[music] Okay. All right. Good morning. It is the December 17th Urban Economic Development Committee meeting. I'm councelor Ballas chairing this meeting. First item on the agenda. I call this meeting to order. Um a quick note, the second item on the agenda has been rescheduled and item five has been pulled. All right, we are on agenda item three, resolution number 2950 1076 of the Tulsa Metropolitan Area Planning Commission pursuant to title 19 Oklahoma statutes amending the comprehensive plan by adopting an amendment changing the land use designation from employment to neighborhood on approximately 16 and a half acres and multiple use on approximately three acres located at the northwest corner of East Latimer Street and North Udica Avenue. This was approved unanimously by TMAPC and we have Nathan Foster with the planning office here to tell us all about it. >> Good morning, council. >> So, yes, this is kind of a combination application in two parts. There's a reasonzoning that's being considered under MPD7 um and a land use amendment that's being considered under CPA 125. For the land use purposes, I'll kind of cover that first. This entire uh property has been designated as an employment district uh really even in our previous comp plan but was maintained when we updated our comprehensive plan in 2023. The last major industrial user that I could find stopped at that site in uh the early 90s like 1993 I think SlumberJ was the the previous occupant of this site. Since then it has sat vacant. Nothing has occurred on the property and no development has happened. And at this time, the property has been acquired by Habitat for Humanity in conjunction with some other partners. They're proposing really a a new neighborhood with a mixeduse component along the Udica frontage. So, in order to support their development proposal, they're requesting to update the land use map and change a portion of this to really the bulk of this to a neighborhood land use designation. and multiple use for the UDICA frontage. Um, [clears throat] we were supportive of that land use change and the planning commission unanimously recommended approval as well. You can tell from just even this map mostly to the north and to the south there are existing neighborhood areas. This was kind of an outlier already that it was this large employment site just tucked in between these two. Everything to the west where you have some industrial zoning along Peoria and up to the highway remains designated as employment. there are some existing industrial users within that area, but updating this portion to neighborhood and multiple use really seem to make sense uh from a land use perspective and ultimately creates um I don't have the land use map but neighborhood consistently to the north and to the south and then also complementing multiple use along Udica which is the same designation that exists on the east side of Udica. Um, so ultimately that was recommended for approval by planning commission. The MPD itself is so just to give [clears throat] a little background on what an MPD is because we don't talk about them very often. Um, this is really only the seventh one we've ever considered. An MPD is essentially a an opportunity for a property owner to write their own zoning standards for a project. Rather than using a typical zoning district that we have already defined with standards and requirements, their justification for these are typically that we don't have a zoning district that accommodates what we would like to do here. So, we're going to propose a set of zoning standards to do what we wish and allow you to consider that. So through [clears throat] the master plan development, we would be establishing all zoning requirements for this project. Um, and I think that for this project in particular, the main goals were one, they wanted to reduce some of the lot sizes that are required by our zoning code to allow for some smaller lot residential development. Uh, but also reducing certain setbacks for those uses as well. Um, and then allowing a mixture of different housing types. So from this exhibit, this is kind of the conceptual plan that they provided within their MPD document. You can see they have a mixture of multiplexes, duplexes, town homes, um, as well as even some single family homes within this boundary that are all going to be kind of working in conjunction with one another. So rather than segmenting that with multif family and single family zoning throughout the MPD allows these uses to be mixed throughout the project to ultimately accommodate all of those different uses. The breakdown of this is really that along Udica you have some mixeduse commercial type development that will provide you know smallcale commercial uses restaurants retail neighborhoods serving commercial. The rest would all be residential uses but a mixture of those housing types with probably the main multif family being that far west portion of the property. Uh the description the applicant gave to the planning commission was that this is really kind of three partners working together. There's a developer working on the mixeduse portion. There's Habitat working on the bulk of the residential within the middle and then there's an additional partner I believe they they mentioned Mercy Housing who would be working on the western end doing the multif family project for that portion. So the way the MPD is broken down is really two separate development areas. We have the residential core which establishes guidelines for all of those residential building types and then we have the UDICA frontage which establishes the rules for the the multiple use or mixeduse component of it. They do have some very robust landscape standards, open space standards, uh, included in the MPD. You can see there's a a main kind of park area located on the western portion. That's a requirement as well as some very robust access and connectivity standards throughout to ensure that there's walkability that public streets connect to the public streets on all sides and that you can actually pass through on foot through this entire project to get from mixed use into the residential area to the west. Um ultimately the planning commission re unanimously recommended approval of MPD7. Happy to answer any questions you guys have. Cool. Um, want to say a couple things. Thank you for the presentation. Number two, uh, I love Mercy Housing and the work that they're doing around the country and they're doing some work in District 2. So, I'm excited to see that. Um, I have a question about the south uh, west part of the property. Is that just easement or what? That it's it's grayed out. >> [clears throat] >> So, there's a railroad that runs between the pre the subject property we're talking about and that triangle on the southwest, but that that triangle is actually separately owned and not owned by Habitat. >> So, that's a railroad. >> Yes. >> Yeah, there is a railroad kind of easement that goes through the property and along Latimer on the south end. >> I'm looking on Google. >> It's on the map right there. >> Whether or not it's a inservice railroad is a question I don't know the answer to. >> There's still tracks. >> There's still tracks. It's really close to the railroad that's is on. >> I don't know if our if you can see anything on our aerial. It's a little bit visible there, but >> Okay. >> So, does the railroad own that? >> Yes. Well, they have their kind of railroad rightway that goes through that part of the triangle. >> Yeah, the triangle is is a privately owned parcel that's that's separate from this project. >> I Yeah. Well, I'm looking at the road. It looks like on rock it doesn't cross Rockford. I'm just c if it was an active railroad be like trains going through there but it doesn't look like it's an active railroad. So >> having lived next to the railroad before there is it's possible >> there is active railroads in that area that are active. >> Okay. >> Thank you. >> Sure. >> Anything else? >> I like this. >> Yeah, >> so [clears throat] we're all moving in. >> I think it's a good example of >> What about screening? >> Not everything looking cover. Um, so there's not any requirement to um just as a typical zoning requirement. >> Whether or not they opt as part of their development to put some sort of wall or screening along it, I think that could definitely occur as part of their project. Um, looking at their conceptual layout, it looks like they have actually a drive that comes in between the buildings and the railroad area there with some some units that do come right up to that portion, but train track. >> Yeah. [laughter] >> Shake your walls. >> By a train track. >> Oh my gosh. >> Very long. >> No, you do not. They're not. >> I think in the in the presentation, just also forformational purposes, they indicated a total of 300 roughly 300 units would be accommodated by this project. So, >> really cool. >> All right. Anything else on this one? >> Contract. What's MPD stand? I like it. >> Stands for master planned development. >> Oh, okay. >> I thought you were saying M. You said M >> Master MD. >> So, essentially what that means is once we adopt an MPD, our office, the planning office kind of becomes the administrator of that master plan development, meaning future subdivision plat, site plans, etc. that will be developed here will come through our office for a review with compliance with that document first before heading to to permitting and following their typical process. >> This is everyone's reminder that you have to live somewhere a year before you can run for office in that district in case anyone else was trying to move in there. [laughter] Vanessa's like, "What is your problem?" >> Just letting everyone know. >> She's like, "Don't tell them that." All right. No, I'm kidding. Okay. Um Well, that's super exciting. All right. [laughter] Um we and we are now on Wait, is this part of the same thing? I should have read four too. >> Oh, I think so. Yeah. So, >> so four was the comprehensive plan amendment that we talked about. >> Yep. Reszoning application for MPD things, northwest