This transcript is for a **Hastings Planning Commission** meeting. Based on the context provided in your list and the internal dialogue of the transcript, here are the speaker identifications. **Note on Speakers:** * **Gino Messina** is identified as the Chair. * **Justin Fortney** is the City Planner (Staff) presenting the report. * **Chad Smava** is the applicant/developer. * **Rachel Swedin** is the commissioner referred to phonetically as "sedine" or "Sweden." * **Bryan Braun** is the commissioner referred to phonetically as "y Bron." *** [0:00] **Gino Messina (Chair):** Hastings Planning Commission meeting for March 11th 2024 uh regular meeting call the meeting to order all right first up is the uh oath of office for commissioner Tyken for his next term stand all right raise your right hand repeat after me I state your name [0:07] **Chris Tyken:** I Chris Tyken do affirm that I will support the Constitution of the United States of America [0:15] **Gino Messina (Chair):** do affirm that I will support the Constitution of the United States of America the constitution of the state of Minnesota [0:24] **Chris Tyken:** the constitution of the state of Minnesota and the charter and ordinances of the city of Hastings and that I will Faithfully discharge the duties of a planning commissioner for the city of Hastings [0:37] **Gino Messina (Chair):** and the charter and ordinances of the city of Hastings and that I will Faithfully discharge the duties of Planning Commission for the city of Hastings counties of Dakota and Washington and state of Minnesota [0:47] **Chris Tyken:** counties of Dakota and Washington and state of Minnesota according to the best of my ability and understanding [0:53] **Gino Messina (Chair):** according to the best of my ability and understanding all right thank you thank you all right welcome back all right moving on next one is the uh election of the Planning Commission chair and vice chair and I think in the past what we've done is anybody uh wants to nominate themselves or somebody else we'll take discussion on that otherwise I will um be glad to continue in my role as chair the only requirement to uh serve as the chair Vice chair is that you've been on the commission for a year um but anyone can make the motion and vote okay commissioner Halberg do you want to oh I'm sorry oh commissioner Peters go ahead [2:07] **Melanie Peters:** I was just going to make a motion for commissioner Messina to be chair and commissioner Halberg for vice chair is do we have a vice chair? [2:14] **Gino Messina (Chair):** we do okay yep okay so we have a motion on the table for myself to remain as chair and commissioner Halberg as Vice chair do we have any further discussion I'll second it [2:23] **Chris Tyken:** I'll second it. [2:25] **Gino Messina (Chair):** okay second commissioner Tyken any new discussion if not all in favor say I **Commissioners:** I, I, I. [2:32] **Gino Messina (Chair):** opposed? right that motion carries I thank you I appreciate that thank you commissioner Halberg congratulations to you as well [2:39] **Angela Halberg (Vice Chair):** thank you very much so look forward to another good year [2:42] **Gino Messina (Chair):** all right approval of the minutes from January 8th for those of us that were in attendance were there any corrections or additions? no? okay if not we'll consider those to be approved and welcome to commissioner Swedin I think this is her second meeting right all right all right next up is uh public hearing we do not have any public hearings so the next one will be other actions uh storage work site plan 2024-25 Spiral Boulevard Justin Fortney will have the staff report on that [3:07] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** yes thank you very much chair Messina uh the current uh owner recently purchased the property uh in blue at the bottom of the screen from the city of Hastings it's between the property he owned in Spiral Boulevard this purchasing that property allowed him to have legal access to Spiral Boulevard from his property and it also allowed him to have the minimum Acres required to split the property in half because there's a 10 acre minimum in agricultural District uh at the time the lot was just about 19 just over 19 acres and that included property that went to the center line of the road that would have to be platted for right of way um at that time he also received approval for septic systems um as the property is not served by any City Utilities he was at the time proposing to construct his home on the Northern lot and sell the southern parcel it appears that the northern lot has been sold and uh the subject uh site plan we're looking at is for the southern lot which is that orange lot with the X in addition to the the blue triangle those properties have all been combined and and platted as uh two separate Lots the site was mostly wooded with a mixture of trees and scrub recently um the areas of the level ground were clear cut during a review of a proposed development um a tree inventory is uh taken where there's large stands of trees and a preservation plan is required in line with the city's tree preservation guidelines um at that at this at this time this this was never done uh the applicant for the site plan states that the current property owner who is selling the property removed the trees um the tree preservation guidelines are not adopted as a ordinance requirement but it is a tool for planning uh sites for Development and Construction to um plan logically around natural resources and not remove trees that don't need to be removed for construction uh the applicant uh recently developed two city-owned lots in industrial park at 3 3,1 lightborn court and 2030 Spiral Boulevard with similar storage units go to the next picture here uh this shows the configuration of the parcel we'd be are looking at um the proposed use is allowed by zoning and it's in line with the designation land use of the comprehensive plan in the agricultural District um an allowable use is Storage Rental facilities subject of site plan review um these are some photographs taken uh the top one is from July of 23 and then the the bottom one is current conditions you can see the trees have been removed um obviously the time of year is different there's leaf on conditions on the top picture and not the bottom one and then here's another picture um from a little further to the South this is a site plan proposal for the um storage units um the building setback requirements in the agricultural district is 20 ft from the property line in the front which would be Spiral Boulevard and 10 ft on the sides there's quite a bit more than that on the on the side um along Glendale Avenue because there's a Glendale road I think it's it is um because of the the drive aisle there and then most of the buildings are quite a bit further back except for the first building to the West which is on the bottom of this uh sheet um it's at the minimum setback from the from this property line along Spiral Boulevard uh it's uh 20 ft as far as uh vehicular access and circulation goes it's it's fairly adequate um as you can see the the site is designed to have a very large Drive aisle near these larger buildings and then um most of the buildings can be uh navigated around except for the the second one up from the bottom those two buildings um as you can see there's not a way to drive through over there so when you come in from the driveway uh to get into that area you have to make a very sharp right which is the the only issue that presently we've identified on the site um we had discussions with the applicant about a couple of issues one of them was there was a very short uh queuing area for uh vehicles that would pull up to the the gate as you'd enter uh the applicant stated that he doesn't believe that there's going to be queuing because Vehicles will come into the site so quickly um with an automated gate they could come in but um staff was concerned that if there was an issue there was not room for a second car and it would be out into the road um so the applicant was able to reconfigure the driveway to be a little