[Music] hereby call to order the Roseville Economic Development Authority meeting for Monday September 16th 2024 uh Mr executive director would you call the role please member gra here member St here member here I'm here and president Ro here all right and with us at the de we have our City attorney Rachel Tierney who is uh going to attempt to handle Eda questions this evening no doubt uh and also our city manager Pat treen who is also the executive director of the Eda we have a number of staff and guests who are participating this evening and we'll make those introductions as agenda items come up I would note for both the Eda meeting and the council meeting uh if you'd like uh to see any of the meeting materials and you haven't got them available to you online uh you can certainly access a paper copy that we've got one complete copy of all the meeting materials in the back of the meeting uh Council chamber under the Big Clock uh we also have extra copies of the meeting agenda uh available for the public as well so you can follow along uh we ask if you have a cell phone to make sure that you silence it or otherwise assure that it doesn't disrupt the meeting and with that we'll ask folks to stand if you're able for the Pledge of Allegiance I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all be back next on our agenda this evening uh for the Eda is to consider approving tonight's agenda we just have the two business items this evening so I'm imagining there's probably not a lot of changes that are going to be suggested at this point move approval all right second it's been moved by council member at second by council member St or I should say board member at and board members joh to approve tonight's agenda for the Eda as presented all those in favor signify by saying I hi I post that passes unanimously we have our agenda this evening uh we'll uh delay public comment to the start of the council meeting as we usually do with Eda meetings at the start of the evening uh that allows us to get right into our business items uh and our first business item this evening item uh six excuse me item 5A is to consider entering into a Professional Services agreement with stantech to conduct a housing needs assessment for the city uh and with us this evening we have our housing and economic development uh director coordinator uh program manager program manager I for Genie Kelsey to introduce this item this evening thank you president roow and board members um for your consideration last meeting that you had we did bring forward to you six different variety of proposals for a market study and we made recommendation as to one of them that really addressed all the things that you had given us guidance on um their hence we have stantech um tonight for for you um there was a couple of questions that staff could not answer and so we did bring them in and I'm going to turn it over to them they do have just a couple slides that they wanted to go through with you as it will answer some of the questions that you did have from the last meeting so we'll bring Tom Leighton and also Spencer Cox from stanta thank you Genie you're welcome pleasure to be with you tonight thank you for inviting us um just quick introduction my name is Tom Leighton I've been with stantech five or six years prior to that I was uh doing consulting on my own since 2012 and prior to that I was a city planner with the City of Minneapolis for 15 years um Spencer and I are part of a um a business unit within stantech that called development economics and we provide services uh really were the lead Business Center for development economics for stanch in the US uh provides services to projects all across the US in that regard including housing studies Economic Development strategies we support planning studies with with Market studies um and other services um based a lot of our work on familiarity with what the development Community needs in order to do the kind of development interventions you may want in different communities so that's a little bit about about what we do uh Spencer want to say sure or two about yourself thanks for having me I'm Spencer Cox uh I've been with stantech for two years um kind of an economist and data scientist role and before that I finished a PhD at the University of Minnesota in geography uh mostly economic and urban geography um yeah so I've been working with Tom now for the past two years in a supportive role in in a lot of these housing studies and happy to be here today thank you so we had the opportunity to watch your previous meeting and and just really appreciated the discussion um so as as Jeanie said we just want to um give a very high level overview of the way we approach these and then go to our calendar uh to let you know how we see this playing out and the points in the process at which uh we see involving you and getting and bringing a product to you and getting your feedback to to sharpen um the analysis and the strategies for your benefit there we go um this just a slide that shows the you know a a collection of headlines on how housing issues are just pressing uh in all parts of the country these days I just thought I'd um illustrate a little bit about where we're working you can see it's a wide Geographic range it's it's wide also in terms of rural communities to urban communities as you know we were we've worked in sheview New Brighton vness Heights some smaller cities in Minnesota and and locations as large as the Indianapolis metropolitan area this is really the one slide where I want to just note the two areas that we have felt a responsibility to develop very sharp practices around and I and I think that that we feel like we bring to you and we bring to other communities the one is that housing studies tend to lean heavily on information that's somewhat out of date because sensus data is on the average four years old uh and um and so we've developed some ways to both be more thorough in in our analysis of housing conditions in a community and more current by being act be able being able to access multiple data sources and bring those together in in a more sophisticated way that lets us understand in a more real-time sense what your housing gaps are what and what the needs are based on your inventory and your demographics so we've done a lot of work on our analysis uh I think we've got some processes that are unique in the region the other thing that that we feel is unique in the way we approach this is that we we have really emphasized the solution side the strategy side of this a lot of the Market analysts um give primary focus to the numbers and telling you here's some demand numbers for different types of housing products we have developed a practice where we really tee up a set of strategies that once we understand your needs that you can consider because they will in one way or another they are appropriate for addressing those needs and then we can prioritize those with you we can refine the ones that that you think um are a best for this community so we have worked very hard on the um on the strategy side as well this one is going to be a little hard to read but this is our overall project calendar and and what I'll point you to um is the overview level if you'll look on the second um row of the Rapport you'll see there's a kickoff phase we'll be out here driving around your community looking at the housing inventory talking to people about the needs there's an analytical phase where we really do drill down and understand your demographics your economics the housing market context um the supply um and put those together into uh a sharp understanding of the the gaps and the needs some of this is also you know what we learned from stakeholders what we learn from you what we learn from talking to developers uh and then that builds into our um strategies research so that happens and as I sort of suggest gested earlier that happens in two phases um and this is where the some of the homelessness strategies that you're particularly interested fit in we um we look at Best Practices we have a library of best practices already that have worked in other communities some of which may be appropriate here and we tea up often times 10 12 15 strategies to bring back to you and discuss with you um and really look to your input for these are the ones that I think are the best fit for for us and I would like to see a little more research on this or a little more research on that we do a second round and sort of finalize that as a menu of strategies that you know that belong in your um strategic agenda so that's the strategies phase um and again as I suggested it it involves conversation with you when we bring up those ten of strategies and I know there's expertise on this on this uh board in terms of Housing and housing strategies so we'll look forward to talking to you about that and then the Final Phase is the document phase so that's how it plays out if you look at the um row 2.1 we uh have and row 2.3 those rows will be combined so we like to work with a an advisory panel a group of stakeholders so that we have that sounding board and and I understand that that um your staff feel that you want to be engaged at that level so we will be seeing you as that Advisory Board and coming to you when we finished our analysis to discuss that with you coming to you when we finished our initial um uh in or uh list of inventory of strategies to discuss those with you and then coming to again at the end of the um at the end of the study to um to get any further feedback you have so those are the touch points we have envisioned for you um Miss Kelsey has already told us that these may not perfectly align with your board calendar so we're that's fine we'll we'll just adjust it so that it it makes sense uh with your existing calendars so um I think with that I'll I'll pause and and that's kind of the overview of how we see this playing out and would be very happy to take questions about about the material that we've presented or about anything anything else that you want to talk about in with regard to how we we approach these right thank you very much uh one thing just note too just at least from my perspective is certainly we could conceivably have a special Eda meeting on the evening of one of our Council meetings if the agendas work out okay if that fits better with the schedule I don't know that we need to strictly stick to what the pre-planned Eda meetings are if we need to make some adjustments there and we can certainly have those conversations between staff and the and the board and and the Consultants as appropriate but I did want to just note that that certainly we can we can add some flexibility in there as as we need to because the council meets two to three times a month and so we we've got those dates where we're all going to be here anyway we might as well see if it if if it works if we need to do that in the schedule right uh questions from uh members of the Eda board for the consultant uh member Aton thank you for being here and I kind of explaining some things as you look at this uh homelessness question really as we try to explore how we can interact with it I think one of the big questions is what can a city like Roseville do uh versus Minneapolis Indianapolis whatever um so do you feel like as you look at you said you have collection of strategies you already have best practices there will be a number of things that can work for a midside Suburban City versus some of these bigger Urban cores with larger staffs and other resources that we may not have yeah I want to first um that's a great question and i' like to respond to it more in terms of our process in terms of how we develop that menu of strategies but I want to recognize that you've got some really important foundation that you've already established here your I think your tenant notification ordinance is is really helpful I know you've got uh staff that that are dedicated to reaching out to homeless individuals so you've got a really um helpful Foundation I was um I was mapping this out conceptually before the meeting and um and I we can think about homelessness as address adding a population that is already unhoused and in that sense we've got strategies that relate to building structures of various kinds that they can move into and strategies that related to connecting them with Services Upstream of that we have our homeless prevention strategies right and some of those may be regulatory uh again they may be um program atic or service provision and there there's a sort of a a universe of parties that are bringing some of those to the table already none of this answers your question yet about where does Roseville plug in Upstream of that yet I think are a really important set of strategies that we shouldn't take lightly and that is um providing a stable foundation for families in ways that you know are are super important strong education system connected back to families you know food availability so some of the I would say some of those may be strategies that you may want to consider just in terms of providing a fundamental um you know fundamental um floor foundation for stability So within that the way that that we would think about bringing you strategies to consider in some of those different areas is number one you know literature riew and talking to peers um to develop a set of case studies but beyond that there are people who are in this Arena who will have Smart answers to a question that put to them that asks how what are some ways you've thought of that a local government can make your job easier or can fill a hole that you sometimes see is is unattended to so we would plan to have that conversation with providers with your Outreach you know homelessness Outreach coordinator with with other folks that are in this Arena and I think through those two mechanisms then we can bring you at those different tiers a set of you know possible activities or programs or actions that you can engage in thank you yeah that's better than a simple answer great uh member schroer uh yes um thank you for being here um I wanted to ask you about the um in your um attachment one here under the work plan um um you're talking about stakeholder and developer interviews and I guess I'd like to hear one um who would the stakeholders be and how would we go about identifying the correct group of people to involve in this in this part of the study I imagine that there's insights in this group that could fairly quickly outline a set of stakeholders related to housing needs that relate to the things that you're doing in Roseville so that's that's one set one of the reasons that we emphasize developer interviews is because we know you're not hiring us just to you know address this area that you're keenly interested in you're interested in understanding sort of the the array of housing needs and gaps in Roseville and housing that can be housing types excuse me that can be attracted to Roseville to um to to meet those needs and and we we find that through some you know objective analytical processes