[0:28] [music] [2:22] [music] [3:23] [music] [3:51] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** One for my parents. Okay, it's 6:45. Glad not... meeting will come to order. First up, first up on our agenda is roll call. We're all here. Yay. Um, approval of city council agenda. [4:14] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Can I pull out um number seven of city business? I've been chatting with a bunch of different organizations as of today and they're—they haven't got any information back yet. [4:31] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Sure. [4:38] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Anything else? Um, Alan, did you want to add that under—I just amend? [4:45] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Yeah, if you could. Mayor and counselor, earlier today, um, we did get a call. This is uh, in relation to letter I under the consent agenda. You've already got it teed up to uh, authorize some payments to Henches and Sons, SNM Henches. They're doing a bunch of the lift station work uh pursuant to contract. They've put in a couple of uh pay applications number four and five. And so the total under that line item that they're requesting is 156,497 and 46 cents. So that's the actual number we're approving on the already lettered item. [5:25] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Just FYI. [5:28] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** And then um is this the time that we're talking about the consent agenda? If we want to pull something out. [5:41] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Well, we're now approving the agenda. [5:41] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Okay. [5:41] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** So, this is just a number to go with that lettered item. [5:49] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Okay. [5:51] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** So, once the agenda is set, you can then once we get to the consent, pull whatever you need. [5:51] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Thank you. [5:54] **Alan (Acting Admin):** That's all I would amend that with. [5:56] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Anything else? Okay. Can I um have a motion, please, to approve the agenda with those two amendments? [6:05] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** So moved. [6:05] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** I'll second. Hankins. [6:11] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** All in favor? [6:11] **Councilmembers (Chorus):** Aye. [6:11] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Opposed? Hearing none, motion passes. Um, we'll move on to the public forum. Would you like to speak, Mr. Granick? Thank you. [6:28] **Terry Granick:** Thank you, Mayor and Council. Good evening. Um, Terry Granick. I live at 363 Lakewood Lane. Um, I'm here on behalf of Jessica, my wife, who I think most of you know from the Lake Links Committee as well. Um, and myself—just want to raise concern. I actually stopped in and saw Therese in the office yesterday and she suggested this would be a good kind of starting point. I will follow up with more detail and more more details about the situation, but raise concerns about a tree. Um, I live on Lakewood Lane, so if you're unfamiliar, start at the hockey rink and you're coming up and go up the hill right to the right. There's a very steep road that goes up on the end of that road, actually across the street from my house. So, it's officially, I understand, on both city property and 369 Wildwood Drive property. And the backside essentially of that property is a very large um cottonwood tree that has uh been essentially halved by the property owner at this point. Everything over his property was taken down. Um, and it—now if you take a look at it, it's best to go there and look at it. It is a very precariously um... if it goes down, it will fall on my house, property, family, and I am very concerned on that. He's also been digging—maybe level or something, but bottom line is like I'm concerned about the root system. I'm concerned about multiple things. I've had two independent um arborists who were coming to do other work at my house um unsolicited raise concern as they came up the road about this tree. Um, and one was actually Woodchuck who is uh I think on your agenda later this evening. Um, so I have been concerned about it um for a while and I have pictures. I'll send these via email. John Lund looked at it when he was doing emerald ash borer. So this—maybe a year agoish. And also that I did ask him because he was out there and I'm like, "Hey can you look at this?" and he was tagging trees for EAB, but he expressed concern with it. So my concern and kind of where I'd like to get to is... I'll share this information. It's not on my property. It's across the street from my property. My understanding is that the property line actually divides the tree. Um, so I'd like to try to um just raise the safety concern. It is a big safety concern. I think you'd agree if you took a look at it. Um, and then just following up with how we can you know mutually address the the concern. [9:14] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** I don't—I mean—so just so I understand, the tree was removed on private property and the remainder of the tree is on public property? [9:14] **Terry Granick:** That's—well, that's your understanding. [9:24] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** The trunk is I think right down the middle? [9:24] **Terry Granick:** Yeah. The first like the large branches that broke—like that branch off—split off. So if you look at the tree, it's literally half the tree and it's half this way. [9:43] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** And it's—so the the the trunk is in place. It was just kind of the upper part of it was cut back so that it doesn't balance well now. Something like that. I just want to make sure I understand. [9:47] **Terry Granick:** 50% of the tree is gone. Trunk is in place to the top like—and it's split between like Danny's property and city property. As far as you're aware of the property, that's my understanding. That's what he has uh claimed, explained in the past and actually I think you know there was a survey done and it did appear to me it splits. [10:06] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** It sounds like something that we should look at. [10:08] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Yeah. So how would we access that tree? What's the best? [10:08] **Terry Granick:** So that's also um what what Woodchuck had indicated would be best. So if you want to access it to look at it, come up Lakewood Lane. It's at the top on your left hand side. [10:23] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Okay. Okay. [10:25] **Terry Granick:** Um if you want to access it to do tree work on it... there's there's power lines. It would come down across power lines into my house and property. Um, so Woodchuck did indicate that it would be probably preferential if they had access from the other property owner um to deal with the remainder of the tree. [10:49] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay. We'll come take a look at it. Were you saying power lines go through it? [10:53] **Terry Granick:** No, not go through it. It would fall. It would come down across it. I actually talked to Wright a little bit and they're like, "We only work 10 feet within power lines as well." So I I don't know that it would be a a Right tree service issue at least. But I don't know. I haven't looked at it specifically. I was here yesterday and there was a guy in the parking lot I talked to because I came to talk to Therese and I was like, "Hey, what what do you think about this?" Well, we're only contracted within like 10 ft of lines. [11:28] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** All right, I'll run out and take a look at it. Thank you. [11:28] **Terry Granick:** Thank you. [11:28] **Alan Mitchell:** Good evening, mayor, members of the council. I'm Alan Mitchell. I'm on the parks committee, and you have on your agenda today one item that the parks committee has brought to you, and that's the proposed amendments to chapter 804, which is the uh provision of the code that creates the special revenue fund. So, I appreciate the opportunity to address you here, and I'll be very brief. Uh, you'll remember back in April, you passed a resolution, and you directed the parks committee to monitor the funds that are in the special revenue fund, which are primarily the dock fees, and to prepare an action plan and a budget for 2026. So, we're meeting next Tuesday, and that's our plan to get that together so you'll have it for the December meeting, and somebody from the parks committee can come here again in December regarding that. Um, but one of the things that came to our attention is that the the ordinance provisions regulating the the spending of money from the special revenue fund could use some updating and—and and some clarification. So, we've put together some proposed language to—to do that. And you have in your packet uh explanation of all the changes we proposed. They're—they're not controversial. They're not substantial. They're updating. They're clarifications. Um, so really all you have to do tonight is is just uh pass a motion to say, "Yeah, we're going to propose some amendments to chapter 804, schedule a public hearing for next week or next month, I mean, as uh is required under your rules of procedure, and then uh if if you're happy with the amendments, uh hold the public hearing, see if anybody comments, take those into account, and then pass a resolution and publish notice." Um, and as I said, uh, in December, we are hoping to have an action plan and a budget, uh, for 2026. [13:19] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Thank you. [13:21] **Alan Mitchell:** Oh, thank you. [13:21] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Thanks, Alan. [13:24] **Alan Mitchell:** Have a good meeting. [laughter] Happy Friday. [13:28] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** All right. Barton, would you like to— [13:30] **Barton Winter:** Barton Winter, 15 Oaks Lane, and um, I've been uh doing quite a bit of work on the rink and replacing boards and earlier in the summer we were replacing the perimeter posts and so you know I think uh you know there's obviously more that could—could be done but uh one of the things that's come to my attention is our new netting setup on the sort of the west end of the rink and um what I've commented on is that I was a little concerned about the bolting in of the one—the um existing structural posts that hold up the chain link fence—to the new post that came off the back stop. So, that's one—one thing. Um, you know, I—I would like to see some banding uh to hold let's say the two posts, the primary posts that are around the entrance, hold them together and sort of take some of the stress off the bolted connection. Um, one of the other thing that I'm uh concerned about at the rink, okay, there's—we don't have zip ties or any ties on the center portion of the netting that goes under or above the opening. And I don't know if they plan on doing that, but we should. I mean, it could be that it's being left because it's inconvenient if something tall needs to go in, but that shouldn't be our main concern. You know, that's—that's where we want—we want the pucks to be stopped there. And uh I'm also concerned about—we have uncapped posts and specifically on the far end away from the warming house. Uh, these are the 2-inch diameter posts that support the chain link fence and they're pretty thin-walled and we've got at least eight of those posts that have burst and I believe I was told in consultation with some fencing companies that that's a result of water getting into the pipe and then freezing and expanding. So a lot of those posts there—most of them don't have a cap on them. Right. So, I would say we need to put caps on, you know, ultimately block the water from getting down into the tube. And um on the other end, the new uh setup, we've got the taller posts, which are thicker wall. And um you know, I guess they're not as much of a concern to burst if they get water in them, but why temp fate? So, I'm asking that we designate Jim and Ron or me or somebody to cap these posts with—the caps are not expensive at all. And it was told to me that possibly we could drill like four 90-degree um screws in to hold the caps on because they get shocked, you know, when the puck hits the fence. [16:21] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah, we can talk to Jim and Ron about that. [16:26] **Barton Winter:** Okay. Is there anything—So, uh, yeah, that's that's basically my concern. Um, I, uh, you know, also here's what I've been saying, um, you know, for the last few years. I said, yeah, I—I would like to have some autonomy to flood. And you know, because that's where the key thing that I've complained about is we're going too slow. Our buildup is too slow. We get going too late. And uh— [16:48] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Excuse me one moment. Did you want to speak about that? [16:51] **Barton Winter:** I did. I think that's a good idea. [16:53] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** So, um, my thought is that once the weather gets cold enough, we'll alert you as to when you can start flooding. But we'll let you try it. Really? One