Good evening. I'm James Bell and tonight I'll be serving as chair. This is the planning and zoning commission meeting for November 6th, 2025. The first matter of business is citizens comments. Any citizen wishing to appear before a regular meeting of the planning and zoning commission regarding any matter posted on the agenda was to sign up no later than 6 pm on the day of the meeting. If anyone signed up to speak, they will have three minutes. Staff will time each citizen and provide a warning when they have 30 seconds left. We have five people that have signed up. First up, I will call up McKenzie Welch. And if you will state your name and address for the record, please. >> Hi, I am Mackenzie Welch. And my address, is that what you said? >> Yes. >> 5819 Woodro Road, Le, Texas, 79424. [clears throat] >> Does my time start when I start speaking? Okay. We are in strong opposition to the zoning change to heavy commercial uh for reasons listed and explained below. I'm speaking to the last agenda item 3537. Uh please remember the p purpose of zoning regulations is to give municipalities the authority to regulate land use in a way that promotes public health, safety, and general welfare. More specifically, zoning regulations are designed to lessen congestion in streets, secure safety from fire, panic, flood, and other dangers, promote health and general welfare, provide adequate light and air, prevent overcrowding of land, avoid undue concentration of population, facilitate adequate provision of transportation, water, sewers, schools, parks, and other public services. My husband Wesley and I own and live at 5819 Woodro Road. As I stated, our home faces north with our children's bedrooms, three of them, directly looking toward the land Mr. Thomas Payne wants reszoned to heavy commercial. The city of Levik's zoning ordinance states that heavy commercial districts should be located away from residential areas or if unavoidable, heavily buffered. Question: Was this land annexed without notifying the residents? Since it's not currently zoned as heavy commercial and there's residential areas all around it, this is at the point at which it is avoidable and should be avoided under the city's own guidelines. Even if reszoned, there is little reason to believe the area will be heavily or even adequately buffered. We have seen nearby examples on Woodrow east of Slide near Liberty High School where commercial buildings sit directly across from homes causing significant impacts. Mr. Payne referenced these buildings as examples of what he envisions directly across from our homes. I encourage you to drive east toward the interstate on Woodro Pass Slide. You'll see lifted trucks, Southwest Water Sports, other commercial buildings and offices. Lifted trucks, for example, a car dealership uses extremely bright lot lights that shine into the neighboring houses causing much frustration. Mr. Payne also mentioned a car wash was an example of something he considers acceptable. I personally come from a family of business owners and proud Levik residents. We value making a profit, of course, but never at the expense of our neighbors. Mr. Payne stated, and I'll paraphrase in case he thinks this is slander, "My father was a very wise man, and he taught me that my rights end where someone else's begin." I agree with Mr. Payne's father. My father taught me the golden rule. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Our lives and our children's safety are valuable. We work hard to provide a great quality of life. We were given very little notice about this zoning change. Because of the short notice, we've scrambled to organize our concerns and ensure our voices are heard. Mr. Payne claims heavy commercial is necessary for his plans and promises deed restrictions to limit certain activities. We've heard numerous accounts that he has not kept similar promises. He's neglected his property property across the street, letting tumble weeds pile up with no regard to his neighbors and community. We have safety concerns. Woodro cannot handle increased traffic. We have privacy concerns. Multi-story buildings, like he mentioned, are a possibility. Could allow offices to overlook our backyard where our children play. Okay, I'm going to keep going. I believe we can all [laughter] I have more to say. Thank you. [applause] >> Next up, Justin Phillips. >> I may yield some time for you. >> Justin talk about that. >> Uh, good evening. I'm Justin Phillips on 5811 Woodrow Road. My wife Dodie and I are here tonight. We live right next door to the Welches. Our property faces this proposed zoning change. I think the the big thing I've learned which I had to learn it in the last four or five days because we received this letter last weekend and you know it's obvious that love is growing. I believe in growth. I believe in in entrepreneurship. This is the extreme southern brand new tip of love. Uh, this is completely the furthest thing south that the city of Love has annexed. It was forced to annex, I believe, by Mr. Payne. Uh, probably in some attempt to get water to Highland Oaks and to some subdivisions that he was hoping to develop perfectly fine. I think that y'all's rules that you put in place when something is annexed into the city, it set forth a defaulted zoning for single f family housing. I think everybody that lives out south and west and love it kind of expects that when a farmer can't make a crop on a field anymore, he could turn that into a housing subdivision. I do feel like that that that was the expectation from most people whenever the notices if they were sent out. I did not get one. Again, I am a Lev County resident. I'm not a city resident. I didn't know that it was even annexed. Uh I think that with with that being the extreme southern tip with the infrastructure of a crumbling county wood road that to the east of us has taken 5 years to build one mile. I think that it's realistic to think that this this is going to put an undue pressure on our roads, on our infrastructure. Um, obviously I'm across the street in the county, but I will be looking at this development that I believe is bailout to try to survive a purchase of land that maybe he does not want to make a residential neighborhood out of anymore. He wants to make a commercial development, sell the sell the land by the foot, not by the acre as it was originally zoned, which was single family housing. And that's what your zoning committee or whoever approved this annexation set it up as single family housing. That's what I believe that it should stay. Thank you. [applause] Next up is Clay Irwin. Hello. I'm at 16203 Belmont Avenue and that's the corner of Belmont Avenue and Woodrow Road. So, we have property that comes right up to Woodro Road. Okay. Um my main concern is um just the safety of that road. Uh, that's a pretty famous road or infamous road. It takes lives every year, unfortunately. Um, I was just talking to an engineer about what that road was designed for. It was designed for zero commercial traffic. It's not a commercially traffic engineer road. Um, it's turtle back road. That's the way I refer to it. And, um, I've got a daughter that's 14, about to be 15. West McKenzie have one that just turned 15. So, we travel that road all the time and it's dangerous. So, I'm I'm not for it. Um I'm against it uh specifically for that kind of zoning restrictions for commercial traffic to be coming on and off of that road, especially where it falls off there just west of just west of Wes and Mackenzie's property. That's a dangerous spot to pull out from their house. I couldn't imagine having a car hauler or an 18-wheeler trying to make up speed and and get out of the way of residents that are coming down there. So, I'm against it. Um I think that it's um it's a rash decision to to move forward with it uh under the current request. Um especially since the developer himself felt it critical to call a town hall meeting uh just 48 hours ago. I think we need more time and possibly look at different zoning. Thank you. Thank you. [applause] Next up is Michelle Newman. >> Hi. Okay. [snorts] Okay. Well, my name is Michelle Newman and I live in Highland Oats, the neighborhood just off of 155th in Frankfurt. My house backs up to Frankfurt. Um, I'm here to respectfully but firmly oppose the proposed resoning of the property located at 14612 Frankfurt Avenue from residential zoning to heavy commercial zoning. This will deeply affect the privacy and neighborhood character of our community negatively [snorts] as well as surrounding homes and neighborhoods. According to the city's zoning code under the unified development code, chapter 39, article 39 26D, the the HC district is intended for uses that should be located away from residential areas or if unavoidable should be heavily buffered. By placing heavy commercial uses next to our homes, we risk losing privacy, [snorts] our homes overlooking industrial style operations instead of other homes or agricultural space, and we alter the peaceful residential feel that drew many of us out here. Heavy commercial uses often bring large vehicles, traffic, including trucks, deliveries, increased employee and customer volumes. Our streets are not built like major industrial thorough affairs. They [snorts] lack the infrastructure designed for high volumes of freight and heavy trucks. The EDC explicitly states heavy commercial uses should be buffered from residential areas, meaning the assumption is that the adjacency would cause concerns. Introducing heavy commercial traffic without significant upgrades places residents at risk, particularly children, pedestrians, and cyclists if there's any out there. Um, heavy commercial operations often require bright security lighting also, and that will shine right into the windows of our homes, our children's bedrooms, and it just is it and we don't want that. It's a It's a lack of privacy. In closing, I urge the council to weigh long long-term costs as well as the privacy of nearby residents and vote no to this resoning request. Thank you. >> And last one to sign up was Dodie Phillips. Hello, I'm Dodie Phillips. We live at 5811 Woodro Road. My husband and I strongly oppose the reszoning of this land to heavy commercial. Our home is located directly across from the main corner of Starlite Developments property at Frankfurt and Woodro Road. We've lived there 20 years. We've raised our family and invested many years of our income to the development of our 30 acre estate. We've also greatly invested financially in the digging of our ponds to catch the runoff from Frankfurt and the Highland Oaks area. We've worked very, very hard to create an aesthetically beautiful and tranquil environment over these past 20 years. Zoning regulations are put in place for a reason. They should benefit the existing and future residents of the community and protect all of our safety. Reszoning to heavy commercial by no means reflects our interests, nor does it benefit any of us in any way. The only one it will benefit is Starlac development. Reszoning to heavy commercial will only contribute to our already existing problems. Traffic and safety being of our greatest concerns. We do not have the infrastructure in place to support this new growth, much less to support the traffic from heavy commercial businesses. It will only bring more constant traffic and the larger vehicles will impair our already damaged roads. The intersection of Frankfurt and Woodro Road is one of, if not the most dangerous intersection in the entire Levik area, as we have been told by the DPS officers and the first responders who have had to visit there over the past 20 years as our fence has been run through more than 20 times at our expense to repair and the cost of one woman losing her life on our property on our 18-year-old on our 18th birthday of our oldest Um, we also had our neighbor in a tragic accident. She lost her leg to the east of us and right next door, a woman was pulling a trailer and the trailer tire caught the edge of the road, flipped her truck and she lost her four-year-old daughter. So, it is very dangerous to say the least, and the addition of heavy commercial property would only increase those dangers. We already we already take a chance every day. we enter and exit our driveway onto Woodrow Road. Preserving and protecting the character of the neighborhood by keeping residential areas from being developed with incompatible commercial or industrial buildings is yet another purpose for installing zoning regulations. Mr. Payne said Tuesday he could possibly put in a car wash, diesel mechanic shop, storage facilities, a car lot, all of which would not reflect nor protect the character and tranquility of our neighborhood. Please take into consideration the lasting effects this will have on all of the families who presently live there. We chose to build in a rural area for a reason. It doesn't seem right that after all these years you can strip that away from all of us just because one person seeks to make a profit. Thank you for your time. [applause] [applause] Okay. The next matter of business is the approval of minutes for the following meeting. The October 9th, 2025 regular planning and zoning commission meeting. Is there a motion? >> So moved. Second. We have a motion and a second. >> Any discussion? Okay. All in favor, please say I. >> I. >> All oppose? Nay. Motion carries. 6 to zero. Next up are the zone cases. When we call up your zone case, these steps will be followed. The chair will call the first case and will invite city staff to make the presentation on the case. The board may ask staff questions, but board comments and debate should not occur. The chair will open the public hearing on the case. The chair will then call the applicant and his or her representative to provide additional comment. The applicant will need to clearly state their name and address for the record and briefly explain their case. After the applicant has spoken, the chair will ask for anyone in opposition of the item to speak. Those speaking in opposition should give their name and address and then speak to the board. The chair will ask for anyone in favor of the item to speak. Those speaking in favor should give their names and address repeated. After the public comments, I will close the public hearing. After the public hearing, there will not any further comments from the public. First case we have up is zone item 3.1, zone case 2607. Good evening board. I am Sam Breen with the planning department and this is zone case 2607- A. The applicant is heart heating and AC. They are are requesting a zone change from highdensity residential district HDR to heavy commercial district HC. The property is located east of Interstate 27 and north of 76th Street. 24 letters were sent out and we've received zero back. The aerial map shows residential dwellings to the south and vacant land to the north and east. To the west is Interstate 27 and a commercial property. The surrounding properties are zoned highdensity residential district HDR. To the north, south, and east. To the west across Interstate 27 is heavy commercial district HC. The [snorts] future land use map designates this area for commercial land uses. Here is a picture of the subject property as well as views to the west, east, and south. The future land use map designates this area for commercial land uses. The request conforms to this designation and would be appropriate in this location along a freeway. Therefore, this request is in complete conformance with the comprehensive plan principles. The proposed zone change is in conformance with the zoning ordinance and will be appropriate at the proposed location. [snorts] The proposed zone change is compatible with the surrounding area and will not change the character of the existing development. The location is along Interstate 27 which is designated as a freeway and 76th Street which is designated as a local street by the master thoroughfare plan 2018. Staff has no objection to this request and I can take any questions at this time. >> Does anyone have questions for staff at this time? >> Thank you. Sam, is the applicant or his or her representative here? If so, please come forward. And if you could state your name and address for the record, please. >> Uh James Buts. Uh I represent hard eating and AC. Uh, I live at 1318 County Road, 1420, south of Wolfford. >> Anything you want to add about your request or application or >> No, not at all. The the church itself is in really bad shape, so something needs to be done there. I think uh we've purchased the land to uh move our business there. >> Okay. Thank you very much. Is there anyone here to speak in opposition to this request? Seeing none, I'll ask is there anyone [clears throat] else wishing to speak in favor? Seeing none, we'll close the public hearing for matter of discussion. Do we have a motion? >> So move. >> We have a motion. >> Second >> and a second. Discussion. >> No comments. >> I think it's pretty straightforward. >> Pretty straightforward coming to do it. Okay. So we have a motion and a second. Uh all in favor, please say I. >> All oppose? Nay. Motion carries six to zero. This will be going to for the first reading of this case will be taken in front of the city council on December 2nd at 200 p.m. Next up is item 3.2 which is zone case 3538. This is zone K's 3538. The applicant is AMD Engineering LLC. They are requesting a zone change from lowdensity single family district SF2 to medium density residential district MDR. The subject properties are located west of Quaker and north of 130th Street, which is future Loop 88. 