I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible thank you council member Cole here council member schweer here council member Wong here council member nordby your mayor Maggie here motion to attack agenda please so moved your honor second hi [Music] thank you mayor um the consent agenda tonight uh item a June 20th 2023 Workshop minutes Item B June 20th 2023 regular meeting minutes item C General claims 4 million 210 000 70.71 cents item D HRA claims of 22 125.73 item e special event permit for St Peter's fall festival September 24th 2023 itemf application for a temporary on sale license and an application for a charitable gambling for exempt permit for the church of Saint Peter North St Paul September 23rd 24th of 2023. item G cigarette and tobacco license renewal item h building permit report for June of 2023 itemize resolution accepting donations for June of 2023 and item J is Tyler Technologies agreement for credit card processing services thank you very much anybody looking to pull anything out of if not promotion some of your honor move council member Wong second second council member Norby all those in favor say aye aye aye thank you very much all right next is open to the public we have three minutes if we can well yeah is it Lee Leanne I'm sorry I can see the right how are you hi there I'm sorry is the clock ticking yes okay so as mentioned my name is Leanne weiner this is my Father Mark weiner um I live at two four seven five Second Avenue East North Saint Paul Minnesota um I'm just coming to cashier some concerns that have um that I've been kind of worried about recently since the since I've moved to my residence and I have been living at this residence since October sorry August of 2020. um so I have wrote water encroaching on my property um on July 4th we had a short duration of a storm um and there was a lot of sewer backup into my yard I have a couple of pictures here that you can reference um thank you and just My overall concern is the damage to my property me and my neighbor's property and um basement flooding um it probably rained for like 60 minutes 45 minutes and I just get worried as to what like a longer term storm three hours four hours could do in that time um last year we had a couple of storms that caused the same issue and it's just a little scary so good did you get water in your house during the storm I didn't as you can see in the pictures it didn't get to that um level yet but it was only raining for 60 minutes so if it would have rained for longer there is no doubt that I could have had an issue would you be willing to send those digitally to Brian as well as take a picture of when it's dry and send it to Brian absolutely definitely you know she we just did a basic measurement from the curb storm sewer to the to the hydrant just for your reference is about nine feet so it's well beyond that so I've lived in a home for years I've been in many communities it's it's a relative concern that we have just because the encroachment of water with a short duration storm if it was winter time and we we did check to see if the the drain had egress and it did just doesn't seem like it's capable of handling the water maybe from the slope of the whole entire Street yeah it does there's a low area our subsequent neighbor will talk a little bit about that but uh you know we don't we're not suggesting any remedies we're just trying to make you aware of it and it's it's a valid concern because if it does creep up into the property it could cause significant damage in the lower level and decrease our property value okay thank you thank you thank you Sean might as well keep it in a roll here uh uh Sean rivet 24 83 2nd Avenue East congratulations to the new council members I haven't had to show up since the new people took over so there's a lot of new faces congratulations mayor um a little background history on me um 12 years ago almost to this day it was actually like a week ago I had over six feet of water in my basement so I did have water and I live right next door to Leanne at that point in time the lady had about three feet of water in her basement but she never showed up because she couldn't get out of her house so she never came to the city council meeting she never did nothing about it I helped her get rid of it cleaned up her place we moved on well then about a year later I had three feet of water in my basement after I had my furnace replaced so now I'm on my second furnace luckily the guy was able to just replace the motherboard expensive but whatever so now and also water heaters but whatever so that was in the last whatever how many years last year I was in the same Chambers and the DNR had offered to help purchase my house and then put in a pond or some sort of something in there to help the street get to collect the water two of the council members said yes to the council member said no and the mayor said no didn't find it to be a problem now I sent you guys a video I hope you were all able to watch it so now if you guys can tell me that honestly that that's not a problem I'll turn around and leave this place and I won't come back here ever again I swore last year I'd never step foot in this place again but I'm not dealing with this man I had to buy cameras so I can watch my house when it rains when I'm at work because I can't afford to leave work and stuff and I mean you can only imagine what I go through and this doesn't this is winner and summer winter time it gets knee default in front of my house they've had to come the cities had to come and plow the water to the drain to get it to drain because the old council member showed up at my house he's like it's super easy just unclog your drain and there's no drain in front of my house or it's down there so the water doesn't drain we have bad issues and I still do not see why my house was not purchased last year to help our neighborhood so I am looking for a remedy I've been dealing with this for 12 years every year there's not one year you can't not find my face standing in front of this Podium asking for help asking for the street to be fixed asking for something to be done and it got to the point where maybe we can purchase your house maybe we can help alleviate that they're supposed to purchase the property behind my house at one point in time but no they let the whatever reflex medical building purchased the property and put two more houses back there which doesn't help the water issue now the water doesn't have anywhere to go they built them a fancy Little Pond the last mayor said he did not want to set precedent by buying houses they bought the one on the corner to build their Precious Little Pond in the corner that's precedence building purchased a house to help the other people out because it was reflex medical okay so Alex only there's a lot of history we'll get together with the manager city manager Brian and we'll discuss it okay all right thank you somebody gonna get back to me how long do I have to wait until I hear from somebody before I don't I don't know before I cannot be stressed out anymore you know no guarantee to take your stress away but I'll get back to you by the end of this week well at least thank you Brian I appreciate it thank you council members congratulations again thank you appreciate it did you go to White Bear okay yeah John small how are you time of meetings a friend he's got a friend for the first time first time John Schmall 2750 Chisholm Avenue North St Paul this is getting to be too much anyway uh three items uh first one it's a round of applause whoops to someone who now uh thought that it was a good idea to put the time of the meeting on the first sheet that announces the meeting this is two months it took of uh saying put the time of the meeting because we had a meeting just now before this that didn't meet the requirements of five uh 5 30 for the workshop and there was nothing on there that said it was a special meeting the move it to five instead of like it used to be you know you just love confusion that's all I can figure out you love confusion uh second item July 4th I spoke to council member Wong about July 4th and if you don't know what I'm bringing up uh then you haven't got a clue what goes on at Casey Lake Park on July 4th this was I can't say it was the worst time I've lived there for 48 years 48 years and nothing has changed it's fireworks and this time I'd say it was the second worst it was the second worst because it wouldn't stop it went on and on and on until 10 30. the last go-around for a report on the crime when there's Cosmos coming in was it 11 30. about fireworks 11 30. cool huh to be subjected to that at least the City of Minneapolis has brains enough to shut down the Stone Arch Bridge because they had problems before and they just said we're not allowing there it should be the same thing for Casey Park eight o'clock on July 4th everybody out it's over no police no police whatsoever no presence of our Police Department and that's what we have to put up with the third item that I have is that there was a meeting on the East Metro groundwater no one that I saw that was there at this meeting put on by the DNR very interesting very interesting brought up about it isn't someone's water other than if you can steal from the groundwater you know you don't have a fence around and say this is our water you know I got a well but there's a fence around it this is with Blaine where they put in three new wells and they said well we had a fourth well that we asked for permission to start and we thought the other three Wells were covered by that cool they weren't and they had like 27 Wells that went dry from individuals it's just you know you got to be concerned about groundwater well yeah no we don't we got ten thousand lakes