bit longer um to allow quite a bit more space there's it looks like 52 ft there might be some Boulevard area too there that would allow um some additional vehicle stacking there um the other issue is that uh sharp turn um you know once a vehicle would be coming into that driveway they're going to have to make that that sharp right turn uh to get into this uh the large area of the three buildings back there um and they had provided a a turning radius um plan for a fire truck um with which shows that the the truck can make that turn and get in there and make turns throughout the site um and I had written the staff report um with uh not noting that the stacking had been alleviated and that uh there was a turning radius chart showing that the a fire truck can make that turn um having some more conversations with the engineering department um we came to the conclusion that we don't understand why the drive aisle can't be or the driveway can't be realigned slightly to just reduce the the that sharp turning radius there considering it's the it's the only way to get into those areas and um the engineering department had some different ideas uh of of easy ways to just slightly adjust the the driveway without totally relocating it and having to deal with any kind of major grade issues one of them was to just locate it just a little shift it over to the north a little bit to smooth out that right turn uh radius that would be the one on the left here and then uh the one on the right would change the the the angle of that driveway coming in from Spiral Boulevard this is a landscape plan showing the the planting of the of the trees and the shrubs and showing the landscape Turf area um and another thing that I wanted to mention was the um I have some well I can do it on on this one here there's going to be a phasing plan rather than building all these buildings um right on the outset they're proposing to build uh the phase one which would be the first row of buildings on the west and I'm probably confusing you but on this picture that would be you know the the main large buildings on the North and then um that would be approximately from this spring to uh spring 2025 and then the following uh phase would be June 2025 to May of 2026 that would be uh the one row of two buildings to the east that would be on the other side of that wide Drive aisle there and then the final phase which would be the bottom two buildings here would be um June 2026 to May 2027 um typically our site plans uh would expire after a year but as long as they started the phasing plan and start a construction uh we would propose to allow the phasing plan um as long as the site is developed per the for the approved proposal that um it would it would not expire until after that may 2027 date we've done that on some other uh site plans that are um approved with a a scheduled plan on the tree schedule would require 80 trees based on the perimeter size and the amount of pavement on the site um and they're proposing um 80 trees some of the trees are more of a uh a compact variety which which we do allow as long as they have a mature height of 10 ft at least and then 65 shrubs are also required and proposed on the site this is an existing uh facility that the applicant had done um this one is at uh Spiral Boulevard 2030 um I there's going to be also a fencing around the site uh the decorative fence um I don't know if we have a a sheet on that but I was imagining something similar to this would be along the front of the site uh Spiral Boulevard and then around the side of Glendale road and the the opposite side of the front would be a black vinyl coated chain link fence and then on the West Side Up Against the hill would be a galvanized chain link fence this is the um architectural elevations of the of the structures I have a couple printouts you can pass out just cuz the color might be a little bit better on those but it's similar to what's in the staff report um it's showing um I think the colors would be similar to the other sites one of the differences I believe is the the roof on this is going to be a product called galvalume which is going to the applicant says would have a um a light grayish light tannish or brownish color um these are pretty flat roofs and he didn't think it would be very visible from the ground um I'm not sure if there'll be much visibility if their grades different I know uh as you come down Spiral Boulevard it's a little bit higher and there's also you houses up on the hill but um my original concern was that it would be a a highly um reflective galvanized um uh material but um he had stated that that's not the case with this this galvalume product um and then the photometric plan that we have um shows that there's acceptable light levels at the property line um under one foot candle which is required for or commercial areas The Only Exception is on the very corner where that building is 20 ft from the property line it gets up a little bit higher probably I had to scale it but it's probably about 1.5 foot candles but there I looked and there's a a street light in that area anyway so I don't know that um that that would be any cause for concern um especially you know this isn't um abutting a residential um neighborhood in close proximity to there the light fixtures are all wall packs and um uh reflecting downward that was the last one um and then uh we did meet with the police department and went over some of their security uh protocols and it seemed like the Police Department was um was okay with all their protocols that were in place and would continue any kind of conversations in the future um with with any of those um uh issues that could arise so staff would like to recommend approval of the plan if the turning radius could be improved or there's a compelling reason from the applicants on why those uh that those PL or alternate ideas couldn't be developed to reduce those that sharp turn um after you come into the site on Friday I emailed um the applicant those those suggestions I haven't I haven't heard back from them yet but I'm sure they would be willing to go over those now um but with that I can answer any questions from the from the commission or um they could uh speak with the the applicant [19:02] **Gino Messina (Chair):** okay thanks Justin who would like to start? Commissioner Halberg. [19:05] **Angela Halberg (Vice Chair):** Justin just for clarification on the architectural standards um the understanding that everything will be allowed without the subsequent site plan approvals if schedule timing is followed so there's no way to deviate in that time as long as they're staying on the correct schedule they don't have to come in front of us are any changes to? [19:28] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** yeah as long as they are constructing what was approved in line with what's in the staff report they wouldn't have to come for any subsequent approvals [19:37] **Angela Halberg (Vice Chair):** okay I just want okay I just want to double check and then my other thought was the my concern was the the fire department trying to get their trucks in so okay thank you [19:48] **Chris Tyken:** commissioner thank you Mr chair uh when does the Landscaping have to be done by? [20:01] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** um well if it's not put in by by the the end of the season it would have to be have an escrow account set up for it so um depending on the well I guess the Landscaping could all be put in right away because I don't think the I guess that would be up to them if they wanted to put it all in or if they wanted to Escrow it um so they would have to put it in by end of the season [20:30] **Chris Tyken:** I mean they have a year to do it? [20:32] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** well I mean by the end of the season after it's finished so if if this first building is supposed to be done by um spring next year then that season they'd have to put it in [20:45] **Chris Tyken:** okay so it's based on when they complete the first [20:48] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** correct [20:49] **Chris Tyken:** and they have to put 100% of it in? [20:53] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** um well I'm not I'm not I'm not familiar with um a phasing plan I don't know that it's ever come up before um but but it's going to have to either in or escrow um I think since I think I think since they are going to be putting in the the pond and all the major improvements it would have to be in right away okay plus I don't know if they'd want to have an escrow account open for that many years [21:28] **Chris Tyken:** okay so they would have to Escrow by the end of next growing season right correct unless they put it in okay I just want to make sure it was done in a timely fashion and not wait till all the buildings are up in case there's a delay there and then um do we ever talk about snow removal on these can they push snow into that pond? is that allowed? [22:00] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** um I mean yeah I I don't think there's any ordinances against that [22:04] **Chris Tyken:** okay and then I'd be supportive of adding uh condition in there to uh work with engineering on improving that driveway so thank thank you Mr chair [22:15] **Gino Messina (Chair):** all right thanks commissioner Tyken commissioner Peters [22:19] **Melanie Peters:** uh my main question is if the the part that goes in first is the like when we look on the screen here it's that bottom row that's the phase one looking at the site the pictures right now because all of those trees have been removed already what condition for the next up to three years will the remaining part of the site be in you know because it right now it just looks like it's just dirt and I understand like um the perimeter of the site must have erosion control is that during the construction or is that afterward and what is happening with that space in the next two to three years when there's nothing there [23:08] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** well it wouldn't be allowed to be dirt but I think the applicant can come up in and talk to what they would do in that area um during the phasing yeah do you want you want that's a lot of we we're going to have more questions so I think it'd be easier if you just come up to the podium here and and just um go ahead and state your name and so for and your address there [23:45] **Chad Smava (Applicant):** Chad Smava W12322 888th Avenue River Falls Wisconsin um so is there a pointer well so on phase one the driveway will be set up with everything west of this building everything east of that building all of the excavation and site I think most of them could see use absolutely greatest yeah thank you I'm not a tech person but I can do that okay so I'll try to move slow so does everybody see my cursor um by the driveway okay so underneath it or is West so this is West so that will all be complete with curb and asphalt and Landscaping and coming right across here everything below that Arrow will be installed so asphalt and that needs to be done for water regulations everything here to the east of my little arrow or going this way will all all of the excavation and site work will be done on month one let's say for the entire site so that will all be done and so it'll all be to the correct contour and then what will happen is it's going to get overseeded so it'll look kind like your backyard or you know something of that nature um and it will remain then in that state with the fences up so like he said the decorative fence and I probably would I think we can take under very good consideration that we would put in the trees then along Glendale um because like I said we will have all the excavation done we'll have all of our points set on the site which again are required just for the Minnesota water quality standards which um will be meeting code whereas right now for example this it's not that this isn't meeting the rules it's just because it's in an undeveloped state but when we get done here probably June it's going to be a lot better better higher water quality standards being met with water cleanliness and is is there right now um our Engineers um indicated that so so as a passer by you would see our fence up you'd see the gate up decorative gate you'd see the landscape on the hill cuz that's where majority of it will be going and I'll take my cursor when I say the hill it's the it's primarily the piece that the city sold to the current owner um it's a beautiful Hillside and so we're going to be looking to extend that down if you will with much landscape and trees um so I so our intent is that it will look visually appealing because um if it doesn't people don't see it as secure they don't feel comfortable with it if it's not appearing to be similarly maintained to kind of like their yard then people's trust in us evaporates and we don't have a business [27:31] **Melanie Peters:** keep going I have a couple of followup questions that um and one of these questions might be for you Justin I don't see while I I hear what you're saying I don't see that documented in here so there's nothing that would hold you know the project accountable for doing that cuz what I'm hearing you say is that it'll be graded and then overseeded um I think that would be important to have in here you have very valid reasons but it's not in the plan so there's not really anything to hold you to that [28:13] **Chad Smava (Applicant):** and we're very happy to do that [28:15] **Melanie Peters:** okay and then Justin this is I think a question for you but um or possibly for you as well would it then if it's overseeded would that then be maintained so that it doesn't um you know I I don't know if some of the nuisance ordinances would come over that uh you know if it was overgrown with weeds and things like that um would nuisance ordinances apply to like once it is overseeded to keep it well maintained during the three-year project [28:44] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** yeah um in the conditions in the staff report number two and three are applicable to your questions number two says that all Disturbed areas of the property shall be stabilized with rooting vegetation cover to eliminate erosion control problems and um as far as maintaining that uh vegetative cover that is uh something that is in several uh ordinances um that must be uh maintained and and and kept um cut although you know in the past you know this site has been pretty wild um but with more trees than anything um number three any unaccompanied site work must be escrowed at 125% of the estimated value prior to issuance of the certificate of occupancy so that's where I was saying and any of the Landscaping that they don't put in they have to put up uh 125% escrow uh account for that [29:43] **Melanie Peters:** yeah I guess my my question would be for number two there's just no timeline associated with that so like all Disturbed areas have to be stabilized with rooting vegetative cover does that begin immediately or once the project is is done just because I wouldn't want it to like you know erode or anything during that build phase [30:03] **Chad Smava (Applicant):** so so we will probably finish up excavation which is the site work minus the trees probably finishing that up by mid June and so we would be then doing the seeding immediately thereafter like immediately and that would have to be done before we can remove the um water erosion control erosion control barriers along regulations right thank you [30:33] **Melanie Peters:** thank you [30:35] **Gino Messina (Chair):** any other questions before I dive into mine? any other questions? okay I have some questions so um under the existing condition paragraph here I can you can we go back in time for just a bit here I just want to find out what happened here where the um where the um the tree inventory this was was never done what wasn't done exactly where it says under existing condition during review of proposed development a tree inventory and preservation plans required in line with the city tree preservation guidelines this was never done the current property owner who was selling the