corner, East Latimer, North Utica. We've just discussed this as well. And that's the habitat part of it is what you >> Yeah. Well, it's so there's two separate applications. One is to change the land use map. That's on I think actually item three. Yeah. >> Um and then item four was the zoning for the MPD itself. Yeah, Gilbert. >> So, just out of curiosity, how who is the brainstorm behind this? I mean, who started this discussion? Was it or was it >> No, I think Habitat is the the owner of the property and has has actually >> Oh, yeah. >> So, Habitat has kind of been the leader on the effort and they've assembled this team of of kind of partners to help them in developing the bulk of the site. >> Okay. Good to know. And he's also working with local contractors to do something. Oh, >> could you pass me a Reese? [laughter] >> Just as an additional piece of information. >> Oh, we're just brought them in. The best holiday Reese's. Well, don't eat these. >> But different. >> I got one. I was already awarded my time spent. I was going to mention real quickly uh with with Aaron Pley's help. This is included in the TIFF project for the Crutchfield area within. >> Okay. >> For additional piece of information. >> That's really cool. Okay. >> Um All right. We Let's see. Just a reminder, five was pulled. So, we are now on agenda item six. Um thank you so much, Nathan. We're on ordinance amending the fiscal year 2526 budget to make supplemental appropriations of $3,377,000. is recognized from unappropriated fund balance within the public safety protection sub fund law enforcement records management system and the >> hi Jared Moore from budget morning everybody. Um this action is just uh appropriating the remainder of the settlement funds that were received after uh the vendor settled with us previously. um it was just kind of becoming inefficient for every new development or tweak that needed funding with it to pick from that pot. So, it's going forward so they can manage the project correctly uh going forward. Uh the specific actions in this one that you see the personal services there were two positions that were funded uh on a temporary basis from the project about a year and a half or more ago. a business analyst and a project manager to assist with the transition of this project. And this will uh put funding in place to continue their employment and work for another six or so months. And then the rest is going to the capital uh accounts so that they can pay subscription costs. So there's a court API to have the uh courts MJTN I believe speak to Tyler Munis and some other things. But everything will be used in process for the RCMS project. >> Councelor, so we're not obviously not contracting with Central Square anymore for for this service. Who who are we working with? >> Is there another vendor? >> Definitely not Central Square. And there have been several Axon and uh Tyler are the two ones that >> come to my mind immediately. Sarah's actually. >> So are we dumping that system all together? Are we are we >> dumping? Are we get are we going to not use that system that we paid for or we're >> we never got one. >> I don't think they I don't think they bought the system and I I think and you can jump in. They um received that money back for failure to deliver that system. I think Axon is the >> body cam vendor as well. Um so I think TBD has a their body cam vendor. Axon Axon. >> Um >> great. And um they um I think that is the vendor that they are using. Um I do have I can give this to you all a a kind of a picture of how these systems work together. Um I can give get that to you. >> So this is about body cam the body cam not uh record keeping. >> No, this is this is record keeping. They're also a body cam vendor. They they are vendor. >> They do both. >> They do both systems. But but what what's on the agenda right now is in reference to what? The body cam or the recording. >> The record. >> So what are we using if we're if we >> Oh, the our old system the the jurist and traces system. Um >> so we just went back to the old system. >> Yeah, we never left the old system. >> So what have we been working on? >> Traces. >> A a great system built in the >> 70s gets a lot of [laughter] >> There's been there's been experts coming on trying to get the system up and running. What What were they working on? prices or this >> they were working on making a new system which we did not get because of the vendor issue and so now they're working on >> is it improving the current >> yes so moving away from juris and traces onto a new >> you said API is this about connecting plugins from other data systems to our existing one >> some relevance yes ma'am >> okay and then as a clarifier I think this will add to what council Harper is asking let me know but um because as a clarifier so I get it like there's other data sources is you're creating API and creating those feeds to like try to pull stuff together centrally. Is this like a lot of this is this kind of like startup implementation cost afterwards? Is it like like do we know is some of this then like cloud-based subscription model people maintaining those API feeds or like like is this all like one-time upfront stuff or we're going to have to sustain pieces of this? Do we know in perpetuity? I'm just trying to figure out this is a big upfront cost and then are we done or are we going to have to be sustaining a bunch of this? >> Do we know? >> I don't know if I have a great answer to that. Um I kind of want to separate the idea that the 3.3 million is like the the price tag for getting across the finish line. >> It these are just the remainder of those settlement funds. They are still in the implementation process of this working out kinks getting the uh various pieces to talk to each other. Uh there's better experts talk on this than me but there were some uh privacy data integrity issues that courts prosecution police they they needed barriers between their information and so like this API in particular will let one actually this is to process payments but they got to speak to each other. Yeah, >> there's development, the implementation. Once that is complete, uh my suggestion would be that we continue to pay the ongoing subscription cost, which there will be from this pool of money until it is exhausted, at which point there will have to be a conversation about ongoing sustained funding. >> So, this is not an appropriation to pay for something. This is receiving this money. >> Yes, ma'am. That's probably the easiest. >> Okay. So, this is receiving money, not paying for something. But you're saying what we're going to use these funds to >> we returned that system and got them >> and then with those walls you're talking about feed stuff and then data scrape between systems >> but the software >> returned >> and this is all we're getting back. >> Yes. >> From what we paid >> what we pay and we it was over 7 million, wasn't it? >> Yeah, it was. We're getting half >> suggest having a a presentation on the status of this project. >> Yes, >> there's a lot that's getting taken out of context and confused. So, there's a ton of work that's been done in terms of data migration and preparing data for these systems and there are several systems. Our aspect for example, the prosecution system is Carpel and it has to integrate with with these elements as well. But 3.8 million is the mediated settlement that we got from Central Square Technologies. Several hundred thousand has already been appropriated. This is the remainder of that appropriation. Um but there has been a ton of work done already leading to this point and leading to what I believe is a spring go the last I heard was an April. >> So I I would suggest that kind of be a standalone discussion item. I think that that would be helpful things I can consider writing that down because I'm also thinking about going back to like since this is coming from that settlement we're using it for the project and then as Jared mentioned there's there are those sustaining costs which I'm sure we've been paying for other cloud-based you know we paid >> there will be some swapping cost to drop off and be replaced with these costs >> right yeah I think that'll be helpful for us to know from a budgetary standpoint >> okay what did you say was going to happen in in the spring or in April >> all of These three systems will go live. >> Okay. >> Or at least two of the systems will go live and then they will be added. >> Okay. >> Yes. All right. Anything else on this one? Sounds like there's some to be continued learning for us. Okay. Thank you. We are on agenda item 7, ordinance amending the fiscal year 2526 budget to make supplemental appropriations of $319,867 recognized from unappropriated fund balance within the substance abuse mental health services sub fund mobile crisis response team. Yes, this is just appropriating a grant award the city received uh from in the fire department from the Oklahoma Department of Mental Health that it is funding staff for a mobile crisis response team. They will be out there uh four days a week, 10 hours each and uh do deescalation and facetoface assessments and uh we do have director Liury behind me if you have more intimate questions. This is uh appropriating the dollars for the grant. >> Yeah. Bush. >> Did we receive the money from the mental health department? >> Yeah. >> Oh, if you want to join us. >> Thank you so much, Celebrity. >> Just because they've had so many issues. >> Or I'm like, when were we granted this? >> We have executed the revenue agreement committing them to the money. I know that. >> When were when were we awarded this in relation? >> So, this so this this is like a past year. So, it's come from SAMA. I think Okay. uh the state applied for it, they wanted to invest into the city of Tulsa. >> Great. >> Uh because of some of the work that we're doing um and so um you'd say that very nicely. Um but but this really helps us staff with a licensed clinician, a case manager, a paramedic, and a peer recovery support specialist. So, um I think that really that last part is really neat. um as you don't really see that