we can we can learn some things about those gaps and understand the market to some degree but a in many of those strategies you're trying to attract a certain development type and your deeper insights and more direct insights are going to come from developer ERS who are building that type of developer development type who can say okay if we're doing sort of this a missing middle housing format at you know or smaller format apartments or whatever the case may be in this area that may or may not be attractive to us to do on a strictly Market basis you know it you may need to provide some incentives for that or or what they can give us sort of a more nuanced idea about the availability of that of attracting that development type to rosevi so we we do with the with the types of housing that we determine you know would meet needs here it'll include some affordable housing types and and other things we will be talking to developers who will Who will be able to um inform our thinking about what it would take to attract that that kind of development to Roseville and I know you're already getting some development complete organically and we we don't have the complete background in terms of which development projects are receiving some City support and which ones aren but but that'll all be part of what we want to understand so who would the other stakeholders be besides the developers well I I assume it it would be um people who are providing homelessness Services some of your staff that's working in that area um I don't other other things aren't coming to mind yeah there's urban planners that are really useful in terms of understanding how housing fits into comprehensive plans um it's really important to provide or understand context of nonprofit housing developers and nonprofit service providers to understand what challenges that they're facing in the market and what challenges they're facing amongst populations that they serve and it's always really useful to talk to Realtors as well because Realtors know the market inside and out and they'll be able to get a more nuanced understanding of neighborhood and neighborhood patterns and what's happening in a market so we kind of work on getting nonprofit public sector and private development and kind of hearing those different perspectives that allow us to triangulate and kind of understand what the major problems are how people are already trying to solve it and what would they like to see to kind of address problems that they're facing in the community more directly yeah thank you that's what I was looking for because the developers have a good voice and an important voice but it's only one view of of it and it was I was curious to see what the other stakeholders were going to be to help round out that view so thank it's really helpful to get the triangulation in our experience yeah yeah right um member strong thank you so I had a question um sound like you were talking a lot about cross agency work or um consideration and um because we are not the school board um or the school district and we have two school districts in Roseville and then we being part of gramsey County which does impact a lot of what we do here of course the state does as well um how do you see the results of what you're coming up with um impacting them how do they know about it if it's something that is a deliverable that um gets set into their lap um you know I don't know that we've said hey we're going to do this housing study and here's how it could impact you of course as a taxpayer I'm concerned you know are are we funding this for all these other folks so I guess I wanted to know kind of the scope and um magnitude of how that would be for agencies outside of ourselves yeah I mean I think that is one of the really tricky things about this policy area is there are so many external parties that are already deeply invested in it um so I I don't see it as as um you know wanting to take something that someone else is already doing but again getting to that question of really wanting to understand what needs are being met you know what roles different parties are playing um and you know um looking for some best practices that really are about how local communities are supplementing that okay yeah to add on to that I think U there's diverse interests right in the housing market and how it influences what gets developed and what doesn't and what housing is available U one of the things that we find really helpful in this process is getting feedback along the process that helps us understand what language to use understand how to frame things that will be effective at communicating and using this as a living document that can help support aims and needs of the community and one of the other things as being a consultant is that we can also be an independent voice that can help provide some really objective datab based figures to help really understand the market that can also Challenge and push back in some ways that are really productive in those conversations and so like one example is we're working in a community in Ohio a suburb much like yourselves Mentor Ohio and there school board was concerned about um increasing the you know density of households within the community uh because there projections for what the school could could hold had already been met but when we started to present information and kind of work through kind of the housing gaps and housing affordability and how it's pushing families out and making it challenge to actually introduce new families provided supportive environment helped produce a more productive conversation across those different groups so I think it was a matter of listening understanding what those issues are working then on producing a report that can kind of um address some of those concerns and do so effectively and then produce a final document then that can you know facilitate more productive dialogue down the road thank you all right other questions uh member grath it isn't really a question it's more a comment listening to all the questions that have been brought up what I'm hoping to get from this is to see how we can have a balance of housing in Roseville that's not out of bance because uh some of the residents worry that we're going one way too much or one way you know they see certain things being built and they bring that up so that's we don't have very much developable land left in Roseville and we need to use it very wisely so that's what I'm hoping to see from this some some data uh actually looking forward instead of backward I appreciate your comments about using other data because demographics you know that that material gets old very quickly especially when you think four years right now that would put us in the middle of Co which is a very different time so so that's what I'm hoping to see in this study yeah so one thing that's really useful I think in this is that we like to include a lot of comparison studies in the analytical phase so we'll use you know not just Roseville we use Roseville in the county so in Ramsey County in the broader state of Minnesota but also compare it to uh other cities within the Metro that you would considered to be comparable cities and when you start to see the development trajectories and Trends in those other places in ju toos to Roseville you start to get an understanding too of like where Roseville is or is not competing within the local market how it is or is not fitting particular gaps or needs so we think that kind of comparison analysis and being able to synthesize and visualize that data convincingly is really helpful in terms of understanding are we missing that kind of missing middle 2 to five unit developments do we really need to be focusing on higher density in those locations or have we been far exceeding that level of development compared to other comparable locations and you know do we need to make an adjustment based on that so by having that comparison across those places and really focusing on how Roseville J supposes to those can be very productive too and kind of understanding the the housing mix that makes sense for the community thanks what of the um things that we've seen varies widely um varied widely between shiew New Brighton and vness Heights is the level of naturally occurring affordable housing older apartment stock in those communities there's just a tremendous amount in some communities and much less in others and and I don't have a sense yet for where you're situated in that but I'll be interested to see right uh we do have the request before us oh I should ask is we provide an opportunity is there anyone in the public who wishes to speak to this uh uh request to enter into the uh agreement with stantech to provide the uh housing study for the City of Roseville does not appear to be the case all right uh with that we've got the requested action which is a request to authorize the president and executive director to enter into that uh Professional Services agreement with stantech for that housing needs assessment so move second all right it's been moved by member St second by member Aton a discussion on the motion as the maker of the motion member St nothing further right uh member Aton as the second no thank you right any additional discussion on the motion right hearing none and thank you again for being here and presenting this evening and and answering the questions uh and I just would note if we could follow up and have the presentation uh be made part of the the record of the you know the the packet going forward so that the public can refer to that as well as long as there's nothing proprietary or Secret in there and it's fine sweep it or clean it if you need to um but with that request we've got the motion before us all those in favor signify by saying I I I opposed that pass is unanimous and unanimously and we'll enter into that agreement thank you for being here again this even thank you thank you for thank you our next business item for the Eda this evening is our first look at the I think our first look at the proposed 2025 uh Eda budget uh and tax levy uh and we have our community development director Janice gunlock with us this evening to uh bring this for before us for our consideration uh and hopeful recommendation to the council for approval uh Miss gunlock thank you president Ro members of the board um every year the Eda must review and recommend a preliminary budget and Levy to the city council staff did provide a first draft of that budget and Levy to you on July 15th um during that discussion board members requested that staff bring a preliminary budget and Levy back to you that resulted in a zero increase for 2025 um that direction was based on some of the uh Eda actuals as well as the fund balance in the Eda um we did go back and take a look at that and that would require a red reduction of $1,621 based on what was brought to you on July 15th um we did do that and the budget comparison in your packet uh results in an additional $99,500 cut from Economic Development Consulting fees um an additional $2,000 was cut from Professional Services Under The General Eda and that primarily um goes towards paying the recording secretary as well as the Eda attorney and then we also reduced an additional $500 from staff training and Conference costs and so taking into consideration the additional Cuts we made since July with the other Cuts as well as increases that were proposed on July 15th I'll just go through them really quickly the preliminary budget and Levy before you result in an increase in staff salaries and benefits it's just shy of six grand redu in the energy audit funding of $1,000 that's based on some of the actuals that we reviewed we think we're still funded in order to um meet the demand for that the total amount of cutting from our Economic Development Consulting budget is1 19,500 we also cut the full funding for the business education series that's about $2,000 we talked about this last time but essentially those meetings haven't really been happening and even when they were happening we were getting getting very little to no participation from Roseville businesses so we don't think cutting that will be um a big impact or any impact um we've also reduced all of the Professional Services Under The General Eva expenditures again this is primarily recording secretary and attorney's fees by 22,000 um training and education costs for Eda staff have been cut by 2500 as well as training costs for board members that was cut by ,000 um based on actuals so with all of that we are actually decreasing the 2025 budget proposed by $379 which is uh oneth of 1% um it's a funny number mostly because in cutting the budget we didn't want to leave it at an odd number in the individual line items so that is the preliminary budget and Levy that's before you the resolution in your packet would need to be adopted if that's EX acceptable to the Eva in order to meet the deadlines for the preliminary Levy being set um that's all I have but I'm happy to address any questions of the board all right uh thank you Miss gunlock and and that's a good point on the timing of things we do as a city have to certify our Levy uh to the or not to exceed Levy to the county by the end of this month uh and so the purpose of this discussion is to recommend something to the city council take action on I believe at our September 23rd meeting um so that's why we we have this before us this evening um with that just clarification on timing and and procedure are there any questions that the members of the board have for staff on what's being brought back before I and thank you for reminding me I should have remembered that we had had this discussion earlier this year in my introductory comments questions from the board member schroer um yes thank you for coming back with this and and keeping it flat that um um so some good work in there I do think the budget is still quite healthy so I don't feel that any of these cuts are going to cause a hardship of any kind uh I did have a question on does this has this gone before the finance commission and or will it go before the finance commission uh board member Scher I our budget calendar has not typically included bringing the Eda budget or Levy to the finance commission um I know in the as when we've increased funding for example for Housing Programs we have brought some of those minor programming items before the finance commission but the whole budget itself has not typically been brought before the finance commission no CU yes it seems to be the only part of our budget that doesn't go before it so I thought it might make sense to do that well certainly it could probably be incorporated into the discussion we have our finance director Miss petrick would like to uh help us with this item as part of the overall budget packet that goes to the finance commission um and they have looked at this at the last two meetings the Eda general fund is included within that packet so the expenditures and the tax levy are part of their overall pay pet but and In fairness to member Schroeder's