could you please do take roll council member Cole here councilmember schweer Harry Mr Wong here council member nordby here mayor mangy here yeah I just didn't know where the wire was coming from you want to go through or do you want to yeah go ahead and take it from here thank you so moved second okay I don't know if we had to read it before we adopt it sorry no I'm still learning yep all right go ahead all right thank you bear um tonight uh topic is the community center discussion um kind of the background is staff's been working with the world architect group and lobbyists from Larkin and Hoffman on the community center project world will present on their draft feasibility analysis to improve the facility Larkin Hoffman will provide an overview of their efforts to Lobby state and local government for potential funding to support the city's efforts in revitalizing the community center Brandi will start off with just a quick timeline of uh what we've seen with the community center to get us up to now and I'll turn that over to Brandy our community development director please hi everybody um there was some questions from our new council members as to some of the background of the community center so I took some time doing some research because it's fairly new to me too how how this building came to be and you know how it came to be where it is today so I looked at Old lease agreements city council meeting minutes packets um since the beginning of time and whatever other files I could find in the in the folder so it's a really a rather quick um timeline prep so I don't have a ton of details on these items if you have questions that we need to dig into I can do that at a at a later time but what I know is that the community center was built in 9192 primarily as a fitness and recreation facility and it was doing well in that capacity until about I think around 2000 when there was some concerns with maybe membership quantities there were some Renovations I'm not entirely sure what they were in 2004 and 2007 of um in the amount of 2.8 million there was a focus group that our former mayor Furlong was on in 2009 and I believe that the purpose of that was to try to determine how to better serve the needs of citizens in a digital format versus paper sort of dealing with memberships then in 2010 the school district entered into an agreement to operate the polar den which was a coffee shop and a commercial baking class and then in 2010 the county library entered into an agreement with the city as well at that time they contributed for the design and the construction of the library portion of the building and that lease agreement is in place still and it will terminate in 2030. a joint Powers agreement was put into place between the city and Maplewood for recreation programming in 2010 and 2012 is when the city council started to take a hard look at the at the facility in terms of what it cost what it was bringing in and some of the Deferred maintenance items and there was also a policy Citywide that was kind of put on the books that was intended to reduce overall expenditures by 250 000 each year over three years and so in 2012 the way they did that was by reducing or eliminating two police officers and then 2013 was when they focused on the community center the city then prepared a economic assessment report that was put together by an intern at the time and that ultimately ultimately recommended the repurposing of that facility and then from there they explored repurposing the community center and they engaged with this school district as a potential leaseholder and then in 2013 the school district into a Elise with the with the city and so the intended uses of that lease were after school activities Recreation Service Learning adult education another Community type Partnerships like the scouts or others and that that least I guess vacated or terminated in 2014 that's when the school district vacated the property and then it was turned over to Ability academic Athletics which I believe is the hockey facility so I said okay and so they held a lease for a couple of years and then they said led to kokoro volleyball will grow volleyball has its own sublease with a holistic Wellness and in 2017 the hockey association's least terminated are they asked to terminate it before it was done for a fee of 25 25 000 so they got out of it by paying an appraisal was done in 2019 and it was valued at that point for 2.4 million a couple of purchase offers came in one from shivsky's for 950 000 kokoro had a an unofficial offer to purchase the building it was very detailed and it had a lot of here's what the expenditures are for the city here's what the taxation could be um it wasn't an official offer though so I'm just kind of putting this in here as an FYI if you want to have more information I can provide it but ultimately um the city council in 2021 decided that we should keep the building and not sell it and that was approved by a 401 41 vote and since then last fall we have engaged wool to prepare facility assessment which they'll present momentarily and then we've also engaged with lobbyists from Larkin and Hoffman and they're lobbying for us on our behalf to see if we can get some funding from the state and federal government for improvements to the building that is all I have any questions for me do we for 91.92 was what's the original price for the community center do we know I don't have that information of the build price yeah the whole sorry I don't have that it's like 1.4 or something like that does that sound about right let me close yeah um 2004 to 2002.8 was put in to it I'm I do not remember 2007 yeah I guess we're going with the proposal does that sound Ron okay I don't remember that I think I pulled that factoid from another PowerPoint presentation about the timeline of the community center so I didn't have any hard document to to really put that number down all right thank you appreciate it you're welcome hi hello welcome thank you thank