a whole lot through some of our current crisis teams, but you'll have a pure uh someone with lived experience as part of this continuum now, which is um uh once again things we're doing here in Tulsa is really kind of leading the way in this in this space. So that's exciting. >> Is just as a clarifying question to what you just said and then I have >> Yeah, I just just to clarify is this the art team people or is this a separate mobile unit? >> It's it's it's you should look at this as an art the art model. Yeah, but it's another team. >> Art one, art two, and then this is >> three. Yeah, >> this is art three. >> Okay. >> And is it whole city or in a specific area? >> Um we're going to we're going to focus on an area. Um and this is kind of compliment. So, this is um we're we're taking into account the neighborhood condition index on this a little bit in parts of Tulsa, but we really want to have a focus approach on this uh real-time crisis response, that emergent response, but also that that backend non-emergent case management um and really are investing in um to make sure people are getting insurance or improving their health care um getting transportation, fixing some of those and working on some of those that case management. And that's really where the value in um the case manager and the peer are going to come in and the paramedic. >> Yeah. And this is great. I love it. My concern is because we've had some issues with the Department of Mental Health going, "Oh, we're going to do this." No, we're not. Well, maybe we will, maybe we won't. I'm just trying to make sure. Do we have we have we done everything possible to secure the funding? >> Yeah. this money. So, so what you're looking at here, the hope is this is a one year, potentially four years, >> okay, >> uh, for this type of funding. So, obviously, it's just like anything else. We need to really do a good job of hitting our benchmarks along the way, which I believe we will. >> Um, but they're excited for us to for this opportunity and like I said, this comes from SAMA. So great. >> As much as I can guarantee that's going to be there. >> What I what I do know is our the program and what we're doing is a very good program. Um and it does >> we don't have any doubt about any doubt. So I feel confident >> our efficacy is there. Yeah. >> Yeah. I feel confident. >> I'm not worried about that. I have a distrust or mistrust of dollars actually being received >> from the state. >> Even Even if it's from federal >> even if it's from federal. >> You don't trust the system. >> The state >> I came from there. >> Yes. >> Trump. [laughter] >> Oh, I had to admit it. >> Mine was answered. So >> don't admit it. No, >> I was just asking about if it was going to [clears throat] increase the team, which you >> Yeah. No, I think it's great. Great. >> It's exciting. >> We just need to dog the money. >> We're going to do our best. >> Yes. >> Sorry. >> Yeah. You I think you answered my question. This is a year. This funding will fund us for one year. So, it's kind of a pilot and then the hope is to re the state will reapply for additional funds to continue the program. >> Yes. Yes. That's that's the goal. and we've done this with something else and so I I do have experience with this and basically Samson won't say we're going to give you four years but they the way they word it is we'll give this up for up to four years and so um I'm not an expert in that but I assume they're going to check our program and the results we've had after year one and >> and if Sam could right >> so the >> turtles all the way down >> maybe I I don't know if I misheard what you said this R3 is different than the first and second because there's a peer uh partner in addition to the other clinicians. Is that right? >> You're you're exactly right, sir. Yeah. I mean, if you look at CRT, R1, R2, IRT, none of them have a pure dedicated to that team. Okay. >> Like assigned to that team. our three will um and and and and I just want to be clear, it's not because we said, you know, we don't think that's valuable on any other teams or not, but when we we pushed this forward and the state helped us push this forward, we were able to add that position in there. And so I I just think it's good. Uh I say this for Tulsa, we were very unique. You could not look I can tell you this for sure, you could not look anywhere in America and look at have a model like CRT, R1, and IRT. Uh, so I think it's a really great opportunity to look at these different models within our city. All providing great value, but a little different look and and see, you know, which one's working best or what do we like about this one that we could add to this one. And so we'll get to see that again with this this R3. >> Yeah, that's what's so cool about this iterative kind of quality improvement that's happening with these. I just to clarify to make sure I understand how this one operates with that lived experience person and the additional pre like non-emergent case management are those people that are going along for some of the emergency services or are they more kind of like back office like the followup or handoff to services like how does that work? >> It's a great question. That's a great question. Yeah, the the case manager they in in the peer they'll operate out of the non-emergent setting. uh which is important because I mean this is where you're hey I don't have health insurance uh but you're you're you qualify for sooner care well we we're going to sit down and make sure you fill out the paperwork right or uh someone who's unhoused well let's get you on the housing list let's start filling out the housing applications and there's a lot of layers to that well I don't have my ID or I don't have my well let's walk you through that so that's where that that actions will take place in the non-emergency setting but we also wanted to be able to we we it's important that we hit during the crisis intervention as well Here comes Archie. >> What um where are the peers coming from? Can you just kind of give me a little bit more color on are are you going out and hiring them or you have partners in the area that sort of provide them? How how do you find those? >> So we you know we um well when was this? I don't know. Don't quote me. We got this set up worked on getting this set up through the city of Tulsa so we could hire peer recovery support specialists through the city of Tulsa. Um and so we started that. So they'll go through our typical process of hiring. Um we'll put that out. Obviously, we want this to be community-led program. So, we really want to get people in that community. Um, >> so these will be city employees. >> Yes. >> Medical. Okay. >> Yeah. The the peer, the case manager, the paramedic. Yeah. Will be city. >> I'm sure I hope that we have other people who have had those types of lived experiences already at our, you know, city hall being employed. Um, u people I'm just thinking through knowing our rates when it comes to right mental health or substance use. Like I'm sure we're surrounded all the time by people who have had those lived experiences. So I'm glad that we already have [snorts] that proximity. Um, that's exciting. Anything else on this item? This is really exciting. So are we calling this art? Is that the title? Okay. I just want to make sure if I >> We're sticking with art from here on more letters to memorize. [laughter] So, yes. Well, we're sticking with R3 on this one. >> Okay. >> I'm sorry. One more. This is when when will it begin? >> I think we're very close. Um I think we should we're actually close to posting the position. Um so, as soon as we take on these funds, I would assume um we're ready to start. I don't know. Would you January maybe? >> Yeah. Um well, I know I have the hold up there. Uh the funds should post uh 14th by the 21st or so at which point y'all can hit the ground running. >> Maybe in the spring then. >> Yeah. Okay. Thank you. >> Okay. >> Um I'll table my other question. Okay. Thank you so much. >> Thank you. >> All right. We are on agenda item eight and something I'm excited about cuz in my district um discussion with representatives from the Ann and Henry Zuro Foundation regarding a proposed low barrier shelter the harbor. >> We have Jeff Hall with us. You can take any chair you want. >> Any chair? >> Yeah, I'll keep this relatively brief and of course welcome any questions. First off, want to thank councelor Bellis and helping with our community engagement efforts. The biggest update we have is the city's application for the board of adjustments passed unanimously, which is a giant hurdle. If they would have said no, we couldn't do it. So, uh that happened last week and so we're still off to the races and planning for um design actually working through our designers now, but hoping to start construction by spring as we work with the city on the building transfer uh towards the first of the year. Other than that, I mean, what I think this may be the first time I've met addressed the entire council, so maybe take a step back. Um, Old Juvil Detention Center there off Charles Page in Cru Museum Boulevard. >> Um, obviously you guys already approve the purchase of the property from um the county to the city. As a part of that process, where we come in as a partner is um we are working with the city now on an agreement to where that property as a part of the city's partnership will be donated to the Harvard LLC, which is a nonprofit entity that's been created. Um it'll serve up to 180 individuals, adult individuals, male and female, as a 247 low barrier shelter. um which would be you know obviously the Tulsa Day Center is probably the most robust active lowest of low barrier shelters the city has in our landscape um but obviously they're at capacity and and our counts and marks here can clarify more if we need to but we far exceed the numbers that they can serve and so we saw this as a true need for our landscape and serving our unsheltered uh folks and so 180 um we have partnered with an operator um City Care right now they operate a shelter in Oklahoma City and in Norman that's low