comment we don't spend much time at all if any at the finance commission going over the details of the Eda budget it is included in the large packet of information that that is correct but we don't spend any time when I go and speak to them I don't talk directly about the Eda budget and the ins and outs as has G like it so it's a fair point okay thank you uh and member Aton I would like to thank you for your work I know that uh as I think I said last time this budget is the most opaque no clear and wait opposite transparent it's most transparent there we go thank you uh budget we have and that certainly has put you under a microscope that may feel almost unfair so appreciate the great work you've done to make this budget always something that's very um manageable yet is doing critical work in our city right uh we'll double check are there other questions or do we have anyone from the public who wishes to speak to the proposed uh Eda budget and tax levy we do I'll just remind folks uh while remember of the public is coming up the time limit for public comment is 3 minutes and I try to enforce that gently and we do ask if you uh state your name and address or Street for the record to begin your comments and direct comments or questions to the council and with that welcome Roger H junor Wagner please this isn't about this coming Year's budget but during next year I would like the uh the three CI and the county to take a look and see if rice larpenter has done that Alliance has done what you wanted them to do because the people running it are very dedicated and talented but I think they've been given the wrong goals to be working on because any our area still hasn't gotten any better and after all these years and all the money you spent we've had festivals and things and artwork which are great but we really need Redevelopment there it's like this Dale Selby used to be the worst area after Redevelopment people want to be that area well we haven't gotten any better in all these years and I thought when I my building was when I decided to sell my commercial building and rice I assume the Alles had developers all set up to to implement the master plan we have you spent a lot of money on a master plan but there was they had nothing ready to go for that they l&z property came available it was on sale for two years and the rice Alliance didn't even know it was for sale and then there was there was a big plan for that and the master plan so anyway I would like you three the three cities and the county to get together this coming year and see if things are going the way you wanted to if they're not then redirect things or if they are going the way you want that's fine but uh I think you should take a look at it this coming year right thank you for your comments is there anyone else from the public who wishes to speak to the proposed uh Eda budget and tax levy for 2025 it does not appear to be the case uh we've got the request before us and once again this is a not to exceed we do get another uh another chance to uh take a look at this if we need to reduce but we can't increase after this recommendation um the resolution is a resolution to uh recommend this um budget and Levy to the city council for authorization to the county at the September 2 23rd meeting uh is there a motion in relation to that resolution so moved second right it's been moved by member gra seconded by member straw to approve the resolution authorizing uh the council to um forward the proposed tax levy uh at the September 23rd meeting or words to that effect uh discussion on the motion as the maker uh member gra I just like to thank staff for working on this after we requested some changes they did a very good job on that and came up with the numbers that we' requested so I appreciate it all right and as the secondary member St I'd like to Echo those thank you for your work on this right other discussion on the motion all right uh with that we've got the motion before us uh to adopt that resolution all those in favor signify by saying I I oppos that passes unanimously uh and that concludes the budget uh discussion for now for the Eda that will be back before us uh later in the year before we do our final approval uh in December uh that uh concludes the business before the Eda this evening is there a motion to adjourn the Eda so move second right it's been moved by member Sher second by member gra to adjourn uh no discussion on a motion to adjourn all those in favor signify by saying I I I opposed that passes unanimously and we are adjourned at 6:38 p.m. uh we'll just take a few moments to reconfigure for the council meeting [Music] e e right we're back from a short break between the Eda and council meeting uh call to order the Roseville city council meeting for Monday September 16th 2024 and the roll call will stand as previously called and with that we don't have to do the Pledge of Allegiance twice um so we can move right to consideration of the uh Council agenda for this evening and we'll double check with uh city manager Tran first to see if is there any staff recommended changes or required changes to the agenda this evening Mr Mayor there's no changes to the agenda all right uh and uh I imagine with with no consent agenda and only a few business items there may not be a council change either all right with that is there a motion to approve the agenda as presented second all right it's been moved by council member shter second by council member uh Eton any discussion on the motion to approve the agenda I hearing none all those in favor signify by saying I I hos that passes unanimously we have our agenda for this evening uh that then brings us to our general public comment uh at each meeting we do have an opportunity uh for members of the public to speak to agenda items as they come forward but we also do want at the start of each meeting to provide an opportunity for general public comment this would be comment on items that are not on the agenda but may either be of interest to people in the community or related to City business uh and once again we will have those opportunities for uh agenda items as they come up so with we'll open it up for general public comment I see we've got somebody rare in the go so recognize you and welcome you again for comment Roger Junior W in your pleas I wish more people would come up here and talk at public comment time but anyway our in the little area where I live is just North of Randy county beach at Lake McCaron and we've we've hosted a large number of homeless people there for years but this year is really getting out of hand last night when I drove by at 11:30 there's seven cars with people living in them I don't know how many other individuals were living in the park too but and when I drove by I got yelled at by some of them because I was driving by I guess they didn't like that and then not too long ago I found a nude mail sleeping in my porch so it's getting bad around there I don't know if there's other areas of Rosell have the same problems or not but I think we need to do something about our area so I don't I know we've talked about some of us talked about getting a petition and like making no parking at 11: to p.m. to 5: or something in our area I don't which I don't know if you guys would pay attention to that or not but then I was thinking since you have housing Navigators and the cat team and everything I was wondering if maybe could possibly schedule a meeting that the neighbors could get together with some of the city staff and see if there's a solution that can be made because it's just I mean one person's been living there now 18 months and you have a housing Navigator I would think by now in 18 months they would have you know found a way for this person to live a decent life rather than living out of a van on the side of the road but anyway so if that's possible it'd be nice to have someone contact some of us or let us know but if it's not possible that we understand and we can just do a petition and see if we can just get things done on our own but thank you right thank you for your comments and certainly I think that's something we should follow up with and and see if we can't put together a neighborhood meeting or something of that sort move over to Valley Park on Avon we will see all right is there anyone else from the public who wishes to comment at general public comment this evening all right uh seeing no one then uh we don't have any recognitions or items removed from consent so we can move to our business business items our first business item this evening is a joint meeting with the Parks and Recreation Commission why don't we just take a couple of moments to allow the members to get up to the table and set up there I'll okay we need chairs chairs up yeah tap that this is why we're here yeah there's no room for the council confus yeah it's too crowed yeah I I hate to admit my ignorance but who's the chair these days that would be me hello councel all right before we get started I think we need to re uh start the meeting here oh just to make sure unless they didn't actually take a break and I'm presuming that they'll come up I just want to make sure we miss any or that the members of the public miss any of our discussion okay all right I I wasn't sure if we stopped or or had to restart welcome thank you for being here and I'll turn it over to chair Matt's Benson for introductory comments and perhaps a round of introductions of the members yes um so I am Lindsay mat Benson I'm the current chair of the parks and rec commission and we're just going to start with introductions like we do at our meetings to my left uh Jamie Penny darl Brown Joe arneson Audrey arneson Jessica RAR Karen Beckman and Karen is our vice chair so tonight we wanted to kind of go through just some highlights that have been happening um some kind of community engagement and then some next STS and there is uh we have one ask for you that was in your packet uh and we will get to that as we go sure so um I guess I'm going to kick things off um we had Rose Fest this year I think this was our first year sort of on the reconfigured schedule uh if you remember we went down from two weeks to one week uh we received a lot of positive feedback about sort of the more condensed schedule um and as part of that condensed schedule the 10K was reduced to a 5K and the fireworks were moved from the 4th to the 29th so overall I think it was I shouldn't say I but the we think that it was a a great success and we'll help to continue with sort of the onewe schedule moving forward um other areas that we want to highlight is that um we are doing uh Dion has been working uh very hard at revamping sort of the Nature Center programs um and we've received a lot of positive feedback and I know commissioner Ragnar um volunteers a lot at the Nature Center um and so we really appreciate uh Dion's efforts there um and hope to continue increasing attendance moving forward um our live at the rug summer concert series sorry um again this year we um decided to reduce the number of concerts uh in order to sort of have perhaps more quality versus quantity I think that overall uh we've received positive feedback about uh the Concert Series this year I'm sorry I don't have the numbers of attendance um I know it was in our meeting agenda from from last month but I forgot to write that down um the new park at 20381 County Road B is underway we'll have a couple discussions about that tonight so I'll just uh hold off on that but is underway uh we're 70% complete with the emerald ashbo program and then other uh items that we did as a council was we took two Park tours uh as a council uh this year one to Lexington Park and one to Rosebrook Park uh those Parks were suggested because they're heavily used uh and also because there's some programming uh or equipment changes that we're looking at doing in those parks and then finally we completed a SWAT analysis which I believe is in your packet so um so commission and Community engagement one of I think the best parts about the parks and rec commission is how much we get to engage with our fellow Roseville citizens uh during the summer we had discover your Parks events I know at least one was sadly rained out um rain just kind of puts a damper on the summer sometimes um and so it's just a really great time to be out in the community hearing about things so at the table we had a QR code for folks to scan around the Rosebrook Park changes with the waiting pool Splash Pad oh lots of fun discussion with kids uh of they they they are very strong young citizens strong feelings from our young citizens in the community it's a really great way to engage the Young Folks uh the Lexington Park planning is a really fun process um there have been two meetings so far um I've gotten to be at both of them and it's a it's been a smaller groups but also a really engaged group that really deeply com com like cares about that Park um I've seen council members drawn at both of those um as well and it's just been a really good process to think about it from an accessible and inclusive standpoint with the friends of Rosell Park um footing helping contribute to the cost of that Park it's my neighborhood park it's my kids' favorite Park so um it's really fun to get to engage them in that process as well and it's really great to have that opportunity uh the bike planning committee commissioner Bolton who is not here tonight has been a part of that um um I will probably not articulate it as well as I should but looking at a bikable Roseville so they did bike kind of bike tours um around the city they did a walking one I believe around rosale just because it was not a great place to bike I'm sure that's very surprising um and they are coming forth with some I believe some recommendations soon um and then the natural resources management plan technical advisory committee which is a really long name for a really wonderful program that darl brown has been a part of um of learning and I think it was a partnership with Stan was it stantech uh that's um looking at all the different areas in Roseville and coming up with a plan there um so if you have questions on that direct them to Daryl so I think there might be a little bit of repeat here but um we also the the staff put out at RFP for uh a new recreation management system which uh in our opinion is needed uh they received a number of um of answers to that call uh and they're currently underway of reviewing the proposals and I believe the V will come to the commission sometime soon here um the park uh that I referred to earlier the new park uh is being actually built this weekend so I think it's uh 85% complete and again the the build is going to be this weekend for the playground equipment uh on Lexington Park they've uh completed two uh CommunityWide or neighborhood-wide meetings um we also solicited feedback at the discovery your your Parks um the final plan has sort of been developed and now we're just waiting for sort of the schematics to to come through uh for the commission's review uh for Rose book uh Park amenities