you guys for having me mayor and Council um all right we're up on screen wonderful um so as as Brandi mentioned oh yep sorry thank you are you with please Paige Sullivan from old Architects and Engineers thank you and as Brandy mentioned we were brought on by the city to complete a facility assessment and do some long-range planning for the community center so today what we're going to go through since we've been meeting now with the core group for um since about October October November time frame we want to give you guys all an update about what we've you know come to understand about the facility so we're going to review some guiding principles that we created as a group to kind of give us a set standards for the process moving forward so we have something to always go back and check our work make sure we're sticking to these goals and guiding principles we're going to go through a brief overview of the facility assessment that we completed we're going to talk about the engagement strategy which is kind of our next steps on this process in the long-range planning we're going to give a quick schedule update and then talk all the next steps please stop me I'm just going to go through but please stop me if you have any questions at all so to start out the goals and guiding principles so as a group we kind of work together to understand what we want to get out of this process what the community center should be so goal number one is the true cost of operating the facility must match or exceed the community's interest it must be justifiable to City's residents number two is the facility should promote the potential Parks and Recreation Department and become an asset that they could then manage and operate and then the third one would be the project should build on the momentum of the resident engagement sessions to create relevant and usable community space so we've heard that those sessions have been really wonderful and we're hoping to continue some of those sessions as well for this long-range planning looking at the facility assessment so members from Wold we've got Architects mechanical engineers and electrical engineers we all went out to the community center with Ron and really walked through the whole Space we looked at some plans beforehand so we're prepared and then we just kind of looked around and made a huge list of everything that we saw so some of those things that we saw just from an architectural site and exterior standpoint I'm sure a lot of you are aware of the failures that are occurring at the exterior envelope so there's a you know quite a few holes and the exterior insulation system is starting to fail in numerous spots there's an original roof to the facility that needs to be replaced it's at the end of its useful life a lot of the glazing systems the windows curtain walls are starting to fail as well which is causing a lot of water penetration into the facility and then there's some just minor brick repair and Tuck pointing so some of the masonry on the building is is starting to crumble slightly so it needs to be maintained there's some some water penetration there as well that's starting to show um and actually some of the holes in the exterior are allowing animals and rodents to get into the facility so Ron and his team is doing a great job of dealing with some of that at the interior of the building a lot of cosmetic issues that you know you'd kind of expect to see in a facility that's been as used as this one over the years so you know case work flooring all showing signs of wear as you'll see from these couple images on the screen there is water damage that is visible at the ceilings so this is what you see you know at the ceilings but then above that ceiling there is water penetration visible there as well there's damage to the gymnasium floor that we've received photos of and we've heard that that is now covered by the gym flooring but that's pretty significant that's there and then just you know normal wear and tear on the building and non-ada accessible spaces as well that you know could cause issues in the future uh more kind of at a grander scale the mechanical systems although Ron and his team and the city have done a lot of work repairing and keeping things keeping things going there are some larger mechanical items that are going to come up soon so the building automation system is one of those items and then the Aging rooftop units and distribution of ductwork all aging and will need to be maintained moving forward the electrical systems as well there has been a move towards LED in the facility but we need to look at all of the lighting to be replaced with LED and low voltage controls although the gymnasium has been done there's still several areas that have not been updated yet and then there's just some required maintenance on some of the emergency power systems and different electrical equipment that's in the facility so looking at all this information as I mentioned we have a list of everything that we saw we went through with the core group and we prioritized you know what needs to be done in zero to two years we talk about being a priority one so those items are you know life safety issues that need to be completed right away we did not find any of those major life safety issues so that is a good thing but then deteriorating items so if you let something go and it's going to further cause further damage to other areas of the building those things you want to take care of right away so that would be in this priority one zero to two year time frame health issues rooms with no ventilation that would be something that would want to be done immediately and then accessibility issues that go along with accessing the building and then circulation within the building and restrooms and things like that that the public you know would come in contact with right away those things are all things you want to address right away then we go to Priority two items so those are a little bit you know less