barrier and bring some pretty I we believe high quality best practices to this effort. Um and they're they're going to come along the way with the design and be the operator at the end. Um it is our hope um all things considered as you can appreciate with real estate that everything moves smoothly and we open um by or before this time next year. So before next winter, we have the facility that can help support more additional unsheltered individuals. Um, as you would expect with any shelter of this type or any facility, a lot of robust partner coordination, a lot of bringing people on site since it'll also have day services for wraparound case management. Um, how do we get folks? One thing we appreciate about City Care is they're housing focused. And so, this is not a place to warehouse people long term. This is meant to address the crisis at hand, get them sheltered, and then work towards a path towards sustainability. That timeline, of course, varies by person, but how we get them there and get them connected. Um, so there's nice synergy with the program. this council's already funded through uh safe move to Tulsa and how we get people connected to that and ultimately into housing or other services that they may need. Um so it's just really another cog in the system that we felt was a pretty big goal. >> Yeah. Um just want to add on and then I have counselor Bush. Um the operator City Care came and spent time with the community kind of describing services and things like that which was really wellreceived especially when they talked about how because they've been operating Norman for how long? So Norman's probably the most recent and that boy did not have a lot of great feedback when they first started and they've been really successful since they got going. >> Yeah, they um because it's I think she described being in Norman for a few months and already like the reduced rate of reliance on like the city's public safety infrastructure there has really gone down because of the proactive things they are doing when it comes to um providing those supports for people that are unhoused. Um, and then also one of the things that was emphasized that I think really got a lot of neighborhood support along Charles Page was that this operator does a lot of transportation. So it's like the the foot traffic concerns that people have are really alleviated by how much they focus on getting transportation access to resources for people. Professor Bush, >> well to follow up, what where else in Oklahoma City are they operating? >> So they operate their own facility in Oklahoma and I can't remember the exact location or what the name of it is. kind of out by the fairgrounds. >> And they also offer uh they do they just started a uh respit care facility and they do permanent support of housing. So they try to hit the entire landscape which is our hope right of them expanding to Tulsa as they hit not just this facility but their full suite of >> Yeah. I was just curious where else in Oklahoma City cuz >> they have where their shelter's located. Um they have quite a bit of acorage that they have the rest of housing. So they create kind of a housing pipeline. >> Okay. >> Thank you. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I got it. >> Yeah. Um yeah, this has been really well received by um the surrounding neighborhoods which is really great. um you know the neighborhood that's kind of being situated within Crosby Heights is really disproportionately impacted by homelessness because of proximity to services. So there you know wasn't the improbable chance that the neighbors might have had additional concerns but there's been so much great transparency from the operator from uh the Zero Foundation etc along the way that the community has been really like brought along with. That's really helpful to find us out. >> No, it's it's been a really good >> smooth process which is really great for everyone involved. But um and I think >> you're allowed at first. >> Yeah. Well, you end up with Yeah. different people get concerned when there's something new, but they also the other piece is if not for this what that property does. I mean, it could be a junkyard, you know. So, this is a real asset. It adds in some really critical infrastructure and services to the area. So, people are excited. Um, and then I also know there's multiple I just wanted to mention this for all of us to give a pin on especially as we go into one of I think our next conversation too. There's physical space in this that could extend into winter shelter space in the future potentially. Right. >> Yeah. And so right now and and I didn't bring any renderings. I'm happy to email that to Sarah. Um, but what we have for conceptual design is it's a 48,000 foot building and it's massive and I'll give credit to the county though it's been shuttered for five years. Uh it is I mean it needs considerable work, don't get me wrong, but it is well preserved. It's not the worst empty building I've ever walked into. Um but and so what we're we're looking is to activate in this first phase of construction to ensure we're open by this time next year. It is about 30 35,000 square feet, which is considerable, but that does leave considerable amount of a phase 2 work. And so as they can get in and get operate and stabilize their operations, if there's opportunities for additional surge capacity or winter weather or other opportunities, there's considerable space that'll be left for that. >> Good things. >> Yes. Uh thank you for this for this brief presentation. Uh two questions. Sure. >> Uh so the harbor is the LLC that was created. Who is on the board of the harbor? Who who are the leaders that are sort of managing that sort of uh >> So it's a private LLC. Um right now we are the development entity as an Henry Zero Foundation. We work heavily with partners obviously Mark and others in the way for Tulsa to ensure that it's community informed. Um but at this point that's the intent and then obviously we'll contract with the operator and the operator will have their own community engagement and platform. >> Uh thank you. And then long-term funding. I mean, um, you know, we've made some appropriations, but like as we think about just the long-term sustainability, what is the thoughts about that? >> Yeah. And I won't go too far down this uh rabbit hole, but I do think there's been ongoing conversations on what does um how is there a blend of public and private like with anything else with homeless response system? I think that's always been part of this conversation as well. if this can truly serve as a big uh solution to that hole is unsheltered population is there opportunities for future public funding whatever that may be I know part of that was in some of the mayor's presentation some of that who knows what that will come but there are the past few dollars that could be considered um obviously on the philanthropic side we'll continue to look at not just covering the capital costs which are are being covered but looking at where that support looks like long time we do appreciate the fact that and at a future date perhaps Perhaps if this can make to council agenda in November as or excuse me as January as scheduled, we can bring in Rachel the operator. Okay. When I'm we're most impressed with her is not just their skill in operations, but she is a skilled fundraiser. So, we're going to we're excited to have her in the community. >> Yeah. And she's already been so great about spending time here. Like, she came specifically to meet with the neighborhoods, too, which is >> so where she won the neighbors, and you'll you'll appreciate this, is her family um her parents are still in Sand Springs, and so they consider her a part of the neighborhood. So that that one >> that definitely helped. Yes. >> Yeah. >> Good. >> Yeah. Okay. Anything else on this? Thank you so much. >> Yeah. Thank you. All right. We're on agenda item nine, update with representatives from the mayor's office and housing solutions regarding the cre winter shelter. It's brought to us from counselor Denin. And we have Emily Hall from the mayor's office and Mark Smith from housing solutions with us. Did you want to do any context first or just let us jump in? >> No, let them jump in. >> Okay. All right. >> Good morning. Still noon. >> Okay. Um the shelter h the winter shelter has been open for a month now. I think almost today. So, um, we'll walk through I was here at the beginning of last month and, um, provide an update from that time as well as just talk through some, uh, additions and changes to the shelter. Um, so again, the winter shelter is being operated at Creo's location on East Admiral. Um, they are the operators in partnership with Be Herd and Away Home for Tulsa. Um, housing solution. Mark is here because Housing Solutions um the city had has contracted since last year uh as a sole source contractor for um emergency shelter logistics and management. So they're really the manager of the winter shelter and any sort of emergency weather shelter. And then Creopes owns the facility and is the lead operator. Uh so a little bit about the operations at the winter shelter. Um, this is for adults only, 18 years and older. It's on a first come, first- serve basis. Um, meaning that a bed is reserved. So, if someone stays there, the next day they if they want to stay there that following night, they reserve the bed. Um, since it's been open, it's been every bed's been full each night. Um, there's 24-hour access if there is a a bed available, 24-hour on-site security, uh, three meals daily. Um, clients have access to hygiene facilities, products, and warm clothing. Um, and then it is ADA accessible. So, some of the services that are provided for folks staying there, there's on-site behavioral health and substance use support, uh pharmacy services are available, case management, uh crisis intervention support, veteran services, housing navigation, and then um on an ongoing as needed basis, clients can have access to medical and dental services. So, some key data points over the last month um right now currently serving between 