as Comm as chair Matt Benin mentioned we're looking into perhaps removing the pool and replacing with a splash pad we've conducted surveys over the Discover your Parks um and also just uh having it posted at different Parks events um so we've received feedback we need to analyze that feedback and we probably need to go uh back and uh require more feedback so that's sort of where we're at with that um and then Daryl do you have any updates for the natural resources um yeah so as I mentioned uh we engaged with stantech uh we had a uh as you know with there was a contract with stantech I believe it was a 10-year contract which uh which came to conclusion um for the Nal resources in Roseville uh and as a commission we felt that the work that they had done was was exceptional over the that past 10 years uh we're very pleased with with everything that they had done and the accomplishment that they made and conclusion was you know kind of the question is well what next and so the uh commission got very engaged with uh discussing this and I asked uh uh director Johnson to uh you know to essentially get something something going with stanch uh to you know kind of talk about you know where where the you know things could be next and and come back to the commission and so uh so we had a recomend recommendation to uh formalize uh this technical action committee and uh and with that it was the key concept was to to have uh you know very significant engagement with Roseville community at large uh have stantech uh be kind of at the the Centric somewhat uh somewhat driving but mostly you know it's more more for analytical purposes and uh and then with the uh parks and wck uh Department to be very also very engaged with it and uh today we've had we had two meetings to start with one was just an introductory with again bringing the again Community together uh it was very well attended uh a lot of good discussion people were again they are very engaged very uh very passionate um and so that we had an introductory meeting uh stanch then uh went out and did a survey of all the parks uh put together a very detailed document um essentially kind of like A needs assessment um and uh and I they did some of their prioritizing said well these are the prior PRI priorities as they see it but again it's not they made it real clear it's not you know it's not our decision it's you know it's you know the the city's decision basically to go back and uh and you know digest that and um and then B essentially prioritize put goals together so we have our third meeting coming up this week on Wednesday and that's the uh the objective of that meeting is to really um go through that the documentation um and which we again we've had couple months to to look uh you know uh preview it and uh essentially put together kind of a road map um over the next next uh years to as far as what is it that you know we want to do uh to improve our Parks um and from a maintenance standpoint you know and a lot of it had to do you know like with invasives uh you know their trees canopy things of that nature so yeah they I I was again I can't say enough how impressed I was of one with the job that stantech did with his thorough ort that they put together and but then also especially engagement of the the community because they they have you know just a we've got a lot of really talented people here in Roseville and they really have a lot of good ideas and and that was kind of the beauty of this too is that stantech listened to you know get you know the feedback it wasn't just one-sided it was like you know kind of like again explaining and then getting getting a lot of good feedback and taking that thank you all right so part everybody's been waiting for is again one of the fun parts of this commission is we get to discuss and recommend names for new parks in the city and so the process we went through is a very similar process that we've gone through in the past except for we got stickers this time uh so we received 43 names and what we did is we had all of the names up on chart paper and we all got I think three three-ish stickers and we voted to narrow down the list uh because um we thought that that was a really great way to just kind of narrow that down get a general feeling of what we thought um things that we kind of removed from the list right away were ones that didn't fit with the um naming policy so we wanted to make sure that the name was a natural space a geographic location and it wasn't associated with a name an association a business unless there was a significant contribution and there wasn't for that Park um so the name that we would like to put forward for this park is Sunset Park and that is um for a couple reasons it well it fits with the naming policy it's a serene a natural name and also it's on the west side of the city where the sun sets so um that is our recommended name is there anybody who wants to also provide information on that that name yeah say uh right around Sunset you might have to swing a mic that way I was just going to say right around you know sunset or the evening it does there is a brilliant Sunset as you're in that area so it kind of matches with um with that yeah and it's a good I think it's a good neutral as well yep um so we know that we have a council action for you all to do something like that we do have one more slide with discussion topics I don't know mayor what you would like the order to be I would say let's keep the discussion going okay and then we'll come back to the name all right sounds good all right so we have some other discussion topics that have come come up in commission meetings repeatedly so um I will ask commissioner arnison if he wants me to take the lead on this one or if he would like to start this one off uh you can start it I can start it okay so one thing that we've noticed and that we've heard from fellow residents of Roseville is um kind of on that land acquisition piece of that we are a very landlock City you all know this from the previous um discussions you were having we are a very landlock City and there's not a lot of space for parks and there um so one thing that we have discussed is that the city may want to consider a more proactive approach in certain situations to acquiring land rather than what is currently written in the master plan policy um for instance there are certain sectors in the constellation where um that is in the park master plan I believe that don't really have a park um I'm specifically thinking in the Harmar area we hear a lot from um I hear a lot from parents at my kids school that there's no Park West of Hamlin North of roson that that is an area that there just is no Park um and it would be great if there was because then families don't need to cross the street over to K Mayflower over to Lexington Park um and there's just there's just nothing there so the commission has talked about how um it may be something to consider an amendment to the Willing seller link land acquisition policy um commissioner arneson do you want to finish us off I'm not calling you out I'm just uh I would just say it's more of a well for me personally it's more of if something comes up that's maybe an adjacent property to a park that would really make the um you know benefit the park to have this piece of land instead of it being a willing buyer willing seller type deal um if the city would be willing to to pay you know if this is some a piece that we would want we wouldn't want to be stuck with just trying to get a deal for that piece of land we go after and pay retail price for this piece of land otherwise since we are pretty landlocked once it's gone it's gone so we have run into that in the past um and you know there isn't any real situation right now but it's something in the future if there was a um a piece of land that was close to a or another piece that came up um you know be a good idea I think and we we think that it'd be good to have it not just being like a donation or paying a small amount towards what the actual value of this property is it would be good to be able to go in and buy this piece of property if it was something that the city wanted any other well any other folks want to comment on that parts um and then are there any initiatives that the council would like the commission to investigate I think that's another thing that we'd love to discuss um we know that there's going to be a lot of conversation coming up with the new campus master plan and the the movement of things happening around here with Veterans Park and the maintenance facility and everything and so that is um another piece that the commission feels really passionate about being informed on and being talk to all right well we appreciate you all being here and all the work that that you do uh over the course of the year it some seems like sometimes that one one joint meeting can't cover everything so and we know that the commission has been before the council with certain individual special discussions as well so we appreciate that uh certainly open it up uh to the council for uh feedback or questions um not specifically necessarily related to the name of Sunset Park proposal I think we'll take an action on that maybe be once we're finished with more of the the general discussion uh but with that uh Council thoughts feedback questions council member St thank you I wanted to ask about your SWAT analysis um was that in partnership with stantech then part of that or is that was your internal piece internal and how many people are missing today [Music] Bolton no yeah okay thank you well and I appreciated um the list of strengths and of course I agree with those but um I had some questions about some of the items that you listed as as weaknesses and I found one that um or weakness or opportunity that I mentioned to um the director uh Johnson pretty often is um the need for bike racks at parks and um an insufficient number you know if we're looking at a biking Community we need to make sure I know at the discovery your Parks event at Lexing park there are three or four bike racks and it was waiting room uh it was like a waiting line for those to be available so four is just not enough for a park of that size so I hope you will consider that a a weakness or opportunity um I I just was curious you know I agree that looking at the music and other things like that is a great idea we have been asked before to dog parks um I do want to mention that world famous Ganan drummer so Mena lives in Roseville uh and uh the Aztec Dancers Kuli something with a Y they also live in Roseville um so we have these some really amazing worldclass world famous um groups within our organ and so for looking at how do we change what happens in that Bandshell um you know I think it it would beho us to look at who lives in our neighborhood but also heard great things about that ABA cover band and then of course the band that was at uh at um tapped in on cork the other night so really finding ways for a lot of people of all ages to come out is I've seen changes and improvements and and I and I hope we will continue that um I just wanted to um ask about this community center which a lot of newer residents to Roseville do ask about regularly and I was curious to know um you put it in a weakness and um and yet in my 22 years in rosille I've never seen any movement on that and so I was just curious to know if you had some ideas or um thoughts behind that um as a nearly lifelong resident of the city other than those like few years I lived in St Paul um I think that part of it was that like for me growing up we had there was a partnership almost with the schools where like Fairview was considered more of a community center um which is now on vua um that land um and so there is not a lot of good space good public use space in Roseville that doesn't belong well I would say that's a city property essentially that there's not a there's there is Cedar home now there is um a couple other like the park shelters and everything but there's nothing that's like a big fancy Community Center that has the gym and the water park and all of these things that well sheview has it um and it might just be parents not wanting to drive all the way up to sheview I don't blame them but having that Hub in the city and having a hub as a heart of the city I think really means a lot to people that there's a place to meet there's a place to organize there's a place that's relatively inexpensive to do a thing um and that's what I've heard from folks of when they talk about wanting a community center that is a place to gather um it isn't the library even though the library I think um in rosville takes a place of a community center a lot of the time um other folks I would I would say that your phone don't know I'm talking you can hear um I would say that in in Li of a community center you have to look at the things that we have that maybe other places don't and Roseville and the state have put a lot of money into the oval there's meeting rooms there I kind of I personally feel like Roseville for its size has this um you know this National facility and that's maybe taking over a lot of space of what a community center wbe money would have gone towards upkeep would have gone towards so there but a lot of people in the city use that too so I I think that you know having one or the the other I'm not sure that uh I think I think Roseville pushed for that more back in the time of maybe thinking about a community center and and the old Fairview Community Center really wasn't it had a community center name it really wasn't much of a community center it had two gyms in it um another space kind of a small meeting space it was an old uh I think middle school or High School in horrible condition um so the basement had been flooded for years so it I would love to see a community center in Roseville but you know the push to building something like that and where you would put it would be uh would be uh definitely a big task not that I don't think it could happen could miss arnes when would you be willing to add your opinion from your point of view sure um as a student I think having a space to like a community center would be helpful to study with friends not always going to like right now it's either going to the library going to a place to eat and spending money and it would be nice to have a space free that you could study instead of going to school or being having a space like school and or or like having a place to work out I think would be really nice and being a little more inexpensive than the gyms around rosville thank you other other input or um into that question or I we can provide an opportunity for other Council thoughts as well I have a question um what is going on with the old the Park View School Park View school is parkie school as far as I know for the school anymore I don't think well no I think it is actually oh it is the school district is has a lot of activities going on there I think we're gonna get a update on that at our next oh okay I I think from the point of view of exterior space