but ground wire water is finite thank you thanks Sean all righty all right thanks everyone appreciate it thank you mayor thank you next up is the city business action items and recommendations um Brandon would turn that over to you or are you going to have Jim discuss that no I can go through them um there's the next four count or Council items a b c and d are all related to The Lily project development the first is related to the Tiba Grant agreement if you'll recall back in October of last year um the city council approved a resolution authorizing the city to apply for funding on the developer's behalf that is the tax base revitalization account to assist with cyclinic activities related to the to the Lily Redevelopment tibra is available by the livable cities act and it's administered by the Met Council the city has been provided with the grant agreement from the Met Council our attorneys have reviewed it and they have prepared a subgrant agreement as well as the developers the intended recipient and will carry out the clean cleanup activities um so the center the city will enter into the subgrant agreement with the developer and then we would transfer the grant amount to the developer to ensure that the city's obligations are fulfilled so the the subgrant agreement protects the city um again the City attorney reviewed the draft Grant agreement and prepared the sub-grant agreement between the city and the developer so at this point we're asking for authorization from Council to um execute both of those agreements any questions about those any questions anyone I guess that was items a and I'll let you go ahead and do your your business then I'll continue on items a that was a and b if there's Mr Mayor if there's a agreement to adopt these I do believe that you can with a single motion adopt both the grant agreement and the sub-grant agreement okay do we have a motion those two so move your honor so I'll move council member Square second second Renewables in favor say aye aye thank you third item is a security agreement for the Lilly Redevelopment and I would ask that Michaela present if you have the welcome good evening Mr Mayor members of the council the action item before you tonight again as related to the the Lily building Redevelopment is a security agreement that was requested by the developer in conjunction with the tax increment assistance that was already approved by the city council pursuant to the terms of the Tif assistance agreement the developers lender Sunrise banks is requesting the security agreement and essentially what it is is it's pledging the the the tax increment from the city to directly to Sunrise to repay the obligation um that that the the lender or excuse me that the developer needs for financing so as a contingent or as as a requirement of Sunrise they've requested that the city consider the security agreement which again the conditions of it are that the developers rights would be assigned under this the Tiff assistance agreement that was already approved to the bank as a collateral for the for the loan this can be pretty consistent practice regarding the developer obtaining the financing and essentially pledging the increment that will be pledged from the city to the bank to repay the obligation we have reviewed the security agreement and we recommend we being me from Baker Tilly as well as the city's Tiff attorney from Taft Law Firm that you consider that you that you could consider proving the the security agreement contingent on the developer providing evidence that the assignment within the security agreement there's a difference in the entity of who would be signing the security agreement with the Tiff agreement so we would recommend that should you consider approval of the security agreement that there's additional that would be contingent on receiving information satisfactory to the city council the city manager um and the the finance director that the um they're providing evidence that the signatory is authorized to sign on behalf of the the debtor so essentially it's making sure the um secured agreements between two five one five Seventh Avenue LLC the Tiff assistance agreements between two two one five NSP LLC so essentially understanding that the Tiff assistance has pledged to the developer the development entity and the Tiff assistance agreement is the same as the The Entity sign in the Tiff or the security agreement if that makes sense so it's more of a it's a lot of legalese language that essentially the developer needs this to be able to obtain the financing and its Sunrise Bank requesting that essentially the the um that the Tiff note is collateral to obtain the financing that they need for the project and you mentioned that's pretty standard practice yep it's it's fairly standard this is I would say this one along and maybe if if Jim wants to speak to the complexity of obtaining financing for this project I know there's been we've been before you a couple of times with different requirements of Sunrise Bank I think given the the complexity with obtaining the financing and the interest rate environment and so on but this is a fairly standard practice of of collateralizing the Tiff note to be able to obtain the financing thank you so best practice type of thing it's it's it's it's it's somewhat common on a case-by-case basis of what the lender requires so it's really comes down to what Sunrise Bank is requiring of the developer and in this case this is what they are requiring and requesting from the developer obtained from the city in order to be able to secure the Tiff note and pledge that is collateral to the financing okay any other questions we vote on this one too right individually I might guess my go ahead I'm just gonna say it does take a motion so anybody want to bring a motion I moved so move council member Cole second second council member Wong all those in favor say aye aye thank you thank you sure come on up Jim wouldn't be a council meeting without you Jim um I really just I can't say enough kind words about all of you and your staff and this deal would not be happening if it wasn't for what you folks have helped us with and we're really excited um we're we're scheduled to close either Tuesday Wednesday next week and then we get the guys with the big fun demo trucks and everything coming in the following so hopefully it all falls in place oh good and then we'll get some things in on the books to uh do a ribbon probably uh second or third week of August we'll check with them and we'll do something fun too great okay look forward to it thank you thanks so much appreciate it Jim all righty okay the the next item is item D also related to The Lily building uh Redevelopment project the the Tiba Grant requires that the city have adopted a fair housing policy and I've scoured our books and I wasn't able to find that we have ever done that the Civil Rights Act of 1968 with the fair housing Amendments of 1988 um is intended to assure Equal Housing opportunities for all persons and the Metropolitan Council requires that Grant recipients that have adopted a fair they require that housing projects with a housing component have a fair housing policy so I've asked our City attorney to prepare to prepare a policy that would be in alignment with the with the fair housing act and that is what is in your in your packet and I I guess I would defer any questions to the City attorney on that I don't have any update on it unless there are questions it is uh the two Grant agreements that have been approved this is a part of administering that so it's I don't know about a formality but it is something that's required correct then please so moved so move council member one second council member Norby all those in favor say aye aye thank you thank you next up is also the parking lot paving at 2579 7th Avenue East and I'll turn that over to Randy Howard Community Development director this is an item that has been considered by the Eda I think since probably spring of 2022 at that point in time it was determined that the piece of property at 2579 7th Avenue is in a condition that is not conducive to um attracting new development downtown um and so there's a lack of green space as well that's been a concern of the of the Eda and the parks and rec commission and so at the point um in time last spring they engaged with the city engineer to prepare some concept plans that would green up the space in addition to ads and parking and so we had the concepts drawn up the Eda reviewed those and they selected one and we then went forward and obtained some bids for that then subsequent discussions with the Eda resulted in requesting what would it cost to just pave the entire lot and at the last Eda meeting here in July the direction was given to seek funding from the city council wherein the Eda would fund 50 of the cost to pay for the entire lot for parking and they would throw in an additional 500 or sorry five thousand dollars for uh pavers and other Street amenities such as benches or possibly picnic tables the project cost came in about fifty two thousand dollars and so the city or the Eda is requesting a contribution from city council from the 2023 budget in in the amount of sorry I don't have that pulled up in front of me here of the city's contribution would be 26 272.50 for the overall project so at this point staff is seeking um a budget amendment to allow that project to go forward one additional note on that is that was a one abstained on that boat otherwise you should unanimous for the full parking lot of that of that lot sorry one more time it wasn't unanimous because I voted against it oh you're abstained yeah I didn't Shifty did because he had a bid oh I'm sorry yeah you didn't weren't at the last meeting but so tell me