and done. How about that? [17:15] **Barton Winter:** Oh, yeah. No, I—I—I don't want to compete with Jim. I want to work in concert with him. And so hopefully— [17:21] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** We'll have you do it. Um, and then in the event that um... Well, we'll have to set some—some rules in general um and probably a little bit of training as far as— [17:34] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** We'll have a meeting with you. [17:36] **Barton Winter:** Yep. Yeah. We need to re—you know, I mean he's—he has given me training on it uh like 2020— [17:42] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** And then we'll have to have you sign the waiver as well. [17:45] **Barton Winter:** Okay. [17:46] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** But we'll set up a meeting. Okay. [17:48] **Barton Winter:** Okay. That, you know, that's great. That sounds good. Thanks. [17:52] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah. Thank you, Barton. [17:54] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Thanks, Barton. [17:54] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Thanks for all your work on the rink, too. It looks great. [17:57] **Barton Winter:** Yeah. Happy to do it. It seems like it takes a long time. [18:03] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah. We appreciate that. [18:05] **Barton Winter:** Uh it's, you know, but right now I have some time and and I'm finishing up. I'm gonna finish this last corner in spring. Anyway, but— [18:13] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Well, thank you. We really appreciate it. [18:15] **Barton Winter:** Excellent. Thanks. [18:18] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Thank you. Mr. and Mrs. Jensen. [18:22] **Ruth Jensen:** Bud's gonna sit this one out. [snorts] I'm Ruth Jensen. Is this on? [18:28] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** I believe it is. Just tap on it. See? Yep, you're on. [18:31] **Ruth Jensen:** Um, 701 Hall Avenue. And I'm here to talk about Halls Marsh and I am assuming that the council's objectives are to restore and maintain Halls Marsh while preserving Birchwood's property rights and keeping the budget down. So, I think that uh Rice Creek's proposed agreement opposes these objectives. You've all heard of putting the cart before the horse. I think Rice Creek's agreement is full of carts that are way way down the road with no horse anywhere in sight. That missing horse in the scenario is easements. Rice Creek Watershed District has no easements to use Birchwood property and their agreement is a distraction from that basic fact. Birchwood should not take this next step of signing the agreement drafted by Rice Creek in its own favor until it takes the first step of requiring Rice Creek to get the legally necessary easements to use Birchwood's property, including all of Hall's Marsh. We know you're all tired of talking about this and anxious to settle the problem as quickly and cheaply as possible. But I think it's important to realize that Rice Creek first proposed this agreement on June 1st, 2022 after Birchwood's resolution in October of 2021 and after Ellen's letter March 1st to Rice Creek of 2022. Both of which directed Rice Creek to clean up the marsh and stop using Hall's Marsh for untreated Prebby runoff. That's when they came up with this agreement. But in three and a half years, Rice Creek still accepts responsibility only for the outfall settlement and denies responsibility for the length of Hall's Marsh. I think it's time for Birchwood to reject the whole idea of this cumbersome agreement. It contains falsehoods that support Rice Creek's position and weaken Birchwood's. And uh really the only relevant parties for Hall's Marsh are Rice Creek and Birchwood. The strongest protection Birchwood can get for the marsh are easements that include legal description of the property, plus maintenance terms that don't depend on what another municipality does or does not do. Even if all of Birchwood's amendments are accepted by Rice Creek, the agreement takes away Birchwood rights by requiring it to access without easements. Easements would specify the legal description, maintenance and cost sharing terms, the intentions of the parties, and dispute resolution. Those are important protections for Birchwood property rights. Rice Creek has known since its original engineers reports in 1978 that easements were required and that they did not get them. The agreement also requires giving up the right to claim damages and requires agreement that the PLOP is two separate projects, thus excluding the marsh, and that it's not a storm water project subject to MPCA regulation. So, here's what we think Birchwood can do instead of signing that agreement. First, of course, they inform Rice Creek that they're not going to participate in this maintenance and operations agreement because it is adverse to Birchwood's legal rights. Then they inform Rice Creek that Rice Creek has to negotiate for the legally required easements with maintenance terms to use Birchwood land for the PLOP. And that includes the land over the piping that comes down and Rice Creek has to cover all the legal costs for drafting and recording those easements. Attachment one has documentary support for Birchwood's position and there is no cost presenting these facts to Rice Creek and requiring them to do what the law requires. If Rice Creek refuses to negotiate the easements with cleanup and maintenance terms, Birchwood can petition the Board of Soil and Water Resources to compel Rice Creek to get the easements. And then further along, they could investigate filing court actions to compel Rice Creek to get the easements and possibly to pay damages and legal fees if that were allowed. As far as I know, Birchwood has not asked the White Bear Lake Conservation District or the Washington County Conservation District or the Washington County Commissioner for help and support in demanding that Rice Creek accept legal responsibility for Halls Marsh as a district facility that has always been an integral part of the Prebby Lake outfall project. The PLOP has degraded Halls Marsh, a public water wetland that's hydrologically connected to and drains into White Bear Lake at a fish spawning area. So, I think they might have some concerns too. Then we can or simultaneously petition the DNR to get Prebby Lake off the public water inventory. Prebby was listed on that due to a known error, a flyover mistake. And Rice Creek knows it. They're fully aware of it. And—first, last, and always—it's storm water going into Prebby, storm water going out. But in March, because of this technicality that Prebby is a public water lake, Rice Creek successfully petitioned to be removed from the requirement that the PLOP is removed from the requirement for an MS4, you know, the storm sewer separate thing because they don't regulate transfers between public waters. And uh but Minnesota statute 103G.2011 says the commissioner can revise the public water inventory map as needed to correct errors in the original inventory. I think we should ask him to do that and then we can ask the MPCA to rescind the cancellation of—of Rice Creek's need for an MS4 permit since it's clear that Rice Creek is using a known error to circumvent the intent of Minnesota water law. And then finally and least favorite would be to investigate asking for a declaratory judgment on the rights and obligations of both parties specifically on Rice Creek's use of Birchwood's land without a legal easement. Then followed with or combined with a request for a summary judgment compelling them to get the easements to negotiate those easements. And another thing that you could look into since Rice Creek is physically occupying and using the city land without an easement—this could be conceivably a trespass and the city could seek damages from them for the unauthorized entry and use of the property. Then I just wanted to say about the attachments, some facts and law. This is just some of the evidence that's available about Rice Creek always intending to use Halls Marsh for water treatment, starting with the first engineers report in 1978 and that it was always one project to get the water out of Prebby and into White Bear Lake. I'm just going to say that like on the first page under facts A1B is the quote: "permanent easements for drainage purposes will be required along the entire length of the outfall and then a drainage easement through the Hall Marsh will also have to be acquired." And at the bottom of the first page is a quote from the final engineers report in 1979. And it says, "The new location of the storm sewer outfall will provide assurance of the complete utilization of Halls Marsh as a wetland treatment facility for the storm water discharge prior to its entry into White Bear Lake." I think that's pretty definitive. And then there's the questions about easement law. And it's interesting, this is at the top of page three, that despite how old this project was, Rice Creek had to get an easement from Dale Johnson when it replaced the outlet into White Bear Lake in 2017. And then it also acquired easements from the property owners around Prebby when it replaced the outlet structure there in 2022. And Rice Creek policy requires the district to get easements for all their facilities, but they've never acquired any from Birchwood. A petition for a drainage project does not grant easements and allowing usage even for years and years doesn't grant easements over municipal land because for municipal land prescriptive those kind of usage easements are specifically forbidden by Minnesota statute 541.01 901 and permission can be given and it can be withdrawn and it's very reasonable I think for Birchwood after discovering a polluted sediment that requires removal to an industrial site to require Rice Creek to get the necessary legal easements with maintenance terms. Now then, attachment two is important because it shows that Rice Creek knows the water coming out of Prebby is storm water. They have known it at least since 2021, but they knew it before that, but at that board meeting, they talked about it and how it was mistakenly identified as a lake. And I think Rice Creek wants to use the fact that Prebby is a lake and that there isn't going to be any MPCA oversight just to help them do a draw down over any objections Birchwood might have because you know it's just a transfer from one lake to another public water body. So I think it would be important for Birchwood to uh petition the DNR to get it off to get Prebby off the public water inventory and then—that's it. And I have lots of answers. I hope you guys have some questions. [32:51] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Well, I will mention that we have talked to Stan and we have talked to Washington Conservation District. [33:04] **Ruth Jensen:** Oh, good. [33:05] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Um, and Minnesota Pollution. Yeah. So, we are awaiting more responses from those groups, but we'll see what comes up of it. That's why I took it off the agenda for tonight is because we're awaiting some additional information. So okay. [33:17] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** I don't have any questions yet. I need to digest all of this, but thank you for putting all this together. This is a lot of work, lot of time and effort, and I appreciate that. [33:28] **Ruth Jensen:** We have been in Birchwood for a long time. I'd really like to see all of Birchwood get to enjoy the marsh with a walkway or—or just more shore access or something. [33:55] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Thank you. I appreciate you guys doing all of this for us. Thank you. Did any of you guys have questions? [34:04] **Councilmembers:** No. [34:09] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay. Thanks for coming. Um, seeing no one else to speak at the um public forum, public forum is closed. Um, we did the presentations and we're moving on to the consent agenda. Um, Bridget, did you have something you wanted to pull from that? [34:29] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Yeah, just a couple of things. Um, I'd like to talk about the Woodchuck in Poly's Park and then the paid leave. Okay. And then I just have a question about the balance sheet. [34:45] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Hold on. Um, what letters? [34:48] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** So, it's G, uh, it's L and then a question about M. [34:55] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay. G, L, and M. You should try to spell something. [laughter] That's like "glam," but what—the—Anyway, never mind. Okay. So, can um— [35:05] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** I want to pull out C. [35:08] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Can I have a motion to accept the consent agenda after the removal of G, L, and M and C, please? [35:14] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** So moved with the removal of G, L, M and C. [35:21] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Second. [35:22] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** All in favor? [35:23] **Councilmembers:** Aye. [35:24] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Opposed? Hearing none. Motion passes. [35:28] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Can I clarify something quick on that