critical to be done immediately so it's just kind of one step below there so we're talking things like energy items that would result in a payback of 10 years or less systems costs that would require maintenance or replacement within five years and then just some modernization comes here as well in this level two priority two category then we go further into a priority three which would be the six to ten year time frame so what we're doing here is we're kind of setting up a 10-year plan if you will so the things that you'd want to get done in the six to ten year time frame would be system upgrades Energy System upgrades that would require payback in or result in a pay back of more than 10 years and then material costs or materials and systems that currently function but would require replacement in that six to ten year time frame health issues that might not have been been flagged by health code but would want to be addressed that would occur here as well and then removal of any items affected by other changes occurring would all all happen in that priority three time frame and then priority four items are the aesthetic items so things that really aren't affecting how the building functions but you know you want your building to look nice obviously so those things would all be in that priority four category and then moving forward so now that we've completed that phase um you know we've completed the phase but it's still kind of a work in progress because although we've identified all of these things that the laundry list of things that the building needs until you know what program is going to go in the building how the building's going to function it's not really realistic to just say we're going to tackle all of these things right now so now this second phase of the project is kind of the long range planning and so at this point what we've done is we have worked together with the core group to identify potential users of of the space who's who's going to be most likely to maybe rent out space or or hold community events in this space so we've started to identify potential partners and so we've worked together to create a list based on current business owners in the city of North St Paul and then we've gone through and kind of given a level of of interest that we would think that people would have these potential users and then our plan would be to go out and meet with these potential users and talk with them about the space and generate some ideas really about what what they would use in a community center what they could see that the community might need after that once we have a list once we've met with all of these groups we would expect that we would probably come back to council and you know present again based on what we've just what we've identified that's kind of an optional thing so we just have it on there as optional because we could then go straight to what we're calling and what we've you know heard as the community inspiration Forum so at that point once we've identified what spaces that we think would make sense in the community center then we could bring it to the community and really have the community come in let us know if those spaces are of interest to them and how they would use those spaces to get people excited so it's you know we were setting up a framework of what the facility could be and then we're inviting people to come and comment on on that and then there'd be further engagement with Council and the core group throughout the whole process that we're doing that uh so our next steps since we've got the facility assessment behind us would be identifying the possible use so that would be through those Outreach meetings that I just mentioned and then further Core group discussions once we have these possible uses we would look at programming and assessing the needs of the facility based on that new programming and then we'd work on some options development which I'm sure is what everyone really wants to see is what's this going to look like so then we could do an additional workshop at that time to present some of the options that we come up with we could then bring those to the community inspiration Forum to get feedback from the community once we have something for them to really see and dig their teeth into then we'd foresee probably another Council Workshop as I mentioned then we'd understand budget really at that point once we have a use and here's what the facility could be then we can identify exactly what needs to be done to make it usable for the program and then ultimately it'd be a council approval to move forward with whatever we come up with during those Community inspiration and Outreach meetings so looking at a draft schedule of what that would all mean we started the core planning meetings kind of kicked things off in October of 2022 and we've been meeting pretty consistently through this these last several months use identification we kind of started that that's kind of what the building could be possibly used for kind of started that in December and then we are planning to keep moving that forward through April that would include some of those you know community outreach meetings and you know user potential partner meetings that brings us then this Council update is the March 2023 Council update we would expect that we would have Design Concepts ready in about May of this year then be able to hold public engagement around June of this year revise things and re-engage in July and then ultimately Council approval in August of this year that is what we have for you today so I'm happy to go back to anything hear questions any questions anyone good job Paige thank you thank you thanks very good so then we'll be broken down as far as to get up to a certain level and then what the programs are going to be is that because it sounds to me like there's there's system things no matter what to get it up to a building that is workable as far as ventilation and everything else and then the other