that again you [Music] or whatever um due to conflict and I voted I was opposed to uh well excuse me project of a parking lot of something else [Music] so with that I'll open it up for discussion yes um Brandy's right this has gone on for at least 18 months um the spaces that exists today I don't even think is in a line with our own personal ordinances um so we're kind of a bad tenant of some of some space downtown uh when we first started looking at this the costs were a lot lower than what they came in with um then kovid came around drove a lot of the pricing up and now we've seen a lot of favorable price income back in our way I believe some of the original quotes that we got back were in the 150 000 range um I was opposed to it at the Eda meeting for a couple of different for a couple different reasons one the city has really truly has a lack of soft space and so to take a take a lot and pave it over completely for blacktop doesn't mean in my opinion what the city can use we had soft space where the little city hall and Max the old Max Diner used to sit uh that was very well utilized um park and rec utilized it for movie on Main we had vendors that would park out there during car be out there during car show um there were a lot of different uses for it um and so for that reason uh the way that the way that it's written I will vote against it again tonight anybody else what was the price went for the whole when we were talking about I think was 79 but that we still don't have the answer to where we can get water to mean to try to do this did you get the answer was this it was the water the 79 was all blacktops and then it would have been a 50 50 split was minder standing God I haven't had that right Utah Green Space plus the half parking lot was 70 79. okay the big big expenses were to catch the water from and somebody mentioned maybe trying to grab it from the neighbor we didn't know if that was something because they had to go to the main and there was a lot of construction that would have done that I don't know it found anything so where the clinic stood there is not a uh a standpipe for the water there so they don't know where that's at so if they had to go find the main dig to it that would be a considerable expense one idea that was brought up was to contact either business on either side to see if they would allow a hose for summertime watering and then maybe work out work out some kind of deal with them clearly on their water bill in the 52 000 if I remember right that heads they're gonna maybe some some benches and some pots or something to bring some kind of Green Space it was there was no green space they talked about forklifting and a couple of yeah or some green Greenery I should say sorry Greenery correct that would be looked into if we did went that route I don't know if everybody had the opportunity to view the the two sketches that were in WSB did the first one I don't know who did the all-paved parking lot but um I hope if everybody didn't see him in the packet I asked if they put up for consideration if everybody's seen it then that's fine anybody like to see it again I'd like to see it again I think Dan might be telling you later this evening but this project is included in the um in the current uh 2024 CIP plan so if you vote Yes tonight this will be removed from next year's budget proposal but here's the preferred design for that space what money did he have in it for last year or for next year excuse me uh I used the money that was based on on the bids yeah I guess like one of my biggest concerns is and this is because we just recently gone through the master Redevelopment plan is there really isn't a whole lot of other space that we have as a city to make green space and that is a huge that's a concern of mine and um yeah there's just not a whole lot of places to sit and enjoy or what have you so I think that could help liven it up if it was dedicated Green Space entirely I agree that that area is a lot of concrete as it is right now asphalt whatever you want to look at it and that green space would bring beautification inside a area that is full of concrete not to mention additional opportunities for events inside the car show space with that and just downtown walking love ice cream is right to the right of that a few spaces down it's nicer to see people if they were inside Sidewinders instead of in front of the building off to the side in that green space um I just think it's going to bring a little if there was Green Space so beautify downtown could I get some clarification just I got confused by some of the numbers that were coming out so going to Green Space with irrigation is the cheapest option right no more expensive but 20 000 25 000 more so what was the 33 753 bid the green space and irrigation would be in addition to the half parking lot bid so the forty five thousand plus the 33 000 um is we're about 78.79 I also see Parks and Rec utilizing that location as well for past events that they had downtown but I also see future opportunities for events as well on a Parks and Rec side also for the arts and culture side too so even though 27 000 seems high there's a lot of opportunity for growth with both commissions and the beautification of the city is that 27 include getting the Bane wherever we're at the the 27 was 50 of the part the full Park I don't know how much it's going to cost to get water to irrigate is what I was asking correct we don't that's an unknown number so that's what we have to put in there is the Eda kind of can considered alternative like grasses or like green space I mean urban Green Space doesn't necessarily always just grass so about their turf or other considerations it hasn't been discussed yet but it's something that could be explored it has it's just something I've seen a lot of yourself and it's easy to clean and manage but yeah just something to consider I would I voted for the for the full parking lot because of I think the expense of some of the other stuff like that but if we could do something where it's not irrigation and putting a lot of effort into getting the water and stuff like that has there been a discussion with public works and Ron yes they've been involved in all these discussions to give it help procure the quotes and um okay they just don't know where they can get the water from yet correct what kind of church do you like a football field Turf is that what you're kind of thinking um councilmember one um whatever Turf people use yeah at the the bars or the the breweries I think it's the same how do you keep it clean if you have animals in that area um yeah you hose it down I mean it's it's worth a discussion I mean it's from the city to do that because we don't have the water over there um can I ask how many parking lots there are parking spots there are and what the difference is between a half and full and how the decision was to do angled versus straight it looks like there's about 17 with this half lot and I think there's 50 approximately 50 in the full lot the angled versus straight I think it was just based on the most efficient use of the space with keeping into the um keeping the dimensions that are required the the angle I believe allowed two additional parking spots from straight in parking and it also then just kind of created a traffic flow in and out off a simple law in one way and out the other correct um does anyone recall how many parking spots we added last year in behind knj no because yeah because I guess you know it's for me it's a balance we have just put in a lot of parking and how do we prioritize Green Space if if parking continues to be the priority and this is one of our few least or the you know one of the only Parcels that we have in this area we do have three City at least three City parking facilities in addition to this lot that are within a block or the one across the street really isn't it has a sign up but it's not just the one right behind it over on Margaret I was talking about straight across from here yep and then right behind Market is the one I was talking about in sepula and there's a Sandberg lot behind there that was just repaved and then the A J lot yeah I will I would I don't know how much it costs but I would you know as far as the space where there's less maintenance and as far as having irrigation and because it's going to be pretty trampled that's the thing too is when you got the you know people hopefully it will be that means people are using it but I mean grass is pretty hard especially when you have a lot of different activities on it it could be other some kind of surface but I don't have a idea how much that runs we can certainly get some quotes together though especially with the unknown I mean how do we find out exact price for to get water and things and other infrastructure one of his ideas sounded pretty expensive they were talking about even picking up where the sprinkler was left off on Margaret and seventh here and then boring down to that site which can be expensive to get the water there if they especially because we did it yeah it wasn't a permanent Park so they didn't think of any water down that far right what's um been thinking pretty hard over there I think I better ask you I think at a minimum weight table this um and I'm not sure if that's the correct word and ask the city to come up with some other options and give us quotes at the next um uh council meeting I don't see this as a pressing item that we need to decide today I see a lot of views um the word expensive keeps getting tossed around and I think that's not a right statement to use if you don't know how much it's going to cost without more information backing it up like grass seed it's expensive well what type of grass are you you laying in planting down