property removed all the trees so I'm trying to figure out what what does that mean exactly what because I was a little surprised to be honest with you on what happened with this property when all of a sudden everything was was gone and there wasn't anything there I mean I've been now I've been I live in the area yeah and then all of a sudden we have this gaping hole with and I don't remember that being part of the original I thought we were talking about a house on the one side and houses on the other and so I need to go back in time a little bit and kind of figure out how we got from the original reason for the sale purchase to this before I can go on with my additional questions about the actual site plan itself [31:47] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** yeah well I mean it was a surprise to staff we had been talking with with the property owner um for quite a while and it was always his plan to build his house there on the North and uh sell the other parcel assuming for another house I think that was kind of the way it was it was discussed um uh the last time I think I remember talking to him he wanted to know if he could build his garage first and then his house and then um he had asked prior to that if he could uh clean up the site he said there was some old uh mining equipment and um stuff that's been dumped and he said he just wanted to uh clean up the site and then um kind of clear the area where the where the house would go and um and then I started getting calls from uh people with commercial interests in the property and I found out that the the Lots were for sale and um none of them were were uh interested in in buying it for a home site and then um I went to take pictures for the for this um review and that's when I saw that all the trees were gone [32:59] **Gino Messina (Chair):** okay so that was one of my first concerns was how we got to this point today um okay um well nothing we can do I mean the trees are gone so they're gone but um the second thing is this driveway so I've been I've lived in the area now for 18 years I've been on Spiral Boulevard in the winter time here's my concern um I know we're worried about fire trucks turning radius once you get in the lot however uh Spiral Boulevard in the morning usually is iced over pretty good and anybody who wants to go down that Hill it's a steep hill if you've never been on Spiral Boulevard it's a fairly Steep Hill it's not a gradual descent and there's a curve there's two Curves in there my concern is if you have somebody going down that hill and they want to take a left and take a sharp left into this into this facility and they have to wait for that gate and they choose to wait on Spiral Boulevard and somebody comes down behind them they're going to slide right into them I have slid down that Hill many times I know how to navigate it because I'm used to it the other issue is um traffic on Glendale Avenue and Spiral Boulevard has increased exponentially over the last few years and I don't know it has to probably do with 61 people have figured out the shortcut around um and when you come down that intersection you have to time it just right cuz traffic is not coming down that hill on Glendale at 45 miles hour from 316 they're coming down at 65 or 70 I know because I've seen it um which means you have to time that turn just right when traffic is coming to the from the uh to the north on Glendale um if they take left onto Spiral Boulevard in the winter time you cannot just come to a stop if somebody is waiting to queue up or waiting to turn in there and then expect to make it up that hill you have to go and so that's been you have to just keep going because that's what gives you momentum to get up that hill otherwise it's going to be dangerous when cars are coming around there there's nothing to slow them down to make that turn and they're usually accelerating by the time this driveway I I by the time where you get to this driveway um fire trucks I I don't know if they if you've ever driven one of those I've driven motor coaches buses before the Turning races on those those are tight you're not going to get that tight those take a lot longer I can't even I can't even begin to tell a fire truck pulling into there in any way shape or form to get in there but that I think that needs to be I think that whole entrance thing needs to be redone your your entrance is coming in off of a hill so that's an issue for me um so I just want to make sure that goes on the record as that the other thing too is the houses you know when I think of something that makes sense the other two storage facilities that you have by the way look very nice they were done very well very tasteful the Landscaping the architecture was great the placement was perfect they fit you don't notice any issues couple Bright Lights there were the sign is make it a little bit hard to turn off of um Voyageur Parkway on the on the Spiral Boulevard because that bright light's coming in your eye when you make that turn but that's fine um but they're very Tastefully done and they fit where they go but now we have storage we have we have the houses up on Glacier then we have the houses up on Voyager we've got the two or one or two houses that are across the street from where this is going to be and then you've got the property just to the north of that um and now we want to just kind of put the storage facility right in the middle and it just doesn't seem to fit for me personally I I I know that it's I know that it's agricultural compound I got that so we're good so that's dispense of all that it's a a suitable use for the property but it's just I think we're just cramming too much in there I don't think that this property is the right place for this much commercial building especially where that driveway is um and you expressed concerns about the driveway several times throughout this presentation so obviously it's been in it's it's been on people's minds so I have a real concern with just in general this site plan as being adequate for this for this lot just because of the way it's designed I think it's just too much um and I do have another concern too with the roof if you do live up on Voyager Parkway or excuse me Rushmore Drive if you live on Rushmore Drive your house used to overlook woods and more woods and then a river now it's going to overlook four storage roofs and you know how reflective are they going to be there's no guarantee so I I don't know I don't I just have a I have so many more questions about how this how we got to this point from the original reason why we approved this in the first place to this and I know we always don't look at intent and things can change and I get that part but this is such a dramatic change from the original plan or the intent that I'm having a real issue with that so I'd be happy to hear anybody else with any additional comments but do you understand where I'm coming from we we we got to a point that none of us saw coming I mean it was we we're in that camp as well we were equally as surprised yeah kind of learning learning a few things matter of fact um but that driveway is a m is a real concern I know that intersection it's getting busier and busier um you're going to have issues there and you're not going to get a fire truck to make a right turn in there I you're just not going to not anything bigger than maybe a little rescue truck that'd be about it but that's my concerns at this point so I'm happy to hear my other Commissioners department they have any other things but right now you know it's not something I can move forward with as far as I'm concerned so commissioner Tyken [39:09] **Chris Tyken:** thank you Mr chair I I'll back you up on this um but to me it's are we going to set the direction of this space as commercial or do we want to keep it as more agricultural residential um I 100% agree with you it's we're setting the direction for that neighborhood and I don't know which way is right yeah cuz it's currently zoned agricultural right and storage facilities are appropriate use in agricultural so that's that's not to be that's not the question but but