though? [35:32] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Sure. [35:32] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Um I think we left in I. Yes. So that was for the revised amount. Okay. [35:39] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Just to make sure that was all. Are we—are we getting reimbursements again? I don't want to... Let's just not remark on my remarks. It's a—it's a Friday and a long night. Okay. So, um I'm going to add this G, L... well, let's go in alphabetical order. C, G, L and M. I can't do it after um number eight on city business there. Okay. Um, let's move on to staff reports then. Uh, Marcus couldn't be here this evening, but in your packet you will see on page 71... [36:21] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Do we want to adopt the consent agenda? [36:21] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Oh, I thought we did that. [36:25] **Alan (Acting Admin):** We—we did. I had a clarifying question afterwards. Sorry. [36:25] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Sorry. [snorts] I just wanted to make sure that the amount we approved was actually the amount we approved and that we don't have to come back later. So, um, if you look on page 71 of um your agenda packet, there's a map and the highlighted streets on the map show um where the Crack and Seal project will occur in 2026. Um, we need approval on this tonight um because it goes to Washington County. We're going to go through Washington County to have it done and they need to get us on their calendar. And in order to do that, they need to know in December if we are going to go in with them, you know, to get this project completed. So the expected cost, if you see on the side, is $22,000. [37:15] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** I'm not finding that—page 71. [37:21] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay. So there's two packets. It's not on page 71 of either. It's right here. [37:25] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** That one. Okay. 71. I don't know what to tell you about it. [37:33] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Um, it says page 71 at the bottom of the page, not page 71 in the PDF. Okay, hold on. No, I saw the map because there's two. I got you. Sorry. Anyway, do you have any questions about the project and or the amount or anything? So, it's part of our 2026 uh road improvement plan which um Marcus is working up two different scenarios and that will be presented in December as a council. Um, probably at our workshop if we agree to do that. But this part we need to pass first because like I said the—the deadline is coming up if we want to have that done. [38:30] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** I think it's a good idea. [38:35] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay. Then can I get a motion to approve the Crack and Seal project for $22,000? [38:40] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Uh so moved, Kathy. [38:42] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Second. [38:45] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** All in favor? [38:45] **Councilmembers:** Aye. [38:47] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Opposed? Hearing none. Motion passes. Okay. Um, going on to number two, engineers report on drainage improvements in Poly's Park. Um, put in—I don't know how this is working in your packets, but it's page 72. Um, he put in a map of all the improvements. Um, did anybody have any questions on that? And we know we get—we're getting any—all funding through um Rice Creek. [39:27] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Rice Creek watershed? Is that for the Poly's Park one? [39:34] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Oh. Oh, Poly's Park. I am so sorry. Yeah. Poly's Park. No, this one. Okay. Sorry. [39:38] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** They're applying for a grant. It looks like. [39:41] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** You're right. Yep. Yep. Sorry about that. So, Poly's Park. Um, if you have walked down there, you will have noticed all the erosion. The water just like runs straight down Birchwood Avenue into the park, um, causing like—just rivulets. [39:54] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Yeah, rivulets. [40:02] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Well, it used to be a pond. [40:05] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Yeah. It used to be a pond and they drained it and put that drainage in there. [40:08] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Well, that's—that's we're talking about—that's why it was water runoff. [40:10] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Yeah. Yeah. That's why that all goes down there is because it's—that's I mean whatever. It's still a catch basin down there. Mhm. [40:15] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** So, um [snorts] this would also be a potential part of the 2026 road plan. Um, Marcus and I met with um some people from Rice Creek. We have to have a pre-meeting before you apply for that storm water grant. Um, so, this would be the project if we were to get the grant. Um, it would take care of all that. Um, the water just rushes down and it erodes everything, the street, the sides of the road. And so you'll see the different parts of the project um that would be done. And there would be a rain garden or retention pond. Yes, that is the south side of Poly's Park um which would catch all that water running in. And with curbing we could um direct the water better. So anyway, that's something um Marcus and I have been talking about with Rice Creek. Um the action item that goes with that is number two and that is on page uh 73. Uh, Marcus estimates that it would cost about $12,000 for him to work up—do the soil borings, infiltrate tests, um surveys, hydraulic modeling, feasibility report. So to work up the information in order to apply for the grant would be $12,000. The grant would be a $60,000 grant. Um, 30,000. It's a 50-50 grant. So Birchwood would come up with 30. Again, all this money would be coming out of the road improvement project because it would be rolled in to the um roads plan for next year. [42:12] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** So, I just have a—a couple of comments. One, do we have an overall plan for Paul's Park? Do we—do we know what we want Poly's Park to be? I know what the parks committee had planned on doing once they were done with Ty Schmidt, which was um—there's a lot of dead trees there. That tree removal was part of that. We were hoping to grind all the stumps at the same time so that we could replant because um—we can't apply for the relief grant and the other DNR grants because we are too wealthy of a community as far as our um—the the people who live here um are above a certain poverty level basically. And this year they've uh only allowed um income levels to dictate the first come portion of that. And there's never been that grant where it rolls over. So that's why we have not applied for the relief because we are very unlikely to get it. But um in the event it next year has one where you can plant again, removing all those tree stumps that would be detrimental to planting would have been the plan for the parks committee and then putting in a boardwalk through there because of the steep grade ends up just washing down into this retention pond or along the route. Um, and then uh same issue with like wood chips and things like that and it just ends up being washed down because of the steep angle. So, they were hoping to do a boardwalk or something through there to make that a little nicer and then the educational placards etc. that it used to have um would be restored with all the new trees. So, that was the plan that the parks committee had planned on doing once Ty Schmidt was done. So or the current project in Ty Schmidt was done because they were thinking about Poly and then easements was the next one and so anything that's washing away is what they were aiming for after that. [44:09] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** I think it would be helpful to have sort of the overall picture of what we want this piece of land to be. And then the—the other the other thing that comes to mind is sort of the cautionary tale of what we've run into with Ty Schmidt, which was that it was a marsh and it was a wetland and we've been fighting it and fighting it and fighting it. And it seems like that's what we're saying about this one, too. [44:30] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah, it was as he mentioned it was previously a pond and then was drained for the purpose of— [44:35] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** So it's going to go back to having a pond in it? [44:38] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Rain garden/retention pond to catch all that storm water and then perhaps we won't need a walkway because it won't be rush—it won't be run out you know— [44:48] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Well I think it's the grade—like the—the steepness of it that's causing a little bit of the issue but depending on where that rain garden is... yeah, possibly. [45:00] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** So anyway... Um, I don't know. What do you think about this grant? Applying for it? [45:06] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** [snorts] I—I guess what I—I—I don't disagree with Bridget. The question I would ask is, don't we need to do this anyway? [45:15] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah. [45:16] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** I mean, that's—it's destroying the road. I mean, so it's either going to come out—I think it's going to come out of our pocket or we can get 30,000 potentially from Rice Creek to help us do the project. [45:33] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** That's the way I'm looking at it because either way, if you take a look at that section of road where the water just rushes down, both sides of the road are totally destroyed. [45:44] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** It's really bad. [45:45] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** So, we're going to have to do it one way or the other. Okay. And if we can capture the water, like direct it to a certain place in Poly's Park, that'll keep the whole path from burning and getting muddy. So hopefully— [45:51] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** So, I I guess this goes back to the maintenance thing. Like when I look at Poly's Park, I mean I run through it every day. Like, when it rains, the water is supposed to drain because there's a giant drain there that gets full of crap that no one cleans out. So it's like... like who's taking care of it now? How do we get it? I know we put money aside for maintenance. Like that needs to be part of the—that needs to go on a list for next year. [46:21] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah. Yeah. Just like those whatever we're uncovering along the sides of the road. [46:31] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** I mean, that's the [laughter] thing. That's the thing. Like, you start digging and you're like, "Okay, well, there's all this—all this storm water management that we have that's just covered in dirt and—" [46:44] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** It's not functioning because it's not maintained. [46:46] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Yeah. So, it's like—needs to be vacuumed out, etc. [46:49] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Well, it needs to be shoveled. Shoveled out at this point. Yeah. [46:53] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** It's buried. [46:54] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Yeah. Like, I was shoveling again down there. [46:58] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Were you? And white pine and— [47:01] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Oh jeez. Yeah. But Ryan ran by and he found this pipe. There's a corrugated pipe that was... I don't know, hidden under leaves and vines and—I mean it was just... we have some sort of storm water structure out there. It's just all covered. It's been neglected for a very long time. Mhm. How far was I digging back from the road? [47:25] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Just three feet. [47:26] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Yeah. Three feet of asphalt and it was like this. Oh my gosh. [47:32] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** So, I mean, so our roads are actually significantly wider than [clears throat] you think. [47:37] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** They are. [47:38] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** They are surprisingly larger than you would think. [47:40] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Yeah, I was—I was actually digging along Hall there by Roto Path. Clear all that. But anyway, we digress. [47:48] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** So, anyway, we're going to have to take care of this storm water management anyway, one way or the other, so we can try to get this grant and get 30,000 from them. [47:56] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Or repay. [48:01] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** I—I mean, I guess the way I'm squaring this in my head is saying that this is just... it is destroying that