50 and 60 individuals and the breakdown um is 48% female, 52% male. And I think this is a really interesting data point because our point in time count and other shelters and the planning for this really is around a 6040 split of 60 male and 40 women. And councelor Denton, I know you care deeply about um women's access to shelter. And so this particular location is overperforming in that sense of serving more women than what typically we've seen. Um, of the population that's been there, 110 unique individuals, 47 individuals are experiencing chronic homelessness. These are our long-term stayers. >> Emily, can you tell me what's the capacity for that for that location? >> So, right now it's at 50 to 60 beds per night, and that is scaling up. Um, >> okay. So, that 60 is the is the cap right now. >> Right now, yes. And then it's scaling up. Um, and what I mentioned last time I was here, it would be 125 and then when life or death situations where it's everyone needs to clear the streets, it will scale to 250. >> Okay. So, if you don't mind, so I want to make sure I understand this. So, daily without a a significant weather event, >> your cap is 60 >> currently. Yes. >> And you're scaling up and at So right now I remember asking you this question. No one would be on the street if we had a significant weather event. >> Right. >> This is part of that. Correct. >> Yes. >> Okay. So >> right now this facility could support 250 today if we had >> in an emergency situation weather situation. And I'm going to and my last slide here is diving into kind of some different scenarios on what that trigger looks like. Good. >> Um, and we talked about last time, you know, that getting to this 125, but a ramp up and we have one-time uh, ARPA dollars that we are utilizing to cover the operational expenses of this. Remember, this is just a temporary shelter. We h again these are one-time dollars that were very generously uh allocated for homeless related services including um emergency weather. And so right now while the weather is not consistently cold and again I'm going to hit I'm going to get to those temperatures um keeping the numbers a little bit lower. So because weather is completely unpredictable. We don't know if we're going to hit uh like last year where we had about 14 nights of um needing to clear the street sort of weather or is it going to be three nights or is it going to be 20 to a whole month worth? So um that's why the scale up period as we're getting more into the colder nights is occurring currently. >> Did you follow up? And I know >> on on this slide real quick. So, it's 50 to 60 individuals per night that we have currently. Correct. Okay. On the next one, it says 110 unique individuals. Where are you getting that 110? Because that breakout of 47,4 and three equals 64. So, where where's the 110 coming from? >> Yeah. So, the 50 60 individuals per night. Each night uh in the morning when an individual wakes up, they check in to confirm that they're going to stay the next night and so they're able to reserve that bed. But we have had individuals who have exited. So it's not the same 50 to 60 individuals who are there tonight as were a month ago. So the 110 is just the unique individuals who have spent a night in the shelter over the month of operations. Okay. And then the numbers below are just some specific populations. It's not full breakdown of the total. So the 47 individuals who have been experiencing homelessness for a year or longer and have a documented disability. Um the individuals over 65 and several veterans. >> Okay. It's just very confusing. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> I just have one question that 38,000 is that per day? >> Uh, no. Yeah, we can get into So, you had a question about expenses. I hadn't have not gotten down there yet. >> Finish your slide. Yeah. [laughter] Sorry. >> Um, but the 38,000 expenses um that includes the purchase of 150 highquality durable CS that have mattresses and that are washable. And the CS that we've been using for multiple years now are really just like the army CS. These are have a much greater lifespan and they will stay with the city. So that >> so that's just the cost of the cost. >> No. Uhuh. Okay. >> That's a portion of this overall cost. >> This is the cost today. >> No. >> Okay. >> Hold on. I'm I haven't finished. >> I'm sorry. >> This includes two purchases that I'm explaining. One is the CS and the re the CS stay with the city, right? So any sort of ongoing or future um situation where we need to utilize them, we have the CS available. The second piece of that 38,000 um is the rental of a uh restroom trailer for the facility. >> Okay. Are there not facilities inside? So there are facilities but not but if we have 50 to 60 individuals and a couple bathrooms um and those are being used for for folks who are in are uh in wheelchairs then have um more restrooms available as well as they are they include showers. >> What's the rental cost per trailer? >> So I'm going to get right there because um our rental cost that we that the city utilized it was $10,000 for a short-term rental. And then I'm gonna I'm gonna talk about a partner that has um purchased trailers in just a second. >> Any other questions on that? >> No, I want and the cut the cut cost as well. Yeah. >> How about we finish the >> Let's finish the presentation. >> We're ready >> and then see where we get. >> Yeah. Here. Yeah. Do your presentations. >> Yeah. Oh my god. [laughter] >> The patriarch. >> Okay. So additional right this is really a community effort to lift up a a temporary winter shelter. Um so TMUA has purchased two uh shower bathroom trailers and those are being located at the winter shelter. Um they were being serviced getting ready and that was the reason why we had to do a uh initial rental. These shel these restrooms are arriving arriving now. their bathroom shower combination. Um, but then they will be util they can be utilized for other sorts of emergencies across the city once the winter shelter has ended uh in March. And so that that's an additional resource. Um PSO has made a donation to CreoS uh for 15 CS and then OMG is uh has donated the setting of a meter and a hard pipe to provide gas so that the bathrooms are heated, winterized. Um and they've also made a financial donation to the shelter for gas payments. So, are we does this include from TMU, just as a clarifying question, like maintenance of those trailers long term now that we own them or >> um the long-term piece I am >> I I can get back to you on that. No worries. >> Um but we do have a contract for regular maintenance now. >> So, I'm sure this could be good for like events too, but then I'm thinking about what it costs to keep them going or keep them winterized. Councilor Dun, did you have a >> No, I'm wait till the end of the present. >> Okay. >> Okay. So here is um some scenarios in the shelter expansion regarding weather again right like we are working off of >> not good color. >> Hard to see that font the black >> the black. Okay. >> Um so we made some changes this last winter in January or February. Um, prior to that, for several years, when emergency shelter capacity needed to occur, an increase in it, uh, that temperature has really hovered around 0 to negative degrees. [cough] And it was based off of when hypother takes for hypothermia to kick in on someone. But but that was in someone who had uh properly clothe was properly clothed for the temperatures um and not uh taking into account that many of our unsheltered individuals don't have the proper clothing um and have been out into the weather for uh several days prior to that temperature drop. So what we've what we've gone off right now and this is you know can this is why it's in collaboration but uh 32 degrees or below for one night there is no expansion of shelter space typically means that daytime temperatures heat warm up above freezing. Um, now when we get to single digits for multiple nights and day temperatures remain below 32 degrees, then we're looking at expanding capacity and allowing more people to come in off the street. um as well as when multiple days of ice and snow occur, expanding capacity. It's because it it's an increase in um staffing, food space, and it's not just at the location of the winter shelter, but typically it means expanding uh emergency space across the other shelters. Um, and this is done in collaboration with housing solutions, um, the city, city emergency management, Tulsa County emergency management, and other away home for Tulsa partners having outreach and folks literally going and bringing folks into shelters. So, with that, happy to answer questions. >> All right, I have counselor Duten, Bengal, then myself. >> Okay. Um, I have a slew of questions actually. So, >> let me know if you want to do like half take a pause and then come back for more. That's what >> Yeah, that's fine. Just to give >> turn. >> That's fine. Okay. You you you call out. >> Okay. So, >> so I'll I'll try to share the questions with y'all. Y'all can share them with me. So, um the rental costs for the trailers that wasn't clear. >> Uh yes. that the rental cost for the trailer that the city rented around it was about $10,000 um until TMUA's trailer arrived >> and those those arrived last two weeks ago. >> Uh the rental trailer arrived. One TMUA trailer has arrived. So rental trailer is still there and then the next TMUA trailer should arrive um any day. So the uh rental trailer then is incurring a cost of 10,000. >> That's the cost that for the time span that it's needed. >> Time span. >> Yeah. >> Okay. And that's coming out of the >> the ARPA um shelter dollars. All of the expenses have are coming out of the um shelter operation dollars >> including but the TMUA dollars for the act for the purchase. >> That's TMUA donation, right? >> Okay. And then >> from our >> um so what I'm wondering are um if you could expand on what the roles are of housing solutions Tulsa Beheard and Creo so that the public can understand the subreient aspect of the contract and how that goes forward. >> Sure. So, City of Tulsa has a sole source