if we allow this then right we're attracting more commercial into that area right and it just doesn't seem to fit you know if this was up in the other in this in the um industrial park across from of your other ones where that big huge open field was I'd have no problem with it because now you've got commercial agriculture whatever it might be and then you have the town homes the apartments and then the surrounding houses and it seems to fit but this doesn't seem to fit what we're looking at that area for and based on what we where the understanding was so so I'll go back and and reiterate I would be supportive of it if the commission as a whole feels like we want to do commercial down there if we don't want to do commercial down there then we probably shouldn't interject something and spot Zone it in my my view thank you Mr chair [40:48] **Gino Messina (Chair):** yeah you're welcome okay Commissioners commissioner Peters [41:00] **Melanie Peters:** question um what is currently like on the other side of Spiral Boulevard right there that's also empty space right now can we pull up an over intended for to go there cuz I'm looking so that would be the South and it is zoned agricultural but there you go there's the wider view right so what's intended cuz I think you're right like we have the development up on the top of the hill that's on Rushmore but then what goes even because I can kind of see like is it all open space at South of south of Spiral Boulevard and if so that's zoned agriculture but what what is it intended to be you know years years through now what's in the comprehensive plan there [41:51] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** uh the comprehensive plan has all the surrounding property um to the east and north and south as agricultural um the property to the um oh I probably have my directions yeah that's right to the South is owned by the city um and we don't have any intention of having that area developed um we use that property for uh some miscellaneous uh material Storage off and on um you know on this east side it's there's a lot of large lot homes that are there so there's um not a lot of potential for uh development of of multiple Lots um this area is outside of the Municipal service areas so it's um had not been intended to be used to as an area where there would be a lot of density or uh City Utilities extended um you know that could change with the relocation of the um of the sewer plant [42:51] **Angela Halberg (Vice Chair):** but on here on it says on the comprehensive 2040 plan it is designated for that area is industrial so I and I I I get where my other Commissioners are are saying I have questions concerns about the entrances and whatnot but I do think that going by what our purview is and deciding whether or not you know we want something to be this or we want something to be that I don't think we have that purview we have to look at things as a case-by-case basis um I think based on what our purview is I think it fits in this plan this site plan fits but there are concerns on the plan itself the entrances the stuff that Justin brought up about the concerns with the traffic and the turns in and out especially during winter um I've sliden slid down that road as well so I think there's some things to really kind of look back can reconsider and think about um but I I do think that this does fit what we're asked to do [44:03] **Gino Messina (Chair):** okay thanks commissioner Halberg [44:05] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** commissioner could I could I just make one clarification go ahead the the comprehensive plan um guides this property and the surrounding ones for agricultural [44:21] **Angela Halberg (Vice Chair):** agricultural okay [44:22] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** um there was a misprint in the in in one section of the staff report that said industrial but the chart is correct that shows which all the properties are guided for [44:31] **Bryan Braun:** okay I'm sorry commissioner Braun go ahead yeah I just have a question something that shows up in the site plan that I don't know if it's really addressed necessarily but there's those triple culverts that come across the end of spiral and I believe and I was also wondering um Glendale's County 91 I believe right so I'm not sure if anybody at the county gets a pass at this or needs to get a pass at this um but I do know just having seen it happen being familiar with the area and some of the infrastructure um I've seen that over top I'm not sure if it's under capacity or you know we've just been getting more intense rain events um but it does appear to cross over the corner of the property line and then there's some pretty tight you know side slopes and grading down into that ditch along Glendale um and I just don't know where you know you um applicant wants to address this but I do have a comment also [45:34] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** uh we did send a copy of the site plan to the county and they responded that they don't they don't review uh site plans sure um they only review uh work that's being done uh they did they were involved um in the the major driveway that the owner put in onto uh Glendale Road on the on the Northern lot because it took quite a bit of fill and also has uh culverts under that um but yeah normally the County's access changes right [46:13] **Bryan Braun:** but just knowing the lay of land out there those triple culverts drain kind of the entire as far up as 316 if not a little further um yeah and I've just seen a lot of water concentrated right at the corner of that building you know 30 ft yeah um from the corner of that building I just hate to have it become an issue doesn't look like one now when everything's really really dry um but yeah I've seen that entire intersection underwater [46:42] **Gino Messina (Chair):** so uh yes I have two can I yeah um so that was my I wrote down drainage that was one of my other questions I I know it says here in the conditions approved um the city engineering department has approve a required drainage plan um yeah that famous winter when we had uh the waterfalls coming down the hill from the melting snow because melted so quickly granted this winter nothing like that but it was it overtook the whole entire intersection it over to the point where you couldn't drive through it um and that was with all of the foliage and all of the naturalness of the area so my other concern is we're take we took all that out trees are gone it's now nice and flat and now if we have another winter like that and we will okay um and we have that massive amount of drainage or we have one of those those those rainstorms that we get that water is now going to come from those Hills down from where those houses are above and it's going to come right down into those storage units um and I'll tell you what it's coming at a fast pace because it's coming from Glacier the houses up on Glacier it's coming from Spiral Boulevard it's coming from the houses up on Rushmore and it's coming down those Hills and it all converges at that one intersection um I know the city you know I'm not an engineer Price is but I'm not I'm not an engineer but I'm just going by by personal experience I have seen that intersection and that property underwater for um amount of time during either like a large melt event or um heavy rain event so just just a heads up on that and now we've taken that natural drainage out of there and replacing it with flat I mean concrete and whatever else the whatever else is going to be in there so that's just my other concern do you want to go ahead and you had something to reply to sorry I was keep going like I don't I apologize if I'm not following protocol [48:47] **Chad Smava (Applicant):** so part of taking a look at this um starting from the what we started with um involves a lot of conversation with John Hinzman he's kind of our primary contact and um and John Caven and so um we've probably been talking to them for um probably since about October when we first proposed this so um that was actually I think John Caven was our