part of it is to figure out what's going to happen on the if there's remodeling for certain programs or things like that correct yes um three of us are new as far as council members so yes we weren't involved in your your price is that is is that a total bid for this is this the package bid for them to do the analysis here okay yes the long-range planning and the facility assessment all of that was packaged under our scope of work so um you know we're done with the facility assessment part but what comes next is really going to inform what needs to be done from the facility assessment standpoint right away and like you mentioned you know once you start tearing down walls and whatnot some of that facility maintenance deferred maintenance items gets eaten up in a potential construction project because once you're tearing down walls you're you're affecting ceilings and all the kind of aesthetic things are going to get addressed at that point mechanical systems then fall into that realm as well so exterior envelope that kind of stuff that would be something that as long as you're not touching the exterior those numbers might not change but as far as anything on the on the interior those are going to really depend on what's going in there and part of The Proposal is to have something alongside the building that's animals can't get into yes as far as not the same stuff that's on there now uh We've yes we have discussed that and that's what we are looking at in our facility assessment we did provide numbers for a metal panel instead of the exterior insulation system that's on there currently because repairing that is it's pretty difficult it can be done but it's pretty difficult and you know animals got in there once they might be able to get in there again so based on discussions that we had with the core Planning Group we decided to look at a metal panel solution instead so the numbers that we have in our facility assessment right now do look at replacing with metal panel thank you yes any other questions just want to thank you for your presentation I know you've been working with us for you know a while now and um you know I really appreciate your engagement strategies and efforts and I I really look forward to what the community has to say and I think we've heard some before but definitely looking forward to how they're going to shape this so thank you yes thank you so much thanks thanks Paige next up we'd like to have uh Larkin and Hoffman we have Grady here to speak to that welcome Brady foreign Mr mayor council members um Grady harm with Larkin Hoffman and Margaret vessel our director of government relations so just giving you a brief update today on the current status of where things are at the legislature I'm sure some of you have followed the Press but um we are kind of on the ground every day and want to give you a quick update on that and then we'll talk about the bills that we have introduced for the city and kind of the next steps there so I'll turn it over to Margaret good evening Mr Mayor and council members Again Margaret vessel director of government relations with Larkin Hoffman it's a pleasure to be here this evening we are your representation at the Minnesota state capitol so I'm just going to go kind of high level and then I'll turn it over to Grady and he could talk about the bills specific as you may all know sessions started on January it feels like June January 3rd of this year at that time we had a budget surplus of 17.6 billion dollars a lot of that was one-time money but it certainly meant that the state was in good economic health and everyone was encouraged what that meant and then of course with the elections in November um we had what what people are calling the trifecta so the governor governor walls is of the Democrat Party the Senate uh has a one volt majority um for Democrats in the Senate and then the house has a five vote majority um with Democrats being in charge so all three bodies are controlled by the Democrats and I will say they hit the ground running um if I look tired it's because I am we have passed a ridiculous amount of bills in a very very short time as of I think as of yesterday there were over 2 700 bills introduced between the uh in in either in either body that is probably that is numbers that we've not seen ever before um it's just they're they're introducing a ton of bills and um and the bills are being moved and and heard and moved out of committee I would argue that this is they're moving bills at a rate of four times as fast as they have in years past so again it's it's it's a pace that um people are struggling to keep up with but the reality is is that this new group that has kind of taken over is um they're they're raring to go and they really are hungry to to get some things done and we did see that in the month of January they passed four major bills um and so now we kind of are in the committee process um the February forecast came out at the end of February and that revealed that we have a 17.5 budget a billion dollar budget surplus that number might sound weird um but actually we did gain some money but in the for the first time in over 20 years the state is now accounting for inflation so we actually had about a 1.5 billion dollar addition to our Surplus but because of again because of the accounting for inflation they will be using 17.5 to balance the budget and and pass a bill by the end of May um first bill deadline is actually this uh Friday or this Friday it's the March 10th and that means that it the bills have to be a bill has to be out of a policy committee um by the end of the in one body by the end of this month um a way that they've kind of gotten around that is a lot of the bills are a lot of the Committees are Finance committees so this is really relating to policy only so if you have a pure policy bill you would have to be out of one body in either the house or the Senate by this Friday the second Bill deadline is actually in 14 days after that so the 24th