agreement which was uh put into place last year with Housing Solutions Tulsa to be um the manager of emergency shelter uh logistics. So, for example, in January, February this summer with um the day service expansion and now they are handling the management and logistics. Um and then they contract with CreoS who is the operator of uh and work with the other partners who operate um and facilitate any sort of programming at the shelter. Um and so Mark, you can speak to the contract that you guys have then with CreoS and with Beard. >> Yeah, so the build's off an existing contract that we have with the city and so that contract owner set. made it for a year um last winter because we didn't know what type of events we would have. Um and it makes it much easier for the city to contract with housing solutions and then we can subreient or subcontract with any other organizations like depending on the need and event as opposed to the city having to do those one by one. And it also aligns with our role of during like an emergency we coordinate service providers. We have coordinated with TAMA in the past. And so it it's the role that we've already been filling. It also allows us to provide support to a provider that is going to eventually maybe be using federal dollars or city dollars that may not have familiarity. So, our grants and finance department provides additional layer of oversight to make sure expenses are categorized correctly um and that you know uh there's a predictability on expenses being reimbured. So, we have done this previously with other events with Iron G one hope Tulsa Tulsa Dream Center. that this one we are contracted with CreoS and with Bee Herd directly. The initial proposal when we looked at this is that Beer would be a subreient of CreoS but as we actually went into the operations it made more sense for Beer to contract directly with um housing solutions to make sure the payment for reimbursement was quick for them as an organization to remove like an additional layer. So uh we are the relationship between housing solutions and the two providers is uh be herd is providing the services and the staffing at the location. Cre is overseeing facilities, vendors, equipment as well as security and additional staffing support. Uh and that's how we've divided it so that we can run the facility but also be mindful for um an organization like Creo that having fast turnaround on expenses and payments is important or excuse me be her not cre is significantly smaller in size than Creo's behavior health. >> Okay. And then um I know with the presser that the mayor released last month that he said Creo was going to be standing up the shelter. So it is it's Creo's facilities and so the shelter is Creo's building. They're standing it up and Beh is providing additional staffing and support for the sort of dayto-day and overnight operations. But this is a Creo's facility. they own it and they have an um you know I I don't have it specifically but they have an operating agreement where be heard is working within the building um similar to how previously you know they were working in portions with the previous ownership but it is Creo's facility >> okay and then I have a question emergency shelter that's what all the contracts say is emergency shelter what defines emergency >> so the I this slide right here when we're talking about the winter the weather. >> So, will they be reimbursed then for these nice winter these nice weather days when it's not actually declared an emergency? I'm just wondering how that's going to work with the ARPA dollars. So we so all of this has been has been open for a winter weather temporary shelter just like in the summertime where it was um day service and maybe one day it was n it was 90 degrees but one day it was 110 heat index. Um this whole time it has been allocated for winter weather because it's so unpredictable. Part of it is having a set place and um in that population saw that a lot of people are over 65. So temperatures affect people differently. What we are doing is identifying um temperatures in a plan so that does it mean additional capacity here or does it mean additional capacity needed across the system and that's that's the trigger. So, >> so wait as a clarifying question with what you're saying because I think this is maybe what you're asking about. So, in all the materials where it says like emergency shelter, you're not talking about like a declared state of weather e formally. It's like interchangeable with the phrase winter shelter and how we're talking about it. Is that the >> Yeah. So, this is a >> that may not have been your I just wondered because all the contracts state emergency shelter services and so I'm just wondering >> it is set up as an emergency temporary shelter. So it is during this winter time and it has the ability to um expand based on the need and when it becomes a life or death emergency then that triggers all shelters to expand. So this location could expand without other shelters expanding and that's what we're working up to right now is increasing space. have any um expenditures been submitted from CROS to be heard. >> So that typically happens um every 30 days and those expenditures will be submitted to housing solutions who will then submit them to grants. I don't have those yet but when we do I'll let you know. >> Yeah. Okay. And then um I'll ask one more question then pass it on because I have more questions. Um, so in in the space itself, these trailers are not ADA compliant. >> They are. >> They're not ADA. I know they're not. >> Yeah. >> But also, >> I've not seen any ADA compliance there. I know there are stairwells up to where the main, you know, where you're going to add more population and um the bathrooms are not ADA compliant downstairs. Um so that slide where you claim a winter weather operations ADA accessible and um I know that that's not the case. And then who is providing the winter weather shelter services like the pharmacy services? Who's who's doing that? >> Sure. So I just want to clarify there's a difference between compliant and accessible for ADA. This is you are correct. This location is not compliant. That means because it is temporary and that uh in order to become compliant there has to be um construction and changes to the actual building and this is a temporary location. So is it is accessible um meaning that folks have access in a wheelchair to a to a bathroom inside. If situations present themselves where someone arrives um who needs greater assistance than what can be provided there uh shelter providers work with each other to ensure that that that individual is then transported to the most appropriate location. So you are correct it is not compliant. It is accessible. Um and then >> yeah that was just that uh to meet ADA compliance like you have to do the expanded doorways and it's a significant overall. So the aim is accessibility for mobility. That's where we have restrooms on the inside for an individual who may need um you know to use the who's wheelchair bound and getting up onto the trailer would be challenging. And then we're working through the process for transfers for individuals appropriate whether that's to another shelter or another type of care facility healthcare facility. And then in regards to the pharmacy delivery, CreoS works with um a mobile pharmacy vendor um and they do routine deliveries. >> Okay. >> Have contracts been signed for both be herd and Creo with you guys? >> We have Yeah. So we have completed uh contracts with Creo and we are today executing the finalized contract with Behd. It's been some because of the changing of process here. Um we have had to work with behal on finalizing that contract. So we're quite frankly just waiting for their board to sign. >> Okay. So I have councelor Bengal Gilbert myself Archie and then we'll circle back to Dunin. Councelor Bengal. >> Yeah. Obviously I'm grateful that there's a collaboration and partnership for this specific thing. Um go back to the weather slide if you don't mind real quick. Okay. So, being a child that the the child that I am, I'm going to ask a silly question. You know, we listen to the weather, we hear like during the summer, it's going to be x amount of degrees, but the heat index is this >> or then we say it's going to be x amount of degrees during the winter, but the windchill factor is this. So is that based off measured temperature or is that with the wind chill >> or with the heat index considerations? >> Yeah. >> So >> all of the above? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. So temperatures and windchill um because sometimes you might have temperatures drop to zero, but there's no wind. Sometimes you may have temperatures at 20 with 30 mph winds and the windchill is zero. So it's going to be both. >> Okay. And moisture comes into play. Precipitation. Absolutely. Thanks. Okay, councelor Gilbert. >> Now, I had >> Is it the wet bulb temperature or the dry bulb? >> An issue in the summer. >> My question was the same uh that councelor Dutton was asking about the what's the difference between a a weather shelter and an emergency shelter. Um and most importantly, what is the is there a cost difference >> in association with each of them? Because I mean weather shelter I mean next week we're going to have temperatures up into the 70s for Christmas right? >> So the >> it's still a winter shelter is still going to be open. Correct. >> Mhm. >> Okay. So um so this shelter is going to be open from November until >> March. >> March. Okay. That's why I thought I read in Kevin's story. So um but when it becomes an emergency shelter more people are coming so is that going to change in cost? >> Yeah. So >> are you about that like you have to staff up during that time? >> So we have to staff up during that time and then you're going to have it's especially related to a lot of the vendor costs. So you're going to have increased costs for utilities and heating because you have more people and it's colder temperature. We'll have to increase the food. So the property itself we are uh we have a vendor that's providing