first call if if I'm not mistaken um because of exactly what you just said um water on the hill and water through the um um ditches so as part of working with with them and working well with them is listening to them and listening to I'd say it's wisdom but if we didn't listen it might become just something they tell us but my point is um we listen and one of the earlier changes was that we had a building I should say along in this area here because we do have a lot of space where we could have built a building and it fit um it fit uh but after working with John and both John's I guess um the recommendation was for Aesthetics purposes please don't do it and for um making sure that we protect ourselves in the way that you just mentioned from Water Rising that we back off and so we backed off and we added um significantly more grass and I want to say 25 ft approximately was added when the building was taken off so along Glendale there's a very large larger strip that's on our property that um we we we we agreed to do seemed like the right thing um also this site has a natural slope to it and that natural slope right now is kind of like this but what happens when the pond gets built is that's perfect sand and so what's going to happen with that sand is it's going to be layered across the basically the eastern part of the site to bring it up approximately six feet and then making sure that we have the proper um grass or greeneries not the quite the right word but the proper Turf I think to make sure that it is not going to wash away and part of it is that we at our expense um will be adding that rip rap which is those little dots right there to protect us and protect it wash out from the for the County's perspective um so I think and and we had our engineer Johnson Scholfield as part of all those conversations and um I think everyone's feeling that we won't have it and because for insurance purposes we probably wouldn't have be able to insure it um if if we didn't take this um when it comes to the hillside that was a very so first thing our first thing out of the shoot was and again this was us just not wanting to create a problem where it doesn't exist but we do I think as you saw we own I don't know 40 50 60 ft up that hill and the first thing we said is we don't just volunteer we don't want to touch that what you have working from there West is working so we didn't we didn't and we won't be touching any of that um and based on now this is this Engineers so I I'm not going to be able to get into an argument or debate with anybody on this um except to say that how the water comes down is that it supposedly soaks in but in case it doesn't so the way the hill is designed and the type of soils that are there that is to is what's happening I'm told and what will continue to happen and again because we didn't touch it but we do have a very very large Swale that is not on this one but a very large Swale and I'm going to kind of point and a Swale is a fancy way of saying a a a turfed ditch that is several feet down so anything that would come off of there um would be caught and this wide in deep ditch and then transported um to the north side of the property and that was I Johnson and Scholfield and John Caven are pretty much the ones who have those kind of conversations and we're obviously we're paying the bill but um you know we we didn't disagree with them at all we we're going with what their expertise says [53:40] **Gino Messina (Chair):** okay perfect [53:42] **Chad Smava (Applicant):** with regard to the driveway um so yeah I've guess I've worked with the city of Hastings in this same group for probably five years or so um it's been a good relationship and obviously that was something we want to continue um and so just like I mentioned the ditch was some feedback and the water down the hill was feedback from the city um the city did yeah the the team probably about two and a half weeks ago when when we sit down with all the engineers from the city and ourselves and our engineers and it was brought up that the driveway while it would have been large longer in length than the one that we have up at the top of the hill at our site at spiral the city um Engineers recommended that we add significantly onto here so at this point we do have and so we we we definitely took that feedback and went back to Johnson and Scholfield and made sure that it could work cuz again we want to we want to make sure that we have a good relationship with City because obviously we have many years here that you know we we want to work well at city it's just easier um so we have right now 65 ft from the Spiral Boulevard to the gate um right now and well so and I think I say I think because I have to sit with Johnson Scholfield until they say it as Engineers that it can work doesn't matter what I think but I think that based on what I know even though we adjusted uh here in the last two weeks basically redid this entire driveway um I think we see and understand also the feedback that came up I think last Thursday which is um I think what Justin was pointing to here today so we're interested in doing that because we want to have a good relationship and I think that also it will benefit us from from having a softer turn once you do get in um with regard to the the the the the stacking space let's say from what cars can stack we do have um 65 ft right now that would um be from the curb to our gate and right now I believe we're about 30 ft at the top of the hill so we doubled it um from what we have there again based on the city's kind of second round of feedback and I think now the third round we're hearing if we can round that off and and make life easier for the fire department I you'd hear me as a saying yes I just need to sit down with Johnson Scholfield and get to yes with them um part of the orientation is the clientele that we'll use buildings 1 2 9 and 3 and 8 they all face that 60 foot wide driveway for a reason you mentioned coaches and travel trailers and people with 35 foot River worthy boats that's where those people will land we're they're larger storage units there and through our Rental process we we would not feed those customers into uh a death trap in 6 5 7 and 4 obviously just to be clear it's not a death trap what we have here on the side what we have on the east side is exactly what we have um at at our other site which works very well thank you I'm not the marketer he is it does work well um I mean City had some other feedback they wanted a little bit more grass along spiral so um of course we did that um I don't maybe recall offhand other things but I don't think we said I don't think we fought or said no or tried to twist anything to benefit us [57:25] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** suggestions yeah just like this new once uh entrance change [57:29] **Chad Smava (Applicant):** yeah Justin you're the one that kind of helped us come up with the entryway as we see it for the stacking I'm glad you said something because we would have probably regretted that long term [57:42] **Gino Messina (Chair):** my other question is there's nothing in the conditions about no outside storage being allowed and I do recall on the other ones that was a condition we just had it in there as a as a formality [57:56] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** yeah I mean we can add that condition um there's ordinances that would kind of prohibit it to to a certain degree um because it would have to be screened um but but yeah we we can add that in [58:11] **Gino Messina (Chair):** I think that was a boiler plate one that we had on the other ones yeah so just for anyone that's planning to make a motion I would recommend um adding that as a condition if you're so well choose so okay commissioner McGrath [58:22] **Missy McGrath:** thank you chair um so I just wanted to comment that I do align with commissioner Halberg I think that you know they've they've met the the zoning requirement agricultural laws for storage so I and I appreciate the fact that they have listened to some of the technical expertise that's been offered and been good stewards