of March again that would be a policy bill that would have to be out of all policy committees technically in after the 24th policy committees should be shutting down but again many if not all are both finance and policy committees so I suspect that we'll still have the same number of hearings or committees meeting I should say and then third Bill deadline which is when they have to pass out their Omnibus bills are the respective committees is April 4th that is the Tuesday before Passover which I believe Passover begins at uh I think dusk on on the fourth so they'll be on break it's traditionally a spring break typically we have usually like a 10-day um I'll call it spring break for lobbyists and legislators this year that was kind of cut down so we'll be back on the 11th uh kind of and that at that point my my guess is they'll be moving bills off of the floor and going into a conference committee type scenario which is also going to be new because due to covid and just tough things have worked in the last at least specifically the last three to four years we haven't seen the traditional um conference committee process where they've actually sat down went through the side by sides and worked out the differences in public so this will be a newer experience for some of the newer lobbyists and certainly for the new legislators uh yesterday or last night you might have read the house was able to pass out their bonding Bill packages they had two bills the Geo bill which is the general obligation bill was about 1.5 billion dollars and it passed by 91 to 43. that bill needs a super majority to pass in both bodies and then the cat they had a cash bill as well and that bill was about 393 million dollars that bill is just a simple majority that you need to pass and that bill actually passed with 98 to 36. so there are um now those bills will now go to the Senate um and I don't know again if you've been watching the news at all the Senate Republicans did a press conference I believe within the last couple of days where they said that they are not going to put up any votes uh for a general obligation bill um until they get kind of a tax relief package for all minnesotans so what that means is the seven votes that are needed in the Senate from the Republicans are they're being hung up if you will so bonding at this time is certainly uncertain the um the plan was because of last year's uh I'll call it a meltdown but just things just kind of falling apart at the end of last session and they not they're not passing a bonding bill there's a number of projects that kind of has it's there's a backlog and so they wanted to do a early Bill and then go into a and then do a second bill at the end of this um at the end of this session now the reality is my guess is they will negotiate one big Bill towards the end of the session and it'll be part of kind of a larger package so I don't anticipate us seeing a general obligation bonding Bill however we could see them Pass the Cash Bill pretty easily if they wanted to because again that's a simple majority uh they are constitutionally mandated to join to adjourn on May 22nd so there is some time there is talks of them um uh maybe finishing early I will tell you in my 25 plus years I I think I've only seen it once and it's only been bad days so we'll see um if they can accomplish that but it'll be um it's certainly going to be an interesting time to not only be a lobbyist but to to be a legislator and and city government because every you know everything they do impacts the things that you do so with that I'll turn over Grady to talk about your bills thanks Margaret Mr Mayor and council members um as Margaret said this bonding bill that passed last night for the most part was was primarily bills items that didn't get done last session so we'll be working to try and work on the two bills that we have introduced for you to incorporate them into the the final bill that's passed so I'll talk a little bit about the two bills that we worked with Brian and with Brandy um and Craig to draft up um one is a bill for the community center so the north North Saint Paul Community Multicultural Outreach Center currently the bill language is for four million four million dollars appropriation either in in general obligation bonds or cash and we are continuing to meet the both bills have been introduced they have Bill numbers in both the house and the Senate um the Senate author is um is Senator Zhang and then the house author on both bills is representative Lilly so we're continuing to work with them as we get through this process um to refine our requests if we have any changes there will be opportunities to go in and amend some of the language so we'll continue to work with with the city to address those points the second bill that we have introduced is for the trail and that's currently for a five million dollar request for the Silver Lake Trail and again we'll continue to work with the city to to further refine that request as we have more information um I think just to touch base a little bit on some of the other efforts we had both authors into the city um and we talked about the projects developed with Brandy and and Brian two pagers on the project that we're marketing throughout the legislature um and we are looking forward we've got where the senator Pappas who's the chair of the bonding committee will be touring a different project in a different city near here the date was rescheduled due to the Blizzard a few weeks ago and so we're working to try and get her to drop by the city for a quick briefing to talk about our bills um additionally um there will be opportunities as we go forward to engage the council and the mayor if if we want to either attend committee meetings have there will be some hearings typically in the bonding committees they're brief so it's about a two-minute presentation on your project but we'll be keeping you in the loop as we have opportunities to do that lastly just a little bit on the federal