food service because it's doesn't have a commercial kitchen. So we would have to set up and order more meals. Um we would need some add so there will be some additional costs there with just more people using the facility and then of course some staffing costs. We try to supplement as much as possible when we're in these extreme events with volunteers to try to limit the amount of you know staffing costs and of course we want to engage charitable people who want to help their neighbors. But there are some hard costs that will have to go up. If we have 250 people, we may have beyond meals, we may have to have additional security on site for that period. Um so it depends on the facility um uh in that setup and what's needed. Um but we would expect that there would be some increased cost. Just for an example, last winter um with February where we got below zero for five or six days, we had to open two facilities and essentially make 400 additional beds available to meet the needs. So, um it just depends a little bit on whether >> what was the cost for that. >> Uh I can I can get it for you. Um the you know, as we've talked about the intent of having this November to March facility open is that the the unpredictability of of what weather can do. And anytime that we've had an emergency, the responsibility has really relied on service providers to figure out a location to get it open, scrambling to get the building ready. And this allows for some continuity as we begin to look at um this one time, you know, this year as kind of a trial look at does does a winter shelter make sense? Um for example, Oklahoma City's winter shelter opens, I think, in October and goes through March or April. and it's open o at night only for 300 people um every night that span of time. So really looking at how how can um you have something that is consistent um given the unpredictability of the weather and that doesn't put so much burden on service providers to for example have outreach going out getting people offering rides but then staffing overnight and so they're just in this constant grind but you've got some regular uh staff and then and then have the ability to provide some expanded service opportunities. So, I just want to thank you for doing this and this is the first time I do believe that the city has put something together like this. Um and so using ARPA dollars for it, is there any way that we can get a um an assessment line by line of how much of those um the ARPA money how it's being used and how much we have left so that we can keep an eye on it as we move forward into um the first of the year and kind of watch. >> Yeah. um as soon as we get the the um invoices for this first month, be happy to share it. >> Okay, perfect. Thank you. That's actually part of the contract is that um the line by line have to for federal reimbursement. Well, that's that kind of tees up what I >> Yeah, cuz I just want to make sure that we keep an eye on it so that especially with this being the first time that we've that we've done this that are we looking at another budget amendment coming to us um to to help uh close out the cost. So, um I just want to be as we're being responsible of helping others. Um I just want to make sure that we're being fiscally um responsible in this process. >> Absolutely. Well, and that kind of tees up what I was thinking about or I want to say to my colleagues going back to the last agenda item tied in with this where we know that this the harbor like idea is optimally going to be launching by the end of next year, but like I think their phase one probably does not there's so much work to do on that building probably does not get us to a winter shelter in that space next year. So we're probably doing something some iteration of what's happening this year next year. So to me I was just been thinking a lot about right those costs or cost efficiencies. Um, and it was kind of curious like knowing that whatever spend has happened so far hasn't included a severe weather event, which I was kind of looked up like, you know, statistically those aren't super common in November, but I get wanting to be ready like um so then when like if here's a like kind of hypothetical question for this year and then helping us think through costs for next year, what we might need to do again next year, hoping that two years from now we're in a really different position because of having this old juvenile detention space ready to But um say the re like the cost so far were like a third of the total money that was allocated and we haven't had an extreme weather event yet. What happened like what happens if we run out of the money before like you know February or something which I think is super feasible especially if we like you know understandably you're you know we're retroactively reimbursing. I know there's I'm sure a budget set but I also know what you were just saying if we have to scale up. Well, when does the ARPA money have to be spent? >> Um, we have we have a an internal date of August for and then for budgeting >> 26, >> but end of August 26, >> but I could see with just like the operation, you know, what it takes to have people there 24/7 >> and then if we're scaling up like by whatever fold for unknown numbers of days, I could see the ARPA money getting spent down >> well before March. Just being realistic. What what are we thinking? >> It better be. >> Well, yes, but but then but that is what pays for this to keep happening for a weather emergency. And so I think some of so housing solutions has gone through a really significant budgeting process in this and part of the uh ability the flexibility in that 50 to 60 of beds of okay if we get month one returns um and weather's looking warmer than anticipated. We don't need to open up additional beds. we can hold on that until temperatures drop and then open up additional beds as well. >> We're also as we're getting into the operations looking for cost reductions. So like volunteers that maybe want to come in and serve a meal and if we're able to schedule that out routinely does that res reduce some of our food vendor costs. Those are you know every little dollar counts and taking in donated items or like gee this is really helpful on some of the utility costs. So we know you know you we're talking about severe weather and there can be costs that you know come out of nowhere. Um and so trying to find ways to mitigate costs. It's also part of the reason on the the planning for expanding in January and February, not expanding too soon and exhausting the dollars until where we historically see the coldest temperatures are, you know, through January and then certainly February is where we consistently have a very very cold snap. So is since we know to your point about those trends is there what's the I'm just again this is me thinking for like next year knowing that we're going to have another year of figuring this out would we do start in November again probably or would we revisit I'm just trying to think of what we need to budget for >> I don't know um you know we started November 17th and so could it go to December 1st possibly and it was either 24 or 23 we had we opened emergency shelter in December >> um for weather for cold and snow. So, >> you know, I I definitely think you're right. It is so unpredictable. Um and then you can you get those 70 80 days in January and then the next day you're you are freezing. So, I think that being able to look back after this long stretch since this is the first time that we've done this. Um and then looking at when we when service providers have had to try to open space in the past few years and making some adjustments based on that will be >> um important. >> The only other consideration I would add is it depends on the facility and the operator. So, if we have a facility that needs to have significant updates or work or there needs to be some lead time to do that as well as time in order to hire and train staff to have because, you know, when we're talking about expanded shelter for uh a multi-month effort, we're going to want to hire staff for that period. So, you know, at least probably two week lead time to hire set up the stage. It could be different if it's a different type of facility that is like just ready to go and not looking too closely at Jeff for turn on uh turn it on right away. But with this facility because it had been recently have been acquired and needed to be set up and the staffing need to happen, we needed a longer runway. >> Okay. Councelor Archie. >> Yeah. Um I think the majority of my questions have been answered through this the conversations happening here. I you know I'm just curious. Um, my understanding is TPS, uh, they will not let their kids out for recess if it's below 40. And my my kids go to, uh, Coast Public Schools. And, um, I was reading on the CDC's website that, you know, below 40 degrees, if it's raining, there's a possibility of hypothermia. And so, obviously, um, there's a trade-off. There's a trade-off when it comes to 32 degrees. you know, are we expanding more or less? But >> I'm just curious, you know, um, Director Hall, you said not all of our unhoused residents have those necessary hats and clothes and gloves. Um, you know, I'm just concerned if it's raining outside and it's like if it's on that bubble, you know, 35 degrees, 36 degrees, you know, how are we are we thinking about expanding if if there are additional conditions that may put people at risk, >> given the fact that that may cost us more, I guess. Yeah, you said that >> I definitely I mean there's some there's some wiggle room and flexibility in that and looking at at um the impact to our vulnerable population and making that decision versus having a hard stop temperature. Um so again, these are just some scenarios that were used this spring or not spring, January, February um and what we're kind of gauging, but there is some flexibility. It would be great to be able to have um space and the financial resources to just open up and say, "Okay, it doesn't matter whether it's 32, we're not having to look at temperatures, weather