75 letters were sent out and we've received two in favor and one in opposition. Here's the notification map showing the two in favor and one in opposition properties. This map reflects one in favor and one in opposition that should be available to you on the dis. There were no comments on the opposition letter. The aerial map shows residential dwellings to the north, vacant land to the east and west, and commercial properties to the south. The surrounding properties are zoned lowdensity single family district SF2 to the north, south, east, and west. The future land use map designates this area for residential lowdensity land uses. [snorts and clears throat] Here's a picture of the subject property as well as views to the west, north, and south. The following slides were provided by the applicant and represent a possible development concept for the subject properties. The future land use map designates this area for lowdensity residential land uses. The request is a minor deviation from this designation as it allows medium-density land uses in addition to lowdensity land uses. However, it would be appropriate considering the existing adjacent zoning districts and land uses. Therefore, this request is in conformance with the comprehensive plan principles. The proposed zone change is in conformance with the zoning ordinance and will be appropriate at the proposed location. The proposed zone change is compatible with the surrounding area and will not change the character of the existing development. The location is along Upton Avenue which is designated as a collector street future and has additional points of access from Salem Avenue and 127th Street which are designated as local streets by the master thoroughfare plan 2018. Staff has no objection to the request and I can take any questions at this time. >> Do we have any questions for staff? >> Okay. [snorts] Thank you, Sam. >> Is the applicant or his or her representative here? >> Hello, Mr. Stevens. >> Good evening. My name is Will Stevens with AMD Engineering at 651568 Street. [snorts] Um, I thought Sam did a great job kind of laying out the our request here. Um [clears throat] I just like to add a couple other things. Um the developer of this property um has developed three other properties in Levik and his um kind of product is a singlestory apartment complex. So um I wanted to include those elevations to kind of show what this was kind of intended to look like. So it'll be all singlestory um and then it'll have those three points of access that Sam mentioned. So I'll be happy to answer any questions if you have them. Anyone have questions? Okay, thank you very much. >> Thank you. >> Is there anyone here to speak in opposition to this request? >> You'll come forward and please state your name and address for the record, please. >> Hi. Uh my name is Steve Avent 4710585. Our land is just adjacent to uh this land 50 acres just west of uh uh Upton Avenue and uh we've been trying to develop and look at developers for our land and uh feel that this will bring down the value of our property by bringing putting apartments up there. So that's it. Any questions? >> Any questions? Okay. Thank you very much. Is there anyone else wishing to speak in opposition? Okay, seeing none, is there anyone wishing to speak in favor? >> Seeing none, we'll close the public hearing for matter discussion. Do we have a motion? >> So moved. >> Second. >> Have a motion in a second. Is there any discussion? >> It's a good transition from commercial to residential. >> It's a little transition I feel so too. Mr. >> No, do you have anything or you just debating there? >> No. >> Okay, I'm good. >> There's no other discussion. We'll go ahead and call the question. All in favor, please say I. I. >> All oppose say nay. Motion carries. Six to nothing. Again, this will go to the city council for December 2nd at 2 p.m. Next up is item 3.3, zone case number 3539. Good evening, chairman and members of the commission. My name is Shane Spencer and this is zone case 3539. The applicant is Hugo Reed and Associates for Red Canyon Development. They're requesting a zone change from single family district SF2 neighborhood commercial NC office District OF to Office District OF. The subject property is located south of 110th Street and west of Indiana Avenue. We've sent 34 notifications and we've received back now six in opposition as well as one that appeared to be neutral. Here's a notification map. The opposition was concerned about the possible uses involved and traffic. Here's the aerial map. to the north are homes with garden offices to the east. The former golf course to the west and south and the winery is also to the south. Here's a zoning map. There is lowdensity single family SF2 to the southwest and north, office district to the east, and neighborhood commercial NC to the south. The future lane use map designates this property for both parks and also for office. Here are photos of the subject and surrounding sites. And here's a graphic provided by the applicant. The future land use map designates this area for park and office land uses. Although the proposed zone change is not fully consistent with this designation, it would be appropriate considering the nearby zoning districts and land uses. Additionally, it would serve as a buffer between the residential uses to the north and commercial uses to the south. Therefore, this request is in moderate conformance with the comprehensive plan principles. The proposed [snorts] zone change is in conformance with the zoning ordinance and is compatible with the surrounding area. Would not change the character of the existing development. The location is along 110th Street which is designated as a local street by the master thoroughfare plan 2018. Staff has no objections to this request and I'd be pleased to answer any questions at this time. >> Are there any questions for staff? >> I got one. I got two actually. So did we reszone any portion of this piece when we reszone that? >> Yes. So this property uh a portion not the entire thing obviously. >> Was it the garden office? >> Yes. So the we can go back to that real fast and that will you can see right here that blue edge on the east right there that was reszoned uh to garden office and now office district. I believe the that was back in 2018. And then the the southern pink area which was C2 and now NC that was zoned back in 2021 >> and that's the do sale. >> Yes. >> Okay. >> Okay. And secondly is there what is the buffer requirement on 110th? >> So the buffer requirement uh if 110th would be the front right there. So the only buffer that would be required along the street itself would be a possibly a parking buffer depending on the number of parking spaces and their proximity to the street. Uh to the west and to the south along the uh SF2 zone portion there would be a typeB buffer yard uh from office to SF2 right there. So there would be a required buffer yard on that side. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. Do you have any feel for the uh flood plan in this area and really how much is it developable? >> I don't have a good answer for that right now. So uh all that would have to be examined uh by by the engineering department as they plat and go for building permits. >> Thank you. Any other questions for staff? >> Okay. Thank and give us an overview of what the zoning that he's requesting what what can go in L1 just to give a general view >> as as far as office uh mostly it's office related things you're looking at like uh >> office >> offices medical office medical clinics uh I think a bank uh cemetery funeral services parking lot park and wreck facility educational services utilities uh there's Um there's several other limited uses in in that district as well. Um but the main emphasis and the main purpose for the office district is offices of various sorts. >> Thank you. I was looking at the wrong one. Thomas has like 10 on here tonight. >> That's right. Yeah. >> Okay. Thank you. Any other questions for staff? Okay. Thank you. We'll now open the public hearing. Is the applicant or his or her representative here? >> [clears throat] >> Good evening, members of the planning commission. I'm Terry Hullman. I'm with Hugo Reeden Associates. We're 1601 Avenue in. Um I thought Shane did did a great job of laying it out. I think I can add a little bit to it as we go. Uh for starters, um you have seen me here many times representing Red Canyon Development. about a year or so ago, that development entity was acquired by Dusty Womble and his group. So, this one is is actually no longer Thomas Payne. Um, I'm working for Dusty Wall and his group on this deal. Um, and as they acquired the property, they took the project uh sort of underway with construction. We were oh maybe half the way through a pretty extensive pia cut and fill plan. Uh we did that for the Adelfos construction. Um to answer the flood zone question, the the whole thing is a flood zone. The whole thing is a a storm water empowerment easement. We still have some of the area available for development and we know that to do that we'll have to come back and do a subsequent cut and fill to uh to allow that to occur, but we do have the capacity to do that in this location. Um so we've been working on cut and fill. We we pretty well got this phase of it wrapped up and uh our goal now is to try to make some of this property a little bit teed up more for true development so we can get some things happening out there and so the the the maintenance of the property can be uh taken care of and so forth. It's just been in limbo uh for for a number of years and uh we're ready to get this thing polished up a little bit and and and get some construction going on it. So the goal here is to extend offices um you know starting from the offices that are already constructed that front on the Indiana Avenue south of 110th um to construct offices north of the Adelfos facility and the Adelfos facility is this sort of oddshaped piece right here. This is their parking lot. So our goal here is to uh put some offices here. And there's not much room, but we can put an office in here uh to sort of insulate uh this residential from from this delos here. Our thinking is that we've got room to put a building up more close to uh 110th Street and maybe put the parking in the back. We're certainly mindful of trying to create an environment that's that's friendly to the neighborhood. And yes, it would be offices and those types of things that that you guys asked about. Uh we did have letters of opposition. I'd like to kind of clarify that a little bit. It's six tax parcels, but it's only two houses, two households. Um, the one there on the east is six separate tax parcels, but that's one residence spanning across those six those four tax parcels. Sorry, four, not six. And the other one to the left is two tax parcels, but it's one house um owned by Mr. Johnston. So, I um I had a really good discussion, nice friendly discussion with those two land owners as well as Mr. Collins who called and asked me about uh what we what we had going on. I think the the the gist of their concerns was the at the base of it, they just want their golf course back. I mean, they wish they still had their golf course and u we we just can't help with that. I mean, those those days are gone and and we are in limbo. um and so we're trying to get this where it can be cleaned up a little bit um and or they want residences. We have a bit of a constraint doing single family at this location. We are too far away from any existing city sewer that's adequate to service um to to serve the property. And so we meet a qualification which allows us to develop without city sewer. But guess what that means? We get to do halfacre lots. That's a state requirement and that then becomes uneconomical for residential development to do those large large residential lots. So we feel like because of the utility situation out there we are kind of sort of locked into something non-residential offices seems to be the tamest for us um at this location allows us to to um recoup on the investment on the property. Um, I I think as we go, our intent is to, as I said before, put the buildings on the north closer to the street, tuck the parking back in behind, make it as as as friendly to the neighborhood as we can. Um, so forth. The uh, as I said before, we still feel like we're going to have uh, some plow lake cut and field to do, uh, some easement closure, some flood zone stuff to we got a lot of engineering to go through. This is just the first step to seek the zoning to allow us to confidence to move forward with that. Right. One question was brought up about the roadways out there. Um they're accurate. 110th Street, both legs of 110th is uh is not in the best of shape. The good news is I explained it to the folks that I spoke with that as development occurs, guess what? The the city requires us to improve those roadways. uh expand the paving width, fix some of the drainage problems there that's right in front of us. And so as we if we get the zoning and as we then are able to develop the next step is is that gives us a mechanism and an opportunity to make those roadways a little better there on 110th Street. So that's our objective. We feel like uh it's it's about the best use given sort of our constraints that we've got to work with. Uh I do have Mr. wamble here as well to answer any questions from the owner perspective. Uh but we'd be happy to answer any questions. >> Any questions for that? Okay. >> Um so you're putting just one office on the >> two separate buildings. Um it would the way this would work or two or three. In fact, I'm glad you asked that, Mr. Redwan, because I wanted to also explain this. Oh, and I'm glad I went to this. The comp plan calls this a park. Well, when the comp plan was prepared, the golf course was still um in use. And the the consultants who prepared the comp plan, you know, really they looked at Lakeidge, Stonebrook, the other golf courses around town, and they just identified that as park, even though those were never public parks, per se. So, be aware that that that that's sort of a nuance in the comp plan. Mr. Red one, to answer your question though, um we envision uh maybe one building on the far right side kind of tucked in there as we wrap around to the west. Um and I'll I'll admit to you that I zoned a pretty large area not yet knowing how much we would actually be able to develop. I I didn't want to zone not enough and then be boxed into a corner. So, we may use all of that u boxed area on the on the left. We may use half of it. We don't yet know. But to answer your question, that would be a separate structure, maybe one or two or maybe even a little small park of some sort, office park of some sort. We we're just not far enough along to answer it any better than that. >> Okay. You mentioned earlier that there was problems with utilities serving that. >> Are you not serving the office with sewer? >> Um the the offices um the the offices that we would construct would have to go on septic system. The nearest sewer that we have is all the way down in 114th Street. >> Okay. >> That that's deep enough. And >> so all of them are going to be on Septic. >> All of these these these offices. Yes, sir. Um and so for that reason, we kind of can't do retail. We can't do restaurants because you we just, as you probably aware, we can't put that stuff on a septic system. Uh little trivia, the the new single family residences uh that are over along Memphis Avenue um are on septic system because there was not deep enough sewer at that location either. So those are ultra high-end high dollar lots. You know, that that worked out economically at that location. We can't support that at this location here. Okay. >> Any other questions for Mr. Holman? >> Okay. >> Thank you so much, Mr. Holman. Is there anyone here to speak in opposition to this request? Seeing none, is there anyone else wishing to speak in favor? >> Okay, we'll close the public hearing for matter of discussion. Do we have a motion? >> So moved. >> I'll second. >> Have a motion in a second. Is there any discussion? I >> think it's one of those ones that whole area. I think what he said, what they can build is going to depend on the cut and field. >> Yeah, I think it's creating a neat environment over there. Um, you know, the offices shouldn't bring any after hours traffic. It's going to be daytime. Pretty minimal. You're not going to be able to fit a lot of office on there with the septic constraints. >> Any other discussion? >> Okay, we'll go ahead and call the vote. All in favor, please say I. >> I. All oppose. Nay. Motion carries 6. Again, this will be going to city council on September 2nd, I mean, excuse me, December 2nd. Next item is item 3.4, zone case number 3536. [snorts] Good evening, chairman and members of the commission. This is zone case 3536. The applicant is Hugo Reeden Associates for Thomas Payne and they're requesting his own change from lowdensity single family district SF2 to light industrial district LI. The subject property is located south of 122nd Street and east of Frankfurt Avenue. We have sent 28 notifications with no responses in favor or in opposition. Here's the aerial map. To the north are homes and storage buildings. further homes to the east and west and warehouses to the south. Property to the northwest and to the south is outside of city limits. Here's a zoning map. There is lowdensity single family SF2 to the west and east with medium density residential MDR to the north. The future land use map designates this property for lowdensity residential land uses. And here are photos of the subject and surrounding properties. The future lane use map designates this area for residential land uses. And although the proposed zone change is not fully consistent with this designation, it would be appropriate considering the existing nearby zoning districts and land uses. Therefore, this request is in moderate conformance of the comprehensive plan principles. The proposed zone change is in conformance with the zoning ordinance and is compatible with surrounding area would not change the character of the existing development. The location is along 122nd Street which is designated as a collector by the master thoroughare plan 2018. Staff has no objections to this request and I'd be happy to take your questions at this time. >> Are there any questions for staff at this time? Thank you, Mr. Spencer. Okay, we'll go ahead and open up the public hearing. Is the applicant or his or her representative here? Mr. Holman. Good evening again. Uh this time I am representing Mr. Payne. Um this this whole quarter section here that this property is located in [clears throat] has been one of those pockets in Leach that we've really scratched our head on what do we do with this? Um, most of the development occurred prior to annexation and it's just a peppering of just about every different kind of land use that you could imagine in this little area right here. Um, is there a photo? Yeah. Yeah. This is the best. So, you see our property here. Um, Mr. Payne is currently using this um as a sort of a makeshift contractor yard. uh it's we felt like it was time for us to go ahead and get the zoning in place in case he wanted to ever do any kind of improvements on it that we we were in keeping with the the zoning uh to do that. Um but we've got, you know, warehouse rentals to the north of us. We've got the Typton Pet Center to the to the west of us. You know, Kincaid Roofing is a couple of lots down to the west. Behind us is warehousing. If you look around, there's all and there there is a a peppering of homes here and there, but the majority of this whole quarter section is anything but residential. And so, we were really kind of, as I said, scratching our head trying to even figure out what kind of zoning is appropriate. And we got a we had a little bit of favor from some folks down the block from us uh where they got they got the light industrial a few parcels to the west of us and we felt like that kind of begin to set the mold a little bit. Uh we didn't believe that commercial per se was appropriate here because we didn't want to really open a door for retail at this location. But um you know if we have a light industrial which allows us to do a contractor yard, we felt like that was the best fit and it's really what we want to do with it. So um we are we do have duplexes across the street from us. None of those duplexes face us uh which I think plays in our favor a little bit. I'd be happy to answer any questions. >> Any questions for Mr. Holman? >> Okay. Thank you very much. >> Thank you. Is there anyone here to speak in opposition to this request? Okay, seeing none, anyone else wishing to speak in favor? Seeing none, we'll close the public hearing for matter discussion. Do we have a motion? >> So move. >> Second. >> Have a motion in a second. Is there any discussion? This is such a hodgepodge of what's in the city, what's not. How to go? Any thoughts, comments, or any other discussion? Call it. Okay, we'll go ahead and call the question. All in favor, please say I. I. >> All oppose? Nay. >> Motion carries. 