request is we have a represent we have Megan Knight on our team in DC we've been working to put together a request for Congressional a congressional spending request I believe that amount is three million dollars and we recently had a call with council member Wong and um Brian and um Brandi I guess the whole team and the chief of staff to congresswoman McCollum to talk about the importance of this request so with that I guess turn it over to you guys for any questions that we can can address a quick question I was kind of curious of that 2700 bills that they're introduced is that is that all new for this year or was that everything that was in the queue as well yeah Mr Mayor um right and council members yes uh those are brand new bills so we are in the what's known as the first year of the biennium so the bills that get introduced this year will be I'll call them live for this year and next year um but anything that was introduced last year is I guess for lack of a better term dead um so these are all brand new bills that have been introduced um you know keep in mind the legislature had a huge turnover and so there are 70 some new members that have really hit the ground running as I said earlier and so these are yeah some of them are ideas that have rolled over because not a lot of things happened at the end of last session but certainly there are a lot of new ideas that have come up as well thank you thank you for your work I know that there's a lot going on it sounds like um and uh you know look Hope crossing my fingers and and thanks for your work again thank you and it's been a pleasure to work with you guys and we look forward to uh keeping you up to speed and seeking any opportunities to get you in front of members of the legislature to to push forward these projects thank you thank you thank you time for dinner any other business can you take over nothing further mayor do we want to have a discussion a little bit more about the community centers okay do you uh we're new so any information you can give us as far as there's a community center with animals in it that we're on is uh summer friendly it's a zookeeper as well yes so when I think of some so as far as the community center I was looking at these some of these numbers hopefully get some more answers on that just to kind of get an idea of what it was originally you know when we come time to understand numbers back forth what original what that uh 2.8 was during that time just to kind of get an idea of where where it's at if you were you were on the um the meeting as far as with Walden that is there anything else you would think would be good to bring up at this time Ewan we think about that but okay Tim do you have anything to add there I think from day one Lisa and I have been on the community center in some aspect or another whether it have been working with its current tenant to negotiate a lease to determine the the value of the property to um take a look at um costs to to repair to Band-Aid to all the way down to demolish we went through as Brandy pointed out two offers that were that were put forward and neither one of them were incredibly feasible for the city at the time based on what the value of the property is worth the property does hold the generator for Public Works is that right as well as the wiring the uh the the fiber optics um as well as there is a 30-year lease with the county um that they believe they give us a dollar a year for the property but in turn they they had invested money into the construction of the building to the you to the space that they utilize so in the event that um we in essence break our lease with them or don't provide additional space um I think the numbers have flooded around anywhere between a half a million and three quarters of a million dollars that the city would be liable for I don't remember where we where we settled um but do you remember thank you so in that was in there yeah yeah um I mean we've got we've got a lot of time in time and energy into it I really haven't drawn a conclusion as to what the community center may or may not look like going forward the project of Wold in actually somewhat was done in Reverse of how they normally do things due to legislative session due to the need to attempt to get bills introduced to gain and Garner funding for it they completely flip-flopped it usually the money comes at the end but it was recognized and identified that there was a budget surplus within the state so that's kind of why the why it's been done in reverse and so we're we are now really just getting into the proper process in which they go through to determine the feasibility the need who the tenants would be what the community looks for um and I do know that they had it one if not more Community meetings one of them was here and it was very well attended and the overwhelming desire to what was to retain might not be this community center but a community center within the community it was deemed as an asset so whether it be this building or another building located within the city the residents desires to maintain something and so what I think Wold is helping us do right now is identify what that building or what that facility would look like what its uses would look like and it was unfortunate that we kind of got the cart in front of the horse and started looking at the at the dollars before we determined the need in the usage any any I would say also one thing to note too is we do have a current tenant and their lease is up in June I believe so that's something also to remember as well is the is the lease annually so do we renew it every year exactly sure he's actually building a new building in Lake Elmo the guy who's leasing it now so if he when I talk to him I did a little tour over there when I talked to him it would be if he expands his program to men's volleyball there may be a need for it during the summer so it wouldn't be a real counted on lease I don't think right now actually at this point we are