conditions, but here is a space open." Um so we don't have that. Um so really just working working with what we have and an understanding of what where the the triggers have been pulled before and making adjustments as we go. >> Yeah. Yeah, cuz I I you councelor Bangle asked a similar question I think. Is that right? >> Yeah. >> Okay, councelor D or sorry, were you done council? >> 30 degrees feels different when you're wet. >> Yeah, absolutely. And and I think councelor also it speaks to the need for us to continue with uh safe move Tulsa and ending street sleeping and getting um at a at a faster rate as possible getting more people off of the street. >> That's the concern. That's the concern. And I I know we're going late on time. People are leaving. Uh but with >> She calls me out. [laughter] >> I know. He wasn't even on camera. He was doing the polite. Sorry. >> I leave sometimes early, too. >> Um with ART3, with many of these programs that are I think are going to do great, you know, that are funded, you know, one time. How do we think about keeping them around if they're effective? >> Exactly. Yeah. need ongoing revenue resources. >> Um I would just add to that or this is like a thought related to these kind of like weather etc questions is we also know separate from those that are street sleeping and need longer term housing solutions. Um that there's also when there's yeah I know it's hard to say a phrase like that when I'm really plugging someone's organization. Um I um we also know that like during severe weather events, especially with different strains on like the grid or things like that that people could lose electricity or we just had like you know all of Midtown out for a while the other night like if it had been colder night and so then you also have people that are in need of really similar resources during just like a cold snap because their home lost heat, electricity, etc. So, I'm just like kind of putting a pin in that thought, too, where there's like these, you know, it's thinking I'm just thinking through what's the criteria of this weather happens and we're going to have to activate a few different things including for people that we know can't safely be in their home during that time if they have one. So, there's there's a lot of layers there. >> Um, and I know some of that comes into play with like what then you have more safety issues of people trying to use space heaters or all sorts of other things that cause fires. And there's I think there's a lot of layers that makes me think through like what's the weather criteria that activates what resources. I'm sure there's some city has a rubric somewhere. >> I I will and Chief Baker is an interesting person to talk about this and I don't have the stat. >> He's a very interesting person. >> He's a very interesting person, a big fan, but he noted that with additional shelter activation last year that in previous years and I don't have our data from him, the number of fire response that they had to do in like abandoned buildings or from people's trying to start fires to stay warm was significantly reduced. And so which you know that's what we care about too is public safety as well. Um so if we don't have people trying to survive in abandoned buildings or in their own homes when they don't have heat because these spaces are provided there's a significant public safety as well as you know public infrastructure public private property uh savings that happens there as well. >> Makes sense counselor D. >> Yeah. So um I would be interested in getting the cost for standing up the shelters for last year with the dream center and the Rose Bowl. um what that combination was for January because I think we had two events in January. >> Uh January and February, >> right? Okay. So, if we could get a an idea of the cost for that, um I think it would be helpful to give us [clears throat] an idea how far the money is actually going to go. Um I also was wondering about the administrative cost. Um what does that look like? We're looking at 60 people right now. What does the administrative cost look like right now? >> Do you mean what are we paying housing solutions or what do you mean by budget? You mean >> with the budget? Yeah. >> Do you mean staffing overhead or for direct versus direct services >> for both? >> So I think um I can't say that right now. I we there is a breakout in the reporting that we do to the city on sort of direct administrative and some of those other costs. So that that's available. um housing solutions unless we have a direct cost is not >> not taking any additional dollars out of this contract. >> And then do you know what the cost is right now per day with 60 people? >> Uh no I once have those um expenses I'll be able to give you to give you that. >> Okay. Because I I know that the food cost itself is almost 2,000 a day. My understanding >> it's Yeah. And food costs can be significant because it's prepared off site and then delivered. And we have looked at again trying to be as reasonable as possible. How can we do um you know non-heated meals so we can do one delivery a day? Those can be you know given to someone whenever they need it and then doing a hot meal at the end of the night. So like all of those types of things that really g you know we we want to provide a safe place for people to live but to stretch every dollar. >> Right. Okay. And then um which is fair. I I totally get that. So I was also wondering how many um staff people that you guys anticipate for client. >> So um I do have that information for you that right now it is uh depending one to 10 so 10 to 20 staff members per I'm sorry 10 to 20 people per one staff member depending on time of day and activity. So, at night when people are sleeping, there's fewer staff members than during the day. Uh, and that and when you get to that 10 to 20, um, you could have case managers on site. You could have other sorts of, um, service providers on site as well. >> Okay. And then the security aspect, that's provided by >> Creo. They're on site 247. And then I was also wondering smoke alarms, carbon monoxide. >> Yeah. >> Creo. Yep. Creops worked with um fire department and they did walkthroughs together and made prior to opening made any um adjustments that fire department asked for. >> Okay. >> Hard wiring, smoke detectors, things like that. >> Okay. >> Sounds good. And I'm still confused on what emergency looks like as opposed to winter shelter. I I know that I've been going through the contracts and so they all say emergency shelter and so I'm just wondering if >> so this is a temporary emergency shelter, right? And there is an additional level of emergency when everyone needs needs to clear the streets because it becomes a life or death. I may be in a situation where I'm wet. It's 40 degrees, but I've been out overnight. I'm wet. I'm freezing. I can tell like hypothermia. I'm not appropriately dressed. That's an emergency for me. This shelter provides access for me. Um >> versus Yes. a a true declared weather emergency that's coming. >> I think that's probably like a little bit of like the different vernacular. a lot of homeless facilities >> for capital A versus whatever. >> Well, I just want to make sure that everybody gets reimbured per definition, you know, because I don't want I would hate for be here to have to submit um expenses and then not be reimbursed because of the differentiation between winter shelter. Yeah. >> Or or just shelter >> there there won't be any of that. Don't worry about that concern because there has been a a an ask and a um it is covered under grant through grants and the definition of what this is that this shelter standing up from no mid November through March um meets those definitions and so >> are those FEMA definitions? >> No. Uhuh. >> Okay. Does any of that entail female FEMA? >> Nothing is attached to FEMA here. >> Okay. Thank you. Appreciate it. >> Okay. Anything else on this one? All right. Thank you all so much. >> Thank you. >> Let us know how much it costs a month later and then we'll figure it out for next year. [laughter] >> Um Okay. Um just keeping people safe. All right. We are on agenda item 10. Discussion regarding council confirmation. Oh. Whoa. Yeah. You recusing yourself? No. Presenting to your own name on your confirmation of Sarah Davis, council administrator to serve as a council staff representative on the loan committee for the Tulsa Housing Impact Fund IOT3 housing funds. So, just to give a little public overview on this, um, this is the IOT375 million in housing funds. The council within the last couple of months has, um, approved the economic incentive policy around those funds and also has um, approved the first budget amendment of close to $14 million into those funds. So, um, when HPN was here, they gave you an overview of the structure. There's a loan committee and there's a board of directors for HPN. Um, your economic incentive policy that you approved has two seats for the city um on the loan committee. One is for a mayor's staff member and one is for a council staff member. Um, we wrote in that policy that the council would need to approve that staff member. That's for transparency so everybody understands who that person is. The two city staff members also have what we were calling pretty informally internal controls um on functions that we would need to perform like making sure you're aware of community engagement opportunities um checking on um if somebody has been a good actor in our um system, code enforcement, paying water bills on time, etc. So those are the obligations of the city staff members on that committee. Um Jeff is here in case you have more questions about the loan committee or or those functions. >> No questions for me. It's going to be a very close vote. I think >> it's my prediction. >> Yeah. Thank you. >> Just a lightning rod of a decision. >> Yes. Thank you for your ongoing attention to detail. >> You're welcome. >> Willing to [laughter] continue sitting in meetings. All right. Well, in that is anything else on this one? All right. Item 11, we are adjourned. Thank you, everybody.