6 to zero. Again, this will go to the city council on December 2nd at two. Knowing that everybody is here for the next one. We're going to take a short fivem minute recess and then we're going to start. We'll be back at 6:50. Okay, 650. We're getting back into order. The next zone case is going to be item 3.5, which is 3.5 number 3537. I know this is going to be one that everybody wants to speak out, but I would like to say one thing. Everybody is willing to come up and speak at this time for it. But just as a courtesy to all of us up here and everybody up here, if y'all have a representative or if you have different stuff to say instead of having a hundred people come and say the same thing because we get what y'all are saying on it. So, but you can speak if you want to, but just as a matter of time to be able to do that. But we'll go ahead and turn it over to city staff to bring it in. All right. Okay. [clears throat] Good evening, distinguished members of the commission. I am Jamie McGar with the planning department and this is zone case 3537. The applicant is Hugo Reed and Associates, Inc. for Stolite Development LLC. The applicants are requesting to reszone from lowdensity single family district SF2 to Heavy Commercial District HC. The property is located west of Frankfurt Avenue and north of Woodrow Road. 26 letters were sent out and we received none back in favor, 10 in opposition from within the notification boundaries and an additional 126 in opposition outside of the notification boundaries. Of the 10 in opposition within the notification boundaries, eight are outside of the city limits. All 136 combined letters of opposition reflect 78 unique properties. Here's the notification map showing the seven in opposition uh within the notification area. Uh we received two additional letters of opposition from within the notification boundary not already accounted for and we received them this afternoon so they're not on this. I handed out a updated map for you guys and actually I believe there's 10 on there now. Here's an aerial view of the property. [cough] To the north [clears throat] is vacant land. To the west is unincorporated single family homes. To the east is a mix of single family homes and unincorporated vacant land. The properties to the south are unincorporated and include single family homes with one property that would be classified as heavy commercial use by the current UDC and a mixeduse property that would be considered non-conforming with both residential and heavy commercial uses. The current land use map shows unincorporated properties to the south, west, and east, and lowdensity single family zoning to the north. The future you land use map was created prior to the annexation of the subject property. Therefore, a future use designation was not provided. Here's a picture of the subject property from the addressed frontage on Frankfurt Avenue as well as views to the south, east, and west. Here is a survey exhibit provided by the applicant. The property was voluntarily annexed in August of 2021 after the future land use map was completed in 2018. At that time, properties outside of the city limits defaulted to lowdensity land use with commercial nodes at the intersections of major streets. Although the proposed zone change to heavy commercial district is not in conformance with the current residential designation, is furnished to both Frankfurt Avenue and Woodrow Road and heavy commercial use properties adjacent to the south make a zoning change to heavy commercial use appropriate. The proposed zone change is compatible with the zoning ordinance and will be appropriate at the proposed location. Okay. The property is suitable for the proposed zone change and the uses allowed in the heavy commercial district. The property will need to be platted before further development can take place. The subject property is located on Frankfurt Avenue. The master thoroughfare plan of 2018 designates Frankfurt adver Frankfurt Avenue as a minor arterial street. The subject property also sides Woodro Road. The master throw for plan 2018 decide designates Woodrow Row as a principal arterial street. Arterial streets typically serve the high volume needs of local and regional traffic and provide connectivity across the transportation network. Staff has no objection to the request and I can take any questions at this time. >> Any questions for staff at this time? >> Quick [snorts] question. Um, since this one since Woodro is a major arterial, does that mean half the arterial is going to be on this land? >> You mean the the rightway easement? [clears throat] >> Um, I don't know that answer right now. Okay. >> Any other questions for staff? Okay, thank you very much. We'll now open the public hearing. Is the applicant or his or her representative here? [snorts] >> Good evening again, Mr. Redwan. I'll answer your question first. Um, when this property is developed, we will be required to dedicate our 55 foot of rideway. And we um of course when you this a weird way we we do paving in the in the county they require us to do just this curb and gutter along with the development but we don't actually expand the paving until the bond program comes along but the yes we will dedicate the 55 foot of right away >> that 55 foot will be in the city right not in the county. >> Uh at the moment it's in the county. Yes sir. the way the way the annexation the way we were required to do the annexation at the time um we had to stop short of the rideway for the annexation. So that that is still today county rightaway of all things. Yes sir. Uh I'm Terry Hullman with Hugo Reading Associates 1601 Avenue in. Um the first thing I'd like to do before I dive into um sort of my comments is I'd like to just touch a little bit on a few of the comments that were made at at at the citizen comment. Maybe kind of clarify a few things. Um one of the comments was we only had a town hall quote unquote meeting only 48 hours ago. That's correct. Um, we weren't made aware that there was uh opposition like this until very recently. And I don't think that's anything anybody did wrong. That that's usually just a byproduct of the timing of when the notices are sent out. And property owners uh take a moment to even try to figure out what it is that that represents a request. And so it's just a sort of a function of the way things play out the way things are currently going. So, yes, that that was a meeting just recently and I think everybody uh did the best they could to get together as quickly as possible to to discuss the project. Um there was one comment made concerning building height. Um and that's fair comment and seeing into my backyard. That particular uh lady has a house that faces um Woodro Road from the south and the concern was about building height seeing into her backyard. uh given the distance and the fact that the backyard is on the back of the house. I I don't know that that's really u even possible with this type of development uh it's a fair bet to say that almost every structure will be single story. There may be some that may be tall buildings because of just the the the size of the building, but I I'm I'm not personally concerned about 18tory buildings looking into the backyard. Um uh one comment was made about the annexation having tied to the Highland Oaks annexation. It didn't play out that way. Highland Oaks would have been annexed whether or not this was annexed and this actually predated the Highland Oaks annexation. It was on its own merit. Uh this this project has been on the books with us for for a number of years pre preceding the Highland Oak stuff. Um, now I'll sort of go into describing the case. We're going to have a sort of a two-layered approach to this. I would like to lay out for you mostly the technical aspects of what we're looking to do, address some of the questions that were brought up the other night with respect to drainage, and then I'll ask Mr. Payne to sort of take the second half and really share his vision of of of the project. And hopefully we give you a nice rounded picture that way. Um, we're asking for HC zoning primarily because one of the big elements that we believe works at this location is what we call flex space um or office warehouse or things of that nature that you may have a wholesaler or a retailer up front with a pretty goodiz warehouse in the back. Um, we have to have HC zoning to do things like that. um if we want to do flex space shell type construction, we have to have HC zoning to do that. So, we just felt like that was the right fit for this. Yes, Woodro Road is a major thorough affair. Um no, the paving is not what we want it to be today. Um our best answer to that is is that's sort of the natural progression of development. you know, we we we get our zoning in place, we go through the plotting efforts, and then we as development continues and as a traffic need becomes evident, then there's that's when the roadways begin to get expanded. But today, I don't see any any roadway getting expanded without any more development. So, it just sort of the kind of the way that the the system plays out. Um, regarding our request, this kind of tells the picture as much as anything. Um, it's a little over 51 acres. Uh, it's only about 275 ft of net developable depth. So, I think what we've done here is done our best to sort of steer away from ultra super large like warehousing facilities. These are really intended to be smaller operators um fronting on the Woodrow Road. We are backing into the leaveout on Highland Oaks. And by the way, I I did I did the Highland Oak development with Mr. Glashene years ago. It's one of the developments I'm more proud of. I thought it fit together really well. And we purposely left this corner out at both corner, both here and Slide Road for future retail, knowing that that's sort of what the expected use is at at locations like that. So, all we really did was line up with that. Um, we expect that there's going to be some sort of commercial here. We're just matching up with that. Sorry. We're not intending to do any non-residential next to the Highland Oaks residential. Um, and yes, of course, we have non-residential along the uh Woodrow Road. >> Oh, thank you very much. So, uh, one thing that, uh, also kind of helps us set the mold is we've got a a a new gas line easement and a gas line that's going to be under construction here that goes along the back side of the property. Uh, so that's sort of a good way for us to sort of differentiate between what we see is commercial frontage along Woodrow Road. North of that would step into the residential component of the of the development. So all the rest of this square mile but for maybe a small piece at each of the northeast and northwest corners uh is expected to be residential and currently zoned that way. Speaking of residential zoning, you all know this. I'm going to say some things tonight that you all know. I'm saying it really more for the benefit of the folks in the room. The residential zoning here um was not purposeful. It's a byproduct of the annexation. Um, we're all aware that when property is annexed, it comes in defaulted as the residential zoning, which is smart. I believe it it puts us on the spot. If we want to do something that's non-residentidential, we have to come to you and ask for it. As of this moment, this is the only place that we're asking for residential I mean non-residential zoning. The other part of this that uh hasn't really been touched on yet, the west end, you can see it in the photo. That's a pretty good ply lake, pretty sizable lake. Um, we're hopeful that we can develop all that frontage and and do the cut and fill to account for that. Um, that's why we zoned all the way through the bottom of the lake. Um, but if we decide that we can't quite make that, then we just can't. You know, the the the the drainage rules, you know, zoning doesn't trump drainage, right? And so just be aware that there's a large element of this on the west end that may or may not ever actually be developed, but it was our objective to get the zoning in place to at least allow us the chance to pursue that. So that's why we did that. At the neighbor meeting the other night, um, one of the big concerns was raised about drainage. And again, you guys know this, but for the benefit of the audience, when we develop, we're required by the engineering department to demonstrate that we're not having any adverse impact on the downstream neighbors. You know, we can't we can't flood them. Uh to the southeast of us, there's a ply lake and there's a large area that was developed um decades ago before the county even really took paid close attention to to drainage in platting. So, there are some homes that are in peril down there. Um, and so I like I said to the folks the other night, we we can't make it any better for them, but we certainly can't make it any worse. Now, this is not a zoning question, but I wanted you to hear that we're aware that we have to be mindful of all the drainage characteristics as we develop anything. If we do single family or commercial or if we did a a bazillion story hotel, whatever it was, we would have to account for the drainage appropriately and prove to the city engineering department that we're not creating a worse situation for those folks downstream from us. Um talked about the ply lakes. Let's talk a little bit about um lighting. Uh that's been raised a couple of times. the UDC is going to play in our favor on this or it's going to it's it's going to help everybody. Uh because when the UDC was adopted, the there was very stringent lighting criteria that was put into effect for parking lot lighting, uh you know, dark sky compliance, all of those types of things that a lot of larger communities have. Our UDC now requires any development that when you go through the building permit process, which anybody would here if we're an we are annexed and we're zoned, we got to go get a building permit, right? We have to demonstrate by way of a lighting plan that our lighting is compliant with the UDC requirements. And the the objective of the lighting requirements in the UDC is to do what everybody wants, which is protect neighboring properties to make sure that there's not excess light and glare on the on the neighboring properties. So we have that mechanism in place in the UDC which helps protect uh abuing property owners with respect to lighting. As you guys are aware, the UDC has more stringent parking and more stringent landscaping requirements. We now have buffer yard requirements as you're well aware that we didn't have um prior to the UDC. Um we have parking and and most importantly we have driveway spacing requirements in the UDC that we didn't have in the prior code. For example, um you guys are aware we just passed the latest round of amendments. We can't have driveways any closer than 250 foot apart from each other off of a thoroughare. So that is going to help uh police access to and from Woodro Road. Um, and I think all those together, if we are able to get the zoning, uh, and we're able to move forward with development, um, we're we're going to be policed pretty heavily by the UDC on how we develop and to make sure that we do something that's that's appropriate and doesn't create a safety problem. Um, I I feel like it's a good fit for the property. Um, it is a narrow strip of land. Uh, our objective here was to just create a something that makes sense for us along Woodrow Road. Um, with that, I think I' I'll be happy to answer any questions before I ask Mr. Payne to step up and and give his perspective. >> I have a question on the where the >> gas easement is. I was under the impression the gas easement ran right along where we're zoning, but it looks like it's way back from that. >> There are actually two of them. So, there's not there's one not shown on this. >> Uh, there's one shown on our graphic. We may not have Let me go back here >> because it's quite a ways back down. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, there's there are two. >> Oh, I see it right down there. Gas line easement down there. >> I'm sorry. I failed to point that out. Yeah, that the the the parallel lines that run inside of our red tract along the north side. >> That is the recent Atmas easement. Um, and that ties into the other gas easement, which is uh Mark West uh gas provider. They're they're a big gas transmission group. >> So, it doesn't run all the way down. Does it stop right there kind of in the ply lake? >> Uh, it it turns south and connects into their line in Woodro Road. >> So, it can be deeper where the Ply Lake is. >> Yes, sir. Yes. >> All right. Thank you very much. Thank you, Mr. Roman. [snorts] Gentlemen, Thomas Payne5309 FM1730. Um, there are several things that I want to cover. Uh one is that uh although this request covers approximately 51 acres um there are only 32 acres of it that are [snorts] not included in the Atmos Gas Line easement. So there are only 32 acres of net land that to be developed here. Um the product that I intend to do here is very similar to what was done in uh in front what I did in front of the Liberty High School uh just to the east. Um Terry >> this one. >> Okay. Uh these are some pictures of those properties. And one thing I would point out to you is that there is no requirement. And so let me back up. When I developed this property, I formed an office park association and put in place deed restrictions even though this land is actually in the county. The city limits here are the back of these properties or the north side of these properties. So this land is actually in the county. But I formed an office park association and put in place deed restrictions. Those deed restrictions did not require masonry. But you can see that people by their own choice, I mean these are several of these are million-doll properties. Uh and by their own choice, you can see what they did here. Um there's even a full commercial strip center on one of these lots. And that's a stucco. Uh the sort of medium brown is a stucco facade. Uh and and that's actually a just straight up retail strip center. Um and so uh this is uh envisioned to be something very similar. These lots subject lots are slightly shallower by about 25 ft than the ones of the pictures that you see. So, more restrictive in terms of what can be built in terms of depth. Um, see if I can Oh, yeah, I got the hang of this now. Uh, one thing I'll point out is, as Terry said, there are two gas line easements involved here. The one to the north that's kind of the long dash and three little dash line that go straight east and west has been in place for a long time. It was there when I bought the property. And it connects to a gas manifold just east of of Frankfurt, which is the target of the new Atmos line that they're running. They're going to that manifold because that's where they'll tie on to buy gas. And so, uh, the atmos easement, as Robert pointed out, is it comes in from the south, not all the way to the west end, and then turns and goes down the back of these lots and up the back of these lots and across. So, although I certainly uh righteously could have asked for commercial zoning on a 10acre corner at Frankfurt and Woodrow Road, I didn't do that. And that was because uh I don't want to have a 10 acre commercial lot there. I didn't desire to do that and that's why I didn't do it. At this point, I'm limited by the [clears throat] location of that Atlas gas line. It actually is in construction. Uh it's not going to be. It is in construction today. Um and so, uh they own that easement. I can't do anything on that easement without their permission. I can't build on it. Nobody can. Uh it's basically just dead land. Uh the most that could be done with Atmos's permission would be, you know, planting grass or something like that. Uh but nobody can build on it and nobody can use it for development. Um whether or not I'll reclaim all the way to the west side of this section of land is certainly in question. As you get west of that atmos easement where it turns you [snorts] get to the bottom of the [clears throat and cough] the hole here the deepest part of the hole. So it will be the most expensive thing to develop from the standpoint of dur cost. Uh I want to talk about kind of the west end of this uh request. Um, you can see where what will be Milwaukee Avenue shows to curve out to the west and our zoning carries over to to that point. And it does so because those two there are two 10acre tracks west of Milwaukee there. Um, and so when the zone case was filed, uh, Hugo Reed described a track that goes to the west side of my ownership. Uh, I think it's important to know, and this speaks to zone, I mean to deed restrictions both ways. Uh, there are deed restrictions in place west of Milwaukee Avenue. There was a row of 10 acre lots that was developed uh, in the past. I ultimately bought the rest of that land to the north and then separately bought the two 10acre tracks that are between the section line and what [clears throat] is shown to be the future Milwaukee Avenue. Uh although this zone case if passed would designate the south end of that heavy commercial, there are deed restrictions in place that preclude that. they require the construction of of uh residential homes on those two lots. And this is an important thing to and I've talked at length about this and y'all all know this, but from the standpoint of how city ordinances and deed deed restrictions fit together, a developer can put in place deed restrictions that are no less restrictive, but can be more restrictive than city ordinance. And so the deed jurisdictions that exist there will require and which I have no intention of not complying with will require residential construction. So although we didn't amend the description because we didn't want to change our timetable. Uh that's the kind of the status of of what's [snorts] west of the section line. Uh whether or not I reclaim and file cut and field plans to do lots in the deepest part of the ply lake will be up to me later on if the zoning [clears throat] is passed. I have attempted to explain uh quite a few times that uh there are a lot of reasons that it's to everyone's advantage to have this land in the city and and zoned. Uh the reason that I requested uh heavy commercial zoning here, which has been a source of consternation, and I understand the concern because if you look at the heavy zoning district, uh it uh allows for uses that nobody wants. Um there are statements that have been made uh and whether they're intentional or not, they have to be addressed. So, for example, uh there was a town hall meeting at Highen Oaks night before last. At that meeting, I not only did not say that I intended to develop storage here or a diesel mechanic shop, uh I said specifically that although those things are allowed in heavy commercial that they will be deed restricted and I will not allow those things. So, there will not be any storage. There will not be any just warehouse space. uh on any of this land. And and I want to make this point. This is not a he said, she said thing. The entirety of the town hall meeting was recorded. Uh I believe it's been posted and can be viewed. Uh and what I said is is right there for anybody to see what I did say and what I did not say. And I did not say I was going to allow those things. I said I was not going to allow those things. One of the things that has been a concern is is the sequence of things. And as Mr. Wood and I have discussed, we both regret. In the past, I could have come with a zoning request for heavy commercial. And within the context of that request, I could have said, I'm going to eliminate these things within the zone case. And I could have said, I won't allow these things. And the zoning could have been passed with those restrictions. the city on advice of council that that wasn't legal. Not current council and I don't know where current council stands on this but previous council uh the city uh at a point in time in the past took a position we can't do that anymore. So I can't come to you and say I want heavy commercial zoning and I'm going to restrict this and this and this. So because of sequencing, I come to you for zoning first and after that I plat and put in place an office park association and uh put in place the deed restrictions which are then filed at the courthouse for all to see and anything that happens on the land after that is subject to those restrictions that are public record. And those restrictions will be much more restrictive than the city's heavy commercial zoning. But I can't I can't do what comes second first. This is the first step in the process. Some people have said, "Well, what if you don't do that?" And my response to that is I have assisted Highland Oaks with their water questions and annexation in the past. And I would hope that I would have some credibility with them so that they understand when I say I'm going to do what I just told y'all I'm going to do, that that's what I will do. but I can't do it until I have the zoning in place. Um, a couple of things I want to talk about specifically. Um, Miss Phillips posted on their website, I guess this morning. I it was sent to me this morning a post and I I I hate doing this uh just because of time but at the same time I don't want to be accused of picking and choosing things out of what someone has written to try to make it seem like I'm trying to impact the the impression of what was said. So, I I want to read this to you, and I apologize. It will take a little bit, but I think it's important once I find it. Okay. Okay, here we go. And again, I apologize for the time. I will require my glasses. So, she [clears throat] said as follows. This meeting is taking place tonight for anyone who wants to attend. I strongly encourage you to come if you're opposed to the use of this land for heavy commercial properties. This land has been county annexed forever and just recently was annexed into the city. Now, Starlight Development, aka Thomas Payne, is requesting a zone change from single family housing to heavy commercial, meaning we and several others in this area will be very possibly be living across from a car lot, diesel mechanic or storage units, 80 or 90/10 version, not sure what that means, etc. It actually could be worse than that. It's all about the money. The beauty and serenity of our rural community will no long be no longer. Imagine the bright lights, the noise and increased traffic. Also, this area's current infrastructure cannot handle that kind of traffic, especially with the addition of a thousand homes by beaten bow in the northern half, plus the housing development by paint. I can't even imagine adding the traffic from heavy commercial to that. And what effect will this have on our property values? I for one wouldn't want to buy a home across my car lot. What a nightmare. And as near as I can tell, that's the end of it. Couple of things I want. Uh no, y'all stop. >> It's not on the page, by the way. >> Well, I don't know where it was. It was >> It was not on the notes. >> That's fine. It was sent to me. That's what I was told. Well, uh uh uh y'all stop the back and forth out there. I it doesn't matter where it was posted. It was posted publicly. And the main point I want to make is the comment that it's all about the money. Guilty is charged. Mr. Wood, when he develops land, it's all about the money. I would point out that Mr. Phillips, Mrs. Phillips husband, is in the roofing business. And I would dare say without asking him that every house he roofs is all about the money, as all of us with our businesses. And it's my business to develop land and I develop it as economically as I can. That's the whole point. This land was there for many many many decades and was available for anybody to purchase who wanted to purchase it. Nobody did until I came along. Uh I believe in personal property rights. My father did say, "My rights stop where yours begin and yours stop where mine begin." And in the case of property that that's at our property line. We don't have property rights that extend outside of our property line. Now, I don't mean by that uh and I'll say it differently. Nobody will defend the right of people as many as want to come to speak to come to speak any more strongly than I will whether or not they agree with me. Uh so and I said this at at the meeting and I will say this tonight. I have absolutely no problem that a hundred or a thousand people show up to speak and I'll support the right to do so. However, I do not support the right to tell me how to develop my private property and I don't tell them how to develop theirs. Um Charles Chambers wrote a letter to the uh board of Highland Oaks that kind of kicked all this off. Mr. Chambers lives south across the street and you see the West Woodrow edition there. He's three houses south of Woodro Road. So he's not on Woodrow Road. Uh furthermore, he lives in a subdivision that has no deed restrictions whatsoever. And as I pointed out, I could buy the house next door to him tomorrow, knock it down, and put a concrete plan on it. There's not one thing anybody could do about it. Uh there are no there is no zoning uh in in the county. Mr. Chambers stated and again this is recorded, you can see it at the uh Highland Oaks homeowners meeting that the city controls zoning in the county. and he stated unequivocally, "Don't kid yourself. The city controls zoning in the city ETJ." My response was, "Mr. Chambers, I don't know why you're telling pe these people that, but is factually incorrect. There is no zoning in the county and there is no control of use in the county, and those are the facts. So to some degree there is some disinformation that has been has occurred whether it's accidental or intentional. Uh and I'm not assigning either one. I'm just saying either way there has been some disinformation that has uh has made its rounds that have caused people a lot of concern. Um, that letter was conformed to to place an emphasis on the things in heavy commercial that can be done. I've made it very clear what my intentions are. There's not more than that that I can do. I can't there's there's not until we get past the zoning part of this question. I would point out to you that um see if I can find [clears throat] well I'll go right there. So do y'all see the uh let me see if I can get to it. That building right there that is a 60,000 square foot straight up metal building industrial manufacturing warehouse. It is a cabinet um milling plant. in front of it is a landscape a nursery landscape business. Now, frankly, I don't consider a landscape business to be uh offensive and I would certainly not have that as an disallowed use. The 60,000 square foot industrial building couldn't be built on what I'm developing. It's it's too big. There's no way to build a 60,000t building on this land. It's it's too shallow. when the lots are too small. Um, and so you already have these things in the neighborhood, uh, outside the city limits. Um, and I believe that what I'm doing is an appropriate development for for this land. At the time, there was somebody that mentioned something about neighborhood commercial zoning. I could ask you for neighborhood commercial zoning and and I would get it and then I would sit on this land for 30 years. Nobody's going to come build a strip center here uh for a long long time. The other thing I want to just give you for a point of reference and this I want to clarify a couple of things that Mr. Holman said. I own three acres at the northeast corner of this tract of land. So it would be on the southwest corner of 146th Street and Frankfurt. [clears throat] I retained that when I sold some land up in the northeast part of this section to Beatenville. That's all I retained is three acres. The net developable acreage requested here is 31 acres. Probably less one acre on that west end that I've already told you really is not going to be developed this way. So it's probably 30 acres. If you add the two together, that's 33 acres. There won't be any other commercial development on this tract of land. There won't be at the northwest corner that will be residential all the way to Milwaukee, down Milwaukee, down Frankfurt. There are only two places on this land there will be commercial development. And that's by my design by my design and limitations of the market. I should say it that way. Um, and I'm just going to give you a little example of of what a small fraction of commercial land that is in this section. Mr. Wood and his partner, Mr. Strong, bought a piece of land at the southeast corner of 146th Street and Quaker Avenue. It's 80 acres, I believe. On that 80 acres of land, they zoned, platted, [clears throat] and sold off 30 acres plus a little bit of commercial land. That's 37 12% 37 12% of a section of land, which is 640 acres, is more than 200 acres of commercial land. So, think about that for a minute. 