road down there. Like it is in tatters right now. And so it's like, I think you're right. This—this is part of the roads project. [48:14] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** I think Washington Conservation District also will do the rain gardens for free as well. So, if we get um Marcus to do the plans potentially that location and then also um on Wildwood where there's always that huge puddle whenever it rains. It's just a little ways down from my house. [48:34] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yes, that—those would be two good locations that potentially could use some water diversion to start draining them and getting them off the road in both locations because potholes are going to form. So, right. So, even if we don't get Rice Creek to pay for it, it would be probably good to have the engineering figure it out ahead of time when it's time to do that road. [48:56] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** And so like—these things are strictly for the grant and required by the grant? Because I look at this and I'm like, this seems like an astronomical amount for these things. [49:05] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** I know. That's what—we had to have a pre-meeting before we fill out the pre-paperwork—like before we even get to the grant. So, you have to have the meeting, then you have to fill out the preliminary paperwork, and then after they approve your preliminary paperwork, then you can apply for the grant. But this is all necessary for the preliminary paperwork. [49:25] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Forget what "survey to shoot existing conditions." Like, I don't even know what that means. [49:33] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** I'm not an engineer. Marcus, where are you Marcus? [49:37] **Alan (Acting Admin):** It's just a topographic. [49:40] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Is that what that means? [49:41] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Yeah. [49:42] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Okay. I mean, I probably would have put it in human speak, but that's what it means. [49:49] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** What would you like to do with this? [49:52] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** I say we have Marcus, since we still have some money left over from the project that we had, we have Marcus do this and then if nothing else, we have it all recorded and ready to go for when we get to that portion of the road anyway. I mean, is this a hard and fast 12,000 bucks or can we negotiate a little bit? [50:18] **Alan (Acting Admin):** He always um—generally an hourly rate and then—it's—yeah, it's—multiplied a little bit. [50:23] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah, he—he generally comes in lower. [50:25] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** He does. Yeah, because I'll dig the holes and bring them the dirt. [50:26] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Nice. All right, then. Can I get a motion to approve the 12,000 for the grant work? [50:33] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** So moved, Kathy. [50:36] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Second. [50:42] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** All in favor? [50:43] **Councilmembers:** Aye. [50:44] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Opposed? Hearing none. Motion passes. Thank you. Um, so on to city business. Oh, I'm sorry. Page 74 shows um by my math. We're on number three, which is the parks amendment. [51:10] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Yeah, I was just saying that on page 74, there's more for that street maintenance. So, yes. So, we're on to um number three. [51:18] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Discussion of parks committee request to amend city code. Um, anybody have any discussion on this? [51:30] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** The only thing is it's—it looks like there's a bunch of markup here. [51:34] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Oh yeah, he did a markup version and then he did—he did both versions which is nice. [51:50] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Um, what do we have to do to get this into like an act? I don't think it's a problem to do a first reading on this but let's just plan to get this into like an ordinance format for next... are you able to help with that, Alan, to put the— [51:55] **Alan (Acting Admin):** That's what I'll be doing. Yeah. So depending on if you guys approve this and we call it a first reading, we would have the final one come back and have a public hearing in December and presumably pass it. And I know I heard Al just like you did—it won't be a resolution. It'll be an ordinance. [52:16] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** I think he was—might have been referring to the summary publication. [52:20] **Alan (Acting Admin):** I don't know. "Al, pass a resolution and you're done." But pass second reading of the ordinance and that'll be it. [52:22] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Yep. We'll just do it. I just wanted—this is short enough. I'm not sure if it would benefit from a summary. [52:27] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Well, we'll figure it out. Okay. Just so long as—as we are all on the same page of that's what we're doing. [52:33] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** He did a nice job. [52:35] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** He did. Agreed. [clears throat] [52:37] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Yeah. I think this is about as spoon-fed as you can get from something. [52:39] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** So, what would you—what kind of action do we need to take on this tonight? [52:39] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** I think I would just uh move to call this the first reading of the ordinance as it's presented in your packet with the strikeouts—basically literally as presented—and direct staff to come back with the uh final version of it uh for second reading and order public hearing. [52:55] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** What he said. [53:01] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** I move to pass... Oh, I move to pass as a first reading the proposed amendments to section 804 Park Special Revenue Fund. [53:13] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Second and order public hearing. [53:13] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** And order public hearing. [53:15] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay, then I'll second that. Okay. All in favor? [53:17] **Councilmembers:** Aye. [53:17] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Opposed? Hearing none. Motion passes. So, you're all set with that, Alan? Do you need any of us to do anything with regards to that? [53:28] **Alan (Acting Admin):** No. If I do, I'll ask. And frankly, I can just call Al. I mean, that wouldn't be questions for you guys. [53:28] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay. I'm on to number four, which is discussion and possible authorization for seasonal road management, snow management. Um, Alan did a lot of work on this. Yep. So you can—you explain it? [53:47] **Alan (Acting Admin):** I [laughter] can take a stab at that. Uh, mayor and council of course we met on—I think it was the 28th of October. Talked a little bit about the snow uh management season and you saw somewhere in my uh materials that you're really buying insurance to make sure the snow goes away when you get it. So, as hard as it is to decide what uh what the season might bring for the snow company, it's even harder for you guys to decide what to bite on. And so, you made certain requests about what to um ask the—the company, and Birch and BrightView are good company. And so, they maintain a lot of people to make sure if we get a lot of snow, they're ready. And if they have minimal snow, somehow they keep these people busy and uh anticipating [snorts] more snow. The uh quote that you see there... um, well, my memo kind of teed that up to talk about what would happen if we actually moved to a 2-inch trigger. And of course, the trigger is when they will actually come out. The initial quote that you guys saw um which was a little eye-watering when you think about uh what it's going to cost, but at one inch, of course, you've got trucks and people deployed at what most people wouldn't even shovel their sidewalks over. So that seems a little bit excessive. Uh in talking with the people at the uh snow company, they said that there are people in Birchwood who will call them and even ask for service when there's less than that. But of course, you have to be fiscally responsible and think about, you know, what's reasonable in terms of value. And so that's why we have this quote for 2 in, which is still not that much snow, but certainly when it gets packed down, um it can create a problem later on in the winter. And so it makes sense to use that as a trigger. It just really does and it changes what you see. Um, based on the average that uh at least we used for kind of teasing out what it would look like for the season... uh, it is reasonable to assume that we'll get to a tier five which is you know basically right down the middle in terms of average. But you can also see what that actually does to your bid. You know the initial quote um at 1 in um if you're at tier one was like 53,000. And so now with a 2-inch trigger, you're at basically probably all the snow that we're going to get for just a hair over what that initial tier one was with a 1-inch trigger. And so the recommendation from staff, at least from my perspective, uh would be to authorize uh that um basically the contract as bid with a 2-inch trigger. And so we go from there. And those increment payments will start in December. And certainly it'll start at tier one and just move forward. And if we don't get that much snow, then that's where we stay. So— [56:38] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Was it one inch last year or was it two inches last year? [56:45] **Alan (Acting Admin):** It was one inch, apparently. [56:47] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** I—I do have seen BrightView come through when there's barely anything. [56:52] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Barely anything. Yeah. I mean, plus, you know, I asked them not to plow down to bare pavement. That just destroys the asphalt that we're putting down. [clears throat] So even at two inches, they would be plowing like an inch and a half. [57:04] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** They took out a lot of curbs last year. [57:08] **Alan (Acting Admin):** We have a plan for that. [57:08] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** I'm—I'm assuming that they um—when they're mentioning people calling to request service—they're only coming out if it's someone who has a purse string, right? Not like me. Well, I I'm a council member, so that's different. But I guess like let's say my neighbor calls in and says, "Hey, it's really icy." Are they coming out for that? [57:37] **Alan (Acting Admin):** As in servicing individuals and getting billed? [57:37] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** No. Oh, well, if that's—that's what they're doing, fine. But as far as like the—on behalf of the city— [57:49] **Alan (Acting Admin):** On behalf of the city, right? [57:49] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** On behalf of the city, right? That's what I'm making sure of, [laughter] right? [57:51] **Alan (Acting Admin):** They wouldn't—an—an average—your neighbor wouldn't be able to call the city's service and say, "Get out here." That would be reserved to someone on staff. [58:01] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Okay, good. So, I know occasionally like we get ice that gets on the hills portion and I'd be okay with them coming out and salting that in the event we had ice ice. But— [58:14] **Alan (Acting Admin):** And if we get calls, I mean, we would certainly call that in and they'd send someone out. I mean, they're a big enough group that they'll have folks out all day during a snow event. So, if something's missed or if they need to come back and do some cleanup, you know, that'd be something we'd order if we had someone call in. So, pretty typical. They were really good at that last year. And in fact, um, the Granicks sent a nice email about—that was good road service that they got last year. [58:34] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah, they're pros. I mean, they're nationwide, so I mean, they do this all over the place. So, they've kind of got it down to a science, which is how they can come up with this tiered pricing model in the first place. [58:42] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** So, when we're looking at this chart, we're saying it's going to be approximately $50—$55,000 for snow removal. [58:52] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Approximately. Yep. And I would uh you know you can authorize to move with that and if we have to go outside of budget then we can talk about that but let's hope that that doesn't happen until Marchish. Right. [59:04] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** So—all right. Did you clarify with them as far as um—like we were