going to lose our tenant on a full capacity it sounds like to me you agree yes moving forward he would just want to rent actual volleyball space right now he takes the upstairs and the downstairs with the chiropractor and they have workout rooms this would strictly be for their team coming in and using the just the volleyball courts okay and go ahead when I was out campaigning of course this is a this is a Hot Topic to talk about out there because as far as understanding how when it was built the position the where it was built at being kind of wedged in a corner like that and the weird shape of the lot and just having to pull the plug on it in 2012 is a regular Community Center so there's been quite a bit of feedback back and forth when out there so as a council I be in a new politician I understand we're coming in as far as this Project's been going on but you know we'll all have to look at it with being able to figure out the numbers and understand where it's at because it's something where we're inheriting but we just have to get caught up with it so I'm glad we got this information today so I want to ask if this process that they did is a is a bid which I thought I remember hearing it was so it's understanding and just seeing what the need is for it there's a need of a couple other places that have thought maybe different Community project can happen inside that building but it's to get the building up to in my mind the way I look at it and I did a tour and I did sit in one time for your meeting when you were out and I'm the one that actually brought up that siding because the squirrels were going through it can't really needs to have some other kind of a not just fix that so that's going to add to it but understand the whole get it to this position and from there it can be redone to do that I understand maybe you knock down a few walls it may save a few things or may add a few things which I think I'd probably add more than it's going to save as far as moving forward just to get it back up into that position yeah I'm curious on what you know the I mean there are some needs identified already the youth programming Elder programming [Music] um use for you know quartz those are the three that have you know immediately popped up in what the needs assessments or the conversations also say it's in the comp plan over and over and over again so I think what we've heard so far is uh it's definitely a need just again what does it look like and if those if that current building is is um reflects the needs of the community because it might not that position too it's very odd for parking it's like the apartments use half of it for their parking and then you have the it's not a very laid out very well for that piece of property it looks like to me as far as being able to have accommodate maybe a weddings or things like that there's not much parking around it so that brings out concern too is just the position it's at for my concern where I've talked to people is where it was placed originally and you know the facilities and being able to accommodate groups of people if that's what we're going to do yeah certainly I guess it comes down to you know what is the um programming looking like um as we've discussed and um you know is it renting out courts to you know uh volleyball teams and other teams as with one source of uh Revenue to I I will say also that the community center when I think about Public Funding I don't think of it as a business I don't think of it in terms of we need a break even because I don't think that's how public money really works it's we're already taxing people they're telling us what they need and then we provide the service of course there's definitely a threshold but I think there's opportunities for us to really consider what you may be wraparound Services could look like um with non-profits and we've been approached by many of them the school district as well so just and there used to be a coffee shop so just thinking of alternative ways to you know look at the sustainability of it to not just simply from you know um taxes or something but there may be other ways in which we could um supplement certainly always it just depends on the needs of the programming so it just kind of you know is it so if we have courts you know the volleyball team can rent those out if we have a different non-profits Merrick they work with adults with um developmental disabilities and so you know are is that a place for you know um different Community organizations to house their programs so we're not maybe strictly running the programs but we have partners that are helping out so just kind of thinking about different models in terms of cost savings to or just contributions to that so it's not yeah tax dollars yeah and my I agree it's not making money off of something as far as a lot of it but it's to have something where people are using it and my concern is that it didn't it closed in 2012 as a community center how does that look going forward what's the big changes as far as population and what is needed for where we're at with it because even after we get it fixed up we still have the the maintenance of a building and the Staffing of a building and everything else where that has to be budgeted out too so that's where this is a this is going to be a tough one for for this Council here because we're gonna have to make decisions and it's not going to be some easy decisions because it's a lot of people money wise taxes people have gone up quite a bit and they can't afford so it's just looking at understanding where we all are with our tax dollars and where we can be with the community needs and if the school district we have to get what I've found out is there's a lot of agreements but there's nothing written down for what we've done in over the years so we'd have to understand you know who's paying for what what leases we have as far as going forward tenant-wise and what we're paying and everything else because it sounds to me like