30 acres is pretty much the same amount of total commercial land I'll have on this entire section, which is eight times more land than that 80 acres is. I don't think this is in any way me being overly greedy or unreasonable. And I want to make for now one final statement as clearly as I can. One of the residents of Highland Oaks at the meeting, and again, this was all recorded, made the statement that I had, as though it was intentional, offended the residents of Highland Oaks because I have allowed Beatenbo to build houses in my section of land. So, in terms of somebody trying to extend their rights way beyond how far they should go, I just want to make the point that there is some of that thinking that's involved and that has permeated through a lot of discussions with some of their neighbors. Um, I would be the first one to step up and defend my friends at Beatenbow. They build a quite a nice product. I'm not the least bit embarrassed to have them. Uh, you don't have to like them. The residents of Highland Oaks don't have to like them. But it is beyond unreasonable to suggest that I set out to offend anyone in Highland Oaks because I sold some land to Beatenbo. Uh, I suppose that if everybody had their way, I wouldn't develop this land at all or I would develop another Highland Oaks. It would take, you couldn't even calculate how long it would take to develop this land in properties similar to what's in Highland Oaks. That's just not where the market is today. It's in smaller homes. And as a developer, uh it's my job to determine what the market needs and to provide that to the market. Uh just as anyone with a business does exactly the same thing. For now, I'm going to leave it at that, but I'll be happy to stay here and answer any questions you have at this point. >> Any questions for Mr. Payne at this time? >> Yes. Um, is there what is just out of curiosity, why is Milwaukee curving like that instead of going straight down that property line? >> The reason that it was devised that way [snorts] originally is because of the pile lake. Uh, as you know, we typically now try to go around the boundaries of PIA Lakes where we can rather than going through them. Uh, it's not going to end up [snorts] being at that location for a number of reasons. Uh, but uh, so it will be further to the west than what it's shown on that map, but that's why it's shown there at this time. >> And then in just from knowledge, heavy commercial, what are the height rules in case >> what are the what >> the heights? What is the maximum height for um heavy commercial? >> Heavy commercial. There are no maximum heights. >> That's what I thought. >> Yeah, >> no maximum heights. >> Yeah, there are no maximum heights. However, deed restrictions will limit height. >> And I mean, you brought me into this conversation a couple times. So, we talked this morning. That's my biggest concern is >> you get it done, you get it switched, and >> something happens, you don't reszone it, somebody else. I come and buy it >> and then I do what I want. That's my own that's and and the traffic concerns of the of the neighbors are as well. [applause] But to Terry's point, I mean, I just developed on the other side other end of Woodrow Road and it's it's a disaster. The road's a horrible disaster, but until we do something, they're not going to fix it. That's just the way it is. >> Well, Robert, my response to that is is very simple. I go back to what we talked about earlier and what I've already said. I I can't control [snorts] I didn't write the rules in the city zoning ordinances and there aren't any height limits in heavy commercial zoning. That's a fact. But as I've also clearly stated, I will be platting and putting in place deed restrictions. This piece of land is not for sale. So the idea that I'm going to get this zoning and sell this tract of land to somebody before I deed restrict it and plat it, it that's that's not in the carts. It's not what's going to happen. Uh, and I'm telling you affirmatively and and formally today publicly that's not what's going to happen. It's not my plan. It's not what I'm going to do. And so I understand it, but the answer is the same as it is to the mechanic shop. I mean, you could say the same thing. I can sell it tomorrow without deed restrictions to a mechanic shop. All I can do is tell you that's not what I'm going to do here. I can't fix it beforehand. I can only put in place deed restrictions after the fact and as you know those are the rules that we all live with now. So the kind of whatif game can be played with you know a multitude of zone requests that you have and there's not any other bit different answer to give. I mean I wish there was and we talked about the fact we wish there was but there's not. when the annexation took place when the annexation took place. Yes, sir. >> There was nothing to where like you have to uh pave two lanes um in Woodro Frankfurt and Milwaukee. >> Well, uh good question. The answer is no, but I'll expand on that a little bit. Uh Woodro Road is a county road. None of it is in the city limits. So the city could not annex this piece of land and impose on me a requirement to do anything on Wood Row Road. That's number one. Number two, uh they didn't impose a requirement for me to build thorough affairs in the city of Wuk construction of thorough affairs is the responsibility of the city. It's not ever the responsibility of the developer. >> Correct. when you do an annexation sometimes like I have other places in LC where I'm having to pave two lanes of major arterial just because I did an annexation in it. >> I can't speak to that. I can only tell you that's not the case here. It's never been the case with I've done a multitude of annexations and that's never been the case. >> Okay. >> Um >> and the other half of Woodro is going to be inside the city limits right on on the 55 ft rideway. That's not correct. the the city limits of Lok, Texas stop on the south end 10 ft north of the future city uh the future rightway line of Woodro Road. None of Woodrow Road is when I say ever going to be in the city, none of it as a result of current circumstances. It would only ever come in the city if the city annexes additional land to the south and brings it into the city. But none of it will be a city street at any time in the procedure. >> The 55 ft rightway that Terry was talking about is going to stay in the county. >> It is in the county. It is in the county. >> I think you you could go back to your stuff in front of Liberty on those slides and it shows exactly what you're going to do >> as far as curb. >> Tell me when to stop >> other way. Yes. >> Right there shows kind of what that has to be wood railroad curving. But but to Thomas's point, they they don't to Thomas's point, they don't make you do anything with that. That's just the way it is everywhere [snorts] in the county. >> That's right. Now, I will say a couple of things. [snorts] As a result of the development that I have done already, uh, Highland Oaks will save easily a half a million dollars on their project of bringing water to Highland Oaks because when they set off on that path, uh, water was the better part of a mile away and it's now at their front entrance on Frankfurt Avenue. I have extended it to that point. It's there today. So they already are half million dollars ahead easily uh as a result of development that has occurred. In addition, uh Vatenbo will choose to improve Frankfurt Avenue or is choosing to improve Frankfurt Avenue from 146th Street down to their southern limit. Now I want to be careful when I say improve because that can mean different things. Uh, if you go back far enough, uh, University Avenue south of 1585 and all the way to Woodro Road was a two-lane county road and Bell Farms was halfdeveloped. Uh, Vidian was partially developed and the city in conjunction with the county, myself and Beatenbo who all contributed to the cost of the project, improved University Avenue. What that meant is they milled up the old asphalt and they put down new asphalt. It's still two lanes, but it's new. And in the short run, the development, you know, of thorough affairs out in this area will be no different. Uh the city council recently reduced impact fees to zero. So we don't have the option anymore of developers building thoroughares in exchange for impact fee credit. So the shortrun thoroughare construction is going to be uh just as I said it'll be you know two lanes or maybe three lanes of asphalt at the current elevations but it will be much better than it is today and that's coming very soon. I mean will be building houses uh at their homestead subdivision uh in probably 90 to 100 probably 120 days. Uh and so that's all coming and those are all improvements that development brings. Without development, you have you have none of that and that will continue to be the case and everybody will continue to benefit from that. Anything else? >> Any other questions for Mr. Payne? Okay. Thank you. Thank you. [snorts] Okay. Now we'll ask for people who wish to speak in opposition. again, if you will state your name and address when you come to the podium. >> Well, thank you, gentlemen. Madam, now that Mr. Payne's had his opportunity to make personal attacks on me and Miss Phillips, maybe we could get down to business here. My name is Charles Chambers. I've been an attorney practicing here in Love for 40 years. I grew up out here. I've had the privilege of serving on literacy love arts alliance and on Grace campus in addition to many other committees and civic things. Very proud to be a resident here. My wife Pam and I live at 16206 County Road 1735. Now we bought that house when we got engaged five years ago. Love it out there. Got room for my my horses, got room for my garden, [clears throat] and my little road comes right out in pretty much the dead center of this proposed resoning. Now, my first argument in favor of uh of or in in opposition in favor of y'all voting against it is a legal argument, and I will certainly defer to Mr. Wade on this. I believe that this proposal by Mr. Payne is premature. When Mr. Payne or Starlight Development entered into a municipal services agreement which was signed by council on 71301, he agreed to be governed by subsection 5B uh to the city of love ordinances. Now that refers you over to chapter 38 subdivisions of the city ordinance provides that a subdivision is a division is the division of a tract of land within the corporate limits or the extr territorial jurisdiction of the city of Leach into two or more parcels or two or more parts for the purpose of laying out any division of any tract of land. This survey cuts out a 51.3 acre tract out of a larger tract owned by Mr. Payne. It's a subdivision by any stretch of the imagination or a strict reading of the ordinance. That ordinance goes on to require that at a minimum a preliminary plat including a preliminary drainage plan must be filed in accordance with with the uh uh with the uh ordinances. Neither one has been done to my knowledge. In fact, the proposal specifically says unplatted. So that is my argument as to that he has not complied with the ordinances which require that if he had wanted to annex or to seek a zoning change on the entire two or 300 acres he owns that's fine but here he has specifically cut out a tract to move it to 8C which lays out a separate track and thus is premature. Now, second, traffic. Everybody's talked about traffic, and you bet that's an issue. Woodrow Road is a 40 foot dedicated easement. 40 foot, not uh a whole lot farther meet cage. and it scares you to death when you meet an F250 with a six horse trailer coming behind it. It's narrow. It has zero zero shoulder. It has dirt and bar ditches. That's it. Another legal point which I again Mr. way can correct me if I'm wrong. Under the uh believe it's the Texas uh uh city municipal code or what it's fairly new ordinance if I read that correctly says that any annexation that reaches out and abuts a county road must annex that county road. That has not been done. There is no question about this is a county road. So I don't believe that the proper annexation of the county road was done. Again, Mr. Wade's the expert here and uh he knows his stuff and if I'm wrong, I'll be be the first to admit it. It won't be the first time this week. Third, this change requested is one of the most radical changes available. It goes from low density single family homes. The area north of this division beaten B is going to develop about 400 acres of homes. There are residential homes everywhere else. The cabinet shop that Mr. Payne refers to is roughly a quarter mile to the south of Woodro Road. It's not right there on Woodro Road as he might want you to believe. Now, Mr. pain says and he said at the town hall meeting and he among other things told me when he called me Sunday afternoon said hey man don't worry I'm going to put deed restrictions in place well guess what I think Mr. Wood touched on this. If this is granted and passes council and he decides, you know what? I don't have to put deed restrictions. He doesn't. He does not have to put any deed restrictions whatsoever. He can put what he wants. A diesel repair shop, he can sell it to rust truck. He can sell it for [snorts] a warehouse. He can sell it for heavy equipment repair. He can sell it for a freight warehouse to sign a freight. I I've been practicing law for 40 years and I've seen people say a lot of things when they want something. But there is no assurance that he can give other than saying I'm not going to do it regarding the deed restrictions and what he can do. I want y'all to think in your mind for me just a minute. I want you to ride along with me on a drive I took this morning down from my office downtown. Went to 19th and Avenue A. I drove down to 50th Avenue A. I turned east down uh to MLK and I turned around and came back. Y'all y'all all know what's along those roads. Y'all been down there. Envision in your mind some of those businesses across from your home. across from the home that you have worked your whole life to buy and maintain. Envision that because that is what is several of those businesses are allowed under HC. Now I said it's all good and well to promise that but that is what is allowed. Now as some people first learn the policy of the city is to dis discourage commercial development. uh uh discover uh HC uh development. If so, it should and this is a city's own policy and it's in the letter that I sent you. It should not be done in a residential area. This is a residential area and if so, so it should be heavily buffered. I don't think a 50ft rideway and a 40 foot black top road is really truly buffering. This storm water is going to be horrendous. The storm water runoff. It's 51.3 acres. Mr. Fine said 35 acres 32. That's still 1,500,000 square feet paved over that slopes very uh very steeply to the west. He shows that little ply lake down there. What he doesn't show is across Woodro Road there is another ply lake. It is considered one big ply lake before Woodrow Road cut it in half. But running off down there, it's going to flood across Woodro Road. It's going to go into that other Plague Lake. And even in a heavy rain, as it sits now, that unimproved county road right to the west of of me, right to the west of 1735 looks like a river when it rains. And this is going into a lake that recharges our aquifer. Uh you look at you look at the city of love where they've got the little sign with the fish on their drains. You know drains this way. Be careful what you drain in there. Think about oil, grease, dirt, uh what have you running off pavement or concrete down into a pla lake that you to recharge the the the ogal. Now again the entire ne character of the neighborhood is low density commercial. This HC development can be avoided. Y'all have the you all have the power to do that to deny that. And I hope that you that you will. We all built to move out there for the peace and quiet that other people will talk about. Now let's talk a little bit. There was a lot of talk from from uh uh the gentleman who go Reed and the city about how many out of the city limits letters that we got 120 something. Well, let me share with you something that Mr. Payne shared with me Sunday afternoon when he called me. You know what? Y'all are out of the city limits. All y'all do is show up and talk. That's all you can do. you don't have any say. You can show up and talk. Well, guess what? We're in the extr territorial jurisdiction. We're subject to zoning or to development uh development uh it may not be zoning per se, development criteria within the five mile home rural extr territorial uh jurisdiction. So, yes, we do have a say. We do have a say and it's a say that you should listen to in in my opinion. Now, Mr. Payne talked about this meeting at Highland Oaks and I was there. Several people said, "What Mr. Payne? What if you don't get your zoning? I'll just deanex it from the city and do what I want." He said it was recorded. It was don't matter what they do. I'm going to do what I want. I'm going to deanex it and I'll just build what I want right there. That's what he said. That's not right. That's just not right. And it was the Texas Local Government Code that I was uh referring to. Uh Matt, excuse me. Uh Mr. Payne also said at that meeting, we've got this narrow strip there that there would be three new roads going on to Woodro Road out of that tract. Three roads plus the proposed uh Milwaukee and I I don't know when that is scheduled for or what have you, but we do have a say and I encourage y'all to preserve the character of this neighborhood. Mr. P talked about his talked about his his daddy, your rights quit where mine start. Well, my daddy also told me and this is a classic example. Just cuz you can don't mean you should. And I'm glad that you should not do this. [applause] Can you state your ladies and gentlemen? Are y'all ready? My name is Rodney Warren. I live at 16211 Private Road 1740, Lockach, Texas. And uh I'm kind of apprehensive about talking against this, but I'm I'm against it. I'm apprehensive one because Thomas Payne is a friend of mine. I think we've had some dealings together. We buted heads. We've gotten apart. We've come back together. So, I hate talking against him, but I think he's wrong in this case. Second reason is I've been in front of this planning and zoning board I don't know how many times over the past 30 years. I developed sonic driveins starting in ' 89 or 90. And every time I had to do a sonic drive-in, I had to go in front of, well, maybe except one time, planning and zoning to go from C2 to C3, which was the old zoning C3 with special provision, special use permit. I had to go through the same process to go one degree. And here you've got a man going from single family one, the lowest level, to heavy commercial. I would have been laughed out of the office if I'd have proposed something like that. In fact, the first two or three times I came to the city and talked about building a sonic drive in, I was told, "No, we don't want another hidey-ho over here." So, I persisted and and I've got where I've gotten and uh I'm thankful to be a part of Levik. been in this area for 40 years. [clears throat] I was a little miffed when I didn't get a letter. Okay. I I live on private road. Okay. I said that private road. We are community homeowners association. We own the road. We have to maintain it. Woodrow Road is on my only point of ingress and egress. I'm impacted whether the city allows it or not or admits to it and I know they've got to draw the line somewhere. But I'm impacted because I've got to go down Woodro Road. Several people have talked about some of the things about Woodrow Road and I'm going to re reiterate a couple of them. It's a narrow two-lane blacktop. No centerline stripe, no shoulder. Some cases there's a little bit of dirt that you can get on to, but in some cases you go off and over correct, come back on and uh you got a rollover. In the last 5 years, there've been two fatalities within a mile of my home. I don't know about the west of Woodro Road. But it's it is it is dangerous. It I pulled out one time and it was a guy coming up from the west. He was coming