on the site of Parkview school I think that's something that the the city and the school district are interested in having some conversations about yeah uh maybe more optimal use of some of that space that's there especially as we talk about Veterans Park I was a swimmer in Roseville but we always they were the only one with a pool so we had to go there for practice and training and everything so well and certainly I think that you know just in talking the conversation about Community Center has probably been going on as long as I've been involved in in city government here in Roseville and one of our challenges is is you know we've got a lot of amenities they're just under a lot of different roofs and so figuring out what a community center can and should be for the city has I think been one of the one of the stumbling blocks and obviously whatever you might decide it is there's kind of a huge price T associated with the two and figuring out that piece of it it's just you know if if that's something that the community really wants to do we have to figure that out so that's where we're at um other feedback questions comments uh on just the general topics that we've had before us council member thanks all the work here you tackling a lot of different things with some impact on the community right some bigger impacts potentially uh on the SWAT analysis have you gotten to the point where you've digested it looks like all the ideas are there have you gotten to the point where you've digested them and said hey Park and wreck department the park and wreck commission thinks you should focus on these three things or something like that we at a point of refining that coming to some goals um we have not yet um I think that's a question for vice chair and I to talk to director Johnson about I think that one of the great things about director Johnson is that he doesn't he hears Us in the meetings and doesn't necessarily let the SWAT analysis dictate that like he's already moving on so many of these things that we've identified um so there's always those moving pieces that are already happen happening behind the scenes and it's kind of an affirming aspect that we've also identified these so that didn't totally answer your question but no I yep that makes sense um thinking about um Mr arners your your thoughts on expanding parks and even looking very specifically at the zone you talked about looking at a map of that area I don't see any open spaces unless you bought someone's house and took it down is that fair well that's fair and I would I would say that it's it's that or if uh for instance let's say there's a a lot a person that's let's say there's a person that has a lot that's um you it's got their house on it but it's possibly has two other Lots on it that could have been developed at some point well if that land came available and it's right next to a park and it would fill out a nice spot in the park it would be a valuable piece of land then you know considering that as uh it would be nice to consider that as an opportunity to to purchase if that's possible and that would be a house that would be removed for Parkland so it's it's not something that I don't think we would do often it's more something that the uh the potential Sunset Park name is that's kind of more where that came from is the um is that was a piece of property that I really wish the city could have purchased um but willing buyer willing seller we weren't able to move forward with that um that would have been a great place but that's all in hindsight and luckily we do have a park there so it it did meet the criteria but I guess just moving forward in a landlock city if there was a piece of land available um you know uh even if it was an industrial place that was along next to a park or um something it it would be a good a nice to just move and have the ability to purchase that piece I I think I think as we've I have a lot of history as the senior ccil member no um they like to make fun of me for being a senior council member here um well I do you do um you're you're talking about hey here's a lot with an extra space on we actually um we're working with a homeowner just a few blocks east of both Sunset Park um several years ago and that that didn't work so certainly that's something that's something we should always be considering and thinking about one of the things in that specific area is uh if Harmar ever redevelops or changes theoretically Park dedication might kick in or some sort of agreement would go there right now that parking lot by Cub is used about a quarter of the time and most of that for snow you know so um part yeah um big sledding hill um but anyway that that there seems to be a great opportunity potentially in the future in that area if we're proactive I think that's the challenge how do we become proactive in today's market um we can ask the realtor down down the road here but um but if you're not proactive you're not actually in the market it's going to be hard to get anything yeah I think part of the one of the things that we talked about too was that we don't it might be a thing to look at to make sure that the city's policies wouldn't prohibit the city from acting something so like having that strategy having that plan going forward and so that you aren't then told by your City attorney or your city manager like I know you really want to do this but our laws and our rules and everything tell us we can't so that is one thing that I think more of this discussion has brought up as we want to make sure that there can be a strategy that it can be something that can back and I think that that one of the things that enters into it is that um you know as stewards of taxpayer money paying a premium for acquiring a property has always been a bit of a stumbling for theil because you know what we're trying to do is we're try to get you know we we' rather put the M into amenities on a park than necessarily just that upfront acquisition of the property you know given the choice and so that's I think part of where that policy comes from and some of the decision- making that's been made um certainly the challenge is if we're competing with a particular property with a development potential which is going to pay a premium because they're going to make money on it versus the city not saying you know are we're out to make money but at the same time once again we're trying to balance the the taxpayers interests as well as as the you know acquiring strategic property so I think there's that's been the tension that's been there and so uh you know if we want to add some Nuance to the policy you know there may be opportunities to potentially use condemnation uh if there's a blight situation but I don't know that we that we want to say we have a lot of that in Roseville either um but sometimes those opportunities could present themselves as well and that's another tool that cities have but obviously there are significant limitations on what you can do in in the realm of condemnation but one of the advantages of that is that you're not necessarily paying a premium um so I think it's a a matter of balancing all those competing interests and making sure that we have a policy that gives us maybe a little more flexibility um cons strong I do think though that given the popularity of our land trust and the people within interest in donating their land to the land trust that there might be a possibility that someone would with a really pastoral yard might say you know I would love for this to be uh you know gone into a park system if that's something of value I think we have to be willing if that were to be the case though to be able to allow that to go off the tax roles and so we can't let whether or not it fits on our tax uh rules be Drive whether or not we're willing to let it um go into the park system um but I do think you know there are some pretty unconventional things out there and I think sometimes that's where things work the best um because they we think outside the box so I think if we were able to come up with some type of um some something that made it advantageous for whoever that was in a a building that maybe is has reached the end of its useful life that maybe they would be willing to uh find a way and they would have interest in in um working with the city to move that to the city I think that's always a possibility that people and once again that's almost almost the Willing donor situation in that in that case um and and some of the cases that we've had recently just has been we're competing with development and that's a that's a real challenge um oh uh council member graph I want to thank commissioner Anderson for bringing that subject up I live in that little corner of the world and it's been very contentious uh obviously we don't need to relitigate a past thing but I would like it to be able to in the future if something ever did come up that that would happen or at least be discussed seriously um people are happy with the park that's there now so that has you know they're happy with that proceeding but um the other thing I wanted to comment on is that I liked your work plan and the way you organized it and that you had Point people on the plan who were reporting back to you I thought that was really good efficient use use of your time and it helped me reading through uh your your information so that's all right Council sh um actually I'm going to incorporate a lot of the things everyone's already said um first I wanted to thank you all I'm really impressed how involved you all are and how much work you're doing and there's so many things going on in the Parks and wreck as you know that that's our the jewel of Roseville if you ask people what do they like about Roseville I mean even some of our interviews for commissions that's like the first thing they say what you oh it's the park so so this is a super important area so I really appreciate all the work you're doing and I wanted to talk about um your your um your list and I think it makes really a lot of sense to prioritize some of these things you can't do it all you know you know in the short M so to figure out what is priorities but I wanted to add on to that that everything costs money there is no free space really um so you know if it's a community center whatever it is it all takes um money and usually it's from property taxes and so that's something you know we're going to hear from the finance next and so that's something you know with both it's kind of ying and yang with the two commissions on that so so looking at priorities and part of the priorities needs to be then the cost that's associated with that so as you're looking at these things I mean even the the oval we know you know and all these pieces everything costs money and so if we're going to you know we have so much now we want to be careful what we add and do we need it and is it do we have it in different parts do we need to have it all Under One Roof or not so you have to look at maybe there's um unique ways to have different pieces of areas to study or whatever that you don't necessarily have to have it under one roof and there might be some you our Park buildings are are beautiful and the cedar home and so there's so many of these pieces that is there a way to look at it creatively to help it come up with a lot of these amenities without having it um cost the taxpayers you know a lot of money we obviously want to pay for what we have and keep it all up yet we want to make sure and balance that against what are we going to have our residents pay in property taxes and that's always the balance so so it's great work and some great priorities and just consider that that other part about the cost as well thank you other thoughts or feedback council member that's a spur of question I meant to ask earlier when we starting to look at you're going to meet on Wednesday again this natural resources uh master plan which I think is really important for us to be looking at um because we spent a lot of time and money and a lot of volunteers and a lot of staff and consultants and so I want to make sure we keep that going we don't lose what we've done as you come through that process will there be a prioritization per Park per the whole system yes how how will that come back for decisions because as member Schroeder says you it's going to come back to money right you know our current program is cost of fair amount of money I think it's very worth it um but to go and continue that it will cost certain amount of money to expand what we're doing in Parks will take additional work I understand there's some goals to expand our number of volunteers which I hope so but we have a volunteer coordinator full-time volunteer coord you know so how how we will be able to make all of those things work and where that prioritisation will come from yeah that's a again a real good question and that that actually is a lot of what we'll be discussing at this this upcoming meeting um and essentially and so the volunteers is is definitely as as part of the core that's uh we want to keep that ongoing and and even expand um and I think there's even some thoughts that it's we're might be close to almost like like doubling what we've been doing in the past um and you guys are doubling okay but the uh but so part of part of that process U with goals and priorities um is looking at it and uh and take into consideration resources um and so there are there are some things that are you know on one hand might be like kind of a high or you know like a lofty goal again uh P this guy is like you know clean up Lake Bennett U but the resources for that um you know is it was you know his uh would be you know prohibitive and so it's kind of like you're put you have to put all your eggs in one basket and that's all you'd get and so we're looking at um the you know prioritizing based a lot of it is on you know what's what's most feasible how do we you know how do we get the biggest bang for the and and who's going to be doing it and uh and so we'll be segmenting that into uh the work that volunteers can do the type of work that uh Park and Rex uh can do with their staff and in some cases you know there's some work that uh we need Professional Services like stantech to to help and so it's it's really looking at again that trying to you know take that whole picture um and and really setting together the you know the priorities and and how are we going to manage all of that and and so yeah that's again that's a lot of what we're going to try to think uh in two [Laughter] days not over the course of two days but two days from now yes set the stage the next I I do want to follow up on on the natural resources part of it too because I was thinking earlier uh as I was observing a location that is not in a park but happens to be city property it's it's a larger property around a stormw water Pond um there are a lot of invasive trees Plants and Things in there um is this effort looking at some of those non-park properties or are we siloed off from the public works department and they take care of those