of that information I just wonder because the sort of the big um issue is the traffic and you Justin maybe weigh in on this is there like some sort of abbreviated or short-term type traffic study that can be conducted or anything that can be weighted in from that perspective it probably doesn't need a full comprehensive study [59:08] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** yeah I don't know I mean I think the our issue with the traffic was that we didn't want to have any Vehicles hanging out into the into the roadway um or cars um queuing in Spiral Boulevard to turn in there I think with the with the 60 plus feet they have is is probably as um is pretty good insurance the the the um the traffic volumes they have are fairly low um so I I you know that's generally what you're going to have with the traffic study is to determine um you know the effect to the to the you know the intersections and and being able to to get out and things like that and that's that's not the concern the concern is basically just we want the cars to be out of the way if there's going to or vehicles to be out of the way if there are a couple of them um and I think we're fine with with with that um you know there's always a chance that somebody's not going to be able to make a turn into a site like this because of the um because of the the gate is taking a minute to get open or if it's any site and there's just you know some cars um you know blocking the way waiting for a spot or something anything can happen but um just that large amount of uh stacking area I think addresses that issue [1:00:44] **Gino Messina (Chair):** right and I second he is absolutely right commissioner Halberg is absolutely right purview I'm a big fan of purview right within our purview but I do have the personal experience of having lived in that area and so I have seen cars park on Spiral Boulevard at the storage facility waiting to get in they'll just park right along the curb because either they don't have access or they're waiting for somebody else to show up and I I've watched it because I live there I could see it um and if somebody is parked on Spiral Boulevard at this particular entrance now you've got cars coming around and if they're parked there waiting for somebody else to show up or to get in because they don't have a code yet or the gate doesn't work and I've seen that happen unfortunately I think you're probably aware of it the gate sometimes gets stuck up and then or the gate they can't get the gate open and they have to sit there and wait I've seen it so my concern is is if there's an issue where they can't get in if there's an issue where they're waiting for somebody else um where are they going to park right? and where are they going to park? they're going to park on Spiral Boulevard that is not built to have any cars parked on it it is only one lane that's it you have to go around in the opposite lane of traffic to get in there that's my issue is again from a site plan perspective this is not a zoning issue this is a site plan perspective is that any cars parked on Spiral Boulevard have nowhere to go and I've seen it happen on at your other one not often but when it does you got to go around them you have to go in the opposite lane of traffic to get around them and it creates it can create an issue that's just my only personal experience and there's nothing you can do about that cuz if you're not there there is you know if you're not there you know something happens or the gate gets stuck up or the gate gets stuck down you know they have to work on it and figure it out how to get in there but um that that's the traffic issue the parking the safety issue I guess is the best way to put it um [1:02:16] **Chad Smava (Applicant):** so like any new system there's a learning curve and so the learning curve was with the gate the gates all have a personality of their own some of them are so we have two of them so some of them are happy some of them aren't some don't like snow some don't like the sun I mean I'm over exaggerating but what we learned was and so you wouldn't have seen that problem since July 1st we've had 100% perfect um we figured out the system there and there was a glitch that we had to work out with the software company so we are now um 100% with with the gate always opening or always closing appropriately um so maybe just for perspective um six so an average car is about 16 or 18 feet or so truck is about 18 ft or so um so with 65 ft you know when everybody leaves a little space you know you know we have comfortably four you know Vehicles if one of them has a trailer be you know one vehicle with a trailer and two cars um so it does address I believe it would address I should say um the need not to have to stack on spiral just by having the ability to do four four vehicles and that was yeah City's very direct feedback [1:03:39] **Gino Messina (Chair):** okay thanks I am complete [1:03:41] **Missy McGrath:** would you hope people would use common sense to uh not park on the hill on a busy road? [1:04:06] **Gino Messina (Chair):** no okay okay I was just yeah it seems more dangerous potentially than 2030 Spiral road and so maybe to not park right on the side of that road would would be a good idea and I okay okay y [1:04:30] **Missy McGrath:** all right or to put a sign to just say really don't park here [1:04:34] **Gino Messina (Chair):** yeah okay commissioner Tyken [1:04:36] **Chris Tyken:** thank you Mr chair I'd be interested in hearing from the others uh besides commissioner McGrath and Halberg about the direction we're setting for this so I agree it's allowed in the agricultural area but also part of our purview is to set direction for the city and what we want the city to look like so if we want that area to be industrial then let's go for it and because I'm assuming that lot to the north he's got the same idea because industrial land probably sells for a lot more than residential land does so he's going to charge a lot more for it and make a lot more money which is totally up to him but that's the next thing we're going to see as soon as this gets approved he's he's going to be you know hey we can we can do something else industrial down there because we kind of set the precedence for that so um with that I'd be interested in hear what others think because I'm kind of on the fence on this whole thing thank you Mr chair [1:05:41] **Gino Messina (Chair):** welcome Tyken commissioner Peters [1:05:43] **Melanie Peters:** when looking at this as as an isolated space if that's the only spot where something industrial would go then you know I mean I have mixed feelings about it but then I I lean more toward yes now if there's other space down there where all of a sudden it could you know more more spaces like this be made and then it does change the personality of that area instead of having it be mainly agriculture with houses but instead agriculture with storage or industrial then I think it is changing the character so I guess for me if there's other undeveloped space that zoned agricultural but could be this kind of storage um then I that to me would change the character and I think we'd be setting a precedence to change the character of that space so I guess that's a question for you Justin the other undeveloped agriculturally zoned areas how much of that is down there in that same general vicinity um because yeah I think it would open the door to this kind of of thing and change the the character of that area [1:06:52] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** well the zoning ordinance allows the use that they're proposing so um it it wouldn't be something we can cite as a reason for denying the site plan um application is the use um what our purview here would be is to um approve or deny the application based on uh site specific improvements um you know how how well is it designed how well does it fit and work and integrate with the area um you know are there uh you know if there's things that can be improved that would that would that would allow that to happen you know you can um uh add conditions to do that for uh table it for