so fast that he went into the bar ditch to the north of me so he wouldn't t-bone me. I I had looked down there and I didn't see anything coming, but there's a hill right down there and man, he was flying. It's dangerous. The road, Woodro Road, uh Woodro Road, I I was told by the city it's going to be a thoroughare, major thoroughare, I think it was. You go to the east end of Woodro Road and you start in farmland in Ransom Canyon and and I will apologize to anybody from Ransom Canyon for what I'm going to say in a minute. You go to the west end, it ends in a bar ditch next to a farmer's field. So, it's a road from nowhere to nowhere. There is some development in the middle part of it. uh love Cooper got two high schools there from uh highway 87 down to slide and there's a lot of development in there but when you go further west my part of Woodrow Road from slide road further west it's residential [clears throat] Mr. Mr. Payne talked about the little flower shop in the mill shop. Mill shop has access to the road behind >> County Road 166. >> Uh he he can get out another way. I can't. Many of my neighbors can't on on both sides. We have to go down Woodro Road. It was it's a rural residential area from Slide Road all the way out till it ends. and we're wanting to do a dramatic drastic change. And so I'm opposed to it and I I think my neighbors are opposed to it. Talked about being laughed out of the PNZ meeting or the application process. There was one time several years ago an associate of mine had come to town. I don't know where he's from but out of state and he was in the sign business and outside of Leach he put some billboards up on some of my properties. We worked out a deal. Well, he said let's go into love and put some of those in. And I said, "You can't do it. Love does not like signs. No way, shape, or form. They don't like signs." [clears throat] He said, "Well, let me do it. I you know my lawyer has looked at it and it it's legal. We can do it and we can convince them. So I said, "Okay, you can use my property in your in your zone case and you can apply for it. You got to pay for it. I I'm not going to speak for it, but I'll be there give you some encouragement." And you [clears throat] guys know what happened. Uh if you weren't there, or if you were, you definitely know what happened. Uh there was a lot of opposition and uh my friend Thomas Payne got up. I was defeated. I knew it. I wasn't in the deal. The other guy was, but Thomas Payne got up to speak against it. And he talked about the traditions in Leach and the community that we've built and how we shouldn't let commercial interest come and impede and overturn what we've done. And my thought when I think about that is my how things change, you know, a few years later and a half million dollars an acre for land will change your opinion on what is permissible and what is not. Uh second thing when I look at that is commercial. I I've developed sonic drive-ins in probably 12 states uh from coast to coast. done a lot of sight selection and there is no way that a McDonald's, a Burger King, a Sonic Drive-In, Dairy Queen will ever build on that road in my lifetime and many of your lifetime. There's not enough traffic. There's not enough itinerary traffic coming through there to support that kind of traffic uh that kind of business. We're just not going to build there. We like to go up in places like Slide and uh Loop 88, you know, where there's a lot of people coming into town to go to work. So, I I think it's a mistake on that part, but he could put some people out there uh and create more traffic, which would impede us. >> [clears throat] >> And I think it's kind of interesting that it was annexed up 20 or 40 feet away from Woodro Road. And and I'm thinking why? I don't I don't know why because I don't know what was going on there. But I know the city doesn't want to pay for making that a five lane, making it a safe road. They they won't be able to and they just don't want to do it. And if they don't annex up to it, then they don't have to. So who's going to do that? If you want that kind of commercial, there's thousands of acres along the loop 88 corridor that has the road work or will have the road work and have the space and not have the residents all up next to them that would be protesting it. So, there's a lot better options. Somebody at the city asked me what I would prefer there and you know, I said, "What was it before? Single family residents. Yeah, that would be great. Let's just leave it alone." That's uh that's my opinion. I think it should not be approved and I would appreciate your vote against it. [applause] Anyone else like to speak? >> My name is Clay Irwin. I'm at 16203 Belmont Avenue. Um, I think there's been some great comments made. I think um, and correct me if I'm wrong, but did Thomas Payne stand up here and say money over people? Is that what he said? I think he said that. And I think that's that's deplorable. And I think that's that's something to take into consideration that he's going to do this and going to do that. Okay. I've got to my knowledge behind my property. When I say behind, I mean to the east. I'm going to have storage units directly across right right on my fence line. Storage units and possibly a car wash, I believe. I'm fine with that, guys. I'm fine with that, man. That's fine. He's going to make money. I had a chance to buy that land. I didn't. Somebody's developing. That's great. Making money is good thing, okay? It's not a bad thing. But the way we're going about this, where it's at, the road conditions, the [clears throat] elevation change, okay, all those things have to be in taken in consideration. Not the money, but the people. Okay, that's all I have to say. Thank you'all for being here and hear me. Justin Phillips, 5811 Woodro. Obviously, uh, the Welch family and our family are probably the most direct u affected by this. I think that's why we were one of the few letters that was sent out uh to discuss this. I've never been to one of these before. I really didn't know how to prepare for it. [clears throat] Uh, I learned a lot by listening and I did listen to Mr. Payne the other night at that meeting. I think he's a very a very good businessman. I think he's uh obviously a very good businessman. He is a large land owner for our community. Uh he's he's got property almost on every corner of uh Lok and u and and had so for a long time. I don't think that it's the right time for out there right now. I don't think the very brand new southern tip of love needs to even be entertaining these zoning questions right now. Uh, I do agree with Robert with guys that have done an awesome job through their life of of developing love that development does bring infrastructure, but the county budget won't be able to cover the infrastructure. And you can see the progress between our two Cooper high schools. And it's and and that was with plenty of bond money given to them. And so obviously we've always been a sort of stepchild west of Slide Road on Woodrow Road Maintenance on Woodrow Road attention. Obviously we got kiddos, buses, things like that running down the running down Woodrow Road taking kids to school at two different schools now at Liberty and and at Cooper. And my kids grew up going down that road scared to death when they got their driver's license. And it and we've all we we don't need to reiterate the problems with Woodro Road, but what the picture I want to paint is is this shouldn't even be up for discussion yet. This is is the as the sonic guy told you, there is literally thousands of acres of commercial property. I own a couple of them. I'd love to sell. There's thousands of acres of property for people to attain, to rent, to buy, to do whatever. It's not needed out this far south in love. And I agree with Mr. Payne. He does have the right to do what he wants to do. He did buy it. Nobody else in this room went over and bought that section. But I think possibly the gas line easement and some land trapping from that has pushed this to it's the only way to make money. It's the only way to make money on it. Even though just west of these is beautiful 10acre tracked homes coming back east that could just be continued right across the front and and and those homes are full of our Red Raider basketball coach. Uh um I I think there's Matt Murray uh Matt Murray's over here. So we have and those filled up like that. I remember when I saw them go up and then I go, "Oh man, they're going to put that that oil well down there." and they and they had an oil derek down there and I was like, "Oh my gosh, those people are no way." And that busted. But these folks have have successfully developed large acreage lots and I think that that with the ability to have city water there, man, that's pretty attractive. Halfacre lot, 1acre lot, however big you want, Woodro Road frontage. I think there's other I think there's other uses for this land. I think cramming heavy commercial zoning in is basically what he thinks can be done to profit the most money this side of that gas line. And u and I think that's really why we're here. Um is to start those steps towards doing that. And I think it's wrong. I don't think I don't think South Lev south of that line that's annexed right now is ready for it. Thank you. >> [applause] >> HELLO GENTLEMEN, LADY. My name is Stephen Hill. I live at 5713 Woodrow Road, right at the corner of Frankfurt and uh Woodro. Um don't know exact I've never done this before, so you know, I'm not this professional guy you guys been dealing with. uh Woodward Road from our house when we bought it had just this little we were a playa and Justin and his wife we they've cut that in half and they got flooded in 2011 got flooded out big time five days of rain uh several inches an hour and they had like water 4 foot deep they were water skiing in their backyard because the pla that was there was not even beginning to become adequate. It was like a foot or two deep. Since then, Justin has gone out and spent, I'm sure, hundreds of thousands of dollars to build three plyatt tanks, huge ones. I built one that's seven acres, 10 foot deep. And I built another one that's five acres out of fear that I was going to go through that what they've gone through where they had water coming up through their back door on a normal rain. So I'm thinking about this and I'm going well if you look from my property all the way around 360° it goes like this. Everybody's elevation over us. All the water comes to our house. the um God, I forgot it. I'm sorry, I lost my train. All the water comes to our house and floods us. We built these tanks. We were able to get the water control under control with our money, not with city or county money, with our money. And this this structure he's doing, the the lot that he's going to do, well, that's 51 acres of concrete. And concrete just doesn't soak water up like a field does. The field out there soaks the water up for the first two or three rains if they're real close. If they get further apart, we get a little get a little more soakage. Uh I'm just concerned about flooding. Has there been an impact study on that? Now, Mr. Payne says, uh, we'll guarantee you won't get any water. No, he doesn't say guarantee. He says, "We're going to build something to to man manage it." Well, my question is, what if he can't manipulate mother nature and she puts on a real snit out there? How is he going to be able to control that? We've got tanks to that can control our water that's there now today, but not the extra water is going to come. The only tank there is is up Frankfurt about a mile. The water can go in there, but from that tank is probably 50 foot slope down to our house. And the last I heard, water runs downhill from Frankfurt uh from the gas station at Frankfurt this way and from the other from Milwaukee this way. It all converges right where we're at. And uh I'm just concerned about that. The other thing is is Woodro Road is a you've heard all the stories about the road. Well, it's 65 miles an hour. If you can imagine driving down a road and trying to put your signal on and pull into your driveway with cars going 65 miles an hour this way, that way it gets exciting to say the least. Um, a woman ran the sign, car blew up, she burnt to death, right in his his front yard. He's had so many cars go through his fence that he doesn't even put the fence up anymore because why? Just someone else is going to come down drunk and knock it down. You go the other direction. My wife over here, she got her leg ripped off from right on the corner of Frankfurt in Woodro because of people going too fast. Uh you can sit there and listen to the motorcycles. I kind of listen and listen to these guys to see how much how much courage they really got. They get on it. You can hear first gear, second gear, third gear, fourth gear, fifth gear, and they're like a mile down the road and they're still going at it. Now, I don't know how fast they're going. Guys in Corvettes. There's a drag strip in front of our house. Not with two cars, but with people just coming around the car corner going fast. We've had a pickup truck that hit our property, went off the ledge, off the asphalt, under the dirt, pitched sideways, and rolled, killed her daughter. Uh, you know, there's got to be something done. and having huge cement trucks or dirt trucks like we have now constantly running up down the road. Well, I understand that because they're building and they need to move dirt wherever they got to move. And I don't have a problem with that. But at some point in time, that road has got to get set up to where it calms down to where it's safe for people to be able to move around on. Uh, I would like for you all to just think about if you own my house and you're thinking about the water that's going to come into your house or the cars that she got hit right in our front yard. So, I mean, couldn't couldn't put it any closer to us. Uh, you know, if you go down the road, you'll see big boulders by my gate. I did that so that we can go out to the g out to the mailbox and have some protection against a car running over us on our property because that's where my wife got hit. On the other side, we put the boulders there to keep a car from coming this way, which has happened and ends up in our on our front lawn and goes has gone through there. I put these things there to get make it safe. Well, that gets me hopefully safe where I'm at. But once you turn out, it's Katy bar the door. You got cars going everywhere. Uh I would really appreciate it if you just consider if you were there what you're going to have to do. And as a city willing to put up any kind of a bond or insurance policy for us getting flooded or helping us get the street bigger? Uh I mean it's come out some night. I'll buy you a beer and you can sit on my front porch and you go watch the races. Okay. Thank you very much. Thank you. [applause] My name is Nick Hill Parag. I am at 53 and 160th Street in Highland Oaks. Um I want to speak uh against this development of course. Uh but first of all, I've not had any dealings with any of these folks. I don't know Mr. Payne personally at all. Um I have no qualms against him in the 10 minutes or 15 or 30 minutes he spoke. Um one thing I'm it's clear that he's a great businessman. So I want to commend him for that. But I also want to say to him that Lord has blessed you. He really has. I mean he's been in this community for so long. I hear all sorts of good things about what he's owned and what he's done. I'm sure he's been up here talking to you all. But I want to appeal to that side of his heart because I've come from a different state. Moved here five years ago. Moved our family here. And the one thing I love about Lok is the people. It's our community. It's the safe place where I thought I could homeschool my kids. And I'm so proud that I'm here. Lord brought us here. Coming from high density places where people are packed in. He just mentioned that Mittenbo is putting homes. That's where the business is. There's no longer a need for a Highland oak likes neighborhood where you have an acre lot and big houses. There is need for a smaller homes that are packed in. I just wanted to propose a different perspective, a different view. I do not understand the business uh of land development. That's not the business I'm in. I'm sure he has his reasons to go straight from a low um whatever it's called the low housing whatever your code is to a certainly a high see I don't know anything about this clear but I just wanted to present a different perspective you're going to have homes in this particular lot and it's going to be highdensity homes there's going to be kids in there's going to be families in there let's look at it a bit differently I love this picture that's up here because I drive on wood going down to the airport and every time I come home at night and I see this lot, all I see is a lot of money. Behind that is a school where kids go to school. Right in front of it, this business looks odd. I don't understand why it's here. I really don't. What business? What are we Why? First of all, why are we selling boats in Labok? I don't get that. I really don't understand it. I'm sorry. But when I see what he's proposing, I feel like at least a business like this will show up. And then it concerns me because not only everything that these people said, I have seen wrecks in this city like I've never seen anywhere and I was 12 years in California. Okay. The wrecks on slide road, humongous road coming out of the Harbor Freight areas or whatever that that street is. People go through that big of a street and end up t-boned. And now you can imagine what these people are saying. 