how much does it cost Ron to plant that the words expensive are that's an easy word to use unless we have numbers I think part of it is just the Water Source I don't think we're ever going to get an answer to that one well and that's something we need to look at so where are we going to tap in we're going to borrow it from somebody we're just going to make that assumption are we should we ask first because if they're not willing to let us tap from there then that tells us the story right there we're not going to be able to plant green space if we don't have any water that we can tap into and if it's the next door neighbor or wherever they're looking then we need we need to ask at least the answer is no if you don't ask but also do we want to look at some kind of a Turf where we have less maintenance to go across yeah the artificial joy to me that makes more sense than grass just because it is a you know it's not a permanent Park we you know hope someday it may be Soul we don't know but at least have something where it will take some wear and tear because you know there could be quite a bit and then we're also talking you know we don't have any place to put snow in the winter either as far as that the temporary place to put Snow until we get it hauled out because the good news is we're developing a lot the bad news is we don't have many spots to to put Snow we've got to get a money and we have to you know get the downtown cloud and then get it out of there so but I would like to look into the turf and the water that was the question that came up that we uh weren't sure if we could talk to the neighbor on either side and they'd have to separate a meter out wouldn't they have to do that Brian I think what they would do is see how long the sprinkles would run and find out the gallons used and they would figure that out to get the credit to that I also think it would be worth checking into on how often you would have to replace that Turf and what type of turf you use because there's Turf that you can put the it's like pieces of pebble or whatever it is I mean just you're gonna have to keep it fluffed and groomed and how's that going to happen who's going to take care of that yep we'll look into that as well the Conway Center the community center there their soccer fields are all Turf and um they seem the operations um supervisor seem to really like that material because it was also recycled so I don't know how that um plays into an option but um the other thing is when we think about water is what the feasibility is around maybe rain catchment or um you know something along those lines definitely for the parking lot and and maybe even the riffs off the sides of those buildings too right looks like we're looking for more information do we have a list of everything that uh so yes Mr Mayor do you want to make a motion to table it I mean Brian do you think you can have this by the next meeting or is there so if there's a motion to table it to your could I ask for a clarification the the agenda item was to approve a budget amendment so it sounds to me like we won't you're looking at not doing that and you're seeking instead to pursue the green space Sounds like as far as the majority of the council it sounds like green space is for the majority do we need a vote to give direction and maybe this is a Dan question do we do we need to have a vote to give the financial Direction and then Kick the Can back down for I I don't know candidly what what I think is always helpful is if you guys want to take this up at I believe your August 15th meeting if there's a motion to table it and directing staff to do blank so that the direction is clear what it is you want to have come back to you so that you can make a decision so if it's more information on Turf then that could be the direction if it's financial information then that's the direction but I I would be clear in your motion to table it to explain why you're not able to make that motion tonight or decision tonight and explain what additional information you want so it sounds like we have two the artificial something artificial and water source that we can talk to the neighbors because it sounds like the other one is not feasible that far down and the maintenance of the turf as well so may I recommend to table it we look into the pricing of artificial turf and the maintenance of it we look into the water source and who we are borrowing water and what that's going to cost the city if we're going to plant grass I mean it's concrete now or it's asphalt right so you're going to tear that up what what does that look like how much is that going to cost that's all included okay we had to get it down was the and that yeah I mean it's irrigation where are we borrowing the water from and it sounds to me like that 79 bid is close if we can borrow water from the neighbor because the only unknown with the 79 bit is where we're getting the water from so that's the only spot we're missing okay and then the upkeep of that I know you had concerned about the snow removal we just got a portion if we put snow removal there what is it going to look like to upkeep that in the spring once that's been hit I mean that's all salted snow so there's going to be more grassy put down I mean it's just bigger picture items to think about so I asked let me table it and look in those items Finance director thank you if I if I if I may add something from the discussion here um basically I would table it and direct staff to develop three options one is the existing option that is presented in front of you tonight um the second would be for artificial turf and the other one would be for real grass it would be look you would look at it from what is the one-time Capital cost to be able to implement any one of those three and then the ongoing costs and also addition to that is some pros and cons because the mayor has brought up a point and I know our Public Works director Ron has brought it up too as far as plowing and not having that parking space for plowing into the future so there'd be some pros and cons underneath both all three of the options and then part of from Finance perspective we will develop a financing plan just like we did with this last one and have that included in the in the three options now this is just considered temporary so we don't have to worry about any of the things that come with the park right as far as if somebody says any kind of an ADA or anything like that where because it's not really a true Park I know that question's come up quite a bit what what's your concern we're any kind of Eda like you know any kind of you know any kind of yeah I'm sorry no we we no I mean you're always going to have to do things via the Ada but um you're talking about laying down some grass seed or things like that so we're fine on this yeah so if there's basically a motion to adopt Dan's um suggestion on the three recommendations and table it till August 14th or 15th that would be an order at this point okay so I have a motion so move your honor swear second second council member Wong all those in favor say aye aye thank you everyone thank you next up is uh 2024 budget discussion um Danner and Mary Kay are going to be presenting on that foreign members here we are again it's a month later um there's been a lot of work that's been done on the on the budget to date and there's a lot of information in the packet tonight I'm not going to go through all of the information that's here today as far as some of the attachments I'll tell you what they are for your references because some of the next steps that we'll be having will be meeting with the department heads and we'll go through all of that detail at that point in time um but for tonight the purpose is um first kind of wanted to start off just so since we have three new council members on the city councils to talk about what budgets does the city council have to approve um and then from our last Workshop we'll kind of give some the summary of the activities of this some of the brainstorming and some of the ideas that were thrown out in our 2024 Levy Target we'll review the driving factors in our 20204 budget uh we'll look at where we're standing right now after we've met with all of our department heads for the preliminary Levy and then we'll look at some we'll look at the general fund budgets just at a very high level and then we'll review some additional options that are not included in the budget that have come out from our discussions with the department heads and then we'll take a look at the capital of improvement plan and then we'll talk about how we're going to do the next steps again remembering that by September we have to approve the maximum Levy that includes the city budget which includes two components the operation the debt and then we have to approve HRA and Eda levies um those will be the maximum and then they have to be certified by the end of September to Ramsey County and so we'll talk about some of those next steps uh at a very high level the budgets that are approved by city council are the general fund that we just kind of talked talked about the HRA The Economic Development Authority and then there's proprietary funds in the proprietary funds are our Enterprise funds which are utilities and then our internal service funds and those funds are set up like for Technology Insurance um and so forth and then there's some other funds that are set up like community center community event fund Fire Relief and Street Maintenance are underneath the permanent funds and I'm not going to go through all of the the the different components or pieces and definitions of the Enterprise funds you know we we have six of them waterfond Wastewater font electric font surface water fund Solid Waste fun