um for changes that would meet um you know your ideas of how it should better fit with the characteristic of the area or the you know access to the area or other concerns you have specific to the site or if there's um uh reasons that uh don't allow the the proposed improvements to fit with um the design of the area and it would be incompatible the way that their site plan is um arranged you know those could be you know possible reasons for denial um if if you don't believe that there's any any way to uh you know easily change the site plan that's that's in front of you to accommodate that [1:08:58] **Gino Messina (Chair):** all right thanks Justin commissioner Swedin [1:09:02] **Rachel Swedin:** is anything being done to prevent the owner from doing similar things to the north side of the property? because part of me feels that this plan which is beautifully worked with the existing landscape as the seller is presenting it to you is only somewhat allowed because trees were ripped up that shouldn't have been or like right without care essentially not that this couldn't exist with those existing trees but I feel some of that beauty that you know the home buyers up on the hill had initially could be preserved as places like these move in if the landscape isn't completely ripped and destroyed in the future because what I see is a plan that matches the zoning and matches the like it fits with everything that it's supposed to but it also you know it feels such maybe a drastic shift because of things that were out of our applicants control and done by the seller before they even came onto the scene and maybe that maybe not those things not happening in the future would prevent this type of what feels like a drastic shift and the our applicants are simply making a nice space out of what is there because it is a blank dirt pit now but I don't know what can be done when you just ignore the guidelines [1:11:00] **Gino Messina (Chair):** okay thanks commissioner Swedin commissioner has any other discussion otherwise go go commissioner Tyken [1:11:03] **Chris Tyken:** I'll make one more comment um they're not meeting up to the architect standards for the site do we need that in the um conditions or something [1:11:24] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** well when I I was under the understanding that the architectural standard the buildings were similar to the other sites it's correct it's correct correct um when I was looking at the architectural elevation the labels I saw on there were our panels is that what's on your other sites on the street visible sides? [1:11:47] **Chad Smava (Applicant):** sure so when we had our approval last time we had it um with a Edco product or an R panel an R panel basically it's it's it's the same thing it's just a different name for the same thing so I don't know that a person would notice a difference and um last time that that's why John gave us the ability to upgrade basically what we're doing is we're were're putting higher quality materials overall on the front than I think the City Rules required that was part of what John at that point had asked for so we did that [1:12:35] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** yeah so the the requirement is 65% class two or better and 25% class one of that 65 and what you were allowed to do was 100% class two so it didn't allow any class three materials but also didn't require you to put on any class one materials may state that right sure yeah um one of the the biggest differences we found between the the two class two and three was was that the what you were proposing on those other ones didn't have visible fasteners they weren't just um face screwed on what what is proposed with this the R panels and are those do? [1:13:08] **Chad Smava (Applicant):** they're the're fastener-less [1:13:10] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** okay all right yep and that's what that's why we got our approval last time so it it it doesn't meet the architectural standards but it's not necessarily worse than the architectural standards the the buildings are different than most buildings um that we normally are reviewing cuz these things are predominantly garage doors so you you're not going to get any uh um any attractive materials on any of the areas with doors on some of the building sides that are most visible from the street they're putting um you know some some fake windows in there and they're putting um some uh pseudo uh brick kind of material on the bottom and the the metal panels are using um hidden fasteners rather than um you know the typical like sheet metal and um screw heads that you'd see like on a pole barn or something so with the last two projects we thought that was a a good compromise especially since there are non-traditional buildings that are difficult to make good no matter what price or type of material you put on them [1:14:32] **Chris Tyken:** so going back to my question do we need that as a condition to allow it or are we just going to look away and um [1:14:39] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** no it's it's explained in well it's it's explained in the staff report okay um that the um the planning director has the ability to um accept alternate materials and that uh the proposal to have 100% Class 2 rather than 65% Class 2 and 25% Class 1 was acceptable [1:15:10] **Chris Tyken:** okay all right thanks Justin [1:15:15] **Gino Messina (Chair):** sure um and I know I I made a comment about adding the engineering um work with engineering to improve that driveway what was your request for condition? [1:15:26] **Chris Tyken:** just ensuring there's no outside storage okay so it's already covered technically but I think it should still be in there it was part of the uh other ones sure if I remember correctly just as so I'll go ahead and make a motion that we recommend approval for the site plan 2024-10 storage rental facility at 2489 Spiral Boulevard with the uh what is it six conditions I lost them here there's nine current ones adding a tenth of uh work with engineering to improve the driveway entrance and number 11 to prevent the outdoor storage [1:16:00] **Gino Messina (Chair):** okay okay okay we have a motion on the table Commissioners do I have a second? [1:16:03] **Rachel Swedin:** second. [1:16:04] **Gino Messina (Chair):** commissioner Swedin second any new discussion? no new discussion? okay um Commissioners all in favor say I **Commissioners:** I, I, I. [1:16:13] **Gino Messina (Chair):** opposed? no? motion carries and thank you for coming tonight and answer the questions appreciate that and then Justin when will this go to City Council? [1:16:23] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** oh have a calendar up um it'll be going to the next uh city council meeting which would be on um the 18th next Monday [1:16:32] **Gino Messina (Chair):** 18th March 18th March 18th okay thank you thank you we appreciate the opportunity [1:16:40] **Chad Smava (Applicant):** all right thanks for coming appreciate it [1:16:47] **Justin Fortney (City Planner):** all right any other business um just uh very brief update um the city council approved the the kennel amendments that um the Planning Commission discussed probably back in January um there isn't any scheduled uh business yet for any upcoming Planning Commission meetings uh we are still um expecting the application to come uh forward for the the Walden um development down on 316 um and then um probably the next meeting we have also John would probably present the um 2023 um kind of planning related recap that he does once a year [1:17:39] **Gino Messina (Chair):** okay perfect any Commissioners any other business? if not I'll entertain a motion to adjourn [1:17:40] **Angela Halberg (Vice Chair):** I'll make the motion to adjourn Mr chair [1:17:42] **Gino Messina (Chair):** commissioner Halberg motion to adjourn second? [1:17:43] **Melanie Peters:** I'll second [1:17:45] **Gino Messina (Chair):** all right commissioner Peters second all in favor say I **Commissioners:** I, I, I. [1:17:49] **Gino Messina (Chair):** opposed? we are adjourned.