65 miles an hour coming down the hill where you don't see anything. And now you have a high density whatever business. You're trying to get these people out in and out of that business. You are going to put people at risk by doing this. Instead, let's imagine this particular area that he's talking about. You know, one of the best beautiful things that I see every time I get out of Highland Oops. towards Woodrow is an empty lot next to that big old gas station now. And there are these this grass. It's just grass. And the beautiful evening sunset hits those blade of grass. Just wait at that stopite for one second. Does two things. Gives you safety because you can then let the woodro traffic go as fast as they want. and just let you adore the beauty that the Lord has put. That is what he has in his hands. He could take that land, convert that into a little park, make that part of the bigger project where the kids that are living in high density areas can come out and play. That does improve the value of the property. Believe me when I tell you that converting that to a high density and whatever high capacity business, you're just turning this into California. Why? When we have so much land, we have so much places to develop in the appropriate places. Instead of putting this kind of an example, you know, in front of kids that go to school wondering where do we use the boats? Why can't we use a park? Put a park. >> Give your give Betton B your friend another place to increase the value of that home and also help us in the process to retain the value of our homes. Think of it. It's the power in your hands. You are able to do that. do that and the community will love you, worship you, not like the Lord, but at least worship you like a good businessman. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. [applause] >> My name is Shannon Hansen. I'm at 5502 158th Street in Highland Oaks. Um, thank y'all for your time. Sorry this is going so long. Uh, first one to start out with is I've worked off and on with Thomas throughout the years as I'm in real estate. Um, different questions and then on the water committee too for Highland Oaks. Do want to make it known though that that area of water that they did put in was not Goodwill. It was whoever beat whoever to the punch and they're developing before our water came in. So, just to make sure everybody knows that there was no back door things going on. Um, but I just kind of want to throw out pictures are deceiving and I don't know if y'all want to slide back through like the different maps or anything. I mean, if you think about them, it doesn't show really what it looks like on Woodro. You've got residential on all four areas. Although Beaten Bow has not have a house standing at the moment that is going to be thousands of houses. I mean, just right in that area. You've got one house that is right. It's a 10acre track and that bubble goes into that house. On the other side, it's all, you know, mostly populated. And then Highland Oaks on the east side of Slide and Woodro. On that side, you do have some housing where they've built these areas, but it's not the same. It's not what we have on the other side. That is not as residential. Um, so pictures are deceiving and it doesn't show exactly what the population looks like when you're just looking at the maps and little pictures like this or the pictures they took of the roads around where it is. You don't see that the beat houses that are going up. You just see open land. Um, on the opposite side or something else to talk about is uh in y'all's development that hidden oaks 30 acres is going to commercial. Correct. But is that garden like garden offices >> in the 30 acres in y'all's development? Is that going to be garden offices? >> He was referring to a different neighborhood. But yes, we have 10 acre a hard corner and then we have garden office all the way down Frankfurt. >> That's a lot different than heavy commercial though. I don't think anybody in this room would be completely opposed if we were to come to some type of compromise and and it be brought down from heavy commercial to some type of lesser commercial. Um, and things do change and that's why sometimes people have a hard time because two years ago I remember Mr. Payne telling me that that area behind Bow was going to be a Holiday Oaks 2.0 0 when we were discussing water and how we were going to get water lines all the way down the road and now that is not even feasible and was said in here that it's not what is needed but two years ago so when people are concerned about what deeds and restrictions and things that might go in there's reasons for that the plans on that land of what has been said from his mouth to what is coming up now has definitely changed um while we were also in here and they were talking about the lights not being that bright coming off of any of the stuff that they've already put up on Woodro. I asked my husband to drive down there and I don't know if you could see it, but this is what it looks like coming off of the car lot at 7:30. It's bright. I would not want that shining into my house across the street. And I think that everybody in this room has something important to say. It is not our land and we do not have the exact same say so of anything that can happen and we are not trying to keep anybody from property but how can they profit and not also drop the values of our properties and our livelihoods around it. Um and then the roads the roads are not ready. I had two kids driving to Cooper and when the weather was bad it just scared the crud out of me to put them on the road because everybody drives so so fast. It's two lanes. There's no shoulder. And I'd always be like, leave lots of distance between because all it takes is even if you don't hit the person in front of you, that person behind you is going so fast it's going to be a a pileup. And that happens a lot. We are not ready for this type. Now, hopefully maybe this can go back to the drawing board and be lessened or tabled until the roads are ready. Thank you. Good evening. I'm Mark Williams. I live at 16203 Private Road 1740. And I disagree with Mr. Chambers. I think we are actually directly in the middle of that. [clears throat] And furthermore, we are probably the closest homes that sit there. I got a notice about this, so clearly I must be impacted. And I'm the second house in. And I already know as soon as I walk out my front door, the first thing I'm going to see is that it's there. It will be there, whatever it's going to be. And I don't know Mr. uh Payne at all. I hope he's a man of his word, but I I don't know. [clears throat] To that end, u I know trauma. I'm a trauma and general surgeon here in this town at the level one trauma center, the Griswald trauma center, and have been for 15 years. I know dangerous. That road is already very dangerous and this is only going to make it more dangerous and that's enough said about that. Y'all have heard about it until we get at least a center line. It's going to stay dangerous. [clears throat] But what I will bring your attention to since so much else has been talked about is your 2040 plan from 2017 2018. There's obviously several references there that about heavy commercials intended to be located away from residential uses. There's almost 10,000 acres. When I looked at this, and I may be the last person or the most stupid person to look at all 288 pages of that, but I did. And there's a graph in there about the usage of your designated heavy commercial land in this in this city. Only 5% of that land is used. So, I wonder why this has to be done at that spot when there's all this other land that can be used. So, and then bring your attention to page 81. There's a statement there that says nonresidential uses adjacent to existing or planned residential areas should not happen in this instance with the building of the beaten mode comp uh subdivision above it. And make no mistake, I realize we're across the the street, but we're 100 ft away from the city limits. We are part of the city. We we will eventually be annexed per that plan. And we'll probably be ruled rural residential, which means we'll get have to pay city taxes, but we're probably never going to get any services because of that because how are you going to get around all that other stuff to give us services? But I anticipate that'll happen sooner than later. But there's in both instances that is at play with the residential above it and the fact that we are residential all the way from slide all along Woodrow Road all the way to till you get to 179. It's residential. It really is. I don't know most of these people in here, but I feel like they're my neighbors. [clears throat] So, to that end, I I think as we grow, there's the other concept, neighborhood preservation, which is on the same page that existing neighborhoods are to be protected protected as the city grows. I feel like we should be protected by this commission with regards to this zoning change. And then defined in that zoning as defined in the plan must be for the protection of health, safety, and general welfare of the public. I think all of these three principles are at risk for everybody that lives on Woodrow Road from slide to 179 because of this. I hope there is some thoughtful consideration regarding this proposal and I appreciate the opportunity to render my objection. [applause] Hi, Amy West, 16201 County Road 1735. I am the northeast house facing Woodro Road in West Woodrow Estates. So, I am um our culde-sac is parallel to the private road that the gentleman just spoke of. Um, I'm writing on behalf of our family and our farming operation and all the other property owners affected by this reszoning request. Um, all affected property owners strongly oppose the granting of the proposed reasoning for a variety of reasons. You know, Woodro Road, the current traffic patterns are a problem. Adding additional strain by bringing in heavy commercial traffic will continue to contribute to the problem of road erosion and dangerous conditions for all traveling on Woodro Road. The road system infrastructure is not keeping up with current needs, much less the problems that added businesses and customers would introduce. The homes along and near Woodrow Road have a very high current value that would significantly de diminish with the addition of commercial property. By the very definition of your heavy commercial outlined in the city of Leach zoning chart, such development should be located away from residential areas. All current homes in Highland Oaks, West Woodrow Estates, Lato Estates, as well as properties along Woodrow Road are residential. It is also my understanding and from listening to previous conversations that there are going to be a thousand beaten bow homes to the north of this property. The 51.3 acres under consideration are and will be surrounded by residential property. There are numerous other properties in Leach County that would not directly impact personal residences in this manner and are better suited for heavy commercial needs. Our properties have already suffered significant inconveniences because of the property in question. I hope that you got a copy of my letter that was included in your packet um that included the 5-ft walls of tumble weeds that we all experienced all along Woodrow Road from the nurseries to personal properties. And those don't just go away. They don't just blow away. You have to take them up, you have to burn them, you have to do something with them, and then they just return. So, it is a definite disregard and an inconvenience for our personal property. Trash, weeds, debris have been a nuisance during windy days for quite some time. The traffic, waste, noise, dirt, and weeds that commercial property would generate would be even more problematic. In my original letter, I failed to mention my disappointment to learn that only 26 residents bordering Woodro Road received a notice from the city of Leach about these zoning changes. Homeowners and friends in our culde-sac of West Woodrow Estates would not have been denied the opportunity to make their voices heard if we had not shared the information. It is disturbing to think that the city completely disregarded the impact these zoning changes would have on entire neighborhoods, traffic patterns, road conditions, and nearby property owners. They informed only the parties they were required by law to alert. Decisions made concerning those proposed changes will affect many lives, future choices, and property values. Anyone within a 3 or four mile radius of these 51.3 acres deserve to know the intentions and propo proposed changes that could affect them directly. Please consider our urgent plea to not reszone this property for heavy commercial use. We value our homes, our quiet neighborhoods, and the sunsets that have already been mentioned that are easily viewed without the obstruction of commercial development. Thank you for your time. [applause] Hello, Chance at 1602 Dover County Road 1830. Um, y'all know all the issues that have been addressed. I mean, first of all, that looks like crud, but more importantly, boats. I don't I'm like him. Most of the most of this stuff's already been concerned, but as a resident of Highland Oaks, I want to say that people lie, numbers don't. You see the people in here, they spend a lot of money on their houses. You know, [snorts] I think Robert's got the right idea coming in with the size of houses that he's coming in with. And I want to applaud him for that. You know, we were told that Beatenbo wasn't going to go in. Uh well, we weren't ever told that. We were told that higherend houses were going to go in and suddenly there's going to be a million homes over there and the infrastructure is not made for that right now. Leaving in the mornings for school, we take Frankfurt and there's not a traffic light there. So you can imagine there's 100 so cars just backed up. Woodro school lets out. It's a race. It It's a disaster. I don't know how they passed a bond, built the school, but couldn't build a road before it. But that's that's neither here nor there either. [snorts] But in the near future, this is something that, you know, I respect my neighbors and and uh I think it's important that that the money they put in their houses, the time, the effort, what they've done to build what they've built, somebody just not come in there because they couldn't make the money on something else. So, they're going to commercialize it and you know, I believe what the what the gentleman said too about the park. You know, you can do good things and uh better things happen because of it, but just strongly we're we're all in here for the most part. I feel opposed to what's going on and and how it's going to affect us. We live in a great neighborhood and [snorts] we're fighting traffic problems out there as it is. So, there's my two cents. Thank y'all for your time. [applause] It's going to fall down anyway, so I'm going to put it up here just not embarrass everybody. >> [clears throat] >> I'm Ronald RB Brownart, Colonel, United States Air Force retired. Um, I'm speaking to you as a homeowner in Highland Oaks, 16004 count, not County Road, Albany Avenue. Sorry. [clears throat] I'm against the proposed resoning sort of. I'm very, very torn by this, conflicted. Um, I have some comments and some realities, or at least there are obvious realities to me. I appreciate the concept if I buy land, it's my land. I will do what I want to with it within reason and try to make compromises where I can to try to solve problems or issues, but it's my land. I also as a uh officer and fighter pod in the United States Air Force moved 14 times in 30 years by buying new houses every time. Only lost money once. [clears throat] But um I appreciate the entrepreneur who is truly the backbone of this nation's economy, not government. And it sure as heck isn't uh big business. bad a lot but it's the entrepreneur. I met and talked at length with Mr. uh Payne. He was extremely helpful and provided uh proved to be an encyclopedia of knowledge about the state and the county and city rules and procedures and all things pertaining to land while I was in the in the still am part of the Highland Oaks what we call the water committee trying to look at the options to bring water to our neighborhood. That's all it was purely. He was our uh highly experienced professional um consultant, not paid. We just asked questions and he always a answered them for us. He was informative. He was honest. He talked directly to me, looked me in the eye when he talked to me and put me on the right track and all all in the effort to try to help not make water happen for Highland Oaks. We did that by hard study. But he certainly was uh informative and important to us for that purpose. What he's what he is asking for me personally is kind of scary. Not the kind of scary by being repeatedly shot at like I was when I was in Sieo or having both of my jet engines quit. It's called a flame out at 1,000 ft above the ground. That gets your attention. But it's still a threat because it involves our home. And that I think that's probably true for most of Hila Oak's homeowners. It's our home. It's most people a home is the most important thing, the biggest financial transaction they ever do in their lifetime. It's a home where we made for our family [snorts] and where our kids grew up. It's real personal. Okay? And I understand and I know he does. We've had this conversation. I've had those exact words with him and he understands that. [clears throat] For most of the Highland Oak neighbors, this is one thing I haven't heard mentioned, so bear with me please. We're coming to grips with having to pay an estimated right now $33,000 to bring water, the infrastructure for that water to Highland Oaks. You're going to either pay over 20 years or going to pay it up front, but you're going to pay it. We'd hope to recoup some or all of that money by the increase in the value of our homes [clears throat] once they once they sold. But now we're faced with a spectre, real or imagined, I have to say that of declining home prices from a heavy commercial zoning decision. I empathize with those folks on Woodrow. I love those homes. I look at them all the time. Some are not all on some. They are beautiful and uh really nice to look at. I got it. I understand why they're nervous too for the same reason I'm nervous. There's also the risk of entry in increased traffic and congestion and lots of new houses and we've all talked about that. I'll skip over and lots of young drivers on a pretty dag on dangerous road. By the way, I'm a DPS certified motorcycle instructor. Used to be a rider, can't anymore, but we talk at infinitum about being safe on a motorcycle. Some don't listen. Mr. Payne is petitioning for the least restrictive zoning category, heavy commercial, and he promises to control his properties through the use of de deed restrictions of which he is a sole arbiter of any changes and requests. In my dealings with Mr. pain. I have never ever had any doubt of his