thinking I guess in our meeting—where it was... if you say in—in March we hit that 49.99—the end of that one. So then we had been paying the 55,130. If we get half an inch over and now we're at 50.1... Um, do we owe all the rest of that um between 55 and 63? So then we owe 63? [59:47] **Alan (Acting Admin):** I'm a little disappointed to answer your question by uh putting an aside in there. I wrote a memo that was supposed to go with this stuff, but I don't see it in here. [59:47] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Okay. [59:47] **Alan (Acting Admin):** So, I don't know what happened to it, but it explained exactly that. But since it's not here, let me explain it again. So, let's say we're at this $55,000 tier, and let's just drop it to 50 because it makes the math easier. So, over five months, the city signs up for this and it pays 10,000. It's invoiced 10,000 a month over the course of the season. And so, that assumes a certain level of service. If you go over that and you go to the next level or tier of service, then what they do is they send you a bill and you're at this new rate and let's say it's 70,000. So, it's 20,000 more divided by five months. So, that's 4,000 a month difference. And so, they'll send you a bill for the months prior to that trigger um basically to catch up. And then you pay that new amount for the balance of the—of the term. [1:00:43] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** So, we would be on—on—it would be the— [1:00:49] **Alan (Acting Admin):** So, it's odd because of course it's like, well, does it just jump up and now do we pay that annualized uh for those months? No, you catch up for whatever. So, that's the—that's the hard part about this, right? If you have a 24-inch Mother's Day blizzard, all of a sudden you can get thrust into a completely different uh tier and all of a sudden all that back stuff is due plus the last month. So, yeah, it's quite painful. If you get to that point and we're signed up for it, um I believe that once we sort of get beyond that 49.99, uh it would be time and materials at that point. [1:01:25] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Okay. Um, in the event we got 70 in, is that even a tier or is that we get it free? [laughter] [1:01:34] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Well, again, it becomes time and materials. So— [1:01:34] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Ain't nothing free. I assumed as much, but there wasn't another tier, so I wanted to check. [1:01:41] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Yeah. So, at that point, I mean, everyone's just happy when anyone shows up. [1:01:46] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** I would imagine. Yeah. And that's—they keep track of that with a modeling service that uh anonymizes it. So they're not out there with their measuring stick saying, "Yay, we made it." So there's a company that does that. It's a subscription model and it's basically using NOAA and other models to actually say this is exactly what you got here as opposed to using the number in—in the airport for example for the official number. So when I talk to Matt who's sort of our salesperson, uh they've got crews that go out and so they'll actually spot visit to say, "Hey, you know, because we do have some of these little pockets and it's very possible that Birchwood could get 2 in and Oakdale could get one." And so they've got folks out there and if they see that, they'll come out and—and work. So— [1:02:44] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Okay. [1:02:46] **Alan (Acting Admin):** And if you guys see something, call, email, whatever else and say, "It looks like we should have some snow service." And if we don't, then I can make the call. [1:02:54] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Do we get to call you as well if they come out too early? [1:02:54] **Alan (Acting Admin):** I would hope that they wouldn't do that. You know— [1:02:54] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** It did last year, so I'm curious. [1:03:00] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Yeah. Well, just watch it. [1:03:02] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Okay. [1:03:04] **Alan (Acting Admin):** So, I drive through here, too. So, chances are if it happened here, it happened in Dellwood. So, if I have that much snow and no one comes, then I would probably call in without anyone having to say anything. [1:03:19] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay. All right. Can I have a motion to approve the contract for BrightView um at the 2-inch trigger for snow removal? [1:03:25] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** So moved. [1:03:26] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Second. [1:03:28] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** All in favor? [1:03:28] **Councilmembers:** Aye. [1:03:28] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Opposed? Hearing none. Motion passes. Thank you guys. [1:03:32] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Thanks. Thank you. Oh, we got under the wire. So, uh, I did get a call from Matt and, [snorts] uh, just FYI, if anyone was biting fingernails, um, I did get the assurances that they would come out. So, if we had something happen, uh, they said just call, we'll assume something's going to go. So, we were not, uh, exposed without service. [1:03:51] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay. Number five, discussion on possible approval for process to allow limited access to public property, a licensure, and an update of the city parking code. Who would like to talk about this? [1:04:05] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Um, I guess I'm not quite sure. I think the limited license for public property probably should be visited as part of the item I'm going to add here. Um, I had written some parking code a long time ago to kind of revise it. One of the problems with our parking code is that we've kind of long had a policy that people can park on streets, but we've never actually had an ordinance that—overnight. We've never had an ordinance that allowed that people could get a parking permit. And so this kind of clarifies what is allowed and what's not allowed. Um, it's a lot more specific than the existing ordinance, clarifies winter parking and some things. Um, now having said that, I don't know what we want to do with this tonight. I'm happy to... I think there's a bigger picture here, which is what should we allow to be stored on city property? We have different rules for easements, different rules for parks, different rules for streets. Um, do we want to consider what should be allowed on private property? What are—um, you know, what we allow for storage in front yards, for example? And I—I went through and kind of based on what I know about the codes and—and just marked up all these sections that kind of cover this. So I think we have a couple of options tonight. One is we can pass the parking code and move forward to a second reading. Another option is I think we might want to just push this into a workshop and have kind of a council discussion on what we should do with stuff. What should we do with all of our Birchwood stuff? Um, and—and should we do just kind of some broadscale revisions because I don't—I don't think what we have works well for us. Um, so and I don't, you know, this is a long meeting. Um, are there preferences and if—if we want to have a lot of discussion, let's push that to a workshop. If people think, hey, the parking code is great and a good start and we're not going to have to revise it again, maybe we pass that. I'm kind of fine with whatever. Um, I'm also fine with let's just take this under advisement and look at it again in a couple weeks. [1:06:24] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** What do you recommend, Ryan? [1:06:26] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Uh, I think we should probably push it into a workshop and I think people should think... if you don't care, that's fine. Um, but I'm more than happy to go through and revise a whole bunch of ordinances if that's what we want to do. And I think it would be better to do is kind of one all-consuming thing, but you might just think about what your vision is for whether people should, for example, store trailers in their front yards. And what about construction materials? Just think about your vision there and then let's just push this into a workshop. I think that that would be probably my recommendation. You know, I think it needs to be fixed. I don't think it's that urgent. [1:07:07] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Do you think it needs to be fixed in December? Because picking a meeting or having a workshop in December is going to be a little bit of a challenge as far as— [1:07:15] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Well, I don't know that it needs to... I mean, if this sits for a couple months that's fine. Otherwise if people want to, that's fine. I'm not that worried. [1:07:23] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** I also don't want to tell people they can't store their boat or whatever in their—on their own property so I'm of the opinion— [1:07:31] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** We do currently tell them that. [1:07:33] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** They can't unless it's in the backyard? [1:07:36] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** We— [1:07:37] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** No, no, I know that portion but I mean as far as like this states it has to be an unobstructed view. If you take into account my property, I don't have any unobstructed view area. I'd have to put up a fence. [1:07:54] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** So that's—are you—what—what are you looking at here? Are you looking at— [1:07:57] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Um, just in general when I was reading the private property portion that I'm like this would be tough. [1:08:05] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** I'm hearing it's a longer discussion. We should push it to workshop. [1:08:12] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Like in January. [1:08:14] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** No, it—uh—we have to have a... Okay. So, are you saying that you would like to then talk about the 2026 road plan in January? [1:08:24] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** I think we have to have a workshop in December. [1:08:27] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** That's what I'm thinking because then Marcus, he needs to get on writing contracts and stuff. [1:08:31] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** But let's just—let's just push this to our next workshop, whether it's December or— [1:08:35] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Well, that's up to you guys, too. [1:08:39] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Whatever. Okay. So, you want to push it? Let's—let's push it and just because it sounds like Kathy wants to... I don't—I think that's great. Like, let's just start talking about— [1:08:50] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Okay. I do think it's work that should be done, but I don't think it needs to be done Decemberish. We could do it next year. [1:08:54] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Yeah. I—I—I'd like to get it done before um spring. [1:09:03] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** So, February. Let's do it in February. Well, I don't know about that, but this is before spring. Okay. Um, are we good then? Just moving this out. Then we move on to the next thing, which is what [snorts] the schedule. [1:09:16] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yep. Ryan, you want to talk about that? [1:09:20] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** So, fees, um, there's just a number of provisions to fees. The water, um, changes are incorporated into there. Um, one of the things that we're going—a lot of things are just kind of cost of living increases. Um, trying to keep the fees associated with the staff were kind of consistent with actually paying for the cost it takes to process them. One area of the fee schedule that's going up a little more significantly is conditional use permits, variances, and those—those things. Those are incredibly time consuming for um staff to do. Um and I think we had talked—Jen and I had talked a little bit about an arrangement where we actually make a payment to staff based on processing of variance um because of the—because of the work involved there. Um I think I think we expect to hash that out, but uh it's kind of a—a broad rambling overview. Um, I'm happy to entertain questions. [1:10:29] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** So, Ryan and I just sat down and went through all this together. Um, another change, I guess, what prompted it was the rental of this facility. Um, it was $25 for 24 hours. That doesn't even cover like lights, water, um, having someone come in and clean before and after. So that's kind of what prompted us to look through all of it. And then we needed to update our water and sewer fees anyway for 2026. So— [1:11:08] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** We needed to get rid of that chicken license and food license. [1:11:15] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** There