and fiber optic fund internal service funds we have information technology we have the insurance equipment City mechanic and the building maintenance internal service funds so the costs are collected here and the charges are allocated off to the departments in both the Enterprise funds and in the general fund um other budgets like I had mentioned or the community center community event Fire Relief Park and Street Maintenance fund so one of our Workshop items last time we met were to talk about what the city council priorities were and I kind of broke it into four different kind of sections infrastructure Staffing Public Safety and other and you can see the the most responses were given on the infrastructure and I I totally agree with the needs that we have for the infrastructure and that's where I think it's really important what this city has started a few years back is really developing a very comprehensive Capital Improvement plan tonight Mary Kay is going to show you what we've done with our Capital Improvement plan we've picked it up a little bit on on some steroids and we're making it more professional and and to give you more information on the projects that are that are in there a lot of thanks go will go to Mary Kay um for for all of her hard work that she's done on out in actually introducing the software that we're using for that and then all of our department heads they had to do a lot of work in a very short time period to gather some sort of estimates and then putting in some descriptions other is making sure that we have adequate Staffing and that we should probably look at total Compensation Plan for employees they probably want to time that out when Union negotiations are occurring Public Safety making sure that some of the commas were keeping perception of safety app school safety and some of the other items out there was internet keeping costs low not kicking the can down the road limiting liability and business layout um from our brainstorming session we talked about maximizing our resources minimizing the overview the overall impact to the residents of the city we had in there we need to look at the I.T contract and and options Insurance options uh the fire department costs and options Police Department costs and options use of Consultants versus in-house all major contracts grant opportunities a useful life of equipment sales tax cannabis and bidding process there's an asterisk next to a number of items here there is a handout that was attached that will give you further information on those items that we certainly can discuss either tonight or at some other point in time um and then the third item that was asked was you know trying to get council members kind of a sensor feel where uh a levy Target would be uh we had four council members respond the average of those four responses is between 4.5 to 7 percent um is looking at a levy increase if you remember our uh meeting in the household value has increased about nine percent um right now it's a little bit early and finding out what what the majority of cities are are going at um but um fielders out there with about a half a dozen to nine cities is that they're kind of targeting somewhere in the range of about six to seven percent as kind of the majority kind of sense and feel of where where most cities are at of what and again that's a preliminary number so definitely a lot of discussion that you know from their organizations um again the driving factors that were presented you know we have total Personnel costs um you know we have an increase in our debt um Levy we are going to get some additional local government Aid um our information technology costs have increased and then CIP the infrastructure the items that were shown above you know would you know amount to about a 5.6 percent increase after we've met with the department heads in the city city manager put his comments in and made adjustments we have a preliminary budget right now um at 5.5 percent um and um so you can see the city is at 5.5 that's um including the general fund in debt um and uh proposing um that we if you remember last year we eliminated the levy for the HRA I'm suggesting that we start to increase it slightly over time and so putting 11 000 in to that and then the Eda staying where it was in 2023 overall that would give a levy increase from 2023 of 5.5 percent that's where we stand today the budgets there's the what the revenues and the expenditures of the general fund budget are for right now is the preliminary for 2024 as you can see the revenues have gone up so we'll have the expenditures obviously um to to have a balanced budget that means we have to Levy more dollars which is shown in the revenues underneath the ad Valero Valerian taxes that's where that 5.5 percent Levy resides you can see some intergovernmental increase that's the increase in local government Aid and then estimates for permitting and so forth you can see down below our expenditures are shown on this table by category of personnel supplies contractual Services Capital debt and transfers and so you can see the makeup of each ever of each and every one of those categories and then also the next one shows the same revenues but it shows the expenditures broken down by departments and that's kind of where we're at with the general fund in in one of the attachments that you have with this packet are all of the general fund budgets and you have them all the way down to the line item detail and that will be something that will be presented by the department heads and for you to ask questions of the department heads on each and every one of those line items if you so choose to additional options options that came out of our department head meeting after we reviewed we had two separate meetings with all of the department heads one to look at Capital Improvement plan together to make sure everybody was in agreement what with what was being presented we also did the same thing with the budgets and there were some additional items that are not in the budget but are up for consideration and they'll be much more Dialogue on that on on these items when department heads present their budgets to you but the list is um I've I've got the first one of a one percent Levy dedicated to CIP well we will be showing um after we go through our discussions with the department heads is a method in which we can try to generate additional funds through the levy to help pay for our infrastructural needs that the city has and so that'll be coming later the next item is to combine two part-time Code Compliance positions into one full-time position in the fire and Co fire and inspection department and then there's another item there that is requesting an increase on the on-call firefighters of three dollars per hour and then there's another item that's requesting one canine um and the expenses that are associated with with that each one of these will show you the dollar amount and also what the potential increase in the levy would be so if you were to accept all of these you'd move from a 5.5 to a 7.66 percent Levy increase now we come to the very exciting part here and I'm very excited and I know two council members that have been here during my tenure so far that when I started there really was not a comprehensive Capital Improvement plan um and so in two years for the first two years developed something and and headed in an Excel spreadsheet we've kicked it up and so I am going to turn the mic over to Mary Kay because she deserves the credit for all of the hard work and I would like her to kind of walk you through the changes that we've made and hopefully you're as excited as I am the credit all the Departments helped a lot with this as Dan mentioned and Dan obviously helped lead the project too so um so in your attachments you should have got the new CIP book as a PDF and so just to give an overview of How It's organized um there we go there we go okay um so what the new system we're hoping that can provide better reporting so you can have different ways to analyze it but then we also have more detail that helps get better descriptions and justifications and so in the CIP book by the way I have a new computer today having a little bit of difficulties couldn't have waited till Wednesday thank you [Music] foreign okay um so there's a table content so if you're looking for specific departments it'll give you an easier way to find the Departments and as you can see there's also a couple of summary reports at the beginning of the book so if we go to page one to begin with um this just gives a brief overview of some of the information we're collecting on the projects so every project has a project number the first part kind of identifies a category whether it's building equipment park pavement um and then there's a project name a project description a justification for the project the department the department had that request at the project um the each project was assigned a type whether it was maintenance new a planner study or replacement each department had provided useful lives for their projects and then also we asked the department heads to assign a priority with one being critical to being very important three being important for Less unfortunate and by of a future consideration and so if we go to page two this report here is basically just a summary report and this report is organized by the type of project and so you can see the first page has the buildings and the capital technology and then if we scroll to the next page those are all of the parks pavement and then if we scroll down to page seven you will see that there's a total for the capital projects so if we look at the 2024 you can see the total requests are just under 5.3 million and then if you look at the