or don't take care of those or can can you know can that be part of the consideration is looking at you know I not doesn't have to necessarily be every every right of way you know along a street or anything like that but some of those more significant storm water POC Pond areas or things like that is that lumped into it what a good question and U I'll bring that up on Wednesday um I saw some nodding from our director behind you um so I know we've talked a lot about even like uh you know adj you know private property adjacent and how you know there's the limits that we have with what we can be done with that but yeah it's uh that's a good question with uh with other city property that's uh that's not part of our Parks is there things said yeah I'm glad you brought that up and the other part of it too is always looking as I've advocated before is it are there opportunities to get away from maintain turf grass in city parks towards more native type planning areas um just in general so that's I'll just throw that on top of that um the other thing um uh Actually I don't even know if it exists but it was kind of an idea that that came to my mind as as council member strong was mentioning it I don't know if it's possible for the city to cons consider some sort of you know Park Land Trust similar to our housing land trust or something like that I don't know my might be something to investigate as a possibility where people could could if they're interested could buy into that and and it might be a way to once again having the Willing donor uh situation uh come up but I I don't know anything about any of that could be totally illegal for cities to do that in which case it's a short conversation but I just building on that thought I thought that'd be worth putting out there look so anyway we have we have experts that can help with that discussion it's not her though all right um anything else uh on any of these topics we've had before us um I do want to Echo all the appreciation of all the work that uh that goes into um you being before us these these joint meetings here I know there's there's just a lot that goes into attending all and participating in all the all the commission meetings as well as all the events and and other work that you that this commission does and so it's always impressive uh uh what gets accomplished and a great group of people as always uh enthusiastic and and wonderful to be involved all this uh we do have the request before us to by motion authorize the naming of the park at 2381 County Road B as Sunset Park does a council member want to make a motion on that I will make that motion second all right it's been moved by council member gra neighbor to the park uh to authorize that uh that naming at Sunset Park seconded by council member STW uh discussion on the motion Council M gra is the maker of the motion well I think it's a good good name and I I agree with uh commissioner arneson that you do get a sunset from that area the sky in that part of town really lights up at that time of day so I think it's a good descriptive and it fits our naming requirements so I'm supportive all right Council as the secondary nothing all right other discussion on the motion nope thanks for your work on it all right hearing no other discussion uh and I don't think I see anyone from the public who may be interested in commenting on it uh with that we've got the motion before us all those in favor signify by saying I I opposed that passes unanimously that Park is named uh congratulations to everyone for all that work and once again the playground build is I believe from 99 to 11: on Saturday uh it's somewhat competitive with the Wild Rice Festival but I think people can do both uh so we look forward to seeing folks out there uh uh and certainly neighborhood folks no doubt will be a part of that uh always a great group activity to do the playground build uh uh in in your neighborhood park so thank you again for being here this evening and everything all the discuss I was going to say too um whoever makes the wild rce Festival I've got a booth there my dad does jewelry and right moccasins and stuff and so I'll be and mugs and so I'll be there so his stuff great great that's why I want to make sure I mention both they're both very popular and important events in the city yeah I'm excited great well hopefully the it sounds like the weather will hold out too so all right well thank you again uh and now you get to go enjoy the rest of your evening unless you want to hear our other discussions oh I did have I did want to bring up one thing though because I do talk no we're done sorry oh okay no I talk to the community a lot so everyone's asking about Veterans Park ah that was the other thing I was going to mention is we may want to consider uh this open space that comes on the city hall campus as part of the renovation assuming the project goes forward as the new Veterans Park so hopefully anyone who's left on The commiss I know the neighbors around there are worried about like the beep beep beep of the trucks sure sure no that's all part of the consideration but I did want to mention that so thank you for trigging that that thought to problem make sure we do look at potentially that as as the new Veterans Park on the campus here thank you right yeah thank you thank you all right with that then we have the uh another one of our commissions the finance commission uh took a look at the city manager recommended budget including the Eda budget uh and is here this evening with their recommendations to us and I think we've got almost the whole commission uh so uh we'll welcome you up to the table uh for your recommendations thank you greetings I'm BR bester chair of the finance commission and I'm joined by my assistant commissioner Joe tuy commissioner Hannah bort commissioner Dan second sir and that's all of us tonight M oh actually for you Bruce we're going to have to turn that mic in front of you towards you a little more the one by yeah push that other one okay we got this there we go Dan and I that'll work two and two is this better yep good deal so uh we we looked at the budget as we do each year we have our usual steps which includes about three meetings to talk about the capital investment program we uh uh are proposing a budget uh of revenues 69 m88 th000 that's a 2.9% increase uh over the previous year previous budget the budgeted expenses proposed 72 milliion 870 that's a 6.8% increase over the previous the net change in fund balance or net assets is a reduction of 3,914 uh that compares to a budgeted reduction last year of 2,665 so one of the questions that we asked ourselves during those budget meetings was is that sustainable and I think the short answer to that question is uh that we tend to budget conservatively so we tend to stand a pretty good chance of beating that budget so that the concern was can we operate in the red year after year uh anyway so we're we're comforted we're we're we're satisfied that we can we can make our budgets and keep the city healthy that's that's the prime objective secondary objective uh is to be uh watchful and and considerate of the tax levy and the the taxes that our citizens and businesses pay uh so uh we have our our $70 million operating budget uh we looked at uh the capital investment spending our balance sheet is a big deal we've got a balance sheet approaching $300 million so that dwarfs are much bigger than the the annual operating budget we're proposing $12 million in additions this year Capital additions uh we during the the conversations about the uh capital investment program we talked about and it see at least for me seemed to crystallize a little bit that that we need to consider borrowing as part of the way to fund acquisition of of assets uh not to do that to fund all of the additions through uh through the operating fund puts too much pressure I think on the operating budget puts too much pressure on the uh uh the levy and so we we're trying to balance that and we're trying to to look forward to to probably doing more of that in the future uh the budget 25 budget includes a 5.1% increase in the tax levy uh I was thrilled when we first heard that number uh that was we we had set our sights on trying to get closer to the rate of inflation and so that was that was a good thing the estimated impact on the median value of home is $114 on the median valued home uh some of the uh indicators that we we're going to watch and that we have been watching a key one for me is the uh unrestricted fund balance for the general fund at the end of last year 23 it was $8.7 million or 37% 37 a half% of the general fund expenses uh our range for that indicator is 35 to 50 we were pushing the top top end of that range just a couple years ago we were at that time our range topped out at 45 we bumped it up to 50 to give ourselves a little extra breathing room but now we're kind of closer to the lower end of that range and I suspect that's kind of where we're going to be for a little bit uh so uh this is it the the budget that's being presented uh the I I'll open up for our other Commissioners for additional comments comments here you had all your comments at your discussions huh exactly Bru speaks for us that doesn't sound too we have you all we're going to work on that um you're all there to contribute that is true very true uh so we present present this budget to you Council and mayor with our recommendation for approval and includes adoption of the overall budget the capital spending plan and the proposed tax levy so we open for questions right uh questions for the commission from Council Members council member gr so I appreciate the report this is not totally new but I like your perspective and I like your analysis that's very helpful um do you see did you see anything in the budget that concerns you other than that perhaps we should look at borrowing instead of just adding on in the future years were there any other items uh well borrowing would be at the top of my list uh because I think I think we're that represents uh a a level of being quite conservative um and I think that's that's perhaps appropriately built in throughout the budgets uh or perhaps we can do a better job of of doing things such as the investment recommendations that we've made that's that that hangs out there as an open item um so very conservative budget very conservative approach uh could could we do more could we um probably okay thank I I think I had the you're good I had the opinion that seems like we've been trying to be cautious the last few years because the economy has been weird we've had very high um increases in how much we were taxing folks and so I think the hope is that if the trends continue i' hope that the city could be um less cautious about the spending trying to defer no longer trying to defer stuff until later trying to make sure that we've got enough in all the funds that's really what I'm after is trying to make sure we've got enough in all the funds in the coming years assuming the trend continues so thanks I think coming out of Co we all a bit of a cautious reaction right right other questions or feedback Council M Scher thank you guys um you know as you know Finance commission is near and dear to my heart um a couple comments um and a couple questions long-term assets definitely long-term debt is always a good thing to look at um to use your current operating to pay for a long-term asset um just about an IDI environment that doesn't make sense for a long period of time so um debt is not necessarily A Bad Thing it can be quite a good thing so that's something to think about which comes up to my question about the electric fire Tru coming up I know that um the grants some of them were turn down and I know that might be something we'll have to think about is how do we pay for that coming up because I'm not sure I believe the the uh funds are very conservative in showing even remote possibility of Grants aren't even in there and so I guess the question is are you looking at the fire Tru and then um are are you aware of any of the other grants that could possibly be coming in do you do you get any in um vision of that or sight of that so on the first electric fir Tru our expectation is that would be funded through a bond financing uh beyond that uh no decisions have been made um I let's see here I just want to jump in with I think the problem was the best information we had at the time was very uncertain as to what those financing options were what type of Grants or subsidies there were and so our Hope was that some of them would work um and we were hoping to hear back but we actually this is the first information about how some of those have gone so when I don't know I just want to check we haven't applied for any grants at this point we we apply for some uh ear marks from Congress oh not a grant but a a congressional ear Mark right and we did not get those from Senator Smith I just wanted to clarify that right or any other fund sure sure I should note also that we made the suggestion during our the course of our our budget review meetings is uh would it be worth considering uh a grant writer for the entire city as opposed to grant writing being done within each of the operating departments um and and Mr trudon said you know that took it uh I think as a suggestion that could be worth considering actually that that grant writing is a very special skill so that's that's an interesting point thank you for that and I know you'll continue to look at that one and I wanted to um your comment about the balance sheet thank you for saying that I think uh balance sheet gets under um mentioned and looked fairly often and it's good to to make that note that Rosell has a strong balance sheet and and the amount of assets we do have and you know we look at most people look at our budget and our operating you know annual operating fund but it's the balance sheet that really underlies everything that happens here so thank you for bringing that up and then um you mentioned the um we have that change in the investment policy which was looked like it was going to bring an additional um earnings possibly over time it certainly should where are we at with that uh it's still under advisement it's still being Ed at the finance department level yeah we we are looking at that that's something we'll need to bring forward to the council for official approval on that but we are looking at our asset allocation to see what we have available we we certainly want to um be cautious as we do that understanding there is a possibility of great return but also want to be cautious with that so I think in the next few months we should have a recommendation to the council okay and um yeah so those are the questions I had thank again I just want to thank you for all the work because this is is extremely important and oh the only other thing I I mention is I think the if you were here for that last commission the parks and rec I talked about what it costs to do these different projects and so that's something to also maybe consider as we're moving