will be no CD available for data requests. I'm so sorry. I don't have a CD burner anymore. [laughter] [1:11:21] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** They have to bring their own zip drive. [1:11:21] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Yeah. I—I do think we have to look and double check the water fees um one more time, but we can do that as part of the second reading to make sure we got everything right here. [1:11:30] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Okay. Yeah, you've passed those obviously through the resolution. [1:11:34] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Yeah, we—I pulled out the resolution. [1:11:41] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Yeah, we didn't get there yet. We—the passing—we're just going to skip the resolution because we'll do it here with the fee schedule. [1:11:47] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Yeah, that was the other thing that I told Shel too. So, no problem. [1:11:51] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Did you match what Shelley had for the fees in here? Okay, we have the numbers, so we'll just update it in the list. [1:11:56] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** I was surprised to see the boat slip permit fee go—the boat slip one—is that for individuals on their own property or is that through the dock association one? [1:12:06] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** But I don't know if we have to talk to the dock association about that first. [1:12:12] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** We don't. It says set and collected by dock association—dock association fees. [1:12:20] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Yeah. So that is—is there a liaison on that one? I don't remember. [1:12:24] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Me. [1:12:25] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** You are. Why don't you—why don't you talk to them between now and the second reading. [1:12:28] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay. [1:12:32] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** If it's—if it says "set by them" I'd like them to—they can set whatever they want for the annual boat slip permit fee. They charge a fee higher than the Birchwood fee. We set a fee and then they set a fee higher than that. So there's two fees there, but only one of them is a city fee. [1:12:56] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** I see. And the—this—the addition there is insurance and putting the docks in and out and so on. So— [1:13:02] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay. So what's our action on this then for the fee schedule? [1:13:06] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Let's pass it as a reading. Uh, are all the ones that you actually made changes to marked on here? [1:13:16] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** This—there's a new column—that new column—right, as the proposed fee. There are a couple things that are kind of struck through and those will get removed. [1:13:27] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** And then I did make some changes to correct some of the ordinance references, but I didn't really call those out because it's not necessarily germane to the consideration of the ordinance. [1:13:33] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Okay. So, like the demolition fee, that's one you're changing because it's in the sec—that other column, right? Okay. [1:13:46] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yep. Ryan made the motion to consider this the first reading. [1:13:50] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** I move to consider to adopt or to pass the fee schedule as a first reading and—and schedule a public hearing next month. [1:13:57] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Can we also put some language in that we're going to touch base with the dock committee? [1:14:04] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Um, uh, I further move to direct the mayor to— [1:14:10] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Can you direct the mayor? [1:14:11] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** No. No, I can direct her all I want. I mean I can direct her to do all— [1:14:15] **Alan (Acting Admin):** You mean can direct my wife too. It doesn't work. [laughter] [1:14:19] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** I—I—I further move to request that the mayor touch base with the dock association on the—on the fee increase. [1:14:33] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Can I have a second, please? [1:14:36] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Second. [1:14:38] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** All in favor? [1:14:39] **Councilmembers:** Aye. [1:14:39] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Opposed? Hearing none. Motion passes. [1:14:47] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Are we significantly under um—underwater on our... because we have a lift station replacement fee or is that for a— [1:14:57] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** That's capital improvement-esque kind of. [1:14:57] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Okay. Oh, good. [laughter] [1:15:03] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** That's what it is. Yep. That's exactly what it is. Going into the sewer fee. The sewer fee is going—and that's the one that's on with the water. [1:15:15] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Not sewer fee. The water fee is for— [1:15:18] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** It's the one she mentioned. Okay. Sometime in our future. All right. Um, lake outfall... that was struck for number seven, we removed. Number eight is the discussion of the workshop. If you want to wait until January to talk about the um 2026 road plan, that would be fine. I'm sure Marcus wouldn't mind. He's scrambling to get all that together, but um—up to you guys, but I would like to have a workshop either January... Is he requiring a workshop to be able to apply for that grant? [1:16:03] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Okay. [1:16:05] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** It's just—he and I have been working up two scenarios on how we could use the money that's already set aside for 2026 for the roads and we want to get council, you know, obviously get your opinions on it before we move forward. [1:16:14] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Can we do December 2nd? Can people do it? [1:16:21] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** I can. [1:16:25] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** I would be fine with it. [1:16:34] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Always me. My schedule sucks every—every day. So— [1:16:38] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Do you want to— [1:16:40] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Um I would like to be there on that one because I have thoughts about people putting stuff if we're including that in the workshop. I don't think I can make it on the second since I'm uh not in town until— [1:16:54] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay, that's um— [1:17:05] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Late that night. [1:17:08] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Would we want to do a long one on the 9th and front end the truth and taxation? [1:17:15] **Alan (Acting Admin):** I think we have to front end that one—that meeting anyway though because we have the... what's that group that comes in for the truth and taxation? Yeah, it's going to be a long one regardless. So you're going to have your delinquency... [1:17:30] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** We have—we have to come in early for that one, right? [1:17:30] **Alan (Acting Admin):** 6:15 is what we talked about truth and taxation or did we talk about 6:00? Yeah, I think it was 6 to 6:30 and then—yeah. [1:17:39] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** So it's not terribly long, but if you want to actually front end um a workshop, I think you should dedicate a couple of hours to that between the roads and the parking. [1:17:50] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** I think I'd prefer to push it to January if we can. Okay. [1:18:00] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay. Um, do you want to schedule that now before—before everything goes... Okay, that would be fabulous if we could get that. Uh, how does January 6 sound? [1:18:18] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** I hate doing this without—Is there anything—any legal holidays on January 6? Don't think so. I know. Omology. [laughter] That would make total sense that you do. [1:18:31] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** What time were you thinking? 6:00, 6:30. [1:18:34] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** 6:30 I can get here. Okay. [1:18:34] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** All right. 6:30. [snorts] Thank you. [1:18:41] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Okay. So, let's just keep it to the roads and the storage or whatever. [1:18:41] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah. I want to add an item on Halls Marsh for the sixth. [1:18:48] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Yep. Roads, Halls Marsh, and um—what was this? Parking. [1:18:53] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Parking. Roads, parking, and Hall's Marsh. Mhm. [1:19:09] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Okay. [1:19:09] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay. Thank you. And that's 6:30. Yes. Um... okay, let's go back to what we pulled out and see, which is resolution authorizing water and sewer rates. [1:19:25] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Ryan, um, long story short, we just passed it already, so let's just skip it. [1:19:35] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** You just didn't want to pass it in the consent agenda before we did the— [1:19:41] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** No, we can't revise fees by resolution. No, we're not allowed to. We just passed an ordinance revising fees. So there's no need to pass the resolution. If you want a longer explanation, I can give you one. [1:19:56] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** That's okay. Thank you, Ryan. [laughter] We're just going to go with that. All right. Uh, G, acceptance of bid from Woodchuk and approval of payment in the amount of 19,800 for tree removal in Poly's Park. [1:20:05] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** So here's my question as I read that. I mean, I love the idea that we're getting rid of those trees. Um, but I think about the storm damage that we had and all the trees that fell over and knocked the lines down and would we be better off using that money to take those at-risk trees out so we minimize that kind of event again. [1:20:45] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Isn't that what Excel was doing though? [1:20:53] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Isn't that what Excel was doing? Excel only does the ones that power lines go through. Yeah. So they—they will only do the ones with power lines in them, but it's not necessarily the ones across the street or— [1:20:58] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** So it's just—I just raised the question. I don't know. I think—it's kind of rob Peter to pay Paul—like they all need to come down. [1:21:10] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** They do. And this is just a start. I—I'm not sure where we are on our tree budget honestly. I think we spent it. [1:21:13] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** I don't think we spent the 15 at all because— [1:21:15] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** So, this would go... hasn't done any of it. Yeah. Already. Correct. It would be 4,800ish over because I think we did 15,000. [1:21:15] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah, we did do 15,000. But— [1:21:44] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** But I—I do agree we might want to address the ones along the road. Um, not that I don't want Poly's Park to be addressed but— [1:21:55] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Well, this is what we have the quote for though. We don't have the quote for anything on the road. [1:21:55] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Yeah, I don't—I guess I would just let Excel do that. I mean, and I think we need to revisit the Excel situation, but I guess to me if we—we run a risk there of doing work that Excel would do, I'm going to pay them to do work they would do for free. [1:22:07] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** And the other thing—I don't—I'm not disagreeing with you, but when I think back to those trees that did come down over the road, they weren't dead. [1:22:12] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Yeah, they're all live trees. Yeah, that's true. That was the weird thing about it. [1:22:17] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** I was moving all the leaves on, right? Same. [laughter] I just thought about that like, oh my gosh. Um, it's hard to predict which ones are going to come