next here you can see it goes up to over 10 million so hopefully this just provides a high level report of the request that will be out there so if we go to the next page these are the exact same projects just a different way to look at it instead of by the type of projects these are by departments and so first page Community Development Electric and if we scroll to the bottom you're going to see the exact same totals as the other report and so then if we scroll down to page 14 here is where we start breaking things down by the department so you can see page 14 is Community Development and if we look at the second line on that page you can see it's the Downtown parking and Green Space Project that was talked about earlier and so you can see currently in the book at 120 000 for next year and if we scroll down just two pages you can see the detail that Brandi had filled out so you can see the description the justification and in the header you can see the department the contact person the useful life um and so that's kind of how the book is set up so hopefully it provides that high level overview but then it also can help provide more detail if you have questions about specific requests thank you so much very much yeah it's very helpful great job thank you thanks take the justifications help I like the ranking piece of it or the prioritization piece too so thank you good well and I would just say that it is a draft um like on the where we see like the bungee requests we're still working through them with cash flows to try to figure out what could be afford to find different funds and different options no wasn't that worth it that was good and and the two in the two in the two council members that were here to see this as we've gone through I I think we've made yeah leaps and leaps and bones well yeah yeah see there we go oh wow you do you Tim well I I thank you very much because we're a finance director this is as good as it gets um and then uh additional attachments that are there again are the general fund budgets uh to where we're at today um Enterprise and internal service funds um and so really it's just because of the schedule and so forth and to be able to approve uh you know the maximum Levy for the general fund HRA and Eda by September um and we missed the first August meeting and so forth that we really do need to look for some special sessions so we can get to meetings with our department heads and it's really up to the city council Hall we want to do that if we want to try to do all of the department heads in one day I think that's probably a little bit too much I think we need to do it in split in two meetings that we could go through and if we get through that then we would have one more meeting that we could have on a regularly schedule in early September where basically we will come back with with what the decisions from the meetings were and then have that maximum Levy and again a maximum Levy means that you can bring it down you can still have discussions after September you just can't go up above that component to it so um yeah so really it's going to be looking at trying to develop some special sessions still here in August and then you know well when the department heads present here in August we will in addition we will have the write-ups of the narratives of the Departments with some statistical information that will be presented in addition to their budget summaries and their budget line items for you to review and you'll have that ahead of time before the department head meetings so it's really looking at what are uh you know some dates that could possibly and we don't need to discuss it today or how is that I'm going to turn that over Jenny how do we do we have to decide today or we can you're pulling yeah idea thank you Dan you seem to be giving us a lot of wonderful information to go over to set this maximum [Music] what is is there a benefit to being close on this maximum or to not just say there's no way we're not going over 12 percent said that at 12 and just well I I think I would try to set something that you believe is is reasonable um there's there's a there's a a cause and effect with everything um whatever we certify as our maximum Levy will be included in the truth and Taxation notices that'll go up in November um that means it goes to every resident who owns property and that's where they will see this huge increase that you're proposing even though you're really never going to do that and you'll have uh at least I always look at it you should have a lot of people making comments and coming in here and and being upset if you truly aren't intending to do that so to me you want to be somewhere in the ballpark of a percent or two no more than that from where you believe that you're going to end up being um and a lot of that will you know I think in the past years depends on you know we we also we want to see where our neighboring cities are going and what the trends are and it just I think an Optics perspective you don't want to be the the one at 25 where everybody else is at five percent so but there's no penalties associated with there there's no legal ramifications it's all Optics and correct being fair to our recipe yeah you could you could set that maximum Levy at 20 and then come in at a five percent for the final approval if you would like to do that again I would my advice would be I would be against it um just from a from us that optic standpoint and why put alarm into our residents if that's not something that the city is intending to truly do because there may be some day that you really do have to to raise a significant increase in your Levy um and you want our residents to to know that um that we're serious when when we look at this any other questions any other comments and there's a lot of information there and um I I just want to take a take a moment first of all I want to thank city council for all your support that you've given um to the finance department we had an item tonight that was the approval of the Tyler technology which is going to be able to get us to that 2.25 charging on our utilities in addition to that they have some additional features which are actually going to help us do to make it easier for residents to pay um they either they even have uh you know ways that they can do a text to pay um and some other options so very excited for that and your support in your direction that you've given to the finance department I want to give all the department headers heads kudos for all the help that they've done on their Capital Improvement plans and their budgets to date and then the biggest Kudos that I have to give because I've already given Mary Kay hers is to our city manager our city manager has taken a a huge vital role in our development of our budget in meeting with all of our department heads and without his support we wouldn't be where we are right now in the process so I thank you very much city manager and I thank you all council members if there's no other questions I'm going to be done isn't that a record I didn't run the timer [Laughter] oh I felt it you know I'm just joking I do now [Laughter] thank you for your work and love the CIP okay yes let's just baby baby steps come on but yes no I'm I'm excited and they're willing to help us and it was fun to negotiate it um from from the workshop that we had on the credit cards we had a certain percentage and then they turned around and increased those percentages so um we ended up getting it back to where we were and we got him to hold it for three years so um yeah so it was it was quite fun and exciting and um and and yes Mary Kay has been a fantastic addition to the city of North Saint Paul and the finance department so and then I just I love coming up here I really do so well thank you so much for everything appreciate it yeah I just thanks everyone just kudos to Dan to you in the whole department you've I mean since Lisa and I started sitting up here we were wide-eyed and didn't understand a dang thing you said for about a year but this is brought it okay you're you're a rapid adapter but what's been presented is a lot easier to swallow a lot easier to understand and a lot of work and effort went into it so I just want to thank you and your team so you're saying we only got five months left to play the new card is that what I'm saying all right yeah yeah you get you get a year that's what I said only have five minutes left I better sharpen up you're ahead of the Curve all right thank you so much all right all right next airports I think Marisol reports from city managers and departments I will start off with Dan finance that they've done an incredible amount of work putting all this together and at the same time training in a new employee and uh couldn't be happier with what Dan has done and I'm excited for you guys to hear the story of his negotiations with the tether technology he did a wonderful job so yeah more than busy with the budget process Public Works has been uh clearly busy as well with their uh they got the mill and overlay done at the Burke Belmont Eldridge area we've been getting a lot of thank yous for that and everything looks pretty good down there really good down there um moving on next to Sean's way in and Diane Street um and what's left from there with this year's budgeted funds they will look at how much they can do on 16th east of McKnight Road so they should be able to get for sure from McKnight hopefully to Third and potentially even to the second depending on what is what the funding is left over [Music] um they have uh they're going to be doing this in three different stages but they can put in a sprinkler system out at Casey Lake by the by the playground area so that would be nice to Green that up the student