forward with some of these things is to um take you know broaden the scope a little bit maybe help some of these other commissions look at that side of it as well so it just I think it's it's a nice um um fit to have the commissions possibly work look as these projects together and very consistent with the direction that you've given us in the past yep okay thank you one more point on on uh debt uh uh the city has a significant debt capacity so um yes that would not take us into a dangerous territory to our rating would stay high yes council member think thinking about debt I know the council right before I was elected um started moving through Dark Ages a couple weeks before that I'll just keep talking um made some very specific uh steps and the mayor was very much a leader in that uh to move to strengthen our uh Capital Improvement uh program and making sure that we have the Assets in place What I Hear You SU adusting and we've had little nibbles on things as a uh maybe even I don't know if it's a fundamental change but certainly a strategic change to that philosophy we've seen other maybe no okay no turning the dial I would say okay so a strategic change um the uh certainly we've seen other cities who are or counties who aren't able to keep up with their assets so where are the key areas where you'd say hey this is where you'd really want to say this makes sense to borrow here and it wouldn't make sense over here uh an examp one real quick easy example would be uh each year we invest or in most years we invest a fair amount of money in police cruisers that Pro I no I have packaged those into tax exempt Bonds in the past but then you end up with multiple maturities short matori so I don't that's an example of something that probably doesn't fit very well okay um but maybe a classic exam example of something that would fit is the campus expansion and renovation long-term Improvement that would serve many many years into the future so term term I guess would be a expected life of the assets would have a lot to do with it yeah that makes sense and I think that's you know one of the things that needs to be clarified for the public too in terms of borrowing is the city can't borrow money to cover operating expenses the state law doesn't even allow cities to do that we have to balance our budget with with taxes fees and other sources of revenue for operating expenses the only place we can borrow is for Capital expenses and so that's right off the top of the board in case anybody was listening to this and going oh we should the city's talking about starting to borrow for operating expenses no we can't even do that uh but I think you're exactly right in terms of the like the length of the the time of the investment uh that makes sense and I think we always sort of had that as part of the philosophy in the discussions back in the mid you know I guess it was 2011 time frame in the sense that we're not talking about setting aside money each year in the tax levy to pay for the new city hall that we're going to build 40 years from now that doesn't make sense we would borrow money for that through bonding uh similar to actually if if the sales tax uh is approved or refund the the um Maintenance building and license center project through property taxes either way it would be something that we would bond for and borrow the funds up front and then pay that back through the the revenues that we'd be getting so I think that's exactly right is is it's though and even the fire engine with a a 20year life expectancy that's the kind of thing that would that would look to be financed through through the the bonding I think the the challenge we still wanted to have though as as a city was you know you talked about the balance sheet a huge chunk of the balance sheet is funds set aside for future capital P purchases and and it's important to have that because it it allows the the ability uh to not have to borrow for everything because then we would probably be pushing up against our our borrowing limits and that's not necessarily a great position to be in it's finding that that balance but I think you know the idea is and and I think what's happened with certain expenditures in fact I think we did that in the water fund because we don't have a lot of funds in the water fund first of all but then we also had a lot of expenditures come in a short period of time that needed to be needed to be paid for and so instead of trying to you know kind of do the the rob peter to PayPal with internal borrowing it just made sense to issue issue debt for those so I think that that you know once again we've gotten good advice from our finance director Finance staff as well as from the commission on some of those decisions and so I appreciate that uh council member strong thank you um we did not have a copy of the budget to which you were referring with numbers so I'm not sure how it corresponds to what um the city manager had proposed was that the same should be it is one and the same okay I assumed but without that data we were not sure I'm so sorry I thought uh I asked I asked what was being presented to you tonight and what no and we got it a couple weeks ago but that I already downloaded that to my Okay Google Drive anyway um and then I just was curious you know since my time on the council this plan has been for this master campus plan to be here on the City Campus as the uh Finance commission addressed it all the cost Effectiveness um and as like uh market rate of the land here versus potentially locating something like that in an more industrial area of Roseville so I realize that we currently own that property and that comes with some great asset to us but also it's in the middle of our city where probably there's a higher market rate for and this is not my area this is uh council member grath's area but just putting an industrial building to Echo um uh commissioner rager as she was departing she mentioned the sounds the noise the neighbors have made this concern and then even I've heard off-handed comments well we may have to acquire Properties or we may have to do other things to mitigate some of those concerns so I guess I would appreciate if the finance commission has brought this up um or if we'd be willing to in the future just to give us kind of a perspective with that information certainly willing to give you some perspective a terrific question uh we asked it early on in the process and it was kind of pushed in the direction of the the group that is planning the renovation and so we we didn't go too far down that road but I may be the only person asking question regularly uh it's a totally logical question to me and one that I asked early on in this process if I could I I did uh present to the finance commission a couple of months ago about the project uh the cost and kind of the staging of it um and to be quite Frank the decision to look locate over there has been made previously by the council so that wasn't something that I brought forward for alternatives to be looked at that was already looked at previously so so they were focus more on the cost the process understanding the sales tax the phasing and as we move forward as we get into bids and get into borrowing there's going to be more interaction with the finance commission nothing else updates but certainly bringing things to them about the project as we move forward I guess I would have to ask the question though are we past the point where we could actually entertain conversations and and Market the I would investigating the market for pushing to say yeah no I think we're past that point and I can't imagine that on a $72 million project that acquiring the necessary land the necessary 8 acres of land in industrial property is going to make the project cheaper um I can't even conceive of that possibility because right now we have land that we already own and it costs that much money so it seems to me the question's already been answered okay so I it doesn't seem to me something we would direct the commission to take a look at at this point okay unless I'm wrong about that I I don't think the community realizes that it's there's no going back I don't think the community is under the understanding that they're this is a done deal and they have no choice this has been concern as you come as you bring it up to people they're wondering what why are you asking us on a property tax amendment for this ballot initiative you're going to do it even if we don't want to and you're going to put it there even if we don't want it there and I think this was a decid decision before I've been on the council for three and a half years and so I don't know if it proceeded um and I so that means it proceeded council member schroer in um not to say that um there are other options but it is hard to say that a decision that was made by people who no longer involve people who no longer are on the council that that is absolutely the way it has to be um moving forward and so I find that frustrating on behalf of the community that we are we're just locked into that no matter what um and I realized that there I realized a lot of pieces have been put together and there has been studies and all kinds of other things done that did cost money but um just be there are a lot of other pieces moving parts to this and there are a lot of people are very frustrated and upset um that this continues to move forward without their um their understanding I think if they didn't realize that six years ago is when they had to have an opinion against it in order for it to to stop and to do anything further than what it's happening right now I I think the the commission doesn't have to answer that this is this is not a question that was my that was my that was not a question and I will just say that since the beginning of time there have been people serving on City councils who have made decisions that have impacted the future of the city and just because those people leave the council doesn't mean that we just stop and change everything and and go back on all the decisions that were made that's a Preposterous proposition uh it would mean chaos City business could not be done by cities if that happened now if there's a change to the majority of the council and they and there's the council that wants to take a vote to reverse a decision that's always possible there are always consequences to those decisions as well I think if the uh uh the question the ballot question doesn't pass the city does have a decision about how to finance the project going forward uh because then that option is off the table uh unless there is somehow a way to go back and try again you know which I suppose there is but it doesn't seem that once you lose that kind of vote that you're going to necessarily be successful in the short in the near term um but if if that sales tax didn't get passed by the voters the city would have to take a serious look at how we would proceed or whether we would proceed on that project but we don't know the answer to that question yet because that that hasn't happened yet uh once that happens if that's something that the council has to take a look at the council we'll certainly take a look at it um but the process to get to where this is now certainly was not without public engagement uh including hearing from Neighbors and very valid concerns about noise and other aspects of the project and I think the council also has some um some strong feelings about how the project ultimately is designed and built in terms of the impact and the visual uh relationship to the neighborhood around it and things like that so we'll be continuing uh as a council to make those decisions and will'll um uh cross those bridges as they come before us but I I wanted to just note that uh that um make those couple of points and certainly once again not a question for the commission to have to answer are there other uh uh comments or feedback or things we need to be uh looking at in terms of uh the council's uh recommendations to the commission or requests to the commission or anything else I think we are good well we appreciate you taking a look at the the budget and and certainly um it does not have to be the case that the commission says what's been brought forward by the city manager is what we recommend certainly if there were areas where you wanted to say let's take another look at it that's that is totally acceptable and we would take that uh into account as part of the decision-making process to that point I think there were a couple of things that were brought up at uh our previous Council discussion of the budget as possible additions that the city manager didn't include and I think we had this conversation last year maybe in regard to some aspects of the budget too or maybe a couple years ago um specifically the additional HR employee uh I don't think we'll ask you to take a look at city council salary discussion we'll take care of that at this level uh but I think that HR employee uh possibly if you want to have a conversation about a contribution to the Tubman who has come to the cities in the Ramsey County looking for some sort of contribution and whether that's something to add you know if you want to make a recommendation on that that's those are two things I think specifically that were brought up by the council uh to possibly consider adding back in uh if the commission wants to to to weigh into those um feel free to do so we do have to obviously on September 23rd pass our not to exceed so the council May if we decide to put some of those things in not to exceed to make sure that we have those options before us but if that's the case that would be an opportunity then for the commission to take a look at those things if we don't do that then it would be a question of what do we take out to put something like that in so you could still consider it but um I just wanted to put those out there and and certainly defer to the council if the council says no don't do that council member shorter yeah actually as a council we had not agreed on the Tubman um contrib so that was something the council did not agree on at this point so the mayor brought it up it was something that came up but we as a council we had not talked about that because it also involved not just that particular organization but should there be a policy in place how do you decide which organization are there other ones that could be also doing some of this work so that's still um I just wanted to say that part of it um um if you're looking at that you didn't want you to think that that was something we had approved and and just didn't have room for it so we're still having that conversation Mr Mayor if I could say maybe the best approach is wait until the 23rd to see what is or isn't in the budget and then if there are additions the council decides for the time being to put in uh we can bring that back to the finance commission dive a little bit deeper into those topics yeah right I think we we talked about this a little bit in our meeting and I think one of the things we just wanted to point out