So there's no bulky pickup through the winter time then because sometimes this stuff you guys are going to be plowing snow out in the winter time. You don't want this stuff laying out there. That's that's definitely a thought that you know that we've talked about. Um uh Ken and I um and then we shared with the committee. I believe that we probably would um want to do that, but then others say, you know, you still have the bulky pickup during those time periods, but again, that's really leaping to city council. Um I there's, you know, there's some positives to cutting it off um for at least, you know, maybe three months. March, >> I mean, I'll start. We can just go down the road. I mean, to to me, I would want to say at least four items per year, preferably more, but that would be the minimum. Um, and if it's more than that, I would be willing to go up to probably a dollar per month per resident, but that would be my absolute max. Um, but it's all going to depend on how many items they get, you know, and how often it is. But that that's where I sit. >> Okay. Very good. >> I would say um you know, >> let's say six to 12 items per month. But if we can keep it >> per per month >> or sorry, six to 12 items per year, >> sorry. Um but if we can keep it, you know, more towards the 50 cent per resident, um I think that's going to be more uh accepted among the residents. You know, obviously the cheaper it is, the better, but >> I'm stuck between quarterly and semiannually. That's where my thought is. >> Monthly, I think is too much. >> I think a quarterly for me would be better. I'd like to 50 cent rate. Yeah, more realistic. And >> will they be done then? >> As far as not during the winter. >> Yeah, basically. Yeah. Or you do it at the end of No. Yeah. You're right. >> So So maybe do four items, three quarters. Yeah. >> And and don't do that January, February, March >> because you don't want anything laying out on the street >> because we have also parking parking rags out there too in the winter. One thing for the council too, we are fingers crossed, if we're fortunate enough, the way the rates came in, we may up to 50 cents, maybe more, maybe a little more, would be able to include that in the contract and not have to raise our rates. That's that's our hope based on what we've seen so far. Again, negotiations haven't started yet, but what we've seen, they're very, very favorable for the city and the residents. >> Do you have a good pencil sharpener? We like our pencil pencil sharpen really tight. >> That's Dan's department. He's the money guy. >> Sharpen that pencil. Well uh >> if if any of the seven vendors are watching this or watching it on the replay, um, you know, to to get this contract, they're going to have to sharpen their pencils and and and give the city. There's a lot of competition um that that is out there. And, you know, again, we had a vendor that gave a proposal of two items per month, 72 cents. So, if you do four items for three quarters at 50 cents, you're probably somewhere in that ballpark and and that they should be somewhere in there. Um, yeah. So, I mean, yeah, it's going to be uh yeah, I don't think we're going to we're going to give a lot of ground up here on on some of these negotiations, especially when we get the city council's backing on that. And that's the purpose of getting your ideas ahead of time so we have a better stance. Um, and just to throw one thing out there, I don't know where everyone else is. Um, I I I for me car tires are not a deal breakaker. If they accept them or don't, because I know some some people So, for me, the bulky item does not if it does, great. But if it doesn't, that wouldn't be a >> And I would imagine that there will be, you know, and we haven't seen Yeah. There'll be items that are restricted and and and Yep. And and understandably so. Um that's kind of how the the environmental um components to it. >> Yep. >> Yep. Yeah. And we have the Ramsey County Environmental Center that a lot of those things anyway. So we can you know there's options there. >> Yes. >> About mattresses have to be elimination too. And and again, that'll be something that'll be part of that whole negotiations is where where are they at with certain things and and you know, hopefully, you know, and and again, you know, hopefully vendors do check this out and find out. It certainly would be a wise move that they would offer at least something up whether it's we'll do mattresses, but it's only twice a year um or some other component. And that's really what we're hoping again I think it was council member Woods that you had talked about what was that value added. This is what we were hoping for um for for our vendors to come up with some different ideas of how they could do us and and share some pricing with us. Um but we didn't get as many as ideas as we wanted to. But that's for us now through this discussion to go back and