build house is moving along really well they uh they believe they just poured the driveway over there just a few things little things left they'll be painting uh carpeting and then landscaping and then they'll be moving on to pouring the basement of the next house over let's all moved along nicely yeah um the downtown project Street project is going well even though we could use the rain it's been very beneficial for them to get a lot of work done during that time they did have to haul quite a bit of soil and fill out of there that they found to be contaminated I don't haven't heard the extra cost for that being that it had to be sent to a separate landfill for that but uh so more to come with that but projects moved along well they uh dug that out replaced it back up got it compacted sounds like next Monday they'll be doing pouring curb so let's move along well um the PD has been doing their program for gun trigger locks they had two of them 200 of them to give away they've been giving away here at City Hall they've been the foundation was given away at the car show as well so kind of a nice program fire department will be doing some fire extinguisher training for people up here at City Hall coming up soon Brent will put that on they're also doing that program going in and replacing um smoke detectors which is always a well-like program by our residents electric department has been finished up their project of the relighting of the path on 19th Trail along the lake that looks really good straighten out them lights some of them lights were randomly in odd places so it all came together well they did some overhead underground rewire behind sherelles there or in Oakdale of course a lot of focus has been on the uh sepula Boulevard for the Lily project still waiting on Long lead times on some of the equipment but uh were able to accommodate to make sure the part the program moves forward they uh some of the concern that they have right now is the 8000 volts power line that runs along sepula to at least get them moved out over the road sepula or temporarily put something underground if they can because they'll have to come in one of the first things they'll have to do is put pilings along sepula so they don't dig out a big basement and then suppla shears off into the basement area or that Dugout area but it's coming along well City Hall has their yearly training coming up uh kind of covers like MSDS ergonomics bloodborne pathogens aware program we do that once a year that's coming up soon thank you Jenny um what else we got we got the employee City picnic coming up here soon Wednesday August 9th we'll be shutting down City Hall from 11 30 to 1 30 so employees can go over there you guys are certainly invited hope to see you there and that is all I have thank you reports for Council commissions and committees Baltimore Norby the Planning Commission had their meeting on Thursday November or Thursday July 6th I was unable to attend as I was out of town I've watched the YouTube and sounds like they got a lot of nice work done and there's some information on the web and their next one is August 3rd thank you much much and it's been quite busy um they're about to launch a phase two of the utility wraps so I think both of them have now been installed and they're also discussing their budget um and the mirrorless mural project is going forward um one thing for us to consider is that we had a conversation around for a council is when when would Council like to have a project or some sort of you know come forward to to council before you know it continues to be developed yeah so just something for us to think about and maybe talk at a workshop or later but um I think that would be helpful in terms of expectations and you know our is our do we want to put provide input on certain things so just having some parameters around that but their next meeting is on I believe August 2nd at 6 30 here in the chambers thank you watch Council membership um at parks and rec commission is busy continuously planning their upcoming events they have a food truck night excuse me on Wednesday July 26 5 to 8 pm at Jose Park the same day their meeting will be in council chambers at 6 30 and don't forget about the event this upcoming Thursday at Casey Lake music in the park at 7 pm by the Brazilians all right that much council member Cole we had our Eda meeting on on the 11th uh there were three primary topics budget conversation for 2024 and what the EA Levy would look like um we also spent a lot of time talking about the proposed vacant space that we just uh discussed tonight as far as what you know what recommendations the Eda wanted to make to bring forward to council uh and the third topic had to do with the vacant lot across the street from City Hall they have entertained a proposal to take a look at and they want to share that with Council and upcoming meetings or workshops other than that I think John I cover most mayor I'm sorry mayor monkey did I cover most items uh next DDA meeting is eight eight uh in council chambers at three o'clock thank you very much General business none at this time council member Cole they did it again I was so good it was right there's the check mark here's that paper couldn't wait just 2 seconds to you're writing it down yep that's Kelly yes oh good [Music] I um I don't have any new business but to also go back to the arts and culture commission one discussion we also had was around the culture component of arts and culture and the concept of diversity equity and inclusion and really branching out and looking at how that can be implemented more in the programming space but then you know how can it be you know something that resonates throughout the rest of the organization so it reflects our community all right I don't really have anything um we did the fire appreciation dinner last Wednesday it was lovely to spend some time with all the firefighters and their families again appreciating the fact that these individuals are volunteers they take time away from their families to serve our city and serve the surrounding cities as well um so it was a very lovely event that Jason put together for everybody I remember call number two same you can call me Wong it seems like it's been forever since we've had a council meeting so we we have had a few activities in the community uh I had the opportunity to attend the ribbon cutting both at sweetie's candy store as well as Hang Time boards that was right prior to the Fourth of July that was a lot of fun there's a lot of energy in both both the new business owners in in North St Paul and and a lot of great ideas to come so I had the opportunity to attend that you didn't stab anybody mayor with the big giant scissors so that's a plus yeah they got a workout in a row um I want to give a shout out to um Ron Randy and team at cityworks our Public Works I'm sorry um I met them on the 5th of July after uh at Casey Park after the Fourth of July um and their their group spent the majority of the day cleaning up a lot of our Parks here in in town um it wasn't Casey wasn't as bad as prior years but they're and the park was actually cleaner than prior years but it's do you scratch your head as to I mean people were leaving their their coolers with food in them in their grills and just all sorts of stuff that the Public Works went out to to clean up they had to re-rank a few ball fields so that's often kudos to to public works for taking care of that um councilmember schwier reference I called it the family fighter family picnic [Laughter] um but we had the opportunity and uh I'm sure Carrie has some pictures of the mayor in an apron so that's a a wonderful cherish thing to to hang um and then had the opportunity to visit Carpenter small engine repair uh re-grand opening it's under new ownership uh local North St Paul individual purchased it so I had the opportunity attend that as well so it's been a busy month yes a lot of us were at those thank you very much it was great to see the new businesses and Carpenters they doing a good job of that um the only thing I can can bring in is when we were at our picnic there's a lot of little kids yeah little kids coming that was really fun baby to see all the way they come in twos they want to have twins we come in all different so it was very nice to see their families and how how what a great group they are so I really enjoyed that and one other note I learned is when we were on that street 17th is one of the main streets for the firefighters for Maplewood as well so there is they would if everybody thinks that North St Paul's burning down a lot it's not that it's just they take that to McKnight and down McKnight probably because White Bear Avenue is too crowded so just a little if people are wondering why they're hearing more more Sirens it's their their North fire department and they whip down 17th to McKnight so just a little we learned that and we were there all right can I add one thing you sure can um I got an email um as you all know I'm part of the pilot program for the food Recycling and it's going to be opening up to all you so keep an eye on your emails and very soon you will be able to put the green bag in your garbage as well I saw that I saw that note come out as well and I was I was excited to see it and I did want to have a conversation with you just to talk about how easy it was to implement and do absolutely happy to have that well we're looking to do a recess my understanding is what the council would like to do is um instead of going to the closed session for the performance review of city manager Brian frandel right now we'd like to go ahead and take care of the HRA meeting and then come back to the review which I think makes good sense so if there is a motion to recess this