is we can approve the budget as we saw it um um or approve a recommendation of the budget as we saw it but our next meeting is not until after the 23rd so we offer our recommendation based on the budget we saw and we heard those ideas and we thought those sound great but we can't give any feedback about the budget because there's no time window for that but sure um yes yeah we did talk it talk talk that's true otherwise I guess I would turn to our finance director and and talk about the mechanics I mean if we wanted to try to do something like that might outside this media discussion to a follow up yeah yeah but I just wanted to note that there were a couple things that were brought up in the council discussion that may be meritorious to look at so stay tuned on that and you'll you'll find out more after our discussion next week all right thank you again thank you conversation this evening as always thank guys thank you all right that brings us to a couple of hopefully maybe more administrative type business items this evening uh the first of those is probably what would normally be on a consent agenda but because we don't have any other consent type items we've got a license liquor license request I'll turn over to Mr trudon to introduce that item yes thank you Mr Mayor as you mentioned this would typically be on the consent agenda but given it's a work session and the fact that this event is coming up we want to make sure we get this in front of the council as quickly as possible this is a temporary liquor license for Rosell Lutheran Church for their annual October Fest event on September 27th uh as you know we do limit the amount of u events people may have or um entities may have and this is the first event of 12 that they could have I think traditionally they just have this one event uh all year so they have submitted the application and everything is in order and we recommend approval of this temporary liquor license to Roseville Church all right thank you Mr trudon are there any questions on this requested liquor license temporary liquor license right hearing none doesn't appear that there's anyone from the public to speak to this item at this time doesn't appear to be the case uh given that is there a motion from the council second it's been moved by council member shter seconded by Council moretton to authorize or excuse me to approve that temporary liquor license for uh Roseville Lutheran Church as outlined in the information uh any discussion on that motion hearing none all those in favor signify by saying I I opposed that passes unanimously that license is approved and then finally uh discussion about we had made five appoint ointments to the equity and inclusion commission at our last council meeting uh and since that time one of those appointments has uh has not accepted the appointment and so that gets us down to four appointees uh and we have the question before the council is sort of are we okay with four going forward do do we feel we want to do something uh different than that um and so but maybe the starting point is are we okay with the four going forward and I'll just kind of open it up to the Council for for thoughts on that uh councilman um as part of this discussion we also need to consider that the person who turned down the appointment was one of our required two that had to have a three-year initial term so so we' still have to shift some we would have to shift some just so we're thinking about that and we don't have the motion for where we shifted people so I don't I don't remember that off hand maybe you have that there but where we put everything but that's something that we would need to discuss somehow EV in other words we don't know for sure who the other uh three-year person was or who wasn't one of the three-year persons that right we may have to see if staff can track that down for us while we're while we're discussing uh council member shorter you know I would be comfortable going ahead with the four because I to me nothing changed because we had this conversation last time and I think we agreed that um we wanted to again do this right instead of fast or you know so it's it's such an important commission so you know we all had agreed that um we didn't go to seven we went to the five because we felt those were the five that we could agree on and now that there's four I it to me it doesn't seem like anything else had changed so I guess um I would be comfortable leaving it at four and and still go ahead with the um process to try to open it up and and get even more people to um apply for this and get the right mixture so because again we want to make sure this this commission is done the right way and not and not just try to because we want to speed it up I I'd rather do it right and fast so I I'd be comfortable with the FL great other discussion uh council member short um I'd like to propose that we accept the candidate who got three out of five votes um that would normally be a majority for most of our voting unless it required a super majority um in order to get the five candidates um and then continue if they could start with the two youth Commissioners and then we would fill on our next cycle our normal cycle in the spring because this would take a little bit of time for them to get the um the ball rolling so that would be my recommendation council member graph one of the arguments I heard at the last meeting was that we needed an uneven number so that if there is uh a vote that there would be a three majority otherwise we can end up with a two two split so I would support the other candidate that I supported last time um we would still have two spots to fill and I wonder what we're going to do differently to increase the number of applicants unless we have a plan in place to really up that number I don't see that as a reason to wait we had 11 applicants for the initial seven positions so that wasn't too bad um so we've got some some thoughts towards uh keeping at four some thoughts towards going to three or going to five excuse going to three nobody mentioned that not so far sorry about that you're the first other other other thoughts from uh council members Council Moren I appreciate uh member grath's point on that on even number I'm prettyy sure it was my point um at the same time I'm not prepared to um add another person um based on the big picture here um so I guess I would lean toward uh member Schroeder's feeling about this I think the commission can still operate is that correct course yeah yeah yeah there's nothing saying you can't so for um I guess given that I'm going to lean in that direction and I think I've remembered where everyone fits so if we get to that vote then we have to come back and figure out who to flip but I think I have that so well I I have it too so that that will help so all right um well it sounds like we're kind of two to two right now on four versus five um I think the a couple of things first of all uh you know if it was another commission like the Planning Commission that was taking votes frequently I might be more concerned about the the even versus odd number of members I think this is a commission that hopefully is is working more on a consensus model anyway in sort of handling their business um um I I I wasn't one of the people that that had tallied and let's be clear we didn't vote on these we tallied you know support um I didn't tally for the the person that got three tallies um and I I don't know that I'm 100% sure that that um that I'd be supportive of of adding that individual to the commission necessarily um at this point so I I would tend to lead towards sticking with four I think just because we also have six months and we're going to have another round of appointments basically so I'd just like to point out that that person did bring a different Dynamic and a different set of lived experiences than several of the other people who I had to go back and double check that I knew which one was from which um and so I I do think if we want a truly diverse set of people that we need to make sure we pay attention to maybe someone that's out of your personal comfort zone and into something that maybe would be the best fit for the or for this group of people I don't know if it gets into the personal comfort zone but it was an evaluation of individuals but that being said um I think we need uh a motion from the Council of some sort to make a decision here so I would be looking for that motion to approve um the additional candidate with three pork uh addition to the council to make up make up of five second it's been moved by council member stra second by council member Groff to appoint and to be clear that individual is Michelle doel who had the three tallies in the previous go around uh to be the fifth member um and I'm going get to the terms in a moment I'm not sure that you're where we're at with that so um we got that motion uh discussion on the motion any additional discussion from the maker or seconder certainly don't want to preclude that opportunity well I do want to comment on that I think if we're going to ask people to be on these commissions and they make a goodfaith effort of coming in and we reject more than half of the applicants I think we're making quite a statement to the population of Roseville and I think anyone who votes against someone who was is qualified has to keep that in mind all right uh other discussion on the motion no all right we've got the motion before us to make that appointment as the fifth uh member uh all those in favor signify by saying I I I opposed n that motion does not pass that uh council member shorter Eton and mayor in opposition uh that then brings us sour we're at four unless we want to appoint somebody else but I'm not imagining based on the tallies that that is that is in the cards um that then means that we do need to make an an adjustment to add somebody from a one or twoyear appointment to the the three-year appointment that we need to make by our code I would just note that the other appointment if you've got the list the other three-year appointment was uh miss lrange the two-year appointments were Mr Chan and Miss Philip cof and the one-year appointment was Mr Vetti um one option would just be to to move the onee to the three-year I suppose or one of the two years to the three year I'll open it up to the council I don't think there's an obvious conclusion of that they all got five tallies I'm fine with moving Mr V ready I agree that there's no perfect answer and U Miss The Grange is already a three-year person so and I think that would we have four appointments I'm just doing some math here real quick so um we have to do at least a third of the four uh to the three-year terms which I think is two up to a third to a two-year term and then just the balance so one twoyear it it might be better from our perspective to to do one one one one uh one of the two-year people to a three-year term then Mr Chan to keep a of a gender split on the three years start at the top of the list okay is that a motion sure I'll second it all right motion by council member ratton seconded by council member Scher to change uh the appointment of Mr Chan from a two-year appointment to a three-year appointment to meet our code requirement for two appointments to threee terms discussion on that motion um no all right need NOP all right with that we've got the motion before us all those in favor signify by saying I I I opposed that motion passes all right passes four to zero with an exstension from council member St I think that takes care of the business on that item I would just mention the first meeting of the EIC is this Wednesday two days from now no okay I'll be doing the oath of office and montz will be running the meeting St excellent look forward to that that then brings us to um future agenda review Mr Tron y let me just pull it up so uh got a combination of regular meetings and uh as well as some strategic planning uh next Monday we are looking at the city budget a preliminary City budget and Levy we also um and I sent an email out uh late this afternoon about um the water uh meter deposits and a possible option to um refund those using the sanitary sewer fund balance um so look for that case we also have a preliminary plan and comprehensive plan uh change at 2865 Hamlin Avenue that's property owned by Rosell Covenant Church to split that into a couple Lots Planning Commission did um take that up and did recommend to approve all that I would mention a couple days later on the 25th you have the focus group for the city council and the strategic planning from 4:00 to 6:30 that'll be in the Willer room downstairs uh department heads did uh their uh focus group last Tuesday uh it was really good so um hope you uh will enjoy as much as we did and then after that we'll have our next uh our first I should say get together on October 11th which is on the uh on part of the slide October 7th we'll have a a meeting where we'll look at the recycling contract as well as the CAR contract kind of part and parcel so look first at the recycling contract overall and then depending on what's chosen whether or not to go with a recycling cart we do have some uh RightWay vacations again uh to continue that and the possibility of receiving the utility rate study from ERS so we can start setting our utility rates but still in flux we're still trying to sort that out if that's going to work for them but uh we will be doing that soon on the 11th as I mentioned we that's a Friday uh strategic planning from 1: to 5:00 p.m. we are going to be in the Fireside room at the OVA um that is the more desirable place to hold it um from the consultant U we still in the Willow Room for the focus group just because the Fireside room wasn't available so okay uh but we'll try to do that as much as possible in the fire side room and then on the 14th we have another work session we have um Ramsey County Commissioner mayor Joe Maguire coming along with some staff to talk about a variety of issues we also want to uh have an initial discussion about Police Department staff allocation study and um what some possibilities are there would also mention also from the county but separate uh we'll have some representatives from the Community Development Department to talk about their upcoming legislation about the H Eda um they're looking provide information may recall that pops up in a couple years and uh this year uh to their credit they're trying to get ahead of uh new legislation and talk to cities first uh before that so we'll have a presentation from uh that staff as well and that is the future agenda all right questions on the future agenda or future agenda items from council members uh or leaz on reports announcements po Peri right doesn't appear to be the case uh the only item left on our agenda is a motion to adour so moved moved by council member gra second by council member Aton to adjourn no discussion on a motion to adjourn all those in favor signify by saying I I I opposed that passes unanimously and we adjourned at 8:15 p.m. thank you everyone e e e e for