down. [1:22:31] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Can we—can—is that negotiable? That quote? Wanting to do up to 15,000—$15,000 worth of trees because that's—that's what we budgeted, right? [1:22:42] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah, I'd be okay with the 15,000. A lot of things though this year... what do you—what's your—what's your concern? [1:22:50] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** It's my concern is I think that oftentimes tree removal companies will remove the trees if you tell them how much money you have to spend on the trees. So like, "I have $15,000 and I need these trees removed." [1:23:05] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** How many quotes? [1:23:07] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** You get a couple quotes. [1:23:09] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Yeah. Birch and Woodchuk. I mean on the other hand, street sweeping companies will stop after they hit your budget, which I mean I'm—I guess I'm okay if we—if we do the 15,000 of trees gets removed and then we have to go back and get a couple more later if we need to. [1:23:30] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** The thing is is like—what he was explaining to me—they come in with big equipment. So, you're having them come back out the second time with this equipment. It's—it's not cost-effective, but— [1:23:45] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** I mean, we're going to spend more on um—we spent more last year on quite a bit. I'm not sure that we're above that in the red already. What do you mean—as far as overall budget? As far as what we had budgeted for various things, I know we were uh higher on snow plowing. We were like... there were other... so I don't know that us being lower on like the road budget and things like that was offset to the point of where we have extra money. [1:24:15] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Well, I'd like to take trees down. Need to get trees. [1:24:19] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Any tree down is good. I was just raising. Should we—should we focus on the others? [1:24:32] **Alan (Acting Admin):** And if I may, since it is winter, it's a great time to take trees down. Yes, it is. And so this bid is about 20 grand. And so if you had to winnow it down, I think I would ask Woodchuk to present another bid and see just how much of that needs to be done with the crane truck with the big equipment because your move fees are going to be substantial. And so if you can get that out of the way and do some of the other stuff with just climbers or you know other equipment without having to bring in big equipment, if you are going to split hairs, that's the way I'd split it if you're price-sensitive. [1:25:08] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** I would just do the whole thing. It's only another $4,000 done. I mean, I'm just saying if you have to do it again and they miss one, it's going to cost a fortune to bring in that truck for just a couple of trees. So, you're getting 36 of them done. So— [1:25:27] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** I was going to add more to this. I was going to ask you guys for a cap if we could cap it out at like 21,000 and then have the—there's two huge ones on Wildwood. Um, what is that, Ryan? Wildwood Park there. [1:25:38] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Oh, there's—yeah, Wildwood Park. [1:25:41] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Those need to come down. [1:25:43] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Really? Probably needs to be addressed, right? So, actually, I was going to ask for more than this and have those two added. It's really bad, too. And I'm—I'm surprised that Excel hasn't taken that. [1:25:56] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** They're so backed up on tree removal, though, that they're super slow. Like unless the tree is— [1:26:01] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Just have Woodchuck come out and like cut a bunch of them right into the power line so Excel takes care. Right. [1:26:08] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Can we authorize—So, if we authorize $20,000 for—and I'll negotiate to get the biggest bang for our buck—for—for Jen to use at her discretion for tree removal. Would that be okay? [1:26:28] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** I'd second that, I guess. [1:26:28] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah. Okay. All right. So, I move to authorize up to $20,000 um for tree removal to be—to be dispensed or to be authorized at the mayor's discretion. Um, the mayor along with the acting city administrator's discussion. [1:26:47] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Mayor does not act unilaterally on anything. [1:26:50] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Well, I mean, I think what—okay, fine. I make it seriously. [1:26:52] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Can you amend the motion to— [1:27:01] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** I amend the motion to say whatever Jen said. I got it. Thanks. Thanks. [1:27:07] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** All right. Thank you guys. I just want to get moving on this because I know a lot of us want some dead trees down and we didn't do any. I mean, Jim and Ron have been working, but um I think they've taken down maybe between 10 and 15. [1:27:23] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Just over 22, the two of them. [1:27:23] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah, that's pretty good for two people. [1:27:27] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Let's get a vote before minds change. [1:27:27] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay, let's—all—okay. [laughter] Any more discussion? Did we get a second? [1:27:32] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** I thought you did. [1:27:32] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Oh, there wasn't a second. [1:27:34] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Bridget second. [1:27:36] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Um, all in favor? [1:27:38] **Councilmembers:** Aye. [1:27:38] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Opposed? Hearing none. Motion passes. Thanks, Ryan. Um, oh, what was the next one? L... [1:27:48] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** I'm sort of a Grinch on this. I love this paid leave program. I'm so glad it's going to be implemented in Minnesota, but I don't think that we need to pay the full premium. I think that we should do it like I think everybody else is doing and have the employee pay their portion and the um city pay its portion. [1:30:13] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Is that how it's generally being done? [1:30:17] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Yes. Then I would do it the way it's—um, there was some—can you tell—tell them why we thought... [1:30:19] **Alan (Acting Admin):** I would simply offer that the the increment is so small it's really not worth it just because there's such a small bench in Birchwood. So it really amounted like a couple hundred. [1:30:33] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yes. It was like $300 and the accounting work is a—is much more difficult if um we split it. Um, did you have discussions with Marsha on that? [1:30:45] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Yeah, we—we all did basically in the office. So that's why the recommendation is just to cover it because again it's just such a small number. [1:30:45] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** 300 a year? [1:30:57] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah. [1:30:59] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Yeah. I mean literally it's that... I'm not going to say it's peanuts because to some people that's a lot of money, but um for the administration of it just to parse that out is just not worth it. [1:31:07] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Um I was wrong. It's 436 total for the year. Well, small business is 872.97, employee 50/50. Is that right, Alan? Make sure I'm reading this correctly. [1:31:18] **Alan (Acting Admin):** That much per employee. [1:31:22] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Says currently the city of Birchwood Village has eight employees in the previous five quarters. The city is classified as a small business, meaning the premiums would be due at the 66% rate. [1:31:26] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** We count as employees if you're wondering how that works. [1:31:36] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Oh, we pay in? We pay into this even though we don't qualify for— [1:31:40] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Gifters pay into it. [1:31:42] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Everybody pays in. So, if we wanted to request our tax money back, we're welcome to do that for our—what is it like 33 cents or whatever it would be. Um, let's see. I'm just trying to read through this not to make sure I'm not—but is—is that per month, per year? [1:32:04] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** That's total per year is four-something. [1:32:06] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** So [snorts] she put "township," but I'm pretty sure she means the city. If the city pays 100%, it would cost us $872.97. If the city pays 50 and lets the employee pay 50, we're talking 436. So yeah, it's going to cost us an extra 436. [1:32:27] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** If we just pay 100%—per employee? [1:32:30] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Total. Total. Oh, total... $436 total if we cut. [1:32:42] **Alan (Acting Admin):** That's on the basis of 130... we'll say 132,000 in gross. [1:32:46] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Okay. Yeah. Okay. So, it's really not that much. I think time saved is— [1:32:51] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Yeah. If it's time saved, that's fine. [1:32:53] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah. I wasn't in on that entire discussion with Marsha, but she was mentioning the accounting end of it. If we do 100% it's way easier. I don't know. Do you remember any details on that? What was the detail part? [1:33:04] **Alan (Acting Admin):** What Marsha was talking about um—the accounting end of it? Well, simply that it's the drudgery of having to keep those things separate and so what you lose in efficiency you might gain. But uh it's kind of a wash. [1:33:13] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** I take that question back. I don't need to be a Grinch. [1:33:19] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Well, someone can move it then as it is. [1:33:24] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** So moved. [1:33:25] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** I'll second. [1:33:28] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** All in favor? [1:33:28] **Councilmembers:** Aye. [1:33:28] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Who got credit for the motion? [1:33:33] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Kathy. [1:33:34] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Kathy. And the second? [1:33:36] **Alan (Acting Admin):** I—Ryan. [1:33:39] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah. All in favor? [1:33:41] **Councilmembers:** Aye. [1:33:41] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Opposed? Hearing none. Motion passes. Count as Ryan senior. How do we differentiate? [laughter] [1:33:44] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Hankins is fine. [1:33:44] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** I don't—I don't think I've earned seniority yet. [1:33:49] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** About um—our balance sheet. Mhm. Do we have any idea where we're going to end up by the end of the year? I—I can't figure it out. I mean, I'm looking. They make no sense to me. [1:34:00] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Bridget, I am so glad you said that. This is what's going to happen. [1:34:10] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** That's what I tell my husband all the time. I'm like, you know, I—I—I'm not—I don't think I'm an idiot, but man, I just look at this stuff and say... [1:34:21] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** I think what makes it difficult is that um—a lot of our expenses are seasonal. So [snorts] like when we come up to... we can't really plan. I mean we can assume based on history what the year is going to end up like. We can't really have a final figure on anything. [1:34:35] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Like I told you before like I feel like I need the T-account. [1:34:58] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** I guess one of the things... you know, I need the—one of the things I've thought for a while and I'm not 100% certain, but I think if you plotted our—our fund balances year after year, even though we budget for what we think we are, I think we gradually are increasing the amount of funds we have in the bank. So, I think we generally underspend our budgets. Now, maybe I'm wrong, but it sure looks that way. [1:35:10] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Well, part of that is