meeting to read to a motion to recess this meeting to come back into session immediately following the HRA meeting that would be appropriate at this point in time so you want to throw that motion out some of you are thank you council members second second council member Cole all those in favor say aye aye and then it's you ready all right it's all the HRA making police take role do you take roller for this one as well okay commissioner Cole here commissioner schweer here commissioner Wong here commissioner nordby your chair monkey here all right action items tonight or for the HRA is uh we had the 2024 budget discussion and we'll turn that over to Brandi Howard Community Development director thanks for accommodating the the move the movie atory meeting the one item that we have for discussion tonight I know this is probably only the second meeting for more than half of you of the HRA so I did provide in the staff report a little bit of background on the function functions of an HRA the powers and duties that it is given by Statute as well as the programs that the North St Paul HRA has supported over the years and just to give give you an update on those um or an overview rather rhra was established in June of 1971 and since that time we have supported three primary programs the first is the ghmc home program which provided loans from two to five sorry two to fifty thousand dollars to assist homeowners maintain and improve their properties the program was administered by the greater metro housing Corporation and that program is no longer offered by the HRA they also funded emergency repair loans between one and eight thousand dollars and that program assisted low-income homeowners to make a correction to their household um if it was in danger of being uninhabitable the loan recipients were required to meet HUD Hud's 80 Ami threshold and additionally that that program is no longer offered by the HRA either the student-built housing program is the third and that as you know is a partnership between the city and the Northeast Metro career and tech center where students build and remodel homes on city-owned property that partnership helps improve the housing stock at store tax base and give students an opportunity to explore careers in the building and construction trades so what we've been doing for the past few years the activities that the HRA has funded has been primarily the student-built housing program as well as monitoring any of those remaining Home Improvement and emergency loans acquisition for Real Estate has also been a an expense that has been programmed as well as funding for personnel and overhead expenses to administer the HRA fund in 2023 there was no Levy increase and in its decision making last year the HRA planned to utilize the existing fund balance over um other other Revenue to support those activities and so in the discussion of the 2024 budget um staff put together a proposed budget it's in the packet you'll see that the revenues listed in there are from the anticipated sale of our our current student build house on Eldridge Avenue as well as investment investment income the expenditures that we have listed include Personnel costs supplies and services that are commensurate with previous budget years we put down 280 thousand dollars for potential property acquisition that would continue to support support the student build housing program and then finally there's twenty thousand dollars in transfers that was included to the general fund and that has been proposed in previous budget years and it was done by the direction of the former city council so if there are any questions I could take those um or if there's any discussion or changes we're happy to accommodate that question all right no not in regards to the budget okay thank you anything um the only thing that I don't know that I've talked to Brian about is now that for our HRA the last one of our three we had we have left star excuse me the um student build housing is uh I'd like to us to reach out because now they're working on their Foundation of their their last lot and I know that Tom is getting older and we're not sure so we want to make sure to reach out to say how important this is to our city and how we enjoy this partnership and want to continue forward because we're going to if that's the last leg we have right now what we're doing with the archery I think we need to really get on it and make sure that uh and if there is some changes we need to have time to figure out what we're going to do um a little an update on that I did reach out to Eric to have a meeting with him that hasn't been set up yet um unfortunately for us unfortunate for Tom it sounds like there was some some retirement issues that he might be sticking around a little bit longer which has benefited us I mean he's just spectacular he's great to work with very knowledgeable keeps things moving smoothly um very good with uh letting us know what's going on what's coming up so um good for us though but as much as he deserves that so that's the latest I know so that's what be trying to get another project for the year after next then and I've been had my discussions with Brandy um we've been looking at a couple of different Lots with some ideas which we'll bring back to you great good I'm glad we're going forward thank you for checking that out [Music] I would like to entertain the idea of inviting the someone from planning and one from Eda to housing just because I feel like they have their own insights from their perspectives that would really contribute to how we how we move this forward just something for us to really consider I just think it'll give us a wider perspective Randy can you speak to the discontinuation of some of those loan programs like I tried to look into the history of meeting minutes or Council packets to figure out what what was the cause of that and I was not able to find the history so it's possible that a decision was made I'm not sure it's possible that maybe the program is just not administered by by that entity anymore um I think there's a similar program that the Eda had with small small business facade improvements that we no longer do anymore either and so I'm in the process of trying to investigate what additional programs at least for the Ada are possible and if there is a desire to direct staff to to look into those types of programs for the HRA as well I could do that see that I think it is in our comp plan as well so I guess it's a little um yeah something for us to really take a look at I mean our community is majority housing so what I remember from conversation of Prior Council prior to us they were discontinued because of um lack of Interest no one was applying for anything um and there was Prior Council just made a decision that if nobody's interested let's remove those from from the table I would love to entertain looking back at them yeah I think there are several communities uh near us that offer I think neighbor neighbor works or something like that they offer that type of program so yeah love Dad know what's out there all right anything else I have a question and tell me if I I'm new so please help me out um would it be appropriate if we are looking for another um student-built housing project if um Luther is going to put those in the city Lots where we asked them to develop four and we keep one for a student-built lab is that I know at one time they were talking about using those for student but that was too big of a chunk for for Tom at the time when he was still here looked at many years out but that just scared him a little yeah that was the issue they could only do well one a year and because there were so many different units that uh it was passed by yeah it would take in a long time and with the transition we didn't know what was going to go on with Tom and the program itself do we have some other spots you're thinking of yeah one is uh we're looking into making sure that space works over there on 6th and South 7th Avenue or Seventh Avenue excuse me right next to um Webster School right across the street there on the corner it's an odd shaped lot it's kind of a little bit of a pie shape and uh I know that I think they looked into the county before and they didn't want to allow um a drive off of a South Avenue but so we'd have to look at and because of the tightness that's coming off of sixth I just need to redeak into it again it's been a while since we looked at that a lot but we'll see if that can work as one of the options would just kind of like to see the project stay a whole project for the developer because then it becomes later on somebody else is trying to and I hope we can find some more spots yep to a motion to adjourn the HRA meeting so moved your honor move council member Wong second second council member Norby all those in favor say aye aye all right how do we get back into ours now mayor if there's a motion to reconvene the regular city council meeting have emotionary convene councilmember Wong second also remember swear all those in favor say aye aye welcome back and now that you're back into regular session Mr Mayor I believe the only item left is to go into closed session so I what I would ask is that on your agenda there is language that should be read out loud into the record and then a motion to go into closed session where is it what's this right yeah would you read it off well you got it there I must have closed when I opened up the HRA sorry this meeting will be closed pursuant to the Minnesota statute 13d.05 sub d three a to conduct a performance review of the city manager Brian frandel if there's a motion to close the meeting so moved so I'll move council member schwer second council member Norby all those in favor say aye aye all right