word. That's just my opinion and that's my opinion having dealt with him before. If I have no choice, then I'm going to have to cross my fingers, trust Mr. Payne's better angels to make his commercial enterprise a model for this city. And I encourage that. a commercial center that sets a high bar for the way the signage, the lighting, the landscaping add infant item. I'd also ask the planning and zoning to push as much as you can do uh to fix the roads when beaten comes in with a thousand. I know it will take time, but Frankfurt is already a subm marginal roadway at best and Woodro still needs a lot of help, too. I'm going to bring one additional uh issue if I could to that has not come up only very slightly perhaps [clears throat] that is the notification of the requested zoning changes. I don't know what happened. I'm not implying some some deep dark conspiracy at all. But I I think maybe whatever the legal guidance is to determine who gets notified, I'd argue that guidance is the absolute minimum. When I look [clears throat] at the map up here and I see that the the proposed zoning area changes touches the edge of the very corner of the western part of high do. I think that qualifies that maybe we should be notified. Okay. We got a letter Thursday late afternoon. I took it down to the property management company Friday, opened it and off we go. I think you can see that Piland Oaks is a pretty motivated group of people. We can turn out stuff pretty fast. we can get the word out to our neighbors and we would be terribly remiss if we had not done that [clears throat] and uh and bring bring a lot of information to bear and voters to bear. Okay. I think the city should amend or I ask you to consider amending whatever the guidance is to include any nearby neighborhoods especially when it touches even at the slightest moment. And again, this isn't a pot shot at anybody. I probably the rule just says that and that's where we went. But I I would ask you to reconsider that to to make sure that you at least reach out to the big neighborhoods that are going to be affected by that. Also big not only in numbers but in cost of the homes and voting blocks and all the other things that may or may not be important in life. [clears throat] Um and if I'm talking to the wrong group, please tell me, okay? I will go down and uh try to meet with city council woman uh Dr. Wilson and see if there's anything I can do to convince her also that same thing. Thank you for your time. Appreciate the hard work you do. Thank you. Hello, my name's Thomas Larson. I live at 176 16203 County Road 1735. Uh Amy West is my neighbor. She lives right on the corner. She got a notification. We did not. We're one house from Woodro Road. Not to beat the same dead horse, but slide road state road funded by the state. So all the construction there, it's going to get funded. It's going to get widened in time. No problem. As Mr. Payne said, Frankfurt beaten developing there. Beatatbow will take on improving Frankfurt. Woodrow Road. We don't have a representative from the county here. The city 85 ft from Woodrow Road. The city's not going to touch Woodrow Road. It's too much money. But yet, we want to put commercial property right up against that and yet have no responsibility for it. So, that that's my biggest thing right there. Uh we adopted the UDC for a reason and the UDC doesn't want or is against having heavy commercial against residential property. Uh, so I think we ought to stick with that. We talk about lighting and stuff and as Mr. Payne said, the UDC addresses what the lighting can be like, but if we disregard the UDC's putting uh heavy commercial against residential, what makes us think the UDC is going to protect us with lighting concerns? Also, uh, right now, Woodrow Road's a very dangerous road. the city's going to come right up to it or you're 85 ft from it, I guess, but it's not going to make it any safer out there and it's actually going to make it a lot worse for us. So, I appreciate your time and thank you FOR [applause] [clears throat] good evening. My name is William Franklin. and I live at 6620 Woodrow Road, uh, right to the west of this development. Thank you for your time. I'll be brief. One of my major concerns with this is you can't unring a bell. So, if you all and the city vote to approve this zoning change, it's set in stone. And one of my major concerns is not what Mr. campaign said he was going to do with the property, but if he sells it, what somebody else may do with the property. >> And I strongly disagree respectfully with Mr. Payne's statement that says I can't do anything until such time as the zoning is approved. I disagree with it because he can put those restrictions that he's talking about in place now. we don't have to wait until zoning to put those restrictions in place and then we would know for sure what's going to happen. I also strongly disagree with his position, as much of a property rights person as I am, that my boundaries stop where his [snorts] begins. If that was true, we wouldn't be here today, would we? We're here today because Mr. Payne asked the city to annex the property. He got the benefits of the annexation. So therefore, he has to comply with the requirements of the annexation. You can't, as my mom said, have your cake and eat it too. Finally, I would leave you with this. If you decide to approve this, I would implore you to remember it when someone else comes before you and asked to put heavy commercial zoning on what's going to someday be or already is a major thorough affair. I oppose it. I appreciate your time and I hope that you will side with the majority here today and deny the request. Thank you. >> Can I ask a question? >> You can come up to the podium. The public hearing still open. >> I just It's a simple question and I meant to ask this earlier. Chance Britt. How do you deanex? like he chose to be here. So if he doesn't get his way and he wants to go another way, that's a concern. Like >> beyond the purview of us. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> I just didn't a lot of what y'all talked about is beyond the purview of us. Traffic, all that other stuff is not >> wanted to clarify. >> Is there anyone else wishing to speak in opposition at this time? Okay. Is there anyone wishing to speak in favor? >> Mr. Holman, >> thank you. I really wanted to I've made my statements. I think uh there's no need for me to necessarily add to that, but some things were said very early on that I just [clears throat] couldn't sit back and not comment on. Um Mr. Chambers alluded to we had somehow broken some law that we had subdivided the property and uh there we hadn't had a plat and all those types of things. Um it was clear to me u he he doesn't understand that aspect of the local government code and it's clear to me that he doesn't understand how development works. None of this property has been subdivided other than the 200 acres that has been sold to the beaten bows and they are platting. They're going through all the normal processes. Chapter 212 local government code says subdividing is uh just that the act of subdividing for purposes of sale for conveyance. Okay, this boundary is not anything that has been sold or conveyed. And I want to clear up a really terrible misrepresentation that we're up here trying to violate a bunch of statutes regarding subdividing. This is the very first step in all development. You folks know that. But I'm telling that to the audience at this point that this is we are doing everything in the exact proper sequence that it is intended to go. Um I just wanted to kind of clarify that. Furthermore, he also said that um we should have annexed or the city should have annexed all of the county road because we abutdded the county road. The city specifically required us to to stop short of the the existing rideway for the purpose of not having to annex the road. There was a time when the city uh required us to work that way. We're not doing that now. So we as as consultants and as a developer um I can promise you we are exactly following statute and we are doing proceeding in a manner exactly as we are required to and exactly as we need to. So I just wanted to kind of clarify that uh for you all that um there's we're doing things the proper way here. Thank you. >> Thank you Mr. Alman. Is there anyone else wishing to speak in favor? >> [clears throat] >> Thomas Payne again. I'll be very brief this time. I promise. Um, first I want to say this. None of this is personal for me anyway. Uh, I've never heard of such a thing as reading someone's publicly posted statements as being some sort of personal attack. My point was there were comments that had to be responded to in this setting. It had nothing to do with any personal attack and I that's not what I do. I do want to strongly reiterate what Mr. Hullman said about the annexation of this tract and where the city limit lines are. That was not influenced by me to be that way. As a matter of fact, it was contrary to my almost begging pleading advice to the city to not do it that way. But uh the current again current uh legal staff at the time insisted that that's how it had to be done. So that was in no way influenced by me in that direction nor did I want it to go that direction. I didn't have any choice if I wanted to annex the land. And I just wanted to be really really clear about that. And I'll once again be happy happy to answer any questions y'all have. I have no questions. Anybody have questions? >> Thank you all for your time. >> Is there anyone else wishing to speak in favor? >> Okay, seeing none, we will close the public hearing for matter of discussions. Do we have a motion? >> I move. >> Have a motion and a second. >> Okay, discussion. >> Can I say something? >> You certainly can. We're in discussions. Based on all the conversations that we've heard tonight, I've really really had a lot of things to think about. And some of the things I want us to consider is I want us to think about the zoning that is going from minimal to the highest zoning. And one of the things that we did at our last meeting was we took a case and we actually they asked for a zoning and we kind of amended that zoning. Did we not? >> You mean downgraded the zoning? >> Yes, we downgraded that zoning that would accommodate in the best interest of others. Right. Did we not do that? >> We did. >> Um, taking into consideration everything that's being said tonight, is that something that we can possibly consider? because I understand, yes, we want, you know, things to be done with this land because there's probably limited things that can be done with it, but just like we did last meeting, can we consider something a little bit less? >> That would only be if the parties agreed to it. >> If Can we amend? You can always uh downzone to a more more restrictive zoning. That is an option. So you you can always make that. >> So you can propose the zone and >> I [clears throat] would I would caution though that because one of the things that this whole process, one of the things that's been brought up numerous times is notice to people about what the zoning is going to be, right? And so the discussion while that has happened at times, usually it's within a similar type of zoning, right? So it goes from a a instead of multifamily to single family, but it's still the same type of of use of the property, very similar type of use of the property. >> Okay? >> And there really hasn't been that discussion. We have an application before us. um the the property owner can always come back for a different type of zoning at a future date if they want to do a different type of zoning should this um commission and the city council deny the current application. So while I think you can do that, it is something that I would use um rarely um and really in unique circumstances. >> Just something I wanted to ask. Thank you. >> I just want to bring up part of the stuff too and I know people were talking about the notification zones and all the other stuff and basically state law requires that anybody within 200 ft be notified. One of the things we did do on the UDC the last time is we increased that to 400. So I know that y'all had concerns, but we've actually doubled what the state law said on that. So basically doubled the the length on it too. [clears throat] A lot of the stuff as Mr. Noble pointed up to a lot of it is out of our purview about some of the stuff about the zonings about the roads the traffics. Basically our our call is to look at does this zoning fit within [snorts] the regulations and with the property that we're going to. So, while we listen to everything, we've also got to narrow our focus to it and try to look at what it's at in simple parts. Mr. Wade, it might be good for everybody's um benefit tonight if you could expand or explain why deed restrictions cannot come or you know why we cannot put deed restrictions in place prior to zoning within the city limits. >> Well, okay. So, a couple of things I'd say. Um, first, if I'm going to give any type of legal advice, it has to be only to you as my client. We probably would need to do that in executive session. As as far as when and the the proper the city doesn't put in deed restrictions. City doesn't enforce deed restrictions. That is a purely private property owners um right to do if they want to do that. They can put it in when they convey the property. they can put it in on their own property with the idea of future um uh you know future use of the property. So, you know, we don't enforce them. We don't um put them in on property. Um and I do believe that the comments regarding that the deed restrictions can't be less restrictive than um the city's zoning um they certainly can anybody can place their own more restrictive restrictions on their on their property. I'm not sure if that answers your question. Um, and as far as what process, as far as when you actually do that and how you do that, um, I think there might be some business reasons as to why the order in which you would do it, but I think legally you can probably do it at any point in time on your own property. >> Thank you. >> Questions, more discussion. Uh so this is my last meeting on the PNZ of six years [laughter] and so I have heard I've heard many many cases and um it is actually pretty common. I don't know if it's pretty common. It's we see a lot of cases where it's going from single family to high commercial and as was mentioned that's because of um when when when land is annexed usually that's because when land is annexed it's annexed as single family and so um so I just want to point that out and then secondly I want to say that um there was a lot of talk about putting commercial zoning not next to residential and that's going to lower our property values and all of those things and we hear that all the time and there is some validity in circumstances to those arguments. However, if you think about the city of Lev, there is commercial next to residential everywhere you look and like you take the orchard park case, you know, they put a Walmart across the street from Orchard Park and I don't think their values were impacted by that. Having said that, um, in this particular case, my issue is the length of that commercial. Um, I think, you know, [snorts] from my understanding of the spirit of the future land use map and the the comp plan, it's to have these commercial nodes at major intersections. And to have it running across the whole mile, um, to me seems excessive. And um that's that's the part I'm struggling with the most. So that's that's my thoughts. >> Oh, I just have it on. >> Yeah, I I would agree with that. uh you know if this was at just Frankfurt and Wood Row um you know 10 to 20 30 acres or something of that nature right there on the corner might make more sense but coming all the way down um doesn't seem like the best fit uh for that frontage at this time. Uh but I think um at the same time it's kind of wishful thinking long long term that this is going to remain super low density uh single family over the long long run. Um, but today I don't see where heavy commercial fits on a mile long frontage. >> Yeah, I'll have to join in on that. I I I think HC fits on the corner and uh I know there's a restriction on the gas line on some of that, but I think it could be AC or NC neighborhood commercial because I do think it it will be commercial at some point. It's on Woodrow Road and you can't go deep enough to build what you live in, you know, back far enough to get off the road. It's going to be on the road and there's not a lot you can do about it. People don't, just like you were talking about the raceway going down Woodrow Road, you want to be way closer to it because that's where the gas line is. So, to Drew's [clears throat] point, it's not going to be back. It's going to be on the road. And so, that's going to be commercial at some point. Now, whether it gets there this way or another way, that's what it's going to be. I did I was interested in in your comments about you could deed restrict it now because you because Mr. Payne owns it and that might be something that could be worked on. But I also think it's interesting that they can't be enforced even if you during permit process >> not not by the city of Lok. The government doesn't enforce the city doesn't enforce deed restrictions. >> Could be forced courtwise. It would it would be if whoever is subject to those deed restrictions. >> That's my two cents. >> Okay. [snorts] >> Any other discussions? >> Okay, we have a motion. We have a second. We'll go ahead and take the vote. All in favor say I. I. All oppose say nay. >> [applause] >> The motion fails uh one to five. It will go to the city council for reading on December 2nd. That's the close of our regular business. We do have some extra business we'd like to do and turn it over to Craig. >> All right. Well, first we want to thank Tanner uh for six years on the planning and zoning commission. Uh we thank you for that. [applause] We have a certificate here that we'd like to give you. Tanner, I appreciate I'd like to say that I've been with you the whole six years and it's been a pleasure to work with you and appreciated your insight and we're going to miss you. >> Thank you. >> Thanks for saying that on the record. >> Yeah. Well, it's true. It's true. That is the end of our meeting. We are adjourned at 9:04.