kind of hammer and we would like to see these different things and I think they would benefit our our residents um greatly. So, >> did they make any mention to I think most everything can be picked up by their regular trucks. I think they run a separate truck if they're doing appliances. If that was any more for like a appliance as opposed to a regular item they can just pick up the truck. >> Again, there there wasn't really great detail. The the one um vendor, and correct me if I'm wrong, I think the one vendor who was going to do two items per month would run a whole separate truck. Um you know, pretty much Yeah. and and go through and do that. But >> for all the vendors that you talked to, are are they all willing to participate in the the green bag? >> Yes, that was >> Yes, that was >> Yes, that was a requirement. >> That was a requirement in the in the RFP. >> And I would assume all the vendors would continue on yard waste and recycling and everything like that. >> Oh, no. Yes. Again, again, all all requirements and there was pricing that was >> weekly pickup, right? Correctly. >> Well, for you could be longer. >> Oh, yeah. Oh, I I just pile on the curb. That's >> and more expensive. >> Well, once sweeper goes by, just you'll hook it up. >> Yeah. It's strange. The recycling seems to be more full than the trash can nowadays. >> Yes. >> They're a little smaller, too. Unfortunately, the recycling can. So, No, we we the RFP included all of the other services that the city's currently receiving and that's where kind of the added value was trying to give us give us something different. Um you know and we did talk in in the RFP about the bulky um pickup as kind of being we use the term issue for the city but something that that we really wanted them to focus on. Are there any other things that we should be aware of that is important to the council to include in the contract besides the all the what I call the regular stuff? >> Were there discussions back to what the mayor had mentioned earlier? Were there discussions about what they see other cities doing in terms of bulky pickup versus the you know the periodic whether it's monthly or quarterly versus the annually annual like what we're doing now. What do they see other cities doing? Is there a general consensus of what's >> I think it was all over the board. Yeah, >> a lot of cities are doing the cleanup days still. >> Okay. >> And as far as bulky pickup, it was all over there. Okay. >> And the consultants even said there's no magic bullet. It's kind of a combo of >> people have too much stuff. >> Yeah. >> Oh, yeah. >> Tell me about it. Um a and for me ju just for noise where I sit I would do 50 cents a month if the trucks were electric so you didn't have the motor noise that early in the morning. Um I I don't know if that's any options in any but that's just where I sit. >> You would give an additional 50 cents if they were >> Some of them are run on propane though. >> Yeah. But but those are allowed ju just like a a regular motor. In my mind, >> they have better luck than the fire trucks do that were electric. I don't know if there's any garbage truck. I never heard of one yet. Is there electric garbage trucks? >> They they were just building a a station in St. Paul for them, I believe. >> Um but but like I I don't know if any of them have that option. Um >> it's definitely something that we can ask and >> I wouldn't pay any extra for that. >> Yeah, I mean everyone's going to be different on their >> There's considerations with that as well. the uh once upon a time we just had a demo of a truck that uh it added what 7,500 pounds to the weight of the vehicle and like this time of year is pretty critical for the weights and what they running on the streets that you just sometimes you don't think about that stuff but there and the additional cost was tremendous as well. I'm just curious, what do the trucks weigh when they're fully loaded after a day of recycling pick or pickup either truck? What do they weigh when they leave town? >> I'd like to find out what their actual weight is. >> Cuz they're undergrowth when they come in, but they've got to be pretty close to overgrowth over four tons per axle. >> Follow the ruts. Can't think of anything else. I asked just asking people what they thought and they everybody seems to be happy with our garbage service the way it is now. Nobody's saying that issues as far as you know miss pickups or anything like that. I was asking people that I ran into just to see if they had any thoughts. I think there were some places that actually looked at requirements of single axle over double axle due to the weights or but I don't know if that was brought up but I've heard of it anyway. >> No ridden in never ridden in a single axle. They're scary. They're not very comfortable. >> Don't they have air ride seats? >> Yeah, but you're still going like this. Uh really happy somebody