that we had money set aside for things like the lift station that is—was banked, per se, but yeah, overall I think we still have—we kept money in the bank, whatever we call it, and then interest on that... a little higher because we wanted to... we were concerned that for example, the lift station grant could go away. So, we wanted to um—it—it might be worth just... hate to commit to it because I'm just um... it might be worth just doing a couple plots, but last time I promised that I didn't manage. So um— [1:35:54] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** But could Marsha come and talk to us or provide? [1:35:54] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Agreed. Yeah, absolutely. That seems—that seems really smart. [1:35:54] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** An overview of what it is she's seeing? Plus, we're straight-lining the budget rather than putting costs in the months that we think that they're going to occur. [1:36:06] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** That's true. Which then can come back and bite us. [1:36:10] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** That's true. I don't know this budget. I look at it every time. It's like I don't know. [1:36:15] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** It—I think it—it does seem to me like having Marsha come in and just giving us a—having you ask her questions with everybody here so we can all hear and understand. It sounds like a really good idea to me. [1:36:30] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Is she coming to our—even a workshop? [1:36:40] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Yeah. Uh and then as a general practice every month for her to have her sort of editorial on what she's seen compared to last year compared to— [1:36:50] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** We used to just get some treasurers notes every month. Mary Cahill did a great job of that. [1:36:52] **Alan (Acting Admin):** That's pretty typical to see more of a—of a year-to-date snapshot. At least that's what I'm used to seeing just because how do you know where you're going if you don't know where you are? If you want, I can have her come in in December. It's a good time to actually have that discussion. [1:37:09] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Well, we have the—the meeting anyway for— [1:37:13] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah. Truth and taxation. [1:37:15] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Be good to have her here for that if at all possible. [1:37:21] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Yeah. Be good for our next council meeting. [1:37:23] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah. Because we have to approve the budget, correct? In December. [1:37:25] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** But like if we're way under this year, then doesn't that impact our budget for next year? I would think it would, but I don't know if we are way under. That's why I'm wondering. [1:37:42] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** Yeah, I don't know for sure. I don't know that we're way under. It just feels to me like I mean, having read the budgets for a number of years that the city budgets... the amount in the accounts would max out at 600 and then it would max out at 700. Now we're up over 1.1, 1.2 million. And that may not—may partly just be because our budgets are going up, but it definitely seems like we budget for what we expect to spend and yet the money in the account keeps going up, which—I'm going with. [1:38:08] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** No, it should invest—kind of stay even, right? [1:38:12] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** If you budget for savings, [clears throat] you should have savings in the amount you budgeted but— [1:38:22] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Well, I mean, we do have it in investments though, too. So, I would hope that they are doing well enough to get us some, but yeah, we— [1:38:26] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** We get three—3% interest and that, you know, that's 30 grand a year. So, that's something. [1:38:28] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Well, let's start by having Marsha come in next month. I think that would be great. Alan, would you be able to invite her? [1:38:41] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Yeah, I think she'll be here anyway, but I'll ask her to at least have her uh—be prepared for us because I thought I was the only one that when I look at some of these things, I'm just like... I just don't really know. [1:38:51] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** I had done that um where you go into the office and then sit with the accountant and go through them and even after that I was like—still I'm not quite sure but it looks lovely. I mean the numbers look good. I don't see anything, you know, nothing's in the red—important part. [1:39:09] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** That's what I keep looking. I'm like, that bottom line looks really good to me. So— [1:39:15] **Alan (Acting Admin):** The checks were bouncing but it wasn't the budget. [laughter] Okay Ryan. Is there anything else? [1:39:27] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** All right, so our December 9th city council meeting... uh, I'm on to announcements. Will feature the truth and taxation hearing as well as a public hearing with delinquent utility bills. [1:39:41] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Before you get that far, should we approve the balance sheet? [1:39:44] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Oh, that was the ask under M. [1:39:46] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Oh, we pulled it out. Good. I move to approve the balance sheet and the disbursements. [1:39:51] **Councilmember Ryan Eisele:** And the disbursements. [1:39:55] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** All in favor? [1:39:56] **Councilmembers:** Aye. [1:39:57] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Opposed? Hearing none. Motion passes. Thank you. Thanks for the reminder. You okay? Announcements. Um, as I was saying, the December 9th city council meeting will feature the truth and taxation hearing as well as a public hearing regarding delinquent utility bills and certifications. [1:40:22] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** What is that? That second one: public hearing regarding delinquent utility bills. [1:40:22] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** So that's when um [snorts] what is the group that comes in? I don't know what the tax... was it Washington County? [1:40:40] **Alan (Acting Admin):** That's not this. This is um—actually water bills. Yeah, the public—it's just for delinquent water bills, utility billings. So, sorry, I was thinking it was—hearing goes on and then it goes to—gets reported to the county and then it gets assessed to the taxes. [1:40:50] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** The letters have already gone out to residents who are passed through on their water bills. So, they've had notice so they get a time period to either pay or come in—dispute basically it—and then after that it goes to the county for collections. So, it requires a public hearing. The truth and taxation one is the one where the gentlemen come in and talk about people's taxes and people have complained about as far as their values of the... um, number two. The city may have a short special meeting to approve the hire of another administrative support person prior to the December meeting and discuss... okay. So we still might have to have a meeting. Um, interviewing is beginning next week. [1:41:35] **Alan (Acting Admin):** Yep. Um—Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday. I think Tuesday. I don't know. There's at least two of them. They're scheduled for Tuesday. I don't know how many total there are, but uh—for Monday and Wednesday. With any luck at all, we'll have someone surface by the end of next week. So, might require a special meeting just to approve the hire. Mhm. [1:42:05] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Um, just—I don't know if we've talked about this or if it was at a meeting that I... Yeah, you guys approved Teresa's sister when I wasn't here. Correct. That's working out really well. [1:42:21] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Um, replacement for that. [1:42:22] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Okay. She doesn't want to work— [1:42:27] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Well, that makes sense. [1:42:27] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Regular, just a sub. [1:42:30] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yes. I was gonna say she was doing us a favor of sorts. Yeah, she liked it. Um, so the newsletter submissions is the 19th. That would be enough time. Thank you. Okay. Um, oh, yeah. And then the power outage um on November 20th. It's a larger scope than just Birchwood Lane and Wildwood. I think it's going to be Avenue. City Hall's closed because... so we'll have to see how that goes. Do we have any residents along there that um—because it is winter... where are they going to go if it gets too cold if the power is out here? [1:43:24] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Let's look at the 10-day. [1:43:24] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Um I don't know, but it's only from—it's supposed to be 9 to 1. [1:43:30] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Shall I check the weather report? It looks to me like that tree down there will probably not take four hours. It would probably take— [1:43:37] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Yeah, it would take the morning, but—yeah, I—I expect... I mean we can refer people to the library or something. It seems to me like— [1:43:39] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** I don't think it's supposed to be frigidly cold yet. [1:43:41] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** I was going to say 40, 45. [1:43:41] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay. Um, I would think that XL sends out something that says your power's going to be out, too. [1:44:00] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** You can send people to my house and I'll start a fire. [1:44:03] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Okay. Oh, I have a tree to burn. [laughter] All right. Um, number five is, uh, city staff evaluations are going to be completed within the next month and the city hall will be closed for Thanksgiving. I do want to um read this nice little thank you note if you would let me. Um, I just got it tonight from Alan Mitchell: "The City of Birchwood Village, please accept this donation toward the new netting being installed on the hockey rink at Ty Schmidt. This enhancement will help prevent pucks from flying over the boards and potentially hitting walkers, cars, and garages. Most of all, the skaters will benefit the most and will appreciate not having to search the street for lost pucks. Thank you for all you do." And that's from Jerry and Jackie Carlson at [snorts] 409 Lake. And then they included a donation for the netting. [1:44:54] **Councilmembers:** Thank you. [1:44:56] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** This is very nice. Um, is there anything else anybody would like to announce? I was hoping to have the date of the holiday party. Um, we're having our meeting on Monday, so I will have it later for an email at some point for the December children's and—or other party. Um, I also have worked up a—um an order form for Birchwood Gear. [1:45:15] **Councilmembers:** Yay. [1:45:21] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** So, maybe when I get it just right... I've been pricing it and things, I'll send it out to you guys and maybe we can include it in the newsletter. Okay. I want to get everybody's opinion before I do that. [1:45:33] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** And then, um, have a display at the holiday— [1:45:41] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** You sure? [laughter] [1:45:41] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** Yeah, that'd be good. Have a display... at the holiday party if you can turn around orders quick enough where you can— [1:45:48] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** I'm not ordering anything until we get the like— [1:45:51] **Councilmember Bridget Sperl:** No, no, I mean as far as like the—the samples. I can take pictures. [1:45:52] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** If we have samples at the holiday party and someone wants it for a gift. [1:45:52] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Oh, I see. Depending on how quickly you can turn that around. I can try. I don't know when the date is. It might be really soon. I—I'll see what I can do. Um, I think that was it though. Okay. Anything else? Are we done? [1:46:27] **Councilmember Kathy Weier:** Move to adjourn. [1:46:30] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Oh, can I have a second on that? [1:46:33] **Councilmember Ryan Hankins:** Second. [1:46:36] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** All in favor? [1:46:36] **Councilmembers:** Aye. [1:46:37] **Mayor Jennifer Arsenault:** Thank you everyone once again. Lovely to work with you.