there's been it's kind of just up in the air we'll rent it out if somebody wants it it will sit empty if nobody wants it I mean I'll essentially have to have a full-time position for this yes organizing it yeah and that's a full-time position to the end of the city too I guess my my thought there is we don't really have any resources like that for Young People based off of our tax base I mean a lot of the the budget if you look you know what what was passed a large portion of it or a very very small portion of it goes to Parks or Community Development and so I think it's you know based off of what the overall value is for the community do we think about making adjustments to what that looks like in terms of percentage um we're doing it right now by obviously investigating this um but I see John's point of view too I mean at what on a financial impact for the city and its residents in the grand scheme of things we have to wrap everything around and you know much to Tim's point we're doing this backwards so we haven't sought out anybody in the community about this we're exploring re-renovating it and revitalizing this community center yet we haven't done any investigation of what does it look like inside there um what does it look like on a financial end for employing somebody what is it there's just so much I mean it's there's a lot to it and to do it in a reverse order um we don't have choice right now but that's what's going to happen so and we have a facility you know Casey Park I know that building isn't big but that's you know it's to me the community center is just in a spot where it's not great if it wasn't built in a good spot in my mind and that may come out of what Wold works with as well we've you know a spot right across the street might might better serve the community um you know we have we have vacant land in in multiple locations so well there's because of the way that it's been done there's a lot that's been wrapped up at least in my opinion of this is what it's going to cost to fix the building it might not come out that we fixed the building we might drop the building and determine what the community needs are in what a community center looks like when the community center was first built it was a workout facility everybody either belongs to a gym or lives in an apartment that has work has workout equipment that has since that has since gone but there are still Community needs so that's that's where we're now in the step of investigation with Wald as to what does that look like I agree I think that and now we got the overhanging piece of we got equipment in that building if we drop it is the next Community engagement session on the books do we have a time to give people or a date I think they said June okay we just have to keep an open mind understand all the numbers we're at to understand the location and what the needs are so I'm glad to be a part of it I really want to take a real close eye to this with all of us because I think it's a it's a big commitment for us as a city it's a big commitment for for everybody to be able to have that and use it properly and to use the tax wise dollars wisely because you know like you mentioned it could be a different spot it could be a different scenario that we have we just have to to keep it open and understand so I'm glad glad this is going forward so my hope is we can put this to rest one of these days and decide what we're going to do and because right now it's it's been going on for quite a while and there hasn't been a decision on it so I really want to get this as far as a group to be able to get this moving forward whatever Direction We Do It so you want to elaborate on your statement that's been going forward for quite a while and a decision has been made well just as far as people have been talking about the and not not as a group here but as the it's been the community center has been an open issue for open and close and different things like that and it needed work and it was empty for a while then they got some tenants does that make sense I don't know if it really ever said empty for extended period of time but yeah just where the future is and being able to take care of the building properly foreign the city wasn't a real good landlord um let's just say it nicely we got Ron are you wrong I'm so sorry seriously well that's the type of thing is you know buildings are such Investments we have this building here and that's starting to reach the number of years now where we're gonna have to start looking seriously at the thing where we have it so it doesn't fall into the same disrepair we got a lot of a lot of a lot of places we have to take care of and the structures can't get away like that but it really never was kind of the purpose was there but it never really took off so I think it just kind of got ignored that's where I see it at least all right anything else anybody I just didn't know if there was a firm date of that next Community engagement Center I you know if people are tuning in to watch us talk about this if there was a firm date I wanted to be able to give them that information at this meeting and I'm going off a memory I thought it said June I did it okay I won that one well very good but I mean given in the fact that it's March we probably should get it on the calendar so folks are we gotta get it out so people can can come and get through who do we need to talk to to get that going is that do we need to schedule that with a walled we'll go through them excuse me we'll go through them but also determine the best for us in the time frame for that to see where we're at with the bill process as well because it makes kind of a big difference moving forward whether or not that happens or we get that funding essentially we really won't know anything until end of May so it sounds like well the bill and everything yep based on legislation legislatures oh during the meeting if there's nothing else I mean adjourned at 5 59. I just did it so it moved second