picks up garbage. I think that's the best thing ever. >> I'll uh reiterate what Dan I think said earlier if not tonight at previous night. The value of putting this out for the RFP. Hey, we got seven proposals. We did get a few ideas, but we did get very competitive rates and those top two are very competitive and we're hopeful again that we'll be able to hold the rates for for the next five years of the contract at a very affordable. >> Let's not go that far, but >> we're hoping it will be a five-year contract. Now, there will be some probably some inflation raises in there, but overall, and if we can provide some extra services like with the bulky pickup on some curbside versus people having to haul it, I think that will be a win-win for the residents and the city. >> Yeah. just don't realize when you have kids at home, you know, the thing was packed to the gills and now if I have two bags in there, by the time I pull it out, that's a lot. So, it's really strange of, you know, how much less there is now. When you get an empty nest, >> I experience the same thing when the wife goes out of town for a while. I don't even need to put it out. That's >> right. >> But I I I'm going to put it in my own words, kind of what what Ken had said. two years I've had the the privilege of of uh going to the council retreat and one of the themes that has been there for two years is for staff to be looking at contracts and to come out and try to get better pricing. Um this is a good example of yeah it it works. Um and we're saving not just the city but we're saving our residents. Um and this is a very good very good story. um you know and and um you know our our city manager Brian you know keeps telling us let's get moving let's get moving. We we did have the right to do another two-year extension with our current contractor and Brian pushed and said you know no we need to get out there um and find out where it is. Well we hit we hit the market at a good time. uh seven proposals. Uh we got some fantastic um rates that are there that's going to allow us some flexibility to potentially add some additional services and our residents won't see an increase um in this um at least for the first couple of years if not all five. We'll we'll be shooting for that. But uh but yeah, so I mean it is a huge value to be able to have those conversations with city council and to be able to to get where you're at um because that's very meaningful for staff and it allows us to be able to then carry out um your mission. Two of the things two of the things that I guess I'm looking >> our current hauler has been very gracious on coming out on the cleanup day to help its public works. That's huge. And another comment I had about our current hauler, I watched a driver get out of his truck one day, went down the alley on 17th and Helen. He noticed the set of barrels were down. I forgot to get pulled out. He went down and pulled them out and dumped them for the guy. Now, how many drivers from other companies would do that? >> You know, and that's the thing is I I don't know. >> Um except for except for >> that's what I see >> except for the annual cleanup. virtually all of them talked about that they provide, you know, staffing for the cleanup. So, that one I think is pretty equal across any any vendor. Um, when it comes to an individual who's a driver, who knows, company A, B, C, D, they may have a fantastic employee who would end up um doing that. And um nothing against our current vendor um but this is a process and um at the end of the day um we need to be able to provide good service at a very good price um that's enhancing our residents you know way of life. So >> any other questions thoughts? I think you did a real good job and thank you for the work and investigating. I think you know go to the two two like we discussed and >> so we we'll go and set up interviews. We'll have interviews, try to negotiate a contract and then we're planning on um at least by hopefully the second meeting in June, no later than the first meeting in July, that we would have a a contract um you know to bring forth. Again, there can be some changes in that contract, but hopefully we've ironed out pretty much everything and again, it'll be in line with what this discussion was um today. So, >> thank you very much. >> Thank you. >> I appreciate the hard work. >> Yeah, thank you for all your work, Ken and Dan, and the rest of your team. >> Again, I give Ken a heck of a lot of credit because he's keeping us on task and he's done an absolutely wonderful job. So, thanks, Ken. >> All right. Anything else on this subject? If not, we're going to adjourn until 6:30. We'll get us all this time. So much room. So much time. >> All right. Can I a motion to adjurnn, please? >> So move. >> So move. Council Woods. Second. >> Council Mackenzie. All those in favor say I. I. >> We'll see you in 18 minutes. Thank you everyone.